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Buffy 3x12 (Extended) - Helpless (Patreon)

Published:
2021-04-09 17:01:02
Edited:
2024-07-10 00:02:59
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

So my conclusion (yet again) is that Buffy is TOO freaking good for this world.. And oh, the watcher's council SUCKS.

Files

Buffy The Vampire Slayer 3x12 - Helpless .mp4

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Comments

Todd Bolton

Good callback to Giles’s comment to Buffy in “Revelations” – “You have no respect for me, or the job I perform.”

Ron Fehr

Giles only ever knew Buffy as the Slayer, with slayer strength. It definitely tested his trust in her when he had to see her without her powers. If he didn't trust her completely before, I think that seeing her resourcefulness when helpless helped to strengthen that trust. I love the point that was made at the end of the episode. Giles displayed a father's love for Buffy, by trying to redeem himself for his earlier actions.

Steve Quast

Poor Buffy. Just once she would like to have a GOOD birthday!

Jordan Haddow

Great reaction for a great episode. Oooo, that feeling of utter betrayal as Giles slips that needle under her skin. Emotionally, thos episode reminds me so much of Prophecy Girl. Her devastation at learning her future fate, her feeling of betrayal from Giles, and her going headlong into danger so selflessly. Then there are those watchers council jerks. I can't remember, at the moment, if this is the first time we actually saw one of them, but I do know this is when I've thought of how many times they've been jerks to Buffy. For neither Kendra nor Faith, did they ever bother to give Buffy any information of their existence. They each had watchers, so they knew of them. Also, if you really think about the beginning of the show, they most likely did something to make sure Buffy's mom chose to Sunnydale. Giles had been established as the school librarian before Buffy moved there. To them, it appears, she is nothing more than their pawn. Anyways, looking forward to your next reaction as always.

Steve Quast

"Then why did you seem more excited last year when you got a severed arm in a box?" Oh, the good times!

Steve Quast

PS I love that they keep bringing Mr. Pointy up. lol

Steve Quast

I would think to a vampire the sweetest thing next to slayer's blood would be watcher's council blood.

Steve Quast

"Why don't you call your friend in here, we'll discuss it over dinner." That's what Hobbs gets for slacking on the job.

Steve Quast

"How much for a lapdance for me and my buddy?" Pardon me for a second.... *magically steps into frame and smashes man's face in with a frying pan* ok.....continue.

Steve Quast

"The Watcher's Council has decreed that you are to be relieved of your watcher's duty immediately." "On what grounds?" "That we're assholes."

R J Walker (FumblesMcStupid)

Great point about the Prophecy Girl parallels, she even throws things at him while he's standing in almost the same place, except this time the force of the box hitting the wall is just so, well, weak :( And also the 'I wonder who the next one will be, will you train her?' has sort of got turned on its head.

UTU49

My favorite thing about this episode is how Buffy and Giles react when Quentin Travers says, "You have a father's love for the child, which is useless to the cause." What reaction, you ask? Exactly. Neither Buffy nor Giles reacts with any surprise, protest, or disagreement [or embarrassment]. Not only have Buffy and Giles become like family, but it has become so normal for them that they don't even react when someone says it out loud.

R J Walker (FumblesMcStupid)

