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Hello my loves, my dear patrons...this one's a biggie.

**And: I am reading all comments here until this line is deleted**

CONTENTS of this Althing:

  • A LITTLE LIFE UPDATE
  • TIKTOK TOWN HALL DISCUSSION
  • WHAT'S HAPPENED THIS MONTH, WORK-WISE
  • ROUNDUP OF PROJECTS THAT WERE RELEASED IN MARCH
  • WHAT'S COMING DOWN THE PIKE...AND WHAT'S ON HOLD
  • DISPATCHES FROM VARIOUS MEMBERS OF TEAM AFP
  • HOW THE PATREON ITSELF IS DOING/GROWING
  • OTHER ARTISTS TO SUPPORT & FOLLOW
  • ART BEGETTING ART
  • THE PATRON COMMUNITY BULLETIN BOARD

Kia Ora, all.

Greetings from the center of my own heart.

It's been a really heavy few weeks around here, both in world news (good god) and personal struggle, and it actually brings me a great deal of comfort to have the time to finally sit down and write to all of you, share the month's work,  connect with the team, ask you some deep, important questions, and tell you what's been on my mind and on my heart. Many of you have been seeing my somewhat melancholy posts on social media and reaching out, asking how I'm doing. To set your minds and hearts at ease: I'm really (truly) fine, just going through some typical growing pains due to the inclement weather outside my door. Mixed metaphor there, but you get what I mean.

I also want to kick this Althing off by yet again welcoming in ALL the new people who have floated here from one corner of the world or another.

We have LOTS of new patrons - many who came through the "Surface Pressure" cover (we're gonna discuss that below, at length)...and I just want to say, hat in hand: thank you.

HELLO. WELCOME.

The more this little community grows, knits, chats, loves, helps one another, and bonds, the more I grow as an artist, and - strangely, and I'm only really grasping this for the first time - the more I grow as a person. This patreon was supposed to be a nice little way to fund my ongoing artistic endeavors, my blogs, my writing, my songs, and so forth.

Over the last few years, particularly during the pandemic, it has turned into much more: it's turned into a family of poets of fellow seekers and survivors, it's turned into a lifeboat. It's turned into a little pub. It's turned into a lifeline for me. And I love you all, so much. Thank you for being here, and if you've just arrived, thank you for coming here.

Here's a few little life photos from the past month on Waiheke Island, in my newly adopted home (for now, still) of Aotearoa New Zealand.

This is me at a peace gathering on the beach for International Women's Day, on March 8th....

We lit candles and prayed especially for the women in Ukraine who are getting screwed due to circumstances entirely outside of their control.

I spent a lot of the early part of the month delivering food to people on the island who had come down with Covid. For a week or so, it seemed like every single friend and family were trapped in their houses. 

Neil had taken Ash for a while, and I did something I've never really had time to do before: I just cooked for people. I didn't eat the food. I just cooked and cooked and cooked and shopped and cooked and found it incredibly therapeutic. I went to the internet and asked about good foods for people with Covid. Soups. Curries. Greens with garlic from my garden. I cooked.

While I cooked and dropped off various casserole dishes at various houses, I thought a lot about the patreon, and about art and music, and friendship, and how my life for the last many years has been defined - by me, to be fair - by an endless list of artistic offerings that never ends. About how I feel I can never do enough, say enough, catch up enough, create enough to satisfy myself and my own standards.

I realized that this has been preventing me from being the sort of person who prioritized making soup for her sick friends, because there's always a more burning priority.

This gave me a lot to think about. While this was happening, I released the "Surface Pressure" cover song, which got an immediately wonderful reaction, but then caused a lot of turmoil (see below). I thought about that, a lot, too, while I tried to ponder the re-prioritizaiton of my life and energy.

If it sounds quite existential...it was. It is. Why make soup? Why make art? Why have friends? Why even stay alive? 

I think some of this existential dread was probably brought on by the fact that my little country here is finally facing what everybody else in the world has been facing for more than two years: Covid completely tearing apart normal reality. While the death toll here has been incredibly low, the weirdness-in-life factor has been incredibly high. There was a point where this country of 5 million was clocking 25,000 cases a day....day after day after day. The stores shut down. The world stopped. In the pause, the inhale: a thunderous WHY....ANYTHING? I recognize this freefall from all my friends in New York and the states (and Europe, and Australia) who seemed to have gone through this over a year ago.

For some comic relief....here is me, looking very futuristic. I needed a new pair of glasses, wore my mask into the optometrist in the little village of Oneroa where we live, and found myself wondering what the aliens, or someone from 1749, would think if they could only see this human....

(I feel shades of that scene in Back to the Future when Marty shows up at George's house in the radiation suit with the walkman). 

(Also, I'm getting my first pair of prescription glasses, at age 45. I'm officially old and proud of it.)

I took a walk (several times, it's near our house), through the "Sculpture on the Gulf" installation that was up for about a week or two on Waiheke, near Matiatia Wharf, where the ferry comes in. Different sculptural artists (this one, below, is by my new friend, a Waiheke local named Anton Forde) created outdoor pieces and the walk to admire them all wrapped and snaked along the coastline for about an hour's worth of jaw-dropping. 

It felt like church to go there again and again, in different light and at different times of day, to see what the artists had to offer.

It is one of the most beautiful things I've ever seen, and here I am, absorbing. (Photo by Rosie Walford). 

This all existed about a ten minute drive from our house. This island is just one of the most unbelievably beautiful places I have ever lives. We celebrated Koro's birthday on the hill next to the sculptures (you may remember Koro, also known as Konstance Miraj, the beautiful drag queen who opened up the small hall shows many months ago) and the sunset, with the rising full moon at our backs, was one of the more glorious productions I have ever seen put on by Mother Nature. We all just stood in total awe, not quite believing the beauty of what our eyeballs were taking in. Photographs do it no justice, but try to use your imagination and stand on that hill with us.

A sunset kiss for Koro the birthday queen:

And if I were to show you more pictures from the month, you'd just see a lot of dishes, a lot of gardening, a lot of grocery shopping and sponges, and mostly: I've been on the telephone, trying to sort things out with and for people, and for myself.

...........

TIKTOK TOWN HALL, and other stuff: talk to me.

I need your input. It's....one of those moments. (*Insert Every Single Circus Emoji*)

**I am, as stated above, reading all comments until this line is deleted**.

While I was working through some stuff in my personal life that had absolutely nothing to do with my art, my career, the internet, or anything public-facing, a classic kerfuffle (as we call it around here) blew my way.

Last week, a discussion about Amanda Palmer blew up on Tiktok: first because people didn't like my rendition of "Surface Pressure", then because the cover itself was deemed an appropriation, and within a few days, the conversation had turned to why I was just generally a terrible person (and a racist, and a transphobe, and an ableist, and an antisemite, and a person who doesn't pay her staff, and the list goes on and on, and is a very familiar list at this point).

One thing I truly love about the low-walled garden of the patreon is this: in these odd moments, I can always come here directly, to you, to talk more quietly, away from the loud arena of social media.

And I also realized something over this past week: I've become much more adept than I used to be at handling the collision of personal/family problems and public-facing/internet problems. 

If you read "The Art of Asking", you may remember that around 2012 was one of the hardest stretched of my life and career: it was Kickstarter/Crowdfunding kerfuffle year...but it was also Anthony's cancer and chemo. I'll never be able to untangle those two things, the same way I'll never be able to untangle Anthony's death - and the grief I was dealing with - from Ash's birth. They'll always live together as a pair of beautiful, morbid, bittersweet twins.

In 2012, I wound up fighting two fronts at the same time, the very public, and the very personal.

I remember days when I was sitting with Anthony - my very best friend - in the hospital, watching the chemo drip into his body, and meanwhile my phone was buzzing with the alarm of another 1,000 people on twitter telling me that i was a piece of shit who should just kill myself.

I would walk with Anthony from the hospital parking lot to the house and have to step away because my manager was calling, because someone had hacked into my facebook and was posting violent porn.

I would be sitting with Anthony during his bone marrow transplant, in a sterile room, and I would have to be holding, at the same time, the image of a tweet with a thousand likes about how I was a transphobic anti-semite who should be cancelled. 

Things happen at the same time, sometimes. Maybe: all the time?

Anyone dealing with a kerfuffle on the internet, or an abortion off the internet, or a cancelation from a friend or family member, or the dirty secret of a partner who has an addiction and is hitting rock bottom in the basement while you try to explain to the family why they haven't shown up for dinner....basically anybody who's ever dealt with LIFE knows that you are never afforded the luxury of having spacious time to grieve, endless time to deal, scads time to stop everything you're doing and tend to a crisis. You juggle. You try. You attempt to keep pace with the world while still keeping pace with yourself.

And good lord, I know how "internet -> real life" bleed works, I've been dealing with it since 2007. Sometimes a pile-on (or kerfuffle, or whatever you wanna call it) will happen on the internet, but you can ignore it. And sometimes, you know it's more serious when you  walk into a party, or a cafe, or start getting sympathetic text messages from your friends "because I am seeing what is happening online". That is happening right now, in my life.

I've now been through a dozen of these moments, perhaps more, in the span of my career. I always learn something, I always come out a little more battered but a little more insightful, and I always take a step back and try to figure out myself, my community, the world, my actions, my artwork and my voice.

I've been making art and being a public figure on the internet for SO LONG and been through SO MANY SHITSTORMS that I really am able to be somewhat dispassionate at this point, and a little bit clinical. Not that these things aren't important. But they don't feel like The End of the World anymore. Ten years ago, they did.

I find myself able to look at things like a professor: What happened? Why? More importantly: Why Now? What are people going through that this is the moment they need to say these things to me, and to each other? Especially if these are things being dredged up from the past that have already been addressed: What do I represent to people? How much of it is "me" (do I still have things to learn, to say, to apologize for, to be accountable for?) and how much of it is "them" (can these people not google the blogs I already wrote about this shit?)

I was having such a hard personal week that I simply walked away from TikTok. I couldn't read the abuse, it was too much to look at. It's pretty horrendous stuff to see about yourself.

But also: I cannot walk away. I always want to be real, accountable. Open. Learning.

I've done some dumb things in my career, for sure, and I've spoken and written at length about those things....and still, the level of abuse that's currently getting leveled at me is pretty seismic. 

And YET....also.....I've built up a pretty thick skin over the years. I worry about how thick, sometimes. I don't want to become bitter, or hard.

It's only in moments like this that I get to test the new hardness and thickness, to see what penetrates and gets to my heart and what just bounces off as a broken arrow. 

I don't ever want to get so hard that I cannot be bent, that I cannot learn, and join with others in an actual conversation. I never want to live in a fucking echo chamber. That feels like death.

But even the scale of things doesn't matter to me as much as it used to. And I don't know whether that's good or bad, sometimes.

As of a few days ago, my little 15-second "Surface Pressure" clip has now been viewed over 3 million times on TikTok.....but the more than 30,000 comments (THIRTY. THOUSAND.) on that post and my subsequent posts are along the lines of: "hey bestie whats ur favorite slur" and "U R a racist" and so forth. Endlessly. It's....a lot.

It's not a dialogue about whether the "art" is good or bad anymore; it is not even a dialogue.

It's all stemming from the many moments in my past - all of which have been addressed and blogged about at one point or another, SOMEWHERE on the internet - that keep resurfacing without context. 

Most centrally (and probably missing from these many little internet spaces) is the post I wrote over a year ago about the lyrics in "Guitar hero" and "Fuck tha Police" by NWA (a song I covered on ukulele many years ago)...and about why I have, in the case of "Guitar Hero" changed those lyrics, and, in the case of "Fuck Tha Police", why I would never cover a song like that again: https://blog.amandapalmer.net/racism-words-art-time-progress/.

I could go on and on, and clarify the other 10 things that keep surfacing, but now...I step back, and I wonder. I big-picture wonder. And I wonder what you all might bring to the table, to this discussion.

I mean: if you know me, I've been here so, so, so many times.

I've always weathered this storm. I will easily weather this one.

I wanted to address one issue very directly, and ask about it, after seeing this on the patron FB page..a place I rarely hang, and a place I hope we can sort of import gradually over to the discord when the time is finally ripe (I know I keep promising, but then life keeps biting me in the ass.....but soon).

First of all, I want you to know that I'm really listening here.

HERE, for the time being. I cannot go, at the moment, to TikTok and listen. It is too harsh, and too loud to hear anything.

It honestly never occurred to me that covering "Surface Pressure", or any other song from "Encanto", would be considered in poor taste, or appropriation. The patron who requested it, Kya Farquhar, is half filipino. We never discussed this aspect of the cover when it was requested; and I didn't see a hundred patrons (or even one?) on the webcast that day saying "NO!!! AMANDA!!! NOOOOOO! That's a BAD IDEA!"

But no matter: this is still my responsibility. And just because I, or Kya (or any of the patrons on that webcast when it was requested) didn't "catch" this or necessarily think that the song was or wasn't appropriation, well....that doesn't mean that it isn't. Like many things, it's in the eye - or ear - of the receiver. So it's really more about how the song is affecting people. It's about that. It's not about "what I meant". So I would like to come to YOU. And ask. I ask YOU, my patrons, especially my patrons of color, and super-especially if you're Latinx, maybe even from Colombia: and ask.

Does it feel wrong? Does it not sit well? Please talk to me. Clearly some voices are already speaking. I want to know why, and I want to listen. 

And as for me "not addressing" the criticism: let me reassure you about that. I stopped looking at TikTok the minute the comments became 99% abusive and I just couldn't handle the fire. That is, in my humble opinion, always the wisest option for one's mental health when something like this is happening. But it also means I stepped out of the civil side of the conversation as well. I want to have it, and I am going to have it, but not while the tenor over there is so hot that I cannot hear other speak, or be heard. Trying to have nuanced conversations on TikTok while everybody is screaming is the equivalent of trying to hold a conversation in a bar while a brawl is happening. You just have to leave the bar.

Trust me: all of this will be addressed. But in a kind, slow, civil manner. I am also going through my own big, personal problems at the moment. So I beg you, Bernadette (and anyone else who's wondering), I'm mostly staying off social media and away from there, not because I can't engage with the content, but because I need to be with my kid. Trust me, believe me. Priorities.  

I wonder, though, with these issues.....if things might also be a little more profound, because unlike 2012, I have my patrons to come to. To ask for feedback, for help, for impressions, ideas.

This is where you come in.

I know that many of you aren't on TikTok but some of you may be. It's mostly a platform for a younger generation, and I know that my patrons tend to skew older (especially because there's a paywall), but I know we have at least ONE patron here under 40 (I'm looking at you, Rae...wait! and Angel). But many of you are parents, and might have teenagers that use TikTok, and may have impressions and so on that you could share. 

SO:  here is what i would ask, and, as usual, I'll read all the comments here (I'm staying off TikTok and other areas of social media right now for my mental health):

What do you think the best way to address this is, right now?

If you've come across this, what would you want to ask me?

What would you want to know, to discuss? To learn about me?

If you were me, and you saw that there were a lot of new people coming my way - with no context about who I am, what I've done, and what's already been discussed - how would you navigate this?

What I am seeing right now is that there are plenty of places on the internet that have compiled lists of reasons Why You Should Hate Amanda Palmer, but I've never actually compiled a list of central resource that addresses each of the issues. 

Is it perhaps time to do that? If I did that, would you help me?

Is it time to write one big essay called "Amanda Palmer clarifies all her kerfuffles, for the TikTok generation and anyone else who is interested"?

Is it time to just get off the internet for a couple months? (it seems very tempting).

What is hardest is this: a text message from a random friend on the island saying "hey, someone was talking at a dinner party last night about how sad it is that you're transphobic."

this is gossip, and it pains me.

it especially pains me when i think about my community. my fans, my patrons who are trans. what do they feel when they hear that? do they question whether or not i love them? do they second-guess everything i've ever said about inclusivity and wonder if i'm secretly a TERF?

the same holds try for the racist stuff and my community who or BiPOC. is it just too scary to hang around me? is it too messy? even if my community know that i've done all sort of things to explain why i've made mistakes, multiple mistakes, that covering an NWA song was a dumb idea, and so forth....i wonder if it makes people of color in my community just look at me, and the charges leveled at me, and say "it's just not worth it. she's too hard to be with."

for the record: i think trans people are beautiful. i support trans rights. i believe that trans rights are human fucking rights and watching what is currently happening in the states with regards to trans rights is horrifying. i think that racism is a huge fucking problem - in america and the world over - and i think that privileged white people like me still have a fuck ton of things to learn and active work to do to understand what moves we need to make to support progress and create justice. i try to do this work. i'm always trying to figure out how my words, my art, my contribution, can add to progress and cause less suffering. for everybody.

PHEW.

I know that was a lot.

But... it's been a lot.

Talk to me.

......

And now....

WHAT'S HAPPENED THIS MONTH...

I am sure that all of you - my patrons, who are People of the Internet - are all already inundated with news, stories, and harrowing, unforgettable images from the senseless destruction of life, property and peace over there.

I made a whole post about this, but it really is worth repeating here in the Althing.

I spoke with my friend Gaba Kulka, who lives in Poland, about the best way to actually, tangibly help, and this is what she said:

Ever since the Russian army's aggression on Ukraine, Polish people started mobilising at every level to help our eastern neighbours, and that feels like a beacon of hope in this grim time.

But even though the countless, grassroots efforts have been uplifting, they have also been really hard to get my head around, and this fragmentation has become an increasing problem - it may feel overwhelming right now, to find the exact right place where you should put your energy and money.

What we need is better communication, and a more centralized system of support for people affected by this war.

That's why my first thought  went to nonprofits that I'd already known for years, who already have the know-how - most of all Fundacja Ocalenie, who has been working with and providing help to refugees in Poland for many years.

Luckily some people have it together, and know that combining efforts is the way to go: There is a huge fundraiser, Together For Ukraine:

https://zrzutka.pl/en/razemdlaukrainy

It is based on one of the largest fundraising platforms in Poland.

The organizations benefiting from the fundraiser include Fundacja Ocalenie, Polskie Forum Migracyjne, Homo Faber, Fundacja Dialog and many more.

They post frequent and helpful updates documenting how some of the funds are already put to use.

As an addition: if someone likes to know very precisely what their money buys. Here are two verified fundraisers that gather money for 1) tactical first aid kits https://zrzutka.pl/dlaukrainy and 2) bulletproof vests and helmets https://zrzutka.pl/pomocukrainie The links come from the Euromaidan-Warszawa organisation, which has been active since 2013.

Please consider supporting them.

I really trust Gaba, and I hope you trust who I trust, so please consider sending your money over in that direction.  I donated $500.

I also found out that THE KYIV INDEPENDENT is on Patreon - one of the only independent media outlets in the country. I'm supporting them, and I cannot tell you how good it feels to be able to know that my dollars are literally keeping real, honest journalism funded in Ukraine.

i became the 3,249th patron last week, they're now up to nearly 7,000 patrons, earning about $70k. I've heard they are re-distributing any extra money to places that feed the funds.

This is revolutionary. 

Please join.

......

PIANO? PIANO!

Sydney Opera House 

invited me to join them for PIANO DAY on the 88th day of the year....and I played an especially emo version of "The Ride", filmed on roundhead studio's massive steinway. Go watch:

https://www.sydneyoperahouse.com/events/whats-on/live-stream/piano-day.html

......

And:

I was interviewed by my new kiwi pal Jesse Mulligan on RNZ a few days ago, about Surface Pressure going viral....and....you can guess:

You can listen to the interview from anywhere in the world, right here:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/audio/player?audio_id=2018835714

......

Also?

I was invited by amazing academic and writer Helen Sword to join her on a conversation event, broadcast via Zoom to the world, about creativity.

Helen's and expert who writes ABOUT writing...

Here's one of her best books.

The talk itself was truly AMAZING....we covered all sorts of things from process to imposter syndrome to...just go watch. 

There's an archive link especially for Helen's supporters, and she's given permission for me to share it with all of y'all too. 

You can check it out here:

https://vimeo.com/691594950/1bf83eae13

(the quality of the video isn't amazing because zoom, but O WELL the CONTENT is hopefully worth it :))

We even had a bonus guest dog at the beginning. this is Freddie, as in Mercury:

......

ASK AMANDA is OFFICIALLY ON HIATUS!!!

I set out on Substack as an experiment during February.... and what I learned is that writing a weekly column takes a FUCK TON of time and energy. And if I kept it up 52 weeks a year, I'd probably have to drop everything else.  

So we're on hiatus...... FOR NOW. 

I plan to continue, and Sarah Beetson, the artist who I collab'd with, is also very keen to keep going. But maybe monthly?

It was, by the by, a huge success. I'm so proud of what we created - not just my articles, but the beautiful questions, and comments, and connections from inside the community. 

So consider this a promise: we will be back. It will just likely be more sporadic. I'd love to do it once a month.... We'll see.

The "paid" subscribers over there (there's only about 2-300) will not be charged this month. I've paused the billing cycle. I assume that if I kick it back into gear, I'll do it under the umbrella of the patreon, otherwise I won't be able to pay for the time and editing and artists. We'll discuss.

In the meantime, you can catch up with the 4 existing columns at:

https://amandapalmer.substack.com/

......

I ALSO RECORDED SOMETHING ELSE SPECIAL IN AUCKLAND.....

Superstar political-expert and special-ass person Samantha Bee is doing an episode of her show Full Frontal all about book censorship, so she asked me if I would play Judy Blume...

And fuck was I honored.

BUT

Since I'm still in New Zealand, I figured I'd have to sadly pass, because I couldn't make it to the states to film.

BUT....I was like, I can ASK. So I asked: hey Sam, will you pay for a film crew to record the song in New Zealand? At a library, maybe?

THEY SAID YES.

Here's some photos from the day:

This shit cost MONEY....and we went way over the budget that the show gave us. Those lights weren't cheap. ;)

So I came to the Patreon that very evening before we filmed....and asked how you'd feel about me thinging this video, and the results were - honestly - OVERWHELMING:

Interestingly, less than 10% of y'all actually voted in this poll.... I tend to think that means you're pretty much shrugging your shoulders and happy for your money to go to whatever I deem is Art Enough.

But probably if you didn't vote, the chances that you're reading this far down the Althing are close to zero. So....yeah.

......

AND

This is probably also a good time to mention that I have started getting some social media help - everybody, MEET AURA:

AURA'S DAD, NATE, IS A PATRON (h nate!!! and I think their mom is a patron too?? HI MOM) and he hooked the two of us up.

I've been needing a little bit of social media help for a while now - my team is GREAT, but they're strapped with their own actual jobs, and timezones are a bitch, so having someone HERE on the ground with me is a serious godsend.

I especially realized I needed a second pair of hands when I did the Enjoy The Silence webcasts back in February, and realized that while I was concentrating on TALKING TO THE STREAM and RECORDING THE GODDAMN SONG I WAS THERE TO RECORD, I couldn't be tweeting and instagramming at the same time.

So.... Aura came with me to the studio for the Surface Pressure podcast, and posted up a storm.

Since then, they've helped me out on a few occasions. 

Watch out for more from Aura. I might even ask them to write a note to y'all next month. Why not?

......

ROUNDUP OF PROJECTS RELEASED IN MARCH...

The cover of "Surface Pressure" from Encanto, performed with Jherek Bischoff and the Black Quartet, was released into the world!!!

If you missed, you can read all about it HERE:

https://www.patreon.com/posts/63918580

(and don't forget, if you're in the $3 tier or above, you also get an mp3 and wav download of the song here: https://www.patreon.com/posts/63848737 )

And this just came in from Alfredo, my artist friend from Puerto Rico who provided the gorgeous cover art...

THE ART CIRCLE CONTINUES.

Aura and I held a webcast when the song was officially released. If you missed it, you can catch up here:

https://www.crowdcast.io/e/surface-pressure-coffee-

I played some music...including a live piano version of "Surface Pressure" and "The Ride"

Aura played some their OWN music...and oh my god....it was good....

We chatted and spontaneously interviewed one another....

........

SOCIAL MEDIA TIME?

Well, it's sort of an odd time to ask you to follow me on TikTok (I'm @theamandapalmer) since I'm going to stay quiet over there for at least another few weeks, but hey. Still come. I'll be back.

And speaking of the BRIGHT side of TikTok:

I fucking love the idea of the DUET, and posted a duet with the user @nursejessicasites, who had decided to use "Surface Pressure" to talk about being a nurse. Is it complicated yet? Maybe. Talk to me below.

And here's a sneak peek behind the scenes of what it took for me to set that duet up....from a cafe in Devonport. Where, weirdly, LORDE grew up. It's not, as I was shocked to learn, a "torn up" town. Oh well. Art.

......

WHAT'S COMING DOWN THE PIKE...OR NOT....

In the IMMEDIATE FUTURE...

Enjoy The Silence is going to get a proper, full public release... hopefully in the next month or so.

We've also roped in our filmmaker pal Hugh (who has been behind the camera for these recording studio livestreams, and also recorded the Waiheke show last summer) and he's editing the highlights of both the the 10-hour livestream to make a nice digest-able short documentary following the whole process.

.......

As for what's coming down the pike in a more long-term sense.... 

Well, I may need your help with that.

If you've been reading these Althings, or my posts about work, for about the last (gulp) three years, you'll know there's a long, long list of projects I've worked on that are in some sort of state between being an idea in my head, and being officially Thinged into the world. 

Some projects are 99% there. Some projects are 60% there.

I've got some time now to focus on getting some of these motherfuckers across the finish line. But WHICH PROJECT WHEN?

I'm gonna be doing a longer dive into this in the next while, so keep your eyes peeled on your inboxes - I'll probably hit you with a look at 4 or 5 different projects, write a little bit about what they are, how they came into being, who I'm working with, why they've stalled, where they've stalled.... and then I'll listen to y'all when you tell me what you want to see. Maybe we'll do some POLLS.

You all love a good POLLING. :)

......

DISPATCHES FROM THE BEAUTIFUL PEOPLES OF TEAM AFP...

From Jordan.....

This is a time for eternal optimism. 

It sincerely feels like the world just cannot catch a break at the moment. I write this from Sydney, Australia after spending almost 60hrs in bed with some weird stomach bug fever, after dealing with insurers and sub-contractors to deal with damage to my house due to floods, after mopping up after three separate flooding events, after dealing with crazy and unexpected work business and of course, zooming out from my myopic personal view to the world at large… 

DAMN… This world right now... The serious floods on the East Coast of Australia and of course the real tragedy at play globally here… Russia and the Ukraine and the media hype of the next world war. 

There has never been a better time to practice eternal optimism. I write this while I look out the window and see trees swaying in the breezy sunlight, as my dog snuggles up to me, as I listen to a live unreleased recording by one of my favourite bands that was mixed and sent pretty much just for me… 

I write this as I consider my girlfriends limitless supply of love, as I reflect on the taste of the guacamole I ate for breakfast, I write this as I consider the things I will be doing this weekend to try to guide and help my 16 year old through the things he wants to do and achieve… 

I write this as I consider empathy and love and to give without expectation… 

I write this as I think of one of my estranged best friends who reached out to me to re-connect… 

I write this as I feel that all I can do in the world right now is to give a pure and positive intention. To help, to be of service, to do the best I can, to look to see the good in everyone. To not judge a book by its cover and to simply feel the world flowing through me in a positive way. 

I sincerely feel like now is a time for eternal optimism because without that how will we give freely? How can we spread love when we feel that we’re doomed and there is no point to it all? In these days of fractured and stolen attention spans, of inequality, of struggles real, imagined, unexpected, and unjust, of the repetitive bombardment of negativity at every angle that we look… I just have to look out the window and see the trees swaying in the breeze and forget it all. To disconnect to reconnect. I must be coming down from a three day fever… 

I want to thank each and every one of you for your support of Amanda and the work we do as a team. Without it, our worlds would be a very different place.

{Jordan...I have never been more grateful or proud to have you as a manger. I fucking love you. Reading this made my heart explode and my breathing slow. I just love you so much. -AFP}

......

From Alex.....

This has been a bit of a weird month, in that life almost feels..... like the Before Times.

I accidentally ended up with almost an entire month of concerts and theatre shows that I booked months/years ago, under the naive impression that things MUST be better by March 2022!!! And, well....... I'm looking around nervously, but our government has decided that yep, lift all the restrictions, life back to normal. So the shows all went ahead.

It's been a hard decision, and I've spent the past 2 years being so ultra-cautious (I wouldn't even go out to eat until about 6 months ago). But I've got to the point where, unfortunately, the UK government has given up. We have no restrictions, and as of April 1st they won't be offering free testing. So the virus simply isn't going to go away now. So my options are either to continue living the hermit lifestyle, not going back into the city, not going to events that I love so dearly. Or else I just accept the risk, and at least do what I can to minimise the risk.

So, I went out to several shows this month. I remained masked, I tried not to breathe on people, and am putting my faith in my (relative) young age, my vaccine and boosters, and my general good health, and hoping that if (or, more likely, when) it finally catches up with me, I can suffer at home for a week or two.

I can only imagine how much harder these decisions are for people who have underlying conditions, or disabilities, or are older, or have other reasons why they may not be able to put as much faith in their immune system as I can. I wish so dearly that the world collectively had had a better response 2 years ago.

But...... god, it feels so good to see and hear and FEEL live music, and live theatre, and live comedy, after so long without it.

I hope that the theory of diminishing variants is correct, and we do end up seeing covid as a mild cold or flu, and society as a whole is able to get back to proper normal again soon, instead of just pretending it's normal while case numbers still rise and hospitalisations are still steady.

But in the meantime... here's Tori Amos, doing what I love the most about her performances - straddling the piano stool, one hand on her grand piano, and one hand on her electric keyboard, duetting with herself. MAGICAL:

I also want to share something Hannah Gadsby said which really hit me.

She introduced the show by saying that she had written a feel-good show. And she acknowledged that it does feel a lot like the world is ending right now, and maybe it feels inappropriate to do a feel-good show.

But then she decided that actually, she doesn't have the answers to solve the world's problems. (Is she talking about Ukraine? COVID? Climate change? All of the above? Probably!!) She said she's not going to profess to be an expert, and that actually if she pipes up with a half-informed opinion, maybe she'll actually make matters worse.  And she talked about how celebrities are tripping over themselves right now to 'make the most of their platform' and be constantly 'commenting' on world events. 

And sometimes it's okay to not be an expert, and instead to just be quiet, and to listen, and to perform a feel-good show and make an audience of people laugh for 90 minutes.

In other news - I finally renewed my passport this month. My partner's family live in New Zealand, and he hasn't been able to see them for 2 years now. But finally the borders have opened to citizens, so he's planning a trip in May, and I'm going to go halfway with him, and take a little holiday to Toronto. So if anyone has recommendations or advice for spending a week in Toronto in April, please do hit me up :)

That's about all for now, and I shall see you next month.

(My new passport photo, looking deeply serious and worryingly dark around the eyes)

-Alex

xoxox

{Alex....welcome back to the real world-ing, my queen. I am so grateful to have you on this team, and I love that art is flowing back into your veins. You know how much we all need it. And I love that you do so much to keep us all connected. I love YOU. Thank you....for all of it. -AFP}

......

HOW THE PATREON ITSELF IS DOING

As of this writing there are about 12,500 patrons pledging about $40,000 for the first Thing each month.

A VERY IMPORTANT NOTE FOR NEWCOMERS: you are welcome to (and encouraged to) CAP YOUR PLEDGE! PLEASE.

I cannot stress this highly enough.

Your pledge on Patreon supports me per Thing that I release, but sometimes it's unpredictable how many Things will come out in a month (sometimes it's just 1, usually it's 2 or 3, we have been known to do 6 or 7).

We know this can create financial insecurity and uncertainty - so Patreon allows you to cap your pledge. This is, essentially, setting a MAXIMUM amount that you want to pay per month. YOU CAN BUDGET. Say for example, you're happy to pay $3 per Thing, but you don't want to pay more than $10 a month. In that's the case, you can "cap" your pledge at $10, and whether I release 4 Things or 40 Things, you won't be charged more than $10. But MOST IMPORTANTLY, you will still have access to ALL the things, even if you cap your pledge!!! It doesn't effect access.

You can read all about capping your pledge here.

I go over this stuff in every Althing, but if you're new to all this: Patreon charges you monthly & retroactively, meaning that you get billed on the 1st of the month for all the Things released the month prior.

Because people have their pledges capped (SEE ABOVE), the first "Thing" raises the most money by far, and anything released thereafter raises less and less. I LIKE THIS! THIS IS GOOD! It means I never feel guilty about releasing TOO MUCH!! So really. Please, cap your pledge if you are on a budget.

In February, I Thanged TWO Things:

The Surface Pressure webcast, which earned about $44,319 from 12,119 patrons.

The State of All Things: February 2022, which earned about $18,541 from 6,879 patrons.

(we say "about" because patreon may be still trying to process some pledges that have yet to go through...we never know, you know.)

Them's the numbers.

And remember: these numbers are gross. Not net. Meaning: it's the money raised before fees were deducted by patreon and is not the total deposited to me. patreon takes a 5% fee (which they use to build and sustain the platform, which is GOOD) and then there's a payment processing fee, which varies on a ton of factors and is usually between 5-9% of the total collected.

These numbers also do not reflect the money I SPENT MAKING THE ART, paying my staff, paying the office rent, paying for crowdcast, getting myself around, getting the team around and fed and slept, all the collaborators, and my actual staff payroll, etc.

I don't share that level of nitty-detail-stuff with you because I assume it would bore you to fucking tears. but you can trust me: paying for a full-time staff, office, manager, accountant, and massive team of art-collaborators ain't cheap. sometimes we barely break even.

......

OTHER ARTISTS TO SUPPORT....

"ALL THE LIVING AND THE DEAD" BY HAYLEY CAMPBELL

Hayley's a friend of mine via Neil (he's her fairy godfather), and is just about to publish this book. It's officially released in March in the UK, April in Australia, and August in the US. I just cracked into it and FUCK IT IS REALLY GOOD. Promise.

Here's the blurb:

WE ARE SURROUNDED BY DEATH.

It is in our news, our nursery rhymes, our true-crime podcasts. Yet from a young age, we are told that death is something to be feared. How are we supposed to know what we’re so afraid of, when we are never given the chance to look?

Fueled by a childhood fascination with death, journalist Hayley Campbell searches for answers in the people who make a living by working with the dead. Along the way, she encounters mass fatality investigators, embalmers, and a former executioner who is responsible for ending 62 lives. She meets gravediggers who have already dug their own graves, visits a cryonics facility in Michigan, goes for late-night Chinese with a homicide detective, and questions a man whose job it is to make crime scenes disappear.

Through Campbell’s incisive and candid interviews with these people who see death every day, she asks: Why would someone choose this kind of life? Does it change you as a person? And are we missing something vital by letting death remain hidden?

There are pre-order links at her website for pretty much anywhere in the world:

https://www.hayleycampbell.com/all-the-living-and-the-dead

......

If you're a Decembrists or Colin Meloy fan (I AM), I have tidings of joy:

Colin Meloy is now on substack!

https://colinmeloy.substack.com/

I just followed. Cannot wait to see what this dude does with it.

......

ART BEGETTING ART

This is where we share some of the gorgeous artwork inspired by me and my work.... Don't forget, if you've got some artwork you'd like to see featured here next month, send it over to art@amandapalmer.net !!

First up, a beautiful drawing by beloved patron Angel Rosen...

Next, a line drawing from Mike Zug, aka @zugart on Instagram...

And a gorgeous oil painting by @joanning on Instagram... 

......

THE PATRON COMMUNITY BULLETIN BOARD

Our final section is the bulletin board for YOU, the community.

If you have something you'd like us to share - to promote, to ask, to offer up, send it through to patronhelp@amandapalmer.net and we'll do our best to get it added in! 

This month's delights from within the community.....

POEMS FOR THE RIDE - THE PATRON POETRY ANTHOLOGY!!!

If you've been following along the last few Althings (or the last few webcasts), you may know that long-time community patron Angel Rosen has been at the helm of putting together a poetry anthology. The physical copy is now up for pre-order here, and I am so goddamn excited. Here's the description:

Poems for the Ride is a poetry anthology zine edited by Angel Rosen (@Axiopoeticus) and Joshua Pipkins (@PipkinsJoshua).

This anthology includes poems written by people within the Amanda Palmer Patreon Community and covers the topics of life, death, grief, joy and everything in between. It features poetry from over 100 community members and reminds us that even if we're all going through something different, we're never alone.

There is a poem out there for everyone.

And here's a link to the list of contributors.... wow.

AGAIN, the physical copy is currently up for pre-order here. The digital copy will be available for free next month too (and I'm sure we'll share the fuck out of that link here, too)

And if you can't swing the $20 for the physical copy, there are also a bunch of volunteers who have offered to 'pay it forward' and offer free copies to people. If you want to be added to this free copy list, contact Angel at poetryclubafp@gmail.com

I love you all.

......

Patron Miriam got in touch with us about her online bookstore, Catalyst Books & Gifts...

Catalyst Books & Gifts has a mission of celebrating and supporting diversity, equity, and inclusion in science and academia. 

It's a Specific Benefit Corporation, meaning I will pass a lot of the money it makes along to non-profit organizations supporting diversity in STEM. 

I can't ship internationally (yet) but I would be so grateful for any business from fellow patrons in the U.S.! 

The website is catalystbooks.org: it has lots of science-themed stuff featured, but you can order just about any book using the search function. I just launched the store last summer and I'm still keeping my day job, so things are ramping up slowly and I could use all the help I can get.

SUPPORT INDEPENDENT BOOKSTORES, YO. Especially when they're owned by patrons :)

......

Rowan aka Dizraeli, a self-described "rapper-poet-musician-songwriter" from Bristol, UK, is currently fundraising for their upcoming tour...

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/dizraeli-the-twenty-years-deep-tour#/ 

The vision for the tour is to do it as sustainably and socially consciously as possible, travelling and eating low carbon, offering free tickets and performance opportunities for young people from disadvantaged backgrounds.

The funds we raise will pay for us to make this tour a new, necessary kind of tour, connected and sustainable, that will be a model that other artists can draw inspiration from; we'll also create a live album and videos if we raise enough beyond that. 

You can check Dizraeli out on Instagram here:

instagram.com/mcdizraeli

......

That's all, my loves.

See you next time.

I'm reading all the comments til this line is deleted.

x

AFP

------THE NEVER-ENDING AS ALWAYS---------

1. if you are a patron and new to my work, don’t forget your patronage allows you access to ALL of my patreon releases to date. HERE is the link to download my latest big solo record, “There Will Be No Intermission”, and HERE is a link to download the PDF of the art/essay book that goes with it.

2. if you’re a patron reading this post via an email notification, please click through to comment on this post. at the very least, if you’ve read it, indicate that by using the heart symbol. that's always nice for me to see, so i know who's reading.

3. see All the Things (over 150 of them) i've made so far on patreon:

http://amandapalmer.net/things

4. JOIN THE SHADOWBOX COMMUNITY FORUM, find your people, and discuss everything: https://forum.theshadowbox.net/

5. new to my music and TOTALLY OVERWHELMED? TAKE A WALK THROUGH AMANDALANDA….we made a basic list of my greatest hits n stuff (at least up until a few years ago, this desperately needs updating) on this lovely page: http://amandalanda.amandapalmer.net/

6. general AFP/patreon-related questions? ask away, someone will answer: patronhelp@amandapalmer.net

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Comments

Melissa

I needed that real bad today. Thanks, Amanda. I love you, too. ❤️

Raven

Amanda, first of all, I want to tell you that I love you, admire your resilience and your honest attempts and strivings to grow as a human and as an artist. I will tell you my first gut reaction to your cover of "Surface Pressure" as a latinx (Brazilian) who grew up spending the summers in Brazil with my grandma and who also grew up with a first gen immigrant who ingrained a lot of latinx culture (my mother) and who has struggled and had breakdowns and breakthrus as someone who was expected to take care of the whole family despite being a kid (I was the oldest). I loved it. Your cover was what made me cry and connect to the emotional intensity of the song that I didn't perceive from the disney version. I even made a comment on instagram about it (I'm @ravendaimon there) about how much I appreciated it. I shared it with my hispanic boyfriend, our relationship still being new and it was something that could describe my experience growing up with that kind of pressure. He hearted it. The appropriation thing is tricky, and I haven't always been on top of it myself, and as a practitioner of new age magic, I have had to make changes as I have learned. But honestly, in this case... I mean this is a song put out by the Disney corporation. Like... what I see you doing in this cover was create a new thing which really captured the emotional intensity I didn't get from the disney film. Thank you for that. You gave a voice to my hurting inner child with it. I love you for that. I love you.

SField

Much like Alex, I have been super vigilant against covid from the word go. So, was not pleased when my husband did first aid duty at the bloody Cheltenham Races and he has now spent over a week isolating from me and our two teens with Covid. It has had a massive impact on us, but we are still lucky compared to others. I feel furious that this is all because of some pissed up gamblers having to be taken to hospital. Makes me cross that these idiots get so out of their brains that the NHS has to pick up the pieces and volunteers like my husband. I did ask him not to do it as it is hardly essential. Going to work or school is essential... Anyway, not a fan of Tik Tok at all and also not a fan of people using the internet to be mean and anonymously criticise others and stir things up. We are all human, we make mistakes and it would do people well to look at themselves before thinking they are 'holier than thou' or have the right to judge. Ho hum. Best wishes. (Get the tories out FFS!)

Janet in Georgia

I don’t have anything deep or profound to add as patreon is my only “social media” outlet of its even called that. All these years I’ve been a supporter of yours even before patreon. Before Facebook. Remember MySpace? I used that for about a minute. I’ve always been horrified at how people attack you. I’ve met you in person a few times. Never a photo taken. A couple hugs given and you never ever in any way seemed to me at least, a human that deserves so much negativity. It literally breaks my heart. I think if I saw everything out there I’d probably die of empathy overload. Even typing this I’m shedding tears and I can’t help it. Just know that I am and always will be here if and or when you need me and my unconditional love as I’m sure MANY other patrons feel exactly the same way. I didn’t mean to go on and on. I just wanted to vocalize my support knowing you’re right there reading ❤️

Pedro B. Gorman

Hello There, Amanda, & My Thousands of Siblings! (Written on Saturday 26th). This post is for all, and has a message of love at the end in video form, but especially, AmandaI thought ou might take solace from this story and concluding video-love-letter Most of you know me as the Pedro B. Gorman-happy-dappy crowdcast enthusiast, and at best, I guess I am. I decided tonight, of all nights, to write here more because Patreon call & response threads can be clunky. I also decided to write here because, though I was temporarily in paradise a few days ago, I am sad, but also deeply moved I wanted to post a photo diary of the past couple of days in a paradise called Sesimbra, 40 minutes away from Lisbon, where I brought my mother, Isabel, who is 81 years old and, though she has no life threatening illness as of yet, she is terrified of dying, and knows she is on a possible last stretch—at least in the sense that she has lived many more years than she has left. I also brought my mother here because she needed to escape the flat where she lives with my older sister. Despite the fact that my sister, due to her own mental health issues (chronic dysthymia and complete anedhonia) is my mother’s prime carer, both mother and daughter have such an awful relationship as to be redolent of Bette Davis and Joan Crawford in “Whatever Happened to Baby Jane,” except the are not sisters, as in the film. But the dynamic between them is the same. I also brought my mother here because she hadn’t been to this “neck of the woods” in more than 50 years, in her early thirties; before that, she had come here with her parents as a child. A magical thing happened today (and I am sorry I cannot post the illustrative photos/videos, as format issues and clunky file transfer glitches wont allow it, I will have to describe it. I awoke at dawn, and was so deeply over by the seafront “infinity” view from the breakfast table that, while my mother still slept, I quietly packed and descended to the beach, enchanted by the flocks of gulls I extensively photographed. My mother’s osteoporosis would never have allowed her to descend all the fifty five steps to the beach with me anyway, and it would have been too windy and cold for her even if she had. When I returned from half-bathing in freezing Atlantic waters, starting a poem, and taking scores of photographs, she was awake. I had brought her goodies like cakes, and pastries she loves, and was showing her the photos with such enthusiasm, that I was taken aback (but soon fully understood) when she burst into convulsive tears. Her father (my maternal grandad, who died a terrible slow cancer death when I was eight—I am 45 now), and whom she adored, had an equal passion for nature photography, but also for poetry and literature (and I am a budding writer, as yet unpublished). Her torrent of tears was brought on by some tone in my voice, and some goin in my eyes as I was showing her the photos that took her back to the time when her own father would show her photographs he had developed himself. She confessed that until that moment, she has never realized how much of her own father I had in me. A few minutes after her emotional outburst, we were visited by a gull on our window sill who stayed, studying us intently, and whom we fed some crumbs and shrimp to. Because she was already so shaken by buried memories which came flooding forth, and became so overwhelmed she had to swallow a Xanax, I allowed her to enjoy the gull’s visitation as simply that. But there was something about the way the gull was looking at me, and at her. I felt it was my grandfather’s spirit. Later, during lunch, she revealed something to me I did not yet formally know: that every man—including my father—she ever had a relationship with treated her violently; beating her, or cheating on her, or making her the “other woman” in their own flawed but still ongoing marriages; and that the only two men she ever felt loved and respected by and treated gently by were both her father, and by me. I am writing late into the night to share this with you because, since we have sent every waking moment together the past two days, I haven’t yet had a chance to tell any of my friends, I needed to get this off my chest. As some of you may know, I you’ve ever watched me and Amanda speak on crowdcast, that here 2019 show in Portugal, Braga, occurred shortly after my father’s death who—though a philandering husband, was, at least, to me, a loving father and friend. I could go on writing now for another three hours here, in an emotional spew—about how horribly women are treated by men—and here is my point—especially strong, intelligent, anti-establishment, anti-patriarchy women such as my mother once was…but I want to rise at dawn again and go down to the beach to finish processing everything I learned today. If these days any of you Sibling Patrons consider me a kind, loving soul, it was largely owing to my mother’s love for me over the years—the values she instilled in me. ---- The above piece was written on Saturday 25th March. On Tuesday, shortly before leaving our Air B'n'B, I read this post, and sensed your sadness, Amanda. I briefed my mother on ho unkind the Tik-Tok world had been to you, and also the internet world. And, herself a single mother in the 60's (to my older sister), where divorced women in Portugal where considered "sluts from hell," she wanted to join me in this message of Love to you, Amanda, especially as a single mother and a woman much harangued by the Patriarchy. And she also wanted to say hello to all of you who have kept me going since 2019. I also sensed all of you Sibling Patron's sadness, anger and frustration at the way strong, independent, anti-patriarchy women the world over suffer. So, here is a gift of love from my mother and I. I recorded a short video with her, especially for y'all, and, Amanda, of course, for you too. My mother knows well what being mistreated is, and through me, she has come to know and love your work, and takes much solace in the comfort I derive from this here community, so she wanted to say hello after I had told her what had been going on with y'all. Here we are, wishing you all Love. https://youtu.be/9PNf7nwNJCg Much Love, Isabel Gorman & Pedro B. Gorman

Lucy

I can't speak about appropriation, and I can't speak for other members of my community but for myself: as a nonbinary person who joined the patreon before I even started doing work on interrogating my gender I have never felt anything other than safe both here and 'with' you, Amanda. You (and Alex, and the patreon at large) commissioned art from me and helped me pay my rent when covid threatened to pull the rug out from under me. You are very human, like all of us, but I have never once thought you transphobic - in fact, very much the opposite. I feel safe here.

Angel Rosen

Hi Amanda!! I think it's really good that you've asked, addressed and acknowledged your responsibility in participating in the discussion about the conversations resulting from the cover. I do, however, think you are constantly held to an unreasonable standard because you're so easy to misunderstand, and therefore, hate. Someone in the AFP group on Facebook said that some young person mentioned not liking you and asked if they liked you, and asked if you're good or bad, and it was said that "people are not good or bad. They all do good and bad things." I think that's mostly how I talk to Anti-AFP people who are unable to change their opinion of you even when they learn new information. I mean, that's a major problem. People set on hating you (or anyone Like You who is Also Hated) will almost never change their mind even if there is new information, but You (Or Any Person Similarly Hated) is willing to take in new information, learn from it, apply changes when needed. Have hard conversations. We are all ignorant at times, you just have to be ignorant publicly, because you're loved publicly, supported publicly, and so on. People think you can't take criticism, but it's that NO ONE should have to tolerate abuse. As a public person online, you don't have total privacy of your thoughts, which means you have a different expectation when it comes to making things right. But, I'm white/cis, so I'm going to refrain from suggesting "What to do", but I will be reading the comments here, too, to learn from them as well and I look forward to the discussions. Thank you Amanda (AND ALEX!) for sharing my art and the Poems for the Ride link!! One of the most meaningful things about the project is that I have a new wonderful friend, Josh, who helped me edit/proofread and he really adds joy to my life (which is not something I have a surplus of). I hope the book makes other people feel seen & loved & community-held. I also love that it's entirely patron-oriented, as Coin-Operated Press is doing all the work for the distribution. One of the two Coin-Op owners is Chloe, who was one of my very first Patreon-group friends seven years ago. I still have art she mailed me 7 years ago. Full circle. I miss you a lot on Twitter, but I totally understand why you're away. I wish I could be away. April is poetry month, so I'll be writing at least one poem a day (this is my 8th year participating), I hope to share some with you. Lastly, is there anything we can do for you right now that you didn't already ask for? I'm proud of you for keeping it together. Editing to add: I don't know that addressing & having good, meaningful conversations is going to actually fix the Tiktok-type situation, but I think it's important to do for yourself & for the people in your actual community who do love you who may have felt hurt or unseen over the years by misunderstandings or ignorance. The people who love you want to be heard.

