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Bonus: The Return to Evermore (Patreon)

Published:
2023-07-26 07:26:19
Edited:
2024-11-19 05:17:37
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

So this ended up being way longer and more edited than I imagined. In the wake of my video, one of Evermore's main defenses was that my video was embarrassingly out of date, since a whole 18 months (lol) had passed since filming my video and releasing it. So, now I can say I've been back!

I might release this one elsewhere at some point. Not on my main channel, but maybe I'll un-unlist it at some point on my 2nd channel, or edit it down to post elsewhere. I haven't decided. I'm of two minds because I feel like when a video is about a company possibly, allegedly, in my opinion engaging in shady business practices, it feels weird to paywall it. But for now it's just for you guys.

Anyway I hope you enjoy!EDIT: Oh yeah one thing I forgot to unpack about the Convergence is that some of the D&D venues also sucked. People were posting pics of the games and some people got to sit in the hobbit house or Vander's Keep but some unlucky groups were just in unoccupied tents in the vendor's marketplace, empty display racks and all - which also would have been freezing and damp. And imo that's a huge step down from just doing it at home

Files

The Return to Evermore

Timestamps: 00:00:00 What is The Convergence 00:09:58 My Conspiracy Theory 00:17:48 The VIP Package 00:23:56 Tour of the Park 01:28:50 The Quincy Element 01:42:08 The Merch 01:48:10 Maxwell 01:58:07 The Changes 02:14:34 Conclusion

Comments

Jordan

Christmas in July!

K.

YEEESSSSS

DN

I am loving this surprise drop in the middle of the night

Heidy J

Oh sweet just in time to keep my insomnia company, thank you Jenny!

Jenny Nicholson

I did add chapters but it's not populating them on the video; this must be the disrespect small channels are forced to suffer. But if you click through to the tube you'll find timestamps in the description

L Stutt

Best news I’ve had all week, only downside I have to start work in half an hour. Thank god for working from home

Mikey

TWO AND A HALF HOURS

Sara

Starting my day off right in CET - thanks Jenny!!

My Summer Rain

Yay!!!! 🥳 I was just listening to the Evermore video while I did my dishes this evening. Can't wait to see what's changed!

LadyLotte

I've never been happier to be a patron!!

cynthia

Girl it's so late - thank you

Olivia Smith

I don't think I've ever felt as much joy as when I saw how long this video is

Brinda Gupta

I couldn’t sleep, and now I’m grateful that I’m still awake for this.

Lacey Daisy

so exciting!!! thank you so much!

Pzombo

2+ hour BONUS vid?!? ahhhh thank you!!

Clara Margot

the scream i scrumpt when i saw this

Janelle Rose

SORRY BUT OK that fact that one of the riddles is just an ad for Quincy’s cookbook is making me laugh SO MUCH it’s seriously giving “remember to drink your Ovaltine” and I love it

zandy

It seems sad, still

nick

HAHA i had that exact thought

Gary

This is the best value on patreon.

sweet dee

why did the menus make me so sad

Clara Margot

i havent finished the video yet so no idea if Jenny mentions it but Evermore are apparently doing a dinner show this Halloween based on their original Ripper's Cove concept and I'm doing a PhD on Jack the Ripper-themed tourist attractions and DYING that I can't go

Blastoise_M

saw the alert for this pop up on my phone and let out an audible gasp of joy, I've watched the original video like 3 times now and I'm so excited to watch this

Jenny Nicholson

Also if there's any redundancy between face jenny and voiceover jenny, I recorded them a few weeks apart. It was a little of a jigsaw

ChiralSpiral

I didn’t know you could do a phd on cool shit like that

Magical Girl Mel

You know... It's kind of insane to me that they didn't make the chapel a high priority thing to finish (if not before opening at least very soon after). I mean, if there's enough space inside, there's money to be made as a wedding venue.

Gary

What's the deal with them stealing real people's tombstones and repurposing them as a theme park curiosity? Is there some possibility that the tombstone I paid money for so my family can remember me turning up in 100 years at some shitty theme park for people to make fun of?

melmelmelmel

The most jarring thing in this video is that Jenny uses discord on light mode

Clara Margot

if you can write a convincing proposal you can do a PhD on anything you want my guy. i mean you also need like a good related Masters degree and some solid academic recommendations (and the funding!), but I mean anything. I met a gal who did a PhD on Mills and Boon novels. Did a conference with a guy whose PhD was in Japanese theme parks. The world is truly your oyster

Galewolf

I just got to Jenny saying "I think you guys will enjoy this backstory" and it cut out lol Hopefully it'll be back soon! I was really enjoying it.

Wilsham

Very excited to get an update on Evermore :) thanks Jenny!

