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Robert Wright Gurometer (Video) *UNEDITED* (Patreon)

Published:
2022-02-24 21:28:53
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

Hi everyone,

Brain is a bit mush from an early morning recording so nothing funny or interesting to say here except here is the Gurometer episode for Bob. We get a bit into recent geopolitics and usual tangents at the start so sorry for that but y'know...

Audio will be uploaded in a short while and *I promise I will get the bonus RSS feed updated soon*. Thanks for your patience on that.

Enjoy!

Files

Robert Wright Gurometer *UNEDITED*

Comments

collapsing

just started. love ukranian flag chris. bob is a real apologist for non democracies and platforms assad and putin apologists which is fine but not benign. its politics guys and ultimately it's your harmful elephant in the room.

collapsing

so glad you did that chris. he's a great power apologist- just not US- and wrong on virtually everything. his lack of understanding of detail is comical , his decisions not to engage eg with putins speech is sam harris level and he was completely exposed when he found out recently that hitchens (not a fan) had been with kurds and was utopian not fucking wmd. something he's never done. used to like him. now he's a useful idiot who feels he didnt get recognition he deserved- see parrot room

ed74

I think Bob has tried to spell out pretty hard that trying to understand motivations (cognitive empathy) shouldn't be taken as excusing actions taken by a negative actor. It's a fine hair.

ed74

The point is recognizing that other actors tend to rationalize the crap out of their own motivations, and generally believe they're acting rationally in their best interest.

ed74

Does the fact that Bob's field overlapping heavily with yours possibly depress your evaluation of his pseudo profoundness? Or do you worry about an inverse effect with anyone else?

elcid

The old wife beater eh Matt? Gonna have to switch from high end single malts to whatever the bogan beer is up in FNQ!

Tom Allison

I have to say I'm a little disappointed with Chris's apparent inability to understand Bob's concept of "cognitive empathy" in foreign policy as a more sophisticated take on the goings-on than the all-too-easy feel-good response to the events of the moment (such as, for instance, waving the flag of the clear underdog currently being attacked). I don't put myself forward as an expert in these matters, by any means, but the little I have heard Bob discuss his idea it has seemed right on to me -- If we have learned anything from observing/analyzing in-group/out-group dynamics, it has to be that emphasizing one side of a two-sided coin only distorts our understanding -- even if it feels good. (I've got other complaints/critiques of Bob's stuff -- I think he tries to expand a sense of purpose beyond it appropriate bounds, for example -- but I can't understand why Chris and Matt don't follow him here...).

Karen

Bob is a fervent defender of international law and has consistently argued that to be effective and robust, international law requires that all parties adhere to it. The US is in the proverbial glass house in this respect, and as such, in no position to throw stones at others. Victims of war deserve empathy, regardless of which part of the world they reside, and which country is the aggressor. I have yet to see Bob argue otherwise. Labeling Bob as an apologist is a disservice to the cause of international law IMO.

Duncan

Now that you're adding more dimensions to the gurometer, didn't one of your recent interviewees, maybe Timbah on Toast or Julian Walker, comment about "sneering affect" or something similar as a possible dimension? I think it was mentioned with regard to Douglas Murray.

Tom Allison

I should get busy reading the rest of the discussion here in case others have made the points I‘d like to, only better ;). Worth noting is the latest Wright Show with a pretty good explanation of „cognitive empathy“ some reminders of history when shaping ones sympathy/empathy in this instance and analysis and a nice send up of Bob’s new Guru status: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-wright-show/id505824847?i=1000552295342

Allan Hutton

I keep noticing a lot of chat about America, here and in YouTube comments. This is a European issue. Of course the USA has to make the right noises concerning Russia shut this is about Europe. I live in Scotland, about as far away from Russia as you can get in Europe but I feel like this is literally happening just over the border from me. It seems to me that no matter the issue, a lot of Americans have a very US-centric view, even the ones who seem to follow and write about global issues/politics. It’s really odd to observe

Tom Allison

Just heard a This American Life episode that pointed out a plausible conjecture that Putin may have been involved in the murder of hundreds of fellow Russians to pump up his popularity by attacking the falsely accused perpetrators when he first rose to power. Lots of ways that may have gone down, but for the sake of "Cognitive Empathy" discussion, let's imagine it was as bad as it may have been -- willingness to perpetrate crimes against humanity to win an election as a stepping stone to effective dictatorship accompanied by repeated murder to suppress domestic opposition/critical voices. Does that describe someone whose motives one should take the time to try to understand -- or simply oppose by any means available? I think this may be the argument against "cognitive empathy" - that at some point a figure has crossed the moral rubicon and there is no choice but to oppose them and any attempt to better understand them just drains energy from that effort. I would like to hear Bob's counter to such a case. I think he might say, if your opponent is entrenched it really is the only option -- sure, killing a mass murderer would be the first choice, but if that mass murderer is a head of state and has proven themselves unreachable, then sorting out how they tick and figuring out how to steer them away from their worst possible excesses/most destructive tendencies is the next best option.