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The Tucker Carlson Apology Situation | Lemonade Stand - Ep. 53 Premium [VIDEO] (Patreon)

Published:
2026-04-24 03:35:07
Edited:
2026-09-25 22:28:21
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Recorded on April 21st, 2026

Topics

Ai + Blockchain + Vape?

Tucker Carlson takes blame for Trump

Tim Cook steps down

Afghan Refugees

Law Firms are getting sued for using Ai

Files

Comments

Scumlord Studio

Poggies don't take this one down like the last time I was early amen

Robert Quinn

Woah guys, midnight on a Thursday? What a delight!

Tyler McCarty

Gotta get Andrew Callaghan on the pod, that would be a killer episode.

Tynan Gacy

I'm sorry, but I can't continue to be subscribed to this Podcast anymore. Atrioc wasted my time by needing to remember the Epstein file anecdote, and I just sat there and waited. Unforgivable, please give me a refund.

M C

Don’t just watch the clips. That’s my recommendation, Aiden. You would know that Tucker is a white nationalist if you kept listening to the podcast. He talks about in this interview how the country clubs should go back to being whites only. He blames the Jews for ruining the west. Tucker has said Hitler was protecting western civilization and Churchill was the villain in WWII. He is against the Iran war and genocide in Gaza and Israel from an anti-Semitic place. Not a human rights place. He just says some very correct things.

Akhos

Tucker Carlson always looks so confused

Bailey Yin

wrt to Tucker Carlson, I do not think it has to be black and white. It seems like he is both seeing a sinking ship and making political move as well as a certain amount of actual principles. They just happen to align at the moment.

Asamorth

I sympathize a lot with Aiden’s thoughts in this episode, but I would recommend he (or anyone else reading) look into the dominion lawsuit. There’s a reason fox fired their most popular host. He knowingly lied about the dominion lawsuit. He texted friends and other hosts that he knew the election claims were bullshit, but he said then anyways because they were losing viewers to alternative news shows. He knowingly lied and reached th actual malice standard, something extremely rare, and cost fox 900 million. I think Atrioc is partly right here. I think these people are reading their audience, and being lead by them. I see them as moving more towards nick fuentes, someone who was explicitly anti-trump (mostly due to antisemitism) I do unironically think this crosses some of tuckers red lines though. He has a very authoritarian bend, and I think genuinely likes countries like Iran and Russia, and would oppose most foreign wars, but it wouldn’t be a dealbreaker if we won the war fast or it was popular (I.e Venezuela) . To conclude, I do think this crosses some of Carlson’s actual red lines but the reason he’s not doing the “he has things like and things I don’t like” is because his audience is leaving trump. Sorry for the typers, I stopped my bike ride and wrote this on mobile.

Jameson

I think, to add to atrioc’s point here: Would Tucker Carlson and all of Trump’s previous supporters really care about Iran if gas was $1/gallon, good, white-collar 6 figure jobs were falling out of the sky, and taxes were low? Personally, I don’t think so. They’d say “the Dow is over 50,000, who cares about the war? The war is probably good, look how great his track record is with the economy. We’re in a golden age.” I think the economy being so bad makes people look for a release valve. It’s difficult for some people to say “I’m poor, I need help” when their entire personality is picking yourself up by your bootstraps and owning a gun, but it’s easy to say “this war is stupid as hell, let’s get someone else in here to stop it (and hopefully help me)”

Niyi

I think one thing that wasn’t talked about was that Tucker is clearly gunning for a presidential run. This is all just a “wiping my slate of the Trump stain while it’s easy so it doesn’t bite me in the butt later”.

💫

Grifter grifts after voter base turns on the previous party leader. don't believe a word he ever says. The Dominion lawsuit texts should discredit him from ever being taken serious in media.

Dubai Darryl

Or just go to the comments on like any of his videos or posts. Like what the hell are you doing how did you miss this.

Riley Kendrick

Aiden, you are giving Tucker way too much grace. You’ve constructed an inverse straw man protecting this guy

Ehaeka

Heavy disagree with Aiden on Tucker. He has clearly only seen Tucker from clips. I watched half hour monologue of every single one of his latest podcasts after his public split from Trump, until the guest segments that start about half an hour in (because the guests are insufferable assholes). In every single monologue, Tucker goes on Tangents about how the gays are Sodom and Gomorrah, the Jews are destroying white america, the immigrants are destroying white america, etc etc. he's still a virulent racist grifter

esp-E

I agree with Atrioc basically 100% on the Tucker stuff. It's a weird conversation for Doug and Aiden to not have as much information on because they're trying to give Tucker the benefit of the doubt, but years of video exist. The creators breaking with Trump now have had issues with things Trump has been doing years now but Trump still had power. In 2016 there is a chance that he wins, in 2020 there is a chance that he gets reelected. In 2024 there is a chance that he wins; but he can’t run legally in 2028 unless he does something highly illegal at this point, because he doesn’t have the support to change the constitution. There isn’t a moment where their bet could still go wrong like it could in the past where they would be left out on the side of the road if Trump wins. They would all still pick self preservation over morals right now if they thought Trump’s sway over their base was stronger than their own. Also Aiden is severely underestimating the weight of $4.00 gas vs the Tariffs. The tariffs are still too complicated for some people to understand. There were weeks of back and forth arguments on who pays the tariffs, but $4.00 gas is $4.00 gas. You could have dropped out of middle school and still fully comprehend $4.00 gas. If an issue is too complicated it leaves room for a smarter person with an agenda to explain it in a favorable way to people who don’t understand it. The tariffs give that room $4.00 gas does not.