Jennifer

So…with the TikTok issue. First off, I didn’t see the cover as appropriation, but it is also not for me to say since I’m a white woman. TikTok is a fucking BRUTAL environment, and everyone, unfortunately, gets hate. Everyone. Now, this is me being honest and not trying to hurt feelings, but it might sting and I apologize. You got more shit than I think you would because when you did respond, you sounded like, well, a person in their 40s who used to be the ‘edgy’ one (I’m thinking of the armpit hair comment in particular), but is just now older. Basically, you left people with even more low-hanging fruit to use against you. I think compiling your past responses to some of the things you’ve done and corrected in the past to post all together might help, but also the internet is just fucking brutal, and nothing may help. I do think that just stepping back from TikTok is good though all around, especially for mental health.

Fonzie Blair

unfortunately I don't feel like addressing the complaints is going to solve this. people on tik tok and the group of folks that lobby this hate aren't in a place to discuss. it's a bandwagon, fueled by whatever emotion they can't properly deal with. it seems like the issue is less about you, and more about finding things to throw rage at. If you feel you must respond, maybe an idea would be to find an actual well informed person who is interested in educating you and do an on-video discussion with them? if there are people with legitimate issues, you could have a humble conversation, people can see you listening to and accepting the criticism and growing in a genuine way? because that would speak to legitimately concerned people. I just don't think those who do the tik tok comments are reachable. if you post a rebuttal or explanation in response to their assertions , I think people will just attack it and take it out of context even more. I'm sorry you're going through this- tik tok just is this way, and those who fall into that gossip are sadly misled. take care Amanda. us who see the context and all of you know you're a force for good in this world. I hope a solution presents itself. love you.

Francine Hibiscus

I am not on the TIktok, I depend on the Young to put good ones on Twitter. I am not sure why you are such a deeply polarizing person, but YOU ARE. It's a mystery to me, it honestly is. No one who is spreading gossip is interested in hearing your side of the story. So Auntie Hib advises you to just stop engaging. This generation of Youngs are steeped in the savage unkindness of the screen, where we can say ANYTHING without consequence, where there is no one to say GET MY NAME OUT OF YOUR MOUTH, or burst into tears, or scream or laugh derisively. It's not a good thing. Even among the more reasonable folks, it's easier to just internalize the gossip. Why not, it's easier than straightening out the story on a person that they don't care much about anyway. Celebrities are shit! Eat the rich! If they didn't do this, then they did some other horrible thing. I am Italian, I cannot speak to the appropriation of Surface Pressure without talking over someone. I CAN say that it's a fine and relatable song, and you did a magnificent job of expressing it. I'm glad that you are better able to shake off the poison. Yeah, you've stepped in it sometimes, but so has every other human being, you just have the joy of doing it on an international stage. Big love to you and the family, Amanda~

August Marshall

Punk Rock Factory covered Surface Pressure - and even featured Jessica Farrow! - on TikTok back in January. Granted, I don't know any of the band member's cultural makeup, but it looks pretty much like some white dudes. I've never viewed any of these covers as appropriation - as the eldest daughter, I feel that song in my BONES, and I am very much a white lady. I don't know. It's a weird, hard, evolving topic and I'm not the person to speak on it. I'm sorry this shitstorm has taken off the way it has. I love you and your honesty and communication. Sending hugs from Tennessee.

Alison Waddy

I'm both under 40 and on tiktok, and in general i have appreciated the -radicalized far left- vibes that are prevalent on the platform, but i was kinda surprised and upset to see just how incredibly negatively everyone took your cover. Like it seemed unnecessarily harsh. You're getting attacked over there with the same vitriol that is usually reserved for conservative white men and it just seems... Unnecessary. But since I'm white too it's not up to me to decide what is racist, or what is appropriative. I think it would be a good idea for you to set up some kind of resource where people can go to find your statements / apologies you've previously made about these issues that keep getting brought up. Maybe link it to your toktok and then stay away from the platform for a month to see what happens. One other piece of advice I'll give, i don't think it comes off well when you mention the race of the person who asked you for the cover. I know you don't mean it this way, but i also know, 100% for sure, that if the tiktok crowd read that they would accuse you of basically saying "I'm not racist, see? I have friends who are people of color". That's how they generally take it in any situation when someone is trying to talk about issues of racism and specifically mentions a non-white person's race in this type of way. That's how they'll think it sounds, regardless of your intent. Much love overall. ❤️ Best of luck with everything

WaitWeCanChangeHowOurNameIsDisplayedWHAAA

I’m a 40+ TikToker and I’ve been so sad to see you receiving all of this blowback. TikTok is like the video version of Twitter; it lends itself to quick reflexive responses and opinions and it can be hard to have real conversations through the impulsive noise. Many of the creators that I adore simply do as you’ve done here, create a post asking for the affected community to talk to them about how they feel about the situation. I’m not sure what the “right” thing to do is, but I’m here to support you through it. I’m so sorry the tidal wave was so high this time. ((Hugs))

SField

Brutal is such a good description of the internet!🙂

Amir

Hi Amanda, I love being part of the patreon, and this community, but I rarely comment on these posts. Felt like I really wanted to say this time, fuck the haters. You're making art, your heart is always in the right place. Seems a bit far fetched that this cover was wrong, but I'm a white guy so what do I know. Feels like people feel free to be mean to you for some reason, and its so annoying to see from the side. Just want to send love your way, and giant hug. We got you <3

Claudia Colicchia

TikTok (and let's face it, the left in general) is incredibly puritanical and indignant. It doesn't matter how well you apologise or how much growth you show, you've already sinned and been banished. I keep seeing them cannibalising each other over perceived wrongdoings. It's not just you and your mistakes, it's also a "them" problem. Take care.

Marianna Fratti

Brazilian here, not a POC, on the Encanto kerfuffle It feels like a territorial response of trying to defend a well made cultural representation of minorities. Blind to the fact that it was made by Disney, a company whiter than Snow White. I felt the emotion you put into the cover. The honesty in your rendition. Those lyrics speak to you, and your heart spoke through them. Were this an indie song, completely made and owned by POC and used by a white person as a self promoting tool I'd understand the discomfort, but that isn't the case. It's blind rage, and I'm sorry you're so often targeted by those who cannot see how hard you're trying.

Cindy Diver

Wooh I feel the weight on your chest right now Amanda. In answer to the WTF do you say to the TikTok response - I think there is probably nothing you can say. Like the anti-science crowd here in NZ - logic, evidence based research, kindness - it just falls on deaf ears - because they have made a position and want to only reinforce their confirmation basis. I think you are an amazing, fiercely human, loving being - and your art speaks for itself. Make more ART. xox Arohanui e hoa.

Hope Greenwood

My youngest kid is non-binary and queer. They are on tiktok often, and were very upset when the shit hit the fan. They were adamantly defending you until they were completely overwhelmed by people....in general. We all love you very much and the right people know the truth and know you.

Toine Scholtz

Hi Amanda and all you lovely people ❤️ Amanda, step back. What is happening with your song on TikTok is not about you or even about your song. People there are responding the way they feel they need to respond there, and that's about them. I don't think there's any way that you can engage there that will be positive for you, or change whatever narratives are bouncing about there. Let it be whatever it is and become whatever it will become, and put your energy and focus into the things in front of you right now that matter. I'm in no position (white, AMAB) to comment on appropriation in the context of your cover of Surface Pressure. I guess on some level, everything we create is appropriation to greater or lesser degrees. That's how novelty and innovation emerge; when we learn and experience and respond to and combine existing things, because that's all there is. You make beautiful things, so make beautiful things. And look after the things that matter. I love you all xx

Taylor Hagerdorn

Hey, 27yo here. I watch tiktok way more than I create on it, but it's one of my favorite platforms. I'm not sure what I'd do in your shoes, honestly. But if there is energy and time and desire, I can imagine that an essay that's open, vulnerable, and honest might land well. I know many peers and folks younger than I care about receipts, which you have. And that when someone's career spans a good chunk of time, the venom and vitriol can strike faster than solid research is done. I don't know if you owe folks who aren't willing or able to do the work to know you, the work to prove yourself worth reconsideration. I also think documention IS important, and if it's generating a receipt of growth and self awareness and Good and Kind humaning, that might not be such a terrible thing to produce.

Livvy C

With regards to the TikTok stuff, I would offer two small pieces of advice. Firstly, in your blog post addressing Guitar Hero - and also in this post - you mention audience members/patrons who didn't tell you what you were doing was inappropriate. And the thing is, I'm sure they didn't, and maybe they actually didn't think these things were inappropriate, but whether or not they did is irrelevant, and they shouldn't figure into any part of how you explain the things you didn't know or understand. A big part of how you present your art is in this kind of collaborative spirit, and your collaborators are your audience. I get that and I'm a patron so I obviously enjoy it. But ultimately, as the main spokesperson for your art (not to mention the main artist), the person who's responsible for the output is you. It doesn't matter what others told you or didn't, and when you implicate them, it can unfortunately come across as you trying to lessen the effect of the thing you're being held accountable for, or even making them somewhat accountable for it instead. In this dynamic, you have more power than they do, so they don't deserve that responsibility. The other advice I have is to accept that you may not be forgiven, and to not let it deter you from continuing to be and do better. Don't stop saying you're sorry. Don't stop learning and listening. Don't stop trying but don't expect forgiveness (I think Tina Fey said something to that effect on Dave Letterman's Netflix show). There's no absolution here, and it has to be okay. I'm glad you're staying off TikTok for now. It's the wisest move for a lot of reasons. It must be very difficult to be on the receiving end of the criticism that's been leveled against you, and I hope you're being kind to yourself right now.

AnnaLatchman

Hey Amanda, I'm one of the young ones. I became a fan around age 13 and was a patron between 2016-2019 while at university and now I'm back, ten years after first hearing you. Because I really wanted to watch the webcasts of you recording Surface Pressure. I watched the kerfuffle unfold, and it weighed on my mind a lot. Last night I listened to your appearance on "Conversations with People who Hate Me" and that helped ease my mind a little. Because I know that you are always well intentioned, and people just need to hear you out. But then, we can't send 30,000 people to go listen to a podcast, right? I am a person of colour and Encanto hit home, especially the themes of the pressure of being a second generation immigrant. I didn't see the kerfuffle coming. Sure maybe the jokes about singing are inevitable but I didn't expect the appropriation things. I agree that these are songs about themes that particularly shine when sang by the folk it relates to. But I really like what the lyrics mean to you, and how you put that in the song. And it was a song that was voted for you to sing!!! Explaining this to angry people on tiktok seems so simple and yet it won't be. TikTok, to me, is an entitled platform. You see someone tell a story and everyone will say "part 2!! tell us more!!! answer these questions!!!" and get mad when they are left high and dry. People won't leave the platform for answers, they seem to only want to go find out what everyone is mad about and join the kerfuffle. If you want to address this, I think it will have to be on tiktok, or easily linked to through tiktok. If I was in your shoes, I would probably attempt to deal with it by planning my words well and making a series of tiktok videos explaining every thing that people like to bring up. Have a clear thumbnail with a title in it so people can see it and which thing you address in it. Some of these things, you have existing answers and have addressed already, maybe some of them require new reflection. Maybe you can do the essay thing too, I like your long form writing. But people want information at their fingertips. Maybe your pinned video could send people to it. Do I actually think you should do this..? Only if and when you can handle it. It is sorta important but never as important as your own wellbeing. And to answer your final question, yes it can be weird being one of the few poc in your fanbase but I don't care, I see you and know what you stand for. "they're all so busy yelling, not one of them is hearing" love from, Anna

Amanda England

White woman, and just this side of too crusty for Tiktok, but you put genuine heart and soul into that cover. I think a lot of that backlash isn't about you or the song, it's about people wanting to be angry and put you in a box that isn't you. I think the only person who's opinion on appropriation would be truly important in this case is Lin Manuel's. Does he not want his words in your mouth? I doubt it - I think he knows he wrote a song that hits deep for a lot of people and he got paid well to put it in a Disney movie. He's not a struggling creator having his work stolen to make someone else famous, and it's not actually a piece of Colombian culture to be appropriated - it's Disney. Are only Colombian viewers allowed to react emotionally to that film? Anyway, again I'm very much white, privileged and a you fan, but I bet Lin Manuel would chat this over with you.

Narcala

I don't have TikTok, so no idea how that one works, but 3 Million views sounds amazing, especially if new people are joining the patreon because of it. Your people will always find you, I think, somewhere a young person just found you through that Tiktok video, and that is really beautiful. A post about who you are and what is not your intention whit the art you make, may be a good idea. Putting emphasis on the change everyone goes though in there life, what once was a good idea isn't anymore as we as people, as we as society evolve. It isn't always easy to break away from our sociocultural upbringing and to see where we must change and to learn what may be cultural appropriation and what is appreciation of culture and art. As I am not bipoc, I cannot answer if you making a cover of Disney's "Surface Pressure" is in bad taste, I hope patreons who are csn answer that for you. I am a migrant, and got to here a lot of bad, bad words spoken to me throughout my childhood here. You have to get a thick skin to get over that and through that, I try to learn to this day to not take this cultural trauma to the next generation. A thick skin is good in my opinion, as long as you stay true to yourself where it matters and let the good things through and don't close yourself to everything. Tiktok maybe harsh right now, but it also maybe the way to bring the people in that wouldn't find you otherwise, that may be worth it. I can't say either way, what I can say is, that you have evolved over the years, and that I see and feel that you learn from your mistakes and try to really reflect on them. That is an awesome part of you, that is one of the reasons I support you and your art. I hope this will be one of the things that make you a better artist, as other hurdles have done in the past. Thank you for weathering the storms when you need to, I hope you can recharge enough here to get over this one, but please take care of yourself either way. ❤️

Lauren Carnall

Amanda - I know you came on here for answers about surface pressure and how to handle the pushbacks. As I feel I am part of the big majority of your fans as a white late 30's (yep I am in the under 40 but absolutely do not do tik tok) it doesn't feel my voice needs to be heard on these. So I leave it for those who do. What I did want to say is, as a patreon I don't read every message (I mean to but it never happens, I get busy, there is so much to do in life) however the all thing is what I do make time to read, as it catches me up on what I might have missed, things you have thinged as well as updates on the team. So nope I didn't vote in the poll about the money spend but I do make it to the bottom of the all thing. And yeah, I support you because that's what I want to do, so I trust you as the artist on what you consider art you are spending it on x

Tara Goddard

This reminds me how these type of things can be simultaneously really important and really not important. That is, issues around art and appropriation and listening and online bullying and all that are valid, and real, and important. But also, as someone who hasn't seen Encanto and isn't on TikTok and hadn't seen one iota of your post or the response until the AllThing - the whole thing - the response, the angst, the fight, it literally didn't exist to me. Or to all the other people like me (not on TikTok, no idea about Encanto, whatever). Just a reminder to all of us that our relationships with each other and how we treat each other are everything and everything is also so fleeting and transitory and emphemeral. (I don't know if any of this made sense, it is just what all this made me think about.)

Brevemike

First, Latinx=No. I am latino or hispanic. I don’t know who thought up the term or why they felt we needed and all-inclusive term. This feels like referring to everyone by the pronoun it, regardless of personal preference. That said, this is *my* personal preference - others may disagree. Second, this is not cultural appropriation because the song is dealing with a universal theme. The song is not about or derived from a uniquely hispanic or Columbian tradition or experience. Everyone, everywhere experiences and has to cope with pressure in life. Whether work, personal, or existential. Third, I thoroughly enjoy TikTok and the various communities present there. However, it is apparently standard practice to do a background check on anyone who tries to create anything anymore. Someone on TikTok had an issue with you (either because of the song or previously) and chose to use this opportunity to signal boost their hate. You cannot reason or negotiate with these people. Nuance will get you nowhere. If you have - and you have - addressed these issues in the past, consider creating some short posts where you simply restate what you’ve said before. People can either accept you at your word, or not. But at least you will have tried to address and not ignore their concerns. Constant engagement is the key to success on TikTok. You can’t set it and forget it. It may be too time and energy consuming to be worth the effort.

Noelle Rum

You do not apologise for being yourself or for the fact that, as a human, you make mistakes. As a woman, this is unforgivable for many people. (Or, if it's not the lack of apology that's unforgivable, it's that you are still able to have a "successful" life while not apologising or acting humbly grateful just for being allowed to exist.) There will absolutely always be a percentage of vitriol associated with that, which you can safely ignore. All that said, there is a moment right now for supporting Black people, Asian people, Latine people, LGBTQ+ people, etc., to take the space and the airtime to tell the stories that are about *them*, without straight and/or white people latching onto the universal components of every human's story and making it about them. Some things are not for us. And I think you touched a nerve by taking a song grounded in the particular experience of a Colombian woman (when Colombian women's stories rarely make it to the mainstream) and emphasising the universality of it. By singing it, you made it your song too. Even five years ago, I suspect this would never have been called out (or in) as appropriation. But we're gaining nuance to these debates. I was on the Crowdcast where you decided to sing it, and I wondered at the time whether it would cause any issues further down the line because at no point did you or any of the people talking around you consider the ramifications of making that song yours. And I get it! It was totally spur of the moment, voting up one particular song by the people watching. I got the impression a lot of the up-voters were people who had kids and were listening to the Encanto soundtrack near-constantly (although that may just have been a vocal minority). The kerfuffle came when you posted it on TikTok (which is an environment in which young people are pushing each other hard on inclusion and equity) without thinking through how it would land *there*. If you'd gone the Patreon and YouTube route, I doubt very much whether you would have had any kerfuffle at all. It's absolutely always worth reflecting, and talking through how your opinions have changed over time. And because it's you, of course it will be done publicly. But you need to put those thoughts out there for you as an end in itself, not in the hopes of changing other people's opinions of you. Because most people run on instinct and feelings rather than facts, and you can give them all the facts in the world and it probably won't make much difference. A better way to get people's opinions to change is to be a visibly good ally. Risk something real or pay a cost to support someone else. Those stories will fly around much quicker than any explanation you might give.

Fleassy Malay

Amanda. This is all so huge and it's a huge thing to be called out and even huger for that to blow up on a platform like tiktok. Tiktok is... difficult. If you had asked me (not that you would) before joining tiktok it would have come with some big warnings around mental health, around the impact of the FYP on our brains...and around the nature of fast spreading 15 second clips with zero context. It's can be beautiful and it can be ferocious. There are real issues with cancel culture. I believe solidly in calling people out...or in... for their problematic behaviour (I do it a LOT on my own socials to men who piss me off in my comments for example)... however, I can be dangerous, when nuance is lost in a conversation they can go so wrong so quickly. I have no answers for your questions...but I can share my thoughts in the hope it leaves you less alone. I'm a white, gender queer, 35 y/o... I do not know your history or mistakes, but I know other trans people who adore you. I don't identity as Trans... I identity as Gender Non-Conforming... in that I have never noticed any comments which left me feeling marginalised or pushed out by you. I see you as tender, fallible, and honest. This is what I appreciate about you, your willingness to converse, to question, to unpack. We live in a time when the global stage is bigger and far more reaching than ever before. For the first time in history we are being asked to bare EVERYONE in mind when we do something. That's 7 billion people across thousands of cultures and subcultures. How incredible would it be to be able to do things and be able to understand the complex and often highly nuanced implications of our actions across all those cultures. But how possible is it? I personally (as someone who has engaged in many of these conversations) feel it is impossible. Especially on tiktok where your words are very quickly not your own. Conversations are almost impossible on that platform. We will make mistakes. And we will learn. And we will grow. And we will make other mistakes...and we will learn...and we will grow. None of us have an intersection of personal understanding of every nuance of every possible lived experience. And here-in lays the issue with cancel culture...it takes mistakes and makes them permanent. It does not say "you fucked up, but you can do better" instead it It stamps across the forehead of someone: "you are a fuck up" and you are forced to leave a part of yourself there in that identity forever in the minds, hearts, and blogs, of people who know you only for that mistake. Without nuance or context. It's a culture that thrives not on growth but on shame (which is paralysing). And sometimes...sometimes that's important...to know so clearly the mistakes people make. When they repeat them over and over (Trump for example). They can build a bigger picture of someone. But more often that not, those mistakes become an anchor for hate that refuses to see you grow. This is more complex when the ones we have hurt are marginalised groups, people (like me) who carry a history of complex traumas and struggles. People who are fucking tired of being impacted by others mistakes. People who maybe even have had those nuanced conversations enough times already with different people...and today...today are just fucming over it. So, instead of leaning into the conversation they just say straight up what they pain and hurt and anger want to say. And then there are trolls. Of course. Always trolls. Anyway...this is a huge (and potentially pointless) ramble from me as a way of saying... I have no answers, but a mere glimpse of my own understanding. I'm sorry you are here, and it must be hard to carry. Go gently, with yourself, your kid, and with the world around you. You are loved...in your mistakes, in your learning, in your growing.

Danielle Buie

I'm in the over 40 crowd, and downloaded Tiktok just to see all the comments, and wow... I got overwhelmed pretty quickly on your behalf. One thing that really troubles me about "cancel culture" is what seems to be a very polarized way of conceptualizing human beings in the public eye, and a refusal to even consider that such humans can change, evolve, grow, desire to be accountable for their own mistakes, etc. Part of me wants to tell you to just run as fast as possible in the opposite direction from this crowd, because of their commitment to giving you exactly zero grace. Another part of me thinks that you might, for yourself and the person you are, need to say your peace, make clarifications and clear amends (which this crowd will not likely bother to search for elsewhere on the web). Not necessarily to defend yourself so much as to show them that public figures are actual humans who can grow, evolve, own mistakes, think deeply, etc. But if you do this and are still met with cancel culture mentality that simply refuses to let you be anything other than the lazy stereotypes they've filed you under, then please wish them well and disengage from that platform. It isn't worth the cost to your energy and well being. I know and trust that you're doing your work as a human being who cares about other human beings, regardless of whether Tiktok believes you. ❤

Marie

I had to stop to respond to you re: the kerfuffle. I've been a fan for a long time, so know this is meant from a place of love and admiration. I'm talking to you as I would talk to any friend in a similar situation. You have fucked up. We all do. However, you come to your blog to explain and, well... the people you've hurt aren't coming to read what you've wrote. And sometimes, what you've wrote comes across as "woe is me, what about the ART?" Or in the case of the last kerfuffle about racism, you put it behind a pay wall. What you need to do is APOLOGIZE. Clearly. For everyone to see. You need to say "I see what I did, now that I'm older I see why it was wrong, I am sorry for hurting you, and this is what I plan to do in the future". It's not enough to tell US. You have to tell the ones you've hurt. You have to accept that a good portion of them will not accept your apology or forgive you. It hurts. But you broke people's trust and good faith. Going forward, you have to do better. Retire songs and phrases that have hurt people. Make new art, better art. Be an aggressive ally. Talk to BIPOC, disabled, trans folks and really listen. I'd love for you to do a town hall with some people who have been hurt by you and have a sit down conversation and do better moving forward. Your music helped me find a lot of pieces of myself. But I often feel like you're an embarrassing family member that I want to disassociate from but I can't because we share DNA. I've actually been debating leaving the Patreon because I don't want to be seen as racist or ableist or transphobic. I believe you don't mean to hurt people. But it feels like you are so bullheaded that you refuse to admit when you're wrong, or you do a sneaky apology which feels like a non-apology to those you've hurt. I'm not saying any of this to hurt you. I just know you can do better. You chose to be a public figure, and you need to accept the consequences of your actions. Learn, apologize, be better, do better.

Andy Leeke

Firstly, I'm so glad of how much good vibes and wonderful art is in this post. Does my soul good, and honestly, I've been a little worried about you. It's wonderful to see that there's so much more than the angry loudness online. But as for tiktok... I downloaded it again to see the response to your post ( I left it behind a while back... I still don't really 'get it') and I engaged with it for a while.... There was a lot of hate, and a lot of the same old untrue lines, the same old snowball of hate hysteria rolling down the hill, getting bigger, regardless of what's at the center. And it honestly, it made me really concerned for you. We've never met, but I still care about you. And I wouldn't want anyone to have to deal with that. I thought I'd be able to resist and the hate choked me in just a few minutes. And it wasn't even aimed at me. I'm glad you stepped away. I'm a white man, so my opinion isnt exactly the most relevant here, but the way I see it is that it's no more an issue of appropriation for you to sing that song as it is for Disney to make money on selling the toys, the album, the movie itself or the inevitable stage musical. Despite who wrote it, or sang it, or who it's about, it's not the product of a culture, it's the product of a fucking giant corporation. Anyone covering one of those songs is covering a Disney song, not a traditional folk song. Tiktok feels like it's full of teenagers trying to change the world through passive aggression and badly researched cancelling attempts. They may become wonderful, engaged people. But it feels like an incredibly toxic, hate filled place, which I don't think I want to engage with again.

Joni

I dipped a toe into the TicTok thing (@FridayBaldwin) and then it hurt... So I walked. I think that should tell you how I feel about that choice. 😉 I'm glad you can do that. There have been times in my life that I've injured my psyche by not walking... Lesson learned (mostly). I can't speak to the appropreation issue.. I will say it never occurred to me either, for whatever that's worth. Crazy idea, have you reached out to Lin-Manuel Miranda? I think that might be a useful conversation... But aside from that, as a fellow WASP, I feel like I need to sit back and listen on that. The hate.... *Sigh*.... What I have always admired about you/your music/your writing/your journey is that you address missteps/mistakes, openly and in as public a manner as possible. I have watched you make mistakes that I could have easily made in your shoes, and the way you take ownership simply leaves me breathless. I love that as you learn and grow and evolve your understanding, you take us along for the ride. Your example gives me strength and inspiration to grow and evolve myself and ultimately be more honest about my mistakes. In that spirit, maybe it IS time to go all "Reynolds Paphlett" and put it all in one place. I think the point about context is an important one... Too many people find one self-echoing chamber and take that as "evidence". Ultimately, you have to do what feels right for you, what is best for your wellbeing and what you have capacity for. That said, My most inspiring teacher ever was my HS drama teacher Mrs. S. who always said "When in doubt, do the scary thing". She was talking about acting... But I don't know, it sticks with me. Whatever you choose... We'll be here and I love you.

Emma Rose Stecheson

This, so much. I don't wanna leave the Patreon, but I've scaled back my contributions. I love the music but I rarely tell people I'm a fan and I NEVER defend Amanda. Because some people have been really really hurt by stuff she's done in the past, and who am I to defend her in the face of that? Yes, she has grown as a person but that doesn't erase the harm that has been done. And then I wonder if I'm still making excuses, even if only to myself, so I can keep listening to her. And I tell myself other artists have done worse stuff and not gotten this much hate, but most of them are dudes. And then I wonder if the hate for Amanda is disproportionate/sexist.... and on and on. It's conflicting.

Elena Mackenzie

I'm sorry that tiktok has brought up all this anger. Maybe give it time and do one blog that talks about the themes you've seen in the comments that came up the most, just almost as an intro for those who don't know your work or history. I am sending you love and hope you keep the faith.

Michele H

As a white queer woman I don’t feel I can anything except for the fact the song written is put out by a corporate mainly white straight corporation. It was created by folks of all background and walks of life not all of which share the heritage they brought beautifully to life. It focuses on a specific community AND what also can be true is it is so damn universal it proves that humans have more things alike than differences. It’s why these films from this studio are so successful. They always speak to the universal ‘we’. In the film, Surface Pressure gutted me. This cover gutted me. The authenticity of the words and music filled with passion and pain and worry - well, they heal me. I feel heard. And I think the man who wrote the song. Who stood on a stage the night of the Pulse shooting and said “love is love is love is love is love” would love this stirring cover and appreciates how 6 year old kids to 60 year old adults have been moved by his music in this film. The internet is filled with opinions. As my dad used to say - opinions are like assholes. We all have them. You will never come to a consensus with arguing folks online. There is no point in trying. The internet can do beautiful things like bring folks together here but it has also given voice to raging to just rage. To stir shit. To cause drama for the point of causing drama. Not to move a conversation forward but to get the most ‘likes’ and, well, it’s toxic. Yes. Step away from toxic.

Mx. J

I'm on tiktok pretty much everyday, and this whole thing felt super weird. People are growing up with access to both information and feedback in a way we did not. They're used to having to know of and stand for every single struggle there ever was from the moment they create their first social media account, and they're used to viral apology videos on YouTube when some public figure isn't a paragon of perfection. They're also young enough to not have had A Major Fuck Up yet, everyone ends up doing something not great for someone if they live for long enough. So there's that high horse riding where it's fine to dig out stuff people did in their early careers, since they have no clue of how much the context of everything changed in the past 20-30 years, and they just assume that nothing they do today will ever be seen under a harsh light like the one they're pointing. Maybe they expect to be held accountable in this way too, but it won't take long to learn how unsustainable it is to be this unkind to themselves. And like, even if you did fuck up badly in the past, what else are you supposed to do but recognize it, learn from it, and keep from doing it again? I don't think it's fair to keep lashing out at someone who understands the impact of their actions and tries to do better, and that's what I see in your story. About the cover, as a latine, I really don't care about it. It's Disney. You're not singing a traditional song that was only taught to those born in the culture, and performing it out of its context. It's literally a cash grab from a multi-million dollar north American company. I will admit I don't care for the cover you did, but it's mostly because I don't see the point of Disney anymore. And one last thing, again about the tiktok thing. I feel like part of what soured the interaction was the type of content you chose to share. Promotional snippets rarely gather the kind of interaction you'd get here on patreon as they seem cold and out of touch with the platform and its users. There's a few big music names gathering support there (Florence Welch and Doja Cat come to mind) and it's through mostly short, stream of consciousness, low production value, I'm here in my pj's with no makeup or plan kind of video. I keep thinking that bits of the livestreams you do here would've maybe been met with less aggression.

EmVT

Hi Amanda, holy fuck some people just wanna hate the fuck out of you, don't they? I think you're smart to stay off social media for your mental health right now. Old white lady here, by the way. TikTok sounds fucking horrible so far, though I admire your efforts to try something new, and I know you will eventually learn the ropes. It sounds like there's a lot of mob mentality over there. What exactly do they fucking want? That's what's not fucking clear to me. I think you may have to address various things in various ways over time. I would start with talking to Latinx about the Surface Pressure cover--convene a panel on video, and then creatively post some of it to TikTok. What's the ask? That you apologize for making the cover? And promise to never do it again? I genuinely would like to learn more about this. I'm less enthusiastic about the idea of you making a long FAQ on 'all the things people hate about AFP'. Because for some of the people hating on you, it will never be enough anyway. They'll just laugh at you for doing it. So fuck those specific people who are nothing but bullies looking for an easy target and picking on the theater kid. I do think that after a Latinx panel on appropriation vis a vis Surface Pressure, it would be good to address Guitar Hero and NWA in a similar manner. Invite BIPOC to talk about how this hurts, how white privilege is invisible to white people so that without the type of direct action activism you have been experiencing, nothing will change. Obviously I'm guessing at the issues here. But usually there is an ask from the community. Find out what the ask is. An apology? What would make it better? And if there's nothing you can do, then--I guess there's nothing you can do. I love you and am glad you are doing okay under the circumstances. I'm also going to answer your specific questions point for point in a separate reply. ❤️ Ed. note: edited this post halfway down because I pressed enter by accident.

Kat Saunier

When the women’s March happened after T***p’s election, I knitted 17 pussy hats. I read about wearing pink hats to the march, because pink is a femme color, and it would make a statement to be matchy. HOWEVER pussy hats, after the fact, became symbolic of Radical YT Feminism, and Trans Exclusionary Feminism. I made pussy CAT hats, a play on words, I did not make vulva hats in the color of my own vulva to subjugate people who have other colored vulvas or women who don’t have a vulva. I can not unknit these hats, I can not unwear the hat to the women’s march. I have explained that as a gender-fluid person I don’t often identify with my vulva, and would not wear a vulva hat, but my name is Kat and I very often wear cat ears. It was pink for girls, not the color of my skin. It makes me sad. My good intentions and my creativity were poorly received, and I got lumped into something suuuper shitty that I didn’t intend. You did a cover of Let It Go, it stands to reason it would be same same with Encanto, but some things end up being other things, they’re extra important to some people and all you can do is be graceful and you’re doing that. You didn’t sing an ancient Colombian song, it is a cartoon, why would you think it’s has anything to do with appropriation? The damn thing was written by Lin Manuel-Miranda who went to Wesleyan University, just like you did. You’re doing your best. You’re not an asshole.

Francine Hibiscus

Hi, Anna, I am curious as to why you think it's sorta important to placate the tiktok mob? Obvs I gave you my opinion with how I worded that :) I think it's important to be understood, but when your audience (and here I use the term to mean "People who consume media") is not interested in understanding, when they are only interested in REACTING, and moving on to the next target, IS it important to spend energy talking to them? Or is it making yourself a bigger target?

Andrew Richard Rumbles

We all forget that previous generations fought for rights and progress too and that we have so much more public awareness these days. I see you Amanda as a person who cares for all humans as people and would help and love anyone you encounter. Be strong. Is it your job to explain all the context? Have not

Kya

My 18 year old loves Amanda so much and used to try to defend her as well, but has given up because as you say, it is overwhelming. It’s like fighting against the tides.

Charlotte Grubbs

Hey Amanda. I'm White and not on TikTok, so I don't feel I can comment on that kerfuffle (I love how that's become a common term across the internet). I will say as a trans fan of yours that I have NEVER understood where the "Amanda is transphobic" rhetoric comes from, and I've been in this community for ten years. I've never felt anything but love and support from you. It's deeply weird to me how this gets repeated as gospel. One criticism I will make – and I say this with love – is that while you are great at explaining your mistakes, you’re not always great about apologizing for them. You tend to qualify your apologies with a lot of “but I didn’t know,” or “but no one told me.” And I really, sincerely get it – when we’ve heard we’ve accidentally hurt people, we want them to know that it wasn’t on purpose. But it can come off as excusing or minimizing the damage we’ve done. You’re so great at admitting when art you created didn’t work, or elicited the wrong response, but what if you just said “I’m sorry, I was wrong” without giving a whole background on why you made the choices you did? I super get why you want to set the record straight on some of this stuff, but unless it comes in the form of a genuine apology instead of a list of grievances, I don’t see that it will help you any. Again, said with love.

Monica Rocha

Wait. Time out. Your cover is being criticized as appropriating a Colombian/Latinx/POC perspective? Okay... No. I get that I'm a sample size of one, but I'm a Latina, Colombian, adult woman with sisters and other women relatives and friends who has watched Encanto in English and Spanish (weird subs that don't match the spoken, but anyway) and has checked out what Spanish-language media has said about the movie because I had my own opinions (like it not really representing Colombia other than in name and it being more of a generic anything-"Latinx"-because-everything-else-is-too-complicated film), so maybe I'm allowed to have an opinion. There is nothing specific about that song that says it can't be sung by someone who is from a different culture. In fact, it has. Most of Disney songs have been translated and sung in various languages. Disney+ is actually fun for that if you're learning different languages (I have a blast watching films in Korean, tbh). I'd argue that the themes of that movie are pretty damn universal. There's always a sibling that carries more, that is thought of as the smartest, the handsomest, the one that's too quiet or too loud, the fixer, the carer, the whatever else. My dad was the Louisa of his sibling set, just as my middle sister is of mine. The songs, like most music should, strikes a chord across groups. Otherwise, what's the point? We want to see ourselves in those movies (even if Disney has absolutely traditionally been oh-so-white like others have stated). But why the dig? LLM wrote the music for Moana, sang parts himself. But suddenly Encanto is the final straw? I watched the original actress as she recorded the song and was amused by the way people attacked your emotion on TikTok when she was just as emotional. Commentary on social media never makes sense (and I completely see the irony in spending so much time on this, a comment that also probably comes off as nonsensical, ugh). Anyway. No. This wasn't one of those pieces that should not be covered. This isn't specific to certain humans only. Folks most definitely need to stand up and there's plenty to take on, but this song? It isn't it. Sigh.

Raeesah Noor Mahomed

AAHHAHAHAHAHHA hello! Yes! I am here! Before anything, you know how much I truly love you and how much you changed my life. BUT I will be brutally honest here. Honestly? As a marginalised person, a queer person of colour from the Global South, it pained me to see the criticisms my generation was giving you because, though very hateful and some a bit unfair, a lot were genuinely valid criticisms. And when you didn't address it I was so so scared that you wouldn't. I'm so glad you spoke about it now. Someone sent me a dm asking if *I* am racist because I love you. I haven't actually responded to it yet. But the response in my head is: growing up in a heavily racialised society I think racism is ingrained in so many of us, I cannot claim to not be racist. That would be erasing the harm and micro aggressions I could still potentially perpetuate. Its not enough to just claim to "not be racist". You have to be actively anti-racist. You've had quite a long career and, as is inevitable, you've fucked up. And it's okay. BUT you're a white American woman with a largely "older" white fanbase. I definitely do need you to take the whiteness of people telling you "it's okay" into account. Because they're not part of the communities hurt. You need to accept and realise that by having an album with a song where you say the n-word, you benefitted from something that hurts BIPOC. And you can't go back in time and change it and unhurt. But you can try to "fix" it. I was thinking a lot about this lately. And, while I don't think that all these younguns who hate you are going to be impressed by anything you do, I think you can kind of try to make up for the mistakes you've made. Maybe, and this is just a suggestion, by giving back to the communities you've hurt. I think to acknowledge that you've benefitted from hurt you've perpetuated, you need to kind of "give back"? I had an idea: i think you should use your platform to spotlight artists of colour. Do something where its ONLY artists of colour, maybe doing things about racism and oppression they've experienced, Thing it and donate the proceeds to a Black organisation. I know there are many. Its not going to solve things. But it's at least a way to be like "hey, I know what I've done and I know why it's harmful and I know I can't undo it but here, I am not just apologising but I'm trying to give back to the communities I've hurt because I acknowledge that just words can be empty sometimes" This is long so I'll end it here. But you know me and you know what I do and why I think these things. But you also know how much I love and look up to you and see you as a "mom". You've helped me so much. Also: as others have said, the song is a DISNEY song, from a corporation. I'm not Latinx so I don't know how much my opinion counts. But I do think that it's okay to have covered it. And I really do love your interpretation of the song and the rawness of it. I feel it so heavily.

Dave R

Well written and thoughtful. As an introvert, I attempt to touch the world mainly through the internet and traveling with a few close friends-or by myself. When I come across toxic people, online or in person, I attempt to understand the root cause for the toxic behavior-just like you are. It can hurt when its' directed towards us, based on a comment or post that was made, especially if the accuser doesn't have all the information or facts. But in the long run, with the facts provided and the bashing continues, it is futile to defend, especially when it starts to cause mental damage to oneself. I visualize verbal bashing like a physical punch to the brain-damaging it, and that damage can take much more time to heal than say a broken arm (especially if one is sensitive or an empath). I think hell is really our negative actions against one another, verbal and nonverbal. With that written, I wish you strength and positive energy. By the way, I believe that you share the same birthday as my twin and me, 4-30-1976. Peace and love your way via your fans and friends.

AnnaLatchman

Hi! I agree that it is potentially a waste of energy and that can make you a bigger target. But I also feel they have valid concerns even if they are being downright relentless and abusive. I would like to see everything addressed once and for all. So it doesn't just have to be about placating the mob but also giving confidence to the fans or those on the fence that all these claims can be debunked or accounted for. I hope that makes sense? Maybe they don't want to give Amanda a chance but she deserves it if she wants it

Erin C

You said so much I wanted to say, and better, so I’m just going to highlight it, if that’s ok. Essentially: People won’t leave TikTok to find answers to their questions. And then Anna’s entire next paragraph of structuring how to answer the TikTok-ing kerfuffle is dead-on, from the clear thumbnail to the pinned video, from a series of short video answers to a link to the essay on “Everything you need to know for the TikTok generation and everyone else.” But Amanda, also as Anna said, only when you’re ready. And only when it’s about being true to yourself and not about changing people’s minds. From what I’ve seen of you, it’s important for people to access the truth. This is how the TikTok generation would be able to do that. But Amanda, I’ve also seen that so much of the vitriol is over stuff you’ve already explained. Even people here are asking about things you’ve already explained. You’re one of the most open and loving people I’ve experienced in the world. The mindful way you approach life has helped me a lot. Listen to folks like Anna here. We love you.

Monica Rocha

Also. Why are all the rock or punk covers by guys not getting the same heat?? Grrr... Okay. Shutting up now. -_-

Kirsten Garlick

Hi Amanda, I'm a fairly recent addition really to the Patreon, and it was your podcasts which brought me here. I'm totally in the <40 age category! But I am not on tiktok, although I did go and have a look the other day when some things were raised on the patreon fb group. I was concerned by some comments re racism, and to be honest, was surprised as in my time being a supporter I’ve not felt/seen any racism (or transphobia) from you. And would say you are quite the opposite. But, reading some of the stuff on tiktok did raise old examples that I was unaware of, I did go for a bit of google search to see what the story was – I do actually think a “Amanda Palmer clarifies all her kerfuffles..” would be good as I wasn’t able to find much to cover the broad lot of comments. I also think it is fine that you have brought this conversation here, as this to me, is pretty clearly part of you reflection and learning and listening process. From your post above I have no doubt that that conversation and/or appropriate response will be available on the “free” internet once you have processed and considered. I’ll also add that I can say that I have also made inappropriate comments in my younger days. I think it’s literally impossible for a white person not to have made racist comments as this is how society (sadly) functions, it is systemic. We have to actively unlearn it; we have all started from a place of racism whether or not we want to admit it. I thankfully have learnt and continue to learn how to better myself in these areas. None of us are perfect, so I don’t want to dislike you for something that happened many years ago and from what I see now it is absolutely not reflected in your current behaviour, while acknowledging that we all have room to improve and grow still, and perhaps the use of this song is one of those areas but I will leave that to those who are better to represent. Sending love x

Bea Becker

Oh, yeah you really summed it up here. It's the constant split between "this artist made things that really helped me and got to something deeply personal within my soul" and "this artist did shit that is really horrendous and despite explaining it to people she knows will accept the apology, has never really gone for an 'i'm sorry and i fucked up, here's why' publically to be seen by the people who are actually hurt" so, yeah. My hope is that that changes. So many people in this comments section are saying really good, smart shit. I don't have anything to add but likes and a lot of love for all of you.

Raven

One more thang. Based on my personal observations, social media is full of young folks walking around like their 💩 don’t stank. Not enough of them have had the experience where they’ve had to apologize for something themselves and if they aren’t creators there will be less opportunity for them to enjoy getting publicly beat with the humble stick after a fuck up. As a creator myself I have seen how much you have tried and how much you seem to make an honest effort and it’s a little discouraging at times because I rarely see other creators held to as high a standard as you.

Kimberly Bradshaw

Agree with Marie re: the echo chamber that Patreon creates. When you ask for feedback from people who already (literally, financially) support you, you’re getting a skewed sample. Hell, in the past I’ve been attacked by your particularly rabid fans for having the audacity to criticize you on social media…I have no advice on how you should walk that tightrope - giving equal time to both the fans and the critics - because I’m not a public figure with multiple platforms. I have no skin in this game. I also have no plans to leave your Patreon, but I do sometimes find myself in the position of adding the “yeah, I know, there’s been some problematic shit” caveat when discussing your work with people. And as mentioned above, your initial reactions to these kerfuffles come across more as self-justification (“my black/latinx/etc. friend didn’t have a problem with it”) than genuine apology. I see you learning, listening, and growing, but there’s always room to do better. Again, said with love.

Hannah Olsen

Maybe you could say that last paragraph about trans rights and people of color somewhere in public and that could be your statement? I’m agog at someone thinking that song, which most oldest daughters can relate to, is somehow appropriation. Then again tiktok is also where people look down on Hamilton now? The thing about cancel culture is one can’t win once they’ve messed up. Even if one does whatever is being demanded to “make amends” it still won’t be enough because one messed up in the first place.

EmVT

replying with answers to the specific questions in the post. Q. What do you think the best way to address this is, right now? A. Start with a live panel of human beings who are Latinx specifically about the Surface Pressure cover, video it, and post parts of it to TikTok. Q. If you've come across this, what would you want to ask me? A. I know you have looked for options to change the Guitar Hero and NWA lyrics. Is the intent to re-master the songs? What do you feel like doing here, what do you feel is appropriate in terms of trying to remove old content? Is it better to leave whatever content is out there intact, or to try and remove it? Curious. Q. What would you want to know, to discuss? To learn about me? A. I'd like to hear you in conversation with BIPOC and Latinx talking about appropriation because you are smart as hell and I would like to learn something from this kerfuffle other than how much some people seem to hate you. Q. If you were me, and you saw that there were a lot of new people coming my way - with no context about who I am, what I've done, and what's already been discussed - how would you navigate this? A. Opening the floor for a town hall is a good idea, just keep doing what you're doing. I've been deep-diving on AFP youtube for almost a whole year, and none of this ever came up before. Q. What I am seeing right now is that there are plenty of places on the internet that have compiled lists of reasons Why You Should Hate Amanda Palmer, but I've never actually compiled a list of central resource that addresses each of the issues. Is it perhaps time to do that? If I did that, would you help me? Is it time to write one big essay called "Amanda Palmer clarifies all her kerfuffles, for the TikTok generation and anyone else who is interested"? A. Fuck the people who are going to hate you no matter what you do, say, explain, or not explain, who simply feel safe beating up on the talented theater kid. I'm not sure it would help to compile a "resource" for this, it feels gross. But I would help you and understand if you decide to. Q. Is it time to just get off the internet for a couple months? A. Possibly, or just make it one-way and don't read the comments (maybe Aura could occasionally give you updates). [Ed. minor paren update] That's all from this old white lady! It's raining here--a soft spring rain, thankfully 🙏

Suzanne

Much love to you Amanda. My wedding plans are progressing well, just over three weeks to go! April 23 is the big day! The DJ (who happens to be a dear friend of mine and a Dresden Dolls fan) is beyond excited about playing Enjoy the Silence for our first dance. It will be live streamed and recorded. Https://loveca.st/hookermastawwedding I do hope Your April is less insane than March has been. Keep taking care of yourself. xxx -suzanne

Heather at Highway Mind

Me: 48, on TT @TuesdayWithSunrise, with you since kickstarter, patron since early days, head on your lap at Omega in the before times. My son: 13, not on TT but absolutely SJW. We watched the voice recording of surface pressure live and loved it. We just talked for an hour about what has happened for you on TT with a few major points - (1) I have navigated discomfort with your actions at the time, and having come to peace when I needed to I do not bring them out to reexamine as the world evolves - my son (having loved and left Potterdom because of JKR's actions) suggests that the body of work through time is always hostage to the actions of the creator and there is a point (different for every fan) where the balance tips away from being able to support someone. (2) Your TT presence so far may not give the impression that you intended because for all of the ways you want to build community - you haven't been able to on TT - maybe because of the energy it takes to start a new community or maybe because your focuses in NZ just haven't allowed for that kind of expenditure. Either way - you are on TT with a video laying (rightful) claim to a trend sound, covering a song that is obviously uncomfortable, covering a song that caught a lot of slack, in a duet, and then absolutely glowing and talking about love while everyone in the comments is filled with rage and red faced. It feels (and I adore you) like baiting. I don't know if there is a way for you to broaden your community on TT but the way that community segments there is different than on other social media. I think it stands out that my FYP started sending me Florance + The Machine after you blew up over there - and she is delivering a much different experience right now. Finally, and in some ways similar to what my son was talking about last night. People I have been watching for the whole pandemic as I learned about neurodivergence, queerness, blackness, and a host of other things from the people who live it day to day have REALLY strong opinions about you which I would not have known except for this week ... and that is a strange thing to balance because I have learned so much from them and have a similar parasocial affection for them as I do for you ... and their interpretations of your past actions hurt them. I trust and believe you will sort it out, and I offer that since the audience on TT is younger than your career, it might just not be a welcoming habitat for you. Sleep well.

Amanda Catton-Johnson

I am so sorry to hear about the tik tok backlash, Amanda. I really don't know what to say. I know you know, so, know I have no idea other than I'm sorry. And at present, I don't feel like saying much else. Much love to you, Neil, and young Ash. ❤

Francine Hibiscus

Thanks, Anna, your points do make sense! I just think it's swimming against the tide. Can you win when you are marked as tainted?

Catherine Miley

Oh boy. Well, I’m 52 but go to tik tok daily. I mainly watch animal videos, babies, funny, etc stuff. And rarely read comments. I did read yours and it hurt my heart for you. The thing is, they wanted to blame, and accuse, but not listen and understand. You were right to back away, you can only take so much before you need to protect yourself. Was I that stubborn and so sure I was right at 14, 15, 16? Well, yes. I probably was. I hope they grow and learn and evolve. I’m sure you know, but I’ll say it again. We love you, I love you. I’ve been with you many years, and you are always trying to learn, and understand. We see it, and love you for it. Please take care. ❤️

Emma Rose Stecheson

"the whiteness of people telling you it's okay" is an excellent point, and one I as a white person probably wouldn't have thought of on my own. Also I feel like it's fine for Amanda to ask Patrons for their opinion but it should be taken with a grain of salt. Kinda like, "I asked my closest friends and they said it's fine." Everyone here is probably biased in Amanda's favor and therefore not impartial.

