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LOUD Ep. 14 (Patreon)

Published:
2022-02-15 14:00:35
Imported:
2026-06

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Comments

Malaki.H

OMG YES!! I was very excited for this episode, since hearing 3racha was on this I've been barely holding myself back from watching it on my own, but it's worth watching it together now

WiseSmellyLegs

Finally those eliminations are over! If there were more rounds with eliminations the final line up would have been Lee Seung Gi, JYP & PSY… Here I have two questions. First question: Do you think Daniel changed his mind about idol life and told PSY to eliminate him? Somebody told me already: „No, he was asked about this on his live stream and he told them he did not“ and I do not want to be distrustful and arrogant, but I would like to see the live stream on my own and anyway, although he probably did not signed any contract or any convention, I do not think he wants to be that much open about these things in general… like LOUD was important journey for him, he gained a lot of knowledge and experiences and fans as well, so saying something like: „Yeah, we agreed on that“ could possibly made bad impact on the whole show or maybe even on the future P Nation group. My reason why I think he asked for that is he said something like: „They told me to speak/say this in Korean“, which feels weird, because they could not tell him: „Hey, you know… in case you get eliminated, speak in Korean, please“… Also someone might say: „He said during the second casting before live rounds, he made his decision to stay“ and that is 100% true, but also the live rounds were the life of being an idol. Before that it was „just“ preparing one performance each round, it was not aired live and basically it was like the whole training before debut. But live rounds were about preparing more performances each week, being aired live, seeing fans voting and haters hating. Like yeah, that was also in previous rounds, but it was not that much intense and also viewers were more open-minded about Daniel’s „not typical idol look“ and as also for another example people did not care about Koki’s age that much, probably because they were thinking both of them would get eliminated… Before I share my thoughts on PSY’s point of view in this situation, I would like to come back to your words in previous round, where you spoke about the “illusion of freedom” of fan votes. Now we know they planned to have 7 members group and 5 members group. I cannot tell they planned it from really early on, because for example, when Sung Jun chose P Nation rather than JYPEnt, PSY was really surprised, so even them were not probably 100% sure about everything, but everything make sense, why they had one wild card, why they casted the number of contestants they casted, why the last collaboration performance was not included to voting, but it took care to bring fans of HyunA and 3racha so they can vote for their Team in those two other performances and to be honest I would say those collaboration performances were made like HyunA will have just a cameo and 3racha will really collaborate with their Team and besides this I think for nowadays viewers and Kpop fans 3racha/Stray Kids has bigger name than HyunA has, so it had to bring more fans to Team JYP, also it makes sense, why PSY put 5 trainees into LOUD and JYP only 3 and I think Lee Dong Hyeon is the reason, why JYP did not cast Lim Kyeong Mun, because he knew at that time, which members he really wants and since he casted less members, he knew he will be the one with 5 members. Also maybe because they could talk to each other (I mean JYPSY) and since PSY wanted his 5 former trainees they had to agree that PSY cannot have just 5 members, because that would mean eliminating Eun Hwi and they both knew he has to debut because of his producing skills and I have not seen PSY so relieved as he was, when Eun Hwi chose P Nation. I would even say I was right, when I thought PSY made a deal with JYP, that both of them will score all of them in all previous rounds in the way their former trainees will not be eliminated and in case they are nominated for elimination, they will be saved as in case with Jang Hyun Soo. And as you mentioned the „illusion of freedom“ for fan voting. I mentioned something similar that both JYPSY but mainly JYP casted some members with the thought in mind: „Well, we have to make this show like fans were included, so they feel they took a part in it as well, to gain more popularity, so we need some contestants, which can get eliminated, so those ones I want in the group, are saved“. I do not want to say they just used them, they definitely helped each Team to get some popularity and for their own it gave them some experiences and fans for their future, but basically both JYPSY knew, who they want and I would say PSY knew it even from the really early on since the first round, but basically after he had his former 5 trainees and Eun Hwi, he knew he will choose just one contestant and the same with JYP, when he knew he has Gye Hun, Amaru, Keiju and his Dong Hyeon he was only thinking about the last member. But back to PSY’s point of view. So he knew he will keep his „OG 5“, because he is loyal to them and he planned to debut them even without LOUD. Eun Hwi for sure. I mean although he is not good dancer and his rap is not that precise as Daniel’s is, he is THE PRODUCER of this show and future generation of Kpop and none of his OG 5 is into producing. So then he could choose only one more and he could choose from two rappers and two dancers. Although I like Kim Dong Hyun a lot and I would prefer to have him there more than someone of PSY’s OG 5, I can obviously see Daniel is on another level. And although I like Lee Ye Dam so much and I started to like him even more than before during this rewatch with you, I think Koki is THE DANCER of this show. But to be honest since debuting Koki is so controversial and many people will hate this group for that, it would be clever move to keep Ye Dam, but I will get into that in a minute. So PSY was choosing between awesome rapper and awesome dancer and although Koki is my number 1 throughout the whole show, I think Daniel would be better choice, because all of PSY’s OG 5 are good dancers, but none of them is true rapper. As you mentioned with Kyung Jun in episode 9, he is assigned rapper, and that is the main reason of mine. Not just Kyung Jun but Hyun Soo or even Jun Hyeok as well (although he is the best in rapping of all 5 of them) are assigned to be rappers and it does not give the same vibe and feeling as it does with Daniel or Eun Hwi. And mind you Koki is much better dancer than all of them obviously, even Tae Hun is not on the same level and all of them are learning from Koki and they appreciate him for that, but I would say it is easier to „tighten the gap“ between well trained „assigned dancers“ and someone, who was born to be a dancer than between assigned rappers and true rapper. Also Daniel is also awesome producer (not like EunHwi, but you know…), so it would be crazy to have these two in one group! And I know, fans took care to vote for Koki, so he ended up on the first place, so someone could say he did not have that many haters as Daniel did, but the thing is, haters share their hates and opinions on the internet and not that many of them would take their time to vote for other members to keep him low. So haters of Daniel were mainly from LOUD viewers, but Koki’s were from general public as well and in this case it is not something new to debut a group with someone like Daniel, who does not have the typical idol look, so there would not be that much hate, but in case with Koki… well I am still waiting, how it all will go with people, who will be surprised and angry about his age, although they did not know him from LOUD… Now back to Lee Ye Dam. It might have been obvious from early on for Daniel and everyone else that PSY will be eliminating those, who were not his OG 5, but this is the perspective we see as viewers and not as contestants, so although he could have known the idol life is not for him even after the first or second round, he could have made his final decision and change his mind based on Lee Ye Dam elimination and because of what I wrote above, he realised Koki is next and kind of sacrifice himself for him? It is weird to phrase it like this, but maybe he was questioning himself about this type of life during live rounds and he thought something like: „Okay, there is a chance, I will quit this life in a future and that would have meant I closed this opportunity for Koki“. I know all of this are just big questions and speculations to which we will not ever get any answer, I just wanted to share my train of thoughts. And since I see how long this comment is, I will ask the second question in another comment.

WiseSmellyLegs

Second question: Do you think Yoon Min would have been able to make it into the final line up in Team P Nation? I know this is just one huge what if... but I mentioned this in episode 11 that PSY wanted to cast Yoon Min, or better to say he planned to put him on hold, but JYP surprised him, when he casted Yoon Min after all. I do not want to make this comment even longer, so I will not repeat everything I said there. I know this question is basically based on: „Yoon Min would have been casted instead of Koki“, because in case PSY would not casted Jang Hyun Soo and casted Yoon Min with Koki, that would mean the situation would be more less same, because PSY kept his wild card for the last round to save Jang Hyun Soo, so he would have used it for Yoon Min, since he did not get that much fan votes in Team JYP, so I assume it would have been the same and I would say it would not make any difference for Lee Ye Dam and Kim Dong Hyun, if Yoon Min would have been in Team P Nation. So the situation would have been between Daniel and Yoon Min and answer to this is based on your opinion about the whole situation with Daniel and if he chose it on his own. As I mentioned, all of this are just thoughts of mine, so personally I would say it would go the same round that Daniel would have sacrifice himself for Yoon Min, because Yoon Min has been training to debut for some years already (because he was in Cube before…).