MaiL6

Dude, I would so pay for a big red button

Michael

Germany is doing something very similar with the Afghans. Last year there was an article about Afghans who already had admission promises from the German government. They traveled to Pakistan as required, handed in their documents at the German embassy, and then had interviews cancelled and approvals were revoked (for reasons such as: bringing a laminated copy of an ID alongside the original, which was treated as document forgery and used as grounds to revoke admission). Some were even deportated back to Taliban-controlled Afghanistan by Pakistan as the process took so long. Heres the article (in german though): https://www.tagesspiegel.de/politik/47-afghanen-landen-in-hannover-die-ungewollten-kommen-14255273.html

Jeremiah Seiuli

Yeah nah tucker Carlson is a fking traitor to the USA and the west as a whole. Him and fox news should've been tried and executed for the seditious actions they took against the USA. I say this as an Aussie, there's no one more that I hate in US media Besides tucker Carlson. He is one of the reasons the Christchurchs mass shootings against Muslims happened. Tucker Carlson is the originator of the white genocide (Jews are replacing whites with non white immigrants to testify them)myth in the mainstream . Also the fact his a gifter is obvious, go read any of the emails that came out of Discovery in the lawsuit. Tucker knew it was all bullshit and he hated trump and having to meat ride him. His just an intelligent grifter who knows how to play on the emotions of America(it worked on Aiden and dough)

bee

Aiden I get that you've had to deal with r/LiveStreamFail's commentary on Ludwig for the better part of a decade, but this is a case where it's really, really just not the same. I found this argument quite frustrating to listen to.

bee

Not all criticisms of a public person's character is made in inherently bad faith. Tucker earns his in a way not many people actually do, tbh! What you're perceiving as principles is just a lack of allegiance to the Republican party structure and/or MAGA orthodoxy (basically the same thing at this point) - it looks like he's taking a "stance" because he's breaking away from that. But there are other operating structures - such as money, influence, and Christian nationalism - he simply values more highly, and he's making an educated gamble that parting from Trump now will allow him to keep those things. Atrioc is right, if this shit keeps up then Asmongold and every other self interested bottom-feeder in the political "commentary" space will do the same.

bee

I really think you guys should get a political scientist on the podcast, it would be such a good discussion.

Robert H

I think the episode number is wrong

Pipeman

One of the frustrating things to me about Aiden's position is that even if a universe existed where Tucker was "duped" by Trump, it wouldn't change anything. Things like due diligence actually exist, especially for political influencers with his reach. Not to mention that even then I find it very hard to believe that him not knowing the score would have come from Tucker being too lazy or stupid to see through Trump, rather than a deliberate choice not to look too closely because going along with the scam is convenient.

Lemonade Stand

I think this is acknowledged in the clip and I do think you're right, and also I appreciate that you recognize that I may be living with LiveStreamFail PTSD LMAO - Aiden

bee

Yeah I do appreciate that you were willing to listen to the argument and change your perspective in the end, I obviously bring my own knowledge and biases into listening that results in the frustration lol. I look forward to the LS missile being used to level the Reddit headquarters and end LSF's tyranny on us all 🤠🤠🤠

Vincent Santen

Genuinely not trying to join the Hate-Pile on Aiden going on, but also I do really feel like I have say something to show how much something like this means to people. It's really important when discussing issues with such public figures as well, to either be informed or to listen. I read Aiden's comment about LSF PTSD and I will say that's fair. But Tucker Carlson isn't just a random guy spouting nonsense, he is one of the MOST influential people in Christian/Rightwing politics, he makes his living this way, it might not seem important or too leftwing/hate rich people coded, but he truly makes his entire career of grifting. Obviously him being a shitty guy shouldn't be a reason to pile on the hate train, that's a good thing from Aiden. But I truly think you should be WAY MORE clear about your stance on the situation being that of a steelman to protect someone against unfair slander. If you are not aware of this man's history than really you shouldn't protect him as much as you did, the idea is a good one, but just as you don't want him to receive so many bad faith arguments, you also shouldn't be giving him so many good faith interpretations. So much time this episode was spent kind of talking past eachother because the stances either weren't clear or it wasn't kept on track in a coherent way making the argument take long and feel really frustrating. Also this is more of a personal opinion which is perhaps not ideal, but the idea that you HAVE to know someone to make a judgement call is a bit silly. Obviously you don't know someone's soul, but perhaps you never know someone even if you talk to them. It creates a bit of a nothingburger conversation if you never allow yourself to talk about something or someone with very trackable or clear intentions, just because you don't personally know it. Aiden explains that Tucker could explain himself, which is just not really something that's all that relevant, of course the person doing heinous stuff could tell you why in their mind it made sense, that truly doesnt change anything. Explaining something logically is easy, explaining something with rational is way more important, and you can rationally look at this and form an opinion without hearing someone out about their logic. (To do a Reddit classic and pull the H-card, even he could explain what he did in WW2 logically, just not rationally (with Rato) and you don't have to talk to him to understand that and form an opinion on those atrocities. Obviously there's levels to this stuff. The way Aiden deserves more leniency because he hasn't really done bad stuff, Tucker doesn't deserve as much flak as Mr. H. It's a hyperbolic analogy that I edited in after to make the point Logic =/= Ratio.) I love the show and you guys as entertainers genuinely, If this feels like hate sorry, it's not my intention.