First Buffy. This is one of my all time favourite Buffy episodes for Buffy awesomeness. Everything she does is so damned brilliant, I 100% agree with her decisions, everything she says, she’s epic and, on first watch, I cheered out loud when she killed Kralik. I love the ‘what will I be if I’m not the slayer’ and the fact that she is now just a ‘normal girl’ dealing with ‘normal’ creeps when she tries to walk home late at night. I love how resourceful she is, but she’s always been good at that sort of thing. Also, the way I see the title, she’s not truly helpless when she’s in that house, she has her wits, the only time she’s truly helpless is when Giles hypnotises her. In the same vein, for Buffy the crime, at least initially, is less what the Council is doing but that Giles betrayed her. Poor Buffy, in this episode and the last she has been let down by her mother, father, and substitute father. What a kick in the teeth and another spectacular birthday :((( I loved Kralik as an enemy. Truly psychotic even before he was turned. Which led me to an interesting thought one day…how did he get turned if he lived in a secure mental institution? Which led me to some awful speculation…did the Council turn him for this? No idea, just thought I’d throw some more fuel on the fire lol Thing is, and this is an ANGEL SPOILER S4. DOMI YOU HAVE WATCHED THIS BUT YOU MIGHT NOT REMEMBER IT SO IT’S UP TO YOU IF YOU WANT TO KEEP READING. ALSO, I HAVE NOT READ THE COMICS SO THIS MIGHT ALL BE RUBBISH LOL Anyway, Wesley believes he’s head boy at the academy. He say ‘I’ve heard rumours about a test they put trainee watchers through at the academy, they used to do it in the past to slayers’. So, he’s talking about the test as if they don’t do it any more to slayers, like that’s something he has been taught. And my thought was this…would they have done it to Kendra if she had reached 18? She was definitely the ‘good’ slayer, raised from an early age, with the handbook, would they have risked losing a slayer that is very competent AND controllable? Maybe not. Do they only do it when they have somebody like Buffy who doesn’t follow the rules and is clearly beyond their influence? I dunno, just thought that was a possibility and the reason why the Council doesn’t seem to tell trainee watchers about this test happening to slayers in the present, because it doesn't always happen. And damn Joyce, ‘don’t go outside’ is slayer-mom 101!!!

Steve Quast

If Buffy caused Giles to throw away the hand book, I would think Faith would make them have to write a whole new hand book.

Richard Ashton

And throw that one away, too. Faith doesn't seem like a handbook kind of woman, to me.

Antonio

That's a great point, Domi, about what Giles said in Revelations re. Buffy not respecting the job he performs. I know the circumstances are slightly different, but they still amount to each of them hiding something from the other albeit with the best intentions. Can't believe I never made that comparison before! Also, the part where Kralik....erm....enjoys the cross that Buffy's holding is quite possibly the most disturbing moment in the series so far * shudder *

R J Walker (FumblesMcStupid)

Part 2 ;) Buffy is straight forward. She’s right, must be protected, but she doesn’t even need to be because she rocks. Giles is the reason that this episode can have me thinking obsessively for days after watching it because his case is not simple. He’s both the perpetrator and the victim of the test. He’s a good guy who found himself trapped in a situation he didn’t feel he could get out of and ends up doing something he knows is wrong. tbh this is a massively important message IMO. Most/many (?) people end up in (somewhat less extreme lol) situations like this at some point in their lives - you know a kid is being bullied at school but you don’t stand up for them because they might target you, you know somebody is being badly treated at work but you don’t say anything for fear of losing your job, someone is being harassed on the internet but you don’t come to their defence because you don’t want that directed at you, you don’t speak up because you’ve been told it’s impolite to make a scene etc etc etc. We are all brought up in institutions and with ways of behaving that are so inbuilt it can be almost impossible to break free of their influence. When those institutions are like the Council you can find yourself manipulated in to a no win situation. 

Many people DO hate Giles for this. I do get that. I don’t think he should be early forgiven. But the reason I generally see cited is that ‘he had a choice and he chose the wrong one’. I’d argue that he didn’t. The only choices that I’ve been able to come up with are 1. Do it and deal with the consequences, 2. Don’t do it and risk being at least relieved as watcher to Buffy, 3. Run away. Choice 1 is the best choice because the test will go ahead anyway (running away is only a short term solution and not really viable for Buffy). If Giles says no, they’re not going to say ‘all right then, back to England we go’ no, they’d almost certainly bring in a new watcher, put Giles on the first flight home, and the test would be the same EXCEPT that Giles would not be there to help/pick up the pieces and would never see Buffy again. 

