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[M4A] Crunch time - EP 5: Hedonism, Meaning of life and meeting strangers (Patreon)

Published:
2021-07-05 15:02:00
Edited:
2024-05-06 00:58:14
Imported:
2026-06
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Hello friends! Back in my office to record stuff.I'm working on audios today, but also thinking a lot! Here are some of my thoughts.Feel free to share yours on this topic, too! 💕

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Orihime

This is something worth thing about and it's wonderful!! I really love hearing about your thought process. Sometimes, not doing anything also another form of hedonism in a way. Have a great start of the week, hydrate and stay safe!! 💙

Isabella

Okay, firstly, how the hell do you cope with your brain attacking you with these thoughts?(Asking for a friend, of course 😌.) Secondly, you’re talking to somehow who every day tries not to lean into hedonism because I think it’s not good for me, cause that’s not all that life is, right? As to the meaning of life, I must agree with Albert Camus and say that the literal meaning of life is whatever you’re doing that prevents you from ending your own life. Now here I want to say: “Look at you being self indulgent!” As a joke, but I don’t want you to think I’m berating you or you getting mad at me, so this sentence is my compromise! I’m just messing with you, I promise! But, seriously, this is very interesting to me, cause I lean in the complete other direction, and I don’t know if it’s a “I-didn’t-have-friends-for-a-long-time” thing, but the real thrill to me is to form the connections AND keep them. It’s indescribably fulfilling, but I guess it comes with that feeling of loving more and more every day. God, I’m realizing I could go on and on about this, but I will stop myself, no essays today! About people coming and going, a while ago I read somewhere that we should allow people to be like waves in our life, to come and go at their own time, and I’ve found that that idea works for me. And yes, while they come and go they change a bit. Here I have to bring another quote, which, to go on a small tangent, Christ almighty, how do I keep this many quotes in my head?! It’s pretty amazing, honestly! Anyway, Frank Bidart wrote: “the love I’ve known is the love of two people staring—not at each other, but in the same direction.” So, that’s where I sit with that. You leave me with the existencial dread and have the absolute audacity of telling me to have a wonderful day! Please! In all seriousness, hope you have a lovely day too! Hugs!

babypanda

I always go with a saying that talks about learning something new every day, and today I learned about Hedonism. I'm glad you agree that doing nothing (such as laying in bed) is doing something. Anyway, have a good day. :)

Ozzie

I think, whether thats consciously or not, humans (and even animals) are hedonistic by nature. we're hard wired to seek pleasure and avoid discomfort, but I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing, if it extends to others pleasure and happiness too. although, one could argue that wanting happiness and pleasure for a loved one is selfish in nature too, haha.

Phantasm Cat

Hedonism, yes! These are the type of topics that continuously eat at my brain for years. A little secret though to prevent madness from kicking in... let it in. You never know what your brain is trying to tell you. Looking at the term for hedonism, I find it rather interesting, mainly of the claim that focusing on only pleasure and pain in a philosophical standpoint, where only pleasure is valuable and only pain is not valuable. From listening to your points, and from a quick search, it seems to be about focusing on one's own well being to ensure a happy life. Right away, I would like to look into this word "pleasure." I think the meaning behind this word, in regards to hedonism, can be quite subjective. Is it pleasure in a sense that can help us in the long term, that can change how we think, how we interact with the world and within ourselves? Or is it pleasure in the short term, giving that little spark of release that we chase for repeatedly to experience, to forget about the pain we deal with in life? It really is a subjective state of enjoyment. In terms of audios, it makes you, the content creator, happy because you are able to express yourself in a creative way and learn about people in the process, ensuring the other person is feeling good in the process. It makes me, the listener, happy because I get to indulge in this fantasy for a moment, calming the nerves and taking a break from whatever it is I need to deal with. How does this fall under hedonism? Well, I think we as human beings always try to seek out what feels good, whether it be for our own enjoyment or for the enjoyment of others. I listen to audios because, to put it simply, it feels good. But putting more thought into this, it helps me relax, it helps me go into a creative world that helps inspire me in the real world, for me to understand what I want to seek, both physically and emotionally, while also giving me reassurance of what I know makes me happy. This in turn helps me want to ensure the people around me are happy. So isn't that the true form of pleasure, at least to me? To know what makes you happy to ensure a life worth living for? Even if it means to lay down in bed for a while to collect one's thoughts, it's interesting... In terms of meeting strangers, that's something. I love the feeling of connection, of two people talking and feeling a spark within each other. Rarely do I feel that connection continue for a long time, but I think it's mainly a matter of wanting to know more about the other person, and to feel if the frequencies are in tune, or at least as close to each other's frequencies as possible. I don't have many long-term friends, mainly due to us having different paths in life and growing apart. But that's okay. If I were to ever meet these people again, I would feel ecstatic, I would want to know what happened in their life, I would love to learn how their minds and viewpoints changed over time. To me, I love feeling new connections, but what I love even more is to keep these connections and to see how it changes over time. Thank you for this thought-inducing crunch time. Very enjoyable. Stay safe out there, sending you many hugs and scritches, meow meow!