Dan

Mandatory Tucker comment, he's not just some voter perceiving the administration through the media lense. He has trumps personal phone number. They are (or were lol) friends. I subscribe to Hanlon's razor quite a lot, do not attribute to malice that which can be more easily attributed to stupidity. But this is too far. It is malice, this is someone who knew exactly what they were doing who should not be given the benefit of the doubt

Betin

"churchill was a villain because he wasnt racist ENOUGH" is crazy

Jake

I want to defend Aiden a bit here mostly because at the behest of this podcast I read Humankind by Rutger Bregman and I’d say a good portion of that book lays out why what Aiden is saying is correct. Giving people the benefit of the doubt and accepting people leads to better outcomes. I see the Iran war as an example of the straw that broke the camels back. So with the question by Atrioc of if everything else was going right would he have done this? I would say of course not but that would be because in his mind everything was going well and what’s one mess up but when you put all of it together it makes him no longer able to defend Trump. If we crucify people when they change their minds I would bet you will see a lot more people digging their heels and sticking to a position that they might no longer believe in.

ToCosma

Thank you LS for posting at the right time to fill one hour out of a 10hr pilgrimage in Taiwan. Crazy to find out Tim Cook died (as a CEO).

Kerrin Grosvenor

Aiden: "I'll be Big A for a second" 😂♥️

Sam

Very well put. Our biggest tool- empathy for other humans and the stories that come along from that- is also a double edged sword. It sometimes allows us to perceive some caricature for a person when that is in reality to simplified or misinformed. Our worldview shapes this- but it is not isolated, rather influenced by other people. This is in part a cause for the current polarization. So give the benefit of the doubt, even when it seems wrong.

Tanner Jones

I think two things be true at the same time. Tucker has a very strong conviction about the Iran War being bad, and he's only capable of making this break due to Trump's extreme unpopularity. But to be honest that I think he's a racist and not on my side as someone who supports liberal values so I'm suspicious of everything he does

Danell Serik

As much as I disagree with Aiden's initial point, seeing as there are tons of evidence of Tucker's disingenuous beliefs and statements, I cannot help but feel deeply sympathetic to his approach to the situation. I cannot, in good conscience, be upset with a guy who's unwilling to condemn a person he does not know much about to complete scrutiny, and instead attempts to see if there is a shred of doubt he might owe Tucker. I believe, in general, this is the most healthy approach to every situation where you might instinctively want to condemn a person in their totality. Giving them the benefit of the doubt, at least until you have evidence to the contrary, allows them to explain their position and humanize their perspective. However, with Tucker, as anyone who's seen any of his content over the past decade or so would know, this approach is a fruitless endeavour. I would also like to say that the amount of hate I've seen Aiden get for his views on here and on Big A's channel feels really unfair, and I would urge people to exercise the same amount of empathy and sympathy that the person you're attacking is willing to give someone like Tucker.

Zack

Aiden Cowlick

Gmbify

I think the biggest thing to recognize is Tucker did that whole video where he went to Russia and talked about how dope it was there despite being embroiled in like 3 years of Ukraine war and sanctions at that point. When you look at the things Tucker agrees with or doesn't agree with, they all line up with what would or would not benefit Russia. He uses being "anti war" as his principled position, but only when it's war against a country that benefits Russia like Venezuela or Iran. He only began speaking out against Israel when it became popular to do so, not because he's opposed to the genocide of Palestinians, but because it puts strain on America's alliance with Israel and causes strife within the American population. Every position he takes is prefaced by his clear alignment with Russia and what puts him in the popular camp with the growing number of anti Trump Republicans for his inevitable 2028 presidential run. Aiden's issue in this conversation is that he is a genuinely empathetic person and wants to believe that everyone in life becomes who they are based on things that happen to them. He wants to believe there are nurture style things that happen to people that make them the way they are. That principle can be applied to the majority of people. The average MAGA Republican voter should be viewed through this lens of empathy and belief that they have simply been misled and have the potential to be moved in the right direction. This principle cannot be applied to individuals who are part of the system that misled those people in the first place. If Tucker were just some random guy, Aiden's argument would be totally valid, but Tucker is not some random guy.

Matthew Doyle

Overall the analysis of the Tucker Carlson apology sounds a lot more like pontificating on the apology headlines and apology quote rather than really digging into the story, the apology came from his podcast episode on April 20th and in the context of the discussion between him and his brother feels less like being apologetic for the heinous things Trump has done and much more like playing to his base. A lot of their discussion seems to revolve around Trump being "compromised" and a government man rather than the outsider he once was, and that he has bowed to establishment. It also featured criticism from a theological standpoint which made it sound like he wasn't enough of a religous extremist for the Carlson's tastes. Big fan of the show, but disappointed in the seemingly surface level analysis here, and for being way too charitable to Tucker Carlson due to this gap in contextual understanding.

Steven K

It's fascinating how much raw vitriol is in the comments on YouTube against Aiden here. This Tucker Carlson conversation IS why I listen to the Lemonade Stand BECAUSE I don't spend my time online 24/7 and I DON'T know any of this stuff about Carlson. This is exactly the "Leopards ate my face" mentality that you all lament during this conversation.

Lynx5419

Tracking my final dissertation progress with lemonade stand uploads, this one and next week till it’s done … thanks for the help during boring library hours gents

Matthew Doyle

Wait, Apple has had product recalls? Including under Tim Cook. Starting to feel a little crazy here with the lack of fact checking, I want to be able to listen and learn but its tricky when I can't trust the statements to be factual, damn.

Sikandar Khan

The boys looked exhausted this episode

Alex Martinez

I think this episode would have been greatly helped by Atrioc making a presentation on who the fuck Tucker actually is, as I can understand the hesitant opinions of Aiden and Doug who don't know this man.

