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Getting Schooled - Heresy 101 (Patreon)

Published:
2025-01-08 11:00:04
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2026-06
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Content

Kaitlyn returns this new year to bring glad tidings—and clarifications about heresy. Are heresies even real? How do we define them?

Kaitlyn returns this new year to bring glad tidings—and clarifications about heresy. Are heresies even real? How do we define them? And most importantly—should you call someone on the internet a heretic?

Resources:

The Bible Made Impossible: Why Biblicism Is Not a Truly Evangelical Reading of Scripture by Christian Smith: https://a.co/d/j5mZ2Jr 

Christian Theology: an Introduction by Alister McGrath and Matthew J. Thomas: https://a.co/d/aA04bop 

Practicing Christian Doctrine: An Introduction to Thinking and Living Theologically by Beth Felker Jones: https://a.co/d/hatSVjT 

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Comments

Rosanna Dagnillo

Thanks for this interesting episode. Overall, the American Christian church is so intellectual and not heartful, hence the constant inflammatory flinging of the heresy accusation in your part of the world. Missionaries from other parts of the world should be sent to America to teach Christianity, not vice versa.

Frank Nance

Thank you! Currently reading “Heretic: an intriguing exploration of early Christianity…” by Catherine Nixey. Very interesting history in f the different forms of Christianity and the rise of heretical themes, laws, repercussions.

Robert Claydon

This may be getting into the weeds a bit - but I am genuinely interested in Kaitlyn’s take how ESS/EFS does NOT “cross the line” into heresy. (Background: I used to go to a church that really dove into the theology of Grudem/Ware/etc - and EFS-stuff all got wrapped up with a lot of hyper-partisan politics, mysogyny (well beyond “vanilla” complentarianism), etc, etc. So I’m certainly not a “fan”, and so I realize EFS/associated theology is a “sore spot” for me.) But reading stuff like Matthew Barrett’s simply trinity, I came to the conclusion that EFS is “heterodox” - because it veers so far from historical, orthodox Trinitarian theology. Is that pushing it too far? Or is “heterodox” enough of a gentler, less adversarial label it’s appropriate? :-)

Mark Roos

Will this episode show up in the other podcast app feeds, or is it just going to live on Patreon?

Susan
>>160780479

Seconding this, I was confused that it didn’t appear in the podcast feed!

Bruce Gaylord

I like it when you agree with me. For me, if you affirm the Nicene and Apostles Creeds you're 'on the team' and 'part of the family'. The Bible doesn't list them, but the Creeds are as good a definition of the 'core teachings' as anything else. CS Lewis talked of this in Mere Christianity, but he didn't define them as far as I remember. The implications of this are huge. It affects how we decide what and who are Christian, and how to handle disagreements. Skye's example with his friend is a good one. I divide them into 3 categories, core doctrines, those that are important, but aren't core teachings, and things that are a matter of opinion (like eating meat offered to idols). Sit down with a fundamentalist, and a progressive, take a list of all the current controversies and put them in a category. I think that would be a great show sometime. Kaitlyn talked about the early church fathers. I've been a believer a long time and never heard a reference to any of the early Church Fathers in a sermon or a class. I asked about this in one of your Q and A sessions and your (Phil and Skye) opinion at the time was because some of them believed a lot of wrong things, they weren't that important. While that's true, we can learn from their lives like any other history. My eyes were opened a couple of years ago when I heard an interview with a Roman Catholic scholar, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, (greatest name ever) who wrote a book called When the Church Was Young. It had a chapter on each of the early Church Fathers and showed how they struggled with the questions Kaitlyn talked about. It was a good read, and I enjoyed it and learned a lot.

deb vandyke

Can someone please reference the episode that discusses the Eternal Subordination of the Son in the errors of this doctrine. It would be great if Kaitlyn could do an episode on this.

Karen Watson

This was a hard one to listen to for me probably because I was coming with bias. When I look at the messages about women, not even women preaching, but women and wives and abuse that is preached by people like Piper and MacArthur, it just doesn’t line up with how we are told in scripture to treat each other. It denies the imago dei in women and it has done a lot of, well documented, harm. Scripture says we will be known by our fruit and the fruit coming from these men and their followers is bad fruit. I just don’t see how how one views women and other people isn’t core doctrine

Kyle Adcox

Here's my situation: My father is a Republican and my mother is a Democrat. In 82% of the white evangelical churches in our country, my mother and I would be vilified. Hypothetically speaking, let's suppose that I wanted to speak about, say, homosexuality; A lot of churches would call me a false teacher before I even said one word.

Dennis Roach

Thank you for this teaching. I’m wondering about the catholic faith and it’s my understanding that they pray to Mary and it seems to me that they view her as a god like being. Isn’t this heresy. Really looking forward to your comments. You’re the best.

Skye Jethani
>>162335075

Dennis, The common Catholic practice of praying to Mary (or other saints) is not "heresy" because they do not teach that Mary is divine. She is not part of the Trinity nor equal to the Father, Son, or Spirit. In fact, the non-divinity of the saints is precisely why some Catholics pray to them. The idea is that some particularly holy people are closer to God and more intimately connected to him. Therefore, asking one of these saints to pray to God on my behalf is more effective than if I pray to God directly. There is an indirect biblical argument for this—"The prayers of a righteous man are powerful and effective" (James 5:16). This is one reason we ask others to pray for us all the time. Catholic theology just takes this a bit further by asking saints to pray on their behalf. And among the saints, who could be closer to Jesus than his mother, Mary? She's positioned between us and Jesus to be a righteous mediator. At least that's the logic. But here's the important part—this whole thing only makes sense if Mary IS NOT divine and NOT equal to Jesus. That's why the Catholic view is not heretical; it does not violate the Trinity. Of course, the Protestant view is that we need no mediator or priest other than Jesus himself. So, over the centuries, as a way to disparage the Catholic practice of praying to/through the saints, many Protestants started accusing Catholics of idolatry, worshipping Mary, and heresy. -Skye