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808 - Pussy in Bardo feat. Ed Zitron (2/19/24) (Patreon)

Published:
2024-02-20 07:28:21
Imported:
2026-06

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Content

Friend of the show & tech journalist Ed Zitron stops by to check in on the state of the internet. Have they cracked AI video yet? Does the VisionPro herald an en-goggled future? Just how stupid is Elon Musk, actually? We explore the end of the era of techno optimism and as our most advanced internet tech seems to aid less and abuse more.

Subscribe to the Better Offline podcast here: https://www.betteroffline.com/

Find Ed’s newsletter here: https://www.wheresyoured.at/tag/newsletter/

Files

Comments

SP

MY TITS IN BIO

Methew

Matt…….

Methew

We need Matt or I’m gonna make up anti semitic conspiracy theories that Khazar Jews took him out as a preemptive blow to opposition media before staging Oct 7 as a false flag

Jordan Brewer

My favorite AI video is the Roman Gods playing basketball and it looked like complete ass.

cogandbal

WERE TO FIND BIO PATREON????

Don Tickles

Five minutes in and I'm already shaking my head. Can you guys please take a moment's grace and please acknowledge tech's astonishing accomplishment these last short years with generative AI and video. We don't want our boys to come off like old man Chomksy and his sour grapes take after the ChatGPT release. Don't worry no matter how much better the robot's slop becomes, our hearts will always be with the human creators- we will make room for you XO

Don Tickles

AI is a marketing term!? Will you will always be my guy for movies. You are still my guy. But cripes....

R K

elon musk is not going to fuck you bro

Don Tickles

I love you RK and I will still come to your shows.

Rory

God MMA promotions keep doing that on Instagram lol I saw gladiator Izzy vs Poatan UFC

Ranni

Damn I thought I was the #1 Elon hater

Joel Marks

Great song for the closer

drewb

giggling and clapping my sticky hands over a glorified markov chain like a fucking toddler

Paul Ozag

yeah this was painful. every software engineer I know is using some version of copilot and their productivity is thru the roof. The advances in protein folding in the last eighteen months dwarf all previous progress. A lot of the hype is cringe and the Killer B to C app (aside from chatGPT) has yet to surface, but this guy's takes were so off base.

Jaime Christley

My wife, she tells me “my pussy in cryo”! No respect at all.

em

Yeah, cause it's REALLY had a positive impact on culture and politics, the topics of this podcast.

etienne

I wrote myself a API bot that would scrape my liked tweets to a database so I could rearrange them in a condensed webpage and whatever and it was a great little weekend fun project and I was very proud of it aaaaand it's been kicked off because the API tier I need is 100 dollar now. And on top of that the bot problem is getting close to 2021 Team Fortress 2 I'm genuinely mad at this. But them's the breaks online

b-rar

This whole wall of text and not a single mention of an actual positive use case

drewb

I don't doubt there are advantages for scientific fields which require a lot of pattern recognition taking place very quickly, but "your IDE copies and pastes from stack overflow automatically for you" doesn't represent a revolution, or even anything notable beyond people's ability to fart out python slightly faster. Especially not for the energy consumption required

nobody64

My favorite part was when he said " what was Elon's last good idea?" as if StarLink hasn't made him a sovereign individual.

Kevin Jurado

Okay, using Better Off Alone for the end song sent me down a hole of late 90s dance hits. I'm not sure when I'll get out of it.

Whucko Jaang

...If John Oliver did Elon Muskie's internal monologue...

William

More than you’re getting out of big tech these days

William

Oh is that the Elon company that gets majority funding from the government?

Jingle Jangler

Right. There's clearly been astonishing growth in AI capabilities

William

I actually hate the ai autocorrect that my ide now has, and it often introduces more bugs into my code, but yeah

Olivia Kali

AI is the most boring and mundane topic but I'll listen to my boys discuss literally anything

Damen Irving

I would prefer not to, Dave.

Joe

I’m truly sad to hear about a British millennial who spends a lot of time around tech and yet has somehow never taken illegal drugs.

Petrorenminbi

Lot of losers in the comments for this one lol

Doug Cartel

think about how many of the dumb motherfuckers worshipping shitty AI-made videos are the kinds of nerds who proudly describe themselves like "Im PURE Rational. I dont let silly childish things like EMOTIONS control me"

Arthur G. Pym

Copilot is crap and if you use it you're a nonce and you shouldnt be allowed on the computer

kctoo

This guy is hilariously wrong about AI. Hundreds of billions of research spend.. can't spell words in pics.. no improvement in a year.. calls it AVERAGE general intelligence.. no new architecture in the past year.. like dude people pay you for your commentary - at least research it. I'm a visual artist and I fucking hate this AI shit but honestly this level of being asleep at the wheel is equally as scary as a new AI announcement lol

Axel H.

It literally is. AI is already in use on all contemporary computers and phones, but people will say things like “but when is Apple going to use AI?!” because AI now means “ChatGPT/LLM”, but that is proof of its use as a buzzword/marketing term.

Yacobum

The new Sora generative videos are absolutely insane and if you dont know you're looking for AI, 95% of people would take it as real without a second thought. I'm not saying I'm for it, but it is incredible. The Will Smith Spaghetti video was 1 year ago and the Sora videos from a couple days ago are a stunning improvement... its just completely incorrect to say it has not improved.

Don Tickles

b-rar see Paul Ozag above- protein folding

Dan Leaf

Great episode. Love the “doom” movie reference. Deep lore

k v

guy calling Elong a sovereign individual needs monkeylinked

k v

The cybertruck is not a car yet. AI is not intelligence yet. They are barely products, and only on a market without standards.