WiseSmellyLegs

I wanted to keep this comment for the last episode, where PSY mentions one thing about Woo Kyung Jun and Choi Tae Hun, but since it will not affect the line up or anything, so it is not like „BIG SPOILER“ and also because of you talking about this exact thing in the last 15 minutes, I will tell it now. PSY says there that Kyung Jun and Tae Hun joined his label really early on. I am not sure if he specifies the date, but it was basically even before Jessi and HyunA with Dawn, they joined P Nation like really at the very beginning, when the label did not have any name or any popular artists besides PSY himself… In my opinion I think Cheon Jun Hyeok is the only one out of those former 5 trainees, who has the „loud mind“ and that is also the reason, why I did not get into those former trainees during my first time watching it and also during this second time, although I like them more, it is not the same as with Ye Dam for example. Maybe Oh Sung Jun sort of get closer to the place, how I feel about Jun Hyeok, mainly because of his solo performance during the second casting, that was the turning point for me as well during my first time watching this show. So basically I see, why I kept Jun Hyeok and Sung Jun and since Kyung Jun and Tae Hun were „loyal“/believed in PSY’s idea of creating his own label, he wants to be loyal to them as well. So… the last one is Jang Hyun Soo and it was obvious throughout whole LOUD that he was the only one, who were not once but twice nominated for elimination. With this last/third nearly elimination during this round I feel like it was made just for drama, because 7 members group are more common and better for choreographies and also it would feel weird if he did not use his wild card, so he just did not want to make it look like: „Yeah, he is eliminated and right in the second he is not“ or maybe SBS asked him to do it in this way for the drama effect. But here is one thing! From what I found on the internet, Tae Hun was under The Black Label before P Nation (The Black Label is under YGEnt), so he might have „followed“ him or even if he did not know PSY anyhow, I still get, why PSY is loyal to him. Although in case of Kyung Jun it is a bit tricky/weird. In episode 9 he told Lee Seung Gi he was street casted… I found also some speculations he was in HYBE or something and it is true he said in that episode he was street casted many times, so maybe he was there for a month or something and then decided to join P Nation. But still it is not the same as with Tae Hun, because to be honest Kyung Jun as a foreigner (he is Korean, but he grew up in Australia) he might have not known about any P Nation or something at all, so for me it feels different and I am not sure if I understand PSY in this case with Kyung Jun. And now… Here comes the thing I did not want to spoil in the episode number 13, where I shared my thoughts about eliminating Lee Ye Dam. Let me phrase it like this: - There were 3 members eliminated from Team P Nation - Kim Dong Hyun, although I like him a lot and I think he is better rapper than Woo Kyung Jun or Jang Hyun Soo, I kind of understand, why he was not ready to debut - Daniel Jikal, I talked about this in previous comment A LOT and although it is not official, I feel like he chose it on his own, so although he was in my top 3, I respect his decision and it is better as it is rather than if he would have left the group sooner or later - Lee Ye Dam, I mentioned many reasons, why I do not agree and do not understand his elimination in the episode 13 and basically he is the only one I will truly miss in this group, because I understand, why Daniel and Dong Hyun are not in this group and although I said, why I understand, why PSY wanted to keep his former trainees, after I remembered Kyung Jun said to Lee Seung Gi he was street casted I started to question myself: „Does it really mean that much as in case with Tae Hun?“, I do not want to say it out loud and hurt some Kyung Jung fans, if they are reading this, but I cannot phrase it in any better way, I feel like Lee Ye Dam should have been in this group instead of Kyung Jun. Like yeah sure… I can say if Daniel changed his mind earlier, he could have been eliminated instead of Ye Dam and than the final decision for PSY would have been between Koki and Ye Dam and since many people do not understand Koki is not a child (like mentally) and they might be hating on him and this group, I think because of this „reason“, Ye Dam would have been clever/saver choice. But Koki is the best dancer in this show, I would say, or at least in Team P Nation, so why should I think about this in this way? Like yeah… Kyung Jun is so called all rounder, but he is not the all rounder as Cheon Jun Hyeok is. Kyung Jun dance well, sing and rap as well and from these live rounds it seams, he will be a rapper in this group, but he is not the rapper as Daniel is, as Dong Hyun is, as Eun Hwi is, he is an assigned rapper and to be honest Ye Dam showed us he can learn quickly and he had some rap lines during these rounds as well, so since he is much better dancer, I would rather keep him than Kyung Jun. I mean, this group will have: Cheon Jun Hyeok as the true all rounder, his positions will be main vocal for sure and although he is also an assigned rapper I think he raps much better than Kyung Jun does, so he might be a lead rapper Oh Sung Jun as lead vocal Eun Hwi as producer obviously and main rapper (that is why I placed Jun Hyeok as lead rapper) Tanaka Koki as the main dancer, who gets a few lines of rap or singing Choi Tae Hun as lead dancer, like I know all of them except Eun Hwi are really good dancers, but I would say Tae Hun is the one right behind Koki and better than rest of them, so that is why I kept this position just for him and for sure a vocal or lead vocal And then we have Jang Hyun Soo and Woo Kyung Jun, who are both really similar to each other in case of their position in this group, so that is why I kept my reason here (down below), why I would have eliminated rather Kyung Jun than Ye Dam and still keep Hyun Soo. First I will say I would love to have here Ye Dam instead of both of them, so it is not like I hate Kyung Jun and I would have eliminated only him, so if PSY would have eliminated Hyun Soo instead of Ye Dam and then he would have used a wild card for Ye Dam (because fan votes would have probably eliminated him), I would have been more than okay. But now the main reason. I do not want to sound as I am sorry for Jang Hyun Soo in this way, so I do not want to sound like I would like to keep him in this group out of regret, but before P Nation he was in TS Entertainment… which for those, who do not know, TS Enter. was A BAD LABEL. I do not want to open here a big discussion about labels etc, but with TS Enter. I cannot find a good thing about them, so Jang Hyun Soo had to go through hard times and now it sounds like the thing I did not want it to sound like, but from these facts we can see he has been working on himself and trying to debut for a while and yeah some people do not have that talent as others do, that is true and I am not comparing Hyun Soo and Kyung Jun in this way, but I am comparing them in the way that Jang Hyun Soo is willing to get better so hard and I am not saying Kyung Jun is just doing nothing, not at all, but now I will go back to the times before Lim Kyeong Mun was eliminated. Woo Kyung Jun and Lim Kyeong Mun were compared to each other because both of them were sort of shy and had problem to open themselves on the stage. And for sure, Kyung Jun got better in this way through live rounds and he was lucky PSY kept him and did not eliminate him as it happened to Kyeong Mun. But to be honest… I am not sure, if he has opened himself enough. Jang Hyun Soo did not have this problem, but if I compare Jang Hyun Soo trying to be better and working hard on himself with Woo Kyung Jun, who is also trying to get better in the way he needs to, I feel like Jang Hyun Soo is doing better and the main reason, why PSY always chose Jang Hyun Soo to be nominated for elimination rather than Kyung Jun, is that Kyung Jun has the visual face, the prettiest face there, which gains fans a lot and also he is fluent in English… I mean… I understand that pretty face is the big fact, why many groups get attention of Kpop fans, so it makes sense, why PSY wanted to keep him and since the whole show is presented as they are forming a „global group“ (although it feels and it is like a Kpop group), it will be useful to have fluent English speaker in this group, because no matter how the group or show feels after all, PSY will try to go world-wide for sure. But in the case of their talent, I would have definitely kept Lee Ye Dam rather than Kyung Jun and Hyun Soo.

