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Buffy 6x9 - full reaction (Patreon)

Published:
2022-11-27 17:00:09
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

she came back wrong???

Files

Buffy 609.mkv

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Comments

Stargazer1682

Well, if you can't trust the conclusions Spike reaches, who can you trust? Besides everyone....?

Kate

So I think you're half right both times on the spell? Willow's spell originally was for Buffy and Tara, only. She specifies them in it's casting "for Buffy and Tara." Everyone else passing out and being affected was a proximity thing, I *think* because the rest of the bag caught fire, which made it go wrong in two ways: affecting more people than intended and being far stronger than inended. edit: So, yeah. Willow fully heard Tara's objections and turned immediately around to do the very same thing to her, again. Only now understanding the full weight of it and how harmful and manipulative it was. All because Tara put a condition on the week of no magic. You can see it in Willow's face. If she had a guarantee of keeping Tara, she was willing to try a week w/o magic. "One week, that's easy." But once Tara took away her guarantee of forgiveness with "and then we'll see," Willow realized it wasn't going to be easy. Even if Tara stayed, there would be a difficulty to work through, as a couple. Not only did Willow not want to chance losing Tara, she didn't want any sort of obstacle in their relationship either. It was about staying on equal terms with her and not being viewed as having fucked up as much as it was staying together. She wasn't willing to risk it. It's really quite stomach turning when you deep dive into her thought process.

Alison

Buffy had on a long skirt so I guess it was easy access.

zerofk

When Buffy was turned into a rat she later told Xander she remembered "a sudden need for cheese," so it makes sense that Amy would remember at least some of her rat life. Remember that Spike also used the chip in Family to show that Tara was fully human. So the chip definitely has some way of distinguishing humans from demons. Or at the very least Spike fully believes it does, as does the gang by accepting Spike's pain as proof of Tara's humanity.

Stargazer1682

Lexi: "I wish someone would Smash me..." Me: Um.... Phrasing... Also... Okay... Lexi: Into little smithereens Me: Oh... Never mind... 👀

Stargazer1682

Agreed about Giles. The writers could have found much better ways to write Giles off. One idea, and it's loosely tied to a separate thought that season 6 could benefit from a bit of a time jump, but could maybe still work here - I think it could have been great if the reason Giles left was if he now he a daughter he was raising alone back in England; maybe one he named after Buffy. It would make sense he wouldn't want to raise her in Sunnydale; and I think Buffy would have understood and maybe put on a braver face to make it easier for him to leave, which would only make things harder for her.

Stargazer1682

I mean, it's not *really* the first time one of Willow's spell backfired and affected the whole Scoobies. Remember "Something Blue"? Buffy and Spike ended up engaged, Xander was a literal demon magnate and Giles lost his vision. At least that time she made them all cookies, she didn't even do that this time. Xander gives Willow a lot of leeway (and to some degree enables her), but he also can't cast stones, on account of his love spell gone wrong; and it apparently turns out he summons a dancing demon that resulted in at least one death and no one batted an eye about that. I know the popular rationale is that he was covering because he thought Dawn had really done it, but if it wasn't actually Xander, I think it'd be more like he was covering because he thought another one of Willow's spells went awry. Although the reasoning that just because it was in the shop, it had to be one of them doesn't really track. It could have been anyone who came into the shop that day...

hannah roboto

i think both buffy and spike are toxic in ways to each other this season. she was the one calling him a "thing/evil thing" early in the episode, which is also pretty terrible. not to blame buffy, but he didn't start acting like an asshole until she provoked him on purpose. i think she wanted that reaction from him. even though spike is more empathetic and seems to have more feelings than most, he's still at the end of the day a soulless vampire.

Stargazer1682

Funny hearing anyone think Red Dwarf might have been too scary. About as far away from that as possible. You should definitely check it out.

Stargazer1682

I really don't like this episode. It's like the writers shrugged off giving any rhyme, reason or limitation to what Willow, or evidentially Amy can do with their magic. Last season Willow could barely teleport Glory without a massive migraine that lasted a week and seriously weakened her; now she practically is a god. Amy was a little advanced in season 3, but come on, flicking her fingers like she's Prue Halliwell to close the doors and blinds? And Willow's a regular Sabrina the Teenage Witch, zapping her clothes on in the last episode. But the stuff at The Bronze goes even further beyond the pale. Like, what the hell did they do to the band to switch the physical people who were playing MID SONG?? Did they create a temporal fold? And Amy can just snap her fingers and entrance a woman to come onto Willow??? Amy screwed Xander's love spell and that took a great deal more effort. I'm not unconvinced Amy's mom managed to swap back consciousness at some point. The rest of that stuff was way over the top, but of course they had to show how far Willow's going down the rabbit hole of magic abuse, as if they hadn't belabored that point already.... The stuff with Spike, and especially that ending... Look, I like Spike as an antagonist, but I hate Bike; and it's just so weird seeing people act like he's reformed or a good guy now. Even before he gets the chip out, he's playing on Buffy's insecurities over coming back, telling her he's the only one he can turn to. The rest of her support system may be otherwise preoccupied or seemingly unconcerned about her mental health, but it's really untrue that Spike is the only person she can turn to. But Spike sees more than what the rest of them will acknowledge, so he knows he can say that, even if it's not true, and get away with it. But the second Spike suspects the chip isn't working, his first impulse is to go back to killing random people - exhibit A that he hasn't really changed. Exhibit B, the moment he realizes it's Buffy specific he presses that to his advantage, telling her she came back wrong. Whether or not that's true remains to be seen; and even whether or not Spike believes it doesn't matter, because he's more keen to use that against Buffy and it doesn't have to be true to do that. He just needs to make her believe it or at least doubt herself. Even if he's right, he's using all of these insecurities to isolate her and play mind games with her; gaslighting her into lowering her defenses with him and all because he's such a peach of a guy.

