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Before the main topic, some housekeeping. Earlier this week, I put out another art post for $10 backers. Above this post, you see a lovely piece of artwork from Annikath's Twitter! This isn't from me, so it's either someone else's request or her own fanart. Anyway, I quite like it - consider it canon that when Hilstara is pushed to such a degree, after the battle her allies reward her with some relief. ^-^

Anyway, this week I want to discuss something with everyone. I work best when I can shift gears periodically, which means I'm always bouncing around. That includes small amounts of work on things I never mention, which in an ideal world suddenly appear as new complete projects.

One of my longest-running side projects is Don't Save the Princess... actually, there's been so much patron turnover, maybe I'd better link the free online demo for the game. It was meant to be a short and light project, tapping into the casual phone games market. Instead it has lingered and malingered for years, to the point where in the past I've considered just scrapping it, which I do not like to do.

The decision point came when I needed to do some work in order to delegate assignments to the artist, which required replaying some of the game. Since that would take me mentally away from other work, I had been putting it off. But when I fired up the build... I ended up playing longer than necessary, because I was enjoying it. I know it's not for everyone, but my feeling while playing was that I did hit the note I wanted, making a new sort of gameplay that strikes the right casual balance.

So: DStP is not dead. But what will happen to it? Well, that's part of what this post is about.

I've done some work in the background, mostly design - honestly, this has been such a relief on stressed days when I don't feel like I have the energy for anything. There are a reasonable number of variations we can get on the physics that are already in the game, different ways to give new twists to levels without coding brand new features. So some of this will be moving forward.

At some point, however, this work will hit a fork in the road and I'll need to decide how much to invest. While thinking about this, I considered a new idea: using Kickstarter as a test. This is the idea I want to discuss, but first some background information.

I've considered crowdfunding at various points - not because the money is strictly necessary, but because successful campaigns are one of the only ways that indie games can get attention. I'm concerned about seeming like I'm "double dipping" from patrons, and as I've always emphasized you guys don't owe me everything after all your support, but I think that a crowdfunding campaign has potential advantages.

Most notably, it would be a test of the fundamental concept and design against a far larger number of eyes. How many people are interested would help me decide about that fork in the road: if relatively few people care, I can wrap up DStP as a small and modest project, but if new players show up, I can invest in some of the more expensive improvements or expansions I've been considering.

(It would also have the advantage of testing out and establishing myself with crowdfunding. A small project would let me get some rookie mistakes out of the way and also give me a track record, if I ever wanted to try for a bigger crowdfunding campaign in the future. Something like OEA2 or a higher budget RPG.)

There are disadvantages, of course, most notably the time and effort required to run a crowdfunding campaign. This wouldn't be something I'd be leaping into any time soon, that's for sure. But I've been thinking about this enough that I wanted to run it by patrons, both to let you know my thinking and in case you have any thoughts I missed.

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Comments

Aramis

Go ahead with the Kickstarter. I mean at the end of the day I assume the game would fall under the same rule as your other games. Those of us with extra cash to burn can support the kickstarter if we want and will otherwise get the game. It will let you get additional eyeballs and maybe even boost the patreon with attention to your other stuff. My only warning is that once you have a kickstarter people start being demanding around completion dates. Its much more of a commercial transaction.

lostone2

Something that you haven't mentioned is that is also another milestone in getting even more protection in case that something happened to your Patreon. Although my interest on this topic has been waned a lot in the last few years, I think that it's a solid fact that nobody or a very few of your fellow developers have branched out in so many directions and places as you have done. But even with all of that, I think that doing a succesful crowdfunding has the potential to open more doors for you. Also, you can cont with my support, of course.

Grim8P

I don't have any concerns of double dipping or similar. I literally back you on Patreon to support you. Being given another way to support you isn't something that would bother me. I wouldn't feel compelled to support you in another way. I already have the option of either increasing my pledge here or also backing you on SubscribeStar. I choose what method and the dollar value of my current support to you and then move forward based on that decision. I do wonder if pledges on Kickstarter would reduce pledges on Patreon for a single month? I'm not sure what percentage of people would do that or not, but certainly something that is probably worth noting if you proceed. On a personal level, I would be far more likely to back a Kickstarter campaign for OEA2 than DStP since I loved OEA while DStP isn't really up my alley. Perhaps something to keep in mind if you have concerns over a DStP campaign not doing as well as you'd hope and that dissuading you from doing one for OEA2.