Xavier Ibanez-Padron

I agree to an extent, but I feel like the paradox of tolerance is in play here If we tolerate everyone and ‘hear them out’ 100% of the time wouldn’t we risk normalizing the immense amounts of intolerance some of these people share? There has to be a line somewhere, and Tucker crossed it a half-marathon ago

Thomas Fischbeck

Aiden is right in a way. Tucker is a pro-Iran/Russia, borderline white supremacist. If you take that as his “baseline morality views” supporting Trump but now turning on him during the Iran war makes sense and is logically consistent.

Jack Heinzel

Atrioc is a very good political analyst

Ridghost

It does feel like Aiden is particularly susceptible to propaganda if he requires a face-to-face chat with anyone who has observably inconsistent views. Tucker Carlson has a very long history of being dangerously disingenuous, pushing whatever narrative will benefit his financial situation the best. His principles and opinions blow with the wind, and whether he truly, honestly, fundamentally believes the things he says has little sway on what he exposes publicly. If he were an average layman to the media business, we could perhaps give him the benefit of poor wording and miscommunication. His background is as the flagship news anchor for one of the largest broadcasting stations on the planet. Based on his expertise, we have to take his communications at face value, they were written with precision to have an intended effect. I find it naive to think that someone with such a well documented history of disinformation for the Trump campaign, cannot be judged from afar as being a weasel in his backpeddling in this situation. Edit: We don't want to see him backpeddle / put the car in reverse, and tell us how he was 'tricked' or how he 'couldn't have seen this coming'. Those lies are so blatant that it's insulting to our intelligence to even utter. True signs of change would be to keep driving forward with a complete change of direction. Admit the disinformation and introduce new process to show how things would change moving forward. Tuckers response has been holding his hands in the air, distancing himself from the scene of the crime, with plans to do the exact samething all over again with a different candidate or situation - because he has changed nothing about his reporting or journalistic standards.

Fern

Look I disagree with them and think that we need to heavily shame people once they admit that they were wrong because we can't physically do anything worse to them. We told them that people's rights were going to be stripped that people were going to die and they did not care. Its one thing if they would turn completely against the ideology but you know that they are just waiting for another Mitt Romney type to go back to the Republicans. They have blood on their hands and it will take serious effort not words to wipe it off their hands. No one has any excuse for not being informed. At this point it is willful ignorance. Everyone has phones and access to information. If you are not political it is because you have the luxury not to be. No more excuses.

Fern

I mean maybe but the person that we are dealing with is a white supremacist grifter so I say that we continue the crucifixion.

Lemonade Stand

I think it's pretty evident through what I say across the whole clip that I don't think it is required to meet someone, I'm just expressing part of a way I feel about this

Keegan Wilhelmsen

There is definitive proof in a court of law that Tucker Carlson knowingly lied about the 2020 election because it was a popular conspiracy among his viewers. When confronted with a choice between principals and money, he chose money. 100% with Brandon that it is not unfairly uncharitable to call him out for almost certainly doing the same now. Frankly, I think it's most likely that Tucker can't stand Trump personally and is relieved that his personal feelings toward the man are now aligned with what is most profitable for him to say at this moment. I could see a world where tucker is actually kinda sorry about supporting him this whole time, but that clearly wasn't enough for him to stick to his principles instead of chasing the money he could get by grifting right along with the Trump train. It's pretty safe to say that if the wind changes direction and Trump's favorability among his base improves in a year, that Tucker will likely be right back in the fold with a supportive voice to once again chase the money at the cost of whatever his sincere beliefs are. He's done exactly that before, so we can rightly assume he'd do it again.

Cameron LaSonde

33:09 - the people saying "I told you so" are just as useless in this situation. There is nothing productive about saying I told you so.

Ian Goldie

Aiden really came into this Tucker discussion unprepared and ready to defend the Number 1 propagandist from Trump’s first term

Logan Page

It’s important to listen to these people on THEIR reasons to break from Trump. They aren’t having some come to Jesus moment, they’re pissed that he’s not railing against vaccines more, and other bs like that.

Ben Isaacson

I think, quite frankly, there's quite a bit of judgement being levied in these comments for what is, ultimately, an entirely noble view of the world and people. And for that reason, I think it's important to, regardless of any personal disagreement I might have or feel, outwardly express my respect for being willing to hold true to a worldview that people, in the end, can mostly be understood if given the time. I think it's exclusively a good thing to, separate from agreeing with someone, recognize that any base judgement is inherently incomplete, and to factor that into your decision making framework regardless of your personal feelings on someone.

Eric

Apple's own service website lists several ongoing recalls from Tim Cooks era. Was the first result of "apple product recall" on google. Edit: just got to that part of the podcast. I misunderstood your comment and had your position backwards. My bad

Matthew Doyle

Yeah that's what I'm saying, right around the 44 minute mark Doug said that they had never had a product recall in 15 years, just a strange stat to throw out without a quick check.

Policy Wonk

No need to add borderline to that statement. If you look at his interviews with Nazi Nick Fuentes and his views on the "great replacement theory" in his most recent podcast videos you can pretty much confirm he's a white supremacist. Going straight to the well as opposed to looking at the Twitter clips helps to exemplify his bigotry.

Policy Wonk

There's a relatively popular podcast called knowledge fight that has covered some of Tucker's most recent stances and opinions. I recommend you check them out if you want a middle ground between Twitter clips and trudging through watching a whole Tucker video. Hopefully it'll help you guys come to a more concrete position on Tucker currently. They're more left leaning and it's political comedy so YMMV.

Spice

you came off pretty poorly in this episode in regards to this. felt very jarring. not on attack on you, its just that you can’t turn some discussions into philosophical abstractions.