Kirsten Petersen

I don't know if this is helpful but here goes: Eminem has sung awful stuff about homosexuality. When asked in interviews if he is homophobic, he just straight up said "no, that's how I talk" and that was the end of it. No apology. No real explanation. He's an amazing artist, but I'm struck by how people rip into Amanda for the slightest possible mistake but spare Eminem. I think it's because Amanda shows the hurt the accusation causes. She defends herself. Eminem just says - with his actions and words - that he doesn't give a shit what people think of him because he's raking in the millions. Which by the by, Amanda is not. It's partly a gender thing. But more... I think it's that Amanda is cultivating an image of a person who really truly cares, and that is always going to be more dangerous. People are cynical, and expect celebrities to be phony. The slightest misstep is seen as proof that Amanda is full of shit, and is secretly as horrible as they think everyone is. Anyway, this is what I wonder every time a woman is eviscerated online: do these critics hold the same torch for Eminem? If not, why not? The song was not appropriation. That is horse shit. If people were hurt by it, they need to look at themselves. They are not justified in getting online and starting a shit storm. They just enjoy doing it. That is really all it is. I think it would be better for Amanda to NOT apologize. She did something with sincere intent. People just don't want to believe it. Every attempt on her part to defend herself will be seen as further evidence that she's fake, or a narcissist or "making it all about her" or whatever. There is no winning this. Amanda: Just make art, and if people accuse you of being or intending something you did not, say "nope, that's not true" and move on. EDIT to say: Rose provided some TikTok context that helps me understand. My previous comment here was too reductive; I understand that the negative comments can also be intended sincerely. It strikes me that the internet is a patchwork of in-groups of people each trying to create connection, and sometimes a new-comer from another in-group who doesn't share that context can feel like an invasion. The question is how to avoid that.

Tom Holmes

Hi Amanda. Holy fuck. I pushed paused on my extremely middle class, privileged life for an hour to look into this and post my two cents. All I learned is how much the internet scares the shit out of me and how lucky I am to be an introvert who doesn't depend too deeply on the appreciation of others. How you manage to survive with that degree of feedback on your artistic endeavors is simply unimaginable to me. Please, please, please don't ever feel like you need anyone's permission to walk away and stick your head in the sand. I fucking love the sand. It's so much easier for people to write two scathing sentences based on two minutes of footage than it is for them to do even 5 minutes of research into who you really are and decide for themselves what you actually intended by expressing yourself. If you want to take a break from social media, do it. I sincerely believe that the very real and tangible joy you have brought to people through your music will forever outweigh any hurt that has been endured as a byproduct. What more could anyone hope to achieve? Keep being your beautiful self.

Rose Cooper

So much to say! I wish I could call you & have a real talk. Hoping you’re aware of me enough that I don’t have to preface any statement with a disclaimer “you know I love you, but…” I’ve been a patron since the beginning. I’ve seen an evolution. Things I have found inspiring & genuinely sustaining. But in recent times - as I become more aware - I’m noticing some tone-deafness that surprises me. By definition your patreon can ONLY be echo chamber. If we are the only people you are asking - about doing COVERS. Then that’s a problem in and of itself. Regardless of appropriation (which I’ll address) the song is new. The film is at the crest of its popularity. It just won an oscar. Whom are the leading demographic of that film’s fanbase? Kids. Tweens. Tiktok has been awash with “little girls lip synching to The very first cartoon characters that LOOK LIKE THEM”. Before the ink has had time to dry on their ticket stubs, you made this - very AFP - cover? I missed that crowd cast, so I didn’t weigh in. But I know I was thinking - THIS CHILDREN’ S FILM IS STILL PLAYING. It’s too early to have a take on the songs. It’s not like WAP cover versions. An adult song being reimagined by adults. Now - appropriation. Don’t only listen to your latinx / BIPOC fan base. I’ve always considered myself an antiracist, but the stuff I am learning about white neoliberal feminism has opened me up so much. I learned most of it from tiktok creators who post to Instagram. I am a journalist & performer - I don’t have a fraction of your following. I have two patrons, both from your patreon. But When I finally joined tiktok last May, I posted minimally- using it to create content for Instagram… And OMG what a learning curve! So much to say about that. A much bigger kerfuffle happened between two creators during March. Its very relevant. Also - I hadn’t seen/heard the“sex change” song - is absolutely understandable that ppl would consider it transphobic regardless of whether you wrote it that way or not. Because my advice is to make a statement on this - and then give your platform to other creators for a while - if you do, indeed want positive engagement there. If you are just using it as an afterthought. Then, don’t use it at all. It’s a dumpster full of tinder and petrol awaiting any crack of lightning. I’m happy to discuss this further at length. Dissecting this is my wheelhouse . Tiktok has “sides”. My algorithm is now giving me mostly BIPOC & LGBTQ creators because that’s whom I follow. My content is intersectional but I lean into anti ageism content because I’m 60. To begin with, as an American. Ask yourself why Covering NWA never struck you as a bad Idea, and why that didn’t make you ultra cautious about cover songs. If as white people, we are not asking ourselves these questions constantly, then we can’t call ourselves true intersectional feminists. White feminists centre themselves. And rightly or wrongly, you now represent typical genX, “YT feminism” on tiktok I really want to help turn that around Love rose

Brittany B.

This whole "appropriation" thing is so stupid. I'm sorry for not having a nuisanced opinion about this, and trust me, years ago I used to be the "woke-est" lefty on the block. But my husband (who is Trinidadian, btw) has convinced me over time that complaining about "cultural appropriation" is anti art. ALL art is remixed. Remixing and borrowing and adopting is literally how art grows. I'm so flipping tired of this "ugh white ppl should never engage with anything from another culture how dare they" type of ignorant attitude. It's the flip side of the same coin as white people who are terrified of "non-white cultures" (whatever the fuck that means.... It's not like my whiteness is the same as my culture. It's NOT.) You know what I want to see? I want to see more back and forth in all and every directions. This ultra-PC criticism of anyone who dares to make any kind of art is just stifling EVERYONE. I'm just done. Amanda was NOT out of her lane in covering a fucking Disney song (you wanna talk about racists, btw, let's talk about Disney's wonderful history with that shit). People need to calm the fuck down about this shit.

Nicholas

Love you back. I don't know what to say about the TIK TOK thing - I tried it a few times but decided it was nay for me. Maybe at 58 I'm over the age limit. Sorry to hear you getting such abuse, I honestly think it says more about the 'ternet in general than anything about you personally, AFP. You are a real person doing hard things and it's easy for randoms to just see a name. But what the hell do I know? Oh, I like POLLS though. Bring it on. Love as always from the UK. Stay safe. x

Douglas Neudeck

I was following you in Twitter (under username Doogamus) until I was blocked for reasons unknown. I saw the comments, and didn't see much reaction, but then again that's Twitter. Lots going out, not much proper discourse. Having been a fan since the DD days, I knew and trusted that something Happened, and you dealt with it. I never saw the apology post however, so my trust dipped to maybe a 95%. I'm white, I've made mistakes, and can't fully trust myself not to make (other, new, hopefully different) mistakes. I find it's awkward defending you sometimes, being also white, because then it just feels like that's the only reason. Like of course he would support her, he doesn't listen either. Whew. So maybe it is time to address Amanda's Kerfuffles in a centralized way, and then versions for TikTok, Twitter, FB, and others could be tailored from it. I know I felt better from reading from the link, finally, with some context, the apology. I don't think Tiktokers will read all of that, so maybe something more digestible. All that is how I feel as a fan, but takes a back seat to how POC, Trans, and disabled folks feel about it.

Kate Opanowycz

Dear Amanda, whoa what a rollercoaster you've had to endure yet again for you're freedom of expression. Art will always do it's job; to probe in the darkness, to admire the beauty found within the work, to be able to to look outside of one's self and to left pondering how is this piece of music or moulded clay have an effect on me. people like the hum drum of life and find creativity to challenging. I've love your work for many years and appreciate the rawness in lyrics...., that's life it's not meant to be a fairytale in a book. You always keep true to your right for freedom of expression, I think surface pressure was amazing especially with the NZ string group and jherik collaborating it all with you. You keep it real you always have, you are one of the most honest person who just happens to slay a piano 🌹🌹 I'm happy that your fine . I'm having a hip replacement in a month because of DV in the past and I'm glad the old one will be used for bone marrow and bone bank, from hell to helping is the way I see it. People are very angry at the moment and are looking for a scapegoat instead of addressing the problem head on. That's human nature, we're all scared however you don't need misplaced grief. Sending you a hug from be Brisbane, Australia 🤗🤗🤗💗💗💗💗💗🍰🍰🍰🍰🌹🌹🌹🌹

Sara Nelson

I am the same age as you are and I do have a TicToc. I have had to also step away from the conversation over there because I couldn't watch people saying such awful things. I have a weird perspective as a hidden minority (I look white but as a Jew many don't consider me white or even human). I've been marinating a lot on racism and white entitlement lately. I was one of the many thrilled for you to do surface pressure. So am I also guilty of missing cultural appropriation? I don't know. Maybe I owe you an apology because I didn't even think about a white woman doing that song as an issue. I just saw the song through the lense of a female and a mom and a full-time healthcare practitioner in a pandemic working in the frontliner. I related to the song, and only saw it through my lense. But isn't that part of what art is? Art is not only the work that we put out there but it's also how people perceive it. While I may do a piece and have an intention that the viewer will take one thing from it another person may see my piece and take something entirely different from it. So then is it bad when a person takes something racist from a art piece that was not meant to have that intention? I don't know. The one thing I can say is that we all grow and learn and I'm thankful that while right now I can't look at your TikTok and watch the abuse maybe both of us will learn new things in time from this experience and grow to be better more loving humans. Who knows. Love ya Amanda 💜💚. I'm proud to be here. I'm proud of your work. Thank you for all you do.

Emma Rose Stecheson

This isn't the first time Amanda has done that, either. When the Guitar Hero scandal blew up she talked to a black trans woman and then posted about it, which came off as "My black trans friend says it's ok" which imo was pretty tone deaf.

Michele Monseau

Hi Amanda! I'm also a musician and a visual artist. I'm really excited to have one of my poems included in Poems for the Ride (I'm under my performing alias Von Economo). I'm on Tik Tok, but I just make work there, and transfer the vids to Insta. I'm set to private because I don't want to deal with the shitshow that frequently goes on, same with Twitter. I can only say that I've been feeling more and more that the far right and the far left have been immensely stifling. It's such a complicated thing. We want to support all those who have been stomped on throughout history and who are finally being heard. I'm talking about just about everyone except straight white men. HOWEVER, things have gotten cruel. I just think all those people who are stomping on you on TT aren't actually interested in having a discussion, therefore it may be time to jettison that from your life. Do you really need it? I've been seeking out and reading a lot about how to deal with the cacophany, illness, and off-the-rails-ness of the 21st C. I read tons of different viewpoints and am finding that people, esp of our generation are quite pissed off about all this censorship of art, speech, etc. I mean, good people do not set out to hurt others. People do however make mistakes and are willing to learn from them. Artists make art. One should not apologize for doing a cover of a song. The commenter above who talked about art being an amalgam of our influences is on the mark--Nothing is made in a vacuum, and covering a song with a different interpretation is not appropriation. It seems to me that young kids do not understand any of this, at least the ones commenting on your cover. It's all very confusing and disheartening. One writer that I've found particularly helpful in parsing out this subject is Andrew Sullivan. Here's an essay he wrote that I found interesting and may be helpful to you: https://andrewsullivan.substack.com/p/the-roots-of-wokeness?s=r

Jenna Bruner

"he who angers me owns me" Marcus Aurelius knew this hundreds of years ago... Guess we don't really progress THAT much eh? Be your authentic self.

Audrey Vosseler

I don’t think anyone criticizing you on TikTok is going to read a long explanatory blog, nor read any blogs from the past that anyone might link to. I think accusations of appropriation are severely misplaced for a number of reasons, many of which other commenters have thoughtfully explained. I wonder what Lin-Manuel Miranda would think of your cover. I obviously can’t speak for him, but my guess is that he would at the very least give his blessing to cover it. Listen to people with genuine concerns and address them as you see fit. Ignore hateful trolls. As you stated clearly, you know how to do that. Don’t be afraid to ignore them just because their accusations are so egregious. Transphobic is laughable. That’s my take on this, for what it’s worth. I rarely comment but it seemed worth saying. I love you for who you are, and for your achingly relatable musical expressions. I would never be afraid to say I’m a fan. I wear your merch. I love your whole artist self, and all of your art, but I’ve always been here for the music.

Kimberly Bradshaw

Re: Ludomir, same here, I always interpreted “Latinx” as a way to be inclusive to everyone on the gender spectrum. Some of my nonbinary friends use the prefix “Mx.” in situations where the cisgender option would be “Mr.” or “Ms.” That said, I also see Brevemike’s point…I’m thinking in particular of unisex bathroom signs that show a centaur, mermaid, or some other fantastical creature above the message “Whatever, Just Wash Your Hands.” No one wants to be seen as a “whatever.” …it’s worth noting that I’m just a white cis pansexual in Memphis, TN who doesn’t know the nuances of the language and really appreciates conversations like these.

Téa Smith

Hey, I just want to give you my love and support after yet another whirlwind. I research this "phenomenon", and even though I am sure you already know this... as hard as it is, a large portion of it is troll farms who are paid to bully you. And those who are not troll farms have various things going on that is rarely about you. Again, I am sure you know this, but having lost high profile friends to suicide over the years from this Persona vs Person conflict... I always go out of my way to reach out and just send support, love and tell you that it usually isn't anything you've done. You become a target, they go through your history, then report you or mob... it's just someone's job. Not just Russian troll farms, but it is so much more pervasive than people realise. I can only imagine what a complete dumpster fire your mentions are. Take valid and good faith feedback where you can find it, assume most of it is artificial and is targeted at the "blue check", not Amanda... and focus on the work and consider it a cost of doing business. You bring a lot of happiness to people. Focus on that. I know you know all of this, but it helps to see validation and support. I've been tracking this stuff for 7 years now... it's not you or anything you've done. I promise. It's because you have an opinion and influence, and these proxy influencer campaigns are sinister AF. x

Kris Davis

Hi. /hug I've been poking around that damn clock app for a while now. I'm not a creator on there though, because /gestures vaguely at everything I'm not built for that kind of interaction. I saw what happened to the comment thread on your clip of your cover (which I absolutely adore and scream my heart out to when I'm irritated with the drip) The temperature was not survivable for logic or discussion. Reasonable was being met with rash anger- it was waisted energy to try and combat in the thread. As far as appropriation. I don't know. Every time I think I understand, I realize I don't. My gut instinct is - its disney- wouldn't the entire thing be appropriation? But I don't know, and as a white lady, I say it's the community that would be slighted you need to ask. This new gen is unique in a lot of ways, mostly good in the human rights department, from what I see so far anyway. However, they have one thing in common with every gen before them. They think everything is new and freshly discovered by them and they think they know everything worth knowing. The arrogance that comes with the age of the young. I forgot what a pain in the ass I was to talk to sometimes. Where the interwebs can be a glorious place, I think people often forget they are talking to other people with feelings and inner monologs and children and tooth aches and parking fiascos. The more chaos in the world the meaner people seem to become behind a keyboard. (But you know all this) A sneech is a sneech. We all feel and I hate that we as species so often forget that in the modern world. So. No advice really, but I hope you feel a little validated and maybe a little less hurt by all the frustration targeted at you. I hope it settles down to reasonable volume so you can have your discussion. Love and Health to you and your's

April S Rolfe

Amanda. I've been a supporter, a Patron, a fan, a follower, a tweeter... just about all you can be of you, AFP, for what seems an eternity... Occasionally you press like or comment on my comments to you... but mostly my comments, ideas, questions & notions directed to you are lost in the sea of other voices even when I'm pretty sure they're awesome or clever & my heart needs your attention. And that's OK, it's cool. Sometimes more important, prestigious, clever, famous or closer-to-you voices take over & sometimes I'm even lost among the haters defending you. If I could sit with you & talk I'd ask you plainly why you seem epically hell bent on using platforms like tiktok that do absolutely nothing to help your career, message, aesthetic or voice. At this point, is there a point in gaining an audience who is only here to wait for a train wreck? Or who aren't ever going to be willing to read your biopic on "all my kerfuffles & who I am?" Also... you have shared so much of your life & personal experiences. I think people start to feel that you owe them more. Everyone is ALWAYS asking "where is Neil", "are they still married" and never once do you cross that obvious line you've drawn into that part of your life. But my point is. If you're going to continue to want new followers - you aren't going to get them on tiktok giving them something they don't want. They don't want re-runs of songs they already love. They don't want meaningful conversation & you aren't going to get that until you get them here in the Patreon & they understand the awesome home we've all created here. Post the stuff Patrons ask for, where your Patrons live. Post the stuff the TikTok gens want on TikTok. Funny videos of you making faces or mistakes at concerts. Bloopers. Or stay off TikTok altogether.... A friend asked me to explain Voicemail to Jill to her the other day. So I did, as best I could with info from your mouth & info from my heart. She was changed. She understood it wasn't being flippant about having abortions. It wasn't saying let's all have abortions & throw parties. It had to be given context... perhaps it's time to ensure there is context with your work. Perhaps that beautiful random AFP isn't quite what the world needs at the moment.... Either way, I'm here to stay & I'm happy. You challenge my mind & heart constantly & I love that. Do you. But do it with a synopsis... Xxx

KeathKeeth

Please remember those people aren't fans and haven't taken time to actually see what you're doing/done and you shouldn't try to find ways to change their minds. You have posts with past apologies, they can find those easy. I am really confused as to why this song cover is appropriation. If they just don't like it, thats ok. I also stay off most social media because it can be toxic like this. I can't imagine what it's like for anyone famous. I hope you get some peace and calm soon

Emily

With respect, haven't you just disproved yourself, that this can only be an eco chamber? Granted it's going to sway one way, but given the explanation that tiktok is a cesspool of insults and shit at the moment (paraphrased), isn't that understandable?

Lynn Parlett

Imma step in here. Yes she said she had spoken to a black trans person she met at an event, briefly, and posted the words that person said to her. She was very clear it was one. brief. conversation and should not be taken as permission. AFP was simply trying to demonstrate that she was BEGINNING her soul searching around the song and it was only one opinion. Everyone just ignored what she actually said, the entirety of the post, and ran with the AFP is tone deaf and here's proof, narrative. can't win

Rose Cooper

I see what you are saying but I meant - Echo from the POV of Amanda as the creator getting feedback from adoring fans. Tiktok is many things. As I said in my opening - so many things to say. I barely scratched the surface. Thanks for the reply. X

Fenstar

I'm not on tik tok so I won't weigh into that one. I adored your version of Surface Pressure. What did make me cry was this one simple sentence "Also, I'm getting my first pair of prescription glasses, at age 45. I'm officially old and proud of it." I'm turning 47 in two weeks and I alternatively feel the weight of societies label of me as being old, but also I am so fucking proud to be here, against a lot of odds. I am trying to lean into my wisdom and my witchiness and inner crone. Some days it's easier than others. I feel like your little webcasts and things have been such brightness in my darkness. I am self isolated due to being immunocompromised and not being able to tolerate vaccines. So for me my world is still within my 4 walls 98% of the time. These little online events are my link to the world. My existence is online, I can't afford to see most people face to face, let alone go to gigs and pubs and cafes. So I appreciate the heck out of being able to participate in a tiny way. Thank you thank you thank you.

Lynn Parlett

How many times does anyone need to apologise and explain, especially when it's years after the thing, the thing has been , properly discussed, fixed and retired?

Rose Cooper

2/2 on the topic of cultural appropriation/appreciation - this is what I have learned. Being white means never questioning where we belong. And being surprised when e are told that we don’t belong. Variations on the difference between appropriation & appreciation abound. One only has to look at the phenomenon of “blackfishing” (see also Kardashians, Rita Ora, et al) These people create a fanbase - that exceeds their black counterparts - while stealing ideas. These conversations are not for white people to have. These conversations are for us to STFU and listen. In the case of Encanto - I feel something that is sacred to children right now, and especially validating for young BIPOC children, should not have white fingers anywhere near it. Not because of anything other than what that movie represents to BIPOC children. Regardless of its Disneyness - it was not made for us. Our right to feel like we own it as “artists” is not valid.

Kristin Ryan

Hi. I love you. I'm sorry everything is so hard. I am here for you, you know where to find me.

Kaisi Haarstad

I’m sorry to hear you are facing such backlash on this! I rarely read comments on things unless an actual post or content is confusing and I’m looking for something to understand what is happening. I’m one of your well under 40 patrons (I’m also one of your under 30 patrons) and do occasionally watch tictok. I greatly enjoyed the stitch you mentioned, but back to Encanto, I’ve also seen a few other artists covering this in different ways, and what feels like a million frequently white folks making significant content around Encanto (not just one cover, but posting weeks and weeks worth of active content). I wonder if these other individuals are receiving the same backlash

Lynn Parlett

Cis het old white woman here. Which means in many circles my opinion is worthless. I'm too old, too white, too woman, too middle class to have an opinion on anything. I know nothing about the struggle of the downtrodden. I am so tired of these assumptions, that I know nothing of anything... and should have no opinion on anything but old cis het white women things. How boring and how wrong. Women of my generation fought against harassment and patriarchal laws so young women of all colours could open a bank account, apply for a loan, own their own business or home. I protested the Vietnam war. We fought to have people of all colours included in our schools and workplaces. We fought against our fathers and brothers and uncles so women could have a voice. It pisses me off that those voices are now used to spread the such hate.

Janine Van Den Akker

Hi Amanda! 1. I love the cover, loved the strings, loved watching it happen. So incredible! Totally love it. 2. You are amazing, inspiring, and so strong for going through a pandemic far from home, hang in there with everything 💕 3. It would be interesting to get some data on how many covers of Surface Pressure have been done, get the details about each individual, and then see how many have experienced the same reaction to their work as you have, and how many have experienced a different reaction. As a white woman I dont feel like I can be very helpful with when it comes to cultural appropriation. I hope that you keep some space from Tik Tok for the moment, gather information and potentially data, and most of all hang in there 💕 This too shall pass. Big hugs from Canada!! Janine

Cate Whitehead

Oh, Amanda! I read your post this morning. I heard my tablet go ping before I got out of bed, and knew it was you. Words fail me right now. Know that I love you, me, your (one of) 67 year old patron and will always be there for you. Wherever you are at the moment, be still and feel your community's love xx

Deeslee

People who don’t understand you are not worth listening to. It’s just noise. I have a friend who is dead set that you are an asshole that doesn’t pay artists and she doesn’t listen to anything to the contrary. She is smart but doesn’t put in the effort to educate herself further than one sensational article from over ten years ago. If even the smart privileged people are dumb as fuck and impossible to educate, I don’t think the brain dead masses will learn. But I do think making a video that once and for all has your face explaining your side would be a useful resource for the 1% of people who care to think further than their nose. Your song was beautiful and you are a nice human being and the world is too stupid to get you. For the handful of people who do get you, you’re awesome. Much love

Dolly

HAH! Yo Amanda! i'm 31! Thank you for making me feel younger. FEELS GOOD! haha... honestly Amanda, i think weirdos like us will always be misunderstood and hated. the younger generation is always going to be the most meanest and most judgmental of them all. i dealt with the WORST of it thru highschool, and you were my mentor and helped me thru it. I think the BEST thing you can do Amanda on TikTok...is ignore the hateful shit, say fuck a heartfelt i love you video, and seriously...make FUNNY or clever videos with the songs of YOURS that tiktok hijacked! I take it back....heartfelt videos are good too, but seriously....while you're killing them with kindness - take your music back! kids are gonna talk shit, sure, but i find some humor in it. Fuck an argument. I know you want to prove to evvvvveryone that you are a good person and not all those things they say you are - but good fuckin' luck. its like screaming a wall. Most of them don't care. I wouldn't waste your breath or time. Make some funny videos! Make cool art and post! Grab the attention of some new younger fans! And don't feed the trolls! Fuck 'em!

Alison Waddy

Well, maybe it still is a little bit tone deaf. Even if she only meant it exactly how you said, as the first step toward personal soul searching (which i genuinely do believe was her intention) we don't live in a vacuum. Invoking someone else's race or gender identity in these conversations is inherently charged with the implication of using them to show that you aren't racist or sexist or transphobic or whatever, because it *has* been used this way so so many times throughout history, and it's hard to separate that.

Suzanne

p.s. Intentionally not commenting on the whole TikTok thing and other random backlash things because I do not have the mental capacity to deal with it and THE WORLD IS STILL ON FUCKING FIRE AND DON'T WE HAVE BETTER THINGS TO WORRY ABOUT??? Ahem. Excuse me. I'm going to go listen to Jherek's new song again. It's super chill and amazaballs. Join his Patreon to hear it. I spend too much time working in hospitals as a support person in a semi-leadership role. I get a WHOLE different view of this mess. People can take their over opinionated crap and shove it. Spend time doing volunteer work somewhere instead of bitching online about someone "because I can" (literally what many people said). Ugh. Anyway. Love to all. I should take my meds and do some deep breathing and go to sleep because holy hell I'm getting married in 23 days.

Kathryn Weber-Boer

I haven't read all of the comments, but this is the first that echoes my own thoughts most closely. I think we could help compile a list of receipts. Maybe, Amanda, start a Patreon post with your list of links (I don't doubt you remember them better than many of us would), and then anyone with additional examples/articles/blogs can add them in the comments. To be clear, on Surface Pressure, I don't think you've got anything to apologize for. But the rest of the shit? You've got your f'ing hard-earned credits. Use them.

Ellie Tudhope

Hey Amanda, I’m not a Latinx or Black, so I won’t delve here into any opinion I may or may not have. What I did want to say, though, is that either way what is super-apparent is that you care and you are listening and addressing whatever issues may have come up. Im not on TikTok, i wasn’t aware of any controversy. But it seems to have spring up so I applaud you for not dismissing it, ignoring it, and actively seeking input in a space where you know people will be considered yet honest. So thanks for being awesome. Remember, it’s a great big ride and nobody is perfect, especially the ones hurling abuse your way xx

Rebecca Potylycki

I will return with my thoughts/feelings & answers just as soon as I can collect the windstorm of ideas in my mind and translate it all into a more thoughtfully, intentionally & cohesively written reply. It is a LOT, Amanda. And as always, I love how you ask for our perspectives as supporters - fellow creators - and fellow human beings. I am feeling legit excited to work through all of those points that you mentioned, I already have some ideas for the deep corners of "the Internet/TikTok vs. AFP"... But for this moment, I wanted to say to you that you are in this community as one of us, and with all of us. I was recently given a piece of jewelry and the accompanying message was so perfect in describing my true value - as "I am enough" and it remains a mantra and a reminder to me still... That I am enough, as I am. "Amanda, You are enough — even when you are hurting, when your bones feel heavy and your heart is aching. It is ok to feel. It is ok to widen your heart, to move to a place of expansion — there is beauty in vulnerability. You are enough — even when others make you feel forever “less.” Worthiness comes from within, so do not build a home for it inside someone else. You are more than their perceptions. You are more than their words. You are enough — even when you make mistakes. Stop punishing yourself for your imperfections, immerse them in compassion and recognize that they are part of who you are — it is only with them, that you are whole. Please remember that you are the only person who defines your value — so be gentle with yourself, be kind to yourself, love yourself. You are brave, capable and strong. You are thoughtful and empathetic. You are deserving. You are worthy. You are enough — so infinitely enough." (This is the accompanying message and I believe it is true and so greatly needed as however it can be reinforced by our own positive communities - encouraging one another... These incredible individuals who struggle to feel as if their accomplishments and milestones are valid or "enough" to feel proud, at peace, deserving of praise or recognizing their own successes. (If anyone wants the link to the website where my necklace came from, I'll gladly share. I just didn't want to post it here in this message...) Amanda Palmer, you are lovely and very loved. I hope to post my other responses soon. Until then... Remember to breathe. I love you and you ARE enough! -Rebecca Potylycki

amandapalmer

oh, larissa. thank you for all of this. i think - perhaps - if there is a silver lining here (and there always is), it's that i get held to a high standard for a reason. maybe figuring out that reason is the work of my life. and perhaps, by extension, since we're all connected here...all of ours. women are always treated differently, in my experience. i would say that in this case, it's no difference, and i wonder if colin meloy had covered "we don't talk about bruno" if there would have been a similar backlash (i am guessing no). anyway: thank you. thank you. x

amandapalmer

aw, thank you janet. that you are there - off "social media" and/but here in the community, means a great deal to me. it's real. it's here. and thank you. a hug from me to you... xx a

amandapalmer

oh my god, pedro. i just sat here and watched this, and i held it together until your mother kissed you, and then i burst into tears. this is one of the most beautiful things i have ever seen. pedro....i love you so much. and your mother. and everybody here. what an astonishing little family we have, we are. this world. my god. the gull - it's us. all of us. from my tearful little bed....and now i can't wait to do another webcast just to cry at you in realtime, pedro. xxxxxxx a

amandapalmer

thank you lucy. i hope we are ALL safe here - this is what here is for. a place we can all feel safe, and loved, even when the waters churn. i love you. xx

Maria Fagerlund

Hi Amanda. I'm so sorry about the shit storm blowing up around you. Again. But glad that you're keeping out of it and prioritising your own sanity. These kids didn't even know you or your art before that cover hit TikTok, but we do and we've got your back. I gather (from his complete absence in your posts in recent weeks, and from a half sentence in this Althing) Ash is not currently with you. I'm a mother myself, I can imagine. You brave strong beautiful lady, hang in there, we love you. Oh and about that song - I hear it as valid the world over, don't all women and mothers feel that pressure and that crushing expectation of having to shoulder more and more? I didn't think it's meant Latinx specific.

amandapalmer

thank you for all of this, angel, you angel. as to this: "Lastly, is there anything we can do for you right now that you didn't already ask for?"....you're doing it. i wonder if you know the extent to which you all make me proud when you make things, like poetry, like songs, like art from your own heart, and share it back with me and the community. to me, this is more powerful than any political conversation about any kerfuffle. the longer i live on this earth, the more important i think it is that we create, create, create in the face of pain, grief, adversity. this is why i love you so much angel. i see you creating, and it brings me joy you will never understand the depths of. xxx

amandapalmer

hi jennifer. it doesn't sting...don't worry. i am absolutely in a new learning curve: not just being on the receiving end of internet hate, but also being an old woman, this is new!! this is the first kerfuffle i've been in where that is an aspect of the hatred, and i am considering it in my heart, as i'm not so far away from 15 that i can't remember how it felt to see women and men in the 40s try to be hip and understand what i felt (THEY COULD NOT). the coolest people backed up and listened. that is what i am trying to do. and yes: off tiktok, the only way for now.

amandapalmer

aw katherine, thank you....the solution always presents itself. thank you for the feedback. i think it is helping, to see many people telling me to not bother trying to tackle this too hard. i have been wondering, in the "expert" dept, if i should just reach out to lin-manuel himself. i know him and i have his email. i mean...go to the source.

Lynn Robinson

So sad that human nature makes us focus on the negatives that are thrown at us. I hate it that people think it’s their right to be so awful to fellow travellers on our planet. Just be kind!! I feel your pain and the injustice of the whole TikTok situation - try not to hang on to it ❤️ You make your art ultimately for you - messages you need to get out there , emotions that need a release , comments on a situation … Touching people with your art is such a gift , almost a byproduct of your life essence. Hang on to the fact your gifts have touched so many people, evoked a huge emotional response , created empathy. The words you have written , music you’ve created have gone from your mind & entered our minds too - and also our hearts. Much love to you & this amazing community you have created, fostered, loved Xxxx

amandapalmer

what only just occurred to me is that, weirdly, if this is the final word on the matter (that amanda palmer covering surface pressure is not okay), that it perhapos sets some sort of precedent for others. like: if adele decides to do a slow-jam cover of the same song next month...i wonder what on earth would happen? this is a fascinating question. sending hugs back to tennessee - land of ash-birth! love to you august xxxx

amandapalmer

i feel this all over the place lately. i worry about the left eating itself and our whole planet. hang on for the ride, everybody, it's getting even weirder. hugs to you claudia xx

amandapalmer

the irony of the content of the song itself...and the story that has followed....i mean, it doesn't get more poetic. thanks marianna xxx

amandapalmer

I WILL MAKE MORE ART!!!!!!!! i have found that it really is the only true antidote to a lot of things....at the end of the day. it's why i cherish this patronage system above ALL. thanks cindy. xx

amandapalmer

i love you both. it is sad to me that the Tide of Amanda has to also effect the people i love. that part really hurts me more. it's like: i can take it, i've learned. but to see other people getting hurt when i can't control it...that just breaks my fucking heart. this world, man. xx

Sam Salter

Under 40s crew, checking in! :P In reply to: "...I ask YOU, my patrons... Does it feel wrong? Does it not sit well? Please talk to me. Clearly some voices are already speaking..." Speaking as-and-for myself (being the only person I'm qualified to speak for), I don't see even the ghost of an issue here. The song is not about any particular culture - it is very clearly about the universal experience of taking too much responsibility (ironic!) and feeling unable to share it, or show it, or turn any of it down. I'm English (from England) - should I consider the original song in the film a cultural appropriation, because it uses the language which originated from my country, despite not being written/sung by someone from England? Should Greece raise an international diplomatic incident of cultural appropriation because Lin-Manuel Miranda wrote Cerberus into his song? Sharing these things between us is how culture works - it's a wonderful and beautiful thing; we're human beings - sharing each other's stories is literally our superpower! Speaking of wonderful and beautiful things - what a stunning, moving, beautiful performance your cover of Surface Pressure is - I absolutely adore it, and so does my Mother, and so does my Daughter, and we have loved sharing it with each other - thank you so much! Sam

amandapalmer

i love you too. thank you. feeling all this understanding from the community - far and wide - is really helping me. this is the place that counts the most. my people. xxx

amandapalmer

thank you both. this is good to read. and always strange, to come back to a new group of people and re-explain and re-explain. but sometimes what's gotta be done just gotta be done. xxx

amandapalmer

this is all really wise, and thank you. and yes: i didn't mean to imply that my patrons were culpable. at the end of the day: it's me, it's my choice, it's my art. that's like saying that the people who applauded will smith's oscar speech were condoning violence. they were just....probably lost in the moment and doing what everybody else was doing. will smith's actions are his and his alone, chris rock's actions are his and his alone....we are all accountable for what we do, no matter whether the crowd is hissing or cheering. i love you, thank you livvy xxx

amandapalmer

thank you anna! this is all really good to read. and seems like a good plan...i mostly have to make sure i have the bandwidth to not only make all of this, but also have time to dialogue and listen and endlessly dig into the issues with people. it takes TIME. i wonder if there's a way of making this ART. i think about contrapoints - who i adore - and those beautiful videos and wonder if something like that might not be the best way.xxx

amandapalmer

well, as i said above, i have his email. i think i'll just reach out. but the dude is probably incredibly....busy :)

amandapalmer

i will, narcala, i will. you too. i am sorry that things were hard. things so often come full circle, like you say. sometimes you just gotta wait and wait. keep the heart open with a lot of softness. hugs....a

amandapalmer

yes. and another reminder that the world is getting more and more compartmentalized and segmented. huge things happen and no people know, and vice versa. and there's something magical about that, but also very dangerous. there is currently a whole section of TikTok dedicated to the war in ukraine...what does this all mean for how we interact with one another? if this is the tone of TikTok, and this is where kids are learning about war, what does it all mean? i have more questions than answers.

amandapalmer

heard and heard. this is the first time anyone has ever discussed the latinx term: thank you for educating me. i had no idea....and as for TikTok, yes, i'm getting that sense. i will not set it and forget it...but i need to carve out time to engage. right now, i'm so deep in the shit of my own personal life that it is NOT the time. hugs...xa

amandapalmer

oh fleassy, i love you. you're such a wonderful writer, and a wonderful heart, with a goddman very smart HEAD. i am so lucky you're there. thank you - for all of this. it's true. and i love you. x

amandapalmer

i was discussing the idea of making a "best of amanda palmer's kerfuffles" video set with aura, and mentioned that maybe I NEED TO MAKE IT FOR ME more than anything else. to clarify, to myself, what i have learned and how i have grown over 20 years of being a human. so even if it blows up in my face....i got what i needed. who knows. thank you daneille. xxx

EmVT

What I hope to understand better is the leap from someone deciding Amanda’s cover is not their cup of tea, to claiming it somehow personally harmed them. Nobody is forcing little girls to sit down and watch a white woman’s version of the song if they don’t like it. I understand that white entitlement is invisible to us white people, but Amanda’s cover doesn’t somehow erase the original version. She’s not saying watch my version instead of the version you love. Art is additive.

Kathryn Weber-Boer

Seriously, becoming an "older woman" is hard, yo. It's forgetting how other people are seeing you, when your own sense of self has just caught up with the "you" you were a decade ago... like, just now? When I'm finally feeling powerful and beautiful and competent? Now is when I get seen as outdated and out-of-touch and uncool? This is the coolest I've ever been! 😆

amandapalmer

marie, i appreciate you saying this so much. and yes: the time will come to step away from the patreon and venture into the real world. i need the personal bandwidth, and it will come. but i want to ask you directly, in this case, what do you think i fucked up? can you get specific? or do you just mean...the general fuck-ups of the past 20 years, in a collective pile? i am not asking sarcastically, i'm asking for you to clarify so i can understand. for real. and so that i've said it, this is the best kind of comment that i could ask for. the fact that you've struggled and yet remained her means a lot to me, a massive amount, and the fact that you;'re willing to make this comment and have the hard talks means a lot.

amandapalmer

and kimberly, thank you for this comment, too...this is something i have streuggled with, for years, on both sides. i have watched very dear friends edge close to suicide because of internet heat...and yet i knew i would not say anything publicly to "defend" them - even if i thought their actions were innocent or defensible - because i just did not want to take any heat myself. it's a vicious circle. this is a larger conversation worth having, and i think i'll probably write about it more deeply when i work on the book. the echo chamber effect is also real....but also, like i said in the post, there's sometimes no point in trying to have a calm conversation in a bar that's erupted in a brawl. trying to find the WHERE and HOW seems to be the biggest question. you're right: here is not it.

Melissameter

Amanda, what so many people wish for is to be listened to and heard. There will be a plethora of different opinions about if covering a song is appropriate under different circumstances. Could you use your platform to amplify the voices of: (suggestions): the writer of the song, the singer of the original version, Colombian and Colombian american musicians, music and cultural critics, activists and scholars who think and care about cultural appropriation. Creating the space for their opinions could give the room for you and us to hear them and think about their thoughts.

amandapalmer

and this is one of the issues. andrew. stay for it? or RUN FROM IT? news at 11. i love you. x

amandapalmer

heard and you're right. i think if and when i finally settle into tiktok it will mostly be me in bed. :)

Kathryn Weber-Boer

I just thought of an analogy. There was this trend in academia for a minute, of writing a "failures" CV. Like, include every rejected paper or unsuccessful grant application. Maybe you need to have an up-to-date "AFP is Fucking Human" webpage with a line for each moment when you learned something, or when people didn't understand something, and links to the key moments. That could be cool.

amandapalmer

thank you em, as always....all of this is wise. and it's nice to hear you swear so much. i'm not used to that and it makes me proud :)

amandapalmer

thanks kat. you're not an asshole, either. and i totally understand your pain. you tried to help, it came back as pain...i've been there many times. we grow. xx

amandapalmer

taken with love in turn. thank you for saying it all. i think you've hit the nail on the head here, and i am starting to learn and understand this. sometimes i say too much, and pour out too much of the defensive/fearful inside of my head. and it just doesn't help. i think the majority of what i need to learn is not about WHAT to say, but WHAT NOT to say. i am hugging you. thank you charlotte :)

amandapalmer

thank you for taking the time to write this. it means a lot to me to hear this directly from you. and as for lin-manuel, i am getting the feeling more and more that i should fucking just email him. i mean: why not. love to you, monica. xxx

Fleassy Malay

(Commenting as a white, queer, gender-queer person) This is a wonderfully expressed response. I think also that this is something that will resurface over and over and Amanda, you will likely have to confront it over and over in your career. Not because people are punishing you for past mistakes but...You will have to speak to it and apologise over and over because as long as that track is out there, it will keep causing harm as new people hear it. You can't prevent that now. But you (/we as white people learning) will become stronger and more adept in your capacity and ability to apologise...through both words and actions. I like the suggestion of "giving back", Brene Brown did something similar re:passing the mic. 💗

amandapalmer

rae, thank you for writing, and as usual i fucking love you. this is all very good to read...and i think you're onto something about taking some time - probably before the dresden dolls tour again - to just do deeper, slower work with the BiPOC and trans people right here in this community and in my wider community, as an active project. maybe you should come to boston and help me run it. maybe there's our fucking reason. the main thing i see and feel is that these things can't be done fast and stupidly. if we do a big project like this, it has to be done really well, for all the right reasons, in the right way, in a deep-seeding way that really brings the community together around the people who need the boost, and the platform, and the support. i think we COULD do this, but it has to be done slowly, and rightly. i love you. xx

Shane Maxwell

Hey Amanda, I am trans, and it has never EVER even once occurred to me that you might be transphobic. That notion just seems patently absurd. For the record, I am a fairly recent Patron (from Enjoy the Silence), although I've been listening to the music and following on social media for a long time.. maybe a decade. I'm 35, but I don't use TikTok. My 20-year-old stepdaughter sends me anything from there that's worth seeing, lol. And I won't speak on the other stuff, as I am not a person of color. Sending love, Shane

Andy Leeke

i struggle to see the benefit of staying there and putting yourself through that abuse. sure, viewing figures, new audiences.... but i'm not sure the burden is worth it. I think the ones you want to reach, who will be most receptive to your work, will make their way to you in other ways. Maybe dont totally shut it down and go into hiding, but a more hands off approach would be better. TikTok seems to specialise in hurting those who wont back down from a fight. I worry how easy it would be to get engrossed and start believing the noise. thats why i dont want to be there anymore, but i appreciate we are in very different places! Love you too xx

Rose Cooper

I understand your confusion - if you’re not on tiktok seeing all the viral posts of little brown kids recreating scenes from Encanto and it’s all about them seeing themselves represented. Such joy! No one ties anyone down to see things - TT algorithm feeds you what you like to see. How else do you think everyone found Amanda’s Cover version in the first place? They weren’t from her fan base. Mainly fans of Amanda liked it. Most other tiktokkers didn’t. And not all little trouble makers. Some well respected influencers with big followings weren’t happy either. Their opinion is not invalidated by spoiled yt ppl calling everything “art”. And Art being protected. By that definition I could start selling hand painted Boomerangs. Music purists would be apoplectic if someone reimagined Marvin Gaye’s “whats going on?” as a white girl anthem. Wouldn’t they? Cover songs and film remakes leave themselves open for criticism. That’s just the way it is. Just because you personally don’t understand other people taking offence does not mean there’s absolutely nothing wrong here. The Choices we make ought to begin with the question:. “who is this really for?”

Melody Gornet

Hi ! Speaking from a 30yo, white, european perspective from someone who's been listening to the Dresden dolls on and off since 2006 and just joined the Patreon. (Hi everybody :)). Since my teenage years (!!!) a lot of your art and statements truly inspired and empowered me (to mention only a few, Map of Tazmania, the Art of Asking, the first time I payed a free price for art with the piano duets with Tristan,Oasis song and so on). In the last years and especially since the pandemic I have been educating myself a lot more on my privileges and trying to learn to be a better ally. The TikTok turmoil made me doubt a lot because I do relate to the criticism I read (not talking about the abuse here, obviously. I mean, interesting constructive criticism about the Guitar hero cover or the line in Map of Tasmania, or the Katy Perry doll). What concerned me (much like Bernadette) was that I feared you would not answer, in any way, to the criticism. So I thought "I never actually wondered whether she was an ally before (since I'm so new to learning to be a better one myself. Is she... not ??? Did I just assume ?"). A certain multimillionaire writer who I had admired for years turned out to be unapologeticely transphobic and I didn't expect it either, so, everything is possible. Now, I am very much realizing how impatient that fear was because obviously you don't owe anyone an immediate explanation. Also I did read the blog article about the Bataclan songs last week and that is what eased my heart a LOT. To answer your questions with my two cents, I am very inspired by how Jameela Jamil handles this kind of backlash. She ackowledges the times she fucked up. Then she gives visibility to the people she hurt. She says how it is : we'll always be learning. And at the same time (and especially as a public woman whose story is handled by misogynist media anyway), we'll never truly convince anyone that we're learning and trying, and the people who are only into the abuse and not interested in the answers to criticism will stay the same. Also, sending love for the tough times. Thank you for talking so openly about everything. Melody

Lou

Amanda ! I dreamt about you, two nights ago. I was telling you how sorry I was about the social media bullying of the past few weeks, and how much it had affected me too. I hugged you very tight and told you I loved you. We were both crying. I’m a younger patron. I’m 27 (how did that happen?). I’m also trans, bisexual, and disabled. It might be because your art saved my life multiple times, but I never doubted your heart. I had many discussions about social media and cancel culture with my beautiful partner. They’re a philosophy researcher (@PhiloTranquille on twitter), and they’re incredibly smart and kind (they’re 28, if that matters). I asked them what advice they would give you on this issue, and here it is: The short version: - Do not apologize to a mob. Apologies are for individuals (if you recognize you did something wrong). - Do not trust anyone who tells you there is a positive social script you can perform to get out of this mess. It’s simply not true. - Try to understand the mob’s point of view (for purely pragmatic reasons). And do not let the mob radicalize you. - Wait it out. For now. If you are to intervene on specific slanders, do it later. - More positive advice: perhaps you should think about hiring a “spin doctor”, “communication expert” or “community manager”. Not about asking the youth what their opinion is :) . There is no restorative social script to re-establish your honor. We’re in “politics” territory now. Here is the long version: Now, be be very careful: you will probably receive very bad advice by asking people in general, and under-40 year olds in particular. The sad truth is: our culture is devoid of procedure to get out of this mess. There is no “social script” to re-establish your honor. Not even “trial by combat”. But people will probably say the contrary! They will point to the possibility of “apologizing” for this or that. I think that is very bad advice. If you can apologize to an individual, that’s good: they can either accept or reject your apology. That’s a good social script. But you cannot apologize to a group, especially not a mob. They will neither accept nor reject your apology: they will dissect it, debate it… some will find it lacking.... They are trying to get a reaction out of you. If they succeed, they will want more. Otherwise, try to understand their point of view, not to be at peace with it and forgive them, but as a purely pragmatic survival strategy. The people who are harassing you are doing it because they think they are doing good. And though it might seem like a strange idea, they are evaluating the quality of their action the normal way that everybody uses to judge the quality of their own actions: - they are acting on partial information they got from people they trust - it feels good to do it - they receive praise and prestige for it from their peers - it allows them to unleash their imaginative combativeness (and yes, their cruelty) - they think they can’t be far off from the truth. It’s a safe enough bet to spend their time this way. - they are seeking feedback from the target (a reaction from you) - they see you as a powerful adversary (the establishment) It is of the utmost importance to understand that everybody does that, and everybody uses that rather strange moral compass. Do not alienate them by accusing them to not by motivated by the idea of doing good in the world. They are. Everyone is. And do not let their behavior radicalize you in your opinions about this, that, or the other :). At this point. The best bet is to wait for the storm to pass. Yes, some “memes” that are getting established right now will probably not go away until there is some kind of intervention to combat them. But now is not the time. Otherwise, it is probably best to hire a spin doctor, who specialize in online presence, not to ask the “youth” what you should do :) ! We’re both sending all our love to you ♥

Pedro B. Gorman

Dear Amanda, This bursting into tears thang is contagious, girl! After reading your reply, I did the same, in all the wet, saline glory that connective, empathic weeping commands. I am in the process of editing a long "chronology" of me & Mum's holiday video which mixes videos of crashing waves, photos of obscenely beautiful sunrises, the Gull visitation I caught on video, lunches with Mum...in short, lots of goodies. Because I want you all to feel the same paradise I felt, I a posting it up on YT when i's done, and, when appropriate, will post the link to it here. And YES Amanda! I SO, SO miss the crowdcast, especially, since I was away from Patreon for a while due to credit card being maxed, and having to wait for wage to come back. I never realized how much y'all are my life-line. I miss our Patron Family crowdcasts SO much, because, "isn't it nice when we all can cry at the same time?". Amanda, I love you. I feel sad that this much "social" and "cultural" work/justification you feel pushed to do. But I know you, and I know why: you've always wanted people to know the FULL story, and by the way you are handling this, with your sensitivity in asking, I know you will, once again, come out Bigger on the Inside. In my opinion, being gay and not a parent, and white, I cannot really answer your questions with any degree with any right to do so, but I can say one thing, (a sentence below) which will probably get me beaten up a bit, even here. But be aware: the as yet unmentioned sentence is for EVERYONE, regardless of race or gender. Before I do Say The Thing, though, may I add--I come from the country that not only invented slavery (yep, Portugal was the first ever country to sell African women and men, though you'll never find it in a history book); a country who committed hideous acts of colonialist genocide in Africa, Brazil, and India--and I am as anti-racism, anti-ism, and anti-phobe in general. Now for the thing which might get e beaten up here, especially regarding cultural appropriation. (I'm nearly there, just providing context.) While cultual appropriation has definitely been an established fact, and a contentious issue, this isn't exactly The Beach Boys stealing Chuck Berry's "Sweet Little Sixteen," or Led Zeppelin stealing Muddy Water's "You Need Love" in their own "Whole Lotta Love." Now here's the thing that's gonna get me beaten up, but I'm past caring, as it has over time and more and more every day become, and will remain, my "mantra" for the too-oft-too-easily offended: "People need to get over themselves." An intentional steal is one thing, such as the REAL cultural appropriations I mentioned above (and do we even speak about Elvis's fame, or The Rolling Stones fame, based on ripping off the Mississippi Delta Blues?) This. Was. Just. A. Fucking. Fun. Cover. Song. But of course, it belongs to 4th Reich that is Disney, the patriarchal propaganda factory that peddles illusory dreams that makes girls simper and wait for princes in shining armor, so of course there had to be backlash. Nobody touches the beloved bulimia-factory without a beating, I guess. Love to ALL. And please know that this comment was simply an opinion, not an arrogant mandate. But beat me up if you must...but if you do, at least engage me in discourse and inform me, and we'll talk.) Yours, as ever, Pedro B. Gorman

Ian Gazzotti

40something European queer white guy here. I can't speak for latino* or black people, but the concept of cultural appropriation as is applied in these cases rubs me entirely the wrong way. To me, cultural appropriation is when you steal something that is not yours to consume, like a white girl performing mock versions of first nation spiritual rites, or a white cis man writing a book about the experience of being a black trans woman. Some things are just not ours to meddle with. But in this case? You made a cover of an extremely popular song. Published by DISNEY. And that had nothing specific about being latino in its lyrics. People who complain about this sort of thing forget that the whole point of making art is to create a connection with people who are *not like you*. So yes, the song in the movie was about having to be the strong one in a latino family, but the lyrics are applicable to having to be the strong one *everywhere*. As a mother, as a son, as a member of a white family, in a group of friends, in a community. To say that only a latino woman is allowed to cover that song it's like saying "this song is only applicable to us", and that IMHO goes against the whole point of it. It's not only applicable to them. It doesn't only resonate with them. The fact that this is one of the most watched and lauded movies in Disney history proves that it resonates with a fucking lot of people. To try and deny that is not progressive. It doesn't build anything, but just tears it down. In general, I think this misuse of the term 'cultural appropriation' is a very American thing, especially something-Americans who are second generation or more who want to create artificial fences to mark themselves different from the white 'default'. It reminds me of the kimono argument from a few years ago, when Japanese-Americans argued that white people wearing kimonos was appropriation, and Japanese people in Japan blinked in confusion, saying that they were happy that white people wore kimonos, and in fact the artisanal kimono industry relies heavily on foreign buyers. Restricting kimonos only to Japanese people would be disastrous to them. So who's right on that? The people in the 'motherland', or the children of migrants? Probably a bit of both. These things aren't usually so black and white as they're made to be on social media. (* I know latino people who hate the term latinx. I know latinx people who prefer to use that. To the surprise of no one, cultures are not monolithic and no one can pretend to speak for everyone else in their circle.)

