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State of the Villain Address (Patreon)

Published:
2022-06-23 15:56:57
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

So when Chemestro was introduced, just a short time into writing it, I decided that the best role would be a dark mirror of what Perry could've been, raised to be a super BY supers.I also realized that with the way I have their starting points, over the course of the series they could easily improve themselves by studying the other.Perry by improving his self-discipline and cold pragmatism.Chemestro by creating a support network and emotional stabilityIn regards to a heel turn:It's possible, but the best heel turns are the ones that happen after they've been earned. Chemestro is going to have to do some bad stuff and fuck up royally and realize it, before he begins the path of a heel turn.This is probably bad news for Lu'Ann.The broad strokes of a good heel turn to me, is a gradual build-up of trust between him and Lu'ann, until she asks him to help her get away, then he betrays her to his father, who kills her.This eats away at him for a large portion of the series which leads to increasingly unstable behavior, possibly a person for him to project this guilt onto, and a culmination where he kills neuron then has to choose between cape and cowl.If you can think of a better path for a heel turn/more rounded villain, I'd love to get suggestions!I Um... have never really made a great antagonist, and this is a skill I feel I need to strengthen. It feels like we've got a shot, and if Chemestro turns out to be the best villain I've ever made, it would make me very happy.

Comments

Macronomicon

Also, can you guys think of a power rating system? I just need a name for powers that alter physics in a fundamental way like Chemestro's does. Universal just didn't sit well with me, but i didn't wanna stare at the screen for hours and slow my roll. It's not an energy type, its a...bluh, type.

Macronomicon

Also the person he could latch onto after being responsible for Lu'ann's death could be Dazzle's siblings. Assuming he added dazzle to his team when he realizes he needs backup and a more well-rounded team. Although the two villains have similar roles on a team which makes them being on one a bit more of a stretch

Dee

For Chemestro’s it seems like altering fundamental laws or constants, but that could be a more specific classification or manifestation of a reality warping power—basically anything that let’s you change how reality functions in our corner of the universe. I’d argue that a lot of magic could fall into that category, and that Perry’s tinker power would as well. Perhaps Chemestro could be a reality warper for specific laws of physics, OR he could be a reality warped that tweaks anything we perceive as being “chemistry-ish”.

Macronomicon

Warper sounds like a good handle for that category.

Chunq

Catalyst-type. Just cus chemistry, but it could work as a more general thing too.

Throngler In Chief

I think you could make it even darker. Have Lu'Ann killed not because she tried to escape, but because she fulfilled her purpose and was no longer useful/necessary and became a liability. Have Chemestro's father force him to do it as part of his training, because the goal was never to actually help him become a complete person but to inure him to emotions and emotional connections (as they are considered a weakness). Maybe have Lu'Ann encourage him or do it herself when he hesitates, because she realizes that if he doesn't kill her, then his father will consider him a failure and "terminate" him like the other 1141 attempts. Or maybe have her brain stuck in a jar because her knowledge/expertise is useful, then have her start asking/begging him to kill her because she's going to go mad if she's stuck in that condition. Us it to highlight the unnatural nature of the brain in a jar, the lack of "heart" that chemestro's father has and the tyranny of cold inhuman logic and cost-benefit analysis inherent in him. Could have the inner conflict be a struggle for Chemestro to decide if he wants to be human or not, maybe have his father mention he's almost ready for transplantation into a "better" body and struggle with the desire for warmth and touch and the pain and regret of having killed someone who did nothing but give him those things. That would be the cowl/cape decision as well, choosing cold unliving logic and rigid power or the softness required for growth and life. Perry's role could be to keep poking at him so he can't compartmentalize what he's done or escape the emotional turmoil. All while being a peer that has the same strengths in the sense of pragmatic logic yet also enjoys the softness of human interaction, which makes him a source of more emotions in the form of envy as well. You could Go deep into hell with Chemestro, providing a narrative foil to Perry's wacky shenanigans as well as an antagonist. Would also help build the darker worldbuilding undercurrents if the Nexus just fines Chemestro and his father for Lu'Ann's kidnapping and death since she wasn't a super and it's high tide. Could even keep him as a cowl, just as a human one rather than a "true monster." The difference between a villain that will rob a bank or steal supplies and one that'll euthanize orphans if they dont trigger after they're adopted. Be a lighter shade of grey as it were.

