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Gabor Maté: Achieving Authenticity, Tackling Trauma, and Saving Society (Patreon)

Published:
2024-08-03 06:29:37
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

Join Matt and Chris as they delve into the captivating realm of Gabor Maté, the Hungarian-Canadian physician renowned for his unconventional perspectives on trauma, stress, and addiction. As they reminisce about their early childhood experiences, they explore whether unprocessed trauma has steered them towards a life engulfed by modern gurus. They also discover insights on how to stay true to their authentic selves, avoid manifesting debilitating illnesses, and break free from the toxic quagmire of modern life.

With atmospheric storm sound effects setting the scene in the early segments, tune in for cheerful discussions about childhood trauma and abuse, emotional repression, and the unexpected cause of female cancer. The episode also includes some classic YouTuber motifs/wisdom, courtesy of "Diary of a CEO" host Stephen Bartlett.

Get ready to uncover the authentic crystal butterfly within, cast of the myth of normality, and soar.

Links 

The Diary of a CEO- Gabor Mate: The Childhood Lie That’s Ruining All Of Our Lives. | E193

The Conversation: Gabor Maté claims trauma contributes to everything: from cancer to ADHD. But what does the evidence say?

Files

Comments

Chris Clark

Gonna be a fun one this, I can feel it. I bought a bottle of Huel last week just to test it out. It has a shelf life of about 300 years. It tasted like puréed weetabix and mushy peas, with low sugar ribena added for flavour plus some starchy old tap water. Was disgusting. It also didn’t make me feel full at all. An hour later I had a bowl of roast potatoes and felt much better. And then had to have a nap.

Chris Clark

Chris’ squeaky voice is a thing to behold.

collapsing

10 mins in … will Chris mention at any point which famous journalist Gabor is father to…..the urge must be huge…

aneladgam_varelse

One of my lolcows is a polish podcaster Joanna Okuniewska. She has a trauma of being born as younger child (has 1 older sibling), because she didn’t consent to having siblings. She’s also traumatized by her mom who was making a cake and didn’t listened to young Joanna when she complained about something at school.

Chris Clark

Curious what DTG make of the Carefree Wandering channel. Semi related> his thesis is we’ve moved from sincere> authentic> profilic cultures. It’s a broad one with holes in it fore for sure. But his book is at least interesting and well argued. Made me think of our Hueltastic Steve Bartlett. He’s performing authenticity in service of his profile. I make the thesis sound more basic than it is. But I find him (Hans Moeller-the CFW guy) quite often compelling. He has a few excellent takes on the big boy JP as well. I’d actually love to hear Chris and Matt interview him. Not JP. Hans Moeller. Food for thought anyway. Sorry I mean Huel for thought. It enhances your cognitive capacity especially if consumed in full sunlight near some random chirping sparrows.

aneladgam_varelse

Recently I was taught that divorce by itself isn’t traumatic to children - as long as parents keep their divorce drama away from children

Lys

Was just in Vancouver, can confirm drug problems are worse due fentanyl lacing 😳 I was shocked to see someone running over to give naloxone to someone and found out the general public carry these kits and businesses hold them because it's so common. My 17 yr old cousin has had to administer 4 in Edmonton just coming across overdoses. Not something we have to deal with in Australia, yet anyway...

S Alexandra

Tale as old as time…but wouldn’t you know it, boring old mainstream medical treatment works for my severe lady ADHD! Eating well, exercising, resting, giving up booze, going to the doctor, evidence-based medication protocols blah blah blah. Reality is, I live in the best time to exist as a woman with ADHD, and what does it matter to others that many of us ladies are medicated. It feels a little moral panicky to me. My female ancestors likely had ADHD too, they were “repressed” or “suppressed” and lived through traumatic circumstances. But they also raised families and lived full lives. I intend on spending my finite intellectual energy on something a little more interesting than… mine or my ancestors trauma or repression… but that’s just me 😂

aneladgam_varelse

Thank you for saying that Poland is much better country than England, 100% agree.

Nina Davies

Blimey. This was so much my world at one time, working in a 12 step recovery rehab. When you swim in the soup of it all it is almost impossible not to take on the world view. Then, as my neuro untypical family hit the teenage years, I started to attend therapy myself .... which is a very long story of me convincing myself that all manner of crap was useful in some way (I was basically lonely and isolated and needed someone to talk to). I feel quite nauseous after listening you latest decoding. I have so many friends that love him - along with the chap that does the cold showers and ice baths.

Nina Davies

If you ever decide to dip into the non-dual world, Scott Kiloby has done a massive turn into 'cancer as suppressed anger' in the last 18 months. I suspect this may be linked to Gabor Mate.

