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Angel 5x18 - full reaction (Patreon)

Published:
2023-12-13 17:00:12
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

this got me emotional

link: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/1d576lpg133ur65oihh08/Angel-518.mkv?rlkey=wag5prcfvve425ykba4qtahs3&dl=0

Files

Comments

Ron Fehr

I'm glad that Angel called the place where Gunn is at a hell dimension instead of a holding cell, like Wolfram and Hart had called it. The way I look at it, there can only be one of two things, a heavenly dimension or a hell dimension, no in-between.

HeiKira

I knew you would end up liking Connor. Everytime you trashed him, I was like, "just wait". College Connor is best Connor

Free Your Geek

This is the Connor we could’ve gotten had he never been kidnapped and raised in a hell dimension by a psychopath who poisoned his mind for 16-17 years. The way I interpret/understand it, Wesley wanted Illyria to focus on the made up memories. Because it helps him with his guilt for kidnapping Connor and his actions throughout the last bit of season 3 and most of season 4. Wesley: “They were created for a reason.” Illyria: “To hide from the truth?” Wesley: “To endure it.”

Ron Fehr

I saw a comment from someone who was watching Alley, from Alleybox, react to this episode The theory was that only those in close proximity to the Orlon Window when it was smashed would have there old memories returned to them. Connor was simply to far away.

Jontor11

I LOVE this episode. All the father/son moments are amazing. This was what we were hoping for in season 4 but never got. This is writer Drew Goddard's specialty. Writing episodes with LOTS of callbacks, Sahjhan, the prophecy, Connor liking older women... So good.

Stargazer1682

The reason the show got cancelled was because Joss pushed for an early renewal. Usually the show's pick-up would come late in the season, and he wanted earlier confirmation so the writers could start breaking stories for season 6 and even begin teasing them out in season 5. Angel was actually still one of the WB's top rated shows; if memory serves, season 5 held steady if not slightly higher on average than season 4. A former exec for the WB later admitted that cancelling Angel was probably a mistake; which raises the question of just how much of a pissing match did Joss get in with the programming exec that the exec would view it as some kind of ultimatum - renew us now or cancel us - that he went with cancel?

Demnevanni

Yeah, I think it's pretty clear by the end of the episode that Connor got his memories back - in the fight we see all the memories returning and then we zoom out from Connors face, immediately followed by him going beast mode and looking properly angry for the first time in the fight. Also the line about Vail not being able to show him anything he hasn't seen before makes zero sense for "college Connor" but is literally true for old Connor. And lastly, Connors line about him being done fighting and his later line in Angel's office about him wanting to leave immediately make more sense AND hit a lot harder when it is double memory Connor saying them and basically doing exactly what Wesley said about embracing the fake memories in order to be able to bear the real ones...

Stargazer1682

This episode is one of my favorites, especially for season 5; because it gives Connor the life he desperately deserves and is perhaps one of the best redemptions of either series. Like, any time a reactor says they can't stand Connor early on, that they'll never like him and are happy to see him leave; I'm just sitting there thinking, "just you wait...."

Stargazer1682

I love Spike saying Illyria can possibly talk to plants - because early in season 3, Cordelia mentions that Fred appeared to be carrying on a conversation with a houseplant. I think this might have also been called back to in "Spin the Bottle," when the gang is tripping out, Fred starts inspecting a plant, saying, "This is important. It's so beautiful..."

zerofk

It seems odd to put a whole range of weapons right next to the urn, ready for Sahjan to use. If they were only meant for Connor, wouldn't it be better to just give him one? I have to say I understand Wesley, from his point of view. He's desperate, and grieving. His decision is not unlike Giles' in The Wish. "How do you know the other world is any better than this? Because it has to be." In Giles' case he was right. Wesley turned out to be wrong, but just like Giles he too could not imagine it being any worse than his reality. He had already lost everything - or so he thought.

Stargazer1682

This episode kind of underscores the trouble with prophecies, they tend to be a self-fulfilling paradox; especially when people allow themselves to be influenced or even dictated by the prophesied outcome. Become Connor is said to be the one who will kill Sahjhan, Cyvus stacks the deck, forcing a situation whereby ONLY Connor can even be part of the fight where Sahjhan is killed. Yet, Cyvus doesn't know for a fact that this would be the encounter where Connor kills Sahjhan. For all Cyvus knew, the prophecy would only be fulfilled after years of pursuit and swearing lusty vengeance on Sahjhan for killing Angel and Cyvus during this first encounter. And sure, by precluding Angel from being part of the fight, Cyvus cements his own role in the fulfillment of the prophecy, by guaranteeing that Connor and only Connor would be the one potentially kills Sahjhan. Angel being part of the fight wouldn't have necessarily precluded the same outcome; and if Cyvus hadn't known about the prophecy, he have made completely different decisions, including whether or not let Angel fight. But because he did know the prophecy, that knowledge swayed his decisions and produced the outcome of the prophecy.

Adoreandu

Connor does remember, and he understands and appreciates what Angel did for him. It's like the best possible thing.

Phoenix Dawn

He definitely remembers! It is one of my fave episodes!

Andy

When Illyria has her foot on Spike's neck, he's reaching for his clipboard to write down notes.

Ian Ramsey

Prophecy aside, it seems clear (in the final fight scene) that we are supposed to think Sahjhan is going to choke Connor to death. It's only after Wesley destroys the cube that Connor's fighting skills from his old memories emerge, giving him the advantage to overpower [him]. So, maybe Wesley was... destined to break the cube? I dunno. I agree - Wesley's conspiracy theory about Angel trading Fred's life for Connor's happiness seems a bit far fetched. Maybe Angel's comment about Wesley's lack of sleep (and continued grief) earlier in the episode was put there to make his later suspicion more plausible.

Britney

This is a really good episode, but it's also kind of infuriating to see this and know that this is the Connor we could have and should have gotten last season. Sure, he was dealing with trauma from being raised by Holtz and growing up in a hell dimension, but the whole Connor hating Angel thing was dragged out far too long, in my opinion. I think it was fine to have him be against Angel for the first part of season 4, but then the writers should have had him come to his senses and actually be a part of the team. Instead, they had him be super annoying for the entirety of the season, to the point where we all couldn't wait to get rid of him. I think his sendoff at the end of season 4 was a good way to end his character arc, but I do also like that they brought him back in this episode to give his character a bit of redemption.

Cory James

omg I can't believe I missed the post for this LOL I love this episode! His comments at the end are way too pointed and intent to not have been the real Connor coming through. Like he is consciously choosing to embrace what Angel gave him while acknowledging him. I always love that Sahjahn's comments on Free Will come right before Wesley exercises his own and realizes he made a mistake, except his free will is what brings Connor back and kills Sahjahn. I find it funny that Wesley lost the memory of keeping justine in a cage and, it seems, his memories of Lilah and of Jasmine entirely. so it makes me wonder how they honestly thought they spent the last year and where the gritty version of Wesley that remained came from in his memories.