Lou

Also, I completely forgot to mention this in my previous comment, but if you need comforting, may I suggest Sufjan Stevens’ Carrie and Lowell live show on YouTube. His songs (especially Death with Dignity, Fourth of July and Blue Bucket of Gold) make me weep and weep, but in the best way possible ♥️

Damian Masterson

Had a four paragraph response I just deleted, because, honestly what do I know. Here’s hoping your time in the barrel is brief and, if possible, something good comes of it. xoxo

Ria

Personally I didn’t see your cover as appropriation because though it is indeed not your culture the movie is portraying, it is very much a universal story based on a very universal disfunctional family affected by generational trauma (Laurie wrote an amazing piece on this). I do however understand the criticism of you „doing too much“. That’s because their interpretation of your cover is still tied to the movie and to where Luisa is at that very moment. The movie Luisa would have never sung the song the way you did because to almost cry in the middle part wouldn’t have been ab option for her. She needed to sing herself free so she would be able to almost suffocate hug her little sister afterwards. And maybe that’s the point. People haven’t yet reached a stage where they can see beyond the movie plot, to see the universal human message. And to give you the freedom to make this song about you, or an imaginary someone that is NOT Luisa.

Amy Hardingson

Hi Amanda, gender queer POC here (specifically a British Eurasian with a mix of Indian, Burmese & European heritage). I’ve also been a patron for a long while, and I remember our last conversation on race in the community (how this is a white space, why that might be the default, if it’s a safe space for BIPOC). That was an interesting conversation, and it’s nice to see that collectively I think the whole community has learned a lot since then and is gradually increasing racial literacy (so many good folk with open ears and hearts here). Tik Tok seems a brutal place. I can’t answer as to the best way to respond, but I can speak to how you create spaces and interact with issues. You create very safe spaces for LGBTQ+ folk, in my opinion. Yours has been the only gig I’ve ever been to where you’ve talked to a venue about making all bathrooms gender neutral for the show (In Cardiff for TWBNI). That was lovely to see and experience. It was very affirming. I think your literacy on queer issues is high, and that you have a high percentage of queer fans which totally makes sense. I first stumbled upon you from a youtube video posted onto Twitter and what made me sit up and go down a rabbit hole of your music from there was how you showed up, from visible armpit hair, to just being loud and free. I am not trans, but I do still listen to sex changes. I’ve learned so much more about the specificities of trans experiences over the years, as I’m sure you have too. Maybe you wouldn’t write or release that song now. But it was pretty revolutionary at the time to hear anything about that topic at all. I listened to it A LOT at one particular point in my ‘confused’ journey when I was thinking about that topic a lot. But I think the more important thing is that you clearly think a lot about how to make your space safe and inclusive for queer and trans folk. You take actions against the status quo at venues. You employ queer and trans people (loved the series of long essays by Jack). There are a lot of vocal and nuanced conversations and proactive actions here. You don’t have to be here long, or look too hard to see the growth, the listening, and the positive actions. As someone else phrased it above, you have the receipts. You can definitely compile them in some way if it is a valuable and useful resource. With race, I think it’s a bit more complicated. I don’t see you as an overtly racist person. I think it’s clear trolling for people to be screaming that at you when they would be better off focusing their heat on overtly racist right-wing policy makers. However, we swim and grew up in the white-centred, white-biased world. Even people of colour have to spend a lot of time and effort to unlearn it, and it’s a constant practice. Do I think you’re a mean racist? Absolutely not. Do I think you could lean in more to this particular learning journey? Yes, I think so. And I think something has struck a chord with you here to make you curious about how you handled this particular project and what you can learn from it. I’m not a member of the Latinx community, so I can’t comment with authority about the cultural nuances of Encanto. I know that the song resonated with me as a third generation member of my immigrant family. But it also really resonated with me from the parenthood perspective too, and I really enjoyed your cover which brought that to the fore. I can’t especially see the issues with covering this song, but let’s think about this systemically. How much is it a part of your practice to think about cultural sensitivity? Could you do more to lean in to appreciation when you do go near material from other cultures? I think one of the biggest aspects to cultural appropriation is the question of who is getting paid – are people from that culture being consulted or included in the process? I know that in fiction writing it’s best practice to employ sensitivity readers to give feedback. Perhaps that’s something to think about? There must be people in the Diversity and Inclusion industry that would be happy to consult with your team on how to improve your systems here and make sure you don’t miss red flags, that you do due diligence, check for what you don’t know. Put it on a tick list as a question to ask for every project. I think that by the sounds of it, you could make some valuable changes. I haven’t seen as much evidence of learning about race issues as I would like to see as a member of your community. I remember that nuanced conversation we had two years ago. I remember one IG takeover with Melz from Black University, and the promise that you would do that sort of thing more often. I know you’ve got a lot on your plate but it would be nice to see a little more interaction with these issues. Racism is one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) issue of our times. We are a left leaning community who loves to learn. Can we learn more about this together please? I’d love to see more of those conversations here. What antiracist reading or learning are you doing at the moment? What’s coming up for you, what are you thinking about? I personally love Layla Saad’s book Me and White Supremacy. The journaling prompts that go with the book are phenomenal and it really helped me see my own internal racism and reflect deeply on harms I have unknowingly perpetuated in the past. I’d be interested in hearing more about the specificities in Aotearoa. I’d be interested in hearing more about or being pointed to more indigenous musicians, writers etc that you are learning about or interacting with. One last thing to end my very long comment. I’ve written to you before about the ongoing Coup, war and humanitarian crisis happening in Myanmar. I remember you writing back to me, and it means a lot to me and to all people in Myanmar each time another person in the world knows a bit more about what is going on. On your recent post about the war in Ukraine I wrote a long response about how it feels for the whole world to be raising money for refugees in Ukraine while ignoring how people are suffering in identical or worse situations in non-white countries. The white-centred, racially biased media are a lot to blame for this. I had several really lovely replies to what I wrote. I hope that more people get curious about their behaviour around Ukraine and how it differs from other conflicts. Why this one and not that one? Why is it that everyone I know is desperate to provide every resource they can spare for Ukrainian refugees, but doesn’t have the time of day to sign a petition to their governments to sanction the junta in Myanmar? I got asked when I bought a burrito yesterday if I wanted to add a £1 donation to Ukraine. It honestly baffles me the level of solidarity and performative action happening for Ukraine while several other conflicts and crises are ignored. It would make a world of difference to Burmese people just to get more awareness of what they are going through, and the creativity and resilience they are showing in the face of their troubles. Financial donations make an even bigger difference, because they are over a year into a disastrous coup which is performing a scorched earth policy. Internally displaced people in Myanmar are starving or dying for lack of basic medicines as their fight for democracy gets completely ignored by the world. This is white bias in action. This is unintentional harm and pain caused by systemic white-centering. To close up my comment – I don’t think you’ve committed a massive faux-pas here. As someone else said, this may not have come up at all if the video wasn’t posted to Tik Tok specifically. But if this is a learning moment, a growth moment, I would really welcome that. Every single time any person (but particularly a white person) becomes more committed to learning about racism and untangling their own relationships with it more deeply, the world becomes a better place. And that’s something this community has always really cared about. It’s why we love it so much and we continue to stay here/come back.

Sam Salter

"Second, this is not cultural appropriation because the song is dealing with a universal theme. The song is not about or derived from a uniquely hispanic or Columbian tradition or experience. Everyone, everywhere experiences and has to cope with pressure in life. Whether work, personal, or existential." That's what I think too, but you've put it particularly well - thank you!

Amy Hardingson

This is my comment from your Ukraine post, and the lovely replies I had to it from Em, Molly and Shivonne. The conversation around Ukraine is filling me with an added layer of emotion because my family are from Myanmar and I've been following the recent coup closely over the last year and a bit. I live in the UK and it's been a huge uphill struggle to get anyone to care about the Myanmar conflict, or motivate them to give much needed donations. I'm sure it's the same story for Afghanistan, Syria, Palestine - the list goes on. And believe me, we understand why nations in Europe and the West have a stronger connection to a neighbouring country against an enemy that possibly threatens them or might send their country to war. Everyone gets that. But this outpouring of compassion for the refugees goes against what people from other countries experience in exactly the same circumstances. It is heartbreaking to witness that disparity. It is heartbreaking to see so much solidarity flowing forth for this group of people when there are so many people suffering under military oppression and aggression in other lands. And we all have choices to make about who to support. I know that I had a lot of questions to ask myself when this latest chapter of Myanmar's history started - if I was so motivated by this, then why not show equal passion for other conflicts, learn more about them, donate equally to them? And it has definitely increased my empathy and understanding of issues from other conflict areas as I follow Myanmar's story intimately, and I understand there will be nuances that go over my head in every situation around the world. And I understand that I don't have the bandwidth to take on every conflict around the world. And that is part of the reason why I haven't worried about sending a donation to Ukraine. At times I even wonder if some of the action we are seeing is performative, it's herd mentality, it's so everywhere in the media that you can't take a breath without reading another emotional personal story, like I want this guilt to go away so take these dollars so I can say I've done my bit. And I know that in my small town alone that we have sent 4 lorries full of donations to Ukraine. On the one hand it's amazing, on the other it feels like a knee jerk reaction that is becoming overwhelming for organisers. I know that the local Polish club has asked people to stop giving them things because they are overwhelmed with volume - how much is too much for one group? And I know that people in Myanmar are living close to starvation as they refuse to work their jobs because they want the junta to fall. I know that power cuts and internet blackouts are happening frequently. I know that food prices are rocketing as the junta continues to do a scorched earth policy and burn villages to the ground. I know that the international media has even stopped writing occassional dissociated trauma porn articles about the conflict in Myanmar. I know more awareness and more funds would make a huge difference to them when they are 14 months in to forging a revolution that is founded in democracy, inclusion and radical creativity. I know that you're aware of this Amanda. All of us educated folk are aware of these things happening around the world even if we're not saturated with it in our news feed right now as we are with Ukraine. I'm not asking you to suddenly platform Myanmar or anywhere else. But maybe, it's worth an introspective question or two. About the choices we make. About the power of our dollars and support and solidarity to make a difference in many places around the world. I'm sure it's something you've thought about in the past through your work with refugees in times gone by. And god, I was so heartened to read that you mentioned Myanmar. Because those are the only crumbs of representation we get. And often Myanmar is even left off of that list. For anyone who has read this long ramble of a comment and wants to know more, I really recommend following Insight Myanmar on instagram as they have a podcast and blog which does wonderfully illuminating work on the nuances of what is going on in Myanmar. They also run a patreon page called Better Burma which is their charity arm which helps feed Civil Disobediance Movement workers (people supporting the revolution by choosing not to work their government jobs), and goes to various communities in need. I would also recommend Frontier Myanmar (https://www.frontiermyanmar.net/en/) as the best news source in English. You can support their independent journalism by becoming a member, or just read through some of their seriously well crafted articles for free. And for a whole host of good organisations to donate to, go to https://www.isupportmyanmar.com/ . Or, if you just want to take a moment to spread a bit of kindness out into the world, then you can post a message on AmaAko, who relay messages of solidarity to our brothers and sisters in Myanmar to keep their spirits going https://amaako.org/ There's a lot going on in the world right now. And that's overwhelming for all of us. And the news cycle can be really triggering in an unhelpful way. But we're all so interconnected. There's so much which we don't hear about. So much I hope one day you might be curious to learn about in a country such as Myanmar (which is full of the most beautiful kind hearted and creative culture). I hope that more people spend a moment untangling the normalisation of conflicts in certain places around the world. Maybe put a pin in learning more about one place in depth in the future. To spread a bit of kindness and solidarity in another place where it can really help to spread safety, and peace, and happiness, and ease. I feel that this current cycle we're on isn't done yet, but I hope that we can all work together to build a world full of greater peace and understanding. xx 8 3w EmVT great points Amy, thanks for writing. it is so important to intentionally seek out information beyond what may be trending, i'm going to resolve to do that more. all the best to you. 3 3w Molly McEnerney Thank you so much for sharing all of this. I am glad to know how I can find out more about what is happening in places the mainstream news is ignoring, and where I can donate. 2 3w Amy Hardingson Thanks for reading. I'm glad my ramble has connected with you. I had another thought. @meemalee on Instagram is another great account to follow for learning about Burmese culture and what is happening right now. Mimi has some wonderful highlights saved on her profile - history, and now - which is a great starting point to fill you in on context and background. Also, she writes the best cookbooks and recipes. ☺️ 3w Shivonne Lynch From a stranger in Pennsylvania, US: This is no ramble, this is a necessary interjection for people to recieve at a time when our minds are especially open to being focused on matters beyond our own borders. I've recently begun following several Instagram accounts which update on world-wide conflicts, and doing some basic research into the depth of each of them. I feel extra devastation when I see what's happening to the people of less-recognized countries in conflict, because, how much more painful to be in it without widespread support, especially at a time when voices around the world cry "I want to fight for good! How can I help!? Who do I send my money to??" And you're so right. It's all so overwhelming. Everyone is overwhelmed in their own life. Even one war is too much to handle, like the pervasive harshness of the world is filling up what little space we have in between getting through life's constant burdens. But then, to cry for overwhelm in normal life must sound absurd to those struggling to get back to it. I'm going to look into Myanmar a bit extra this week. Your words didn't go unheard, I promise some of us are listening.

Sam Salter

"People are cynical, and expect celebrities to be phony. The slightest misstep is seen as proof that Amanda is full of shit, and is secretly as horrible as they think everyone is... They just enjoy doing it... I think it would be better for Amanda to NOT apologize. She did something with sincere intent. People just don't want to believe it." I think this is an excellent and important idea, and I'm surprised how seldom I see it expressed online - thank you!

Sam Salter

"Please, please, please don't ever feel like you need anyone's permission to walk away and stick your head in the sand. I fucking love the sand." :D :D :D

amandapalmer

thank you kirsten, for this really beautifully mature comment. it is true: we need space to grow. the issue of late seems to be that growth just ins't happening in the right way, or at the right speed, for many. coming here and having this talk helps, for sure. so thank you writing this. and for being here. x

amandapalmer

and that, indeed, is where you have to cut certain losses and walk. i think that's the point i'm getting to with people who don't want to see growth or hear apologies. it's a tough one. and the spectrum is wide: there's murder, and then there's song lyrics. and everything inbetween xxx

amandapalmer

THAT IS THE BEST AND MOST BEAUTIFUL THING I HAVE EVER HEARD!!! mazel tov a million times and i hope you get a good video :)

amandapalmer

this is a great take, actually. the truth under much of this is that i have NOT had time to hang endlessly on tiktok to understand the culture, because i've been offline and raising ash. everything is connected. xx hug your son from me.

Kya

I'm an indigenous woman of colour. A middle sister. A granddaughter of a woman who had to flee her village with her young children (one of them my mother) when it was overrun by murderous armed forces, and my mother was raised in a cave for years before they were able to return. I bear obvious similarities to the character of Luisa. And yet I don't think I hold any more ownership over the song than anyone else does, except for maybe Lin-Manuel Miranda. I think the cultural appropriation criticism is disingenuous. There are several other covers of this exact song, plus others from Encanto, on TikTok and I haven't seen any of them accused of cultural appropriation. The song was specifically written to be universally relatable, so I believe it can be universally covered. Thank you for creating this cover version, Amanda. I truly love it. And I love you so much. xoxo

amandapalmer

oh, there's a lot of backlash about eminem. for sure. but also: he's like trump in that particular teflon way. he's just unapologetic and that wins him his own base. it's just not the base i want. love to you kirsten xx

amandapalmer

i love this comment, rose, espeicially because it is NOT echo chamber. i do want to talk to more people - you, tiktok creators, others - to grow, to learn, to change, to understand how to be a better voice and artist in the world. everything you wrote, taken on. i think having a conversation like this via webcast would be a really good. a live conversation. if i do that, i hope you speak. hugs to you. xx

amandapalmer

i've made a note to unblock you when i get back online there, which could take weeks or months! but who knows why. i blocked a few hundred trolls (if the content was persistent and abusive)...you may have gotten swept up in a block-a-thon by accident. xx

amandapalmer

in all of this, with lots of things set to the side: poor jherek, and the strings, who worked so hard on this and were so proud of it, and probably now feel they have to distance themselves from the project so as not to get yelled at. that's a shame in itself....and ironic, given two of the string players aren't white. it's....weird.

Rose Cooper

Absolutely. I’ll be there. Navigating this thing is hard. Very very hard. I’m no expert. I just always see things from different angles. I responded to a negative comment on your TT post a few days ago - and someone asked me to provide “proof” and I thought - like others have said, no one’s going to go read a blog post. And why should they? I think some are waiting for a video reply. I know I have been. I just think older generations & younger generations have SO MUCH to learn from each other. I have millennial & Gen Z offspring. They keep me on my toes. But my driving force on social media is to be part of the conversation - even if it’s just as an interpreter . Much love!

Gail Gallagher

We need to listen to each other's songs. We must also be able to sing along. That's what makes us a community, helps us to empathize. Thank you for your amazing work!

Jennifer Overbye

Honestly, reading these comments, I'm really uncomfortable. People questioning whether cultural appropriation is real, people complaining about "cancel culture", people who were not impacted saying that you did nothing wrong... Cultural appropriation is real. Cancel culture isn't. There's this narrative that The Public decides who to 'cancel' and that person is immediately ostracized from society, but that's not the case. Donald Trump still has a following of millions. Heck, people still listen to Chris Brown. Marilyn Manson has tons of fans despite all of the women he abused. What's different now compared to before is that it's so easy to look someone up online and learn about their past actions. Just because a lot of people criticize someone's actions doesn't mean that they're shipped off to a deserted island and forgotten forever. It's much easier now to hold people accountable and tell them "that's not ok". I'm also seeing a few people here talking about "echo chambers" on TikTok. Echo chambers aren't great, but that's honestly what you have here. I know you want to do right by your patrons, but this is a community who has opted into your message. They're obviously going to be more willing to tell you that you're doing nothing wrong. If you want to know how you can do better, look outside of your fans. You have a self- selected group here and they're never going to be impartial. Doing the work means listening to people who aren't our fans. People who don't agree with us, maybe even people who hate us. Sometimes those people are great educators. I think it would be a good idea to put all of the previous kerfuffles into a blog in one place and make sure that for each one you have all of the elements of an apology: 1. Expression of regret 2. Explanation of what went wrong 3. Acknowledgement of responsibility 4. Declaration of repentance 5. Offer of repair 6. Request for forgiveness And accept that impact matters, intent doesn't. Some people will not be able to ever support you because of the mistakes you've made in the past. And that's ok. That's their boundary to put in place. There's nothing wrong with that.

Danielle Buie

Oh wow, how damn powerful could it be to write a letter to *yourself* re: your handful of controversial missteps, how you feel about them now, how you've grown, etc. Then if you would choose to share it publicly, it wouldn't read as trying to defend or explain yourself, but rather as a vulnerable glimpse into your relationship with your perfectly imperfect self. ❤ That said, I feel strongly that your recent art especially speaks for itself as to your rather astounding willingness to be publicly vulnerable and open, on a scale that most of us will never achieve. I'm thinking now of "Bigger on the Inside" and wishing I could wave a wand and make all of Tiktok (hell, the entire internet while we're at it) listen with an open heart. Thank you forever for writing that song that's so full of truth about each of us. ❤

Len Tower Jr.

a, love you back. all you patrons, love you all. a, covering a song is not cultural appropriation. its a compliment. if the creators have a problem with it, work with them. when the ragers focus on you, devote what time you can to recognizing their humanity, including their errors, them move on. i had a long comment on why the ragers are hurting themselves in the long run. deleted by Patreon. no more time today to recreate it. -len

Fonzie Blair

you're right that this song is first and foremost about shared human experience. what I will say is that cultural appropriation is an issue because of colonialism. so your examples aren't solid, or sensitive to the impact of colonialism. I do think this situation has taken itself way too far, and Amanda doesn't deserve hate. but I also think that assertions of cultural appropriation deserve respect and not to be dismissed by English people. I know you mean well and I agree with your logic. I know that the people who point out cultural appropriation often are rude about it. but there's more at play than the simplified way you put it.

Marie

Amanda, gonna reply anew since Patreon has a wacky comments system. I understand the bandwidth issue. Life is hard in general. I know you've been going through some Shit (tm). And having to be accountable makes it really fucking hard. Its scary to have to admit you were wrong and have hurt people, whether or not it is intentional. But when you do it, do it fully and wholeheartedly. Leave no doubt. In terms of where you fucked up, I meant in general. Not so much this cover (I can't speak to that, as a white person). But your past. Evelyn Evelyn comes to mind, as it is kind of an insensitive thing - and the time you laughed about disabled feminists coming at you for it. Ableism is very real, and we are seeing it live (ex. "oh, it's just disabled people dying from Covid, who cares!"). Using the n-word, which you covered (but it's behind a paywall). The bad blood between you and former employees. Shit like that. There are small apologies scattered across time and space on the net. You really have to look for them, which shouldn't be a thing. The onus is on you to clearly address and apologize for it. That's also why I'd be interested in you talking to higher-profile types from tiktok or other platforms that hate you so you could hash it out and learn. It won't be fun or easy, but it might go a long way in building good will and healing the past for a better future. As I said earlier, you are part of my DNA. I used to shave off my brows and draw them on like you. I occasionally get told I look like you (I don't generally see it, but it's flattering nonetheless). Hell, I am in one of your music videos! My past and your art are definitely linked. You also gave me the courage to want to pursue performing/singing, so you're also linked to my future too. I'd rather be proud of that than have to give caveats of "well I know she's kinda shitty but...." I have had to have hard talks with friends over difficult subjects like this. I've been in your shoes as well. I just want to be as honest as possible with you because I feel like you deserve the truth.

Sam Salter

Hello - and thank you for making the effort to reply! I entirely agree that cultural appropriation can be real (and in such instances, wouldn't be touched by my 'English Language' or 'Cerberus' examples above) - I just see not the slightest hint of a case here (and stick by my two silly examples as equivalent to this situation). And to be clear, that is purely my own personal feeling, as asked for by Amanda here - I totally realise that others' realities will vary! Again, thank you.

Laura Morland

Wow, what a wonderfully thoughtful, beautifully written comment! I second everything you said.

Laura Morland

I like parts of your idea, but are you stating that Amanda should *apologize* for covering "Surface Pressure"? Since the beginning of the Broadway (later Hollywood) musical, many terrific songs have been covered by artists who are only relating to the song, not to the *context of the song* in the musical. That's the case here. I have never seen Encanto, but I related to the song as somone who is under a lot of pressure (as is Amanda). That is a universal theme. I think that Amanda would be giving into to another kind of pressure if she were to apologize for covering this song! I wonder what Lin-Manuel Miranda thinks.

Len Tower Jr.

patreon, aka those who can't program websights, appears to have deleted my long comment. (I had an edit box open on it, while I refreshed the page. I can understand not preserving edits-in-progress (it takes even more programming), but deleting a post already made totally. AMATEURS.) i recreated the first part to amanda as the PS above. the second part about the ragers hurting their own cause, will wait for another day. sigh, Len ps: i should really compose these & save these elsewhere.

Stephanie

First off, I love you. I know that you've already addressed everything in the past, but you've got an entire generation of kids who would benefit so much from your art if they gave it a chance. I think you should make a response video to explain - once again. It is worth it to reach Gen Z. It's one of the worst things, to be misrepresented and to be called all the things you literally very actively work against... The laughing response and sending love isn't being received well, although I do understand why. In the real world - it's the best response. Show love. Show unconditional love. In tiktok land and to this next generation though, it comes off like you're blowing off their concerns. All they know is what they've been presented... and it's been manipulated to make you look like such a terrible person and the antithesis of who you actually are, who we love. Please consider it. 🙏 💙💙💙 all the love 💙💙💙

Ashwin Skoog

As someone on tik tok a lot, there's a lot of kids who think they're saving the world by verbally abusing people constantly. And most of the time nothing is looked into, they'll watch a clip someone shows them and just accept that as fact without knowing the source. It's just easy information to them and they don't think people leave out information that they do. The people on tik tok are not going to look into it, so you'll probably have to do it for them. Show them the links to your public statements, reiterate some of the important points in those statements for the people who are still not going to go to the links, and just be as genuine as always. The people on tik tok want full transparency on that app, they don't really seem to care if it's open anywhere else until someone shows them. Even after doing that it might not be enough for people to hear an apology. They want to know what you've done to help these communities as well, and even then who knows what they'll think or say. I would post a full discrepancy video and then step away for a moment, let whtever happens happen, and come back when you're ready. It's so hard on that app sometimes and I do wish you love ❤️

Alyson

I am on TikTok and Facebook and Twitter and saw some of those comments. Someone did ask “has this ever been addressed?” about some of issues (this specifically the n-word) and I went looking for your response. I remember reading it in the moment. I found it and it turns out it’s on Patreon behind a paywall. The only public information is the accusations/concerns. It’s your choice how you address it but it’s not currently possible to Google your responses. Re: Surface Pressure, there are a lot of covers out there already of this song. Disney and LMM gets covered a lot right now. Is it appropriation? Hard call for me as a white woman to make. I would ask, are bands/individuals getting this commentary? I have no idea. It could be that this argument is the one that you, as a white woman, can’t really defend against in general. Is there a genuine concern because of past trespasses that appear unaddressed? Could be.

Kirsten Petersen

Thank you for giving context for the reaction on tiktok, Rose. Your comparison to "What's Going On?" makes sense to me. Fwiw, my 17 yo who is on tiktok every day showed me dozens of artists who have covered Surface Pressure, many of whom seem to be white. She said some had been popular on tiktok. I think there is another dimension to the response Amanda got. Not just the context of the platform. Something about Amanda makes her a lightning rod for this kind of backlash when other artists get away with the same or similar things.

EmVT

here is a public post from Amanda, publicly available on her website, addressing where she used the n word in songs: https://blog.amandapalmer.net/racism-words-art-time-progress/ I think Amanda said she can't link the original patreon post itself because the people in the comments section never consented to have their comments made public, which I think is fair. I think if you're a patron (anyone reading this) should be able to access the comments section as well, I believe. I do agree Amanda should address some of these issues more, and more clearly, by the way. I also think it's fair to assume any high profile public person with a staff probably has people who are mad at them, and Amanda doesn't necessarily owe the entire world an explanation on every dispute from her past. I'm an old white lady, by the way, full disclosure. I like your post, I just wanted to provide the part of the link that is public, not behind a paywall. ☮️

Tara Goddard

That is such a good point, and a sobering one. I guess we've always been divided amongst our sources of where we get our information, but today's online platforms are so complex and have such powerful tools for targeting groups, engineering certain responses, silo-ing information, etc. It is pretty scary to think about how different the tone, and focus, and popularity with certain groups, and appropriateness for certain types of information is by the different platforms .... ugh, it can be so overwhelming. Really thankful for this space that actually feels thoughtful and more democratic.

Tara Goddard

And all that to say, I'm sorry for the vitriol and nastiness and horror of the backlash, and I'm happy you are in a better place to deal with it, but also since you are human, it still sucks so much. There have been so many thoughtful comments here, I hope you are feeling some ease about the situation.

Len Tower Jr.

Amanda has already addressed these issues. No new issue here. How much time should she invest in repeating herself? It will change very few minds. -Len

Jennifer Overbye

I'm not commenting on any specific issue because it's not my place. I'm white and my opinion doesn't matter in the Encanto question or in any other situation regarding race or cultures other than my own.

Kirsten Petersen

That's a really good point. I've learned a lot reading these comments. Thank you to Amanda and this community for this education.

Jo VanEvery

I got nothing on the Tik Tok situation. But what Alex said about going to gigs despite really resonated. I went to one. Rescheduled from April 2020. I wore a mask but so many people didn’t. Half the band was off with covid (still a good show) and yet? But the energy was fantastic and it felt so good. Have a stash of rapid tests so know I didn’t get anything. So enraged at the UK government for multiple things including ending free testing in the middle of a spike. No idea how we manage risk when the stash runs out. Btw Jordan this variant often has gastric symptoms apparently. Love to you and your family. Sorry things are difficult. Glad you have community in NZ.

Annie

Hi Amanda 🖤 I’ve been a fan since I was 9. I’m 25 now and do tiktok for work, and it really can be brutal. But even if those comments get out of line, at their core, they’re seeking one thing: accountability. Some have criticized your blog posts regarding the n-word use as being inaccessible and too personal and “victim-y.” In my own personal life, I’ve gotten into miscommunications where I’ve hurt someone and I want to explain my side as best I can while apologize so I can make sure they have all the context. But sometimes, they feel that detracts from the actual apology. It’s important to discern whether the situation needs an apology or an explanation, especially since sometimes, people can interpret a well-meaning explanation as a self-centered excuse. So I’d recommend owning it and making a Tiktok post accessible to them all about it. Make a tiktok series apologizing for your use of the n-word, saying there was absolutely no excuse for that. Since then, you have learned and stopped doing that cover, and you’ve removed lyrics from your own work. But instead of taking about how art evolves, tell them there was no excuse ever for that but that you’ve learned, and you are looking forward to learning and growing even more. Take sincere accountability. Apologize from the heart, but let them know they are under no obligation to accept your apology if you’ve hurt them personally. If they are willing to engage with you civilly, invite them to give honest, helpful feedback! But tell them, too, that you do not expect them to perform free emotional labor. And in the rest of the tiktok series, you can address the other things they mentioned, like the rumor of not paying your musicians. In your series, I’d recommend above all that while you provide context for these situations, try to make sure the explanation doesn’t come off as an excuse. Have empathy for their interpretation and tell them you understand why they feel the way they do, and then you can explain why you chose to do things a certain way. Then take a step back and say that with this feedback you’re receiving now, maybe you wouldn’t have done it that way in the past. But at the time, here is how you felt about it and (most importantly) how those musicians felt about it. I’ve rambled a lot (sorry!) but my main piece of advice for battling tiktok would be honest accountability, empathizing with the root of their criticism instead of writing it all off as hate, and engaging with them about this all on the platform itself. Good luck 🖤

Lee-ann Dunton

I read the first part of this post & wanted to respond before I forget (thanks ADHD!) I realllllly like the idea of a massive post/list that addresses each & all those things levied against you. And perhaps it’s something you continue to update any time a new “argument” comes out. I, for one, absolutely LOVE that you take ownership of what you’ve done in the past that may or may not be “ok” now (or even then). Rather than trying to brush it under the rug, or pretend like it never even happened, you address those things head-on. THAT’S what keeps me coming back, and what keeps me giving to you monthly. Because you’re fucking REAL. You’re a human being & you don’t pretend otherwise. 💜 I love you, AFP. 💜💜💜

EmVT

You mentioned "The only public information is the accusations/concerns" but the following publicly available links (not behind a paywall) contain a lot more than that, I'll drop some pull quotes below. https://blog.amandapalmer.net/racism-words-art-time-progress/ https://blog.amandapalmer.net/race-compassion-community-ask-patrons-color-3/ "would i cover it again, knowing what i know now, having read a lot more, learned a lot more, spoken with a lot more people…listened a lot more? no. i wouldn’t. can i apologize for having done it? absolutely. i’ll do that right now. i’m sorry i covered that song." "i’ve posted a few things about it over here on different threads but so it’s crystal clear: i made a mistake using the word, and i’m sorry. it’ll be changed in future iterations of the song when i play it live. " "all i ask is that the comments on this post remain limited to PoC. i am here, we are here, and reading." The comments themselves are behind a paywall because the commenters were trusting their comments would remain private as patrons, but Amanda's responses are available.

Briana Cavanaugh

I love you. I think you’re thinking about things on target and asking great questions. I think the Encanto cover is a funny thing to react to because it’s being produced by Disney. A global mega corp. If the artists aren’t ok with it, by all means, apologize. But covering a song is a form of appreciation. And a song produced by Disney? Nah. The issue with appropriation is often that the original artists aren’t compensated or named. Taking something from one culture to make it white. But in this case this song is ultra famous and they’re widely recognized and compensated. Also Disney. It’s a toss up about whether to respond to all the things. If you can point people to things, cool. But continuing to cover the same ground? Idk. It’s a lot of work for people who seem committed to hating you. What’s your real goal here? You won’t appease the haters. However your heart deserves its full expression of love and healing. If there’s something on your heart to do or an apology to give, there’s your answer. I’m curious to see how it goes.

Kya

I’ve seen several people recommend posting apology videos to TikTok. Are there examples of people who have done this before? I’d be interested in seeing how they are received.

Gail Gallagher

Love you back. I am embarrassed to say that I had never heard your music (until 2020?) when I stumbled across you, on the Insta feed, strumming a ukulele amidst a tropical setting extemporizing a song. (I was looking at #ukelele) Since then I have come along on your artistic ride. I look forward to the next chapter, your ALLTHINGS are amazing. Can't wait to hear your next musical adventure. Showing your process in the studio during "Surface" was incredible. Regarding Ticktock, I deleted mine. Too much of a time suck.

Fonzie Blair

honestly the more I think about the idea of you having a conversation with Lin Manuel on camera, the more I think it's a great idea. I think if there is something you did wrong that were not seeing, people should know. I'd like to be enlightened. is there merit to the tik tok mob or is it just kids being ragey and cherry picking issues out of context? I don't really know. I want to discount canceling as vitriol. and I do think it's the wrong way to handle things. but we need to lead the way to civil discussions of these things, not divide well meaning people by how perfect they act. I don't know how to reach people who deal with conflict in that way. but I think there are many watching who wonder... why? and what am I missing? I don't want to hurt people. but impact matters. I don't want to walk on eggshells, but ignoring legitimate concerns isn't the answer either. I don't think you'll ever "win" this or resolve this. but could we start new conversations and new ways of relating? I'd like to see that for the world. that's not your responsibility. your responsibility is to you and Ash first. please try not to internalize the hate - because people are being unnecessarily mean to you. you bring a lot of good conversations to the forefront. maybe this one too?

Emily Atkins

As a high school teacher I can confidently say that TikTok is a dumpster fire with a pile-on culture bigger than Twitter. I see it in a small scale with 14 year old (“I don’t really think she’s a bitch but everyone else was saying it”) Whilst there were probably some people with genuine grievances (I had no issues at all with it and thought it was great btw), I reckon the vast majority were joining the sport of TikTok witch hunts. For all its cutesy memery, TikTok is a vicious place.

Francine Hibiscus

HOWDY, fellow irrelevant second waver!! Yeah, it was a kick in the teeth to hear from Youngs that our generation DELIBERATELY left POC behind. All I remember doing is fighting for the rights of all humans. We were just as helpless against the Machine as we are now, and with society being more segregated then than the Youngs can even IMAGINE, it's not like there was much individuals could do except protest. Good thing I am not into the resistance for the recognition! CRONE SOLIDARITY!

Francine Hibiscus

THANK YOU for this excellent and cogent response!! Which coincidentally validates a lot of my thoughts :) goodness, I am glad to be Old, and I am also glad that there are Youngs like you and your partner out there <3

Lynn Parlett

Crones rule... and have much to teach. Our generation literally stood up to literal segregation of POC - Rosa Parkes rode in the front seat in 1955! In 1960 Mohammed Ali won an Olympic Gold Medal, but was not allowed to eat in his local diner. The last Indian residential school wasn't closed until 1996. Because POC were not listened to then - it was people like us that stood beside them and took on our own to change laws that have improved things. Are things perfect? Oh Hell No! Have we sat on our hands and done nothing? Oh Hell No! It is so easy to sit safely behind a keyboard and sling hate thinking they are protesting... I'd like to see them standing in a protest being spat on, screamed at and arrested.

Gail

Len: I've had comments disappear, too. I don't remember if they were all long comments, but something is definitely a little weird in that regard here at Patreon. Unfortunately, it's not possible to go back and highlight an entire comment to copy and paste elsewhere; you have to do it in chunks. Like Amanda has said -- a bit clunky!

Francine Hibiscus

Me again! Because there are seventeen (17!) days left of tax season and I needed a break so I came to look at comments. So educational! I remember a guy on Twitter ranting about your Patreon, and taking money from people. *YOU WILL NEVER OUTLIVE THE KICKSTARTER CLUSTERFUCK* I told him that you CONSTANTLY tell people to cap their pledges! Or just STOP if they can't afford it. He was surprised, but of course, why would he CHECK? No one's going to check. It's the era of fake news, remember, and let's just let the latest soak into our eyeholes and REACT REACT REACT. I am thinking about that post where the lady said that you were the redheaded stepchild, and I am still wowed by that. Seriously. I don't know what to think, YOU EMBARASS ME BUT HERE IS YOUR BIRTHDAY ENVELOPE. Um, thanks? I will go pay for my team's health insurance now... with the money you have given to my unworthy self. I am two weeks short of 59. I have been places, and I have done things. And never ever have I seen a social environment like we have now, where there is genuinely no winning, ever, the second you step past that invisible line. At least, not if you are a woman. You have done stuff I have disliked, and stuff I have disagreed with, and stuff that I was just WHAT THE FUCK WOMAN!!! Bad judgment is bad, eh? Know what I really like? That you have some really controversial opinions and you STICK BY THEM. You don't back down from your convictions. You don't let people bully you into CONFORMING. I know it's not easy, either, I am utterly confident that you fret over those decisions. I never heard the song "Let it go" or that song from Little Mermaid until you sang them at your show (AND I REMAIN DISPLEASED I WOULD HAVE PREFERRED YOUR OWN SONGS) and I doubt I will ever see Encanto-- not enough Capybara content. Thanks to you I got to hear very moving renditions of interesting songs. That is good, and important! And while cultural appropriation is a very real thing, covering Encanto is NOT.

Bayani

Not going to list my minority status and I’m not hispanic so I can’t speak for them. However I am on TikTok and I’ve seen the videos. I believe posting that cover on TikTok was in poor taste. You weren’t there the day Encanto came out and saw how it empowered and lifted the Hispanic community. There were conversations about generational healing and finally feeling seen and held with this particular song. I was moved often to tears because a lot of these experiences reflected my own. All of TikTok was really in alignment with that community. I can’t say whether or not doing the cover was wrong , but I can say that posting it on TikTok was definitely a controversial choice. Your version completely disregarded the community that was built around that song with no context. Surface Pressure is a song that uplifted and held the poc community on TikTok and when you came in and posted your version, which is heavier and darker and undoubtedly your own, it was like you butt your head into a conversation you had no idea about and it triggered and insulted a shit ton of people. I’m not into cancel culture and all the past stuff they’re bringing up is a whole other thing. My bandwidth is low, but I wanted to provide some context from my limited experience.

Marguerita Tajibnapis

Hi Amanda I did not know how abusive and deeply mistaken the comments on TikTok were/are. First of all, I am BIPOC - I am half AAPI American 1st generation immigrant. I feel I am really attentive to issues of cultural appropriation because I was in a Women’s Ritual Group where white women came back from trips to SOuth America, had “studied” with a self-identified shaman while on vacation and came back claiming they were now shamans and could charge for their services. That’s gross. You sang a Disney song. Yes the family and characters are Colombian but it’s Disney. Everyone sings Let It Go and whatever Ariel sings. They are not princesses. They are not mermaids. I cannot believe there aren’t tons of people singing songs from Encanto from all ethnic backgrounds. I was present at your creation of the piece - from piano tracks, to quartet to vocal. All I felt was that this is a great song for all and sundry who feel a lot of pressure. Nurses, doctors, single mothers, mothers who have to work from home while their kid goes to school from home. There is a lot of pressure out there! I feel that pissing on your cover because your’e not Latinx is like doing that because you’re not a magical being who can lift multiple donkeys. I am not on TikTok and I can’t join because I already find the internet a huge time suck. And manipulates my emotions too much because that’’s what these platforms do - they’re emotion machines. The few articles I’ve read about TikTok say you have to pretty carefully curate your feed (I hope it is not as pesky as Instagram has become about pushing its recommendations….damn it I follow enough people and artists etc). I spend time on Patreon with you because it is rewarding in positive ways and it goes without saying, I love you. But I know it’s good to hear so I said it. The articles about TikTok also say that people love to generate really negative comments because those get the most likes - like it’s been measured. So I consider it a dangerous platform to post creative content. Regarding the bizarre accusations about you being racist, antisemitic and transphobic - I mean whaaaat? Back when you did that NWA cover Patreon didn’t exist - otherwise I would have scolded you for it or even better if you had asked patrons I would have been part of the group trying to steer you away from it. And apparently you got the message and don’t sing it anymore. And that song is a far cry from Pressure, the content completely different etc. I’m guessing the antisemetic accusation is because you wrote that beautiful poem about that poor kid who helped his older brother (clearly a bad influence) do the Boston bombing. I am here to say it was a beautiful poem and the compassion in it expressed a lot of what I felt. BUT there are people ready to consider any kind of sympathy or empathy with Arabs to be antisemetic (sorry I keep misspelling). I care a lot about the Palestinian people and how they’ve been treated by a very colonialist in attitude Israel. The Palestinians were there first. Zionism is problematic. Many Israelis are also against Zionist expansion. I am not antisemetic but I bet there are a lot of people who would consider my support of the Palestinian people makes me antisemetic. So that is always going to be out there. Re: transphobia - I don’t even understand where that comes from. You have drag queens open for your shows. You had Jack as a journalist writing about you. I mean actions speak louder than words. You got no problems with transgender people. I think it’s the right decision to stay off TikTok for a while. Leslie Jones had to get off Twitter for a while because of the incredibly racist comments directed her way. Incredibly hurtful. Why not take a break until you’ve dealt with other more important personal life issues. I love it that you’ve been able to nurture and care for your Kiwi friends and reciprocate some of that love and care they gave to you. I hope you can carry that good feeling with you always. You are loving and you are loved. I’ve missed some of the posts that poll your questions like should i do this, is it a good use for Patreon $. Just want you to know: my Patreon $ for you are a blank check. If you needed them to buy groceries for your friends, do it. I trust you. Do what you need to live your life - for one thing that is going to provide incredible material for your art. Living real life is only going to make your lyrics more relatable. I mean I think a lot of musing on fame or being a rock star is all very well - but I’m here for deeper content than that. And you provide it. Sending lots of ❤️ ☮️🕉

Lynn Parlett

Hmmm. Did a long post about the nature of rumour, gossip and how the negative will always outweigh the positive. How one bad event for a restaurant could see it shut down, because all information will highlight the bad thing - rather than the 20 years of amazing. Google any controversial person - especially women - and the first few pages will be filled with the bad thing, not the discussion, not the apology. I shared a story about a First Nations female elder, who had unfounded hate rumours spread about her 30 years ago. She had booked workshops cancelled because someone did a quick google about her and found the lies - which she has addressed numerous times on numerous platforms. She offered to personally sit down with the organisers to discuss and even offered to show them her papers to prove her heritage (cringe). No, the people decided to believe the 30 year old things on the internet, rather than the woman in front of them. Haters gonna hate.

ANGELA DUNN

Again white so make of this what you will. I will not comment on cultural appropriation as I am not knowledgeable about that. But I can try and give some TikTok context. I think this time, yet again, you failed to read the room. At the moment TikTok has a problem with minority groups being essentially pushed down the system TikTok uses. BIPOC, Latinx, and indigenous creators are not having their voices heard. False reports of account violations getting accounts removed are adding to the issue and it's something that TikTok is aware of but does not seem to be doing something about. Add this to the recent Chelsea Hart Drama that involved an indigenous creator and well white women of a certain age are not been seen in the best light. At least in the corners of TikTok, I've landed in at times. And I love Tiktok. That combined with the fact that you covered a song from a film about a culture that is not yours and there's the perfect storm waiting to land. There's a lot of discourse about culture and representation etc. on TikTok at the moment. Or at least in my experience of the app. Watching TikTok a lot of the videos I came across were people excited that they were finally getting representation from Disney. It was something that they could relate to. I think uploading your cover on there given that was um misguided at best. I have not read the comments but I would not be surprised that Disney's involvement in the don't say bill has not crept into peoples thinking about this as well. I may be making a huge leap there though. Again with regards to what they are complaining about I think some image clean-up might be in order. People who come across you for the first time, seeing their allegations and going to google them are unfortunately being provided with plenty of receipts for the allegations. Evelyn Evelyn and the guitar hero indecent come to mind immediately without the countless blogs and videos discussing this. Fans know you have been trying to change and learn but it's not easy to find outside of paywalls. Sure the blog posts come up but not the discussions which show engagement etc. Not sure what you could do about that but do not do the tearful apology video. The Tiktok crowd will rip into that as it's old hat and not seen as genuine. This last comment is me generalizing and pondering so again take it as you will. Finally, with regards to the nobody said anything in the crowd cast comments. By your own admission, your fans are predominately white. (I think I recall seeing that when you were filming the Will see you now video.) We white people can not, despite good intentions, always anticipate problems, especially around race, culture, etc. That's without socioeconomic factors that might possibly stop none white fans from being part of the relevant levels or at all engaging in such discussions. It's good that you are reaching out and engaging, seeking answers. But could it be worth seeking answers from outside of your fanbase? It's not always easy to go actually this is bad, especially when other people are going yes awesome idea. In my experience from other parts of my life, fans can be yes people, and it's hard to call out people you want to support, especially if we do not have a full grasp of a situation. As white predominately not gen z people we mostly don't. |(I count myself in this.) Just my thoughts.

Len Tower Jr.

Gail, thanks. if you risk editing them, you can select-all, copy-n-paste. the close the edit. -Len

Marguerita Tajibnapis

Lou I can’t like this comment enough! Seems like great advice for dealing with a mob. It takes me back to that conversation you had with the guy who does the Conversations with People Who Hate Me podcast. Conversation should be with a specific individual not a mob - I heartily agree!

Marguerita Tajibnapis

Lou I meant to reply but Patreon stuck it somewhere in the sea of comments. I can’t agree with your post enough regarding your advice to not apologize to a mob. I also think there’s no way to have a conversation with a mob - you probably said that somewhere. It has to be an individual. Amanda once guested on a podcast called Conversations with People Who Hate Me and had just that - a talk with someone that posted a hateful comment on some platform - maybe Twitter? Anyway, I think that’s great advice that you gave in your comment.