Desertopa

Personally, I think it's worth giving Kickstarter a shot. In some cases, I think the appearance of double-dipping is worth being wary of, but by this point you've built up a loyal audience on Patreon whose trust you've earned quite thoroughly, and you're being open with us about your motives for doing it. I think that if you set up a Kickstarter where your Patreon backers, at least up to the tiers where they're putting in that level of money anyway, are guaranteed access to a project on release, but are still free to contribute to the campaign, I think it's unlikely any of your backers would see reason to complain, and enough of them would probably want to throw in their support to give the project a strong starting boost.

sierralee

Just to confirm, yes, all patrons would get free copies via the usual methods. The demands of Kickstarter supporters are a real concern and something I'm considering. One benefit of DStP as a test is that it would have a much shorter development cycle because of all the work already put into it, so I could fulfill those promises faster.

sierralee

I appreciate it! The foundation I've built is pretty solid, but I'm always interested in trying new things.

sierralee

Fortunately I'm not living paycheck to paycheck, so a reduction in patronage wouldn't be a problem. I always welcome patrons to support however works for them. My expectations for a DStP campaign would be fairly modest, and I think there's an advantage to having done a simpler campaign before launching into anything major.

Dubsington

It is a little bit of an eyebrow-raiser, but so long as you're clear to your existing patrons what you're up to (which you just did) and use your usual rules about "patrons don't have to pay again" (which you just confirmed) I don't see any problem. Your work is good, so more exposure should be beneficial.

Demoet

As a few have said, including yourself, track record is important. I immediately thought a similar point. I wouldn't mind the kickstarter, or even occasional kickstarters, because you've shown loyalty and drive in many of the projects you do. I trust you to have a reason and consideration for your other projects. That isn't something I do lightly, or without a sort of naive faith, in this scene. Going off that, I think that proves the idea of exploring small kickstarters as a way to start a new track record. So you can gain more eyes on your projects. Also the transparency in any of these topics helps a lot.

cpip

I'd be happy to throw some money in on a Kickstarter as well, even knowing I don't have to pay again.

BleBle

Kickstarter could work, and if it doesn't hit the milestone, the money could always go back to the supporters, so it would make them feel safe, so nice. But for me, I wouldn't support DSTP, subjectively is not for me.

Darthjake

Do what you need to do to keep yourself going, I'm not really into DstP, but I do recall that for a sidescroller, I didn't mind playing it compared to other sidescrollers. I'll be here as long as Patron or my bank don't screw up my payments! :D

beening .

Honestly, your logic tracks. I've found plenty of projects I enjoy through Kickstarter/ crowdfunding and I think it would get more eyes on your work! You are great and I love your work. I don't see an issue with crowdfunding and Patreon, cast a wider net!

Belly97

I have supported a couple of hundred Kickstarter projects, both large and small, so I would have no problem backing another. It sounds like a good idea and may bring fresh eyes, but I would reiterate what has been said before, that Kickstarter backers can be pretty whiny and impatient so I would strongly recommend giving yourself plenty of extra headroom with dates and more. It's always better to underpromise and overdeliver. I don't think any of that should be a problem for you but it is better to be aware beforehand. It is worth it to have a well-put-together video fully explaining/advertising the campaign for the main page as many backers won't support a campaign with just images. Also, it is preferable to have a decently long campaign as it allows more people to see it and arrange to have the funds available for when it finishes. If you are not sure about any details of the campaign or you just want feedback there is a way you can create your page and show a preview version of it via a special link that lets people comment on the side of the page. It can be very useful and might be worth posting that link here when ready. Having a $1 tier as your first can be helpful as it allows people to show support without needing to spend more and lets them receive any updates you make after the campaign is finished that aren't set to public. (any update showing nudity or adult content have to be set to backers only)

sierralee

Appreciate all your advice! I knew a little of that (will have to figure out a video eventually) but there are lots of good suggestions there. ^-^

Trisk

I won't pretend do know if a Kickstarter campaign is a good move in your particular situation or not. But I can offer my completely anecdotal observation that I've ended up backing several games and other projects that I'd probably never have known about if they weren't on Kickstarter.

Abso Haram

I say go for it. I've played everything you've put out so far and haven't been disappointed... plus you miss 100% of the shots you never take so throw it out there.

sierralee

Really appreciate your encouragement!

Chip3435

Couldn't hurt to have more publicity. The idea is pretty cool and unique too. I was really excited when I first heard about it; playing as the villain and controlling the stage to mess with the hero is an idea I haven't seen before. It would probably get at least some new eyes. I don't really consider it "double-dipping" either; we're here to support you, and we can choose whether or not to contribute to the Kickstarter.

Belly97

A creator I support is just wrapping up their campaign and about to release their game in a few days, and they did a retrospective of everything they learned and that went wrong and here are the three main points they made: Don't ever add a stretch goal that hasn't been fully priced out and planned. Don't let your enthusiasm at success cloud your mind to the real costs of making a game. Make sure the game is fully outlined prior to launch so all features can be showcased. I don't think they all apply here, but good advice regardless. So mostly the same as I said earlier; It's always better to underpromise and overdeliver. I think that is true in life as well, but particularly when selling/making a product.