Where I feel he f-ed up is not understanding what the real issue was. HE was focussing on Buffy dying as being the worst thing. This is understandable since he’s feared that from at least 1x10. SHE focusses on his betrayal. He only seems to understand this part way through the conversation in the library. That’s when he pretty much goes into panic mode, promising to do whatever he can to earn her trust again. Up till then he’s very much talking about his role and minimising it in comparison to locking Buffy in that house. I’m going to make a massive generalisation now and I admit I have not polled my guy friends but I think it does somewhat have to do with a female/male thing. I don’t THINK many men are worried about leaving their drinks when they go to the bathroom at a bar or club, I know almost all women are. That’s not to say men are never drugged at bars, they are, but I don’t think it’s something they generally think about when they are out for the night. When a woman realises they have walked the wrong way home at night I think they generally fear rape whereas a man might more fear being beaten up or killed if he ran in to the wrong crowd. Like I said, I don’t know this to be true but it’s always seemed that way to me. So, Giles is more familiar with fearing for his life but Buffy has more experience fearing being drugged and violated. I dunno, I just think it might be one reason he doesn’t get it.

OK, this is already stupidly long so I’m gonna have to really shorten this, additional reasons this happened… 1. He’s been indoctrinated since a young age to think the Council knows right 2. He doesn’t trust his emotions - they get people hurt and killed 3. He tries to deny his emotions therefore they are easier to manipulate - Travers does this a number of times in this episode 4. He’s been sidelined by the Council since Kendra was called (and quite probably before) - not knowing there were two other slayers, not knowing about Post, not being invited to the watchers’ retreat, I think after Buffy’s ‘death’ in Prophecy Girl they just switched all their attention to Kendra and her watcher so Buffy and Giles are out of the loop until now 5. He’s been trying his best this season to be a proper ‘Council’ watcher. The reason I say number 2 and 5 IMO is partly to do with his change of wardrobe. Gone are the cute round glasses and old fashioned but somewhat cuddly tweed (IMO lol), in are more severe glasses and a three piece suit of armour. When he arrived in Sunnyvale he threw out the slayers handbook, allowed Buffy’s friends in on the gig, let Buffy have a vampire boyfriend and fell hopelessly in love. I think he got there and thought ‘I’m doing this my way, screw tradition’. We know from Band Candy and Dark Age that he’s a rebel and ran away from these bastards. He doesn’t seem to believe in their way of doing things. And what was the result? Jenny’s dead, Buffy had to kill her first love, then ran away, he gave away the secrets to end the world because he was tricked into thinking Jenny was talking to him. IMO Giles thinks he massively screwed up and tried from 2x22 onwards to be more of a traditional watcher. He didn’t do very well but I think everything has been set up for him to WANT to follow the Council’s orders at first because he doesn’t trust his own judgement any more. They were his salvation (in his eyes) after Eyghon, they know what they’re doing. IMO, as soon as he starts he realises how awful this is and he’s acting oddly from the first scene as I think by then he’s realised he just has to get through this. I think part of the problem with this episode is the ones that follow immediately afterwards, which I know domi has watched. There seem to be no consequences (although I would argue that there are some you just have to look hard!). I WANTED there to be consequences. Giles has f-ed up big time. You shouldn’t have to speculate and look at subtext. He should have had to have tried harder IMO. It frustrated me no end that in the next episode they are mostly OK with each other. I know if I was Buffy I bloody well wouldn’t have been! I’d have punched him when I got back my strength and this is coming from somebody who adores Giles. lol Anyway, sorry about the length of this but this is an episode that gives me feels :)

UTU49

Please don't miss Buffy fondling the crystal that is a roughly cylindrical shape. (Right after visiting Angel.)

CeNedra

*keeps mouth shut about ridiculous test that shouldn't be a thing because the whole point of being chosen is that the position automatically gives you the strength and speed you need.. so why do you need to get tested without those gifts, if she was thick as shit then she wouldn't last too long anyway.. totally pointless. Personally I wouldn't do f*** all for them until the slayer gets a bloody good wage for all the sacrifices, the short lifespan, no actual life, no evenings out... **** oh shit 🙄 I ranted 😁

Something Blue

I find this episode very difficult to watch, because it's so out of character for Giles. I know it's a ritual that every slayer has to go through, but everything we know about him, says he wouldn't just go along with it. If I was in Buffy's shoes, I would never trust him again.

Rey

Maybe he used past tense because they didn’t do it often since most slayers probably didn’t live to see 18.