Linda Sears

Not sure if this matters or not, but at the end of the description, “of” should be “off.”

collapsing

Thought this was a pretty good, tight episode. Maté clearly doesn’t seem to be an evil megalomaniac and clearly does have real trauma in his background so it was hard to parse but he is a secular guru using a sciencey perspective so thought it was reasonable critique as woo at times , cherry picking etc.. guy is quite old so felt a bit harsh at times but tbh main takeaway was Bartlet is insufferable. Like insufferable.

Dada de Broglie

He sounds like Johnny Depp. (Some people might think that’s a good thing)

Ymirsdreams

Thing is there *is* a great argument that trauma effects people's smoking habits: People who are stressed take quick, upper chest breaths, and this can become habitual. Combined with smoking, this creates a focus on the tar and other toxins in the upper part of the lungs, concentrating them on a small patch of areole, increasing the exposure, and increasing the risk of cancer. And my citation for that argument is that I made it up right now and I think it's pretty great. Edit: I asked 20 medical doctors, and one of them didn't say 'you're an idiot', so a statistically significant number of doctors don't think that argument is complete idiocy.

Linda Sears

Well done! I think a more helpful notion than being authentic is having self-awareness or self-knowledge. If a person feels like they are being pushed to be a doctor by their parents, yet they get squeamish around bodily fluids, then becoming a doctor to please them and gain status would be a really bad idea. It irks me when people are bullied to “be themselves” by doing what feels authentic for the person telling them to do something. Example- the truly awkward person at the party being told to “be themselves” and dance as if dancing is the only way to be authentic. I say this as a person who loves dancing. And I have been guilty of being “that” person.

DJ Wearing

I came out of this one a bit disappointed. There were a few good insights that I appreciated, but this episode didn't feel as deep or as well-researched as other episodes, especially coming after Dr. K. This may be at least partly because I'm a lot more familiar with Mate's online interviews and his work than I am with most gurus'. So during the episode i had a lot of 'yes but' moments, and I would easily notice missed opportunities to steel man his arguments and also some missed opportunities to criticise some of his tendecies (like Mate's frequent use of etymology to make a substantive point). If my authentic feedback upsets you, then perhaps a more positive and inspiring spin on it is that I simply wanted more decoding and I felt a bit sad when it ended, like when a film ends abruptly and you think 'is that it?'.

Robert Andrews

Hey, Paul Offit (!) mentioned your podcast episode with Worobey, Andersen and Holmes in response to Michael Shermer doing a podcast with Jay Bhattacharya.

JGraves

I think it might be interesting to do Bessel Vanderkolk as well because I think he has some guruish tendencies, but he’s more well respected. But I’ve heard mixed reviews. I went to an Institute of his about 10 years ago and I used to go see him do grand rounds at the Trauma Center. I don’t know there’s, there’s something compelling about the way he presents and maybe it is because he’s the kind of guru I would fall for. I guess that’s why I would be interested in Matt’s view especially because he seems very good at analyzing studies. I just don’t know if he really overstates some of the stuff he says around mindfulness and how trauma is contained in certain parts of the brain. I also know that he’s a big proponent of EMDR and I know that doesn’t have a lot of scientific evidence. I just be interested in how you see him overall.

Charlie

At one point matt says there’s basically no evidence that talk therapy is helpful other than CBT. Can someone link me to a source for that?

Ben Godek

The big issue I have with “authenticity” as a concept is that I think you can’t help but be true to yourself. Everyone is the sum total of all the things they’ve done and thoughts they’ve had. It seems like a way to arbitrarily isolate personality flaws and actions you regret from your “true” self.

brianshmrian

I wonder if there's a commonality in these clinician gurus where a frustration with not being able to fully help patients or explain their illnesses leads the clinician to seek alternative approaches and theories? Besides Dr. K and Gabor Maté, Dr. John Sarno comes to mind. In his book The Mindbody Prescription, he specifically talks about his frustrations with not being able to help patients with chronic pain that led to his finding his own approach which focused on emotions and repression.

Trees

Good episode. I like the connection to Rousseau. Authenticity is often a great thing, but that doesn't mean everyone is living a lie if they don't follow all their dreams.

Adam Sher

Agree with Matt, inauthenticity is underrated.