Darleen Pfeiff

it was announced end January that koki is actually cut from the debut team and will continue training with P Nation

BaoziBang

I think many people don't get that in an idol group the individuals aren't that important, a group can still be amazing with mostly average Members as long as the synergy is great and they have 1/2 stand outs which is why I would have also voted out Daniel and Yedam simply because they didn't fit in well enough. The chemistry between the Members was off.

WiseSmellyLegs

Okay… I am done, sorry for these f*** long spam comments here, I just wanted to share my thoughts on so many things throughout the whole show, but I had to keep it for myself until you reach this episode. Since this whole journey was so emotional for me and I got so deep into this show that I even cried during some eliminations and I remember watching this episode for the first time, when I was on summer holiday in Málaga (city in the south of Spain), I had to go to StarBucks to have better internet connection to watch it live and because Koki was my number 1 since the very first episode I was so nervous he might get eliminated, I mean by PSY as Daniel was or maybe also because of fan votes and PSY would have not saved him, because as you said Koki is a controversial choice for general public, which does not know him, so I cried even more than after Daniel's elimination but because of the joy, like those were tears of joy, because I could finally relieve after all those episodes during which I read so many hates on Koki in some forums and websites. So because of this I would like to give this show 10/10, but your words at the end of this video (like last 15 minutes) are exactly the reason, why those last live episodes were based so much on PSY’s personality and the fact he could not let his former trainees go, so because of this it is 9/10, or to be honest I would like to say 8/10, because I know about one big aftermath of this show, but I do not know, if I should tell it now or after the last episode next week or maybe someone else might mention it anyway… But the last thing I wrote in my notes, when you started to watch LOUD, I wanted to say after you finish watching the whole show/know the final line up was this: Koki might be the next TaeMin I know this is big and for someone controversial statement and I know their dance styles are different, but from the point of view as the iconic and the best dancer of Kpop scene, I would say Koki might be the next big dancer of Kpop. And mind you, I know there are many god-like dancers already, but the thing is TaeMin is still the unofficial king there and do not take this as an insult to TaeMin or to any other dancer in Kpop, but Koki is going to debut with these skills and this ability he has gained from his training since he was 4 years old and he has whole career in front of him and he is starting on the level as many of them are now.

Sven Lenders

Hi PD, I was wondering if you plan to do any other survival shows outside of Produce on Tuesday after LOUD ends. If so, here are some shows I would recommend: Mixnine The Unit Stray Kids survival show My Teenage Girl Even though some of them have no results, I think it is interesting to see how the idols of today started. Moreover I find it very interesting to see your insight on certain shows and their contestants.

Jenni Laine
>>77931912

I fully understand this opinion of cutting Kyung jun earlier during this show. I mentioned in some earlier episode that Kyung jun was my favourite and the one i was rooting for and it's been that way when I watched this show for the first time as well. Now it is not just because of his visuals, even though he is absolutely beautiful D: For some weird reason ever since I became a fan of kpop in 2016, i always had my favourite idols but I was never like so emotionally invested in like a specific person. I was more into the entire group but I never understood that ultimate bias thing that people had. Ult groups i did understand. Ever since I saw Kyung Jun's audition I was like instantly invested or atleast intrested. I think the reason is that I would describe myself as a very shy and introverted person too. I do dance as a hobby and whenever we have to perform in front of like other dancers or a teacher... i never do my best cause I just can't let go and most of the time I just lie and say im sick or something. But when there is like a legit audience, all of that kinda flies away. That is why I connected with Kyung Jun so well cause I totally get him in that regard. He really started shining in these live shows, because they probably gave him the energy he needs. I also think that with intoverts or shy people they can rly shine in certain situations because they can suprise you. Kyung jun probably suprised a lot of people in these last few rounds, which is I think the thing that made him special. He was able to overcome some of his insecurities. I can't lie and say his looks had no impact because they obviously did, atleast with fan voting but I do think that PSY knew that all he needed was that fire and confidence in order for his skills to develop, in the end keeping him was the right choice imo. And I also think that he fits almost every concept that they did. He was in almost every live performance P Nation had cause I think he has that potential to sell any concept and they did give him a lot of killing parts (like in the hyuna performance he was the center for the first chorus, he has been the center for a lot of the dance things i noticed) But like for example I don't think that Kyung jun's charisma or position clashes with anyone either. He has that potential to be a centre and have killing parts. Hyun soo is more of a stable member but I don't view him as a center, so I think Kyung Jun has some individuality within this group as well. One personal thing for me is that I find his voice rly cool when he sings and/or raps, which is probably just me but I think its attractive lmao ANYWAY all i wanted to say was I get the criticism but for some reason he is like the first idol, who i actually got emotionally connected too. I guarantee he will become my ult when that group debuts :Ddd somebody save me

Serena

Soo first of all sadly its was announced just recently that Koki will not join the lineup after all and instead continue training under P Nation. I'm kinda glad since he's so young and he can definetly grow more but also sad for him since it might have been disappointing to grow so close with the others and then not to end up debuting after all. But I'm very much looking forward to his future. Secondly mannn what a journey. I actually started watching this show here with you. I heard about it when it was airing but i wasn't really interested until u started it here so i gave it a shot. I started rooting for so many boys during the show but the one i felt attached to on a personal level from the first episode he appeared was Kyungjun. Of course he caught my eye with his visuals but what kept me with him was his personality and his journey on the show. I've always been an extremly shy and introverted person so whenever I come across Idols who are like me i can't not root for them. And the growth he showed on this show moved me so much and really gave me so much hope of overcoming this and showing the world what you're really made off. He is a giant inspiration to me personally and that's why I rooted for him from the very start and I'm so excited about his debut. I'm really looking forward to both groups and what they have in store for us ❤

Serena

Btw JYP also announced that the group will be debuting sometime this year 👍 Hoping the same for the P Nation Groups aswell

Thabit Ayob
>>77942855

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT? where was this announced? Is it official? Man this is heatbreaking, i can't after Yedam and Daniel i onl had Koki left. Am sad, i know he's young but to not debut with his friends is sad and he might leave Pnation, and Pnation won't be making another group before 3 or 4 years, i was sooo ready for him to blow the world with how talented he is and young, there was no one like him

Thabit Ayob

I noticed in the last two episodes Daniel got barely any screentime, even in the performances he gets like 2 or 3 verses per song Especially this episode, it felt like he already decided to be the one leaving. I felt so bad for him but i hope he stays with PNation and debuts solo he will be a great asset for PNation future

Ty

Love me or leave me is my favorite performance of all of Loud

Anonymous

Pnation recently announced that koki himself, his parents and the agency agreed that koki won’t be debuting in the upcoming boy group and instead continue to train under pnation.