Connor Dickinson

I welcome the arrival of the porn machine and I encourage it to go further harder stronger

🐷

Guest thinks Cambridge Analyitca is the first time we realized tech can be used against us? I guess we'll just forget about the Bush/O'Bunglers NSA controversy. Probably other things I'm too young to remember. He's like the slow libs that thought Elon was fine until he talked about unbanning Trump from Twitter and then suddenly they have a problem.

plainwrap

I'm so old I remember when tech companies used to promote all kinds of innovative crimes against nature (like cloning) the government would just swoop in and ban it. That's really the promise of shit like AI, like NFTs, like self-driving cars: the unlimited freedom tech billionaires now have to do whatever they want to society and our laws under the excuse of economic necessity. If there's money in it our government will let a sleazy STEM-lord do anything to us. And there will be a horde of dullards heralding it as some kind of miracle.

Casey

That was so good, Ed is a Roth-tier guest

Rigel Goheen

Cambridge Analytica is also a weird choice because what the public got sold isn't at all what happened. The dude who was the whistleblower was a scam artist more than a data analyst. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt though and say that there was a certain awakening to big data after this in the public sphere. I think though he's referring to a certain type of use of the tech. Before 2016ish I think people were aware of how little privacy they just had written it off. True the NSA era there were privacy concerns surrounding tech but overall public attitude was certainly more blase about it. I think there was very much the sense that the NSA was looking for terrorists (and really - a certain type of terrorist if you know what I mean) and that losing privacy wasn't good but it also didn't appreciably affect them in anyway. Same with companies using your data prior where it seemed like they were just selling you stuff. Like it's obviously not good but it's also mostly inconsequential to your day to day life. Then with Cambridge Analytica we hear about how big data can be used for corporations to seize power and affect the outcome of an election through harvesting data. That, to many, is a much scarier premise than the prior iterations. It didn't seem like that tale was particularly true (similar to like Russiagate) but I do think people started to view the data being gathered on them in a less kind light. While it was always true that "terrorism" could have been used as an excuse to spy on or fuck with everyone the average American doesn't really believe that will happen. With the Cambridge Analytica stuff people were already looking for any excuse as to how Trump could have won and then you get a "whistleblower" pointing to something that the average American is already vaguely suspicious of. That's my interpretation at least because my immediate reaction was kinda similar to yours. But I thought about it and I do kinda see his point even if I'm not sure I agree.

Taylor Fredrickson

Completely wrong about AI videos. 3 years ago, image generators were so bad it was funny. A year ago they were mocking image generators for not being able to do hands, now they're photorealistic and 9/10 people can't tell the difference, video will be the same.

Sep S.

Sorry stopped listening half-way through, which I almost never do, but this guy's contribution was just tepid water. I'm incredibly not a tech bro, but if they wanted to talk about this stuff rather than just make fun of them and move on, why not have someone on with a slightly better grasp of AI or a more interesting perspective on tech economics than this "Musk bad and stupid" talking point machine

Bryan Williams

Elon somewhere between Citizen Kane alone in the mansion and The Man Who Fell to Earth.

Dru Heff

Damn this EP was some hot garbage

Jaime Christley

Seems clear to me that almost all of the fad stuff (crypto, NFTs, AI, "machine learning") is smoke & mirrors, but Apple's plan with the Vision Pro allows for them to eat shit and get made fun of with a wonky debut. It's similar to the rollout of many flagship Apple products, but mostly the Apple II, which was too expensive for almost everybody, but it served to push the market along in ways that weren't happening until that point. I'm not interested in dropping $3500 for the Vision Pro (even though the main selling point for me is watching films on it), but we're going to see more robust competitors appear in its wake. The Meta Quest headset actually has a lot more fans than you'd think - kids love it - but it wasn't inspiring competitors in any game-changing capacity.

Donald Darby

I mean he sorted by new on the 3 subreddits he looked at for 5 minutes before the show, what do you want from him?

Enoch

I'm pulling for a Charles the Bold ending for Elon, figuratively and literally.

Don Tickles

Let's all of us- jock or nerd or freak just make nice and agree that it's a deep social divide and we are all valid in our own arenas...it's ok. It's alright..... It's ok. It's... Ok.

Patron

terrible episode of uninformed complaining in a silly accent. just feeling bad about feeling bad and wishing bad on everything. meh

Marshall Steinbaum

Can’t say I agree that Elon’s destroying Twitter for no reason. He destroyed the main way the left communicates with one another. That’s why he’s being tacitly encouraged by the Dem party.

The Other Lauren

Haven't listened yet but i see everyone's pissed. let's see if they're right or if everyone is stupid

Garth Hansen

I could use 121 dollars I'm broke as hell

Jackiel

A testament to chapos quality that the duds stand out

KP

It’s so interesting how they let the culture surrounding AI affect how they report on it. Just because Elon bros love AI doesn’t mean it’s bad. The guest sounds like he has no idea what he’s talking about and made so many false statements only 15 minutes in that I had to click off. This was a brutal listen

Jaime Christley

one of the most terrifyingly sad things I've ever witnessed was when a radio station - I think 104.3 in NYC - was giving away $104 to, idk, the third caller, that kind of thing. And this one woman who won was so blown away by getting $104 dollars that she was sobbing on the call. It was like one of those headlines that are like "Heartwarming! 99-Year-Old Auschwitz Survivor Walks 4 Miles Every Day to Work at McDonald's" happening in real time.

Jaime Christley

I was really offended by all the swearing. Maybe the Chapo team could make their points better without the potty mouth?

Axel H.

Damn, some of you are outright emotionally distressed by this episode. Fucking tech nerds, I swear...

etienne

I was thinking the other day of maybe a good use for machine pattern matching: a thing that pulls the product code when seeing some fruit or produce at the grocery checkout so that the cash doesnt have to fuck around with the plastic tag on the apple or find a guy who knows the code. that could be nice i guess. but it would be difficult and low margin so instead what we're gonna do is, to take a totally random example brought up by TrashFuture, is a insurance startup that snarfs all your personal data into an opaque trained model that dynamically sets premium rates and ends up reintroducing bizarre old timey racism against small eastern european nation migrants

Garth Hansen

Yeah a lot of people are really getting the shafted these days...wonder if there's a way to classify why

Axel H.