Britney

I'm glad you pointed out the toxicity in Buffy and Spike's relationship. Some people are hardcore Spuffy shippers and just choose to ignore all the bad stuff or give it a pass just because it's a fictional relationship. They do have some great moments together, but all of the toxic and abusive behavior should not be ignored. It's not one sided though as I think they are both toxic and abusive to each other. Seasons 5 and 6 really deal a lot with real life issues, so I definitely understand why their relationship was written this way. Although, truthfully, I would have liked them as a couple more if they were like they were in Something Blue from season 4. lol I guess I'll just always be a Bangel shipper for life. Not sure if you knew this or not, but SMG has also stated before that she's a Bangel shipper and wasn't a big fan of the Spike/Buffy relationship. Also, I can't wait to see your reaction to the next episode. It's a pretty wild one.

John Alexander

All completely valid points re Giles in the intro. Spot on.

Claire Eyles

In terms of Tara and Willow's breakup, having had first hand experience of both addiction & having a very close friend decide to set boundaries with me, and then temporarily ending our friendship because I almost immediately abused those boundaries, I have to say I am 100% on Tara's side here. Go back to episode 3, when Tara and Willow are performing the spell to make the demon solid, and look at Tara's expression when Willow pulls away from her and does the spell by herself, there is a recognition of maybe there's an issue there; Tara then tries to gently confront Willow about her increasing reliance on magic in 'All The Way', and Willow almost immediately starts making excuses and getting defensive; fast forward to later in that episode and Tara is literally told that her 'shutting her mouth' on the subject of Willow's abuse of magic would be a good start, followed later by Willow deciding to use a forgetting spell on Tara, 'violating her mind' as Tara later puts it - sidenote as well, the sex they have in OMWF is technically non consensual, and therefore sexual assault, because Tara is unknowingly under the influence of a mind altering spell and therefore cannot give informed consent to any sexual encounter. So then Tara outright confronts Willow on what she's done, how she's violated her mind, and how out of control her reliance on magic really is, and she still gives Willow a chance by setting a firm boundary with her & making it clear that she is close to walking away from the relationship, thereby also giving her a consequence for what will happen if that boundary is ignored. And what does Willow do? She immediately jumps straight into using magic, again, to try and wipe both Buffy and Tara's memory. She used up every chance Tara gave her, and now she has face to the consequences.

Claire Eyles

In regards to the 'de-ratting' spell, the writer has admitted they thought the spell would be really cool if it was written in another language (Italian), but didn't stop to consider what it would actually sound like when spoken by an English speaking actor saying the words phonetically (and yes they also thought it sounded a tad ridiculous & realised their mistake). Also Amy was apparently de-ratted in season 6, because someone pointed out that domesticated rats have a lifespan of around 2-4 years, so either rat Amy was gonna have to die at some point or be bought back.

Stargazer1682

Tom and Nicole were Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman, who were married for a time and we're considered a Hollywood power couple - until they got divorced.

Rio de Tanana

* Willow’s spell effected EVERYONE because it got out of control. They showed how. The fireplace, sparks flying, bag melting. * The general audience didn’t get as spun about Gile’s reasons for leaving as you. Especially since his reason for leaving was foreshadowed since 6x4. Frankly I’m on his side in this moment.

Alexis Billinge

I don’t talk about this openly a lot but I have a lot of very complex emotions about giles’ arc because when I was depressed in college and after college, my dad and step mom were constantly forcing me out into the world, I wasn’t allowed to live at home, I begged for support and was never given it in a way that actually helped me, and for years I hated my parents and still have some massive abandonment issues, but I do try my best sometimes to think about how my parents have their own lives and problems and even though it wasn’t right, I don’t really think they had any idea how to handle it, but I do still talk to my dad (not so much my step mom) and I’m doing much better than I was all those years ago, but that arc for me is very reminiscent of my own issues and thus I can’t just be angry at Giles.

Jack

BtVS is perfect at giving us exactly what we want, in exactly the manner we don't want it. Remember Angel's soul being returned just as Buffy was going to have to kill him? Remember Oz returning for Willow just as she had moved on? And now Buffy has been brought back from the dead - yay! And Willow has come out of her shell and discovered she's an amazing witch - yay! And she's managed to de-rat Amy - yay!! Its motto might as well be "be careful what you wish for".