Thabit Ayob

I totally agree with your point at the end. And i already mentioned it when Ye Dam got eliminated. PSY being attached to his trainees made the show kind of pointless, I honestly can let go of like 2 of PNation trainees, they're not LOUD, (one of them is the one who was about to get eliminated but i LOVE him lol). They let go of YeDam and Daniel (i know he's not good at dancing but LOUD wise he's great and would make great combination with eunhwi taking parts in the production and the team would be able to produce a lot of their music and they're complimenting each other when it comes to rap pretty well, i mean look at BTS, RM, no offence is the worst dancer in the team but he made all of BTS different and it BTS would've never came this far without him) Now i saw in the comments KOKI being left out of the debut team, i'm like wth, all of the ones that made me fall for PNation got kicked out. YeDAM, Daniel, Koki, the only one left is Eunhwi. Tbh i wasn't fan of PNation trainees until they got teamed up with these new members, they got them the flavor and talent that Kpop doesn't really have. I hope just like they put Koki on hold because of his age probably even tho he passed the show, they would bring back Yedam and Daniel. Otherwise i would not be very interested in the team. The show had reaaaaally great potential to make the next generation kpop kings. I stopped being interested in kpop groups since they're all the same they're al KPOP-y (if you know what i mean) but the ones that auditioned made me think this kpop group can be the change. sorry i don't remember the names they're too hard for me even tho i watched the show two time.

Thabit Ayob
>>77951311

The saddest news, the last member that was making me root for PNation tbh.

grace

i cried sm abt daniel i feel dehydrated 😁🤗😢 i agree the group works better without him but it was just sad bc ik how close he got with eunwhi and junhyeok

Doyoungismyult

See I thought this show was amazing from beginning to end. I have no problem with Psy’s attachment to his trainees. They are all amazing and they are only going to get better as they go on. I wanted Yedam in the group as well but I overall still think PSY’s choices were for the most part great. The show never said that the Pnation or JYP would get rid of their trainees. They were basically testing them. From the start I could tell and the show said that it was one last test for the trainees. They know their trainees more than any of us so they see exactly how far they have come. Kyungjoon has grown increasingly fast. Especially these live show episodes. He is an incredible center. Overall I am happy with how things ended. I think both groups have amazing lineups that are all deserving of their spots and I can’t wait to see what they bring to this vast world of kpop.

Thabit Ayob
>>77933080

I'm really excited for koki. I'm just sad he's not debuting with the members. I really hope he doesn't leave pnation because no other company will cherish and treat him better

Lokkij

Oops, super long comment! Apologies, turns out that not commenting for most of the show has left me with a lot to say. Overall, I strongly favor the JYP team - Amaru, Donghyeon and Keiju were my top 3 pretty much from the auditions, and they've only improved since then. Yoonmin is also incredibly skilled and stable, and Gyehun is obviously super solid. It's a really good lineup that could go any number of directions. I do like the P Nation team and will be following them, but they've been very one-note - and worse, their style feels a little generic in the boy group landscape right now. But if P Nation can carve out a space for them beyond the standard brash hip hop boygroup sound while still adhering to their style, they could excel. My opinion on the P Nation MOVE performance is the same as for most P Nation performances: it was once again good, but much of the same. Aggressive and brash, lots of brass, phrygian motifs, all the like. Competently performed, but nothing new, and it didn't do much to win me over to the P Nation side. Same with the I'm Not Cool performance: nothing new. HyunA was awesome, but in this collaboration round I want to see the members shine with the senior artist instead of fading into the background once they appear. The retro performance was cool, but did expose that they're mainly good at the brash P Nation style. It was nice to see something different and fun from them though! For the JYP performances, I loved the retro and Back Door performances. The Love Me Or Leave Me performance exemplified my main issue with most of the JYP live round performances: poor choreo and stage direction. It's clear that JYP loves synchronized group dance, but this is not the show for that! I think syncronized group dance is a bit boring in most contexts anyway, but it mostly works for music show performances. Here it falls flat completely, because the stage is huge and you only have one chance to show the audience your performance. That means you want to have a lot of big moments that clearly and blatantly showcase your members. The retro and Back Door performances did a great job of this. Dramatic lighting! Big vocal opening! Fun transition! Throwing Yoonmin over another member! That's what catches your attention and shows, in a very unstubtle way, how cool/cute/competent/athletic these idols are. The Love Me Or Leave Me performance had a great arrangement but the choreo and stage direction were fairly standard and did not match the arrangement at all. (Side note: the Again & Again choreo was even worse at this - most of the song is one repeated synchronized group dance, and it's honestly not even a good dance!) Overall though, the retro and Back Door performances were more than enough to pull me over to JYP's side anyway, and I'll take the good moments from Love Me Or Leave Me as a bonus. My opinion on Koki debuting, because surely there hasn't been enough discussion on this subject already: I think it was good not to debut him, even though it stings that they only figured that out after the show ended. I agree that mature young people should not be kept away from the stage, but debuting as an idol is not just about working hard and performing on stage: it's a long term commitment to a company that holds an immense amount of power over you, and to a huge and complicated audience. That's a huge deal even for people with much more years and experience, and I don't think children should generally be able to subject themselves to that. Performing on stage? Absolutely. But becoming an idol, with all the insane realitites that come with it? Probably not. Great show though! I don't watch survival show because of that really cutthroat, grim atmosphere you were talking about. But this show primarily focuses on how talented and capable everyone is, and even though they have to eliminate people it still feels like a super positive show overall. I'm looking forward to the celebratory last episode!

billie27

First of all, the fact that you started the show after the airing ended and that 5 months later you just finished it and none of the jyp team and pnation team debuted is so funny to me. But I love the fact that JYP and Pnation are taking the time that is needed for them to debut. I was personally rooting more for the JYP team even tho I agree that Pnation had better choreo in the live stage, JYP at least gave us more diversity in terms of concept, and it made me appreciate more the members. Also, now that we know that Koki isn't gonna debut with the lineup, I'm a bit concerned about their debut... I also personally agree with him not debuting (he was way too young te be an idol and he's also japanese and barely speak in korean so I felt like mentally it was gonna way too hard for him even tho he seems a lot mature). So, know Pnation is left with only 6 members and that's such an odd number for a boy group in my opinion lol especially because the group seemed like it was gonna be a performance based heavy team... (Secretly hoping for pnation to add Yedam to the group lol.) And also, now that Koki left it made Eunhwi as the only "loud" person and it's a bit unfair in my opinion for the other contestant... It kinda felt like Psy used the show as an excuse to introduce his trainee to the public eye and never consider eliminating them. Now for the Jyp team I totally agree with you for the fact that it seemed that the group doesn’t have a center, the jyp team is the team that i’m rooting for but I also see that they lack some charisma and edge. The fact that they’re only 5 members can a disadvantage for them because all the members needs to stand out and none of them can hide their flaw behind the presence of a lot of members. For example, Itzy work a lot as 5 members because each of the members stand out and have their own charm and lots of charisma in my opinion. But we have to remember that the jyp team is actually very young and 3 of the 5 members were not jyp trainee like I don’t even think Keiju train under a company before coming to the show. So, for me with the couple of months they’re using after the show end towards their debut, I feel like we can have a nice surprise coming from them which is why I’m excited for their debut. Also, a 5 members boy group from JYP is a nice change in my opinion and like you said I feel like with this group they will definitely be more pop than at least stray kids lol. And about Gyehun I feel like for the live stage jyp didn’t really try to make him stand out, I think they were more focusing on bringing the group into the same “level” of capacity, so I feel like Gyehun didn’t even show what he’s fully capable, He’s definitely center material if at least jyp tries to make him one. The center will either be Gyehun or Keiju, but Keiju needs a lot more training for him to be a center, so it’ll probably be Gyehun, I don’t see jyp choosing yoonmin as a center.

Doyoungismyult

I’m perfectly fine with JYP not having a center. I know this is a weird comparison…but I follow a group called Little Mix and for many years they never had a center and I personally loved it. It gave everyone a chance to shine. I also think that Kyungjoon perfectly embodies what it means to be LOUD. Quiet people have the LOUDEST minds. He really embodied that the more that the show progressed. He is one of the shiest…but he got out of his shell the longer he performed until the end where we saw how incredible he can truly be.