Never knew Chapo fans were so fucking boring. "It's gonna change the world, guys *sobs*"

Jaime Christley

Some framework to analyze material conditions……

Bobby Volcano

Another World mentioned, Eric Chahi go on Chapo

Andrew M

man fuck you guys the doom movie was a masterpiece

NYCM&AHole

Also twitter’s sale happened because Elon Musk fucked up and insisted that not even satisfactory due diligence be an obligation for him to close the deal. His lawyers listened to him.

Jeremiah Gaiser

Yea, that was killing me…they cannot be this thick. I think it’s completely valid to object to generative AI in principle but just willfully ignoring the trajectory of this stuff doesn’t help. There are very good reasons to be alarmed by OpenAI’s progress (from a technical perspective) and these guys don’t know enough about it to have an interesting opinion :/

Socrates 2

The culture of the AI bulls in silicon valley is incredibly blinkered and stupid, but holistic critics of the technology are also caught in a crisis of imagination, seemingly incapable of accepting that a pattern of historical progress is capable of indicating the potential for future progress. Saying that "we've had image generators for a year and they're still hallucinating" is about as silly as saying "my stupid baby has been crawling for 6 months, it obviously won't ever figure out how to walk." Remember that hallucination is still a common feature of the human mind itself and that's been in R&D since the beginning of the universe. The fact that anybody can see those Sora videos and compare them to AI videos from a year ago and not realize that asymptotic progress is being made is probably more contingent on a sort of Lovecraftian horror reaction than anything rational. Optimists about this technology are going to be proven wrong, but so are denialists. We are approaching an event horizon beyond which we really have no ability to glean insight, and stubborn cynicism is going to prove inadequate as a tool for confronting it.

Mitch Wood

tired of hearing people mortally addicted to twitter make fun of musk as if they could possibly leave the site

The Other Lauren

Update: seems fine to me, guess all the overpaid tech perverts are mad

NYCM&AHole

lol ebaums world. Holy shit that’s a throwback.

The Other Lauren

lmao shouldn't you be taking an agile scrum right now

Chris

Everyone in here saying most people can't tell if an image is AI generated are really telling on themselves

Cody Ross Rex

I wouldn’t have cared at all about this if it wasn’t for astronomy yt video comment sections (usually a place for amazing dialogue by older astronomers) being completely taken over by extremely stupid elon bros

Jaime Christley

he was forced to go through with the sale by the court that oversees Jarndyce v. Jarndyce in BLEAK HOUSE

NYCM&AHole

I’m ambivalent about the court of chancery. But it’s not the court - it’s the document he signed agreeing to buy Twitter, and I’m sure the m&a counsel wrote and sent Elon a CYA (covering the lawyers’ asses) memo about everything that could go wrong. That’s standard practice.

Patron

this is legitimately funny 😁

TC

Really enjoyed Felix kind of take the reins of the interview/conversation. Nice little change of pace.

Chris

i think its pretty obvious that this tech will somehow be used to not benefit people or reduce our working hours. But to say its not progressing is copium, the safe bet is that this shit is going to the moon

tapwaterskeptic

I think about the "NERVE" tweet constantly - such an inspirational lack of effort. If that dude can be a gazzilionare half-assing things so publicly, what sort of foot dragging can I get away with in my own life?

ScorPWNok

I can *hear* your bluecheck in this post

FlyteRisk

Why on earth does anyone care about Twitter this much? Shit, the guest said “I’m never calling it x” like he was a medieval vassal for an imprisoned baron and was being asked to swear allegiance to the usurper.

Jaime Christley

i just wanted everyone to know that i read bleak house

Jack

Elon's in his K-hole, all's wrong with the world.

ScorPWNok

this is one of the most small-dicked comment sections of any Chapo ep ever and that's quite an achievement

Mitch Wood

wrong buddy, I have never had an account and wish people would get serious about alternatives like mastodon or whatever instead of whining about a service they are chemically dependent on

Valerie

Implying StarLink wasn't a horrible idea, yikes. Sure, the idea of a LEO wireless network is a great idea. But StarLink and its competitors are built on the model of "space real estate" land grabbing. The goal is to "sat"urate LEO to the point that global legislation has to intervene and cap the deployment counts just to reduce Kessler Syndrome risk. StarLink is the posterchild of gambling the future of space access and exploration just to achieve orbital monopoly.

NYCM&AHole

Now I want to make a song about that book to the tune of the funk song brick house.

——

This guy is a baby

Jaime Christley

That can absolutely get done. There’s a lot of names and details and situations in that dang thing.

NYCM&AHole

Too useful and won’t attract coked up VC money

C. Andrew

Nah, I think it says something when the group of dumb rubes is telling you to trust them.

Joam Ahmma

It feels like they’re arguing a straw man the whole time. Who cares that it’s not perfect in a year? It’s clearly “improving”. Taking tech bros fully seriously is like expecting to turn into the silver dude after drinking capri sun. Also k!11 all British people

C. Andrew

Yeah I saw tons of kids using the Quest and Apple has always been about Edu markets - you don't see freshman classes full of MacBooks because everyone loves a UNIX based OS - it's because their high school computer lab probably had iMacs. Maybe things have changed, but almost every school in the early 2000s had a Bhodi Blue iMac in it. That's what the stupid goggles is for: shifting the window of normality farther in apple's favor, getting tech into younger, richer (and thus potential future devs), hands, and making people think this VR thing (used to be PCs) isn't just a fad but part of life.

Ranni

Hating Elon is cool and logical. Cope.

Michael Austin

luv me ed luv me Elon luv me podcast simple as

Hyperactive_BS

So like is it in the Patreon bio or where is it?