Bea Trice

No one: … Literally no one: … Crunchy: “so I was thinking about hedonism”

Ange

Of all of that, the part my mid-day brain latched onto was that I’m also trying to say online/offline as opposed to “real life”. Because they can be different, but they’re both real. I can be a certain level of vulnerable with offline friends because they’re largely the people I’ve known for a long time and have really been *through things* with. They’re the ones I can (or could) physically hug and kiss and cry on. But there’s a different type of vulnerability in connections with online people. I am often more open and less worried about judgement online, which may make the connections more specific, if also more fleeting. I am the type that has a few amazing friends to whom I don’t speak for long periods of time, and then pick up where we left off easily. I think it’s healthy that you look at relationships as dynamic things, that you’re reconnecting as you grow and change.

solarpowerduck

Hey, you special bean. I appreciate the brain tickle you're giving me, because I just moved house to a totally different environment and I'm feeling very dissociated about it, lol. It's nice to engage in this stuff. Kinda feels grounding to consider my life from my first principles. Hmm, so I'm going to pull in a concept from economics to model how human choices always have a superposition of motivations behind them. The concept is "utility functions," and it's a method to compare the absolute favorability across a set of choices by making a model U(choice) = ${function of factors important about the choice}, then evaluating it per choice available to choose the one with maximum utility. I like this model because it's hard for humans to make decisions when each option comes with compromises, I think. It also helps me understand why other people make their choices. I'm going to discuss my thoughts on your topics in terms of my utility functions. Hedonism: So to me, the base case of our existence is that we've been blessed/cursed with finite life. I think we are entitled to experience pleasure and survival, because I don't believe that anyone "deserves" to have a net negative experience from their time alive. On top of this base case, all of us have our own utility functions for pleasure. Mine look something like Pleasure_U(conscious choices) = Comfort + Visceral Pleasure + k*Novelty / Routine + Ethicality + Intellectual Engagement + Social Connection ... somewhat in descending order of magnitude for me. You'll notice that my personal utility comes from having an ethical component to the choices I make, e.g. I can't be happy with a job that I think is not serving the world. I think there are so many ways to derive pleasure, and I don't like policing others' pleasure unless they are actively causing harm above what I consider a reasonable threshold. Selfishness: As above, I think that humans are entitled to selfishness, because it is closely related to pleasure and survival. I think nearly everyone has experienced being too selfless in a way that harms them. The way I personally justify balancing my immediate selfishness / pleasure versus the larger picture is that (1) my utility function includes how I derive massive pleasure from working on something ethical and bringing people happiness, (2) in order to maximize my utility function over time, I need to contribute to my future happiness as well as my immediate happiness. This model is how I orient myself in relation to my immediate choices in life. So ... pathfinding with a greedy algorithm based on a utility heuristic (lol hello fellow computer scientists who hopefully share this lexicon). Connection: Yep, totally on the same page with you about this. I adore meeting people with whom I share some gut-level character traits and yet have completely disjoint lived experiences. Fuck, I've been craving that so much over lockdown and all this shit that we've been experiencing. Regarding maintaining connections, let's sketch a utility function. From what do you derive happiness with social connection? What reduces your happiness? For me, it's approximately Social_U(people) = Visceral happiness – Emotional labor + Shared humor + Shared character + Openmindedness + Down to try whatever + Emotionally supportive + Familiarity – Triggers my baggage around socialization ... again roughly in order of magnitude. The factor of –Emotional labor is where the negative experience of trying to maintain connection comes in. Other people are totally allowed to prioritize familiarity higher, but I really can't remain happy while making an effort to preserve connection that doesn't still have a high Social_U for me. It's odd for someone to feel entitled to my time, but they are entitled to feel how they feel and want what they want. Side note, last year I finally found a therapist meets me where I'm at in how I like to think about my life, lol. Bless her, she's wonderful. Thank you, anyone who read this. Wishing you the best! Hope you're cozy and happy.

Girl in Dungarees

I was thinking along somewhat similar lines today. More so counting my happiness than evaluating it.

Menula

Oh wow the last time I heard someone talk about hedonism was in philosophy class a few years ago. I had a really great teacher and amazing classmates and was always looking forward to class because my teacher would always lead us to open discussions about different topics like existentialism or utilitarianism and we also dealt with a few challenging thought experiments which were always the most fun hehe. Also these comments are really interesting, I had a lot of fun reading them. Thank you guys and ofc thank you Crunchy 😊

JaneHatesYou

I think I understand. Is pleasure for its own sake, enough? It feels like something can be pleasurable in an immediate way, but it's not *satisfying* if it doesn't mean anything. I can't imagine what I'd even do without existential crises.

Alondra

I don't think seeking pleasure should be should be seen as a bad thing (safely and with consent of course). The bad sigma has a way of creating a sense of self-loathing and hate to creep in. Being raised in a strongly religious household has shown me that experience first hand. I think the internet is a wonderful way explore things in a, as you said, less vulnerable way. All the while being 💯 authentically yourself. Thank you for sharing Crunchy💛

Libby

Hey there crunchy! I hope your day yesterday went well! :) re: "Forming the connection is easier/more interesting in upholding the connection: -- i think i can kinda understand where you're coming from? Particularly when meeting new people in more social situations. Generally speaking you're going to be meeting the 'best' or most idealised, curated version of themselves, where they demonstrate the attributes of themselves that either _they_ like the most, or that the feel _others_ will like the most. I know for certain that my public persona of myself generally will try to talk about the hobbies i'm really enthusiastic about in order to keep the mood light and active. In saying that, i still have several long term friends and i think that is because either our interests really converged over time or because every time i discover something new about a person, it feels like i'm meeting a new version of themselves, which is really cool in and of itself :) have a good day today crunchy - i'll see you during the stream!