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Buffy 7x2 - full reaction (Patreon)

Published:
2023-03-12 17:00:03
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

well now she knows ahhhh 

link: https://www.dropbox.com/s/06ogti7n235uap8/Buffy%20702.mkv?dl=0

Files

Comments

Derek Garrard

This always feels like a pretty meh episode overall, except for that last scene. And what a scene it is, still one of my top 5 moments of the entire show

Stargazer1682

Lexi (reacting to the end of the intro: And the way this is not fucking Buffy... Me: I don't think they'd be allowed to show that...

zerofk

I like the misdirect in this episode. "From beneath you it devours" - we think it's going to be about the monster we see in this episode, but that is just Anya's curse. And I absolutely *love* Dawn threatening Spike. The way she looks at him after saying it, there's no hesitation or doubt. She is absolutely terrifying. "Spilling useless buckets of salt over your ... ending." Even when he's insane, Spike has a way with words.

Stargazer1682

My take on Angel versus Spike and the whole soul thing: Most vampires, including Spike, are essentially who they were as a human, but now uninhibited without a soul; and becoming a vampire just adds the vampire form and thirst for blood. "The Prodigal," showed that Liam was acting out, in a bid for his father's attention. He couldn't get his approval, so he settled for his scorn. “Disappointment? A more dutiful son you couldn’t have asked for. My whole life you’ve told me in word, in glance, what it is you required of me, and I’ve lived down to your every expectations, now haven’t I?” But even as Darla pointed out, Liam still desired his father's acceptance of him through everything - even death. But becoming a vampire was a step too far, especially for Liam's father and even Liam himself. At some point he arguably believed he would have stop being a wastrel, earn his father's acceptance and live a respectable life; but becoming a vampire would mean he could never do that and I think it broke him. Where most other vampires go by their human name (William took the name Spike later to sound tougher, Darla was an endearment used by the Master) Liam immediately chooses Angelus - but it's implied that this was because his sister thought he was angel sent back to her. He didn't want to be Liami anymore, so he'll be an "angel". Even then, he doesn't just kill to feed, he targets people and goes after the things and people that make them feel most human - he did this with Dru, Buffy, Giles, Holtz, as well as the victims seen in Amends. It's like he feels he he needs to take away from other what he feels was taken away from him; all while doing everything in his power to hide or suppress the slimmest reminder of his humanity. When the Judge read Dru, Spike and Dalton (Spike's lackey), he detected residual humanity in all of them; enough to even burn Dalton, meaning the average vampire has some trace humanity. But Angel didn't read - but Angel had also just fed on the woman in the alley. In "I Only Have Eyes for You," Angel was practically manic from the teacher possessing him and the feeling of humanity that came with it; and decided only a "vile kill" could rid him of that feeling. It's possible that such acts suppress any remnant humanity a vampire has, which was why the Judge couldn't read him and why Angelus would be motivated to be so bloodthirsty. He's trying to ease the pain that even a trace of humanity brings him. When trying to awaken Acathla, he also talked longingly about how it will "all be over" indicating that Angelus had a death wish.

Stargazer1682

The Chip still seems to be firing. You can see Spike grab his head in that moment. There were actually several successive screams in that moment, which I feel was done very well. Because first it's Ronnie, now human again, screaming in pain of being impaled; followed by Spike screaming upon realizing he impaled a human, and again from the Chip, grabbing his head. At this point, this send Spike spiralling, because this is just another moment of guilt piled on top of the other moments he was trying to ignore.

mary smith

Regarding how different a vampire is with and without a soul, I think it ultimately depends on what kind of human they are. I always imagine a soul is just adding the compacity to feel guilt & remorse...a moral compass of sort. I think Liam was a pretty shitty person, so didn't have much residual human capacity to feel/morality. Putting a soul in a vampire like that would drastically change them. William seemed like a pretty sensitive guy with a lot of capacity to feel, so he likely retained some residue of that as spike (we've seen these moments of compassion from spike) although fleeting and misguided. I would imagine adding a soul to vampire like that wouldn't have such drastic effect on his personality, but would still effect his motives/morals equally.