Conner Paul

Tucker Carlson is a bad person and you don't have to give him the benefit of the doubt and talk to him in person to understand his principles if he's said so many terrible things, he doesn't deserve grace now that he's switching sides and the coincidentally most convenient point

Dragau4

I heavily disagree, i think that you're stuck in emotional thoughts of disliking tucker in general. Aiden and Doug are giving merit to actually not being a boot licker. Changing sides deserves merit, its like looking at CoD and then suddenly they do one thing right and you bash them even more for it saying "what about this and this". We all know the reaso is money, but doing better is always better than tucker staying hard on maga... idk how yiu guys seem to prefer tucker staying as a maga dick head.... we never said he became a good guy, a piece of garbage can still do a good thing I feel like a LOT of issue s inthis world would be solved with people being able to hold two competing things in their head at the same time, tucker can do something good while being an absolute piece of shit... I think americans got fried with the intense polarization of parties, Aiden being canadien seems VERY distanced from that polaristic mind compared to Atrioc let's say (I despise everything tucker stands for, don't try to act like this is a partisan thing) I do genuinely think people literally forgot everything about how an entire country started hating Jewish people, the citizens weren't monster... they just were lead to believe someone had the answer to all their problem...

Dragau4

I heavily disagree, i think that you're stuck in emotional thoughts of disliking tucker in general. Aiden and Doug are giving merit to actually not being a boot licker. Changing sides deserves merit, its like looking at CoD and then suddenly they do one thing right and you bash them even more for it saying "what about this and this". We all know the reaso is money, but doing better is always better than tucker staying hard on maga... idk how yiu guys seem to prefer tucker staying as a maga dick head.... we never said he became a good guy, a piece of garbage can still do a good thing

Dragau4

But you're kinda completely dismeriting someone changing their minds, which is the exact reason why NO ONE CHANGES THEIR MINDS.... y'all keep perpetrating this tradition without knowing... seriously.... it implements a mentality of stubborness out of necessity, like "if I change my mind everyone will turn on me", it'S been everywhere, even on VERY MINOR incidents... it'S like people can't accept someone changing their minds ever, and it makes most people more and more stubborn... I don'T think anyone is believing tucker is this "angel" but saying there's no merit to changing sides is honestly just as bad. You're being upset about his view and unable to see past those, just like how america was lead to believe democrats are the ennemies of republicans and vice versa... hence why Aiden is the one person with that opinion while Atrioc is so polarized (do not try to say I support tucker, I never said anything about what he says, he's a piece of shit, but he at least changed side. Stop making it about polarization, you will all burn in ythe seed you sow if you continue like this as an entire country)

Dragau4

Just reading your first paregraph shows just how bad Americans got brainwashed in polarization.... The entire country is buyilt on hating the other side, you cvan't deny that, it'S been a core of your politics. Aiden NEVER even aluded that tucker wasn't a bad person, but EVERYONE IN THIS COMMENT SECTION IS ACTING LIKE AIDEN DID SAY THAT.... because you guys can't even comprehend someone holding competing thoughts in their head... you're too polarized... dismeriting someone changing sides, no matter what they have done in the past, is like saying "yeah no you shouldn't change sides, I prefer when you act like the person I know you are" like you can'T accept someone actually believing they might've been wrong, it'S not just tucker, it'S everywhere, just look at the past, anyone changing their minds, no matter the context gets the SAME EXACT treatment. It genuinely sadening reading this comment section as A Canadian, it kinda confirms my suspicion... there's a reason the only canadian feels the same way I do. We never said he's good, just that doing this deserve merit, just like how a game company finally making a good change after years, is better than not making the change ever. If you shit on the person for making that change, you will NEVER EVER have anyone EVER change their minds... which is exactly what is happening everywhere, early republicans changing their minds were shunned by republicans still believing in trump, now late changers are being shunned too, no way to win... See what I mean? If you act like you can't change your mind ever, you make everyone a stubborn piuece of shit

Conner Paul

The defense I have for Doug is he hasn't followed politics closely until the past year, he's even said he only knew of Tucker from clips. I think he just wants to be hopeful without knowing the full extent of how had Tucker is.

Conner Paul

You're right that we shouldn't crucify people when they change their mind but we also shouldn't welcome them with open arms. Tucker Carlson is one of the largest alternate media voices that heavily influenced the outcome of the last election, just saying "sorry guys I messed up" isn't good enough. Especially when we know he is a proven liar from the Dominion lawsuit, you don't take someone like that and accept the sorry at face value.

bee

@dragau4 Nowhere did I claim that people cannot change their minds, that's really not what my comment was about at all. I completely agree that there's too many punitive (and puritan!) responses to people "changing their minds" about Trump/the right, which may be emotionally earned but are practically-speaking deeply counterproductive. However, I think that (much like Aiden said in the episode) Tucker Carlson is a figure who has existed and shared his beliefs publicly for long enough that I feel entirely comfortable making the judgement that I don't believe that his core values have changed. I'm also not sure what you're getting at with the comment about him "changing sides" - he's still a right wing hardcore conservative, just not one that supports Trump anymore. The left absolutely needs to learn how to embrace people turning away from Trump, but there's no reason to extend that compassion to figures like Tucker who have made hundreds of millions of dollars playing propagandist for him. The tent's not *that* big.

esp-E

Dragau4 changing sides doesn’t deserve merit, with no regard for why you changed sides. Changing a principled stance because the other side paid you more doesn’t deserve praise, and changing sides because you realize that the leader of your side is about to kicked out by his own followers also doesn’t deserve praise. I’m not going to like Tucker no matter what side he is on, but this has nothing to do with me liking Tucker, it’s about the principle behind the decision. If Tucker makes this switch at the height of Trump’s popularity then the decision is at least somewhat principled. Tucker fleeing a sinking ship to save his own skin is not in any way honorable. The other thing that doesn’t have an real merit is this retroactive post Trump clarity, where people had issues with this stuff the whole time and only speak up now that Trump has gone too far. If you are a Republican and the gas prices broke you then its one thing to say I agreed with the other stuff, but the gas price or the war went too far; but that’s not what’s happening with a lot of people. They broke because of gas prices or the war, but now all of a sudden they are mad about the Epstein files or the Tariffs, or the overall number of lies that Trump tells, when they never opened their mouth about that stuff before and in some cases have even defended Trump on them when questioned by the other side.