Sam Schick

Dude that was a parody video shot by big Willy style himself. I swear to god I don’t know who’s full of shit anymore-that’s the power of AI

zach

i’m strongly anti-AI but this guy’s analysis is pretty weak tbh

Jaime Christley

This was the one thing about Steve Jobs that's undeniable, that he was unafraid to belly-flop a few times because he had a whole other strategy playing out on a longer timeline. That's one of the compelling things about the plot of the 2015 movie (underrated!), when he's at NeXT building a huge piece of shit computer that's insanely expensive and has too much going on and is destined to fail because he knows Apple will purchase the company and re-appoint him as CEO as part of the package. I know he wasn't smart about everything - listening to doctors and staying alive etc - but this kind of multi-pronged attack plan simply doesn't occur to most of these tech tycoon types. Certainly it's beyond the grasp of someone like Musk. re the youngsters angle: about 6 months ago I was picking up an order at KFC (DoorDashing) and I saw a kid filing out with his family, Meta headset hiked up on his forehead, very obviously had to duck back in because he left his hand controls at their table -- anyone who's ever been a parent of a kid who brings their toys and/or gadgets and doodads everywhere will clock this scene instantly, it's almost eternal. It occurred to me that, yeah, we're all gonna goof on Zuckerberg and Tim Apple and weird looking gear, and in a lot of ways we're right to, but I wouldn't short VR the way we're unsurprised that NFTs disintegrated. In fact I wouldn't short it at all.

Sam Schick

AI is genuinely interesting when you get away from the consumer/entertainment aspect. Its use in stock trading, hiring practices, policy enforcement, credit worthiness, academic writing, et al and those implications are vast. The use of AI for good is also there, using it to generate scripts that trawl the internet and other public databases for congressional stock trades or creating easy user interfaces to see voting records or donation records of politicians. Etc There is a lot there outside of the generative entertainment context.

Agent Grange

I'm not one to dickride for AI. However. I think people should reevaluate the idea that "all this model is doing is taking and recycling things from other sources to make a composite." There's nothing new under the sun, and most ideas are a composite of earlier influences mashed together. I feel like Will should know that from his time studying film with Movie Mindset. Obviously AIs current method is way more literal and hamfisted, but I think it does a disservice to artists to deny the idea that you build your own creative style by incorporating influences from others. Otherwise you end up agonizing over not wanting to "copy" someone and just sitting at a blank canvas waiting for a "wholely original" idea to hit you that will never come. Especially when even a robot can take a composite of different sources to make something that, albeit shitty and offputting, definitely hasn't been made before.

leah

you are also an AI guy because you talk exactly like them lmao

leah

You are one to dickride for ai

Jaime Christley

Lotta “I’m not saying we should all pledge fealty to the AI overlords… BUT!!” replies on here

Greasy_Jones

Hi everyone, if you're interested in AI art so much perhaps I can interest you in buying this fine bridgecoin?

Yacobum

I think you're mistaken go to youtube type "AI Will Smith eating spaghetti pasta (AI footage and audio)" This was an AI generated video from about a year ago.

Science Bitch

This is thin gruel. This guy is English - did they know that before they invited him on?

Agent Grange

I might be completely misremembering but I'm almost certain that Elon confirmed that the reason he's so high level in Diablo is because he's a whale who pays for all of micro transactions. So. That's where all that salary is going to.

thicchatlogan

all the guys who "learned theory" by posting gritty memes in the chapo subreddit really showed up today

Martin Ross

Ed rules. Still miss the old podcast him and Felix used to do back in the day

Meatwad Cosby

Great guest. Gotta have him back on after Elon dies on October 28, 2024.

emalco

“I would prefer not to”

thicchatlogan

so many babies in here complaining about the lack of hard-hitting journalistic analysis of AI not realizing that going to chapo for hard-hitting journalistic analysis makes you look like a fucking simpleton

rizzlord

I'm not an insane fan boy, but they really let themselves down bringing this guy on. He knows nothing and now they still don't either and no one listening knows anything new. And it's not just that their guest knows nothing, he failed to disuade Will and Felix from their misunderstandings and left the listener actively misinformed. Just very bad episode all around. If they could take this topic seriously for a moment and deal honestly with the facts and the technology as it stands and stands to grow, their voice would be valuable, as it always is. As it stands, they have nothing to add.

KP

I’m not saying you should believe the twats that talk about AI as if it’s the second coming of Christ. I just think denying that the whole AI movement has made massive leaps in technology in such a short period of time is stupid and naive. Will and guest are just playing into the culture war. “AI is now right wing coded and is therefore bad. It doesn’t work perfectly and I’m going to deny any progress it’s made.” It’s just another thing to hate and wear as a badge of anti-right wing, which is stupid.

J Fitz

I wouldn’t call True Anon hard hitting journalism but they manage to be much more interesting and better informed on these topics

J Fitz

Worst guests are the ones too clearly excited to be there (except Ike Barinholtz)

Besand

ＭＹ ＰＵＳＳＹ ＩＮ ＢＩＯ

thicchatlogan

sure, I agree on that front, I just think a lot of these comments have really weird expectations of what they're gonna get from a comedy/news roundup show

Kevin Spicer

We all have a pussy in our bio (moms)....if I was on the x board I would pitch the idea that every user upload a picture of their moms pussy.

aficionado

i’ve come to love the patreon chapo comments where 10 guys complain that every episode sucks yet they’re still eating their slop. Us true slop enjoyers don’t complain!

James Wallace

"credit worthiness" is not a use for good.

MKatieUltra

Excited for his new one!

TugNuggins

Hell ya dude. This guy is great. Always go back and listen to the old ep he was on.

tanmantincan

This guy is awesome and anyone else who thinks otherwise is wrong

Bryan Jennings

I like, and do not think it's an accident how Felix's chatbot impression is very like his Buttigieg impression. He's very capably capturing both "speaking" styles faithfully.