Laura Payne

Amanda, I see you, I hear you, I love you. You are an artist and by being an artist, you need to create, to challenge, to stretch and grow. Encanto is a beautiful film, but as someone else here said, it is a Disney movie, and the fact that you covered “Surface Pressure” only means that you covered another song out of the thousands of songs you have covered in your career. If people were upset on TikTok, so be it. You’re not going to please everybody all of the time. Is there something to what they are complaining about? Possibly? But the viciousness that erupts on the web? I know THAT is very real. And don’t forget: some people can just be jerks. Period. Whatever else you do, dear heart, please don’t let this stop you reaching, stretching, growing. And by all means, never let it stop you creating. Thank you for being a shining light during dark times, even when the darkness seems to surround *you*, you are willing to shine a light for all of us to see by. Wrapping you in gentle waves of comforting, heart healing energy, dear girl. ❤️❤️❤️❤️

Coila

I've posted this on Patreon recently, but it's the strangest thing... For just about everything I'm having a hard time with, you end up posting about it at the most relevant time with wise advice and usually you've been through it worse... Thank you! For sharing your advice and for making art that takes difficult things and turns them into healing moments. It really means a lot. <3 Also... Sorry you've been through so much. <3

Rachel Jones

I think this should be handled the way mom's say to handle bullies, IGNORE. Amanda is such a sensitive soul, which makes amazing music, but must be tough to be a person online with the hateful way people treat each other these days unless everyone is pretending to conform to the standards of the moment, LOL. I was an old school anime fan, loved it back in the 90s, and still today. When the internet was born, I made all my friends based around anime, lifelong friends I still see and communicate with today, at age 40. Buuuut, in the last decade or so, tumblr tots started saying crazy things like, "If you like anime characters that aren't over age 18, you're a pedophile," etc, etc, and things like, "People who write fan stories about anime characters who are under 18 are into child porn," etc etc... Well, so they were likening these 20-something year old, mostly female, fanfic writers with like... ehehe, serious child pornographers. Like, my mom was molested by her stepfather and it's something serious that still affects her today at age 70, and these ignorant children were trying to BULLY each other off of the net, by pretending that some were more morally superior to the others, using this strange way of seeing cartoons & stuff. I saw someone show me a post of someone who was like 16, writing in to ask another idiot child about "I like an anime character that is 14 years old, am I allowed to fantasize about them?" And the person's response was, "NO YOU ARE NOT!!!" Ahahaha!!! It was ridiculous. Considering all anime characters look similar to each other, you can watch them as a teenager and pretend they're your age, or watch in your 20s and feel they're still your age. But my old school anime fans, it wasn't even something we ever even thought of or discussed. It's just a way for tiny tots to feel superior to one another, using their sense of moral superiority... in writing other children off as pedophiles, as dangerous as the grown ass old man who molested my mom! No! It's ridiculous, and a bully tactic. I think the same stupid thing is happening to Amanda with the Tiktok turds. A bunch of little brats, using words they hardly understand, to condemn someone whose changed more lives and made more of an impact on the world so they feel -by proxy- hurting this person is them making a difference on the world. And it aint! Amanda is the kindest soul, that's why I love her, and it serves no purpose to call her names only to hurt her and PISS ME OFF!!! >;O I don't have kids, because I'm gay, but my cousin has 5, and I tell them don't you EVER talk to someone the way I see little brats tearing into people on the net. My grandma taught me and my family, even if a drunk bum bumps into you, you say, "Pardon me, sir!" ANYWAY, for Amanda, please get off of Tiktok since the kids are too young to be having any kind of discussing, they're just hurting your feelings.

Amanda Eckert

it’s been a rough couple of weeks on my end, and I sadly don’t really have the spoons right now to write some long, meaningful response, even though I want to. but I just wanted to say that I love you, and that your posts are always a bright spot in my day. if you want someone to start a “best of amanda palmer” twitter feed highlighting all the amazingly kind, generous, and loving things that you’ve done over the years to combat those other hateful lists, I’m your huckleberry. oh, and I loved your cover of surface pressure so much— it brought me to tears. nolite te bastardes carborundorum. ❤️

Fenstar

*hugs* back at you. There are a lot of us out there, we just have to find each other <3

Marguerita Tajibnapis

Pedro I’ve seen your chats with Amanda over Crowdcast and enjoyed your enthusiasm in your Crowdcast chat. I just want to say what you wrote was beautiful and compelling and you’ve got the gift not just with poetry! I could visualize everything you described. How wonderful to know you through Patreon and Amanda’s community! Thank you for your sharing this. Another person close to me is embarking on a death journey soon using MAID (she lives in Canada) - she sent an email to me and invited me to a special intimate party in May. The torrent of emotions - the other people I have lost - complicating issues around siblings and this person, being scared to travel because of Covid….your post and your story about your mother knowing she’s at the part of her life journey where there is more past than future and her fears of dying - well it really helped. Just letting you know. ❤️ ☮️🕉 from a fellow patron in Minneapolis MN, a first generation immigrant to the US who’s half AAPI

Marguerita Tajibnapis

Pedro I tried to reply to you but Patreon threw what I wrote in general comments way below. If you’re in the mood please check it out (it’s Marguerita Tajibnapis and it starts out addressing you not Amanda.

Esteban Montemayor

Oh, Amanda. I love you. Even though the Internet is groundbreakingly special, it is, of course, not perfect. It is populated by imperfect people. Of course. At its foundation, the Internet is a tool. As with any tool, its handler determines its use. A hammer can help build a home; or help tear it down. I don't think that ANY amount of explanation, apology, or learning done by you regarding the art you make is going to change the basic fact of flawed humans inhabiting a flawed system. Do your art. Raise your kid. Be you. Rinse and Repeat. You don't have to make someone else's problem (or 1,000 someones), your problem. Even if their problem is with you. Please remember I say everything with love.

Du Carniel

So about the kerfuffle... it's funny how most of my favorite female artists have gone through this at some point and have decided to tackle this, considering you and Natalie Wynn as the biggest examples. I recommend watching the video Mask Off by Lindsay Ellis. She is/was a fantastic YouTuber who got hate by many minor things until eventually she cracked because of a barrage of cancelling brought about by her opinion on a Disney movie (I think I see a pattern). In this video she did what you suggested of compiling a list of all of her misdoings, but it really works best as a fuck you to her haters than as any proccess of healing. So much so that she retired from the Internet soon after. I guess what I want to say is: so many people struggle to find their own audience, and you really achieved that, Amanda. Me and around 12,000 people ain't going nowhere. This kind of friction will always happen as you're presented to a new audience, but I guess it's the price you pay for making valid artistic choices. So lean on us as you tread water in other domains, and don't get rattled by the discourse. As on what to do about TikTok. I suggest doing something crazy. Do a livestream where on each hate comment you get you figure out a compliment for the person, or you publicize a charity initiative for the Ukrainian refugees. Turn the narrative around and enjoy the clout. We all go just as far as our sense of humor takes us

Rachel Jones

Yeah, I love what you say and how you say it. Some of my favorite female comedy artists have disappeared from the web as well - the author of Hyperbole & A Half (who created the ALL THE THINGS comic), who left due to pressure and personal mental health issues & then Natalie Tran from the hilarious Community Channel, who made such relatable, anxiety-ridden, neurotic comedy videos who also left due to pressure and personal mental health issues. And each of them were The Funniest and made me The Happiest! I'm glad whenever I see either one (rarely) poke their heads up over the last few years. Online pressure is a doozy. I grew up online, made alot of my lifelong friends online, and yet, I haven't typed a word of commentary, joke or otherwise in a public space (save for here) in years..... as I got older, the pressure and fear became too much. I'm a silent Sally even on the internet wonderland, and play all my online games SOLO too. :( Anyway, all to say, I feel solidarity with the ladies who have had this happen. And especially Amanda who is such a sensitive, artistic soul!!! You hate to see someone with so much empathy get stomped on. :( And you seem cool too, du Carniel! ;D

DebbieG

I am white so I cannot speak to the appropriation issue. I am not on TikTok so I haven’t read the comments. What everyone else has already written here is far more comprehensive than what I can contribute. I am sorry that your version of the song has been subjected to such vitriol when I know how much work and soul went into it. Hugs. ❤️

Coila

Oh and I get to have a 40th birthday party! (Soon!) I didn't think I would but my husband is planning it. Should be warm enough to be outside and even wear a pretty dress. :D Your birthday is coming up soon, too! I hope you get to do something special to celebrate it!

Tammi L

If it were me, I would compile ONE post on my website with links to all the explanations and public apologies over the years — whether blog posts, tweets, videos, whatever. (And yes, I'm sure many of us would be willing to help you hunt them down.) If they are paywalled and can't be un-paywalled because of comments (as was the case with "On Racism, Words, Art, Time and Progress"), then reproduce them with the explanation for why the commented version is still behind the Patreon paywall. Once that post exists, make it easily accessible — pinned Tweet, pinned FB post, big link on the front page of the website: AMANDA APOLOGIZES FOR EVERYTHING. Let your fans know that the next time someone shows up in your comments or mentions demanding you explain yourself, the appropriate answer is a link to that post. Then ignore it. I know you have a thick skin, but I guess you didn't know how much more unspeakably fucking vicious the internet has become in the last 5 years or so. I'm not speaking here of people who have legitimate criticisms and questions, but rather of the TikTok mob who only wanted to shit on you over and over and over. They are like sharks in the water, and they always smell blood. It is 100% Lord of the Flies over there, and these children have grown up believing that you can say *anything* online — and they do. Ignore them. Post whatever you would normally post, don't read the replies. Get Aura to start deleting and blocking. IMPORTANT: I did notice that the view counts started going down on subsequent videos after "Surface Pressure." They will move on, if you don't feed the beast. There will be a contingent of people who will abuse and degrade you in reply to every single thing you post, because they get fixated and are tenacious (this is why Aura should start blocking people), but generally speaking the crowd as a whole will move on to the next bloody swimmer. Just keep your head down. Don't act like you're above it, but don't ever let them see that they hurt you either. Knowing they hurt you only makes them stick around longer. I'm almost afraid to post this reply, if I'm honest, because this is my real name and there's no way some of them didn't pony up a buck just to see what's going on in here. ☠️ But that's my 2 cents.

Tammi L

"All I learned is how much the internet scares the shit out of me " It's terrifying. Legit terrifying.

Tammi L

Seriously, I just read it three more times and it just gets better. This is so good I want to go delete mine. Your partner is brilliant, and so are you.

Tammi L

"It’s your choice how you address it but it’s not currently possible to Google your responses. " This is simply not true. In response to something someone posted on Facebook the other night, I Googled "Amanda Palmer apologizes" and the first three results were the "On racism" post, an unflattering article from The Mary Sue which nonetheless linked to another apology for something else, and a tweet where Amanda said she didn't remember saying something but it was terrible and she was sorry she said it.

Tammi L

I don't think Lin can help; the kids don't like him either, LMAO. Apparently he's "cringe" (because the second-worst sin you can commit in this decade is to be earnest and joyful), and also it's not cool to like Hamilton. I'm so glad my teen is just asocial enough that she doesn't care about mobthink.

MiserlyJuggler

Lynne as long as the original issue remains out there and can hurt people, as many times as it does. I’ve done shit in my life that comes back to bite me in the arse years later that hurt other people and every time I apologise again and make sure I’ve done all I can to make sure that it won’t happen again and that I’m being the best person I can be regardless of whether I meant harm in the first place. I did that, I made that person hurt, it’s up to me to make sure they get through that all right if they let me.

amandapalmer

the music will remain here for you. i think it may be time to citch all my social media for a few years, engage here on patreon and discord, and come back when i'm ready with another record. but that's me on a bleak day :)

amandapalmer

oh THIS. so much fascination with all of this, especially all that i'm learning about the people paid to create pain and divisiveness on the internet. i would LOVE to learn more about what you;ve learned....i'll send you a message. xxxx

amandapalmer

just to hear all the sanity here is helping me a lot. a sneech IS a sneech. xxx love to you kris

amandapalmer

this is the wisest comment so far on this thread. it really made me stop and think and understand something i did not before. i love the way you guys talk to me so honestly, like family. thank you so much, dear april. and as for "where neil" is, i don't think, at this point, that anyone will truly ever be able to answer that question. xxxx

amandapalmer

you're welcome, you're welcome, you're welcome. i will hopefully do more soon, when the turmoil of my own difficult existence settles down a little. i need it as much as you need it. xxxx see you soon, my crone friend

amandapalmer

i hear you. although, i'll disagree that "People who don’t understand you are not worth listening to"....sometimes they are, even if what they are saying is nonsense. for the same reason that i occasionally tune into right-wing talk radio....JUST TO SEE.

amandapalmer

oh, you beauty. i love that you take the time to say this. i feel it deeply, and it's always a nice reminder to hear the words from someone else as well. and you, too, my darling rebecca: you are enough. the liberation that comes from knowing yourself deeply enough to not need validation from others - whether it's a partner, or a toxic family, or tiktok - is really the most delicious thing in the world. i love you. xxx

amandapalmer

thank you maria. ash is with me, but the whole family has just been through a meat grinder. it's been very hard. thank you for seeing me. xxx

Claudia Rapp

I was a bit curt, wasn't I. What I meant was I'm not on TikTok, I am finding the appropriation discussion more and more tedious, because it seems to become so essentialist - much like many things that are important & necessary, but turn ugly through essentialism. Just yesterday, when I first read about the intensity of the kerfuffle, I felt overwhelmed and at a loss as to what even to think or say. Hence the "dunno." Sorry, and sending more love!!!!

Dietmar Bloech

Being a white CIS male living in a well-deveIoped western country am very much aware of my privileges and I know that I will never be able to even begin to grasp the experiences of humans who are marginalized by their societies and countries, be it for their sexual preferences, skin colour, cultural background, history, or any other thing, so I did not even think in the slightest of the Surface Pressure cover being anything else than an artists interpretation of a Disney song ... but that only shows my ignorance or missing sensitivities in these things ... I would have never thought that it would bring such a storm onto you, Amanda, and I can fully understand that you are stepping back for your own benefit of mental or any other health. Sometimes a fight or shouting match is just not worth the cost at the time. I am just writing this, to show that you are not alone at not foreseen such a thing ... and also I am always amazed by your willingness to address these issues in the past when the time was right. I am sure, no matter what you say in this regard, a majority of the haters will not be swayed as they are not approaching this discussion with an open mind ... they just want to direct their hate, torches and pitchforks at someone and you were there with your art and history at the wrong time ... tis makes me sad and sometimes I also wonder if it might not be the right time to step away from the internet as it is more hate than love these days.

EmVT

Bay, wanted to say I find this context helpful. I still have questions that will likely never be answered, and I hear my questions don't matter anyway since I'm a white person so, all set there, private party and I'm not invited. This begins to explain what happened with Amanda+TikTok. I'm not on TikTok by the way. Thanks for posting!

Lou

Hey Gail! I agree with your sentiment here 😊. I think though, that there are two things that are implied when people are saying that something is not open to discussion for white people. The first is that, whether we like it or not, BIPOC communities may be better informed on certain issues pertaining to their communities. A similar case that comes to mind is when women report about their experience and their take on certain issues. Sure, some men might disagree and try to shut them off. But as women, we know to listen to and trust women. We share their experience, and we know that they report phenomena we are familiar with, because we experienced them firsthand. We know what it is like to be patronized in everyday life, to be denied medical care because "women are too sensitive", because "the pain is all in our head", or to be catcalled and/or sexually assaulted. Many men just can't fathom our life experience. They can't fathom the amount of intellectual labour that goes into surviving daily life as a woman. How we have to think about how we dress, how late we come home, about how safe certain areas are, and whether or not it's worth hiring a Uber, only to risk assault there. All of that to say: I trust people from BIPOC communities to, in general, have more information than white people, as to what some of the context is. And so, sure, it's not so much about who is allowed to voice their opinion, as to who has enough context to give a fair analysis. And maybe the language should be changed into something like: "only people who are informed about BIPOC issues and racism should give their opinion", but I see how the leap happens. The second thing, with that, is that, I feel like black people and people of color just aren't granted as much space to voice their concerns and their opinions. In our societies, white is still seen as default. If you look at their representation in the media, they're overwhelmingly underrepresented. I remember seeing statistics of the percentage of people of color in the biggest Hollywood movies vs the percentage they represent in the global population, and media presence was a far cry from reality. Anecdotically, creators on TikTok have also noticed that content by BIPOC creators tended to be showed less to viewers, and that a bunch of them would get shadowbanned or straight out banned for doing similar things that white creators do. So, with all that said, I hate the idea that certain issues should only be discussed by people of certain communities. (yet, it's an idea that's even prevalent in certain feminist circles, when it pertains to abortion: if you don't have a uterus, you don't get to have a say in reproductive rights issues --and I don't think it's a helpful way to debate things) But I think that we have to be humble with what we know, as white people, and agree to listen to what people from BIPOC communities have to say before making our voices heard. Anyway, I agree that the debate between what is cultural appreciation and what is cultural appropriation is complex. I read a bunch of enlightening comments, here, and I think the issue is nuanced 😊

Kathryn Weber-Boer

So, this is not advice, at all. But I just watched Encanto with my kid (for the 50th time, probably), and--just based on some lazy assumptions, based on names--it looks like it was created by a pretty multi-ethnic crew. I don't get why it's ok for some white folk to create the music, but not re-create it? I know the point has already been raised that this is actually *Disney* art, but like... where are the freaking boundaries on cultural appropriation? My understanding was that it's fundamentally a question of people with relatively greater social power taking something for which people with relatively less social power have been criticized, and profiting from it. How does this apply here? And are there actually people in the "affected community" objecting (quotes because I don't even know what that is. the movie doesn't even say it's taking place in Colombia), or has it been obnoxiously over-reactive "allies" jumping in to defend a straw man? (I legit don't know, because there is no way I'm joining TT to read hate comments.)

Alyson

I’m glad they can be found because when I looked for them I couldn’t find them easily. I looked because I was trying to find links for someone on FB too. Glad to be wrong.

Pedro B. Gorman

Dear Marguerita! I will reply in full later today, as i am on lunch break from work. But if you want to read another rant of mine regarding Encanto kerfuffle it is between Ian Gazzotti and directly below your post which to two replies from Tammi L. Would love to know your opinion on my thoughts expressed there. We will talk later my darling, in a rush now! Much LOVE. Your words moved me deeply and deserve a loooooong reply! Perhaps we should move to Shadowbox at some point? But post your thoughts on my Encanto post here, as it’s relevant to the discussion! :) Bye for now! LOVE YOU!

Oliver

I started reading all the comments but couldn't finish reading all of them. So it might be that others already wrote the same, if so, I apologize. I'm convinced that it's _always_ better to try and clear things up, but that doesn't mean you have to answer to every single accusation, let alone abuse. But you don't have to, you have us. But because even your patrons don't always remember all the details and answers of past rumors I'm certain that it's "time to write one big essay called "Amanda Palmer clarifies all her kerfuffles, for the TikTok generation and anyone else who is interested"" and then let your fans spread it whenever it's time again to answer to those who bring up half-remembered stuff and rumors and try to convince the next generation of you being "bad". Help your fans putting stuff right and don't leave the public social media to rumors. (I'm not talking about changing the trolls' minds but about preventing rumors to keep on spreading )

EmVT

Amanda Eckert, I love the idea of posting a 'best of', count me in! I understand why posting responses to a list of grievances could be helpful for some of the issues (mostly the ones AFP already addressed), but where would the line be? Debunk every grievance no matter how small, no matter how personal, or misconstrued? Do other artists have to do this? Those would be my questions.

EmVT

Tammi L, I agree with a lot of / most of what you say. The hesitation I have is that I don't think an artist should have to have their calling card, the very first thing people see on their social media via pinned post, be an apology/debunk explainer for a list of grievances--some from people who are largely not acting in good faith (some may even be getting paid to troll her). I'll bet many artists, especially female artists, have people saying all kinds of things about them. How do others handle this, I wonder? I do think the issue Amanda already dealt with via the following link (the one where she explained why the comments remain behind patreon at the top of the post) is the most serious from my point of view. When I search on "amanda palmer race" both related posts are immediately under her wikipedia entry (which also links to Amanda's website), so they are very easy to find. https://blog.amandapalmer.net/race-compassion-community-ask-patrons-color-3/ ☮️

Gail

Oh, I totally forgot I could right-click and choose that option! *L* Thanks for the reminder. That makes things easier. :)

Tay

Hi Amanda. I am Black and Queer. 34. I love tiktok. It's one of the only places where I get to see other black and queer existing and creating. I was so excited to see when you joined. Your past racial insensitivity in your artwork was alienating. But it also exhausting to see you ask marginalized groups to educate you. Deprograming from white supremacy and colonization takes time and intention, but getting equity and inclusion coaching can help you get trained without adding additional emotional labor to people trying to exist in a system that's actively oppressing them. We are tired. Idk 🤷🏾‍♀️

Marguerita Tajibnapis

Hi Pedro Thanks so much for answering my reply - I wish it could appear in a string like in other apps. Anyway, I really appreciate your reaching out to me and reminding me of the Shadowbox. I’m sure I’m not alone in forgetting about it. I will check out what you wrote above. And my thoughts go with you and your mother. This is a tough but rewarding journey to accompany her on. ❤️ ☮️🕉

AKA Montresor

My partner is white, and relates to Luisa in Encanto as she also came from a big family with big expectations for each other. I don't get the appropriation remarks on this particular front....music is supposed to bring people together in spite of their cultures. If we can't find ways to bring our cultures together, then what's the point of having any? To further segregate ourselves from each other? Appropriation, imo, requires the intent to exploit for personal gain. I don't think you did this with Surface Pressure, and I don't think a lot of the people being abusive truly think so either. I think a lot of people are tired, hurting, and using the internet as a way to lash out at easy targets. I think that there is so much open racism and bigotry being flung around the net, that triggers get pulled before anyone even sees the target. I'm non-binary and I don't think you're transphobic, bigoted, or racist. I think you're an artist, and artists are provocative. That's the whole point of making art. I love you.

amanda hart

Honestly dust ups over cultural appropriation are just exhausting. You didn’t steal anything. You didn’t claim to create it or own it. You didn’t stop others from making their own covers. You were just inspired by art and made your own art. That’s how culture and art should work. When we travel, we come home with new ideas, new recipes, new art, new pictures, new architecture. We come home and integrate all that newness into our life. We expand our own understandings and hopefully other peoples too. If we walk off all culture that isn’t from our own background we don’t help other cultures. We don’t make the world better. We make it smaller.

Pedro B. Gorman

Dear Marguerita! Thank you SO much for your beautiful words! They make me feel like a Greek God on Mount Olympus, sipping ambrosia. Your love and appreciation merit the story of of how and why my writing went public, and how I ended up a proud Patron, beholden as much to Amanda as to this Family! As someone who is a former heroin addict—clean from THAT fucker since 2015; (though one who, admittedly, still struggles with on and off alcohol and benzo binges)—my writing only became public since the death of my father in November 2019, even though I had been practicing my craft in the closet for decades. After my father’s death, there was a curious string of coincidences which I wrote about extensively on Medium (here’s the link, if you wanna read; there’s music and spoken word pieces of mine in it: https://medium.com/swlh/on-love-death-and-change-a84cb5c2f33d?sk=6ede1ed2cc21449b93b8b37fd6ac1649 But I’ll summarize what I mean now for context. Two weeks after Dad’s wake, I drove a 500 mile round-trip north of Lisbon to go and see Amanda’s “Intermission” show in Braga, still not even having properly mourned. It was one of my father and mine’s favorite albums, with “The Ride” being his personal favorite. We bonded a lot over music and poetry. He may have been a terrible husband to my mother, but he was a father and a friend to me, and over the years, I managed to keep the two sides of him compartmentalised. The Braga, Portugal show was epic for me: not only because of Amanda’s fearless honesty and the quality of he music, but because it was at the time of this Guardian kerfuffle (the links are too long just google “Amanda Palmer on Twitter: the Guardian music editor just snubbed the most feminist album of my career”) where, again, much like now, she was simply roasted by all of Twitter & Press at large. Her absolute exhaustion, sadness and candor that night matched my own state of mind so exactly, even writing about it now brings tears of joy and catharsis to my eyes. And bang…something clicked that night: I became a Patron, bought the “Intermission” book off Alex, and then spent a few minutes with Amanda, talking about death, love and change, and then gifted her a poem I had written for her. Here’s the poem link on Medium: https://medium.com/the-lark/you-mother-creatrix-proceed-1799296bcc9c?sk=61ab645a9f00249b806de83f707a5b8c Shortly after, in January, I started writing regularly on Medium, as the Patreon 10$ tier at the time came with a free 1 month subscription to it. www.pedrogorman.medium.com A lot changed in me since then, especially the way I view my art, a feat I attribute in no small measure to having become a member of this community. As a matter of fact, a LOT changed in my life when I read “The Art of Asking,” and listened, repeatedly, to its audiobook as I was in outpatient rehab and struggling with relapses. Amanda’s voice hugged me through countless nights of insomnias and self-hatred; a gaping hole in me as if someone had ripped my soul out with barbed wire. Her art and voice were a balm. They still are. I was also further changed and supernova-inspired by her Ted Talk. My love and respect for Amanda is not recent, though; it goes way back to my first ever Dresden Dolls show at the Camden roundhouse in 2005, and I’ve been a fan ever since. I just wasn’t aware of the Patreon. I wasn’t aware of many things at the time, living in a drug-haze-seven-night-a-week partying routine during four mad years in London, working as an after-hours nightclub bartender in Soho. It was wild, and very comedic, if not entirely healthy! I’m starting a memoir of my London years. You can Beta read it when it’s done, I’ll let you know. So, in a very direct way, I owe my sharing of words and personal essays, poetry—my very candor, in fact—to Amanda, which I personally thanked her for in a Crowdcast you might have watched or not, where I read her my poem, and she gifted me back a piano improv she called “Soliloquy for Pedro.” (Incidentally, I was trying to find it to re-watch, but cannot remember which one it was, but it was shortly after her first birthday in NZ, I believe.) All this to say, Marguerita, that when people who, like you, or Amanda, or anyone here and not here thank me for, or appreciate my writing, honesty, music, or personality-at-large, it more than moves me; it inspires me to KEEP writing, KEEP practicing, and one day, hopefully soon, manage to FINALLY earn a damn living from writing alone once I get my act together in that respect. So, from the sinuous depths of my soul: thank you. (And by the way, speaking of my London years, if you’d like to beta read a gay romantic comedy novel I ghostwrote, but which the editor who commissioned it ended up not using—bearing in mind it is still in second draft form and needs much revision—send me your email by DM on Instagram or FB. My username is Pedro B. Gorman on both. I’m actually quite proud of it, though it’s not a genre I read due to the often terrible quality of its writing, but I bent the rules and made it my own—hence the editor not using it! I’m thinking of self publishing it.) Love, Joys & Other Such Toys! Yours, always, as ever, Pedro B. Gorman :)

Lana Lundi Claire

Hello. Good day to you, and thank you for the post. I wrote a book of a comment. No worries if this goes unread. Context of who I am, writing this response: I started listening to Dresden Dolls when I was in school– about 2009-2010. Just before the Kickstarter era. I was never able to make it to a show. Jump forward in time, adding on a lot of life experience, including a lot of trauma, and you made There Will Be No Intermission. That album helped me process quite a lot of terrible that had happened. The show was a revelation. It had a profound impact for me and everyone else in that room. I joined the Patreon. I joined the social media groups. And... while I appreciate the outpouring of love, the whole thing feels a bit off. It is hard to put into words. I write this as someone now who still truly appreciates your music and your art, but wishes that I hadn't tapped into that parasocial relationship. I don't think we would be friends in real life. And there is nothing wrong with that. It doesn't change how much I appreciate your work. But in a different world where we ran into each other without any of *this*, assuming I met the version of you that is presented in these spaces, it probably would not end with a deep long lasting friendship. Which, again, is just fine. I state that part to say, in so many words, I appreciate and respect your work, and I also will not be sycophantic in my response. Last bit of context - I am thirty. I am not Gen Z or one of The Youths who are Very Online (never call them "the youths", they would hate that, but the phrase "very online" means someone who is clued into the extreme nuance and references and knowledge and culture that only come with being fully immersed in different online sphere). I am a fairly online millennial. I am white. And, I guess I’ll add even though it isn’t terribly relevant to this response in any way, I’m Jewish. I’m a cis woman who is (mostly.. for purposes of clarity we’ll stick with this) straight. I am neurodiverse and also navigate chronic health conditions. So… that’s generally where I’m coming from. Okay. That part is done. --- From what I can tell as someone who glances at and sometimes reads through your posts, and who does listen to new releases readily and happily – you are someone that flings yourself out into the world with very little consideration. And there are pros and cons to that. The pros – you do achieve your image of extreme authenticity, thorns and all. People seeking that energy flock to it. The cons – for those that either don’t resonate with that vibe or who do but see it lacks in tact and consideration, you come across as disastrous and cringe. Those are the two words I see most often from people who like your work but not enough to join the patreon – literally statements like “Amanda Palmer puts out good work sometimes, but she is a disaster of a person” or “it’s just really cringe.” Take, for example, Drowning in the Sound. That is a beautiful song that fully conveys desperation and a sense of urgency and helplessness in a Very Online world while tangible travesty strikes. It’s wonderful. I adore it. …..and it’s inception was the rather online reckoning of a white artist appropriating and mocking Black culture as part of a music video. A reaction to that “insanity.” Learning that was the origin of the song broke it for me. Yes, the online discourse was severe, and it was spiraling out of control – that part was true. But there was a lack of understanding that, culturally, we as a whole were reaching a breaking point where it was no longer acceptable for white artists to appropriate and/or mock Black people – for purposes of entertainment, or at all. One white artist took the fall. There was a lot of virtue signaling. All of that was worthy of critique. But the general attitude when reading about where this song came from seemed to brush aside the very real deeply embedded pain that comes from this kind of built in racism. You seemed unaware. And you seemed oblivious to that lack of awareness. It’s clear that you make attempts to understand and learn, but that general attitude of obliviousness whilst continuing to fling yourself out as part of this business of authenticity follows you in a cloud. What’s more – this song demonstrates you clearly are aware of online culture. You wrote a song about the current culture being one of castigating public figures for perceived infractions, especially racist ones. You see what online discourse is like in general. You know we live in a culture where past sins are dug up and hurled at a perceived offender – justifiably or not. And yet – you flung yourself into a new space populated by the very young people who are most likely to do this without caution or care. It's kind of like touching a hot stove top and then being surprised and angry when your hand is burned. --- Moving on to Surface Pressure. I like Surface Pressure. I think it is a good cover. I think that it very much fits your brand – take a very emotional work, and amp the emotion and authenticity up to 11. Apply your own personal lived experience. And let it fly. (This worked beautifully for the Blurred Lines mashup, btw – that one gets me every single time and is an absolute marvel. I also think that the tiktok posted of it jumps right to All Of The Emotion and misses the quiet subtle build, going straight to the reveal and the catharsis, and that turns it into a farce in that little snippet. But I digress.) Surface Pressure is a song from a movie musical created by an insanely powerful monopoly that doesn’t actually probably care about the people it is trying to represent. They are a heartless corporation manufacturing pathos. It’s what they do well. The people involved in that specific project, however, seemed to care. Lin Manuel Miranda is a treasure. And it seems that they really tried to create a project that represented the traumas and expectations experienced by the youngest generations in migrant families – specifically Latino families, even more specifically in this case Colombian families. The song Surface Pressure can absolutely be applied to other real world lived experiences – such as being a parent who is parenting solo in a strange place while trying to maintain a career without the support of family all while trying not to lose their mind. But. It is originally about the pressure felt by the oldest sibling in a family to take on the brunt of expectation. Even more so in a first generation family. More specifically a Latino family. Even more specifically a Colombian family. A lot of people saw themselves in that character on a level that was greater than the emotional burden. They saw their familial bonds. Their history. Their very specific lived experience, not adapted to other situations. And when those young people who saw themselves in it go online and see a middle aged white lady apply it to her struggles, they might justifiably guffaw at it and say, hey, why are you – this class of person who I can assume will steal things that are meant for me and make it their own – stealing this thing and making it your own. Again, I personally think your cover of Surface Pressure is good. And I understand what you were doing. But I am also a thirty year old white lady. And I also see why the target audience for the original would be upset at a work being robbed of its original intent – especially when it was an intent that was not specifically for older white people, even if we see ourselves in it in some ways as well. --- Onto the crowdcast of Surface Pressure - This was not specifically asked for, but it highlights some of the points above. I watched the crowdcast of Surface Pressure. And… I honestly felt… distanced from the whole thing as a result of watching it. This ties into your persona as an artist that flings their whole self out into the world. The business of authenticity. You are an artist with, quite literally, decades of experience in your chosen field. You proudly proclaim over and over that you know what you are doing, you cultivated your expertise and skill. And yet. You comport yourself as an awkward and oblivious young adult in their early twenties. Shocking and laughing at crude humor that kind of stopped being funny decades ago. Feeling the need to comment on outfit of choice to state This Is Who I Am This Is My Identity instead of just, you know, wearing it. It all feels very I Am Young And Forming My Vision Of Myself And I Do Not Know The World Yet. Like a kid living on their own for the first time surrounded by equally lost kids. ..but you do know who you are. Or, at least the version of yourself that you put out there for your patrons. Your brand. You’ve been doing this for a long time. It’s just a strange disconnect. But that is okay. That is one small thing. There is an art to actually being perceived as authentic in online spaces. It takes a lot of work. Where it treaded into disrespectful was the actual song. I know this is a business of authenticity. But you did not have to do a crowdcast of a song you had not practiced. You could have done nothing. Or played literally anything. Or said, I don’t have this ready to be played on only a piano yet, but I would be happy to play these other songs for you. There was not reason you had to incorporate that level of unprofessionalism – as a touring artist who knows what they are doing – into this outpouring of authenticity. There was this innate assumption that because we are patrons who value the imperfect that literally not being able to do the thing you were there to do was reasonable. But like… it is hard to maintain respect for an artist who gathers thousands of people for a show they literally have never practiced. Then it became insulting. Earlier in the cast, someone asked what your inspiration was, which you read out loud as a question. Yes, we all know this isn't a great question. But later in the cast - you began mocking that question. That literal patron. Deriding that question and how horrible it was. Putting down one of the people who isn't a professional interviewer who asked that question and is literally funding you. Then it treaded into uncomfortable. I will preface this with a little bit more context. Some of the most unhealthy work environments I have ever been in were the ones where my bosses broke down the walls between Employee and Friend – and in some cases, family. You are a professional artist with decades of experience under your belt. You have a *lot* of fans who want to be your friend. You wield a certain amount of power in the relationships you have with people who are also your fans. So, should you choose to hire one of them, you need to take extra care and consideration. Even if they say it is fine. You are the one with the power. You found fans and hired their (adult) child, another fan, a very young person without a ton of life experience. The relationship moved from one of Person Who is Adored : Fan to one of Employer : Employee. Okay, that is possible, with care and consideration. Never taking for granted this person would likely do for you things they would not do for other employers due to the pre-existing dynamic and charged emotion that existed in that space. Then – and this is all from the perspective of what I can see, but this is what I was picking up – you moved that dynamic from Person Who is Adored : Fan to Employer : Employee to Friend : Friend. …all maintained simultaneously. There is a power imbalance in the first where the person with less power is less likely to compartmentalize or protect themselves, but the odds of them ever being close enough for that to matter are low. There is a power imbalance in the second where the person without power is inclined to protect themselves and look out for their own best interest – but they are now close to the Person Who is Adored, so they might be less likely to do that. But there is at least still some professional detachment. There should be no power imbalance in the third – walls and barriers are broken down between friends, everyone is on an equal footing. Except everyone isn’t. Because of the pre-existing dynamics. And that person without power is now ready and willing to let their new friend (and employer) all of the way in without protecting themselves because they are a fan. All of this is possible to do without anyone being hurt or used. But it takes ***So Much*** care and consideration. And watching that crowdcast….. it doesn’t seem like that is in place. The good – you are providing a platform for this person to get their work out into the world. That is pretty cool. They get to work with one of their idols. And they get a job. That is all great. Hopefully it is all a good experience. But when Aura sat down and casually mentioned their rape on camera, you did not take any steps to protect them in an online space. (Which makes sense as someone who seems to be completely oblivious to the harm online spaces can do to people ??????? despite your history ???????). You put them in front of the camera and “played a game.” You said that the game was to answer a question completely honestly and fully, no holding back. And you asked them about where they were and what they were feeling when they wrote about their rape, setting a rule that they cannot hold back. And they did it. With full honesty and earnestness. They went back into that moment of extreme trauma and relived it for our entertainment at your request - they might have been okay doing that, but they might not have, and they should have been prepared for it. They don't have decades of learning to shield themself and only give as much as they choose to give. They followed your *perceived* example and flung their whole self from one of their lowest moments out into the void of the internet. A friend and employer and artist they adore and person who gave them a platform asked them to, after all. And! And. You would do it too! You would answer their question honestly and fully. Except when they asked you a question, it was about something you wanted to protect and hold close. And since you have decades of life experience in how to answer an interview question without giving away part of who you are to the adoring fans consuming your content – you knew how to evade. You answered exactly as much as you were comfortable providing and no more. You knew how to play the game. You wielded your power over them. And you protected yourself, and not them. How dare you. How fucking dare you. I am angry writing this, and nothing comes of writing in anger. And yet I am going to. You compose yourself as a lost youth. But you are not of that generation. You are a forty five year old woman with all of the experience that goes with that. And watching that crowdcast – you know it. You were wielding that power and experience. Yet maintain this image as someone lost. It is okay to be lost. We all are. But at a certain point in life, we have to take on awareness and consideration of others. Beyond general platitudes of “I care about you” and “I love you.” --- Final thoughts – When the world sees you, they see the projected authenticity and they see the cracks in it. It is extremely difficult to be as openly present and authentic online as you are without letting the imperfections of who we are slide through. They see the extreme power imbalances and lack of truly internalizing lessons of systemic issues and power imbalances. They see a white woman who has experienced a lot of trauma pouring that pain and strength out into the world – without protecting anyone who doesn’t fit her demographic. I truly believe you are sorry about past infractions. I truly believe you are working to learn and internalize this grand reckoning of white supremacy and power dynamics and everything of that ilk. But in the mean time…… Hire someone to vet your work before you put it out into the world. I don’t recall the official term, but it might be something like Risk Assessor or something like that. There is a lot of nuance in online spaces that will take more than just earnestness and one person who is Gen Z to wade through. You’ve got a lot of patrons and plenty of funds that come from that. If you truly want to broaden your audience into new spaces, hire someone who can actually help you do that without blowback. Protect the people around you. Perhaps take more care to not blow through the world with such single minded force, taking anyone in your path with you into the spotlight. Just for the love of god be more thoughtful. You are the experienced professional you say you are. Please. Work some of that into the image you craft for yourself online. Or you are probably going to keep inadvertently taking advantage of people or obliviously sweeping right past the people you unknowingly harmed – with your art or your work or anything. This is a very imperfect comment and it is very long. I unfortunately do not have the time right now to go back and edit it. I am going to add once again that your work truly does mean a lot to me and has made a positive powerful impact in my life. Thank you for your consideration and for asking for feedback. Take care and be well.

Lou

This is very insightful and well put. Thank you for taking the time to write this comment, it personally gave me a lot to think about. Truly one of the most nuanced and helpful analysis I’ve gotten to read.

Teresa Toro

Thank you so, so much for these words. I missed this comment when I did my insomnia-fogged reading at 4AM (not a good idea, reading and commenting on such a heavy subject in such a condition – I shouldn't have done). Your words much more clearly articulate what's been on my mind and in my heart. Thank you again.

Teresa Toro

I feel every word here. And I agree, and think it was needed. Thank you for this.

EmVT

Hi Lana, your post contains a lot of solid advice, I wanted to add an observation here that may be relevant to the discussion, about the difference between law and ethics. By the way, old white lady here, a few years older than Amanda, and only recently 'discovered' her work, when Lucy Lawless interviewed her last year. Have been a patron for around six months or so. For the Blurred Lines cover, I recall Amanda was not initially going to release the song outside of patreon, out of an abundance of caution about the legalities of using the songs. After patrons requested it, she did the work to vet the song and release it, and I think it helped a lot of people. I want to point this out because I think it's fair to acknowledge Amanda does try to have consideration for the impact of her actions. However, there is a big difference between law and ethics. Even law can be hard to interpret, but ethics is even more of a moving target. I think a number of the issues raised in this post are in the realm of ethics, I don't know if you would agree. Most organizations develop an ethical code of conduct and a charter, and this may be something Amanda could consider paying someone to help her develop as a de facto business owner. This would demonstrate a commitment to ensuring alignment with her actual values, and the kind of experience she clearly wants her community to be for people--I think Amanda does deeply care about her work, her team, and connecting with and helping people (from reading your post I think you mostly agree). Regarding the reaction to the Surface Pressure cover, the level of sustained hostility and contempt leveled at Amanda over it on multiple platforms is unreasonable. Maybe this is about differences in what people of different generations consider ethical. I'm not on TikTok so maybe I don't understand how it works, why her version of the song could be perceived as taking any air whatsoever out of the room for the prior version of the song. I had never heard of the song or seen the movie before Amanda's cover. To me, it's just a song. As you rightly point out, context matters, so maybe in the eyes of some it's unethical to even say something like 'it's just a song'? The idea that adding a new version steals something from people who like the old version better, even if they see it as a kind of personal anthem with deep personal meaning to them, is something I'll have to keep looking at to understand. The n word issue is not even on the same planet as the Surface Pressure cover from my point of view. Thanks for writing your post, all very well said.

Sabrina

I’m in my 40s, read the art of asking before ever listening to your music, and I spend a LIT of time on TikTok. (I also got to see you in concert during your tour right before Covid and it was hands down the best live performance I’ve ever seen.) I spent an evening going through the tiktoks created about why you’re terrible and my biggest takeaway was that, as often happens in parts of that platform, some creators “discover” old information and the outrage spreads like wildfire. It’s almost like a contest. It happens all over the app, all the time. Fans of those creators then go to the source of the rallying cries - the person they believe deserves a pile-on of righteous indignation - and then they pile on. For best reasons or for the joy of indignation… And there are tons of older people in TikTok communities. I watched “this is why this person I just heard of named Amanda is terrible” tiktoks and the overwhelming majority was in the younger age bracket. If you’re asking about whether it’s time to write the big essay, I’d say yes. Or a collection of small pieces (better, I think) that can be linktree links. Posting one TikTok acknowledging the criticism and especially the criticism that you haven’t given proper explanations for past kerfuffles, then moving on - that’s be TikTok appropriate. I’d really really hope you stay on and keep posting there, but don’t deep dive in comments especially for a while. Interact with content you live from other creators. The TikTok algorithm is pretty awesome. It takes some time to find your people on there, but when you do, it’s awesome. Really, really beautiful. Hate parties pop up and fall apart again all over, but the love, the “I thought it was just me but look 10,000 other people resonate with this too” is not to be missed. (Typing this on my phone and it’s way more difficult to format than I expected.)

Amy Hardingson

A lot of what you've said here I would roughly agree with, except the kimono point. The history of Japanese concentration camps during ww2 for people of japanese heritage in America is a history not taught or spoken about enough. As a result of this experience huge numbers of Japanese Americans changed their names and literally burned all items that connected them to Japan to try and protect themselves from racist attack (many communities had literal bonfires of heirlooms). This is the reason why kimonos being worn outside of the community might land differently in diaspora to people living in Japan. But even within Japan Kimono is an item to be worn with respect. This is the biggest issue in general with people playing dress up with other cultures - so much of the context and history is missing. When people play without taking time to learn what they don't know they cause harm, or worse, perpetuate harmful stereotypes.

Rose Cooper

I didn't see the crowdcast but I'm not sure I would have picked up on all that. Thanks for all you wrote, this is a next level comment that covered a lot of ground. The topic of parasocial relationships is definitely one that needs to be brought up in everyone's life whom is very online, as you say, but it also definitely needs to be brought up in this space, as this community is strong and complex - and it's so hard to maintain individual's safety. I used to frequent the FB groups when I first joined the patreon at the beginning. And while it seemed like a friendly space (and I needed it at the time) I also realised it had the capacity to inhale me and spit me out if I wasn't careful. So I dropped off. I made at least one friend for life in that group though and I think it's a great thing to have these spaces. But not everyone in these groups, are 'very on line'. And there in lies the rub. As for the observations of Amanda within this power structure...I have no doubt she's acting from a place of care and love, but as the saying goes, The Road to Hell is paved with Good Intentions. This is a fascinating topic.

Ian Gazzotti

As I said, I think that both sides have their reasons. I know about the interment camps, and how awful they were, and I understand how that shaped Japanese-American opinions on appropriation, but the counterpoint is that America is not the whole world. Since something awful happened in America, then no one in the world is allowed to wear a kimono? Or is that only white people, or only white Americans? Is there a statute of limitations after which we can reexamine these boundaries, or is it set in stone forever? Is the fact that Japanese stores in Japan sell kimonos specifically for tourists harmful to Japanese people elsewhere? There's also the fact that diaspora people tend to become different cultures or subcultures from the 'original' (which itself is changing, because no culture is static), so people from a country might take exception to Americans putting words in their mouth, even if they're the children of migrants. I'm half Pole, but born and raised in Italy in a very Italian environment. While I speak out against prejudices about Poles, I would not dare speak for the Polish people as a whole when it comes to many other subjects, because Polish blood does not make me culturally a Pole. Likewise, I get a bit miffed whenever something Italian-American is taken as 'authentic Italian' - at this point we're different cultures, despite our common origins - but it does not harm me in any way that, say, people think of pepperoni as a typical Italian product while it was invented in America in the 1910s. I believe there has to be a nuanced conversation on these topics that goes deeper than just knee-jerk reactions like "this cannot be done", and there needs to be a distinction between "this offends me" and "this is harmful" because they're not equivalent statements.

Fabian Zehner

Thank you for taking the time to compose such a long comment, which is rare as none of us has the time for doing things properly. But just everything is in-between other things we need to do. That's why my comment to your comment is only brief. ... While I appreciate your constructive tone in some parts, I must object. My _reading_ and interpretation of everything you describe (and I have watched the crowdcast, and watched parts of it several times by now) is just so different. And that is, in my personal opinion, what online communication is made up of. It is incomplete information. We are filling the incomplete bits by our own understanding / reading. Even with your long post, I still cannot address you in the same proper way I would be able to do in the real world. You might want to revisit your analysis and consider what you are assuming about Amanda, her life, her environment, what you actually do not really know. Just as one example, before I have to rush to the next thing I have to do, you interpret Aura's needs wrt their traumatic episode in quite a different way than I do. And how Amanda is handling this. In my brain (and again, that's not ground truth, that's *my* brain), Aura has written a song about this trauma, and the song was their first choice to be spread into Amanda's community. Their open mentioning in the beginning of the crowdcast of rapes sounded to me (again, *to me*) as if they themself is open about this. As considerate as your post was written, I will also find points that I agree with (e.g. imbalance of power in [also, parasocial] relationships). However. I want to raise. We are assuming a lot. Drawing inferences. And I have the feeling that the online world tends to assume bad things and jumps at disagreements rather than reinforcing what they like. So, what about assuming that other people tend to be good. And are doing the best they can. Instead of judging and judging and judging and judging and judging all day long. (Yes, I see how you were asked to give your opinion here and it was good analytical work, which I do appreciate. I guess my concern about the latter is a general one about how such discussions like the last week on TikTok evolve.)

Lana Lundi Claire

(This is a continuation of my book of a comment that I wrote last night. As if it wasn’t long enough. I didn’t realize that replies to one’s own comment go away. My bad. More people have replied to my comment since then that I did not address in here, and I can’t lose myself in endlessly editing this this morning to address all of your points. Suffice to say - Thank you Lou, Teresa, Francine Hibiscus, EmVT, Rose Cooper, and Fabian Zehner – I really appreciate it, I was quite nervous writing and commenting that. I hope that everything intended came across.) --- There were two last points I wanted to highlight. Again, please pardon this extended book - - 1. On professing love to your fans, and how that might be perceived by people who are not fans - It is very difficult to live up to an expectation of loving – truly loving – thousands to millions of people. It is an expectation that can never fully be met. In loving all of us collectively, we become that one mass collective. And individual need and nuance might be lost. I don’t love you like I love, for example, my sister, or my dearest oldest friends. I do love the contributions of your work and how they have impacted my life, especially the songs processing trauma. But you also don’t love me like you might love a family member or dear friend. The love you put out into the world is love for the people who support and sustain you – financially, emotionally, in whatever ways, but for the most part not on a personal deep level. Which is valid. It’s just tricky because they are two very different things that are described with the same word. It is a tall order to meet everyone’s expectation of the meaning of that word. And extremely draining. Hell – having your business quite literally be your life sounds exhausting and zapping of all of who you are on a level I would wish on no one. It takes a very specific kind of person to do it. …one who might be too tired or too drained or who sees the world in such broad waves to pick up on nuance, and who might not fully see people who live their lives differently. (on a public stage, or just, you know, differently in general.) Someone who does not see themself in the trauma you process openly and publicly and does not see themself considered might scoff at an open declaration of general love. They might not feel love from the world. Why would they trust you? I do see myself in the trauma, and I still don’t tend to welcome such broad platitudes from anyone. There are a lot of people and organizations that espouse love, throwing it out into the world. And a lot of them cause harm – see, for example, not all but many sects of the church. Words are not action. And once words are spoken, some might need action to break their skepticism – something more that might not exist in a way that is relevant to certain audiences or might not be visible on certain platforms. Suffice to say – going onto tiktok and just saying I love you to people who do not like you might not go over well. Even if it’s a sentiment expressed with good, genuine intent. It might come across as surface level, or disingenuous, or tuned out. Or as tone deaf. - 2. On cultivating a presence online, specifically on tiktok or twitter - There is value in this reckoning unfolding before us. I truly hope that all of us have the strength and fortitude and stamina to continue to dismantle the systemic structures that have harmed so many people for so long in our country and on a global scale. A lot of the criticisms that exist in online spaces might have initially been rooted in good faith critique. That doesn’t mean they stay there. We all have done something wrong, and the current culture is one of tracking that down and broadcasting the receipts. I don't condone it. Picking out a villain of the moment to dogpile and deride is vicious. And it serves the companies hosting social media sites as a provider of cruel glee in the name of “doing right” more than it actually fixes the problems of the world. …that said, I also want to recognize that the people engaging in this dogpiling very well likely are acting on a very real, deeply engrained pain or hurt. At a systemic level. Traumas built into generations of people, wounds so expected they almost aren't discernible. It doesn’t excuse it. But it does explain how that pain could be exploited for profit in online spaces and people could be churned up into behaving this way. All while the real issue is not addressed. As one content creator put it – it’s just squeezing more blood out of the same stone. (The real problems still need to be addressed.) There are a lot of content creators in the world who have fallen to this culture of extreme reckoning. Seemingly good, thoughtful people have faced endless harassment and true harm as a result. (I don't want to name names, but some of the most astounding people have been driven off of the internet for far less serious infractions.) They try (or tried) extremely hard to be mindful and assess risk in the spaces where they made their living. They have put a lot of time and effort and care and resources into walking the tightrope of being an online presence. They have faced horrible abuse. Their personal lives and well-being have been threatened – and, in some cases, ruined. They also for the most part do not or did not have the resources that a bigger name artist has. That was their only option to stay in their field. Wishing the world was not this way does not change it. Only persistent, mindful work does. Please – as someone who has the resources to truly be cautious and mindful with what you post into new, unfamiliar spaces, populated by an audience you do not fully grasp, use those resources. And if it isn’t for you, don’t let it destroy you. You have your base cultivated already. --- Those are my last two points. ….I cannot help but mention how absolutely bizarre it is that I, a complete stranger to you, am sitting here critiquing your whole literal life and business. It feels like a breach, albeit one that was asked for. I feel that I am overstepping in trying to cover so much. At the end of the day, this is your life, and I am a spectator. Once again – take care. I do not love you, but I do hope the best for you. Please be well. And thank you for your consideration.