Trace

Noooooo. I need all the details of this zombie park's escapades. Looking forward to the updated posting. The Evermore videos are in the same strata as Folding Ideas, Burbeck's Ghost Ktichen Video, and Coffeezilla for me. Except Evermore is built on wishful thinking AND what seems to be IMO, deception. Great work.

Sarah

Maxwell dancing to presumably a Beatles cover, amazing

Cleo Oops

Such a shame you no longer have the option to fight the chef.

Eric Smith

This place.....seems very fixable? The quest aspects are so conceptually aligned with Escape Rooms. Evermore could license out Beginner + Intermediate 'quests' to escape rooms across the country so that 'players' can stay connected with the park and make progress while in between visits. The regional escape rooms are responsible for updating player achievements through a web portal that the 'players' can track. Have the Epic quests only located at the park itself, so that 'players' have to physically be present at the park once a season to obtain 'max level'. Turn some of the buildings into 'quest rooms' and/or bring in some of those trailer things that escape rooms often use. Drop the cover charge like Jenny mentions in the video and just charge to do the escape/quest rooms. Hell if you're really strapped for cash you can even put micro-transactions in the quest rooms themselves to incorporate digital cosmetic items that appear on your avatar while you're doing the escape room (and of course they could print money with a pay to win cash shop as well.) Once per year have a tournament that all 'max level' players can enter, where you set up two escape rooms and two teams race to complete the quest. It's set up as a PvEvP match where the goal is to complete the quest but you can also do things that will slow the progress of your opponent. (Something similar to Gambit in Destiny if you're familiar). The team that wins each year gets to have a portrait of them hung above the fireplace in the Guild Tavern all year!

Michael

Um, can someone point me to this second channel??

TalysAlankil

i'm just floored that they marked closed buildings as "cast members only" like ken, sir, you are not disney

Sarah

i can’t get enough of evermore content honestly. also huge respect to jenny for getting so mad about worker exploitation. p.s. incredible maxwell impression at the end there

Rikki

So excited for the return of Evermore! As to the end of the vid where you talk about people who just seem to ignore all the bad for the glimmer of good they might get out of the park, this is something I've noticed in all facets of DnD/LARP/Fantasy in general for some reason. A fantasy movie will be absolutely awful but the "true nerds" will say it's amazing, and other similar things. It's like they're so starved for anything nerdy that they'll just blindly accept it as perfect when they finally do get it.

Cat

Jenny this was so freaking good and funny thank you <3

Eric MacMillan

Its the channel this video is uploaded to…The Cooler Jenny. So far she only uses it to upload the patreon content

Ella M

It's CoolerJenny, it's literally just the channel where she posts the Patreon videos. If you click on any of her videos here they will take you to it.

Eric MacMillan

Oh and a lightning mcqueen amv she made

Fifi

It’s now four am but I have no regrets. That guy’s maxwell impression at the end was perfect

Michael

Ooh, if I paid more attention I’d know that! I always save these videos to my watch later list. Thank you!

Michael

Thanks! If I paid more attention I’d know that! I always save these videos to my watch later list. Thank you!

Markus D

I genuinely forget that it HAS a light mode until I suddenly see it and have to spend a few seconds even recognizing which app it is.

Cynethryth

It's shocking that those buildings are still partially unfinished after all this time. Even just little things. Thank you for sharing the Maxwell story arc! I didn't know I needed that in my life.

Emma Wilson

no pressure qween but if that barbie video’s still in the works now is a good time to post to capitalize on the movie’s popularity ;)

Emma Wilson

also a second evermore video is amazing bless up

KarmaismySnake

They need to reopen as a fancy pumpkin farm. Or Halloweentown!!!

Ted Koutz

There was an old cemetery in my town from the 1800's and there were a lot of little kid graves which were real sad and not the thing you'd want in your fantasy theme park

Ted Koutz

It's so weird they have *a* llama and this pretty big paddock that looks hastily made in an out of the way place, it's almost like someone was like "hey we're having llamas now" and they just started doing that without figuring out all the logistics

Rebecca Michelson

i love the first evermore video so getting another 2.5 hours of evermore content???? Best day ever -- thank you so much!

Markus D

I can't believe that that one promo thing at the beginning misspelled "The Lucky Gryphon" as "The Luck Gryphon". I noticed it because I thought the name sounded bizarre and must be some "Quincy lore thing" but NOPE, they just spelled it wrong and didn't proofread it.

Steven Clark

Now, I'm just imagining what a Jenny Nicholson event at Evermore would be like. I mean, I know it's never going to happen, for obvious reasons, but like what if it did? Ideally, I would want it to be almost exactly the same experience as the Quincy event, but without the false advertisement (allegedly). So, the VIP tickets would offer things like, "Day 1: Nothing. Day 2: Mediocre pizza and you get to watch an awkward D&D game," and the quests would all lead to obvious ads for a book that doesn't exist, or maybe for G Fuel if that deal can be resurrected. Then, on the last day, she could come out, answer two questions nobody asked, and then run away.