SparkSolidarity

So many of the listeners of this podcast are so unbearable. This was fire content. Anyone who doesn’t think so should be sent to a gulag for hard labour. Eat your slop and shut up.

Ashley Naftule

That riff at the end about Musk being so rich he can’t remember what it’s like to be human anymore is something William Gibson talks about in Neuromancer. There’s a scene where one of the characters proposes that the ultra-wealthy are a separate species from the rest of the humanity, because once you’ve reached a point where you no longer have to THINK about basic survival, where threats like starvation and homelessness can no longer touch you, you can’t relate to or understand people who still have to worry about them.

David Cox

More Brits on the show please

MKatieUltra

The Alice Deejay at the end 😆 Ed’s great! Of the 7 or so Substacks I subscribe to, his is the one I actually read s o m e t i m e s

Stellar manatee

If this was 80s, chapo would be printing a newsletter dunking on the "so called home computer"

Sam Schick

On the same page about that

MKatieUltra

Heavy ketamine use kills your bladder and kidneys, can’t wait for the the fanboys to tweet “take my kidneys please sir! It would be an honor!”

Max Seppo

This guy doesn't seemed very informed.

Ryan

That's not what the conversation is about. People are unironically claiming that AI will replace Hollywood

Ryan

Because the owner has wanted a business he didn't create to be called X since like 1995, and refusing to call it that is funny

Dick Wolf

Lot of “see more” in the comments today.

Dick Wolf

See more tits in bio

Socrates 2

Look, I'm happy to be proven wrong here, I just don't see any compelling arguments on the other side that aren't rooted in a kind of shortsighted disbelief. I'm not saying AI art is going to increase in meaning and significance to the human experience but it absolutely will improve in versimilitude, which (in conjunction with the declining quality in human output both conceptually and in terms of execution due to many awful decadent forces of capitalism) will mean we reach a point at which it is impossible to tell the difference, at least for the market function of commodity art and "content." This stuff will wash over the human environs like a great grey ocean and drown us all. Unknowable and unspeakable horrors approach. Children will be born into a world in which no authentic human art and literature is even available to consume. The danger of AI isn't that it's too smart for us, it's that it will give us exactly what we want, but we don't know what we want, so it will give us nothing and hold us under the nothing until we are dissolved in it.

Jimmy McMillan

You can always opt out of reading the comments. I think most listeners don't comment

rizzlord

Do you not think that they have a valuable perspective on issues they are well informed on?

Jimmy McMillan

It's getting embarrassing how desperate the investor class is to find the next frontier. Hipeing up crypto currency and board apes really hurt their credibility

chronye

Clean Shirt likes the Muse

Jimmy McMillan

AI doesn't concern itself with worrying about copying people because it's a mindless plagiarism machine. Unlike human artists

FlyteRisk

Calling your buddy by his new step dad’s last name is funny. Catching yourself mid-sentence and then desperately decrying into the ether “I will not submit” over a lame ass website is sad. Ed’s got real shit going on. I hope he gets help. And I was asking why does anyone care about the website at all? Elon sucks. Twitter sucks. It’s bad for you. It was always lame.

chance

What is an example of one of their misunderstandings?

chance

I think we can all agree. AI is pretty gay!

Max Beta

Weird. I think Robert Evans namechecked this guest as someone to go to for AI coverage on the most recent BtB episode on AI, and Robert Evans is pretty informative.

Do Golems Dream of Ceramic Sheep

They have to sacrifice about 1K Fanboys a day to Musk's Golden Throne/Dialysis Machine, lest Elon falter in his battle against the Ruinous Powers

wolfgang

are you aware how much trash comes out of SV. it’s almost all garbage. even spotify can’t manage a profit. it’s not computes, it’s the shit business autistic computer guys think we need or want.

wolfgang

Silicon valley is complete trash.

wolfgang

This is the problem with the discourse around gen AI currently; The impulse to Philosophize while SV serves up another pile of trash for people to waste their time and money on. It’s marketing for openAI. There are no other implications. The tech doesn’t make sense for what it’s promising, besides spam and deep fake porn of course.

Alez

Fucking wild to unironically praise MUSE and slag off Hendrix in the same sentence. This guy needs to never talk about art.

Paul F. Holzfäller

Elon needs to keep up that butch lesbian grandma vibe he had going at the DealBook Summit. It’s just the greatest thing.

Max Beta

Any show is going to have their share of terrible listeners in general, and then even more when something hits near one of their passion projects. There's probably a boatload of Chapo listeners who would've gone on and on a couple years ago about how bitcoin is the future

Besand

░P░U░S░S░Y░ ░I░N░ ░B░I░O░

MKatieUltra

Just in time for ChapGPT going off the rails and speaking Spanglish

Jessica S

I get what you’re saying, definitely creatives build off previous ideas, that’s literally how we learn in general. But - and I think that they’ve touched on this in other episodes and I know that Liz and Brace have talked about it on True Anon - even in the building on previous ideas, humans are capable of creating something entirely unique, and that’s where the “intelligent” component breaks down at least for now. The technology will likely become so good at mimicking consciousness that it will be almost unrecognizable from non-AI, but until they can crack the code of getting a non-living species to understand itself as an“I”, as in self, it has no independent thought outside of what has been fed into it. The vast majority of humans will never stumble upon an earth shatteringly new idea, but we have technically have the capacity to think outside of what we have pieced together around us… …or do we? lol, maybe the only unique factor of conceptualizing myself as “I” is that I can trick myself into thinking that I am unique from other species and processes. I won’t discount that possibility.