Chris Wishy

Great to hear your takes on Gabor. I heard him once talk about rheumatoid arthritis being due to stress and more prevalent in women because they undergo more stress than men and thought that sounds absolutely batshit… he has been recommended to me a bunch of times by smart people so I was left scratching my head on this one. 🙏

Peter

Still only halfway through it as I have rewound so many time already. I have had to navigate a lot this last 3 year in understanding what happened to my wife. This episode so far with authenticy, has been a big trigger to one part i never fully understood. A little background, my wife is a self help nerd, or as she would rather call it investor in self development. At a guess she would have close to 500 books on self help. Starting with the guru Tony Robbins, Christiane Northrup, Gabby Bernstein, and the last one i know she bought was by Marci Shimoff. SO not just self help, but a spiritual aspect as well. She started a new job, a job she had never done before. A L&D trainer at a uni. SO she had to learn this L&D program that she would be implementing. The program was created by a coaching company which seem to base it around Ken WIlbers Integral Theory. They also offered her workplace coaching. I knew nothing of either of these when she started, When she told me about the program just months into it, i called it cult like, she agreed and said i was not the first to say so. Ironic considering my learnings since of Ken Wilber & the coaching companies philosophies. Other than adopting a 4 quadrant program on relationships to the workplace, they also wanted people to use what they learn in everyday life. Oh also, there was this special 5th quadrant for high IQ people. Bringing it back to authenticity. I could never understand why she was talking about being her authentic self. Her authentic self for 25 years of marriage was being a kind, loving, compassionate person. Family orientated, marriage was sacrosanct. I was her rock in life and she mine. She was my world. So all of a sudden, her "new" authentic self became someone who would have an affair, who would lie to her family, me, herself, her boss. Then it is mentioned how that people holding you back from getting that ideal life you are entitled to. How people search for labels like people pleasers to justify a position so that they can be authentic. She told me she could not be with me as she was a people pleaser. She had decided she always puts me first and was missing out as I was putting my kids first and never fulfilled her needs. My kids were very good sportsman and required a lot of attention to get to events and would have sports on Saturday & Sundays and took up a lot of time. While she was happy to bask in their glory, in the end punishing me for their success which wouldn't have come without my time. It was her choice not to be a part of it, preferring time alone in her "world" of self development. So while she has had these pseudoscience beliefs for a long time, been reading and learning. None of it had an impact on our marriage. All of the downside came after starting this new job, and being coached. Learning to speak "My Truth" with "My Integrity" so as to live an authentic life. Whilst i never fully understood the authentic talk. Listening to Matt and Chris explain it, it is exactly where she ended up. To her i was holding her back because of her unsaid needs. She was super proud of the success of the kids and the work i had done, yet her needs were not met. Her needs as i have found out since was A new house, wealth, travel etc, manifested with the help of the universe. Ironic again as i was the one who supported her taking this new job, in fact i was always the one who had more faith in her ability that she did. Authenticity to these people is changing to become the person you want to be in that perfect world. Where as her authentic self was that caring, compassionate, loving woman who would do anything for anyone. But self help labels like people pleasing gives them a sense of they are missing out. Enneagrams and MBTI used to tell people who they are. Coaches telling you that you are entitled to whatever life you can "afford". After we separated she even sent me a copy of 5 love languages to show how incompatible we are, with no self awareness of who wrote it and the lack of science behind it. 25 years together and nothing but love, then she entered an echo chamber that ignited the flame of self help with the help of a coach who allowed her to look back and nit pick our marriage, even to the point of her telling me, she didnt really like the colour of the brick on the house we bought, to prove her point about us. Giving her permission to leave so you can be your authentic self. The shame of it all is there is nothing authentic in what she did. She learned to unlove me, she learned she could have a different life and was entitled to it, she learned a new way to look at relationships, rather than enjoy the one she had. She learned to commit to change for changes sake due to the coaches Neuro-Semantic & NLP ideology. Axes of change. She had an affair with was unauthentic, as he found out when he walked away after realising she was acting irrationally. She was getting all the support from the coach and her workplace, but couldn't be honest and say she initiated it all with an affair, instead blaming me. 9 months sending mixed messages to me as she struggled with her authenticity, she still had feelings for me, but has committed to change. Then finally walks away weeks after telling me she was confused, she still had feelings. You can't have both, so 2 months later has a new man in her life, a man manifested by the universe. Such authenticity in what she had done. Everything Matt & Chris mention on authenticity explains how she saw the world. There is no doubt she would have read Gabor Mates and listened to him. Eckhardt Tolle is another. In the words of her friend who she asked why she was doing what she was doing to our marriage. "To be the best you can be, and to bring out the goddess within".

Neely McCormick

As an American (and New Yorker) I have to say that I am so sick of the word “authentic” and my authentic self wants to punch the people who utter the words “authentic self”, in my presence, in the mouth.

Martin Birch

Maybe it’s just me, but the pseudo-profound bullshit excreted by Mate and Dr K is massively more annoying than the psychotic babble spewed by Brett Weinstein.

Nancy Hale

Because I’m an inauthentic people-pleaser, I felt obligated to find the emotional repression in male lung cancer patients study that Mate’ cited . . .

Matt Dear

I prefer Szabo's Dreams to Maté's

Lori Kiel

I appreciated when Matt framed the calls for authenticity as an expression of contemporary culture; that was a 💡moment for me!

Doll House

so sad to be trapped in a robot lawyer prison