EmVT

Fabian, I agree with you about the nature of text-based discussions making it difficult to have longer, more complex conversations. My impression on the crowdcast was also that Aura was on board with discussing her song. My attention was divided since I was working on something, and didn't pick up on the thread that Lana described, at all. As you point out, we necessarily make a lot of assumptions, and who is to say how Aura felt, other than Aura? Lana's argument is, I think, that we may never know how Aura really felt if she feels too intimidated to say. That's hard to argue with, it seems to say that whatever Aura says, Amanda was still wrong--and that's worth examining. I have a feeling Amanda was trying help Aura by sharing what has helped her over the years, and she was also responding to positive feedback from fans on 'behind the scenes, shoot from the hip' type broadcasts. One way of looking at it, and there are many, is that we all can share part of the responsibility for any damage done to Aura, and Amanda, around Surface Pressure. I agree that Amanda is ultimately responsible and in charge, but I think she can only take responsibility for things that actually happen. Not what may or may not have happened, or someone said happened, but then it turns out that's not actually the way it was. I think Amanda is an easier target than other people for a variety of reasons (she's female, she's unique...). I think she tends to get more criticism than she deserves, more than others in her exact position do--which is not to say she's perfect (who is?) but she's very open to feedback. In threads above, she's even criticized for not asking for feedback correctly, give me a break, but I know she will take even that seriously.

Anthea Peck

Honestly, we all see things through our own lens. This song seemed SO much to me like anthem for women, I was surprised when folks piled on re: race. But, I’m a white woman.

Misty Prostko

I think I was contemplating my support and patronage for a while. The shadowbox helped me a lot with that. I think these criticisms are valid. I love you so much, whatever you need to do for you and your kid right now. I am also under 40 and very active on tiktok (I’m 17 and dunno if you’re aware of my existence) and I’ve gotten a lot of hate for replying and commenting on your posts. I’ve had to stop, because I overthink everything and just typing this and tagging you in things makes me anxious. Tiktok is extremely TOKcix. There have been videos surfacing if people dying, terrible traumatizing things. I hate and love tiktok at the same time. There are so many other people we need to hold accountable as well. Rae and I have talked about it before, and we do agree it needs to be addressed. Thank you for letting us know that it will be addressed. I love you, I love everyone here.

Taya Hastings

Hmmmm... It's very difficult for me to get out everything that's in my head and that I want to say. There's just so much here to unpack, and I'm not sure I have the time or the headspace to unpack it all right now. That said, let me jump right to Surface Pressure, as that is the easiest one to address. No, I do not think you did anything wrong by covering it. However, I'm neither a POC nor a minority in any way. As a result, my opinions on the matter may not jive with others' opinions. What I DO know, however, is that there have been an endless amount of people/bands covering that song since its release. Most of the ones I've seen aren't POC, either. It doesn't seem as though they are getting the same level of rage and vitriol thrown their way that you are. I think that's an important point. I think YOU are receiving the brunt of that because you're one of the more famous people who have covered it. You're the easiest target - the biggest punching bag. And I feel that's unfair. I try very hard to be, as Ibram X. Kendi puts it, an anti-racist. In my youth (I'm 37 - no, 38 as of yesterday, sorry), I wore braids and conrows and loved the look. I think there's even a picture floating around of me somewhere when I was kid (and still mostly dressed by my parents, I might add) wearing a confederate flag shirt. (I was born and raised in Alabama.) But, once we know better, we do better. I'd never be caught dead in anything with confederate flags on it, and though I love the look of cornrows and braids, I no longer wear them. However, I have POC very close to my heart who laugh at that. They think me choosing not to wear my hair in a style that I love because of cultural appropriation is silly. THEY don't see it as cultural appropriation at all. Does that mean it isn't? Because my black friends say it isn't? Of course not. I say all that to say that it can be hard in today's culture to know what is cultural appropriation and what isn't. I genuinely believe my friends when they tell me, "We don't care if you wear cornrows. Here, I'll do them for you!" But that doesn't mean someone else who sees me on the street wouldn't take offense. So where do we draw the line? Do we listen to our friends - our patrons - when they tell us our hair - our Surface Pressure cover - is fine? Or do we we give up every single thing that was put out, made famous, or endorsed by someone who isn't our race? I don't know. I honestly don't. Sometimes, it's easy to know where the line is. I'm white. That means I don't say the 'n' word. Ever. Even if someone were to say, "We don't mind," I'd still know unequivocally that it's not okay. That's an easy line to see. I'd also never wear anything with a confederate flag on it again, even if people "didn't care." Because I know what it represents. It's the same reason I'd never go out in public with a swastika on my shirt. Again, easy lines to see. But something like covering a very popular Disney song... I just don't know. I don't see anything wrong with it. But maybe some people really do. Or maybe they don't and are just trying to cause chaos. Where's the line? What's true? It's so hard to know. In that respect, I think you're doing the best you can. You're asking for feedback from the people whose opinions matter. However, I don't think you can do that in a bubble. I know why you came here to do it. To get away from pure hatred and anger of the wider web at large. But you also have to understand that the people here ARE YOUR FANS. They're like my friends telling me they don't care if I wear cornrows. Even if every POC on your Patreon tells you that covering Surface Pressure was fine... does that mean it really is? Or is that simply a case of your fans loving your music enough not to see the bigger picture at large? I know that's not helpful. It doesn't really give you any answers - just more confusion - but that's also how I feel about it. I think, if you want honest feedback, you're going to have to get it outside this vacuum - this safe space you've created for yourself and for all of us. Because what you get here isn't necessarily going to be representative of what other POC really think. There's so much more I want to say, but it's hard to put everything into words, so I'm going to stop with that for now. I may come back later and address other points. But that's enough for now I think. Also, apologies for any errors, spelling, grammatical, or otherwise. I didn't have time edit.

Amanda Megan

I would just like to start off by saying that I really did enjoy your cover of "Surface Pressure" - especially that string arrangement - beautiful! I can understand the ire and frustration from POC communities though... I feel like there aren't many Disney movies that center around POC families and/or communities, if I was a part of that community and finally saw a film that captured me - I'd be protective of it as well.. not wanting white folks commandeering yet another thing and making it their own. I think we can identify with the characters, I know that as the oldest in my family, I certainly identify with Lusia and cried when I first heard that song... but maybe we leave this particular art, this Latinx centered piece of art, to that community. We can still enjoy it, appreciate it, and sing the soundtrack loud in the shower - but we let that community hold it a bit closer - if any of that makes any sense. I hope it makes sense. As for the rest of the TikTok stuff... I don't think it would hurt to take one of those "Why You should hate Amanda" lists and curate something that links to all the times you have addressed missteps. I've been with you for a long time now and I've seen the apologies and such along the way - others haven't and most young folks probably won't take the time to look for them. I think it's important to look at Gen Z from this perspective - they see cis white folks apology A LOT. And a lot of those times the apologies are not genuine, the person just does it because they feel they have to - look at people like Jeffree Star, Shane Dawson, Logan Paul, etc. etc. - these are the people for that generation that just issue apology after apology for their bad behavior (racism, abelism, etc.) and then just keep on going or keep doing the same thing. For those of us that have read your book and have followed your career for a long time, or had the opportunity to meet you in person - we know you are genuine and that you care! That you try to take the time to learn and do better. No person is perfect - what matters that is if you misstep - you listen, you research, you learn, and you grow - you don't continue to make the same mistakes and just keep on giving hollow apologies. I don't think that is you at all, Amanda. I'm 31 - I'm not as young as some of the younger folks on TikTok that are commenting or stitching videos. From what I've seen of TikTok Drama, it's hard to change the tide over there once the masses decide that they do not like you. This is not to discourage you from being on that platform, but honestly, it can be a nasty place. I've seen some of it from the different sides of TikTok I've been on. Best advice I can give - continue to listen, especially to the more constructive criticism. Sit with anything that may be uncomfortable and ask yourself why it is uncomfortable. Listen to the voices of those from marganizlied communities - hear what they have to say and why - but also do the work as well, read articles, books, watch videos, etc. As white folks, we should never ask POC people to do all the work for us - we are more than capable and plenty of POC folks have already done the work and it's ALL over the internet. I'm sending you so much love and grace, Amanda. I cannot wait for the day that you join all of us here in NY again!

Lou

Not a response to your comment, but wanted to wish you a happy belated birthday, Annie! 💕

Carell Casey

I’m trying to reach out to people in democratic countries to see if they could mention to intelligence that I seem to be unwittingly part of a crime scheme involving running identities parallel from birth which can be used by the criminals to do ID fraud, intellectual property theft, and fake location information while they are doing their crimes. At least one parallel identity is surely a Jan 6 style dangerous domestic terrorist that will be the next Timothy McVeigh if not stopped. Thousands of attempts to report have not resulted in me being included in an investigation or even giving a full report.

Kat

Hey! I am a big tiktok user. I saw it all happen and honestly, it's a hard spot to be in - I think addressing it isn't a BAD idea if you're ready to offer a sincere apology for the things you truly do wish had been done differently. I know that when an apology is given with a "but" or some sort of justification, it doesn't go well. And I think you'll also need to be prepared and understand that many won't forgive you. And also understand that... the internet is not great at nuance. There are a lot of people who will find fault with others just to be able to bully them "because they are a bad person" BUT it's also important to keep in mind that just because that happens sometimes, we can't dismiss all criticism. I know that some of the folks who saw your post ABOUT the tiktok kerfuffle were left with a bad taste in their mouth because it felt very handwavy/dismissive to see everyone brushing anything anyone said off as people just hating because they are young. Also seeing folks imply that gen z would be upset and shocked to discover you sometimes get naked and don't shave kinda.... felt out of touch because gen z, so far, seems to be the generation mostly in support of sex workers and bodily autonomy. As others have said above, it is kinda hard to get the court of tiktok to reconsider how they judge you. I think something like a masterpost where you address this kind of stuff could be very helpful, but I would urge you to have some folks who are outside of your bubble go over it as well because the people reading it WON'T know where you're coming from sometimes and you might be able to get some advice on how to get them to understand.

John Thurner

I'm going to stay out of the discussions of what is or isn't appropriation and all that, and just touch on the "Should I make an 'Amanda Addresses Her Sins?'" thing. Yeah, you probably should, but based on Lindsay Ellis's experience I'm not sure it will actually help a great deal. Those looking to find fault will find it regardless, and any apologies made will be dismissed as insincere and insufficient by those that want to be angry at you. Which, again, isn't a reason to not do it, but just a reminder to set expectations for the results to be low. We're all human, we all make mistakes, and the only thing we can do is try and learn from our mistakes and to avoid repeating them. In my eyes, you do learn and try to avoid them, which is why I still support you even when you make mistakes. Lord help us all if we're judged based on the worst mistakes of our past without the context of how we've learned and changed since we made them. If I was judged based on my mistakes alone I would be permanently shunned by society, and if I didn't learn and change and stop making those mistakes, I'd deserve it. Thankfully, my mistakes have all been well away from the public consciousness, so they're not something people can dredge up from the depths of the internet at will. I wish you well, and I hope you find a way to be at peace with the current kerfuffle, and all the ones that will arise in future as a result of being a public figure.

Kelly Welch

Hey Amanda, it looks like I might be one of the folks who Knows TikTok and is also behind the paywall, so I'll first say: there's basically nothing that will work. I know, I know, that's not how it should be. But every time anyone tries to do a well-intentioned apology and/or clarification, it's like the Streisand Effect in there. I can tell you right off the bat, there is no way TikTokers will read an essay. This is quickly-moving media and no one has the patience to go through it. Furthermore, no one will have the patience to go review all the previous responses to previous issues and see where things have been addressed previously. Maybe if an army of your fans (and I am NOT suggesting that) stitch EVERY video critiquing you with the receipts, that could make a dent. but I see two ways out of this, and two ways only: 1) Abandon TikTok. It's a bad platform for creators and absolutely exploits artists and actual data scientists have run tests in there about how quickly a new account would be exposed to radicalism in the form of the alt right or literal Nazis if left unchecked. It's a bad place, and I say that as someone who hangs out there: I wouldn't recommend anyone hangs out there. Or, 2) People are looking for stuff beyond the defense, stuff beyond "that thing you're talking about, I apologized and/or cleared it up ten years ago" or whatever. As at least one other comment I've seen here has said, people, especially The Youths, are fuckin' over apologies or things of that nature. They do not ring true anymore. There has been SO much drama on TikTok lately with white women and indigenous folks that I think everyone, even people who are in neither of those demographics, is just super over hearing anyone defend themselves anymore, and looking for any vulnerability in the defense to call out even more garbage (warranted or not) and it's just.. unenjoyable to watch, unenjoyable to know that people are sitting in front of ring lights having private conversations between themselves and an ex lover while broadcasting this intimate conversation to millions of TikTok users. See point one: TikTok kind of sucks ass to actually be on, full stop. However, what I don't think people are seeing enough of is meaningful steps of "what I am going to do to prevent feelings of hurt in the future." I say this with radical honesty: it seems like, historically, you Do A Thing, and then the Thing gets outside your immediate audience, and then the Thing gets received by people who neither understood the context of the Thing and/or who are genuinely hurt by the Thing, and the Things seem to be products of echo chambers and insulation from a plurality of viewpoints. I remember seeing on Instagram that you were planning to cover Surface Pressure, and my first thought was, "good luck with that, girl." Do you have anyone in your circle whatsoever who raised doubts about that? Do you have anyone who has spent hours on TikTok watching hundreds of women and girls with Latinx heritage talking about the specific significance of that song for them, how it represented not only their family's expectations of them as a sibling, but that there is a specific cultural context in which that expectation seems to be so much more intense than all the others? I find Surface Pressure to be a song that speaks to me as an older sister, and I do think it's fine to have art like this speak to us, but it very clearly is not for us, even if it's from a Disney film. The community that came up out of watching Encanto has the rights to that song, even if they aren't Disney, even if that's not what Disney expected or even wanted from that film. That's not our song. We have enough of art already, it's time to sit back and let everyone else take all they want. So, it is with that, I suggest that the next time an Idea for a Thing emerges, broaden the circle in which you seek feedback on whether the Thing is a good idea. Seek out voices from those communities. If you insist on using TikTok, ask TikTok to tell you their honest opinions about the proposed Thing, and then listen to and act on their feedback. Majority rules, with that one. Believe in the wisdom of the crowd. I can't even deal with this on TikTok right now, with all the people coming up and saying "I used to be a fan, and now I'm embarrassed to be, and here's why you should be, too," and reconciling that with everything you and your music have meant to me over the years. Quite literally, I was on the verge of a complete mental collapse and dug myself out of it with WKAP as the soundtrack. I met you at Occupy Portland. I think, I know, you are a genuinely compassionate person who doesn't mean harm to others, but there's just something that isn't clicking and it's making this situation repeat over and over and over again. Please, god, we're tired. I'm tired.

Angel Wright-Hughes

Oh, hi, it’s the exclusive under 40 crowd chiming in 👋 I haven’t seen Encanto and have no opinion on that exact matter. What I will say is that you clearly spend a lot of time thinking introspectively about how you can continuously grow and become a better human being. That quality alone is so important. Anyone who is truly racist/transphobic/etc isn’t listening to others or doing any work to be better. When I did skim the comments section on your TikTok video, it did not “pass the vibe check,” as is commonly said on the app.

Lana Lundi Claire

Thank you for this. I agree with your points. I would also add that there are means of doing a risk or threat assessment prior to putting a thing out into the world, and there are people that can be hired to do it. Stepping outside of the machinery of social media - not engaging with people within the platform - might be a good option.

Nick Tepe

I think Encanto in general is a really interesting cultural touchpoint right now, and I think your experience is reflective of just how vital that work is to what we are currently working through as a society. Not too long ago I made the comment in a group of friends that I thought Encanto hit a nerve right now because it can be taken as a pandemic allegory: a bunch of people who have various challenges working together stuck in the same house and bound together by a common history/trauma that they can't escape. But a Latinx friend immediately spoke up to say that you can't disegard how significant Encanto is to their community, because the multi-generational household depicted in the movie IS what they grew up with. So my statement about it being a pandemic allegory could be taken as cultural appropriation, however at the same time the allegory is still there. I think there's a similarity with Surface Pressure specifically, because so many women in my life have responded so strongly to that song because of how it can really be seen to represent how misogyny works across our society and as such speaks hugely to all women in our society, but it is also still at base part of this larger story that is a huge touchstone for the Latinx and Colombian communities. I generally dislike postmodernism, but when it works (and Lin-Manuel is a master of it) it creates art that can speak simultaneously but still truthfully to many different ways of viewing the world. I think that's what we're seeing in this case, where each segment who hears themselves in this song wants to claim it, but the art is bigger than any of that. I've seen a lot of the same sort of thing in all of your work, which is maybe why this has happened to you so much, but I don't know that it's something that needs an apology... maybe some way of acknowledging that all of these interpretations are valid, and it's important for us to understand as much as we can all of these viewpoints, but especially those of marginalized voices, as we engage with the work. There should be space for all of the voices, but that does mean for those of us who are White (and in my case cis-gender, hetero, male, etc), we do have an obligation to seek out and elevate voices that have been marginalized when we encounter them. Question for you: did you talk to Lin-Manuel at all when you were working on the piece? What did he have to say? And comment on "cancelling," another Patreon I support, Sarah Marshall's "You're Wrong About" podcast, did a GREAT discussion about cancel culture a little while ago, and I highly recommend it. It really gets beyond the surface issues about it and gets into what's really going on with this cultural moment. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/cancel-culture/id1380008439?i=1000524480233

Mike DiMuzio

So much happening. Sending hugs and brightness your way. I'm Only halfway through the entire post, and just wanted to say that I didn't vote in the poll, mostly because a)I support you and I trust your decisions to make the art you want and b) I didn't know there was a poll, which wouldn't have changed my support for your decision anyway 😂 The internet at large has a different lens to your music/art/being than your fans or even your patrons. Sometimes our hearts yearn to hear your take on a song. Our beings crave to deepen our connection to a work with a connection to an artist that, as patrons, we admire, respect, and resonate with. So we request a song, let's say "Cooling" by Tori Amos (just because the song is on my mind today). And Amanda Fucking Palmer says "you know what, I can fucking do this for you." And we take what you make and we are pleased, or amused, or, it's not for us and we've lost nothing. Our souls feel a little more whole and connected. Then the internet of tori fans with all of its misdirected anger says "who is this WOMAN to have the audacity take something I connect with and RUIN it" and they rekindle every attack they can find that someone else made and chuck it your way and then go have a meal and relish that maybe they made your day a little or a lot worse...but there are those of us who delight in the art you've made--a new connection to something already cherished, or maybe access to something that had no previous connection. Those vocal attackers' connection is to the possession they feel to the thing, rather than the art, and they lash out perceiving you as a threat to whatever they think needs their misguided protecting. Art is larger than the individual, but we feel it personally. ❤️

Lana Lundi Claire

Lindsay Ellis deserved so much better. Here’s to her and her exceptional work. I hope that she finds the anonymity she seeks now.

geek grrl

I don’t do tiktok because it doesn’t seem to me to generate anything beyond silliness. I am a woman of color and Latinx heritage. I am also older than the demographic of tiktok. I think the entire social media faux outrage and claiming or disavowing or cancelling is a waste of emotional energy. It harkens back to the days of internet trolls and being able to express whatever *your* thoughts are and screaming louder and louder because you could. Those who felt the cover was appropriated do not speak for me. Art and music shouldn’t belong along strict lines of my sandbox and not yours. I love covers, I love hearing different interpretations of the lyrics and music. Art is how we speak to one another soul to soul. How we can hear music and not understand the spoken language but understand the emotion. Surface Pressure resonated with people everywhere of all backgrounds (race,ethnicity,orientation, identification). Singing a cover is not appropriation. There is something brave and amazing about your willingness to try to address this. However, I would ask why? All any of us can do on any given day is walk through the world and try not to be assholes. Doesn’t work every day - and sometimes who we were and who we are trying to be now don’t align and that is ok. It is the human journey- the one we all get between birth and death. Trying to convince hordes of indignant internet strangers of your intention doesn’t seem like a soul enriching thing to do - but if it feels necessary- then ok. The world is exhausted- everyone is cracking - part of me thinks - with everything happening in the world - THIS is where you choose outrage? Social media could have been used for something better once upon a time, and on occasion, is harnessed for greater good, but more often than not, it is an outrage factory. There is a lack of compassion or empathy for the human beings on the other side. You can ignore the haters and put in your profile- links to your blog and say - already answered. Any dialogue is mostly disingenuous-the villagers with pitchfork groupthink lowest common denominator run rampant. To others earlier comments, it will likely be equivalent to spitting into a hurricane BUT - as always, you do you, but take care of yourself - don’t try to slay all the dragons yelling about all the things. A fan and I loved the cover - so there. ❤️❤️❤️

Lou

"Also seeing folks imply that gen z would be upset and shocked to discover you sometimes get naked and don't shave kinda.... felt out of touch because gen z, so far, seems to be the generation mostly in support of sex workers and bodily autonomy. " 💯THIS

Thomas Herlofsen

On our way to donate stuff to our Ukrainian refugees atm. Love you all. See you all in the Shadowbox, the friendliest forum in the universe ❤️

Heather Perriam

I just want you to know I think you are pretty awesome. I appreciate that you are listening to voices that may be negatively impacted by your cover of Surface Pressure as I would have never considered appropriation either - by publicly acknowledging the issue(s) and having the transparent discourse, there is an opportunity created for many more of us to consider the implications and impacts of our own creations. One day I will properly thank you for "The Art of Asking" and how you helped me learn to let people help me. You truly are amazing, Amanda. Sharing your authentic human experience like you do makes the world better. May you have the moments today to really appreciate the woman you are and love the unique combination of qualities you are made of.

Mx Afon

hey, I haven't read the article yet but I will. Things feel scary in the UK. I know its not as big as some other stuff but the government are doubling down on transphobia. Would you share the news about them not banning conversion therapy for trans people? I can see this car crash happening in front of me and there is nothing I can do to stop it. (More is going on than just conversion therapy). I thought 'you could tell Amanda'.

Annette Coates

Hey Amanda - I’m ancient in terms of social media (I’m 49) and know nothing of TikTok so can only comment on my own personal reaction to your Surface Pressure cover. It really resonated with me and I viewed it from my perspective as a woman buried under the heavy day to day burdens we all are. I liked it very much. In terms of appropriation I find it hard to see why it is an issue that you covered and celebrated this song as another patron had said above much more eloquently it shouldn’t exist in any strict sandbox of this is yours and that is mine. It makes me sad that people feel this should be the case. Sending you light and love x

Lana Lundi Claire

..on picking Cooling by Tori Amos Tori Amos paved the way for artists like the Dresden Dolls / Amanda Palmer. She openly sang about trauma and assault and her genuine experiences and pain and joy. Tori Amos' and Amanda Palmer's largely white femme progressive audiences of a certain generation or older likely overlap. Criticism of a cover of that song likely would not be rooted in any sort of critique of changing the meaning of the song that robs it of its original intent, or alters the core message or identity of the person who originally sang it. (Yes, it's tricky with a Disney thing, but still.) It's different, and it kind of misses the point.

Lou McField

Hey Amanda, I am a trans man and you seriously would be the LAST person I would think of being transphobic. To bring criticism to the table though: I think when you bring problems that concern women (like miscarrage, abortion) it can look like it concerns cis women (by the choice of words in songs etc) and can appear like trans men are out of the equation when we do go through the same things. I do know you are not doing this on purpose and you are a wonderful, loving human being who always want to do better. All this to say that it is possible to be more inclusive for the trans community and keep in mind that your patron community ALREADY makes me and other trans pals feel safe, accepted and loved. I actually rejoinded patreon just to show you support when it looks like you deeply need some right now. Will stay as long as it is needed and I always enjoy reading your posts. Love you Amanda. Lou (he/they)

Mx Afon

30, youth worker, white, I've actually been asking them about this (why is tik tok so mean!?) Also about right trans, I know your not transphobic. I know why people claim you are (basically the song sex changes) and I know it's bullshit. I think there is a culture , particuarly with the younger generation to 'do the right thing'. People who are not affected by appropriation, are weighing in to protect others and do the right thing, in a really shitty way. You asking people who are actually affected 'is this ok'? 'did I get it wrong' seems to be the right way to have this conversation. I loved surface pressure. It broke through to me, it helped me release a side of my emotions I put in a box since 2020. But my opinion doesn't matter here, and if you fans who it actually effects come back and say 'this was not a good choice' I respect that, and we should all respect that.

Megan Costello

Up front, I'm pakeha, and I'm so sorry you've been receiving so much negativity for a performance of a great song that obviously brought you so much joy and myself and my daughter who thoroughly enjoyed it. I really don't think Lin or the Encanto cast would GAF, I don't think they put it out there for only POC to listen and engage with. FFS it's Disney, therefore it's for everyone to engage with???? I don't know. I'm over 40 so might have blinders on, but there's probably a lot more oppressive shit happening than you recording a Disney song... I mean, is anyone getting shifty about the Japanese version of we don't talk about Bruno??? No. You're doing the right thing by being introspective, but keep making beautiful art that brings you joy. There's enough pain and hurt out there that we need every little bit of joy

Pearl Howell

I am an "old" fan, having fallen in love in 2008 when finishing high school, and I've listened to your music at least once a week since then. And like an old friend, I don't pay much attention to rumors that come from places that don't know you, don't know your work, haven't read your book or blog. What do they know? I know I don't know you in real life, but I know the art you've put out, the music, the writing, and I know that none of it has ever made me think of you as racist, or transphobic, or anything along the lines of the deluge of comments coming your way. I am a white American woman, so that does temper the content of my comment here, and I am interested to read what others have to say, but I wanted to throw in my two cents, because it feels safe to do so here. I also want to say that Encanto is a Disney movie. If your cover is appropriation, then Disney making lots and lots of money off of movies based on characters from a wide range of races, ethnicities, and backgrounds, is what? Should they not make movies about other cultures because it's appropriating? Where do we go from there? Back to a world of Disney movies about Western European white princesses? I'm not sure. I'm not offended when a person from another culture covers an Appalachian folk song (my own cultural heritage) and am in fact delighted when something I love comes forward in a new light, to a new audience, to find new meaning both to me and the world. But again, just a thirty-something white American with a lot of privilege speaking here.

Pedro B. Gorman

Dear AKA Montresor, Thank you so much for this! Your comment it totally in line with what I think. I already wrote a bit on not getting the appropriation thing, as I see appropriation in much the same light as you. “Triggers get pulled before anyone even sees the target”: so, so, so true! that music is supposed to bring people together, yes! absolutely beautiful! About Art: again, yes! And About Amanda, absolutely, I love her, and she knows that. But now I love you too, AKA Montresor! :)))))))))

Monica Torres

This, exactly! Sums up almost everything I feel about this reoccurring issue. Thanks for your words!

Lana Lundi Claire

...if there's any sort of receipts essay, please make sure it is proofed by people well outside of your bubble, with no emotional connection to you. Depending on the tone, it might go well, but it could go very, very wrong. (....also, it seems that it isn't that you covered Surface Pressure - it was possible to do that - it's how it was covered and presented on this platform. And that opened the floodgates to broad scrutiny of all past issues. As is the way of these platforms.)

Jessica Dillon

Hi Amanda, I'm a former patreon who has come back because I was a little worried (hope you're okay.) I will say, as a long time fan (2009), I think a central list of kerfluffle responses would be helpful. You can produce so much content that even I hadn't seen the post about the n-word (and I had always wondered.) Of course, some will point to it and say - well, if she's had so many kerfluffles clearly she's problematic, but there will always be those unwilling to accept personal growth in the public sphere. If you preface it with the messages above - I am learning and growing, I think that's a positive thing to put out into the world and for the tiktok generation to see. And as a white person, it's not for me to say if it's cultural appropriation. I will say I've appreciated having a beautiful version of a song expressing what we're all going through right now.

Lana Lundi Claire

..this comparison right here likely would not go over well. It's not that it's right or wrong - that is its whole own discussion. It's that it's tone deaf.

Naomi Twietmeyer

This comment is simply to say: I admire the hell outta you, your work, the team and the community you have inspired. Thank you for holding space for us within your boundaries.

Len Tower Jr.

a, the long comment that got deleted had these points: social change is a long process that takes hard work by many people doing community, political, etc. outreach. it includes building bridges, not walls to other people. recognizing all you share with them. after that where you disagree, then find out why they feel that way. & share why the change is needed for you & those you care out about. raging on social media is a very bad tactic to try to change other people. love, len

Fiona MacPherson

I don’t often comment as I often am overwhelmed by it all but today I have a small window of clarity and strength to do so. I am not a POC but I loved Encanto and felt that I really appreciate the depth of meaning within that song. Are we appropriating when we sing or dance to a song written/performed by a POC? I don’t think we are if we have taken the time to watch, listen and feel from our own perspective the depth of that musical creation. Giving due respect to where it comes from and acknowledging the creator or performer and knowing that our own interpretation can only ever be our own & not theirs. But when I really strip it back, all I really want to say to you is, keep going. It is important, it is explorative, it is creative and ultimately, it is art.

Ingrid Nordbø

Hi Amanda I 'm still pretty new to your Patreon, though I've been following you on Facebook for a while. And so I'm a bit like "I don't feel entitled to enter this conversation, that's for REAL fans". So thank you for teaching me through your writings to overcome that instinct (born of insecurity(. I'm white, cis and able-bodied, so my views on the controversies (?) you mention are of limited value, I guess, but even so, I just wanted to say that I found your version/rendition of Surface pressure painfully good. It's already a song that hits me like a kick in the stomach sometimes, and you added even more dimensions to it. Thank you for creating, for inviting to conversations and communication. Please take care.

honor ash

len, was it my comment that got deleted? i came to read new ones, and now i can't find it.

Logan England

As a White transman, I'll not speak to the cultural appropriation stuff, that's not my lane. As for the song Sex Changes, and the cries of racism. I don't want to be the old guy who yells about kids on his lawn, but I think that each new generation loses the context of where the generation before them came from. When we know better, we do better. But I think our kids believe that we had access to all the knowledge and understanding that they themselves have. They can't fathom how small our worlds were before the internet. The only trans woman I saw on any media until I was 30 years old was Roberta, the character played by Jon Lithgow in The World According to Garp. So when the younger folk say that all trans parts should be played by trans actors, that is true NOW, but 20 years ago? Find me a trans actor who could even get an audition. TikTok is not built for context. It gives you 30 seconds to proclaim the absolute truth with no history, no explanation. So, you did some things in the past you would never do now. I grew up in the deep south where the N word was casually used all the time, and no one telling us it was wrong. Now I know that no White person should ever speak that word, for any reason, period. End of story. I think you know that too. I would consider adding a disclaimer to the video of Guitar Hero about why you changed the lyrics. Put it on the video, the liner notes of the physical media. Ask everyone who has put the video up of the songs with the offensive word to take it down, or post on it saying you know now that using that word is wrong. Yes, that's going to be a level fuckton of work. But it's worthy work. Same with Sex Changes. It's a snapshot of the world we used to live in, but its time has passed. I would pull the video. And while it's a gross, disheartening amount of work to do all of that, I think you might feel better for it. Ultimately, try not to be too upset about the outrage. You did the best you could then, and you do the best you can now. The things we say and do now might be met with equal disgust and horror in 20 years. We don't know what we don't know. Just keep trying, and hope it's enough. The outrage will move on to the next video in no time.

honor ash

if it was (and i still can’t find my comment so i think it must have been), my main point was actually that most of these knee jerk reactions come from fear, and a desire to protect other people. and that it’s not possible to change others or do the hard growth for them - they have to seek it. sorry if it was too tough or personal to stay. i kept a copy of what i wrote because it helped me to write it.

Jessie West

I'm 33 and active on TikTok (scrolling, at least, I don't really make content). I'm so sorry that you're dealing with it's Kerfuffle. I think there are good discussions being had that are unfortunately being drowned out by the barfight that is the comment section. Honestly, I think it might not be a bad idea for you to put together a big essay clarifying things. People/fans have heard about you, come to you from all over the world, over all time, over many different medias. Some may no the history. Some may not. Some may not care, and will only want to scream. But, as someone who wants to be open and honest, you putting together a post discussing all these things that have come up and putting it in one place, might be helpful for everyone. However, that is a GIANT ASK of you, naturally. It's a lot to dig into THE SHIT. Especially shit you thought had been resolved, or at least already explained. So, instead of a single post, perhaps a series of posts, "Clarifying the Shit Pt 1-2-3-etc" , even if it's just collating some of the older discussions amidst new insight, might be easier for you to tackle, while still helping folks understand. As for Surface Pressure, I am not a POC. I recognize that, and see my privilege in just claiming that "of course it's okay for you to cover this!" So, these are my thoughts, feel free to ignore: Music is made by one person, and heard by another. As discussed before, the writer's meaning may vary wildly from the listener's interpretation. Or maybe, the writer wrote a song for one group, and another group goes, "yeah, I feel that, too." Plus, these are Disney movies- they're meant to appeal to a wide range of people in order to make the Mouse the most money. If people can find connection to a mermaid wanting to leave the family who doesn't understand her by growing legs and becoming something new, why is it so hard to imagine connecting to a Latinx daughter's struggles to be the physical/emotional support for her family?

Melanie Meilleur

Just a note that I'm not sure hasn't already been mentioned - Amanda has limited control over her back catalog that was released on the record label. She can make requests, but she unfortunately doesn't have the kind of full control needed to unilaterally pull things from the internet. She can pull her own uploads of live performances, but I'm not sure that wouldn't be condemned like a 'dirty delete' on social media. Maybe even better would be to add warnings and commentary explaining her understanding of why it was wrong but not wanting to try to hide that she did it and owning both her mistakes and her attempts to learn and grow and do better?

Len Tower Jr.

Hi Honor Ash, The deleted comment I referred to was one of mine. I expect your comment is still here, but hard to find as Patreon does not make it easy to look at all the comments & replies to them. And certainly, they have not given us a search box to search them. -Len

honor ash

thank you for clarifying! i thought it was loosely chronological, and it’s still gone if that’s true. i agree with you here, hence why i couldn’t tell immediately that you didn’t mean mine. not sure if there are patreon admin helpers cleaning these things up? but recognised your name from facebook, so thought if there were, you might have been one. love to you

honor ash

reposting as i think it got eaten (with some choice edits to remove key words, and in bits across replies if it was just too long) i've been TORN. torn torn torn about writing here, in the semi-public, with my real name attached. but i have so much to say about this. i'm not sure you know who i am, but my partner was quite viciously 'cancelled'/called out online about ten years ago - halting a burgeoning internet music career in its tracks. if i remember right, yourself and neil were some of only a very few people to not cast them away immediately, comforting them over skype through a sleepless night - THE sleepless night. i often feel like you’re one of only a very few people on this planet who i feel like 'gets it' - understands what it's like to have hundreds, thousands, if not more, who legitimately think you are a Bad Person past any hope of redemption. so i’m here to talk about this. hi.

honor ash

i saw what was happening on tiktok, and i saw a mirror of what happens to us whenever we enter a new space - the community defense mechanism is activated, in the absence of any better collective way of protecting others from harm, and the dangerous element must be neutralised. it reflects a world which the oft-marginalised do not trust, so they cannot afford to take the risk and let us in. we must recognise that cancellation and ‘callout culture’ was born out of a lack of any kind of robust or fair justice system - however its proximity to those who preach police abolition is something i think needs examining in gross detail (i feel that callout culture is just another way of expressing the desire to incarcerate and to be an abolitionist requires an embrace of radical empathy and forgiveness in your day-to-day).

honor ash

in my experience, there is very little forgiveness. there is little will to do the work in a tired, scared, and nervous population - of survivors, and yet we are also survivors, we also need community and compassion. i’ve thought about writing a book or essay or SOMETHING on this but there comes such a guilt with speaking publicly - being accused of ‘trying to make a comeback’ when the only thing we want to get to is a place or time where we don’t get thrown out of venues, our employers don’t get emailed with ‘warnings’ about what awful people we are, and friends and lovers don’t abandon us the moment we trust them just enough to open up. my partner always says they don’t think i should see it as my problem.. but it spills onto me too through sheer proximity. cancellation-by-proxy is something else people are very afraid of.

honor ash

it’s the easy way out, to join in with the pile-on. it validates a very human need to be being Seen To Do The Right Thing, and a dark urge to have a guilt-free way of saying something really nasty, and really cathartic. to be a visible figure in this context is to volunteer oneself for everyone to project upon you, to use you as a proxy for the ways in which they’ve been hurt personally. i wish i knew how we get out of this, how to cast the spell which unbinds us from this permanently - but i don’t know if making a master post of ways in which one has f*ed up is the way to do it. someone with a mean spirited approach, keen for a scapegoat of catharsis, will use it as a shortcut to do their worst. there is a lot of powerful parasocial energy in these interactions, and a lot of hurt from all sides that could definitely do with resolving, but short of encouraging everyone go to therapy and try and forgive not only their antagonists but themselves i don’t know how we address that more broadly. i’ve learnt that most people won’t respond well to being asked to do the kind of work it takes to forgive and also appreciate that while all people make mistakes and learn from them, only some people aren’t allowed to move on from said mistakes.

honor ash

that people have to come to healing and forgiveness in their own time, i think is an absolute truth. navigating between now and then is something i always feel like i am getting better at, and then something happens and it feels FRESH. because if one person has done the healing, another person pops up who hasn’t gotten there yet, for whom being reminded of your/our existence is a triggering act in and of itself, who is overcome with a desperate and very human urge to protect themself and their community from the Big Bad who just popped up in their part of town - and the cycle happens again. and more people learn who you are, in a roundabout, f*ed up (yes, gossip-y!) kind of way.

honor ash

i think a lot about the nature of these things happening on the internet - how for someone who was in the right/wrong social spheres when a callout/call-in/cancellation/mistake/transgression occurred will have experienced that as happening in their own HEAD. it didn’t happen in some far away place that you’re just reading about in the paper. it didn’t happen to a stranger. it happened in your phone, in your hand, in your laptop while you curled around it scrolling tumblr at night. it happened to someone you spent hours with, in their music, their writing, their instagram feed - and it felt like a personal betrayal. there’s no way to get space from the time or place it happened, because people carry it inside them, and the people who were “there” are spread across the globe carrying this unresolved hurt around like a ton of bricks shaped like your face. and they are ready to throw them right back at you at a moment’s notice. i really really try not to grow cynical, or jaded, or untrusting even in the face of all of this. i believe in the truth of growth and restorative justice and healing and HUMANS so so so so so much. but god am i traumatised by being ‘on the other side’ of all of this. so much love. so much hurt. honor x

Dance Scholar

Hey Amanda. I hear you about the outrage getting too toxic and being too much. Step away as needed! Take three months or a year off Social Media! Life is too short, right? My perspective on the appropriation aspect is there will always be people unhappy that where you are on your journey isn't the "right" place, and you aren't engaging in the "right" manner, or meeting some arbitrary bar that they've decided on. Sometimes those people are right to point out something that is tone deaf, hurtful, or ignorant - sometimes they are not. The important thing is to have a good heart, listen to feedback, and be honest about having room to learn and grow. I think its pretty obvious you have a good heart, are listening and learning, and growing. Much love from the US.

Logan England

::Nods:: I see your points. I think both could be done; delete what you can so it's not out there hurting people, but absolutely don't deny that it happened and when possible, talk about why it needed to come down. Either way, or any other way, there are people Amanda will never make happy. All she, or any of us can do is try our best.

Julia

I just wanted to say I just watched encanto this weekend so listened to your version of surface pressure today for the first time. I absolutely love it! oh and you are like the last person I would think of beeing a racist, transphobe or what else tiktok is accusing you of. by the way I am a fan since "yes virginia" I don't always have time to read your patreon posts, please use my money the way you see fit, I am 100% confident you will use it wise - if you are going to adopt an animal at a wildlife resort, go for it! (I want pictures!) Amanda I love you, I love this community, it's a great peaceful space - fuck the rest of social media

Francine Hibiscus

You're so thoughtful, Lana! I didn't see the crowdcast or any of that, so I can't add to or discuss your commentary, but I appreciate it! The parasocial world is strange, as is our (societal "our") relationship to celebrity. We seem close, but it's a shadow we're grasping at.

Rachel Jones

I mean, well written like a book but not to speak to another human - so judgmental! I'd seriously consider killing myself if I'd been spoken to as harshly! I'd certainly pack up my bags and refuse to be a famous artist anymore. Shoot, if people were at the gallery, staring at a painting and heaping tons of critiques on me about which splashes of paint I chose to use and what kind of talk I gave at the opening - I'd crawl in a hole and wish to die! Thankfully, I think Amanda's stronger person and, at least, she's extroverted so the fact that other people are looking doesn't freak her out, but damn!!! I try to suspect positive motives from others - especially when you read their letters, listen to their music, etc... you get a glimpse of their humanity and I won't stomp on it or see it stomped on! It's a gussied up hatred, is what it is! What I would do, if I were Amanda, (But I am anti-social and mostly afraid of people) is STOP writing nice letters explaining my heart and soul to the world (save that for a diary to be published posthumously) and I'd just release songs I wrote out to the void... but you know, Amanda likes that personal connection with people for whatever reason, I can't fathom, so she'll keep trying to please some of the meanest ones with the most ridiculous critiques until she runs outta steam to do so! AT least there are a lot of fans who seem really sweet & good at being vulnerable. I am not, but I do really love Amanda. When I was all alone during my saddest times, her music was chirping in my ear. And during some of my happiest times I brought her along too. She'll always have a person who believes in her here!!!!

Anna McCotter

You have come so far. Healed , held and helped. I believe in your art and in your process. Hurt people hurt people. You taught me that. I know that relentless brutal static can feel corporeal and this fucking breaks my heart and ignites fucking rage within me so I gotta bite my lip. But if you want any asses kicked send them here. I love you Amanda and I say this as a devoted life long admirer and as a true friend, don’t question your process. I don’t know wtf is up with TikTok, and I’m sorry you have yet another front to fight…. I hope other people who are brighter than I can give you some helpful information on how you can fight this. … I do know that we need you, fuck what you heard anywhere else so just hang on babe, at least long enough till we can once again physically catch you . Believe when it is beyond reason to believe. We shall meet in the place where there is no darkness. I. LOVE. YOU. Motherfucker. Stay strong. ✊

Phoenix M.T. Noah

I tend to avoid more youthful spaces due to intense black and white thinking of the general population, along with a willingness to destroy anything they feel uncomfortable with rather than sitting with it and learning from it. I've been told that having been enculturated by being raised in a culture not my own is the same as cultural appropriation when i literally wouldn't know the white USian way to do the same damn thing bc i wasn't raised where that was 'normal' - there will ALWAYS be people who hate you based on their assumption that culture is somehow forever only one thing and exclusively possessable by only one group and somehow not infinite or transmissible or perhaps SHOULD NOT BE TRANSMISSABLE. This mindset forgets that culture (in general and also many specifically) consists of people teaching people what is the right thing to do in this or that context, or that this process is respectful and that is not. I bow in greeting. I'm a white USian. Its an INSTINCT I have to FIGHT EVERYTHING IN ME to 'just act American!' I was raised in Seoul in the 1980s and my cousin's gran would bop me over the head if i failed to greet her respectfully. I'm neurodivergent. I respect my elders. My 'script' for being polite is therefore very Korean. Unfortunately, nobody cares that Halmuni taught me that; what matters to them is that me being faithful to a family member's teaching is cultural theft. I can't not be me. Including what Halmuni taught me. What Mr Kim taught me. Really. I will therefore always be a horrific person to a certain subset of humanity. I have become ok with it. I don't do any of my spirit work the way the mudang in my childhood neighborhood taught me to do. I have my own ways my maternal grandfather taught me. But oh. The anger expressed when I betray the fact I know a particular spirit in the Korean pantheon. How very dare. I didn't learn it at uni. I learnt it from my neighbor as a child. I don't use that knowledge. Anymore, I don't tell people what I know. This is all meant to show you that I see you are doing your best, Amanda, and that sometimes, there is no way to make the public happy with you. I have explained my upbringing, and been accused of far worse than what they accused me of at first. If someone raised in another country as a child is accused of cultural appropriation when they are grown, what hope does someone just making innocent art after having ASKED if it was a good idea have to not get pilloried mercilessly for just expressing real feelings? I love you, human sibling. I'm sure I'll be pilloried for sharing this, as well, again. A reminder - you asked. you did your best. you are doing your best to not make huge cruel insults to cultures that are not your own. I'm damn proud of you, Amanda. And if you're any of those nasty things they say, that'd be a huge shock to me. I feel safe as a nonbinary human in spaces you're in. I feel safe as someone with mental health issues in spaces you're in. That's not true of me for most other 'famous' people. I feel confident that you are actively seeking to become more compassionate in every way you can, and I also know that you are like the rest of us only human. Not one of us is ever going to be perfect in our execution of radical compassion. NOT ONE OF US.

Rachel Jones

You sound AMAZING, Phoenix, so interesting and nice, and I like your way of expressing yourself !!! Wonderful words for Amanda too, so comforting! I hope you get a lot of blessings in life for carrying yourself in the way that you do! :D

Eric Skiff

Thank you for sharing. Here for the ride with you, and sending some big hugs. Also to Aura - I just watched the crowdcast back, and wow! You have a wonderful talent, voice, and sense of humor! So glad that you've been introduced to us.

Tammi L

That's a good point, about it being the first thing people see. *sigh * You're totally right. And here I thought I'd solved it! 😂

Bonnie Denbo

In regards to the Encanto situation, being a white woman, I feel like my opinion on whether or not the encato cover was appropriation is irrelevant. I’ll let those whose culture encanto resembles to make that decision. As for the hate messages on TikTok, I’d like to point out that when you don’t respond and go AWOL that leaves those of us who commented in support of you to face the wrath of the trolls in your absence. I know that I got lots of nasty comments and I’m sure I wasn’t alone. I know that taking a break from the craziness on TT was a way for you to cope but it sucked to get dragged into the muck with no moderation on the comments. I don’t know what a better option would be though because the trolls just get more aggressive the more attention they get. In the real world, I would say sit them down and explain things heart to heart so they know who you really are but on the internet things are just so different. I don’t know how to fix the situation anymore than you do. Sorry I don’t have better input

Doreen

I recommend the work and social media content (esp instagram) of @clementinemorrigan. good and thoughtful critic that's coming from the left regarding the toxic elements of the culture of piling on people on social media in the name of social justice, and how to deal with such situations when you're in them

Celia Nolan

Well hi, truth-teller. I'm not the one to make a final judgment on appropriation, coming from white overculture. I can say without a doubt, you are truthful. As one a bit older than you, it is quite a trick to grow a thick enough skin to carry on, and still have the tender heart to love, rage, seek. Thank you for not being a callous all over. Your truth resonates very much with me. If you're every back in the Boston area, well.... you probably have quite a network here already, but I'm happy to be an extension for anyone you know, or knows you, if they need it.

Anna McCotter

Rebecca your words are beautiful. Thank you for piecing them and placing them down so gently. 🤍🤍 I would love to check out the link if you have the time. 🎡

Anna McCotter

Congratulations Suzanne! All the best to you both. May you both enjoy the silence. 🤍

Christine Leake

Hey, I don't really have anything meaningful to add. I just wanted to say "thank you" somewhere that you'd actually see it. I don't have words to explain all the ways and times your work has touched me powerfully.

Christine Leake

Ha! And a quick email search shows that in 2019 and 2020 right around this time of year, I'd tried to send you fan emails to that effect. Not sure why I missed last year or why it's always March/Aprilish. Made me chuckle after a really hard day. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Crystal Heidel

Thank you! Had a pretty rough day. Broke down, cried, took a shower, read this. And felt better. I felt uplifted and more enthusiastic about my projects and inspired to get back to my writing. I don’t know how you do it all — maybe it’s magic, but you inspire me. To try harder and do more and pass the inspiration forward. Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! 💖

Pixie Perez-Garcia

I've just finished the bit on the surface pressure cover. What the flying f is wrong with people!? Let me tell you, as a half Spanish, half English woman, it is not appropriation! It's about the struggle of someone who is barely keeping their shit together. From my little corner in Madrid, let me offer you my favourite quote from Rupaul. If they ain't paying your bills, pay them bitches no mind. Carry on following your star.

Christiane Roeller

Hi Amanda, hi patreonpeople! It‘s wonderful to read all this comments. It’s full of love, it’s thoughtful, it’s respectful, it’s diverse - and I like the tone of the critical comments very much. It makes me cry, it makes me think, it makes me hopeful. The last two years made me more angry than ever in my life and I’m working on it. (I never ever did a post that was without any respect, though - I always try the love ones … probably that’s why my anger is somehow under the surface … it breaks out when little things happen. A car too fast, a customer with a high eyebrow…) I should do some kickboxing training, probably. As some of these commentators on TikTok should, maybe. Thanks, folks, for this gentle and honest discussion. Christiane.