Jessica S

Correct me if I’m wrong (and I know I won’t be let down, lol), but I think Musk is into that whole subset of insufferable Silicon Valley idiots (often times also are effective altruists) that believe it is up to the enlightened and gifted to populate the earth to ensure that there are enough smart people to save humanity from itself. True Anon did a few episodes around the demise of Sam Bankman Fraud about effective altruism and then tangentially about spawning as many superior humans as possible for a better future. Never mind that these are the same fuck ups that suck up insane amounts of resources just to run their servers for shit like AI and, as mentioned here, apparently mostly hovering data to hock “targeted advertising” that has little to no evidence of it working at all. But oh the money they make selling potential! But I digress. Musk is for sure not quite passing as human, but I think there is a vein of neo eugenics, minus the genocide in each attempt breeding. I guess that’s the inhuman aspect, sex with a greater purpose and not for emotional connection or a blissfully carnal experience.

Jay-Z Pants

30 Seconds to Mars is better than Prince

VAN Fan

They weren't writing off AI as a whole, they're rightly criticizing the idea that it will replace human art in any meaningful sense

VAN Fan

No the "new" video of Smith is real, not AI

Ty G.

AI *is* a marketing term, LLM's are not AI, they're very powerful/productive tools that will change labor relations for the worse, the new Sora GPT stuff that came out last week is crazy, but it's definitionally not AI, and the techbro hype about it "taking over the world" and becoming sentient, is similarly bullshit.

Ty G.

LLM's aren't AI, and a lot of it is overblown techbro bullshit, especially in regards to its supposed "sentience," but there have been real advances and it will affect people's livelihood's- would've been interested in hearing that convo and not some dude who just wants to put his head in the sand. Everything Musk does is definitely a grift lol, but a lot of the openAI stuff is fairly legit, it's not going to wholesale replace creative jobs, but it will absolutely be used as a pretense to slash jobs. Videographers and visual artists especially are going to be hit pretty hard by it, especially if no legislation is put in place to regulate the sources of data that LLM's pull from, to think otherwise is just delusional, the tech is basically at that point already.

Last Years Man

I'm a translator so my livelihood is directly affected by LLMs. However, I don't necessarily agree. After the initial shock of chatgpt wore off, the inherent limitations of LLMs have become starkly clear and companies who try to rely on them are getting and will get burned. They are literally capable of producing thousands of words, all assembled in grammatical order, and saying absolutely nothing. ADvances will make them more efficient at doing so and possibly less error prone, but the fundamental fact that what they produce is not actually content and that they have no genuine utility will never change. I do think we are going to start to see big companies, especially in the entertainment industry, adopt the LLM model more and more, but all that is going to do is further widen the gap between institutions of all kinds (political, cultural, financial) and their audience. The more LLMs become prevalent, the more people will begin to congregate in divergent like-minded communities that aren't reflected on the glossy surface. That will have its good and bad effects, but it is what it is. We're in a bifurcated world where people's internal lives are completely disconnected from most of what they see outside and in the media. So yes, livelihoods will be affected, but people will adjust and in ways that become increasingly harder to parse or discern.

Ty G.

I somewhat agree- but I’m not even necessarily saying that LLMs will replace every job, but they will be used to cut departments- for translation for example instead of hiring x number of translators for a project, you’ll hire way less and let LLMs do a lot of the heavy lifting while people take on a more editorial role. Any company trying to wholesale replace their workforce with LLMs will definitely be burned, but I think the former method is more likely- less jobs in general with LLMs acting as a sort of force multiplier.

Yacobum

Ya, there is still confusion. I am not talking about the real video of will smith at all. I am comparing the AI generated will smith spaghetti video from about a year ago, to the Sora AI generated videos released a couple days ago. The improvement between those 2 over the course of just a year is profound.

rizzlord

Nearly everything they said about AI as a technology was wrong. Felix said that it turns out that the images that look good are just from getty images. No. Will said that art generators look through their database of images to find one to match or something similar. No. Also, when Felix asks what will happen in a year when the image generators are better and this goof answers, "'we've had these image generators for over a year now [and they still aren't perfect]" huh? But they've gotten enormously better...soo. Then he refers to AGI as "average general intelligence." Generally AGI is Artificial General Intelligence. The idea that hallucinations are impossible to fix is also wrong. Yes, hallucinations are a by-product of the way the technology is supposed to work, but this technology is brand new and at the moment is very costly. The prices will go down very quickly and when they do, hallucinations will be easily averaged out by simply running more operations at run time. The main thing they don't understand, and seem desirous to willfully misunderstand is that this technology is here to stay and will continue to develop as quickly as it has been and won't be so laughable soon. What then?

Jimmy McMillan

Musk is really betting on nature over nurture when it comes to his parenting. I guess he figures genes are the only thing that matters since his dad was a piece of shit and he turned out perfect (in his eyes). People like Musk talk about declining birth rates but at the same time worry about illegal immigrants and a population bomb in Africa. The racism couldn't be more thinly valed

George P

yeah he definitely is into that shit, episode 682 of chapo covered that, one of their best episodes IMO

Robbie H.

The first two diablos where great games, but it's also possible Elon has just dropped like 1.2 million dollars to level up

Ardy Rezv

Elon sucks and has sucked for over a decade but as crappy as Twitter is now it’s the only social media platform that is spreading the message of the horrors in Gaza

Ardy Rezv

I know for some reason in these circles of the left Julian Assange is considered bad, but I hope you guys can cover what our government is doing to him once he gets extradited

Ardy Rezv

Why is it that some chapo fans get so mad whenever they are even slightly criticized in the comments. Been listening to these guys since 2017 but I disagree with them all the time. You don’t have to defend the honor of podcasters you don’t know

Ardy Rezv

Isn’t this the community that asked them to stop using the term small penis because it offended them lmfao? And they actually did. Just like they stoped saying retard and had to tuck tail after the Cosby picture

Ardy Rezv

I know. Wish they would’ve talked about Julian’s extradition instead of this

Henhound

Chapo consistently has terrible tech takes. Almost as bad as techbro tech takes.

thicchatlogan

nobody's defending anyone's honor here man, I'm just saying running to the patreon comments to post about how much you hated a free episode of a comedy podcast because it wasn't big-brained enough for you is lame as hell

Natalie

I feel like "AI" is in the first stages of becoming something that will go on to have enormous impact on our daily lives. It's funny when it looks bad and we're clearly already hitting a ceiling with its development, but it's interesting that it in 200 years we'll look back on this time as the start of whatever it will develop into. Just sucks the people at the forefront are some of the worst people in the world and it's extremely toxic and expensive lol

United Eric Emirates

Friend of mine spent ‘all night’ doing Ketamine w Musk at a mutual friend’s bday party last year. I mean.. want to talk about a drug not being cool anymore?