Adoreandu

[Looking at Buffy] "It's what you wanted, isn't it?" [Looking up] "It's what you wanted, isn't it?" I don't know who it is that Spike was talking to the second time, but I think it might've been God. He went to a church, laid on the cross.

Gaius Frakking Baltar

Coincidentally, the Slash Film website posted an article two days ago about the church scene from this episode. Joss Whedon had watched footage of the scene after it had been filmed by another director, and found it to be utterly "cringe-worthy". It was so bad that Whedon decided to rewrite the dialogue and reshoot it while taking over the directing duties. James Marsters later said that the reshoot of the church scene with Whedon was his "fondest" memory of filming. https://www.slashfilm.com/1224677/one-spike-scene-in-buffy-was-so-cringey-joss-whedon-rewrote-it-from-scratch/

Megan

I think we can't yet fully judge how different Spike is or isn't from this episode (though I do agree with others saying he was never going to be as different as Angel/Angelus, a special sadistic case). I mean, Spike's losing his shit, so we'll have to see if/when he's a bit saner. But his offers of help, both in Buffy's house and when they're inspecting the hole in the ground, just have a different flavor to me. Like he's a tool that Buffy can use in her fight if she wants, or send him away, as she wants. It feels very unselfish on his end, very unlike his normal soulless self who is motivated to help in part (in my opinion) to impress Buffy, or as a grand tribute to his "love" for Buffy, even when she's dead. Now he seems willing to do whatever Buffy wants him to not for love but because she's the commander of the army for good and he is a willing soldier. The scene in the bar when he was REALLY acting like his old self, as in, practically his season 2 self, was in my opinion a complete act. Buffy already said she knew he was different and wasn't telling her something, and Anya was about to spill the beans. He wanted to convince Buffy he was still evil and throw her off the trail, and also shut Anya up, because he for whatever reason didn't want Buffy to know about the soul yet. I think he perhaps didn't want to tell her because he knew it would make her see him in a completely different light and make her much more likely to treat him well and forgive him, and he doesn't feel he deserved that.

Ron Fehr

My guess is that the school has only been in use for about a week, but the building itself has been there slightly longer, although still under construction. So it would not be a stretch to think that Spike could already have been in the basement for a little while.

Ron Fehr

If you think back Xander and Spike did sleep together, but only sleep. In the episode Hush, when Giles asked Xander to take Spike home, so he could have time with his 'orgasm friend.'

Ron Fehr

I think that the reason that Spike didn't seem any different at first was because he had just gotten his soul back recently, whereas Angel had around 100 years with a soul before he met Buffy. Angel had time to adapt, whereas Spike was still trying to figure things out.

Cool Engines

The reason he didn't seem different as well as he was trying to put on an act as well he even said it. Costume didnt work.

indaeo

I feel like the fact that he didn't want her to know he had his soul back showed that he did it for himself and to be a better person (whether it's someone Buffy could come to like or respect or care about is another discussion), but he didn't do it to manipulate her or immediately show her he's better now so please love him or anything like that.

Cory James

I love when he says "to the be the kind of man who would never-" because you know that was it. That moment. He wasn't able to feel guilt without a soul and yet he got so close to it that it confused him and made him angry and he couldn't reconcile that without a soul and he knew it. The 'costume' was pretending to be the same old Spike. He said the things Spike said, tried to do the things Spike did...but it was just an act to make it seem like he didn't have a soul cause he was hiding it. Pretending nothing changed. The chip still works here. The ping from harming a human is what rattles his brain and makes him go 'crazy' again. Now. Dawn. I LOVE HER. "If you hurt my sister at all. Touch her. You're going to wake up on fire." and then Spike is like "When did your sister become unbelievably scary." and aww. Their friendship is so strained.