Asia Kaniewska

I'm just really glad you write about the invasion on Ukraine, a lot of celebrities pretend it doesn't exist.

ScottB

Hi. I was a patron, then left, then came back. I’m 30-ish. I’m on TikTok. I’ve been reading the comments here over the last day or two and I’m a little frustrated. There are a lot of new people encountering you on Tiktok with little context. But I also felt like you came to Tiktok without learning much about the community there either? I know you were trying to defuse the situation, but all those comments about how ‘the children’ just didn’t understand you yet were really discouraging to read. The community on TikTok is HUGE and very diverse, not just racially but in age and life experience. Using the perceived youth and inexperience of your audience to dismiss their critiques felt condescending. I also feel like some of your fans have followed your lead and are saying similar things about how ‘those kids’ just don’t get it. Scrolling through these comments, I’m amazed at how many people freely confess they have never used the app, yet seem comfortable writing off everybody there who didn’t like your post as dumb kids not worth listening to. It feels very ‘us’ versus ‘them’. Most of your attempts to connect with other people on TikTok seemed to exclusively focus on people who liked your work. I understand you were trying to grow that positivity to create the kind, supportive atmosphere that you try to create at your gigs and on here. I have no idea what it’s like trying to find constructive criticism through a wave of trolling, but there were some people who shared interesting critiques of your work. Connecting and talking with them might be a launching point for discussion, but that’s up to you. IF you decide to continue posting content on TikTok, it’s best to think of it as a marathon, not a race. Some people on there dedicate lots of little videos to answering questions that are very small in scope, and they do this over a long period of time. For artists with a larger back catalog, this has seemed like a good way to get in and offer context on their history. It gives people time to get to know you, and gives you time to get to know the community. But it is a large commitment. Personally, I think the app asks too much of creators. But if you want a presence on there, that is how that platform tends to work. And yes, it may mean repeating yourself. As a person doing your best to live a good life, you don’t owe the universe an apology over and over again for past mistakes. The people who have been following your work for a long time have the context, and understand your intentions and your heart better than someone who’s seen all of fifteen seconds of a video. But as an artist and a business entering a new community and asking for the time and attention of stressed, time-poor, cash-poor people who don’t know you, that may be the work required. I’m sorry, but they don’t owe you the effort of researching your history. Some of them DID do that work and weren’t satisfied with what they found. If you want to pursue engagement with this new audience, it may mean having some of those conversations over again, with the added benefit of further experience and growth. But it's up to you whether or not you want to do that.

Ariane Craig-Smith

I love this comment - thank you! 'Outrage factory' is such a perfect description for the mess that social media can be (I keep wondering when news media will just stop enabling comments under their posts on FB. We'd all be better off). It's such a distraction from real world connection and engagement.

erica munhoz

Dear Amanda, this is all so complicated. I'll try not to repeat the "we love you and you're the best" mantra from many of your fans. Like I've told you once before, the way you make yourself transparent and vulnerable creates an impression of closeness which is very ambivalent, and can lead to immense deep and real love, but it can also bring out dark and difficult feelings. I compared it to the way I feel about my friends. Sometimes they make me really angry. I don't like the culture of holding our idols to such a harsher standard than we hold our friends. See, I think you end up in the "sweet-spot"(which can actually be very bitter), where people can see right through you in a certain way, in your fragility, but cannot feel you for who you are, and therefore are so unforgiving. Not all people, but a lot. And not all of their reasons are wrong, and choosing what to address and how to do it seems really hard. I have never been cancelled online because thank fucking god I don't have a public voice, but I HAVE been "cancelled" by a group of friends. I have been excluded, called names and simply cut out of a very important group of friends because of a mixture of decisions that I don't regret and poor decisions which I do regret. At one point someone told me I owed them a public apology, me in front of a large group, apologizing for something I did that hurt ONE person. I was not willing to do that. If I felt stronger back then it might have been the right thing to do. It might not. I just receded into darkness and away from those people, and one of the things that kept me going was your "bigger on the inside" (which I tattoed as a circular gallyfreyan writing on my back, because I'm such a nerd and because it was also Neil's dr Who episode together with your song that meant what I wanted to say). We always need that reminder: even if I'm not the person I wish I were and people wish I were, I AM bigger than what they are saying. It is so very different to deal with a group of people shutting you out and a group of strangers calling you names online. I know. But maybe the "one on one" instead of "me versus a crowd" thought can still work? I'm reminded of that podcast you did "a conversation with someone who hates me". That was beautiful. Do you think trying to talk a bit more personally to some specific people who posted genuine respectful criticism could help? As far as your question about the song being or not in bad taste. Dear, I don't know. I'm white. I'm from Brazil. We're not exactly considered latino. Being white in Brazil is a priviledge, but I'm from a country the US has fucked over many times. Disney is a big fucking corporation supporting transphobic laws and making money for a country which fucks over the latin america they now want to depict. Is the whole making of Encanto an appropriation? It's much easier to see cultural appropriation in individual acts, isn't it? Did I still watch Encanto and enjoy it? Yes. Life is a fucking contradiction. How do you position yourself in the midst of that contradiction? It's confusing. I find identity politics as important as they are confusing and difficult. I tend to just trust whoever is hurt by something, if it's someone I respect, but that's much easier in a personal level, not being a public figure. "Is it time to make a compilation of the times you addressed the criticism"? I think that might actually be a good idea. But here's the thing. It wont make it stop. But you already know that. It might be time saving to point people in that direction, and some of them might be satisfied and some not. And some of them might find the thing itself wrong because you are treating things in a cold manner, or whatever. You know that Amy Mann song "it's not going to stop till you wise up"? Well, the problem is I don't know what wising up actually means. But I know there will always be bullies, and there will always be real and legitimate criticism. (how the fuck do we tell them apart in the sea of hate? I really don't know. I still struggle with my own guilt. I don't know what was the RIGHT thing to do. I know what I did. I know who I hurt. I know my reasons. It doesn't get much simpler) They will always be there because ypou are a person, and you are a public person who makes herself very vulnerable (I haven't seen a single person cancelling Patti Smith for her lyrics. you know which ones. I love her. I might agree they are problematic. I might not. I'm not sure. but that conversation isn't happening. Why? Because she's not exposing herself the way you are, where you are, how you are, and when you are) That said: I think it's very brave to do things the way you do. But there's a high price. I know there's also a high reward. The person in the comment that talked about how tiktok is a long term thing is for sure onto something. You have to make these choices. I do love you, very much. I don't think you are flawless, though, and I think it's a great thing to choose to address the issues, and I think people who are genuinly hurt deserve your attention, if you have it to give them. I think you do. You have a lot of love to give. That's a way to give and receive love too. But maybe find your limit: it will never be enough for EVERYBODY, not everybody will be satisfied with the way you addressed and opened the conversation. Try and find what is the limit that will make yourself satisfied. I feel like that will accomplish at least some of the addressing you feel the need to do.

David Low

On the topic of new art and music - Sam Buckingham’s new album is out “Dear John”: empowered, smart and fierce. (Sam has a cameo in “Art of Asking” talking about crowd funding - the “donuts”).

geek grrl

Truth and I have said walking the chasm between cultures is a space that takes compassion and empathy. I try to remember that every person’s journey is their own and as Oscar Wilde said (ish)- we are all of us in the gutter looking at the stars ⭐️

Franziska Welke

I can't say much but it never occured to me, that you could be racist, transphob or any other of the tiktok-topics. I know it must be hard to read all this stuff about yourself - but remember: Those people don't know who you are. And I think even if you do a "That's all bullsh** - this is me" statement, most of them would ignore it. Seems like some people on the internet are just there to hate. Keep your head high, stay open und talk to the people who are important to you and who want/need to talk (or to clarify). I love you. Greetings from Munich and a really thight ghost-hug all around the world. P.S. And as a mother of two: Priorities. Absolutely. If you need the time for your loved ones - take it. Now. I just stopped working again after (Elternzeit in germany is such a great thing), because my little one needed more time. And the well-beeinh of those little monsters will always be my priority.

Phoenix M.T. Noah

Every last one of us. And the world is so very small and always has been; so many of us have no idea how many times the same pattern from this or that culture has come up independently in other places entirely that share nothing but, say, climate zones. We humans are brilliant, but our brains are only wired in so many ways before the patterns start repeating in regard to how we relate to our environment and each other. And then on top of that, there we go TEACHING again.

Phoenix M.T. Noah

Experience that is difficult sometimes produces kindness, when we are lucky. Thank you for your kindness, @Rachel Lee.

Titus

You asked for advice about being dragged on the net; but you have been dragged the great unwashed most your life. I think New Zealand and Paradise Island have made alterations to your persona that are wonderful and healing. Inside that blessed bubble you started caring what everyone thinks, and you know they are just trolls. Even worse than being singular entities happily feeding on the troll bait they throw, the valuation of responses is not authentic. Hard core trolls are hard core; like you they push the edges of creativity at what they do. Without writing an essay, the long to short is this, Chat AI Bots. Individually customizable and capable of posting 100s of times a minute on multiple alternate identities. This means 1 person, sets up and argument or statement, and the bot has a discussion with itself supporting or canceling or whatever. And those 20 or 30 people, are so small that this is how they interface with humanity. SO I know you remember our mutual horror show on Twitter over the Guardian (I was crying for 3 days after and during that.) Stop being such a pussy, don't give them the fucks. It is each humans responsibility to seek the facts in any discussion. I know I have said this to you before, and I told you to put a post it on your screen. DON'T FEED THE TROLLS Love, Laughter and Lollipops. Titus Aloysius O'Neill Ps.. Did that person who overheard the gossip step in and let them know that they were getting horribly askew information? Or did they stand there and just think to themselves, "Oh that's so wrong." I love you lady, and thank you for getting glasses. If those things got anymore out of proportion on magnification I was going to ask if you had suffered a severe head trauma recently. ;)

Hannah Olsen

Cancel culture is a thing: see the book So You’ve Been Publicly Shamed. This whole idea of “someone has done wrong, we must pile on and hound them” is cancel culture and extremely problematic imo. There’s no forgiveness once you’ve messed up.

Kate Solomon

"Dont Feed the Trolls"-- Wow, what an uninformed opinion. A lot of the folks coming forward on TikTok have valid concerns. They are not trolling. Age old fan and TikToker here - and I have personally been thinking on a lot of the points these creators are bringing up. A lot of what I am seeing comes from BIPOC folks who have a lot of critiques regarding the white feminism of it all -- and EVEN if what they are bringing up is "old news", been addressed (like the videos of you dropping the N-bomb, or waving away the able-ism in Evelyn Evelyn), they are salient points and criticisms. And as others have mentioned, your initial reaction was patronizing and won you no favors. These critiques keep coming up. Thats a fact -- I think its worth looking at yourself and really try to understand the points they are making. Address them as needed (folks have given tips - perhaps short vids point by point). Demanding creators and those newbs who don't know you to do all the emotional and intelligence gathering labor is a mark of your privilege and NO ONE owes you that. But being willing to sit back, listen, and grow from this all is the least you can do if you intend on staying on that platform.

AKA Montresor

Pedro, thanks! Truth be told, I would have liked to be more challenging for Amanda, but this topic frustrates me. Race and gender identity are so important, but unless we all are planning to make a future with a society akin to what we see in "the Giver," then folks ought to slow down and think a hit more before they parrot social justice rhetoric at everything they can't get down with. I went back to check out some of your comments. I really appreciate how you articulate yourself!

Karen Fig

Hey there Amanda, Long time listener (about 15 years now - I’m 33) that never became a patron because I honestly just don’t spend a whole lot of time online and don’t like signing up for things I’ll inevitably not have the time to keep up with and also I’m just more interested in your musical releases than anything else. But I became a patron yesterday because I was dying to see what other people thought about this whole thing!! And then it turns out I couldn’t stop thinking about it so I guess I should just respond. A little more about me before I get into it. I’m the eldest daughter of four in an immigrant family from El Salvador. My mother died when I was young and growing up I was often reminded that it was important that I make choices that honor her. My father died last fall after a lifetime of hard labor in the US, where despite living here over 30 years, he never managed to get his papers. I loved him very much and as the eldest daughter, I felt it was entirely my responsibility to take care of him as well as my half-siblings, who were born to an abusive narcissistic mother. When I was younger I fantasized about adopting my siblings. I spent most of my home life raising them. I grew up to be the only person with any financial stability in the family (I’ll get to that in a second) and have spent many, many thousands of dollars supporting my three siblings (who did not all even manage to even graduate high school, let alone get decent jobs) as well as my father up until his death. As an adult, I’ve spent a LOT of time in therapy processing the guilt and shame of not being ENOUGH for my family, of not being able to give more, to do more, to make more. Additionally, I’ve spent countless hours with my therapist (a woman of color who understands these family dynamics very well) trying to navigate taking care of myself, physically and emotionally, and somehow setting boundaries that feel good, despite believing deep down in my core that it is unethical to ever put myself first. I’ve made a lot of progress. On top of all that - I’m a union construction electrician! Meaning my family literally relies on my able-bodied-ness in order for me to support them when they need it. Also it means that I regularly work long, long shifts (like 12 hours plus) that are super hard on me, physically. In the past, my siblings have been happy to accept my financial support, but have told me “they don’t want to work that hard” when I offer to get them into the trades so they can support themselves. All of that to say, I REALLY identified with Luisa. Okay, so, I had to say all that in order to contextualize my answer here, which is that no, I don’t think covering a Disney song is appropriation. Yes, it was a Disney song that literally addressed my fairly unique life experience. Still don’t care. And I am someone who tends to be pretty sensitive to White Nonsense like that. (Sidenote: I didn’t think the movie or the song, either version, were even that good! Hah) HOWEVER. I will be the first to admit that any one person’s opinion shouldn’t be taken as the end all be all of anything (cause that would be Tokenism).. It doesn’t matter too much what one person thinks. That’s because everyone’s got their own moral/ethical codes AND their own emotional triggers. My industry is full of conservative boomer white men. I am a latina in the trades. I hear it all. I have a white partner, and sometimes when I come home, I quite literally cannot stand to hear them talk about anything remotely political because I’m just Done With White People And Their Opinions For the Day. Does this mean that my partner has said something insensitive? Not usually. But if I come home in a triggered, activated state, anything can set me off. I am a survivor of rape and childhood sexual abuse. I used to have pretty bad PTSD. I was triggered all the time. I was not super fun to be around. I attacked everyone around me, all the time; I was a frayed rope, constantly feeling like I was about to snap. There are things people said that truly harmed me that were very reasonable. I just constantly felt attacked. That’s PTSD, right? I am privileged that my union construction job has great health insurance and I was able to spend years in therapy sorting my shit out. We live in a country where hardly anyone has the support they need, and almost everyone in every marginalized group has been being attacked from all sides for many years now. And then you add social media to this situation, which is a place that intentionally activates/triggers people but also gives them a place where they can respond and feel powerful, for once. I’m not on tiktok or social media very much, but I understand why people are hurting and lashing out, even when it’s not necessarily justified. I see it all the time. People are really fucking high strung these days. I can’t blame them. But it doesn’t excuse the behavior. I believe in radical compassion. I’m abolitionist, I’m anti-cop, I’m anti-white supremacy - and I recognize that to move forward in the world with these ideals I have to be pro-forgiveness when people make mistakes. But I know a lot of people who haven’t had the time, energy, or space to do the kind of self-healing work that is required in order to get to this place of compassion, forgiveness, and, let’s face it - practicality. Cause racism, colonialism, and white supremacy exist on spectrums and all of us - even people from my own community - have to contend with being born right into a white supremacist world. It’s hard not to internalize that shit, and people who have been doing this work for a long time (longer than some tiktokers have been alive) know that there is never a finish line you cross where you’re not a racist anymore. It’s a lifelong learning process, and like any learning process, there will be mistakes. So, even though I don’t think what you did was ethically or morally wrong, I do think it was a mistake because people are hurt, and I *think* you have a Do No Harm kind of approach to life. Well, we all harm. Hindsight is 20/20. So your next question is, what can you do? Can you do an interview with LMM discussing all this stuff? You could, but maybe you know by now that he is certainly not well versed in racial dynamics and Gen Z knows that, so honestly that would DEFINITELY make things worse if your goal is to smooth things over. I recommend against viewing him as someone you can learn from, except maybe in the case that you look at the mistakes he has made. Can you do a web page/blog post addressing this and other issues? Yes. Not a bad idea. Even though you probably know that it’ll only get you more attention and probably more hate. People will see what they want to see. If you go this route, you should be open that it's a document in progress as you learn and grow. That you are sharing in hopes not of expecting anyone to forgive you, but because you recognize these conversations need to be had, and that hopefully other white women and artists can learn from you instead of causing more harm. The only solid feedback I have here is don’t use the word “kerfuffles.” It sounds dismissive of something you want to take seriously. Can you ignore it? I think you’ve taken the right option in not doing so. However, I do really appreciate when famous people take a lot of time to just listen to everything there is to be said before they respond. There’s a lot of learning and listening and sitting with uncomfortable feelings to do. If you want to avoid more mistakes, you might have to take a more conservative approach than you normally do and let the process play out privately until you say more stuff about it publicly. This can feel like ignoring. But really it’s just stepping back before reacting. Personally, I appreciate your moment-to-moment honesty and vulnerability, that’s why I became and still am a fan, but it seems that right now people are asking you to be more thoughtful. The thing is, this is an impossible question to answer because I don’t know what your goal is. To please Gen Z? To please your patrons? To educate? To get more fans? To express yourself artistically, consequences be damned? To never hurt people? I don’t know what the answers are, not really. But I will say that I have always appreciated your willingness to engage in tough conversations. You, me, and the rest of the world are all going to fuck up sometimes, and the only way out is through. I look forward to the day when the mobs realize that no one learns anything under duress, fear, and attack. This is a pretty basic and well-accepted psychological concept of learning that a lot of activists choose to ignore. I hope you’re surrounded by enough forgiveness and compassion to give you the space you need to keep learning and growing. And thanks for reading what turned out to be a whole damn essay :-) Good luck!

EmVT

Karen, thank you for this essay, I'm almost crying it's so good. thank you for your perspective and your strength. I'm so sorry for the loss of your parents, may you be well 🙏

Mary Ann Wesselman

I can’t imagine having to face all my mistakes in front of the whole entire world. I especially can’t imagine having to do it with the knowledge that everyone would then be free to evaluate, judge, and publicly comment on both my original errors and my acknowledgment of them and the harm done. The idea of listing them all, especially the ones where I hurt people with less power and standing in the world than I have, is daunting. What I can say is that as an old cis het crip white woman from the US, I have thought, said, and done ageist, racist, sexist, homophobic, transphobic, classist, genderist, ableist, xenophobic things. Part of me is clamoring, but, but, but, you never did it on purpose or with ill intent—you didn’t even realize you were doing it. Doesn’t matter. Makes it worse in some ways. Doesn’t take away the pain I’m sure I caused. Does suck I wasn’t more self aware. It’s hard to admit that even just to myself. So to have to face it, to dig into it, really dig in and understand and acknowledge what I’ve done and the harm that has come from it IN PUBLIC would be overwhelming. So, I really feel for you and can’t imagine how hard this must all be. How truly, heart sickenly devastating. That said, I’ve really struggled with this most recent event. I’ve been so bothered, I thought it might be best for my mental health to end my patronage. It would help with the unease I have around your previous responses and it would help with the fact that I sometimes experience your honesty about how things are going as a burden. I’ve actually yelled (in my head) at my phone, “make a damn list of every damn thing you have going for you because you and your son are healthy, able bodied, living in paradise with healthy food and a nice roof over your head.” I open Patreon, see you’re sad, and leave. But. Then I remember that there was that one song you wrote— the one that helped me help someone who I love with all my heart to get through a terrible, terrible time. And I do believe your pain is real and deep and yours to have. So I make my own list of what I’m lucky to have and you are on it, so I re-up my energy investment in your well being and send you my love. Please know all that as you read my dyspeptic response to the most recent event (if you do.) First, and least, on calling it a “Kerfuffle.” I’m guessing that’s a defense mechanism to help you survive the hell, but to me, it’s disrespectful. It makes light of the situation. I hate it. Second, why would it be Lin-Manuel Miranda’s job to fix this? It’s not on him. I could put words in his mouth and imagine he might say something like, while he believes in your artistic integrity and that he thought the strings were a nice touch, he thinks it would be great to let all the little kids who are, for the first time in their lives seeing themselves in a Disney movie, get to be the main ones who sing its songs for the next little while. (Side note, this perspective did not occur to my white self, so thank you to your patrons for educating me. You have amazing patrons, which is another reason I stay.) Additionally LMM WROTE THE DAMN SONG. The one about PEOPLE PLEASING. That he was able to express it so well is because he is probably a PEOPLE PLEASER. So, the chances are he would respond with something nice and reassuring. Which, again, is not his job to do. Third, please don’t link to what you’ve written in the past. That’s the past. You’re not that person any more. And even back then, they read less as apologies and more like long elucidations of how you are too cool to be racist. You did not sound sorry and you did not sound like you understood the harm done. After reading them back then, I almost quit your Patreon. So, let’s both let go of those. Done. Who are you now? What do you understand now, after deep thought and self examination, about the ongoing harm done by your words and actions that you didn’t before? What I’ve seen so far is that you are someone willing to ask for feedback and then humbly take it in. That impresses me. The old responses did not. A cool thing about you is that in your Patreon and in your shows, your intent is to create a small world where people are safe regardless of race, gender, disability, etc. You are helping create the future where that is the norm. That said, your responses in the past gave me the impression you want to just fast forward to a possibly forever mythical time when it’s already like that everywhere and everyone loves and respects everyone, everyone is perceived as equal, and radical empathy is the tea that everyone drinks. Fine, beautiful to long for that, but acting like one already lives in that world is a privilege only available to the those of us who obliviously live in the default westo-euro-americo-whiteo-middle class-o-abled bodied-cis hetero Christian colonizing culture (which I’m a part of.) It lets us off the hook from doing the work. It denies the current experiences of everyone not born into the default. The other reason I really hope you leave your past responses in the past is because I care about you and truly believe you will be DEMOLISHED if you actively point to them, and I don’t want that to happen. As for TikTok, it’s fun for me but I don’t know how to advise you to navigate it so it can also be fun for you. I don’t follow anybody, I just open it up and suddenly there are people dancing and singing and cooking and telling jokes. I don’t read the comments. So my experience isn’t that helpful. I will affirm, though, what others have said about how offputting some of your comments have been. They come off a little like your past apologies, like, don’t you people get that I’m too cool to be getting criticized this way? It’s sounds like the same person who thought you were cool enough to cover FTP. It’s time to leave her behind. I believe, in fact, that you are now entering your post-cool phase. I think it is going to look fabulous on you. There will be loss involved but I believe more will be gained. I’m glad you’re pulling back for now while you figure things out. If you decide to get back in there, I would first spend a few minutes every day on TikTok for several months, so you get a real feel for it. If you decide to put out a response, which I’m not necessarily advising, I echo the advice to get it vetted by someone outside your circle. It’s gotta be short and real. It will be apparent whether you’ve truly “gotten it” it or not, so don’t do anything til you feel like you have truly learned whatever the damn universe was offering you when it opened up several galaxies of crap on your head. And you gotta know the response will be nothing like what you get on Patreon. Last advice, maybe don’t refer to all this on Twitter or IG or FB, at least for now. Most of the world has no idea what’s going on with you, and that’s fine. Really for the best. Putting it out there on other platforms doesn’t make sense to me. One, it reads to me as a little self important, and two, it just seems tactically dumb and may just open more galaxies of crap in your head. All that said, it sucks that you tried to do something nice for your Patrons by recording a cover of a song for them and it blew up 5 million times in your face. I’m sorry that happened, and that it seems to have happened when things are so very difficult in your private life. Thank you for, even as you’re hurting, meeting this head on by asking for our feedback, reading it all, and then responding in good faith. Imagine me sitting next to you, pulling you into my arms and holding you while I say believe in you and you will get through this. I do and you will.

Misty Prostko

Hello, my other comment was kinda short and I thought of more to say. As someone who is part of the trans community (agender) I have never felt that you have been transphobic towards me. Also my life is crazy as well but in a bad way, kinda need support for people. Theater is getting so stressful, I’m constantly tense and feel like there’s bricks on my chest. I almost passed out today at rehearsal because I was so anxious. I’m scared to sleep because my dreams are so disturbing or anxiety inducing. I’ve been getting triggered a lot more easily, and dissociating. I don’t know what to do, why I’m so self destructive and I feel like I’m stressing everyone else out.

Sabrina

So true! I’m 40+ and I often forget that my first 20 years were internet free, and how isolated I was from so so so much. It was like living in a box!

Regina

The paradox that a song called "Surface Pressure" is making people explode seems lost in all this conversation. It is a kerfuffle. Racial speaking, for all those looking for balance, I urge people to start supporting Myanmar/Burma with equal gusto as Ukraine. Please take care your heart and let us all start taking better care of each other.

Kirsten Petersen

Karen, I love what you had to say here. Very well said. Especially this: "So, even though I don’t think what you did was ethically or morally wrong, I do think it was a mistake because people are hurt"

Kirsten Petersen

Can you take some time to rest? Everyone needs and deserves that now and then. Hugs from Oregon.

KJ Hawkwood

This right here is why this Patreon space is worth everything. Honest, thoughtful, clear without being mean, excellent context, helpful nuance. Thanks for this, Scott.

Sara Wright

Hi Amanda, big love and compassion AND keep the hard work of waking up moving. We settler folks need to stay in a constant state of peeling back our layers of privilege. I became a patron because of Surface Pressure, because Lin’s song resonated for me and you resonate for me as an artist, HOWEVER I do also believe it’s appropriation. I was actually confused that you felt it was okay and wondered if there was something I was missing. It’s good to make an apology when you are ready BY DOING A THING. BUT from your writing I can tell YOU NEED HELP WITH THIS. It would be wise to do a live conversation with you learning about appropriation from a BIPOC/ Latin x/consultant/advocate talking you through it. FOR EVERONE’s SAKE!!! Your patronage needs to hear it. It will be heard and it will also be the best thing you ever did. Rev. Dr. Aliah MaJon did a public conversation with Mirabai Starr during a mystic summit in 2021 that was really extraordinary. They discussed appropriation and spiritual bypassing and it was tough and big left questions hanging for Mirabai. AND FOR US ALL to answer. I’m sorry I didn’t speak up and ask. I thought you and those involved knew something I didn’t. I had this question, does you singing Lin’s song celebrate how genius it is? I actually googled it myself around the same time because I asked my 8 yr old daughter+friends what song I should use to audition to become a clown doctor and they said We don’t talk about Bruno. Even though all kids love that song I knew I wasn’t an indigenous Columbian or Latin, so I don’t get to sing it. It’s like little white girls dressing up as Moana. Disney let that happen. There are some interesting articles but none really killing it when it comes to the heart of the problem. I knew this would soon fall out for you in the world of the truth and the trolls but you move fast and you did it so well, I wondered if you knew Lin or something. SO Firstly, I think you use our dollars and pay the right person to talk you through it. And Secondly, I give you permission to model self care, I’m worried about this personal problem you keep mentioning. Please give it some space. Glad you are prioritising Ash. Take more space. Big Love, Sara (Expat USA, living 20 years in lutruwita Tasmania).

Steffanie

Hi Amanda ! Those TikToks made me really sad because I saw all these kids re-hashing stale news, not accepting growth. I think you should address them. That is where the conversation is happening. You are brilliant enough to do it with humor which always plays well. I'd consider duetting with some of the attackers if that is technically possible, that way your response is given the same visibility (please vet this with people who know about TikTok etiquette, I don't) You've been given free publicity, time to turn lemons into lemonade I suppose. All my best

Gaba Kulka

I didn't realize there was a kerfuffle until you pointed it out here - I thought the whole tiktok thing was just people comically not appreciating your type of delivery of the song. I'm not going to share my thoughts on whether or not a white person is allowed to sing a song written by, or performed by, or intended for a non-white person, or a song which is strongly set in a context of non-white experience, because nobody does, or should give a shit what I think about it. I have my opinion, which is valid for me, and doesn't have to be valid or valued by anyone outside of my life or my experience. And that's fine. I'd be happy being ignored in this and many other cases, because in this, and many other cases, I don't want to have any influence over what others consider right or wrong. Wouldn't it be a novel thing? To treat something somebody sings or plays not as a statement, a motto to live and die by, an educational statement to fit anyone and everyone, but as a personal thing, a piece of artistic expression, valid for that person, and not necessarily pointed towards (or against) anyone who happens to hear it? Completely impossible, right? Maybe I'm wrong. I just wanted to say that I have such strong emotional reactions to the pile-ons that happened to you in the past (you are the only person I know personally, who has gone through anything remotely this ugly) that I seriously can't think straight when another one happens. And I'm just an onlooker. It's not that I'm sorry for you, I just have a flashback to how (strongly) I felt about them. The toxicity of what once happened on the fb patreon group, the long period of time in my life where I had to casually, personally explain, in real life, to musician friends who were regular, intelligent, seemigly sensitive people, that no, Amanda did not just defraud a million dollars and cheat her band out of their pay. Cause they'd ask, knowing I'd opened for you. I'm not one to say you're always right, because nobody is. But I woke up today with my heart racing. I think this whole system, which amplifies the most radical emotions, the lashing out, the tearing each other down, and drowns out levelled discussion and context, it's just poisoned - on a certain level, it's beyond repair And I think it's intended that way. The system at large, our political and economical circumstance pretty much depends on that we don't value ourselves or each other (our time, our work, our health), so it benefits from us tearing each other to shreds, and stripping each other of our value and dignity. I bet it's a great tool to keep us in our place. Because the big boys don't care, they pillage and appropriate left and right without as much as a blink of an eye. It's the decent people who do care, who are put in a position of constant alertness, and a fear of a misstep. To the question of addressing your past missteps (and "missteps") and your more or less timely reactions to these missteps - time and again, with each new platform, and each new generation discovering you? I see a lot of people saying you owe it to every person, and none of the newcomes owe you the "work" of finding out about you and your evolution... and my grumpy, middleaged reaction is "You gotta be fucking kidding me". But that's just my exhausted stance, in the middle of Poland, a couple hundred kilometers away from some really bad shit, and not tiktok being triggered by a song from Encanto... so you gotta excuse me. (and thank you - everyone here for your beautifully crafted and wise opinions, I've read many of them and I feel enriched).

Kirsten Petersen

Anger sells really well on the internet, and you're right that the system is geared towards promoting it. It's not new news, but I just read about how Facebook weighted posts with angry reaction emojis 5 times higher than likes, and it resulted in fake news being more likely to appear in people's feeds.

Vae Holloway

There's something more sinister going on that's masking as activism. You'll never please them. They don't care about grow, nuance, or context. Don't feed the trolls. That's all they are.

EmVT

This resonates for me, Gaba. The diversity and inclusion training I do as a regular part of my job does not feel anything like what seems to be the norm on TikTok (which I'm not on), based on my impressions on this thread. Diversity training in my experience includes a lot of sharing and listening, letting people share their own story in their own words, sharing recipes from all the different cultures, that sort of thing. Nobody has ever told me it's not up to them to educate me and called me clueless and ignorant for asking questions. Maybe I've been in the baby class so far. Is TikTok highly enlightened, or is it a dumpster fire? I'm okay with never finding out. My impression is mostly based on the descriptions I've read here--it does sound like AFP started on the wrong foot there. Some commenters who have recently bled over into Amanda's IG feed and YouTube do seem concerned with social justice issues, but an awful lot of them come across as addicts jonesing for their next hit, which they think Amanda owes them. Or are just taking revenge on her because it feels good, and they gain peer acceptance. It sounds like the TikTok group has called dibs on that platform, and are going to make Amanda pay if she wants to play there. I love that she tries new things and is willing to learn, but I think there's a fundamental difference in values, and what respect looks like, so that may ultimately not be worth the effort. I watched a cis white male comedian in a youtube clip yesterday where he refers to developmentally challenged people as the 'r word'. Only two out of hundreds of comments even mentioned it. I'm pretty sure nobody chased him down all over the internet posting negative comments on his feeds, or are keeping a rap sheet on him they will raise every time he posts something.

Jonathan Ciesla

Yes! starting at the source would be a smart idea. Also, perhaps he can lend a perspective on the cultural appropriation and a different way to look at the situation.

Enbie Greyning

You are are a white woman who sang the n-word in front of Black children & haven't apologized. Maybe your patrons think whatever you wrote in the past is an "apology" but it isn't. And now you have Brown tik tok creators rightly calling you out for your lack of cultural awareness for Encanto & your response is to say a half-Filipino person said it was all good and maybe an email to a Brown creator will absolve you? I paid a dollar and am sad to see this sundown town of your patrons where there's a whole lot of nod-nod, those BIPOC tik tok folx are just being meanies. They clocked you right off the bat on who you are. POC do not feel welcome in this community. The writer you paid said that reading comments from them on facebook was like raising a lid and hearing the screams of the damned. Think on that. This feels like a ruse. I don't really think you are reading much into the what the people who pay you think. I think you rightly know that this attention to your racist past will make those in the creative spheres less likely to take your calls. That's the kerfuffle. You will be iced out. And I bet you don't feel like you did anything wrong. You don't even mention the hurt you've caused. This was worth a dollar to see how fearful those in the BIPOC communities have to be aware of white creatives.

Georgie Hughes

Amanda, i am the kids, and scrolling thru TikTok, it seems the kids think you’re arrogant. They don’t know that you’ve had to grow a tough skin, and so they see your tough skin as arrogance, because they are much more familiar with seeing arrogance from celebrities. Maybe they are trolls, or maybe they are disillusioned kids who have seen arrogant celebrities get away with awful shit time and time again. They do not know you, but they know these other celebrities. Maybe they would appreciate some vulnerability. Or maybe who gives a fuck. You are right about the echo-chamber, because u know that when we r young the whole world feels against us, and when we finally find some people who are on our side, its tempting to stick with them no matter what. But this also results in people prioritising having the ‘right’ opinion, rather than your OWN opinion. The kids are not alright, how can we be? The kids cancel EACH OTHER, not just celebrities. You didn’t post a black square, you didn’t share this link, sign this petition.

Georgie Hughes

But yeah. Maybe who gives a fuck. I’m non-binary. There was a time that I loved Sex Changes, then there was a time it made me uncomfortable, and then there was a time I loved it again. I love you Amanda, truly, and I love your music truly too. But I think these two things are inseparable, I love you because I know your music, and I love your music because I feel like I know you. Maybe TikTok doesn’t want to know you, can’t know you, so they wont love you, can’t love your music. Maybe who fucking cares. Maybe they are just missing out or maybe you weren’t meant to touch them. I know it’s easier to say than feel, but i think it can never be said enough - who cares how wide you are loved when you are loved so deeply?

Karen Leicht

Maybe I know nothing about nothing but I love the song encanto by Amanda and I am glad she sung it Because she sang with incredible feeling. Her entire soul sang that song and she spoke to me with every verse

Georgie Hughes

I’ve just read some of the other comments and yeah there’s some really good stuff being said by people older and wiser than me. I think what someone said about not using your past explanations as apologies now is so important. The hurt caused is happening now, so it deserves respect, time, and thought now. But again, maybe this does not need to be to TikTok, they are the big world, they will always be angry, let them be. But the small world, the world you have created, maybe its us that need explanations, new ones, new thoughts. Like i said, there was a time i loved sex changes. I was about 14 i guess, just coming to terms with my gender and i was like fuck yeah something i can jam to! i didn’t listen closely. And then i did listen closely, and suddenly it felt hateful, towards me. And eventually, this went away as i listened more to not only this particular song, but all your music, and read your writing. And now, i really feel like i get something from this song, something good. Maybe it makes amazing art, maybe if you dont get it you dont deserve it. Or maybe you have to decide that if people dont understand, it causes harm and hurt, and maybe the kids need an explanation because they’re just kids. They’re not always gonna get it. Lots of maybes but i know for sure i love you.

Bijan J. Hosseini

I’ve read all the comments, and SO, SO badly want to dig into the nitty gritty of every nook and cranny of all these comments and the original asked things on the all thing, but that would be an collegiate length dissertation no one wants or needs. I imagine there’s a succinct and poignant essay that not only discusses all the comments, but also miraculously strings together several points that I haven’t really seen mentioned on here but think deserve to be addressed within a larger contextualization – disclaimer: this comment isn’t that essay. So… bear with, and forgive, me… but for the sake of comparative brevity (and my sanity) you’re going to get a somewhat disjointed list of thoughts for your consideration instead. Before we start, here’s my personal whathaveyou for the record for those who might care: I am a 38 CIS male, 50% Persian, 25% Okinawan, 25% euro-mutt – but looking at me you’d never guess anything other than the Middle Eastern part. I’ve been treated as “the other” my entire life here in the suburbs of Utah, which is still extraordinarily homogenous (89.2% white via the 2010 census) – and overwhelming Mormon, which meant that none of the kids in my neighborhood were allowed to play with my atheist ass because “I was going to hell”. I do not know what it’s like to be a black person in America, or the eldest child in a Columbian family, but I do know what it’s like to be the victim of some pretty remarkable discrimination. I’ve been called a “sand [n-word]” dozens of times, “camel jockey”, “towel head” and other such slurs hundreds - maybe thousands more. I’ve been accosted, assaulted, threatened, and intimidated by both private citizens and employees of the state – not to mention being subject to the ongoing and countless (and sometimes unintended) microaggressions, as well as the ingrained systemic discriminations across all other walks of life, etc. It sucks, but to be honest, it all feels pretty tame compared to the Operation Desert Storm days, as well as the first few years following 9/11 – which, so far, were definitely the worst I’ve had to deal with. And that “the worst” doesn’t even scratch the surface comparatively to what people who look like me that actually live in the Middle East (esp those in Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Palestine, and Syria) have gone and are still going through. This brings me to the first of the main points I’d like to offer for consideration: MULTIPLE THINGS CAN BE TRUE AT ONCE It is both terrible that I have undergone the discrimination that I have, but it’s also not as bad as what others have gone / are going through. The fact that some have it worse (or better for that matter) does not make someone else’s lived experience less valid – except for when it does, or does it? Imagine that we can show that the lived experience of an individual or small group of people is a statistical outlier vs the mean should we still acknowledge / honor “their truth” for those in the outlier – or do we just dismiss those experiences by definition as outliers and look only to the larger whole? Let’s say a new drug helps restore baldness for X percentage of people who use it, but it harms Y percent – where do you draw the line in order to release the drug? 1 in 5, 1 in 10, 1 in 100, 1000, 10000, 100000? Would it depend on the severity of side effects, the seriousness of the issues it was raising or trying to treat - say it were a potentially life saving heart medication instead? How about an artist who covers a song that how many people – and potentially which ones – think is problematic vs how many who don’t? And what about “emotional” truths vs “objective” ones? I may feel like the world is an unsafe and violent place, but in The Better Angels of Our Nature Stephen Pinker provides objective statistical evidence that we live in the safest period in recorded history by a significant margin. Should the reality of my fear and its legitimate effect on how I move through and interact with the world just be dismissed, or minimized in the greater context? What would these two simultaneously true things mean for those with a variety of mental health issues? How much do – or should – we accommodate, in what ways, and for whom? The above examples illustrate my next point – LIFE IS INTERSECTIONAL AND COMPLEX and THERE MIGHT NOT BE A “CORRECT” ANSWER. Where’s the right place to draw the line between personal freedom and collective responsibility? – that’s an argument as old as philosophy (and government) itself What’s your solution to the Trolley problem - Deontology, or Consequentialism? I would suggest that any question which lacks some sort of objective truth / universal truism will inevitably and inherently result in dissatisfaction for some – you can’t make everyone happy (and probably shouldn’t try) – but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have the conversations. These actually might be the exact conversations we should have more of so that we can explore uncomfortable places where there isn’t that simple, singular “correct answer” or action. However, in order to have those conversations I think we need to – trigger warning – offer a safe space. But how do you do that when the mere mention of a “trigger warning” or ask for a “safe space” can be enough to trigger some, while creating a knee-jerk reaction for others? How can we, for example, have a political discussion if you describe politics via a singular L to R axis, and I consider an X and Y axis which also accounts for the authoritarian/anarchy line? Our definitions our liberal vs conservative / left v right are going to be RADICALLY different. Do we have to define all of our terms EVERY SINGLE TIME? Maybe – but that’s exhausting and likely untenable. What lived experiences, perceptions, discernments and bias – both good and bad, are we all bringing to the table? What long list of logical fallacies? *And it’s a very long list if you want some mind blowing reading on just how consistently illogical we all are, I highly recommend reading Thinking Fast & Slow; Predictably Irrational; and Suggestible You. If you want to gain a sense of how little any of us know anything, and how much of the meaning in our lives is retroactively determined (confabulation) check out The Black Swan; or Fooled by Randomness. ^^^ none of this is meant to be used as an excuse for bad behavior. I’m simply attempting to point out that when we look at empirical data we all show up to the table with dirty hands, and we all know a lot less than we think we do. LIFE IS INTERSECTIONAL AND COMPLEX and THERE MIGHT NOT BE A “CORRECT” ANSWER – so how do we navigate trying to have those conversations? I think it starts in admitting that the world is far less black and white than we would like for it to be – no one will pass every purity test, particularly retroactively. (not speaking to the issues raised regarding Amanda specifically here, but still just in general) – what was considered acceptable 10, 20, 50 years ago may not be now; what’s acceptable now may not be tomorrow. And to be honest, I personally can’t wait until all the kids trying to “cancel everyone” / hold people accountable depending on your pov are no longer woke enough for their own crowd let alone the generation after them. Things change, and that’s good. We’re all, hopefully, learning and growing, and moving forward. It's important to speak out against the ongoing violence in the world – but it’s also important to recognize that this is the safest period in recorded history too. Both are true. So, in this intersectional and complex world where multiple things can be true at once, how do you start a conversation when even suggesting a “safe space” can trigger? I think the answer lies in admitting that NUANCE is NECESSARY – and the vast majority of online spaces, particularly the big social media apps are not geared toward that sort of nuance or any kind of long form conversation. These platforms are literally built to feed upon and exacerbate reactionism to push engagement regardless of content, and without context. And, as aforementioned, even if you could have the conversation not everyone will agree on where to draw the line we have to consider: INTENTION vs IMPACT. You trip and mid stumble step on my foot, accidentally breaking my toe. You walk up to me, purposefully stomp on my foot and break my toe. Some say all that matters is the impact. Others, that the intent matters. I say it’s both, simultaneously – and we learn to live in, and with, the paradox. For me what that looks like is this: grace from both parties. I acknowledge that I did in fact break your toe. And you, when applicable (ie I didn’t purposefully walk over and stomp on your foot), allow me to explain that it was an accident, which I hope to learn from and not repeat. I have made countless mistakes in my life, and cannot imagine the horror of having them all play out publicly, or being the recipient of a barrage of the sort of nastiness you’re getting – particularly for something long in my past which has been previously addressed at length (btw, I was in those POC discussions and have never felt anything other than incredibly welcome, heard, and valued by you, Amanda, and this community). And, again, I’m not saying we should all be off the hook for anything in the past – whether or not it was addressed – or that it can’t be up for further discussion. Both are true. As is the fact that she made a mistake which was bad – but it’s also true that she’s not Henry Kissinger; she’s not a literal neo-nazi which we have in masses here in Utah, the US, and abroad – a lot of whom are in positions of significant power; she’s not someone actively calling for and working to revoke women’s rights, trans rights, voting rights, minority rights, etc… she's demonstrably the opposite. Amanda’s just some dumb rockstar who loves you – yes, even you the woke kids spending time, energy, and effort to harangue her for something she’s apologized for rather than going after someone more “important” who is actively trying to do the terrible things like at least half of the politicians in the USA for example, or doubling down on the terrible things they’ve said (coughs.. JK Rowling), etc etc etc. And I’m not saying even Amanda should just get a pass – both things are true. (are you seeing a pattern yet) the micro and the macro both matter and affect one another. I think that we need nuance in this increasingly intersectional and complicated world that only gets more complicated the deeper you go and the more you understand that no one knows anything and we’re all incredibly flawed. We’ll never all draw the line in the same place, and there might not even be any correct answer for there to be a “right” line – so what do we do? How do we move forward, when moving forward can be both helped and hindered by looking back? Who gets to decide? When will it be good enough for you, me, the minority, the majority, anyone, everyone? I don’t know if there are “right answers” to any of the questions I’ve asked. But, for me, and me alone I think the best / right possible answer has something to do with kindness. With grace, with understanding. With compassion. With love. I try to be intellectually honest, and morally consistent as best I’m able. I try to know more today than I did yesterday, and lessen the suffering of others. And failing all that, just to be kind. That’s it – but maybe it’s enough. Bill Hicks said “you’ve gotta love ALL the people – or you’re not loving any of them at all”. I think that alleged Jesus guy said something similar. “Actions speak louder than words” “It doesn’t matter what people say, look at what they do.” vs "To understand the heart and mind of a person, look not at what he has already achieved, but what he aspires to." – Khalil Gibran Both are true. The world is complex. Loving is simple. But simple does not mean easy. i love you.

EmVT

Hi Vae, here is an interesting article on trolls I found. Luckily there is more research available these days than when the internet was in its infancy. I think trolling is a pervasive online social phenomenon that runs on top of whatever the main activity is (in this article, online gaming is the main activity). https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/1461444817748578 I do believe there are a lot of people who want to have a legitimate conversation, but it's hard to do if there's also a lot of trolling going on to muddy the waters. I personally think text-based social media is the wrong platform for productive conversations on sensitive topics such as racial insensitivity, especially if we're talking apologies. The researchers interviewed people on why they troll: "A variety of individual motivations emerged from the interviews, but these can be grouped into three broader categories in order of sample frequency: (1) personal enjoyment, (2) revenge, and (3) thrill-seeking."

Bijan J. Hosseini

Two other brief thoughts On Encanto specifically: for me, not Columbian, but a POC accustomed to seeing himself most often represented at best as a terrorist or monolithic trope side kick – I don’t believe the issue is appropriation. As others have said, this is a Disney film – it badly fails that purity test. But a interesting points I haven’t seen raised: look up / write out the lyrics – there’s not a single line in there specific to a Columbian only experience, or a child of a multigenerational family experience. Matter of fact outside of the repeated “give it to your sister” line variations there’s nothing about this song that you couldn’t argue is completely universal. And I’d bet that if the songs and stories weren’t, that this film would have flopped hard. The beauty of story telling is that we get to see that all of us – even those “other” people in far away places are actually just people like you and me. Persian and Japanese here – multigenerational homes is thing. You as someone under too much pressure – that’s a thing for all of us. The problem for me isn’t whether or not Amanda’s appropriated the song (I obviously think not) – as others have pointed out, it’s not a traditional Columbian ballad she sang; also why is she getting so much grief over it vs others esp men who’ve done similar / the same – the problem, or missed opportunity rather, for me is the discussion about how we all deserve to see ourselves on screen yes both as hero and (still) villain, but also just as a person. I think to say Encanto is a Columbian story does a disservice. It is. But what if it was just a human story being played out by Columbians (and that casting shouldn’t – and hopefully one day – won’t be something significant enough to even point out). *case-in-point watch some BBC television – and as an American you will be shocked at how much ethnic and racial diversity occurs without comment – even in place where it arguably could for ex: I’ve seen productions both classic and contemporary in which siblings were played by actors of different races. Yes, it’s important to acknowledge that a film “about a Columbian family” or in the case of Turning Red a Chinese one – can be commercially viable ie we should keep exploring, expanding and making more of these movies – but I think it would be a mistake to think of them as just that, and not human stories that happen to be played out by actors of that particular ethnicity. The intention matters (as does the impact). It’s both. 2. On TikTok and the kids, I agree with whoever said it felt like Amanda was maybe a bit unprepared to jump into that pool. Would it have been advisable in retrospect – confabulation again – to be more measured and research the pool first, sure. Would that have been pretty inauthentic for Amanda, also yes I’d say. What’s done is done in that department, but moving forward in regards to “the kids”, I would HIGHLY HIGHLY suggest for you, Amanda, (and anyone else who’s interested of course) to read some literature on spiral dynamics. The first chapter of Ken Wilber’s A Theory of Everything does a particularly fantastic job.

EmVT

Bijan, thank you for this whole essay, as you say there is so much to dig into. Thanks for the reading references! I loved: "As is the fact that she made a mistake which was bad – but it’s also true that she’s not Henry Kissinger… she's demonstrably the opposite" also, you made me learn a new word, deontology ❤️ :)

Jonathan Ciesla

This has been bouncing around me mind and if I don't get it out, I don't want to miss the opportunity to suggest it. I'm reading comments and so loving hearing from everyone. What about a documentary? or something where you use this moment to say...Who HATES Amanda Palmer? and then chronicle your journey to lay out- I've done this and that and am experiencing what i am now....why? Is it disproportional? You could use this as an opportunity to kinda combine your couch sessions, podcast talks, music, etc. into a single piece that you can point to (and display) to explore not only your issues, but getting older and being progressive, how are others affected, and really explore the issue more as well as show "Hey, I've been working to grow, but it doesn't seem to be enough. or people forget and rehash...why? Lets dig into that" Or some other collective piece to catalog everything. This would be super helpful for the up and coming who experience the hate. As well as those really curious about growth and what that looks like. I relate a lot to your journey and have made many mistakes that if cataloged would surely have gotten me canceled and who knows what else. I've grown though. and learned to listen and am on a growth journey as well. BUT I'm not in the public eye. Wanted to throw out this idea, not sure if others have. I just feel like if you really want to do or respond better/more, then do something more and say "Here I am, Here is where I have been and what I've tried. How do I make it stick, do I make it stick, how many times do I explain and defend and love and such. Thanks for listening and hope this helps somehow someone.