Chad

18:07 I live among alot of Trump supporters and I dont see the anti Isreal sentiment the southern evangical base is pretty pro Isreal the anti Isreal right is kinda niche imo

Chad

Aidan being constantly wrong on tucker carlson and atrioc trying his best to not be like your just wrong If Aidan is reading how much tucker carlson content have you consumed he's the biggest right wing grifter imo Bro is selling zyns and praising Russian grocery stores brian kill mead and Sean Hannity maybe deserve some creadance but tucker no

Marvin Krug

I think what is being discussed is not him leaving maga as bad, but the idea of him leaving maga because of his principles, which they argue is not true, the criticism goes towards Tucker saying anything that benefits him in the moment and not doing enough to acknowledge the consequences. Of course it is not bad that he is leaving maga, but also not something commendable when public opinion has already shifted to the worse on maga and he is just going along the flow. The problem here is mostly that if the political scene elects another nutcase on the Republican side Tucker will most likely stand behind that person, because he always follows public opinion and not principles.

Hailey “Beloved” Robeson

man… Atrioc keeps talking like maga or the right are completely self destructing, they’re all deserting, it’s all collapsing, and Djt has no public support left. But rn more than ever has been these past few years, I’m seeing gigantic onslaughts of rightists and unbulging supporters of the causes and administration, nonstop, on like all causes, from every which way :/… yes even after the ‘doctor’ post and ongoing feud with the pope

Davis Addink

I appreciate Aiden’s pov here even if I don’t agree. I think it’s important to think about the reasoning for actions even if it’s hard for us to see. Ultimately I do think Tucker is a piece of shit and did this to retain his audience, but it’s important in general to continue to exercise even thinking about giving the benefit of the doubt to people because I think everyone is capable of growth and redemption. This just isn’t the case with Tucker but I’m grateful that Aiden thought so heavily on the possibility of growth

Tynan Gacy

I'm clinging to your comment for dear life. It's insanely frustrating to see people in the community I used to be happy to be a part of tear into someone for trying to find the steelman for the opposing side. On Atrioc's subreddit and on the Big A clip there are people everywhere who cannot see past the idea of "bad guy does bad things and is untrustworthy".

Tynan Gacy

Genuine question, what is gained by shaming the regretful ex-MAGA cultists? Do you think that shaming them will prevent them or future people from following harmful ideologies? Or maybe the social tarnish they bear is a form of justice that eases a small part of the harm they caused? I ask because I see this opinion all the time but I genuinely cannot understand how a meaningful social or political strategy can emerge from shunning and shaming the people who are trying to get out of the cult. The thought-leaders trying to flip sides are a different and more complex issue, but what is the tangible benefit to shaming the Joes and Nancys of the world who are trying to untwist the hate and fear from their lives?

Dragau4

I heavily disagree, i think that you're stuck in emotional thoughts of disliking tucker in general. Aiden and Doug are giving merit to actually not being a boot licker. Changing sides deserves merit, its like looking at CoD and then suddenly they do one thing right and you bash them even more for it saying "what about this and this". We all know the reaso is money, but doing better is always better than tucker staying hard on maga... idk how yiu guys seem to prefer tucker staying as a maga dick head.... we never said he became a good guy, a piece of garbage can still do a good thing

Om Morendha

Love you guys, but I would appreciate a little more care to fact checking, better to space out the episodes and research more before recording

Brian Duffy

This one is painful to watch so far and I'm only 25 minutes in. We've had one story from doug followed 15 minutes of aiden's repetitive fairytale naivete about Tucker maybe not being an obvious grifter followed by him trying to pretend saying you're 'an anti-weed person' suggests that you support legalisation, just so he can win an argument he had with a commenter a week ago. What am I paying for here?

Brian Duffy

The exhausting and completely absurd first 40 minutes of this episode made we want to continue this rant but I'll summarise it in case Aiden sees this - Next time you want to speak extensively about the values and credibility of a public figure, try watching a single complete interview first, or just google them maybe. I don't care that you said in the episode that maybe you should watch Tucker before arguing he might not be a white supremacist grifter, you have a responsibility to actually do that and not waste everyone's time and launder reputations through ignorance. If Atrioc hadn't been a sane person in the room I'd have already cancelled my sub from this episode alone.