Anonymous

I'm more excited by the JYP group tbh, though a lot of that is I supect I will like the direction of their music more. With so few members they'll will be the smallest male idol group JYP has had, but then again TXT are a five member group and also (as you were saying about Taehyun) when TXT arrived on the scene, those first two singles were more about really technically solid and steady performers doing a really good job with pretty special songs worked up by Big Hit's producers (no shade to TXT, they're probably my faves if I had to pick). I feel like this JYP group is in theory capable of the same. They're all technically sound and adaptable. Maybe they lack something in the way of sheer magnetism and glamour, but that could come later. If they start with a Crown/Run Away-esque era, would that be so bad? (Plus they're under JYP, so unlike all the other groups debuting that really have to make a splash immediately, they've got the advantage that a certain level of attention is guaranteed and they can grow in the spotlight).

Doyoungismyult

Eunhwi has been my favorite since day 1. I think he is a musical genius and I really think he will flourish on PSY’s team. I can’t wait to see what he will accomplish.

Holly

i totally agree with you regarding the final lineups. honestly, i would have loved to see doo hyun debut. he surprised me very pleasantly during the live stages. honestly i think he’s a better live performer (especially vocally) than keiju, but i do agree that if i had to choose one to eliminate, it would have to be doohyun. keiju just has this charm, especially in his dancing, and i think he could be a massive performer with more training. i was just a bit underwhelmed by his performances in the second half of the show. regarding the pnation lineup, i agree with you, but i honestly think that it’s the best lineup we can have considering the circumstances. a lot of the more ‘creative’ idols chose jyp or were ultimately unfit for the idol life (like daniel). i think that in pnation, junhyeok and eunhwi (and possibly koki) have that ‘it’ factor that makes them different. i’m honestly very sad that koki won’t be debuting with the group. the kid is so talented and i love their dynamic! i respect their choice though, and i’m excited to see where he will go in the future. i’m super excited for both groups! even though the pnation group might not be the “loudest” group, i think they’re so super talented, i’ve been loving their performances and dynamic and i can’t wait to see them debut. with jyp, i honestly think my perfect lineup would’ve included doohyun. nevertheless i’m super excited for them as well! my top picks through the show were gyeongmoon, amaru, sungjoon, and gyehoon. i haven’t felt this emotional about a show ever, and i’m super glad i decided to watch it! the concept is so original, and i’ve grown so fond of all of the contestants. super excited to see where they go!

Amanda Araujo

im just sad koki is not debuting with them but i understand tho i saw some people saying he was cut but in the statement they put out it says that it was a decision that it was made by koki and his family thats why he even is still on Pnation just not debuting now, i think maybe the pressure got to him and for him being so young they thought he wouldnt really handle it right now

LoLo

I was sad when Daniel Jikal was eliminated... he was the one I was rooting for the most since the beginning but I completely understand why he got eliminated and I often wonder if he's the one who chose to leave, since it didn't seem like idol life was for him. You can find him on social media btw - DanielJikal on both IG and YouTube! Seems like he may have some music in the works. Can't believe next week is the last week. It's been so much fun rewatching this with you and hearing your opinions! I can't wait for these groups to debut, there's rumors team JYP may debut in April, but we shall see! They were active on Twitter, but late last year, they went on hiatus from social media to focus on getting ready for their debut.

Irving

The line up of the pnation pretty much have all of my favorites so I'm really excited for their debut even tho koki is not in the line up anymore, I'm still hoping they will add yedam but now is just look impossible.... compare to jyp, pnation have a Lot of content to watch from their youtube channel like welcome to pnation (debut group) or the ploud series (while they were in the live rounds), etc. For jyp to be honest I'm not really feeling them yet but I'm still looking foward to their debut, my favorite was zoo doohyun and he was eliminated :c

cy

(apologies for the essay ahead ;-;) Wrt your assumption about the final voting where P nation wins this round: if that actually happened, team JYP would end up with 4 members which would actually be quite bad for the team given their current lineup, I can't imagine anyone else leaving from the remaining 5 members and I think JYP would have a really hard time with only 4 of them. X1's move: oh boy this song makes me wish X1 didn't disband ;-; I think Eunhwi's slowly becoming a better performer but I also think his rapping needs to improve; I don't understand Korean so I may be completely wrong but his diction sounds like it could still be improved to me. The performance was good but not exactly mind-blowing but compared to so many other survival shows they're performing so well considering that they're literal trainees. Day6's Love Me or Leave Me: The VCR broke my heart :( I might be biased since I stan day6 but I LOVE this song so I was really glad that this was chosen. I think this song played off Doohyun's strength in modern dance really well. I also love Gyehun's rap portion in this! One of the strengths that the JYP team has is that they have shown greater range throughout the live rounds and this performance highlights it. I think Gyehun works better with more intense concepts and it shows in the last few episodes with his dance breaks. PD saying that they wanted Gyehun to join P Nation makes me almost wish that this show would produce just one NCT-esque group under both JYP and P Nation and forming different subunits but that would probably be quite tough to coordinate :') I think what JYP is trying to do is to produce the next Stray Kids-esque self-produced group which has their own unique flair and sound. Maybe it's because we haven't actually heard any of their original songs yet but I think this lineup still has so much uncharted potential we don't see from the members because of how "neutral" they are with the exception of Gyehun. What Stray Kids had that this group doesn't were standout trainees who already had their own flair: even during their predebut era Stray Kids already had members like Han or Changbin which added some colour to their group (see Hellevator): I see more of this colour and uniqueness in the P Nation team for now. (also SKZ was initially formed by Chan rather than JYP himself which could have contributed to that) I do believe that the JYP trainees could eventually find their colour though with how much of a blank canvas most of them are. Also with the 5 members: very rarely do boy groups have only 5 members and existing BGs with 5 members are often limited in their choreo and the performance aspect considering how performance-heavy the kpop landscape is rn and this can be seen with TXT and AB6IX. It's a different story for GGs but the optimal number for boy groups seems to be 7+. I do wish that JYP had more trainees to begin with but I also think that PSY snagged the ones with more of their own unique flair regardless of how many trainees the JYP team originally had. PD thinking that they could be doing a skz song makes me want them to have performed a song like levanter instead though omg ;-; I think Love Me or Leave Me was too mature a concept for these kids to perform too! Just for context: among the fan songs that we could vote for, P Nation had: Ring Ding Dong - SHINee Very Good - Block B Crazy - 4minute HIT - Seventeen Move - X1 and JYP had: Love Me Right - EXO Aju Nice - Seventeen Love Me or Leave Me - DAY6 JACKPOT - Block B Gashina - Sunmi Song Golmae's A Chance Encounter: Finally a breath of fresh air! Agree with what was said about the centers: Taehun and Kyungjun are definitely obvious centers whereas JYP's group has no true centers yet but so many trainees have the potential. Hyun Jinyoung's Inside My Dim Memory: this performance is oddly reminiscent of Gyehuns shuffling for his audition omg ;-; and Amaru's singing at the start is so soulful and heavy and I agree that his voice is so good for R&B rather than pop. I loved this performance and the energy and youthfulness of this performance really made them shine. HyunA's I'm not Cool: I think this was more of a feature rather than a collab because HyunA just outshines them so much with her experience and there's only one of her vs 3racha so integrating her into the performance would be less natural. Stray Kids' Back Door: This is actually one of the recording studios in JYP I believe (the one with the Stevie Wonder pic)? Chan's studio is quite small and cramped so I imagine they wouldn't be able to fit everyone there. Also I think Gyuhun started training at JYP around the same time Han did, which would mean that he joined the agency before everyone in SKZ other than Chan and Jisung. JYP definitely has the edge here with Stray Kids being a younger boy group and their experience with Kingdom as opposed to P Nation having no other idols. I also think Gyehun having known SKZ when they were trainees as well as Yoon Min being the same age as Han helped them mesh together more. They definitely had more of a friendly sunbae relationship as opposed to HyunA. Overall: I would vote for team JYP (and this is completely biased) considering the two people I really rooted for during this show are Kyeongmun and Donghyeon. Objectively, most of the P Nation performances were better and even though they have younger members like Koki, the P Nation team as a whole seems older and more mature which works to their advantage. Kpop is never fair though and I personally just like the JYP group more so I'd vote for them naturally. I think 5 members is really the minimum for a boy group and I'm glad no one else got eliminated. They're definitely a longevity group as PD commented in the episode and I'm looking forward to seeing their growth! PSY really has a soft spot for his trainees and it might be so because of how all of them took a chance in P Nation and how PSY personally trained them. With Koki not debuting now, PSY essentially picked up only Eunhwi through this show and basically bagged a producer. I think the group would really need to prepare for a significantly longer time for debut especially if they're going to be self-produced. I also thought Kyungjun should have been cut but now he really came out of his shell and became more charismatic AND he's really popular and good-looking too. Chun Junhyeok is just fucking insane. I think Taehun ultimately would be needed in the group because he would be the leader. I think ultimately the concept of this show would not have worked because we're not just finding interesting people, but also a well-balanced group that would fit the idol image and last in the idol industry. With Koki leaving the group after discussions between him, his parents and P Nation, I honestly am very on the fence about this. Even though he does have the maturity, I do think that him going through puberty and all the shit that comes with growing up out of the spotlight might be better for him. While he can fit in P Nation's team well, with him not debuting P Nation would be far less restricted with all the laws on minors working a few years down the road. I also think the international kpop audience is not ready for children Koki's age to debut and I do think that quite many people would find it jarring to stan a kid that young-looking. The JYP team does have a weird age gap too with Yoon Min (born in 2000) being older than the other members (2004-7) but he still fits in well enough though! On a final note: I think it's hilarious how all of these kids, especially the younger ones, have no idea how to put on the idol image and they just seem so genuine and clumsy (maybe I'm getting old but the younger trainees REALLY feel like kids I want to take care of ;-;)