R J Walker (FumblesMcStupid)

He literally says 'in the past' I think, he didn't just use a past tense. But it's maybe true that what this means is it's been hella long since a slayer has made it to 18, although it's still an odd way to put it. Also, a lot of people think that the watchers know about it in advance but that doesn't make sense to me. If it's a test of the watcher why tell them about it? If they are worried about their loyalty and think they are on the slayers side, what's to stop them trying to circumvent the test. It makes more sense to me that it's something they don't know about. Although this might all be a moot point if it's spelled out in the comics, I have no idea about them.

The Suburban Big Man

My understanding is that the Council represents the Patriarch so the need for control over the Slayer is ingrained. As a Slayer gets older, The Council knows their control and influence over the Slayer will diminish, this concerns them. You'll notice that Quentin Travers often refers to her as a tool or a weapon, that's all she is to them. Having no control over the weapon, they cannot do what they want to do. In a twisted way then it seems they created this tradition of the 18th birthday test was to keep the slayer young thus more controllable, they do not expect slayers without their powers to survive the test.

Rey

If it was done away with by the time Wes was in the academy, it wouldn’t have made sense that Buffy experienced it. Either the writers erred or that since most slayers don’t make it to 18, it had been a long time this the use of a past tense. I’m basing this on your quote, but according to Wes these tests for trainee watchers were only deemed rumors. If it also doubled as a loyalty test, it was probably consequential.

zerofk

This is an amazing episode, easily near the top for me. I love the drama between Giles and Buffy - as well as the obvious love between them. "You have a father's love for the child" and Buffy's reaction to that gets me every time. And Buffy is so resourceful during the fight. I also love how Cordelia - not for the first time - just helps without any comment when she feels it's important.

R J Walker (FumblesMcStupid)

I mostly mean that it's an option they CAN use when a slayer turns 18 but maybe don't always CHOOSE to use. The test only makes sense if they want to risk losing a slayer and if they are competent and under the control of the Council why would they want to do that? Admittedly, who knows with these guys? lol Certainly, the way Giles put it, it doesn't seem that a lot of slayers reach their 18th birthday.

Vicky N

It’s seem to me it was one of the many things the writers of the show Angel chose to twist to their convenience. They were often cavalier with Buffy background.

R J Walker (FumblesMcStupid)

MAYBE SPOILERY, I DUNNO I don't know, there's no reason he couldn't have said 'there's a test watcher's go through' or 'there's a test for slayers' it makes no difference to the rest of the plot. I mean, sure, I don't think the writers were very good at continuity sometimes so it might well be them just making stuff up but my point is, there's nothing that I'm aware of that says they definitely do it to all slayers when they reach 18 (unless it's in the comics, then fair enough). Travers is the one who says they've done it for two thousand years and I don't trust anything he says. Anyway, it's all pure conjecture on my part and just an interesting debating point IMO :)

Domi E

Oh my gosh great points! So sad :(

Domi E

Yep that’s exactly how that scene went!

Domi E

Excuse me while I go cry right now!

Domi E

Didn’t read the Angel part since my memory is so bad I’m guessing I might have forgotten what you mentioned haha, but great points as always RJ!

Domi E

Haha really is so freaking creepy!!!

R J Walker (FumblesMcStupid)

lol So, it's up there with your envelope opening skills? You know we are NEVER going to let you live that down, right? ;)

Domi E

Oh you’re totally right about the feels! This is a completely complex episode! I totally agree that it’s weird there don’t seem to be many consequences

Domi E

you’re so right!!!!

Domi E

Yeah completely understandable, he really betrayed her so much

GaveUp

This troll ... best troll.

Domi E

I hate you guys 😂😂😂😂

Jordan Haddow

I could see why she regains trust in him by the end. She knows he's basically spent his whole life learning and preparing to be a watcher. That's a lot of time to be trained and steeped in tradition. I'm fairly certain that before he met Buffy, he would have had the same exact position on the matter as the council. She also has to know that by helping her, he was violating that tradition. He went against everything he had known and had been taught up to that point to save her. I don't know about you, but that should be enough to at least hesitate on losing all trust. My personal take at least.