Jaime Christley

If I knew a bunch of stuff about AI, I would lie and say I didn’t

Jack

AI sucks but ML is usually good. I studied stats/ML, do it for work now - I’ve followed the field closely for years and there’s always been a tendency for Grindset types to glom onto it and project their own stupid ideas on something they usually don’t understand at all. People use the terms AI and ML like they refer to something specific but really they don’t. They’re just blanket terms for an interdisciplinary field related to data modeling and automated decision making. Lately, AI has referred mostly to the latest gen of generative NN models. AI kinda refers to models that do “people stuff”. This wave started by OpenAI is offensive to the human creative spirit. It paints a future where AI would displace humans with close-enough output, further concentrating capital at the top while our culture stagnates and dies. But “AI” can also follow a philosophy of supporting and enhancing individuals. Here the human is the executive and AI is their cabinet. Humans could be liberated from the toil and become directors instead of work horses. This is kind of the philosophy AI/ML followed for decades as it worked in the background to enhance our daily lives with services like Maps, Translate, caption transcription, medical imaging, visual upscaling, etc. It’s just this turn to putting “AI” front and center and imbuing it with this sort of ideology that says jump on or get left behind that is pigeonholing what AI can be in people’s minds. OpenAI were the first to capitalize on a recent research breakthrough and they got to set the tone for a bit but I think their conception of AI for AIs sake will lose steam once some of the novelty wears off

MKatieUltra

I recall him talking shit about Muse a lot too, just searched and found this “I think Muse is hot dogshit now but KOBK is an all timer from them. I wish Muse would focus entirely on big stupid epic rock songs instead of doing synthesiser shit” IMO totally fair, as I started listening to them when their first album came out

Natalie

Trueanon tip line is waiting

Natalie

I need more episodes based in mocking elon because this was so entertaining, I didn't even know about the whole civil action board rearranging stuff whew

Cesar C

Bro talks like he’s at a table read

Greasy_Jones

bitcoin guys keep saying this too

Jordan Ramage

Been too long since you all had EZ on

Last Years Man

right now, llms like chatgpt are not used for document translation projects. there, they still use neural machine translation (nmt). As you say, it's been used to cut rates by "streamlining" the process and turning the translator into a "post editor". There is no doubt this has effected workers, but practically, it actually creates a whole new set of problems and you're starting to see a backlash where companies that are involved in more creative fields have actually BANNED the use of NMT because of the negative effect it has on quality, even when post-edited (if you're interested, the negative impact of NMT on literary translation has been demonstrated in controlled experiments that can be found online). Anyway, the phenomenon I was talking about in my first reply, and that Ed was talking about, is generative AI - the idea of telling the model what you want it to do and letting it do the rest. It's that process that I'm arguing is limited and fundamentally flawed, in more ways than even its critics knew. And it's that process that is getting all the attention. I have no doubt companies will try to do what you are saying. My argument is that it will damage them over the long run because content quality is going to degrade and people will have more and more trouble trying to get what they want as the model's interactions are increasingly regulated. If we're talking about movies, it's not the end of cinema, it's the end of Hollywood. Everything will fragment and the idea of mono culture is going to erode even more.

MKatieUltra

I've seen it called a breeding fetish too 🤮

Ardy Rezv

They just disagree man. You sound like a fan that doesn’t like criticism. I don’t even care about this subject but I comment sometimes when I disagree and I’ve been listening forever

Last Years Man

Agree and disagree. This is sort of what I was trying to get at further up thread. Machine learning is not perfect, but it at least has a use. I genuinely believe LLMS, in the sense of generative ai, are completely useless. However, even machine learning, in my experience, is far overvalued at this point and the consequences of turning humans into "directors instead of work horses" haven't been fully interrogated.

coolin

Everything they referenced in regard to AI is admittedly funny and absurd, but the take that this won’t go anywhere is rly rly wrong imo. Tons of my ads online now are ai generated - it’s not like that is going to stop. Stock footage will all be ai-generated soon and at that point our reality will have shifted (arguably already has) - people already have a difficult time determining what is real online.

Jack

ML is probably overvalued right now because of the OpenAI hype train, but it’s still pretty valuable. ML is just another tool in a developers toolbox but there’s just pressure to overuse it that comes from the same people that think AGI is the endgame, worse lately because the latest developments are so accessible to the public. OpenAIs AI-as-the-product shit is stupid and those types of products are pretty limited, but intelligent use of these types of models as part of a system has been and will continue to be super useful. You say LLMs aren’t useful but that’s what Google Translate is built on. There’s tons of problems that can be solved with great classification models and other applications that you wouldn’t even consider as AI. Unfortunately, the paradigm OpenAI started is overshadowing everything else by showing you the dumbest use cases and reaching towards AGI

Jessica Rios

The only thing I like better about the new Twitter is that I can say whatever I want now. Sometimes that’s really nice. Before with old Twitter I got banned so many times for dumb shit like “agism.” But other than that? New Twitter sucks.

Greg

Yea me too

Mike Mariano

Far too many of the commenters here would not survive the Butlerian Jihad.

Greg

ML stands for Maxist-Leninist, right?