Brian Duffy

I think this episode would have been helped by two of the hosts doing their job and researching the topic

bella Justice-Eck

i know people are saying a bunch of mean shit here, and some people make defensible points. however, i think aiden’s take on tucker is 100% reasonable if you listen to what he is saying. that urge to give the benefit of the doubt instead of immediately condemning someone you barely know about is a good thing! ironically, i think a lot of the negative comments here could benefit from that viewpoint. i dont think aiden is doing anything wrong here, and from the sounds of it i think he is approaching this conversation in a unique way because of his unique personal values. and maybe the argument is “if you dont know that much then dont talk about it.” but this is a conversational medium?? this show would be so boring if it was just atrioc explaining the situation and doug and aiden both saying “yea you know more than us so we agree” and moving on. ultimately, i hope specifically aiden sees this comment and i hope he knows the barrage of negative “discourse” around this episode is not so much an indication of personal failure as it is people getting angry that he may not be as knowledgeable as them and so his position does not align with theirs. <3

Glidergill

Hey man not everyone on the pod knows the stories they each bring some and they aren't always educated on them I think Aiden's point is a good one to make even if I disagree with it but it is a reasonable point to make from someone who knows very little on a topic and trying to see the best in those around you

Sam Kief

My biggest issue with this ep is Big A becoming Little a as he leans away from his mic.

cheese

they jumping Aidan 😭

Dan Crowther

As a Day-1 Zest member, this episode (and subsequent comments) is the first time I've considered upgrading to Juice tier, just for the upcoming Year of Kindness episode.

REDACTED

I truly think you are the problem with humanity. You clearly have bottled anger that comes out in the form of anything that doesnt perfectly meet your criteria for morality or however you would rather it be framed. I hope you take time to reflect on yourself and your incredibly underdeveloped empathy

Eli Paul

I don’t think the policy pivot by Tucker, mtg, Candice etc is the interesting thing that is going on. I think all of them are trying to pivot their personality away from “MAGA” because I think if you are MAGA in 2028 you will lose, and MAGA is more of a personality than a policy position . I genuinely think Tucker knows apologizing is the one thing Trump would never do, and so by giving an apology he can separate his character from the MAGA personality.

Brian Duffy

@REDACTED The fact that you think telling someone they are 'the problem with humanity' is a reasonable opening to any response, let alone a comment lamenting my lack of empathy, is completely laughable. I made a straightforward complaint about paying to listen to nearly 40 minutes of ignorance, go project your angry feelings onto someone else.

Brian Duffy

@Gildergill This was not like other times when one or more of the hosts is being educated by another. Aiden spent nearly 40 minutes going in circles about how he's seen people tell lies about people online so he doesnt want to jump to conclusions, when he could have just looked him up beforehand. Doug also said he didnt know much about him, so he stayed quiet instead of pushing back every time Atrioc tried to move past the nonsense take that Tucker might just be misunderstood. There is a blatant difference in the approach on this topic

Matthias Conroy

I think Atrioc is actually misreading the original clip. I basically consider Tucker Carlson as extremely unhinged. Before COVID made (almost) every conservative insane he was actually quite nuanced in lots of atypical ways for an American conservative. But I read this clip as being the opposite of what Atrioc's saying. I think he's saying the signs *were* there. If they were just fooled it would not be an issue of conscience, it would be an issue of intelligence. It's certainly too little, too late, but I don't think he's claiming that it's not his fault, or that he wasn't culpably complicit. He could swing back to the opposite opinion next week because he needs psychiatric intervention, but I don't read this as being cynical grifting, even if that's far from unheard of for Tucker.

Jordyn

Best part of this show is how you guys aren’t afraid to bring up two different perspectives. I’m more with Atrioc on the Tucker conversation but I see what Aiden is saying and appreciate that input.

Miraz

Please this is at least the second time y'all have brought of Tucker, the Dominican Voting Machines, the Lawsuit - without know any of the details of the lawsuit! If you guys are going to bring up the lawsuit, especially to dissect Tuckers character and how that might speak to how he is positioning himself, read up on the lawsuit beforehand.

drunkel

I think Candace is an exception her best friend got publicly executed by what i and her believe the FBI was involved in she isn’t distancing herself due to her audience is changing their minds she is changing the minds of her audience Ik you guys are mainly focused on Tucker but i do honestly believe if Trump was doing well Candace would have still turned her reason are different from everybody else even if its not easy or popular to do You guys should look into the charlie kirk case and her coverage on it its very interesting even if you don’t agree with all her views

Vincent Santen

Very heavily disagree, this reactions seems very emotional and not well thought out. I'm not american, I do not live in a place of hating the oppostion you just made that up and used confirmation bias. Switching sides deserves merit, but only if it's earned. I care for people on both sides, and love when people can change their mind to something I believe is more correct. Even I never said Aiden said he was a good guy, that's not the problem with what Aiden is doing. The problem is not knowing enough about a situation and speaking on it, further, there is no hating on Tucker here. People are just acknowledging that his change in position seems very fake/done to save his own skin and not actual changing of the mind. People have come to this conclusion because they have seen his playbook over the years. You act like no one is allowed to switch side, ofcourse they are, but two things. First you can still get shit for it if you have done harm to people essentially, people may be angry. Second, you cannot just get a free pass if you are a frontrunner, if someones grandma feels bad for voting trump, she will be forgiven for learning. But when someone who spearheads him and is likely a big influence in his winning of the election, this person deserves way more flack and scepticism, He can prove him self, but it will take time and people are allowed to be mad. Tucker is just not the same thing as the average american, it's WAY more impacftul, he has responsibility and can get shit for it.