TeaMarten

In terms of Koki’s “departure”, I noticed him receive quite a bit of hate on Twitter before the statement was published. There were even accounts made (Korean and international) that were dedicated to the OT6 lineup (the lineup without Koki). They were quote-retweeting and commenting on his tweets bullying him because he looks like a little kid, that he doesn't fit the group, that he doesn't speak Korean well enough, or for his voice. Also, they were making hashtags for him to get kicked out. Even going by their logic, they were literally bullying a kid with an argument that he is a kid. Like, you can disagree with him debuting based on his age, you can be worried if he is mentally ready for this (since in terms of skills he has proven himself 1000%, hence he won) but why would you directly send a young boy so much hate? I just wish he continues the training and doesn’t give up on this dream of his… Because that would be such a loss if he does… (Maybe there is a chance that he will be added to the team in the future in a year or two, who knows?) To be honest it is kind of funny how their lineup now is literally the original OT5 trainee lineup + Eunhwi. I like the boys a lot, they are incredibly talented, and they are shining bright on every stage but in the lines of the whole show and its concept, it kind of feels a bit ?weird? I guess? ( Like it kind of feels like someone like Yedam didn’t even have a chance since of course it would be harder for him to bond with others who had been training together for years, so if you have to cut someone out and you have two people with a similar purpose/role in a group – you will cut out Yedam since he is still new to the team) Nonetheless, I am looking forward to their debut! I really like how JYP approached this by finding unpolished gems and picking up contestants with potential growth (Which makes me even more excited about what is there to come after their training/preparations that they are going through right now). He was especially critical towards his former trainees, I believe that if Amaru hadn’t fixed his issue and hadn’t worked on himself – he might have not been scouted by JYP, maybe even ended up in P-Nation for all I know. I can’t blame PSY for being sentimental though since he knew his trainees better, he was there to witness their growth whereas you could see how in a big company like JYPE, JYP wasn’t really the one handling the trainees therefore there was less “fatherly” attachment in that sense. But all the boys in both labels are incredibly talented and I am looking forward to what are they going to offer us in the future!

Wiktor

Something I look for when watching these survival shows is “Star Quality”. Sometimes you don’t have to be the most “skilled” person. But if you have that “IT Factor”, that’s actually more then enough reason to debut. I agree with PD’s opinions on PNation lineup. However, I think TaeHoon and Kyungjun also bring the “IT FACTOR” and is it mainly because of their visuals and stable skills? Yes. In KPOP more then in the past, “visual” members are what brings people to “stan” a group. It’s the attraction factor. Look at Xiaoting, Wonyoung/Sakura, Yuna (ITZY), SUNGHOON (Enhyphen). It’s always these stable “visual” members who bring in new audiences. And Kyungjun and TaeHoon are THAT for PNation.

kisa1909

Wow, reading the comments here, I didn't realize what was going on with Koki. Poor kid. Hope the negativity doesn't get him down 'cause he's definitely going places! Idk who will be my PNation bias. Either Eunhwi since I was rooting for him from the beginning, or Hyunsoo since he grew on me a lot. JYP's new group is going to be so difficult for me! I'll have to choose between Yoonmin and Donghyeon, both of whom I rooted for since the beginning. I didn't realize how attached I was to Donghyeon until he almost got eliminated, but I was surprised by how upset I was when his name was announced last episode. But Yoonmin.....I really love him too. I'm personally looking forward to JYP more since PNation's music isn't really my style, but we'll see what both groups debut with and go from there I guess!! Also I'd like to suggest putting Wild Idol on your list of survival shows to eventually get to! It was really entertaining to watch!

Ivy Jaggers

Ok first off I love this show and how it progressed. I feel like some comments make it seem like it was rigged when it came to ex trainees. I personally don’t. I’m not saying Psy wasn’t attached to his trainees, but I feel like he did use an objective view on who to eliminate including the trainees. Psy eliminated multiple trainees during various stages. They were saved based on the people selected to be eliminated as they showed more potential. Kyungmun was eliminated by JYP eventually but I feel like it was right. JYP seemed just as attached to Kyungmun as Psy was to his trainees. But the difference is Kyungmun’s progression leveled and he never really pushed himself past his insecurities. For example KyungJun. I agree that the both of them were on the same level in the beginning and they continued to moved similarly. But after KyungJun paired with someone (I can’t remember who right now) it really helped him come out of his shell and show more potential where Kyungmun kinda stayed where he was more comfortable. If he went for those high notes in his solo I bet JYP would have it that button so quick but he held back again. I think JYP was waiting for him to do something to show he was ready. Where as Kyungjun pulled out all he could for his solo. Hyunwoo… he was not my fave. Something about him I’m the beginning erked me and I don’t know why. I was ready for his elimination every time. But every time he wasn’t eliminated he showed more of why he should stay. I don’t know what happed but he made me love him. And I felt Psy knew his worth but was waiting for him to show everyone else and that is why he was saved so much! Hyun Soo may have been lacking in charisma (which is not my opinion at all anymore) but he was essential to the team. He filled a mom like roll and does really well with helping, teaching, and taking care of members. He plays an even bigger roll than just talent and charisma and I think above all else that is why Psy saved him so much. Regarding the Loud concept I think Kyungjun, SungJin, and Taehun all showed why they were picked. They wrote thier own raps, put together really good solos and worked well within each team. They were some of the quietest but also showed thier potential and passion the loudest (in my opinion) in-terms of putting together a team I think Taehun was chosen for his ability to lead. Not only the group itself but the performances. Yedam’s elimination was shocking to me when I first watched and I think I had the same reaction as most comments. But as i watched more behind the scenes content and looking at the teams he was part of prior to going to pnation he was with members of JYP more. I feel he was closer to them and there was this awkwardness with him and the pnation boys in the behind videos. Essentially I feel that is why he was eliminated. Psy mentioned about synergy as well. I don’t think the decision was made based on talent because by this point loosing any of them sucks but they have too look at it in the perspective of lasting long and members staying together. Daniel’s elimination was the hardest. I loved his voice so much and will miss hearing it. He got along great with everyone and with Kyungjun there I don’t think the language barrier was an issue. But if you looked at the last two elimination rounds I feel like he knew this was Coming. He was supper passionate and excited in the first live round. You can see all the hard work he put in. It makes me wonder if round two gave him a real life understanding of what JYP was asking him. You may think you know something but until you experience it you really can’t know. I think that is what happened. Between him and Eunhwi, Eunhwi was keeping up and progressing better especially with the dancing. From Daniel’s last good bye and his and Psy’s reaction I feel like they talked about it and he was prepared for it. Maybe even his own decision. But I think he would be a better solo artist vocally speaking anyway. So those are my options. I don’t have much to say regarding JYP team. But sad it took JYP so long to see YoonMin! Omg he’s the real ace. As I said previously I honestly think SeungGi’s fave was Min and he really advocated for him. And with this helped JYP choose Min. I honestly don’t think he wouldn’t have if SeungGi didn’t fight so hard. He was a sleeping tiger that was awakened in the live rounds. I’m so excited for his Debut. The proud dad lol from SeungGi seeing Min perform was my fave. He was the best host! Thank you for watching loud and talking with us. I love hearing your options and getting a different perspective. I would like to recommend wild idol for the next survival show. I think it would be as great follow up to Loud as the concept it like no other survival show! I also liked how that was set up it was super interesting and really fun.