Lesley S

Beautifully written. Thank you for bringing your experience and perspective to this discussion. I'm also in the "nuance is necessary, but nuance doesn't fit into a 30 second video" camp. Grateful to @Rose Cooper and those who are pointing out new tools that will help with moving the discussion forward.

Kell Ryland

I deleted my tiktorque a long time ago. I don't have a facebox either. All I have is the instawham. I don't know why but people seem to be nicer there? You don't get sucked into strange bogs of sad and anger and relatives. I've been into AFP for a. long. ass. time. I logged back onto my ticktorque, watched two side-by-side thingies and deleted it again. Toxic, foul, regurgitated, boring rhetorical hate. A lot of the younger kittens don't really know what they are supposed to be mad at. Can't mix songs...what does a DJ do at your desert festivals. Cancel a white woman because she was singing a Latinx song? Ok, has this been done before ever in the history of voice? Covering a song of a different ethnic group because you liked it? I need to go back out to my rocking chair and cross stitch, this all has my knee acting up.

Kell Ryland

I'm sure it is there. We do live in a world of humans. My little corner of fiber artists do have their drama but it pretty tame.

Megan aka Pearl

I'm one of the folks who became a patreon after you posted your cover of "Surface Pressure." I have loved you since I first heard “Coin Operated Boy” so many moons ago. Hi. And hi to fellow patreons. Nice to meet you. So I personally am a white, lesbian, single-mom-by-choice, middle class, American of Irish, Austrian, Hungarian, German descent. I am a customer experience designer (ask me and I will explain) by trade. And I dabble in tiktoking and writing poetry. I love to make art with my son. I am a cat lady. I have great privilege in my life that I am becoming more and more keenly aware of as I grow up. Still growing up at 46. And not a thing about any of those things about me is original or unique. Yet I am unique and my work is unique and my perspective is unique because I am the only one like me really. Same same for every single person on this great big beautiful wild planet we stand on. Bear with me… I pause when folks get up in arms about appropriation without acknowledging or maybe remembering art for what it is. All art is inspired and appropriated in some way no? We recombine and reconnect and re-relate seas of stories in infinite ways (thank you, Salman Rushdie). My current poetry is inspired by @deadlikepoe from TikTok (check them out - SO good!) and ee cummings and my mom. Infinite combinations. And I don't know that we must always expect or be expected to always pause and discuss and add disclaimers for all of artist's inspiration and appropriations. Artists since the... erm dawn of art sometimes just make art and put it out there. Sharing their insides, putting themselves out there to sometimes praised, sometimes unnoticed and too often ripped apart. Then we all witness and become part of the art with all of our reactions and perspectives and discussions. And then we appropriate as we discussed and make our own art. Not just the artist holds responsibility for fallout from their work. Hello, introvert and (oh!) raised Catholic so looking inward and battling guilt around any work or parts of myself I put out there or my reactions to other people are part of me on pretty much a cellular level.) I try to own my sh!t. We all have responsibility in our part of art as witnesses of said art. Critics are part of the art too. I LOVE “Encanto.” I may love “Luca” more. Disney appropriates and makes new meaning and connections allllll the time. They have been both celebrated and torched for it. Been so vibing on the Luca soundtrack (not Italian but got to do an Italian Renaissance Images of Hell tour there once). And it doesn't hurt that its a movie my 6 y/o son and I come back to often to bond over. He says, 'mama, say the words". So I say back to him like the Daniela from “Luca”, "You know I love you right?" and my son beams and echos back Luca himself’s words "I know." My son also deals with me listening to “Surface Pressure” on repeat. Holy relatable song. (And erm… I’m not Columbian.) I am the strong sister though. Literally. And its what my dad calls me too for my way. Deadlines? Stress? Bring it. When life gets frightening or hard? Let’s just say hypomania has some silver linings. Freaking out in my way? Also yes. So happy to be a part of supporting your art in this direct and meaningful way. Hand to heart too, I love art and artists and you. Carry on and godspeed and keep doing what you do and all that jazz, AFP.

Jodie Aber

Hi Amanda! I have read several of the other comments and I love the feed back that you are getting. I have followed you since I saw your TED talk . I knew of dresden dolls and just being honest it wasn't for me but what always brought me back to wanting to know more about Amanda Palmer was your sincerity and that you produced your music and art on your terms and told the record labels where they could shove those labels. My youngest two children have grown up with me talking about Amanda Fucking Palmer . I guess it was about two weeks ago my 16 year old daughter showed me what they were saying and despite everything I had said about you while growing up I was faced with my daughter going "I don't know mom why would she do those things and say those things if she wasn't what they are sayin" I had to process and was like what do you mean "those" things. I found myself having to rehash the n-word lyrics and the Evelyn Evelyn stuff with her. It actually took me several days to not be so affected and calmly talk with her. I was so angry at those tiktok people for saying those things. Then I saw it running over to Facebook with people saying things like because we support you we must be racist too. 😒 I was also hurting and I knew I needed to present my daughter logic and calm, a teachable moment was presented. We talked about these things being in your past. I asked her what else could you do to show you have learned and grown from those misteps? She said apologize. I showed her where you had. I asked her now what should she do? That led to uncomfortable silence and thought. She said idk. I said seems like she is damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. She agreed . I don't think my experience will help much in deciding what to do. I know that I have come to need you in my life. I love your pod cast, your books and your posts your suggestions of other amazing humans. I have even gone back and made myself like your music. The idea of you stepping back or backing off had me crying so hard today. I know you don't want to hurt anyone and that the idea of your art hurting others hurts you. So on that front a sincere apology will always go a long way but I just don't see your cover as being cultural appropriation as another said it came from Disney! I also know how these people on tiktok and other social media are. It seems they hide behind their computers and point fingers and throw stones like they are perfect and they know exactly how to fix the world and of course they would never do something wrong. Thank you for being a human that creates and learns and grows. I posted on Instagram I thing that I love you for being unapologetically you and that is still true. you own that you are what all of us are "human" I ended my lesson to my daughter with saying. I admire you because you are messy and not perfect but you learn and you evolve and apologize when necessary and you explain that the hurt was not the intended outcome. Ultimately I feel you will find a way for an open talk for those out there that matter and are not just regurgitating what someone else said for the sake of having their day in the spot light. Peace and love and many thanks for helping me to not feel alone.

Jodie Aber

Hi Amanda! I have read several of the other comments and I love the feed back that you are getting. I have followed you since I saw your TED talk . I knew of dresden dolls and just being honest it wasn't for me but what always brought me back to wanting to know more about Amanda Palmer was your sincerity and that you produced your music and art on your terms and told the record labels where they could shove those labels. My youngest two children have grown up with me talking about Amanda Fucking Palmer . I guess it was about two weeks ago my 16 year old daughter showed me what they were saying and despite everything I had said about you while growing up I was faced with my daughter going "I don't know mom why would she do those things and say those things if she wasn't what they are sayin" I had to process and was like what do you mean "those" things. I found myself having to rehash the n-word lyrics and the Evelyn Evelyn stuff with her. It actually took me several days to not be so affected and calmly talk with her. I was so angry at those tiktok people for saying those things. Then I saw it running over to Facebook with people saying things like because we support you we must be racist too. 😒 I was also hurting and I knew I needed to present my daughter logic and calm, a teachable moment was presented. We talked about these things being in your past. I asked her what else could you do to show you have learned and grown from those misteps? She said apologize. I showed her where you had. I asked her now what should she do? That led to uncomfortable silence and thought. She said idk. I said seems like she is damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. She agreed . I don't think my experience will help much in deciding what to do. I know that I have come to need you in my life. I love your pod cast, your books and your posts your suggestions of other amazing humans. I have even gone back and made myself like your music. The idea of you stepping back or backing off had me crying so hard today. I know you don't want to hurt anyone and that the idea of your art hurting others hurts you. So on that front a sincere apology will always go a long way but I just don't see your cover as being cultural appropriation as another said it came from Disney! I also know how these people on tiktok and other social media are. It seems they hide behind their computers and point fingers and throw stones like they are perfect and they know exactly how to fix the world and of course they would never do something wrong. Thank you for being a human that creates and learns and grows. I posted on Instagram I think that I love you for being unapologetically you and that is still true. you own that you are what all of us are "human" I ended my lesson to my daughter with saying. I admire you because you are messy and not perfect but you learn and you evolve and apologize when necessary and you explain that the hurt was not the intended outcome. A documentary of AP sounds epic as well! Ultimately I feel you will find a way for an open talk for those out there that matter and are not just regurgitating what someone else said for the sake of having their day in the spot light. Peace and love and many thanks for helping me to not feel alone.

Andrew Raymond

Wow. Big feels here. All hyperbolic claims of "cancel culture" aside (yuck) we do seem to have a serious overreaction problem online these days, and it's derailing a lot of potential good. Story time. Back around 2005 I found out that I'm autistic. I was 45 at the time. Lots of good things and personal validation came out of that. Among those things was finding that there's a thriving community of autistic people online, particularly on Facebook. There was a lot of of lively discussion of our shared experiences, and much validation and support was found. Then the ugly began to creep in. There has always been a certain friction between autistic advocates and non-autistics who feel that we need to be cured. Long story, behind that, not really germane here. But it gets pretty rancorous. Then the friction began to spread. People's views began to be more polarized, and more to the point their views began to be more purist. The slightest error by anyone, intentional, on gender issues, race issues, ableism issues, ANYTHING. Long story short, this has nearly destroyed online autism. It's a shadow of its former glory. This kind of purity absolutism has made it terrible to be around. A lot of the advocates I learned from have thrown in the towel. I'm over 60 years old now, and I grew up in a much less tolerant times. I work, HARD, on getting the old mistakes and ways of thinking. If you look at my life, you can find a LOT of mistakes, and even a few cases of outright evil acts. But you know what? I grew past those things. I'm no longer that person (though sometimes I won't let myself over my guilt.) I try very hard to grant other people the grace that I know I need myself. I wish others would look to themselves and see that they need the same, or if not now, in the future, because, as we have seen, standards change. And the current state of sensitivity today is likely to be as stringent as the standards yet to come.

Liz Hart

Dearest Amanda, I know you’ll read this and I want to say that having listened to Encanto countless times ‘surface pressure’ has become my favourite song because it’s about someone dealing with unrealistic expectations from those around them and from themselves.It has nothing to do with race that I can see and it speaks to so many people on so many levels so why shouldn’t it mean things to everyone regardless of colour. I’m white and it screams to me as a nurse when it says ‘give it to your sister and never wonder if the same pressure would have pulled you under’ because we have just been like Luisa, meeting the unrealistic expectations of the public whilst failing to care for ourselves and now, our NHS is broken because it has lost its strength. It’s crying over a piano that it can’t move, (patients it can’t help). To tell someone that a song can’t mean something to them because they aren’t a POC when they are a woman, a mother, a friend, a partner, a worker, a sister seems to lose the point of global community, compassion and sisterhood. I’m sure the song speaks to all other genders as well but as a woman I can only say how it speaks to me and to honour it and demonstrate how it speaks to you should be a compliment to Lin-Manuel not an insult. Where are the days when covering a song was considered a hats off to the artist rather than theft or appropriation. But, I’m white and straight and weak (literally - f’ing Fibromyalgia) so I have no right to feel connection with a Colombian song. And BTW I love Stephanie Beatriz who is in the movie but she is not Colombian. She’s Argentinian. I love love love that you did this and that you have the integrity to admit when you do make mistakes (Guitar Hero etc) because you are nothing if not honest and in a world of liars that is one of the many reasons I love you. If you do feel you can reply, could you point me to the response to Sex Changes please as I’m scared my daughter (who loves you and cried when you hugged her - she gave you a picture she did of you) will get swallowed in a cancel culture but she knows honesty is key so I want to show her you are a powerful awesome woman who owns her shit - mistakes, successes, opinions, nuances, choices. We will always always always love you. Let us help you move the piano.

Lindsay Hannon

Hats off to you dude, much grace under fire. Or while on fire, possibly. It means so much I think for those of us on patreon- the time you take writing posts, making us feel included in what youre at , reading comments, webcasts, chats - & it must take up a fair bit of your busy life & mind, but it's genuinely meaningful , & occasionally life altering. Thank you! That said, I don't think all interactions online are worth your attention or time, I understand as a public figure you have a certain expectation or response, & you're compelled to justify or answer to certain things you produce , but at the same time, what you don't know can't hurt you. I'd strongly suggest that reading through 1000's of comments on tiktoc isn't a useful or nourishing thing to give your time to - mostly because I don't believe the vast majority of those commenting are truly interested in a dialogue, or growth, or new understanding & shared compassion. I also believe the majority of these commentators would be totally different up close, in real life, & they'd understand you completely differently if they met you. But it's not real life, its online comments & the rules of engagement seem very different. I'd say there's a terrifying streak of almost religious puritanism from alot of younger people interacting online. I don't believe they've seen enough if life or maybe considered history to gauge how life changes, how what was/is acceptable has changed, & will continue to, even throughout their lives. More importantly, I think there's a lack of critical thinking around the how & why things change. It's far easier to leave comments saying 'do better' 'educate yourself ' 'racist' than enter into a sincere dialogue hoping for deeper understanding between people. Such is the ferocity of some of these witch hunts, I believe people might be frightened that that all-powerful, cancelling finger may be turned on them, so they are quick to denounce others. Maybe without considering that shunning someone /'cancelling' them, is one of the most brutal things you can do to another human, especially as we're all flawed, all make mistakes. I wonder in a few years time, another generation will vilify these attitudes currently being expounded as short sighted & massively lacking in nuance. As to 'surface pressure ' being cultural appropriation, I'm unsure . If it was a song specifically about the lasses south American heritage, & the issues that arise surrounding her cultural background, yeah, I'd get it. But I thought her nationality was unimportant, & the theme was universal. If you'd recorded some mozart, would there be a pile on because you're neither male or Austrian? Is the online response the hyper vigilance of perceived wrongdoing ? The afore mentioned witch hunt? Maybe. You're an amazing artist & a pretty great human being, keep on being AFP xxx

Kathryn Weber-Boer

Brilliant! Thank you for the essay! One thought: a precondition of apologizing and promising not to do something again is that you understand why something you did was wrong/hurt the other person. I think a lot of the objection to this Encanto-kerfuffle (including mine) arises because many of us simply cannot understand why it is even remotely offensive. In an identical situation in the future, we would have no way of avoiding identical behavior. And asking why brings the demand to "educate yourself" and stop demanding emotional labor from oppressed people. But unless this is a dialogue, we end up with hard lines and no actual understanding. Just because someone on Tiktock was offended by something doesn't make it inherently reprehensible. We need to be able to have a conversation about where "fault" lies (and where it does not) in that intersection of intent and impact.

Erin DeCamillo

I am not Columbian but I am a POC. On the subject of Encanto. IF the song was specific to the Columbian experience or was a traditional Columbian song, like for my own cultural experience if you covered La Llorona (done in Coco), then yes, that would be a matter of appropriation. Appropriation is a matter of taking from another culture and attempting to make it your own. You were not doing that here. The song is unique to Disney and while it is used to convey a message about what the culture is like it doesn't uniquely represent Columbian culture in a such a way that the song could not possibly apply to any other culture. There are definitely portions of the film that belong only to Columbian culture. I myself saw my whole multigenerational, matriarchal Mexican family in that story. It was the same structure I grew up under.

Lisa Nicholas

I'm in awe of you, this way of being, creating art. Thank you, it's incredibly brave.

Allison B

Don’t worry about what others say. F em. Love you. Ignore. U can’t deal with every human right or wrong. Breathe Hug Ash Hug yourself ❤️❤️🤗🤗❤️❤️

Liberty Stump

Not reading existing comments before piping up here, so forgive me if what i say is repetitive. I'm 33 for what it's worth, been around since Dresden Doll Days as a teenager in Philly, though only became a patron recently. And I'm writing this on mobile where i can't shift-enter to format this neatly, so forgive my wall of text. I saw the kerfuffle, i googled why i should hate AP, i read the stuff, i considered ending my patronage, then i didn't partly because i have enough privilege to let whatever fuckups were fucked to slide. Yes you need to release a compendium response to everything. Half of the responses i found from news articles were broken links to your old website/blog, and i couldn't easily search for your responses without knowing the exact date you posted about them to dig it up. So i just let it go (again because i have privilege enough to do so). I'd say you don't have to do TikTok. You don't have to be there because it's the next new thing. You're allowed to say it's not for me. That's what I wanted to tell you when you posted about it all excited about showing these kids who AFP is, like, they don't care. 🤷. And thinking they'll get it if only xyz is giving tryhard vibes. As far as responding to the shitty stuff, being defensive is the worst thing you could do. "Once you know better, do better," and apologizing on behalf of the person who did those shitty things and didn't know better is where you need to start. You don't need to defend the "art" or your choices. You just need to acknowledge it was wrong and that you're committed to doing better. Don't pull your trans/black/etc friends or patrons into this as a shield, "but they didn't have a problem, etc." That's a bad look too. I know you got thick skin. i appreciate you reaching out for help. Even if the world turns against you, you still have a crowd here holding you up for you to surf on, laid back and trusting we won't let you fall. I think that's it, but this website is absolute shit for mobile, i can't even reread my comment for proofreading, so I'll probably post it then drag out my laptop to reformat and edit [[edit - nope, website is also shit for long comments I can't easily edit through. 😂. it is what it is. at least I broke up the wall of text ]] oh, PS, i didn't hear/read about Surface Pressure being appropriation. That seems absurd to me without doing any diving into why people would suggest it. I mean. It's a Disney song? Why shouldn't you be allowed to cover it? idek, but again, without diving into why people felt that way, it seems, on the surface, absurd. Though I say this as someone who is very yt, and whose opinion on this really doesn't matter, so I guess I should zip it here.

Moxie McMurder

For what it's worth, when I first saw Encanto and heard Surface Pressure I actually turned to my husband and said "Amanda Palmer's gonna sue somebody!" 😂 The style of the song is perfect for you to cover. I wouldn't consider it appropriation however I'm white so perhaps I'm just missing some of the nuance here.

kendeebot

Just.. thank you. Always thank you.

Rachel Jones

Awwwww!!! You sound like a good mama!!! I don't have kids so I feel my responses to things are still pretty childish (I'm 40) hehe, I love Amanda and I don't like people who don't like her, plain and simple - I was single for so long that I built up very strong friendships I was able to put a lot of energy into, so nobody in my life's inner circle is mean or challenging toward my opinions of what I love and am into. If I love X, the people I know are pretty respectful even if they don't know anything about it, or actively dislike it (like anime). I stopped posting online years ago because... I am not the kind of person who handles sticks and stones well. I was beaten as a child, so I resolved as an adult to have as peaceful, and positive, and happy life as possible - so I don't like getting into online arguments but there's one thing that makes me wanna and that's always been.......... AFP! She's such a nice person, a cool person, omg, she kissed me once, ehehe, and makes me so happy! I really just can't stand it when ppl are mean to her and accuse her of crap when it's clear as a bell she's got the gentle heart of a lamb and always means well! ANYWAY, I could see some of my own heart in your response and I bet it was a struggle to overcome that feeling to talk calm and unaffected by the crap so you could be giving a lesson to your child, good mama!!! Kudos to you for being a good mom, and a good fan, and you got a good heart to boot, I can tell! :D

Seia Gamble

Hello! I'm white, so that's just an important factor to state first. I don't actually have an opinion of the Surface Pressure cover, but I have a feeling that a lot of the reaction has to do with how your past is easily dug up and far less easily explained. I am also pretty tired of people responding to 'do you know Amanda Palmer?' with a sort of sigh and uncomfortable shifting before launching into whatever ill informed (yet completely understandable) qualm they specifically have with some of the art you have done. I think one big issue is that you HAVE addressed all controversies, but you've addressed them in different places and at different times, and almost always in formats that are posted directly to your audience (your personal blog, or this Patreon). I think writing a BIG apology that covers literally everything (which will be extremely tiring and not nearly as rewarding as I'm sure you'd like so I apologize in advance if you take this advice) and post it SOMEWHERE ELSE. Like, literally with a separate news outlet, or perhaps blast about it on social media. Speak to it so loudly and not necessarily to your audience. We get it. We get you. We see and hear your apologies and understand where you're coming from. The people who think that you're racist aren't going to see your blog posts. I think it's great and genuine and a good thing to do to post to us first, but I think if you want the general public to hear you and your apologies you have to really give them a big heaping mouthful of it and all at once. And not in a negative way. I also would suggest studying a lot about the sorts of things that make people not trust apologies (just in case, to avoid any pitfalls that other creators have fallen into). It makes ME sad to hear about a lot of your public legacy and I'm literally just a fan. I can't imagine how it would feel to be in your position. I also can't imagine how it would feel to be a POC hearing you use the n word on record and not knowing any of the context surrounding it (context being your apology, not the act itself). I think that if you can find the energy to give one big sweeping, careful, empathic, and NON-DEFENSIVE (that's the biggest one because it's where most creators find themselves shut down for a second time) apology/essay, it could do your career good. Good luck. <3

Seia Gamble

Another thought: write a large apology and post it to your patrons before releasing it to the public. Call to your POC and trans fans (and also ask other to review, people who maybe don't know you as well). Get a really good pool of feedback on making sure the apology is received well by most people FIRST. THEN post it to the shark tank of public thought. There will always be people who won't take it well, but your job is not to please all outraged people, it's to make those who are justifiably confused and upset and only see your poor public-image and decide to write you off because they have no other reason to believe you are a thoughtful, kind person who HAS apologized for these mistakes. It's not about convincing everyone, it's about an apology to those who are conscious enough to receive it, and making them know that you are an ally and believe in the importance of their existence. thinking of it less as damage control and more as the clearest, most vulnerable expression of remorse for having done things that have confused and hurt people. Fame is a fickle mistress. I don't envy you in this task! Again, good luck and you will always have a Patreon to fall back to if things get messier, but it's worth a really good shot to help fix some of the misconceptions about you and your person.

Shelley Gurney

I went to TikTok to see your interpretation of Surface Pressure. I loved it. It bemused me that you'rev getting hate for this version when I have seen hundreds of white boy emo/grunge/etc and other amazing female singers (again, mostly white) do their own covers and not get blasted for appropriation. I'm not even sure how there is appropriation. It's a song. About not showing weakness and everybody assumes you're okay and not drowning. I mean... How? But as Lindsay said... It's just that you have a presence online, one that is easy to dig up and cherry pick to for a narrative. And TikTok can be even more toxic than Twitter. You keep being you, AFP, may maybe you do need to write/curate a compendium of what I learnt while growing up and leading a cult or something like that. That was you can always refer people to what you learnt and why you have continued to grow and evolve. Arohanui!

Alfredo

Hey, Amanda - I just wanted to send out another hug. I find myself with very little bandwidth these days to deal with internet kerfuffles. But I just wanted to let you know I read this and I'll write you soon with my thoughts. Love and support.

Joseph Kindred

Been reading the comments. Thank you to patrons who are really sharing some nuanced responses. Fwiw, I’m trans and white. I was hurt by something you said years ago but I truly can’t recall now what it was, and when I searched online I couldn’t find out what it was. It happened before the pandemic. I feel like this pandemic has changed me, softened me, pressured me, and more. I had to stop working at my job as a therapist as I couldn’t handle the pressure and I had health issues surfacing too. When I saw you on tik tok I signed up to be a patron and fwiw coming from me, I loved your performance of Surface Pressure. I could relate to it so hard. I’m older than you - by a good ten years, and the combination of growing older and living through this pandemic as a disabled person leaves me feeling like I forgive you for anything in the past that hurt me. I do think a way to Google more of your Current response to past hurtful things is a good idea. When I googled I couldn’t find much coherence very easily. I like the ideas others floated about conversations with someone from more awareness than you about issues - if you are led to do that. Keep going - your aliveness inspires me and your openness is deeply beautiful. I’m not sure if you grew up with a lot of privilege - it feels like maybe you did - I can relate as I grew up with some real privileges and I need others to help me grow beyond that place. I can’t begin to have the eloquence of some of the other responses here, but fwiw I love you, Amanda.

Andrea Hamann

I just quickly wanted to chime in...I'll read this all later... I wanted to say that I think this model of patronage is really important. And I support you for having it and for using it as a means to both survive, create and do your own work, as well as supporting others. I wish more artists would use it. I feel like it's the most egalitarian model there is for artists to survive and also to produce for themselves and their patrons. I also hope you don't feel too beholden to us, because that is not the point of this. Xxx big hugs. Keep doing what you are doing. I hope you are doing OK.

Widgett Walls

Okay, as to the poll. For the record, I do read these…eventually. Things have been nuts and my brain struggles to focus. So any time I don’t vote on anything that’s me saying “Yes, fine, whatever it is it’s probably weird and wild and you’re a weirdwildologist so just do that thing.”

Widgett Walls

Agh, paragraphs on the app are beyond me at the moment. I also would like to welcome you to the Can’t See Properly Without Help Club. I’ve been a card carrying member since…well, since.

Matthew Wood

You're an ally when you say you are. (To paraphrase a very thoughtful person) Anyone who says you're not is claiming to read your mind; they're dismissing your motive, your love, and your experience.

Martha Mountain

I completely identified with Surface Pressure when I saw it in the movie, that oldest sister dynamic is universal. One of my colleagues asked me last week, yes but when are you taking care of yourself? and I realized that I wasn't. Again.

Jim Lloyd

There is simply no way singing a song, in English, with a universal theme, that references Hercules and Cerberus, marketed by Disney could possibly be "cultural appropriation". This is not Flamenco. This is a pop song written to be sung by anyone.

Teresa Toro

This is a really dismissive and erasing response to Enbie's above statement. Please consider how damaging such words can be.

Allison McKnight

First, a quick thank you for highlighting Piano Day. My husband and I are fans of Nils Frahm and neither of us had any idea that he did this. ...I have so many opinions on this whole TikTok thing and social media in general. And it seems silly to add to the pile when there's already over 400 comments on this post. But you asked. I think we give too much power to the internet. Sometimes there are rewards for that (like this thriving Patreon), but more often there is harm. The people who scream at you for your various missteps are people who *want* to scream at someone. You're one of many people to receive their online wrath. And, in my opinion, directing your energies towards those people in order to convert/convince, let's say, 2% of them is not worth it. People *want* to have big opinions. People *want* their opinions to go unexplored and thus justified. Very few are going to go to your "this is what happened, let me explain this" page/post. It's the whole "if it makes you angry or makes you laugh, you'll repost it" combined with a "if the article title makes you angry, then you'll repost it... without reading the article itself or checking the source" mentality. Why fight that? Why spend so much time on reaching out when you could be making art, spending time with friends, spending time with Ash, etc.? I say this as someone who has been through a smaller version of what you've been through. I posted something completely inappropriate on my social media several years ago. It was, of course, screenshotted and posted all over 4chan and various other forums. I was harassed online and, of course, my boss and the board of directors where I worked all received pictures of my post as well as email screeds from various internet people about how I needed to be fired. (I was not fired, but I attribute that to a lack of suitable replacement.) This went on for months. It started dying down but continued to randomly crop up, as things do on the internet. Someone I had to fire wrote an eight page list of my failings, flaws, unprofessional behavior, and sent it to all of the other employees, my boss, the board of directors, and anyone he had worked with outside the company that was affliated with the company. He also posted it in multiple places online. It's still there. I had people emailing me, texting me, coming up to me in different work venues to give me their opinion of me, treating me like garbage because they read all of this vitriol online. And I let them say their thing. The first few I tried to convince, and then I realized it wasn't going to happen. That the people who thought they knew who I was (because of a poor choice and because they read things about me on the internet) were the people who would never allow their minds to be changed. So I stopped. And I kept doing my job. I apologized to those that mattered to me (my staff, my boss, the board), I posted a public apology on that platform, then I adjusted my social media privacy and what I would post, and I knew that it would impact my future jobs should my potential future employers google me. That was the cost. How I behaved during it all is... something I admire about myself, I suppose. I did my job. I didn't, like others I worked with, spend time looking up myself online. I did not comb industry gossip message boards. I didn't read the eight page screed. (I read the first two paragraphs, saw that they were incorrect, and decided that I would be better served working and taking care of my staff than trying to sift for truths that could help me be a better boss.) And when people approached me with their decisions made, I wouldn't try to change their minds. I just let them know that they'd be better informed about me when/if we worked together. I know what I did wrong. I know what I did right. Not feeding the fire was what I did right. I cared about the opinions of a few people, talked with them, and processed. I have faith in my ethics and the ethics of the people I choose to keep close to me. The internet will continue to storm and rage, maybe, I'll get caught in that rage again. As long as I know--and as long as those I love know--who I am, what I have and haven't done, the internet can storm all it likes.

Teresa Toro

I replied to this a few days ago and was deeply discouraged to see that the Patreon glitch finally got me too - my comment vanished as I know others' have randomly vanished. I've pieced together again what I said but I am tired, tired of having to write it out again. As someone of Latine heritage who is also (obviously) a patron, I was okay with your covering Surface Pressure. At the time I voted I hadn't been able to attend the crowdcast nor had I seen the movie/heard the original song. But I think it's any artist's right to cover a song that resonates creatively and personally with them - there are so many songs that have been transformed by other artists. I think of Richie Havens who was especially artful at this, and covered others' songs in such a way that you felt like he could have written them himself. But then I saw Encanto, and I understood why you received negative feedback from many Latine people on Tik Tok (I am not going to address the more generic, brutal Tik Tok trolling behavior here). Others here have touched on the very sensitive subject of being the eldest girl in Latine families who are deputized very young for child/elder care and housework, and still expected to excel in school. It’s hardly unique to our culture, but that is the culture we’re discussing here – so I’m going to be specific. So many in our community felt deeply and truly Seen by not only the movie but that song in particular. And many of us knew that Lin-Manuel Miranda wrote that song as a thank-you letter to his own big sister – but even for those who didn’t know, the vibe was clearly felt and appreciated. We could all argue about Disney as a white-controlled corporation and how ironic it might seem to see Encanto as “belonging” to the Latine community – but it’s important to remember that this movie was made as a much-awaited gesture of inclusivity (we have Coco and nothing else), however white the corporate executives are. And Encanto was clearly successful at making the Latine community feel Seen in its characters and dynamics. And now here comes Amanda Palmer, tossing her cover of Surface Pressure out to Tik Tok, without any appreciation or sensitivity about this cultural context. I get it, I really get the anger, the upset, even if I don’t feel it myself. And again, I don’t think the error was in covering the song. The error was in being ignorant of the Latine community’s feelings about the movie and its songs – that one in particular. The way the cover was posted, it just seemed like, here’s a middle-aged white lady exploiting a popular song’s coattails. Amanda, your patrons and fans know that isn’t how and why the cover happened, but strangers, who are going to take you at face value? As for the many suggestions about asking Lin-Manuel Miranda about his thoughts… again I am cringing at oblivious whiteness here. Lin-Manuel has had his share of “kerfuffles” within the Latine community and while he’s a good person to have a discussion with, as the songwriter, he isn’t necessarily the right or best person to publicly comment on this situation. He possibly will say the same thing. Ask him. But please do some googling before you reach out or make any decisions about naming names in public. It's been said a few times here but bears repeating: asking a group of fans who are intensely supportive of you isn't going to yield completely objective advice. They're going to support you, first and last; most of the advice will be on the milder side and likely lost between the bookends of love. The stuff in the middle is at risk of slipping away. And Amanda, there have been pointed comments about your tendency to leap before you look. And when that involves race and culture, you (anyone!) deserve some blowback. But hysteria? No. As I said above, this cover evolved organically and sharing it with an explanation would have avoided most of it. And as we can see, there are plenty in the Latine community who aren't offended at all. Mileage varies. A chronic, underlying criticism that I do agree with, though, is defensiveness and dismissal of those who *were* upset. As it goes – when someone tells you that you've hurt them, you don't get to tell them that you didn't. Period. And – this is crucial to me personally if to no one else; heed the above – I am seeing that tendency repeating itself here, in numerous comments and responses. There's a lot of passive racism here – verbal shrugs and basically saying "I just don't see it so it's not there" or “who cares” and "well no racism/insensitivity was intended so they should just move on already", etc. That is racist. I'll repeat it for y'all. It's racist. Amanda does need to be more proactive on her antiracism journey but she is not alone. Though we are here to support her, I am asking for more forethought, consciousness, and sensitivity in the nature of the comments here – from everyone. More looking before leaping. It is possible to be supportive of Amanda without chiding those members of the Latine community who *do* feel upset about the song/video for whatever reason. We can hold respectful space for their feelings and voices. We can do both things. Please do better.  

ScottB

Thank you so much for writing this, especially since you had to go back and write it all AGAIN.

Mary Ann Wesselman

Thank you for this, Teresa. Thank you so much. Thank you for being our Luisa, for being the bigger sister our Patreon needs right now. I feel like in your post you showed the big sister superhuman strengths of patience and wisdom, of perserverance, and of courage and kindness. Tired as you are, you went ahead and reached out to us with the guidance we need at this time. I deeply appreciate that because I too am seeing things in this Patreon that are as heavy as the three donkeys Luisa carries in Encanto. The shrugs you described, the “I don’t see it so it’s not there” comments, the “no racism was intended so just get over it,” and the “who cares,” comments. I have been trying to figure out how to point out their racism in a “seeable,” helpful way. I feel like, though, whenever I try to point out what I perceive to be someone else’s racism, I suddenly see my own three fingers pointing back at myself, pointing to the work I myself need to be doing. Sometimes that stops me from saying something when I actually should go ahead and say it. Learning. I’m so grateful to you that you did go ahead and say what needed to be said. I’m so grateful to you for surmounting your exhaustion, whether it’s with life, or with Patreon eating your post, or with having to help people see what needs to be seen. Thank you for having the Luisa level strength to do it. I’m not sure if I believe things happen for reason. So often when people say that, I smile politely and say nothing, while thinking no, no, no they don’t. Things just happen. They happen all the damn time and then we make up what they mean. I think maybe I learned from Bijan in his post that this is “confabulation?” What I think could be conFABULOUS would be if we luck out and the “reason” this all happened is so that in watching Amanda’s process through it, we get a chance to look at ourselves and learn and grow. That we get a new chance to again take a look at our own perceptions—especially our unconscious, unexamined ones—and look at how we act on them. If we find something in there that looks like racism, that maybe we find a way to be less defensive and more fearlessly curious about it. And that we go ahead and grow and change. That’s what I hope. I also hope you get a Luisa in the hammock moment soon. Some relaxing time when you’re not taking care of your Patreon family or of anyone else. Some time that you don’t have to bring strength and courage to, just enjoyment. If I could be, I’d be there, handing you your favorite delicious drink and saying once again, thank you, Teresa. Thank you so much.

Ellen Barker

I am a white privileged Australia female and I eternally learn that I have more to learn. Anyone who meets me figures out that I have a strong sense of social justice, yet I still have more to learn. I was initially baffled by the cries of racism but then remembered how hard it can be just to make my husband, dad and male friends understand how their behaviours and attitude are sexist. Thank you to all who are making time to explain. I do know how exhausting it is.

TzaraSchmara

I have read the Tik Tok town hall portion of this post. I have reached out to you many times over the years, in different ways. I will simply say this about TikTok and urge you to check your messages here on Patreon, and find mine: We don't know what donuts are safe to take.

TzaraSchmara

Coming back to say: you don't wanna be in an echo chamber, and you want to listen to people and their concerns. Your patreon feels like an easier place to do that. Your patrons seem more safe to talk to and converse with. What if: you keep the conversation on Patreon right now, but you don't exclude non-patrons? What if we work together to connect you to other creators on Patreon that are struggling with social media and the nuanced issues it presents? I can think of several artists off the top of my head of all sorts of demographics, generations, levels of success, and none of them have ever brought you up in their public posts and musings on this chaos. And again. I urge you to look at the message I sent you.

Mara Wüstenberg

Hi Teresa, I'm german and watching it got that Encanto would be probably a very beig deal for the latin community - I did not know about the special role of the oldest sister in the latin culture. I'm the oldest my self and could identify with the song very well and with Amandas Version even more (because it's more "broken"). I like your differntiated answer and thats why I wanted to ask you directly: how would you suggest to do it "the right" way? I mean given that you know from the beginning people- a community - would be hurt. But how do you know? You say "more looking before leaping" - does that mean one has to asume anytime you choose to get involved with anything from another culture that someone (everybody?) is going to be hurt? If you assume that you would not do it in the first place...? Or do you think by knowing about the background of the latin heritage concernig family roles Amanda could have said/explained something along with the release so nobody would feel hurt? Is that even possible on tiktok - I never used it so I really don't know - but it seems be made for fast consumption - is there a place to give additional explanation? Do people there (on tik tok) really want more explanation? Or do you think it was wrong to do the cover altogether? I don't know if you have time or want to go into more explaining, but I would really appreciate this.

Mr. Taran Tucker

So many people will comment more succinctly and eloquently than I might. I love you, Amanda. Not just for your music, but for all the love you have put out for the world. As to the recent "kerfuffle", my thoughts are would Mick Jagger be compelled to explain his every motive for his entire life up to now? ( Not that you Mick's age.) I think that is part of any relationship. When I saw you and Brian performing Coin Operated Boy on Jimmy Kimmel, I wanted to hear more, know more. Did I expect you to give me a rundown of your life's story? No, you had already given so many interviews and written so much about yourself, your art, how you looked at the world at any given time. So, my thoughts are, I hope you focus on putting love out into the world and not rehashing what you have already said if you don't feel the need to. I am a transman who loves a cis-woman and we both love you so much because you have made it a great circle of love. We were able to see you perform at There Will Be No Intermission about halfway through your tour. For this, I will always be grateful. I just wanted you to know that your message is being received. Hugs given (if permitted).

Mara Wüstenberg

"The people on tik tok are not going to look into it." Why not? That is their responsibility if they want to have an opinion. If not they are just blindly hating (or at least distributiong negativity). Before I judge - or worse insult or cancel - someone I should know the context. Context is everything.

Mara Wüstenberg

It was not made for us (white people)? You mean Disney just made it for BIPOC children? Not even adults? I don't know in detail about the disney distribution channels/ marketing etc. but saying it was not created for the "usual" audience seems a little far fetched since at least in very white germany (cities + countryside) it was in every Cinema...

Alexandria Stuart

Dear Amanda, I’m too sad. That’s just… that’s just all. For today. ❤️

Ashwin Skoog

I completely agree, they should look into it. My experience on that app is most people won't though, they just listen to a majority hatred before they do their own research. I believe looking into someone before "canceling" them as a person is the right thing to do. My suggestion is more with the knowledge of how tik tok works right now, it might not even do much. Tik Tok is currently a cesspool of online bullying at its worst in a lot of places. (Side note, I can't figure out how to reply to your comment so I am just commenting back to myself, but I haven't used this app much so apologies for that Mara)

Rose Cooper

Thank you. I’ve commented earlier on - prefacing that there was so much more to say. Suffice it to say - the folks who express impatience & “exhaustion” with these conversations are almost always white/otherwise privileged - and they just want “everyone to just get along”. In other words: “please don’t upset my world view that my rose coloured comfort zone is in any way a sheltered one”. White ppl - if “you’re exhausted” - sit and ponder the exhaustion of those whom have fought long and hard for your thoughtful attention.

Rose Cooper

It’s healthy though for white peoples to second guess what they are doing and why. This is a relatively new phenomenon in the history of colonialism. Regardless of your marital ties - this is still a specific “art” view. My comment was less about appropriation generally and more about how Amanda might be viewed by others as a (privileged) artist whom might not necessarily have her finger on the pulse.

Brittany B.

Teresa - thank you for the well thought out comment, and especially thank you for really underlining why this particular song resonates so deeply with Latine people. It didn't change my mind (I still strongly feel that all cries of "cultural appropriation" are anti art, always, the only exception being when the "appropriation" is actually explicit plagiarism) - but while you didn't change my mind, your post makes a lot of sense and I can sympathize with people who had their feelings hurt. I still don't think their hurt feelings should mean anyone else shouldn't make certain art, but at least I understand those feelings better and can understand some of this backlash. Thank you.

Teresa Toro

Amanda has mentioned Clementine before as a great role model for bearing oneself through cancel culture.

ScottB

Hi Mara Teresa may have more to say about this too (and I really hope I'm not derailing here, Teresa!) But since you have some questions about TikTok and that was mainly the point of my original comment too, I wanted to offer some answers: It's not about 'knowing' or 'assuming' that you're going to do harm by posting something. It's about knowing that, as someone outside of the culture, you might not have the full context of what the song/movie/story means to that particular community. It means slowing down and taking a look at what else has been said or discussed so you understand the conversation you are joining. In this case, it would have been valuable to check out what was already being said about Encanto on TikTok, particularly by the Latine community. They've been analyzing and highlighting special moments and things that stood out to them in the film, things I know I never would have recognized on my own from my own context. It's been a huge pleasure to learn how to appreciate this film more deeply through their experience and knowledge. So, to put this in action: you can perform searches on TikTok using hashtags and keywords. Searching 'encanto' or 'surface pressure' will bring you to videos in which the song or movie are discussed. Some people post one-take videos where they just talk to the camera. Other people edit together lots of little clips. People can also 'stitch' response videos or comments to other people's videos, like a conversation. The etiquette on TikTok has been that other audience members, particularly white people, step back to give the Latine community space to speak and share and lead the conversation, because this is a conversation about their culture. That's the key thing here. The team at Disney researched Columbian culture, worked with Latine artists, and created a piece that celebrates that culture and speaks to a particular struggle that community has faced specifically. Encanto is an accessible story that many people are able to relate to! And that's great! But it was made using one particular culture as the basis. This is a great time to step back and appreciate them. Of course Amanda is free to have her own interpretation of Surface Pressure and do her own cover project here. But then she took that project out of the context in which it originally developed, and threw it into a completely different conversation running on very different rules of engagement with no introduction. When people voiced their disapproval that their conversation was being interrupted, her initial response was really dismissive. It made it look like she didn't care about the rest of the conversation. That was where it became harmful. There are lots of ways to offer additional info on TikTok, and yes, people on TikTok generally are quite curious and like to learn more. With more context, more looking before leaping as Teresa put it, Amanda might have had a better understanding of the conversation she was joining and approached posting her video differently. Maybe a separate video acknowledging the conversation already happening, maybe a clip added at the beginning of the studio footage to explain how the cover concept came to be. Maybe even a slower roll-out with multiple videos explaining the process, or taking more time to engage with other people's thoughts on the song before offering her own.

Elizabeth Hickey

My issue with younger generations who express themselves on TikTok, as a Millennial myself, is that we cannot see the forest through the trees. We get caught up in social issues and cancellations that are truly so minor in the scope of human history, things flare up in headlines and on TikTok and then are completely forgotten as we are bombarded by the next wave of issues. Why can’t we have a universal understanding that art has a right to exist in ALL forms, that some may offend us, some may not be to our taste but to allow it to exist all the same? This is my issue with modern day feminism. Though I am a feminist, we have failed to really achieve anything lasting in the last 5-10 years because we focus on petty issues that divide us. Do any of these things matter when we STILL have to fight for abortions and birth control access? Sex trafficking is a huge issue worldwide. Why can’t we all put aside our smaller sufferings and choose not to be offended and focus on actually changing things. You just raised money for RAINN, you employ other artists, you raised money for the wildfires in Australia. You do all sorts of charitable acts as a person in a position of “power”, if people want to call it that. And then people who don’t know you tear you down because they don’t agree with your music and it’s driving you mad when you’ve done so much more to create positive, lasting change in this world than the people who criticize you.

Elizabeth Hickey

also to clarify: I didn’t write this to imply that you’re so wonderful. I mean, I like you, obviously, I’m a patron. My overall point is: you’re a fucking musician, not an elected official. Why is it such a big deal?

Penny Sullivan

My initial reaction (as a privileged white person) was that it seems like a beat up. But there are a few people here who have raised some really good points about why this particular song is special and this particular cover might have caused some hurt feelings if it was seen without context. So thank you to all the lovely patrons here doing the work of explaining. I know I've learned a lot. That said, I will note that there are a whole heap of Encanto covers on Youtube and TikTok, many by white people, and the only outrage is against Amanda's. While there clearly is some valid criticism, I think are also some people who are just looking for something new to hate Amanda for.

Katja

I’m a bit late for this Encanto kerfuffle thing on TikTok, but here’s my 2 cents worth, based on the points made here. While it does feel that the backlash has been disproportionate, I totally get why Latinx feel something of theirs has been appropriated. Sure, we could invoke reader-response theory and state that any “reading” / interpretation of the lyrics is equally valid and justified, but that would be an incredibly privileged position to take - only White people have the luxury of beIng “colorblind”. However, since this cover project was initiated, encouraged, supported - and yes, paid for - by our Patreon community, I think it is unfair that Amanda has to bear the brunt. We misjudged. We did not consider the context. We went ahead without a second thought. It was us who failed. So we should take the responsibility together.

Tammi L

Except she HAS apologized. In a couple different place, but here's one: "i’ve said it numerous times now, but to be crystal clear: it was a stupid and insensitive mistake, one that i’ve been examining and grappling with since that day in paris. i am sorry that i did it. i have changed and that word will get cut from the song." https://blog.amandapalmer.net/racism-words-art-time-progress/ Amanda is not — and should not be — immune from criticism; I say "have at it" and, more importantly, so does she. But the criticisms have got to be rooted in truth rather than lies, or else how can anyone fix anything, ever? If your demand is that she apologize, "mention" the hurt, etc — what then, when that's already been done? Do it again? How many times will be enough? Does she have to do it personally, to everyone who was or could be hurt by it? Not possible. Go back in time and not do it at all? Not possible. How could you, personally, be appeased? How could anyone else? I have NO idea what the struggle looks like for folks who are marginalized in different ways than I am, and I absolutely know that. So it's not my place to say what the penance has to be. But calling for a penance that's already been attempted just feels like a bad-faith argument to me. And how can anyone engage with that and actually make amends?

Tammi L

"Is TikTok highly enlightened, or is it a dumpster fire?" WhyNotBoth-dot-gif LOL Your last paragraph gutted me. Because you're probably right.

Michelle Raborn

Long-time lurker but an infrequent commenter here. Since my comment was about the TikTok stuff, I figured I'd do it on this post instead of the new AllThing. I tried to read all the comments first before engaging, but WOW—props to everyone who read them. We’re a family of Amanda Palmer fans, starting with me – 38 yo cishet white woman, to my Jewish-descent 17 yo cishet son and 13 yo lesbian daughter (My husband and seven yo son are indifferent). We all bring different experiences and baggage to your art and take different things away from it. The songs that hit for me aren’t the same as those that hit for my kids, which is one of the things I think we all love the most about you. My kids are both super active on TikTok, and their mutual concern for (and the questions they brought me about) you were a big part of what brought me to read the post on Patreon today. My kids and I have been having MANY dinner table conversations about performative activism, cancel culture, unsustainable purity tests, etc., within the liberal culture of America right now. There was a comment about TikTok early in the thread that I would have given a 1000 hearts if I could have: “Tiktok feels like it’s full of teenagers trying to change the world through passive aggression and badly researched canceling attempts. They may become wonderful, engaged people. But it feels like an incredibly toxic, hate-filled place, which I don’t think I want to engage with again.” I couldn’t be prouder of my kids, their compassion for other people, and their genuine desire to improve the world. But I also, at times, feel frightened of what I can’t help but feel is an almost fundamentalist black or white view of the world that our young liberals seem to be taking. I like to talk to them about how there are no such things as good or bad people, but people who do good and bad things, and it is how we respond to and learn from those things that define us. I want my kids to know nuance and all the various shades of grey. We had conversations about your kerfuffles and how you’ve grown. Regarding how to handle all this: if you’re willing to take the advice of a 13 yo, my daughter echos what I guess a few others have already said. She agrees that you need a comprehensive list of all the shit that keeps getting thrown at you and what you’ve done to grow from it, with receipts. (The receipts – both of the initial incident and the appropriate apology/response – are the most essential part.) She thinks you need to have one pinned TikTok that references the big explanatory blog or whatever it is, then a series of smaller TikToks that address each issue and link back to the “Primer on the f*uckups and growth of Palmer.” She harshly pointed out, “Mom, most of these people have no clue who Amanda Palmer is anymore, but they’re still listening to the Dresden Dolls. She needs to teach them who she is.” She and my son also pointed out some things about TikTok that I didn’t know as an old, and you might not either. Most essential? It is intentionally siloed. Once a video gets funneled into a specific group, it is only viewed or recommended to those in that group. Your TikTok has been siloed into people hating on it because it has been “tagged” by the algorithm to be viewed by people in that group. If a different group of people had started the interactions, your experience might have been different. We also all agreed that it might help if you did an interview with someone like ContraPoints or dangelowallace or iNabber, who they would consider an impartial voice that is essentially theirs. They talked about how seldom their generation accepts apologies from celebrities these days because it’s so often a really teary apology video followed by zero change in behavior. My kids feel like if their generation were able to see your receipts, so to speak, it would reduce some of the vitriol. And my 2 cents? I’d definitely be emailing LMM. I think you’d have an even more nuanced conversation than you’d initially think. My daughter is a LMM superfan, so we’ve been diving into all the accusations of appropriation, misrepresentation, colonialism, white saviorship, and racism being leveled at HIM right now over his actions in Puerto Rico and “speaking for all” Latin American countries as if they were one.