Zachary Lucchetti

Aiden’s bleeding heart liberalism is what caused us to be in this situation. Why do we give rats the benefit of the doubt

Jeremy

I’m gonna have to disagree on the Tucker thing on this. He’s a guy with a lot of VERY far right leaning opinions on things, however, he’s been on my timeline for years now and two things that he’s pretty much always held to is that he wants the Epstein files released with arrests made and to never get into war with Iran. There’s even that one famous clip that everyone saw from years ago where he publicly shamed Ted Cruz for not knowing anything about Iran and trying to fight them. I don’t agree with Tucker on pretty much any political issues, but this felt like a circle of people made assumptions about a person who they never view and assumed that having conservative opinions = bad person. I didn’t want to make this sound like a hate comment or anything but I feel like there was just some wrong info being shared around

Lemonade Stand

You'll get a full response in the next ep in like 2 days but in the world where Tucker gets my "benefit of the doubt" in the situation described it just means he's an even shittier guy LOL, at least IMO. I think I explained myself pretty poorly so I understand why I'm so widely misunderstood here but I'm basically saying what if Tucker believes his bullshit and isn't playing 5D grifter chess - Aiden

Zachary Lucchetti

I see where you’re coming from, and I’m not wronging you for wanting to be a good person. I can admit I’m incredibly jaded and over the BS we have to deal with politically. However I think it’s less so benign ignorance and much more weaponized. This is the rights MO, shift goal posts, blame, etc. allowing any sort of grace gives them more wiggle room than we need to allow them. You give them an inch and they shoot two protesters in the streets, kidnap thousands and start global wars with no objective or reason. I truly believe that anything except full removal of their ideology is a defeat for the Average American and what real American values are, however false they are in actuality. And just as an aside. I’m incredibly worried. I feel powerless, watching my country sink further and further from where I wish it would be. Every day something worse takes place and it feels like all we can do is survive. Our governments checks and balances have failed and we have an administration quite literally running rampant. I mean you can choose to believe it or not, but I truly believe they’re staging assassinations for political gain with this most recent White House dinner BS. The dots are at least very easy to connect. I’m wondering how and if this will ever end.

Lemonade Stand

I think you're actually missing what I am saying entirely here to be honest, I understand you're stressed and where these feelings are coming from (I have no problem with them, I largely agree) but "giving an inch" in this context is me saying that Tucker genuinely believes his anti-immigration, white nationalist principles (among other things), and isn't just saying them because he's a grifter trying to capitalize on his audience. You're interpreting my charity as "maybe he's an ok guy kind of" (from how I am reading this) and that's not what I am trying to say at all. In the case where my "benign ignorance" is right, he is a worse person I would argue. That's why I'm kinda shocked by the response but I think I understand that I just explained my position really poorly here. Him maintaining his principles doens't mean he's a good guy, his principles are explicitly bad IMO.

Lemonade Stand

Here Brian I'll be real, you come across as very frustrated but I'm sure you're a nice guy. I think we should talk about this directly, especially since I think you're misunderstanding much of what I am saying (which is my fault for sure) and how Atrioc feels about it. Add me on Discord - aidencalvin - I'm starting a new thing where I try to talk to frustrated commenters on a call! :) Just let me know when you do so I confirm the request - Aiden

Brian Duffy

Hi Aiden, I'm more than happy to discuss with you, and would definitely like to hear out your position more clearly. I added you, my username is xanduffy.

Jack Haehl

New Apple ceo John Ternus's first and only job before Apple was for designing VR headsets. You know what that means? 10 MORE GENERATIONS OF VISION PRO

Zachary Lucchetti

Ah, I believe I see where you’re coming from now. For some reason I got the impression that you thought Tucker was back tracking on trump out of genuine thought and not simply because he’s increasingly not popular even on the rights base. Fundamentally I agree I think he does have genuine beliefs in his principles but I really do think that in an overarching sense his principles are only as strong as his viewership. I don’t think him back tracking on trump is anything but that. Without a viewership, what is he truly? That’s his source of income and “power” and imho the backtracking is just an attempt to preserve that. That’s my thought process anyways. I’d think that if he was truly principled, he’d stand by trump because their agendas have seemed similar and I guess that’s maybe where we see differently? It’s always hard to connect through text and understand people, at least for me. I appreciate you taking the time to explain your idea more in depth.

Nick

It seems like I might be one of only a few people that disagrees with Atrioc on this one. He is presenting his opinion as if it is a matter of fact, when there isn't the evidence available to do so beyond Tucker being generally a shitty person. Doug and Aiden are saying that he is probably right, but don't have enough information to be as confident in that opinion as what Atrioc is expressing.

Tyhlir

Is there no premium episode for this week?

Anthony Snider

Aiden, the difference is once you do know Tucker's talking points and entire political history, you'll realize he's just an anti-semitic racist grifter and a genuinely terrible human being so there is no "trying to understand" where he's coming from But also I don't recommend looking more into him? Because it'll just make you feel gross. Essentially, though, he doesn't DESERVE the benefit of the doubt, under any circumstances, ever

James

Nah, they aren't saying it's bad for Tucker to change sides. They are just saying he isn't doing it for moral reasons, he is doing it for money. I happen to think him changing sides and clinging to relevancy is a bad thing too - Americans need pragmatic populism, not partisan populism. But that isn't what the other comments were saying

Sam S

I agree with what I think is the principle of Aiden's argument, being that we shouldn't kneejerk a position switch like this as a grifter reading the tea leaves, and possibly accept that a person can have these moral values and genuinely be turned off from Trump's actions. It's a good approach to have in general. However, in this specific case, Tucker has a documented history of reading the room and contradicting himself in the moment to appease the masses of today. And he's only been reinforced by the breakneck speed of modern news coverage. He could support Israel's defense today and call them genocidal tomorrow, and cover it up with a flurry of clips and podcast appearances.

Emmanuel Alagbala

Idk anything about Tucker Carlson so it's very interesting hearing people talk about him. On one hand, Tucker seems to have a history that many people have interpreted as he "having no principles". Aiden isn't wrong because ultimately no one here knows Tucker Carlson. It's one of those that both Aiden and Atrioc both have truth to what they're saying but only one of them is right and none of us know for sure