cynthia li

After watching this show, I do agree koki is far more mature than many kids his age, and kids older than him as well. However, at the end of the day, I'm still glad he's not debuting right now. For me, it might be an arbitrary cut off point, but 12 was just too young for me. I could see his talent, and drive, and passion, but I couldn't get past it. I don't know if my opinion would be different if he'd started puberty (that is, if he looked like a teenager, rather than so obviously a child). I don't know. But I couldn't help my visceral reaction at seeing someone so undeniably a kid as an idol. There wasn't even that flimsy barrier of suspension of disbelief (whether that's a good thing or not, is something I'm still grappling with). On a happier note, I'm so happy we wound up with the JYP team we did! I've been rooting for Amaru throughout, so am super stoked!

Giu Bressani

I really fell in love with the boys during this show and really learnt to appreciate the final line ups. I'm still not a huge kyungjun fan because I never really saw anything in him and I still can't get over not having yedam on the final team, but I'm really looking forward to their debut. I was one of the people who felt like it was absurd to debut a 12 year old before starting LOUD, but Koki completely changed my mind from the get go. Honestly, I think the biggest problem wasn't even his age, but maybe the fact that he really looks like a kid? Donghyun is just 2 years older than Koki, but 2 years in this age makes soooo much difference. I really hope we'll see more of him in the future and I'm sure he'll eventually debut even better than he is now Also, if you want to keep up with the boys, Daniel and Yedam are both on Instagram! Yedam is on SOPA's dance team and Daniel has posted some teasers here and there, but I think he returned to the states (he was in Brazil with his friends and family just last month tho). Honestly, for Daniel, I really wish to see him finishing high school (he's 17 now, so it probably won't take that long lol), working on his korean and then focusing on his music after that. There's no need to rush right now and I really think he will only grow and get better with time so I really look forward to seeing him shine in the future

Emi R.

I was always rooting for the Pnation team because I loved their energy together but also agree that the all kill from the previous episodes was a bit much. I do not blame JYP at all for pulling the voting trump card by including Stray Kids for the collab. That collab made the most sense anyway because Gyehoon trained with them! I was so happy he got to perform with his hyungs. The only thing that sucked was some of the Stays on the live episode, they were spamming the chat just asking when SKZ were gonna perform. They helped by voting but I saw many who didn’t even take the time to learn who they were voting for. Several were even dissing the trainees performing with 3racha even after voting for them ☹️ But I did see a bunch that came for SKZ that were asking about the trainees because the performances impressed them so they did gain new fans!

Melody

Master in the house is a great variety program that had Lee Seungi as the lead in a wonderful cast, you should check it out because it’s really fun and entertaining especially when Eunwoo was in the cast. I didn’t see the episode with Daniel but I will definitely check it out. I’ll miss so many of the contestants of this show and look forward to seeing them hopefully debut!

Kpop_Platypus

Not me cackling when PD's trying to figure out which JYP sunbae's song they're doing for the first performance - because I had exactly the same thoughts when I originally watched it. 😆  I have to disagree about bigger groups doing more impressive performances.  I don't think anyone would accuse SHINee, TXT, Black Pink, or the Wonder Girls of putting on lackluster performances.  Yes, SVT, Loona, TBZ, etc. do look different, but that's it: it's DIFFERENT, not necessarily BETTER.  (I say this as a fan of all the boy groups I've mentioned.)  It really depends on the members & how you use them, which of course remains to be seen with Team JYP as a real group, but I'm willing to bet that they'll end up being pretty awesome. PD, you basically saw that TV watching intro in Ikon's Pretty Savage performance on Kingdom. 😊  I love PD's analysis of the PPLs! The way PD was describing how Team JYP's members are all pretty good at everything vs. Team PSY being great at a few things reminds me of the phrase - usually left incomplete - "Jack of all trades, master of none, but often better than a master of one."  Once PSY revealed that his philosophy is that EVERYTHING should be based in hip-hop, I was firmly in Team JYP's camp.  Strictly musically speaking, I'd rather listen to any of Team JYP's gongs, so even if Keiju & Amaru hadn't ended up in the group, I'd be more likely to follow JYP's group than P.Nation's. "Am I dead inside?" made me actually LOL. 😆  I ask myself this on a regular basis & I think the answer is, "Very nearly."  See you for the finale!!