Wisselbanken

see all you AI guys at the next big thing hedge funds are selling you

thicchatlogan

sounds like you're the one jumping into the comments to defend the honor of people you don't know then, huh I could care less about criticism of podcast millionaires, but the small-dick redditor energy in these comments is too much to pass up shitting on

Joam Ahmma

I’m sorry, thanks for letting me know though!

Daniel Martínez González

That's Pitbull's wet dream. He could do 3 new album releases at once. Also Pitbull at Folsom Prison, The Pitbull Hendrix Experience, Hotel Pitbull and much more. So cool.

William Beamish

/~-~-~-~-~my appreciation in comments~-~-~-~-~\

Reece Coren

such a great episode! love ed!!!! missed matt on this one 😢💗 hope him amber and their baby are doing well!!!

Jonathan G

I was not expecting this guy to be kind of handsome

Eoin O'Donnell

Matt has a really sharp analysis in the last Hell of Presidents episode about Trump that I think v neatly applies to Musk as well. Paraphrasing; "Trump is a tumour made out of America. Too big to fail because too many people can use his name to push money around. Raised without any sense of civic responsibility. Completely empty inside, motivated only by lack of affection from cold & distant parents [Errol Emerald Mine Musk]. Whole value system therefore based around a narcissistic urge to watch himself, through media, be famous." A huge key to Musk's brain is that he wants to save the world, only if he, Musk, can save it. This makes sense of his natalist stuff; he sees a flat statistic about birthrate decline and decides he can solve it by personally having as many children as possible, literally all of them branded in his own name. This is also a root of his transphobia; Grimes suggested the only reason for it is that trans people cant have kids, & therefore Musks own trans daughter cant have kids and continue the "Musk name" in a bizarrely feudal conception of a person's worth. There's an irony in that he has all these children only to refuse to raise them properly & ensure they grow up emotionally neglected and stunted like he did-only hope they dont turn out as belligerently psychopathic as Elon did. we do not need 10 more of this guy in the world

Sam D

Not gonna lie, I fell for AI when I first heard about its big debut. But it took me one 20 minute session of using Chat GPT to realise it's a load of shit. Same with the image AI, as you all said it's regurgitation.

Vincent W Troia

you mean “Generative AI”, because the concept has been around for a long time. Jonathan Searl’s Chinese room experiment was arguing against its salience as early as the 80’s. whole techno-twit universe of this none sense for like 50 years now. lol.

Sam D

Yeah shoulda specifed. Big fan of the Chinese room. Concept blew my mind when I first read about it.

Blingo Starr

Great guest but it really feels the boys have been phoning it in for months now.

Blingo Starr

Nah it’s the season 2 finale of the sopranos

Nolan

Umm wowwwwww I could totally be an NFL GM. You’re not even American you don’t know the NFL salary doesn’t mean shit.

SoldierBlue

They are pointing at the marketing and saying it’s bullshit, which is well, yeah, we know, it always is

coolin

Ya for sure I guess I was just hoping to hear abt how much more insane and stupid bots/fake posting is going to become. That’s 100% going to get worse w this shit.

Max

I think AI is the future of Marvel, the core audience of Marvel and shitty AI tech bros are the same people. And they just want more slop as long as it their favourite characters doing cool stuff.

Jason Matthews

It's almost as though there's a proto-transhumanist agenda embedded in all this superhero stuff.

Rxk Lenderman

Is Ed the first guy to do Chapo and Trashfuture guest spots within a week?

David Cox

AI generated Jason Statham in bio

Natalie

and QAA! Got the notification earlier and was like hey, that guy!

Tom T

It was his personal take on *one* song

Tom T

Just say you're not creative enough to make art on your own. That's the main point is the lack of originality in what it creates.

helvetica.hottie

See, I thought I was alone in seeing Trump and Musk as strange bedfellow equals. Their need for attention without being remotely attractive other than their shared repulsive natures and tendencies to glom onto anything they think will get them the attention they so desperately crave. They are both avatars of evey horrific and vacuous aspect of society. Thanks for putting that out there and validating my own thoughts on it.

Will

Honestly ready for the internet to be over. If we went back to 1994 levels of technology…where computers are just another useful tool rather than the very core of life, culture, entertainment and politics…I think I’d be happy.

WingsOfJupiter

Just shows how out of touch these guys are. They seem dumbfounded by what Elon is doing. Musk has said his goal is to help free speech, not for any financial goals.

Connor Sullivan

🤣🤣 well if elmo said it, it must be true 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Connor Sullivan

Vault Tec-esque experiments coming soon, fr

Hall wingfield

"These guys are so out of touch, don't they know Elon's motivation is [insert laughably untrue and self-serving motivation that not even a baby would believe here]?"

Will

Thanks Bobby.

Alexandr

And Elon is lying and a retard.

S

I worked with generative ai models at my last job. I'm not a crazy supportive of it, it has limitations, tech-bros are blowing it up out of proportions and the monetary/environmental cost is ridiculous. I really think the AI craze is bonkers. But the whole "database" part was pretty reductive and underplays the few aspects that are cool about it. They're called vector stores which maps things onto an essentially a 3d graph and builds associations. So some neat applications is say like, you have a library, you feed the database the titles, publication date, and the back of the book synopsis. Then the vector store will build association trees for you, and we can leverage it by say making a chatbot that can give you book recommendations based on a criteria. I want to read non-tolkein fantasy books written in the last 10 years. Or I want to read sci-fi novels written in the 1700s. Shit like that is pretty neat. There are other applications of generative ai models that are genuinely neat like the hugging face model whisper which is just a really neat audio transcriber. It hallucinates, but if you get it tuned right it is genuinely pretty cool how well it preforms. Is there some bite to the AI craze, yes, but is it overhyped, yes. Can it be creative, hell fucking no. Should it take people's jobs, hell fucking no.