Gavriel

I would say to instead merely have Neutron hold her hostage in an attempt to use his stronger empathy for Lu'An to counter his empathy for others: a stopgap measure to ensure he doesn't shatter him instead of honing him (Neutron has to realize it's possible for someone to break on their weaknesses after all his experiments, Chemestro should be considered too valuable to risk easily due to his triggering a universally applicable power with few limits); having Chemestro go from only caring about one individual who has to live in a cage, and slowly develop empathy makes far more sense than a sudden emergence of latent empathy (he is the son of Neutron, his natural empathy is unlikely to be overly potent without stimulation, and I dislike the tortured antagonist trope, I believe it weakens the character)

Gavriel

Accidentally killing Neutron in a gut instinct to protect Lu'An would actually be a far more effective way to torture him, even better if that Neutron has no memory of him, but knows he killed him. I want to see Lu'An trigger, and she and Chemestro be a power couple. Perry has Heather; if you want a dark mirror an individual with an Opposite upbringing (empathic, parent's, a loving mother, a dead father? ) would be cool, even better if the new Neutron subsequently kidnaps Chemestro, and she rescues him; make Lu'An the real mirror of Perry, while Chemestro is the mirror of Heather; as I feel like Perry is already extremely well equipped by comparison considering magic (all Perry has to do is place a dregor's binding on flying platform, who cares if everything is permeable? Dregor's binding can keep everything in it's proper place by making heal ridiculously fast (same amount of flesh regenerated, but on a much smaller model, general numbing is also pretty easy, gotta be a spell for it)). The powerset I would give her would be Perry's pre-system to make it really uncanny. I think anti-heroes make better antagonists than true villains due to being far more competent (making up for being dumb by having world ending levels of power does not change that someone who wasn't dumb would have succeeded with those same powers; easily, and would realize they have almost no motivation to destroy/enslave the world when being rich, and powerful without that comes with the benefit of novelty through natural innovation by others)

Joe ?

Isn't chemestro kind of too small to be a truly great villain? Perry met him too early and he's too much of a chump. Maybe he could be recruited by the main villain, and rise through the ranks too be the Darth Vader Jr. to Helios, who is the Darth Vader for the real puppetmaster. I think the recruitment seen could even be kind of easy. Neutron orders him to kill Lu'ann with his bare hands. A little bit beforehand he could have been contacted by the organization, and turned them down out of loyalty, but now he's desperate. When Neutron is in the room with him, and Lu'ann the suppressors turn off suddenly,. Seizing the opportunity, he phases Neutron out of his jar and stomps his wet brain into the ground. Anyways way later in the story when he's supplanted Helios as the main Darth Vader, he can throw the emperor down into a pit while he's electrocuting Perry. I mean not that exactly but you get the idea. Also for big baddies, I think easiest way to make them great is that the reader agrees with their ends, but not their means.

Chunq

I thought the goal is to win against High Tide, or at least kill prawns better than everybody else. I think that puts a different spin on the hero/villain thing. Then there's also the idea of magitech vs pure tech. There's no way "just technology" is more cool than the marriage of magic and technology, it's totally self-evident that magitech wins. 1242 can give it a good shot though.

A disgruntled nondescript squirrel

fuck the heel turn biz Fake a heel turn to be a hidden baddy is better IMO I am so tired of heel turns If world war 2 happened now people would forgive Hitler if he got a cat out of a tree

Crownfall

The heel turn here sounds like a strong plot but the tone of Luann dying to his father is very dark and serious compared to what's happened so far. I think it could still be good

James Earl Givens

how many siblings died do to training and now you empathize him how many was he required to put down at fathers command backlash can be a *itch

Nobody

Maybe after the impact of realizing he directly caused a death he reflects on all the death that was happening around him. Siblings who failed to reach the benchmark and went for "special" treatments, lethality test subjects he might have been told were simulations or biological androids, etc... Then have him go Batman (refuse to kill) or full Pasifist.