WiseSmellyLegs

I found out that during this “Kocowa cut”, there was not mentioned the fan voting for this round’s performances, I mean the Fan’s Choice ones. It was not during live rounds, it was really early on, when nobody knew, who will be in which team and they just showed us voting/opportunity to choose from these songs (down below) for both Team JYP and Team P Nation. For Team P Nation we could choose from: SHINee - Ring Ding Dong Block B - Very Good 4MINUTE - Crazy Seventeen - HIT X1 - Move For Team JYP we could choose from: EXO - Love Me Right Seventeen - Very Nice DAY6 - Love Me or Leave Me Block B - Jackpot SunMi - Gashina Before I share my thoughts about each performance… You mentioned last time that from a mathematical point of view it seemed like Team P Nation would win again and in this episode you said something similar to that and you were totally right, they won all 6 performances, which seems weird and objectively it is impossible that Team JYP would be bad at all of them… I am not sure if they have more popular members, because Team JYP has Gye Hun and Keiju and also Amaru, but his popularity went a bit down with live rounds, but although these two or three are/were more popular than their counterparts in term of popularity, which are Jun Hyeok and Kyung Jun, Team P Nation has more of those, who are not the most popular ones, but are popular enough to be above the average, which in case of Team JYP was more like many of the rest of the group/team were just the average or even below that, unfortunately… But as I talked about this in another comments here and for sure I mentioned it in previous episodes as my “theories” and inner feelings, that not only here but during whole LOUD both JYPSY took care about everything, so they did not have to cheat or change the rules or manipulate with votes or anything to get, what they wanted. But in this episode it is more than obvious that they had to talk to each other and make a deal that Team JYP wins. I do not mean it in a bad way, I mean it more like: “Hey, those fan votes are fucked up, let’s do something about it to show them that those votes don’t mean anything to us and we want them just to feel like they are important and they are “creating these groups” as it is with another survival shows”. Because if Team JYP lost here again, it would have meant that Yoon Min would have been eliminated or the only way to save him was if PSY used his wild card for him, but although it would have been so sweet, it would have been weird that he did not save someone (Daniel) from his team to avoid any elimination… Since PSY had, what he wanted, those were his former 5 trainees and a producer for this group, Eun Hwi, plus one member (Koki), which he could choose as he wanted as well, there was no reason to let Team JYP loose and not only eliminating Yoon Min as the producer of JYP’s future group, but also leaving that group made of only 4 members, which is a really small number and odd numbers are better for choreographies than even numbers are and the same implies for Team P Nation as well that it is better to have 7 members group than 8 members, since both Daniel and Eun Hwi started to get better in dancing and did not have to be hidden behind someone on the stage. But do not get me wrong that it was all about PSY and his goal with which he went to this show. Actually JYP managed to have, what he wanted as well even before live rounds, since he knew, why he chose only 9 members, why he put only 3 trainees into the show, he planned to have smaller group and his favorite ones were popular enough to make it anyway (Gye Hun, Amaru and Keiju), only Dong Hyeon was not that much popular, but that is why they had their wild cards… and as well as PSY he just needed to choose one member to make his group complete and to be honest he had to know it should be Yoon Min, because from all of those members he casted only Kang Hyun Woo could have been there instead of Yoon Min, but Hyun Woo might be a better solo artist than to be in an idol group, but if JYP did not know it right after casting everyone, he had to know it in a previous episode, when he chose these final line up members to perform Peek-A-Boo, I feel like he made a “test/try-out”, if he was right. I think JYP would have done this for PSY too or maybe they agreed on this as well that Team P Nation will shine more in the first live round to make a sure that Team P Nation would not be made of only former P Nation’s trainees, which he would not let go for any cost, so that means he needed Eun Hwi as a producer and the same implies to Yoon Min in Team JYP… JYP had to understand that Eun Hwi cannot be eliminated from that group/team. Oh, again… I went too far from the point I wanted to tell… So basically I wanted to say that although this time the fan voting system was different (although if I remember right, only through text messages there were options 1 and 2 for both performances, but on the internet it was the same as before in previous episodes, but without those collaborations), I feel like the main point, which helped Team JYP to win were those collaboration performances. As I said, I know they were not included in the voting, so nobody could say: “They used the popularity of Stray Kids/3racha to gain more votes”, but although the third performances were not included, it gained fans to vote even though they did not care about LOUD before and to be honest, I would say for current Kpop fans Stay Kids/3racha are more known than HyunA and HyunA’s fans might be “too old” to care about these survival shows etc, so not only the performances were made like P Nation chose only one person, who was used only as an cameo or featuring rather than true collaboration, but JYPEnt chose producing trio, which was included as true collaboration. Fan’s Choice Mission: Team P Nation: Well, I know X1 existed and that is everything I know (also that they were from the last Produce season), so I am not familiar with this or with any other song by them. But although this style and concept was really good for Team P Nation, for me it is the least (or one of them) T P Nation performance I have replayed… But I have nothing to say against it, so it is probably because of the song… Team JYP: The song is a total banger and I thought the performance was as well, but during watching it again I realised: “Oh, they changed their clothes! Wait… that is weird, I listen to this version of that song on Apple Music so much, how could I not know?” And then you said it! The song is perfect, but that does not mean the performance was as well. But here I can add something. As JYP says Zo Doo Hyun and Yoon Min were really going wild and tried their best and I agree with that! Not only here, but throughout the whole episode, because they knew they are those ones, who might/will get eliminated, because there was a big chance and probability that Team P Nation will win again they knew there was no wild card anymore… By the way… at 44:00, you were making notes, so you missed that funny moment, when Gye Hun and Keiju did the heart sign with their hands, but both of them did it in different way. You asked after this performance about “a hole in this group/something is missing”. You had that feeling because of the number of members. If we compare it to all those previous rounds, where this number was a number of a unit and now it is a whole group, it feels really small and also because of the fact I mentioned above with choreographies, that even numbers might not be that much eye catching as odd numbers. Also the number 6 is a bit “weird” and not so usual these days for a boy group, so maybe that is also a reason. Which one was better: Team JYP Retro K-Pop Mission: Team P Nation: Obviously I did not know this song at all and although at first I felt like: “I am not sure, if this is the style they should go for” (as JYP said as well), but after second and third replay I started to jam to this song as I have never before and it was one of my the most replayed songs on Apple Music for year 2021 and I started to like it so much that I started to listen to the original version too! Team JYP: I was surprised they chose this song. Not because of this song, but I thought Hyun Jin Young was kind of “forbidden/forgotten” in the Kpop industry, because of the drug scandal he had in 90s and was also in prison for that. Although I like Team P Nation’s performance more, I feel like this is the performance and style Team P Nation would have gone for, so as I said, they knew, what is the way to be the winner among viewers, they decided they will “swap” their styles for this episode. Which one was better: Team P Nation Collaboration Mission: Team P Nation: You mentioned it as a joke, but it is so true… when HyunA comes suddenly everybody seems like back up dancers. Also… she did not dye her hair. I feel like she wore a blue wig, it was around the time of Ping Pong with Dawn and from live stages we could see she had different hair colour every time. Team JYP: Oh yes!
Back Door is perfect finisher for any live show, concert or any bunch of performances. Although you were not that much blown away by I'm Your Brother (난 네 Brother) by Team P Nation in first live round, for me it was one of my the most favorite performances from LOUD and also it was a perfect way, how to start those live rounds and Back Door is perfect ending. It is like in anime, I'm Your Brother (난 네 Brother) is the opening and Back Door is the ending, I'm Your Brother (난 네 Brother) is TOP and Back Door is Slump (I mean those songs by Stray Kids done for anime Tower of God). The fact that 3racha chose Yoon Min’s lyrics as those ones, which caught their attention the most, made me feel so glad! I love that they can see and appreciate his talent right from the beginning of knowing him! And speaking of Yoon Min… I mentioned this about Zo Doo Hyun as well that they both went wild in this whole episode, but Yoon Min in this performance… man… that boy went like there is no tomorrow!! Funny thing that HyunA debuted under JYPEnt initially, so both performances were done like: “They had to debut under JYPEnt… :`D”. Which one was better: Team JYP Your question about, who is better: In this round the winner for me is Team JYP, but if I should compare it as the whole Team/group it would be Team P Nation. Eliminations: Zo Doo Hyun: That is why I mentioned in the first episode that one casting was completely cut out, because he eventually made it this far, although at first he was not casted, and honestly he could have stayed with them as you compared him to I.N and his development with Stray Kids. Daniel: He went back to USA and I am not sure about him coming back to Korea, to be honest. But I think all eliminated contestants can apply to both labels, so I would like to see Daniel as a solo artist under P Nation. My question for the end: Which song is the PSY’s proposal song?

Stephanie Dockery

only sad think is that Koki isn’t going to debut with finalist , I saw recently that he, his parents and staff of p nation had meeting ( I think had to do a lot with his age ) that he was going go back to being a trainee instead . So I think year or two years form now we might debut in new group under p nation. I’m guessing he still under the company .

Milli Mey

I'm secretly still hoping that since the JYP group hasn't debuted yet there's a chance that JYP will bring Jo Doohyun back. He is absolutely good enough and really fits into the group dynamic. I just think he would make the group even better TT