Tommy M

Was Kiersten there? Did she play with you, like her favorite broken toy in her toybox?

Ashley Norton

The investigative journalism we needed

Markus D

Considering the alpaca, and previously-employed chickens, I'm kind of surprised that even if Evermore doesn't want to have a bunch of actors giving quests that they don't have like... random farmers and townspeople, maybe with animals that you can interact with, and something like pony rides? I get that there could definitely be an issue of sanitation, but those things still feel like a relatively inexpensive way of making the place feel more "lived in" and having little activities.

TalysAlankil

but also jenny please understand i can never be evermore'd out. i have watched the OG video so many times already.

Stephen

1:12:00 I wonder if he felt an aura of dread run through him, like when a Ringwraith passes by

B Hair

Yesssss!!!! 2+ hours 🥹

Kat W

it was so sad to hear that those employees who went above and beyond for you got fired :(

Jenny Nicholson

Yeah supposedly a bunch of employees got fired all at once. Some news came out recently that Evermore was paying female performers much less than men with the same jobs. Seemingly in response, Evermore fired multiple middle management and creatives, even though I highly doubt they had anything to do with payroll. It's almost as if every time they fall under any kind of scrutiny, they fire a bunch of random employees and then scapegoat them and say they're "under new management" even while the top positions stay the same

Jenny Nicholson

A lot of people ask me whether I eat food after I make it. Now, the answer might surprise you

Mel Bee xx

thanks jenny! im so excited to watch💕

Jenny Nicholson

I'm of two minds about the grave selling thing, I do think it's unrealistic to expect a plot of land to belong to your body forever, but the idea of a theme park being able to pay money for your grave marker is also really weird to me. But then if they're already up for sale the alternative is probably them being smashed and sold as gravel, so idk. They should let people pre-decide what weird things happen to your grave in several centuries like when you sign up to be an organ donor

T. Fazekas

How? Why? What did I do to deserve this gift? (weeps, hands shaking)

Cedonia Peterson

One aspect of this that I never get over is how cringy the whole “fake English-ish” village thing is lol. The accents range from horrific to iffy, and take me by surprise every time. No hate to the actors though, I’m sure they and the guests all enjoy that part of playing pretend.

draav

"there are still no park maps ... at least not like the brochures that you can carry around and put in your binder" because everyone obviously has a binder of park maps they collect. although honestly, people subscribed to jenny on patreon are an extremely likely subset of the population where that is true.

Dannoboi

Evermore is looking like its moving toward an open puzzle/adventure story thing, which is sort of what I'd prefer it to be. The actors and seasons can add enough fresh activity to keep locals and fans coming but if there's a several hour long puzzle throughout the grounds, people can come to solve that for one or two days. If anyone's been to Columbus COSI's Adventure, this is what I'd want Evermore to be like. A somewhat linear puzzle with layers that can take one or two trips to complete. With the buttons, and papers out, and languages and everything they're inching towards that.

Woody Sims

The sound that came from my body when I saw the runtime… you’re a legend Jenny.

Skylin.

Going super autistic mode, flapping my hands from excitement.

Courtney Schmitt

The absolute joy and rapture upon seeing the merch was exactly the boost I needed today. Thanks Jenny!

Yvy

I hereby give my express written permission/encouragement to post any and all of your work wherever the heck you like. *big thumbs up*

Molly

I will say that from what I can glean, going to an event location and playing DnD w a celebrity DM can be quite costly. $1000 still seems like a lot if you're not getting accomodations included, and it certainly doesn't explain why the GA guests would pay $80 to hang out w the DnD folks after their games ended, though.

Steven Clark

Considering that there were probably 100 VIPs, though, I don't think there was ever any chance of Quincy DMing a hundred-player D&D game.

Eric Williams

Do you want her to LIE with him?!?

Jenny Nicholson

There are sooooo many typos on all Evermore-related media but that one seems especially crazy to get wrong (and to copy/paste it so it's wrong twice)

Markus D

Agreed. I don't even know why that's so standard for fantasy stuff. Just because Tolkien was English and people assume English accents for his characters doesn't mean that people have to force them into every European fantasy setting!

Cedonia Peterson

Absolutely. Though I understand the appeal, because I was so excited to “be in England” when I went to Hogwarts at Universal for the first time. I revisited it again last year, after living in England for a bit, and cringed so hard lol. Still had a good time though tbh.

Emmy Pratt

I can’t believe people are actually traveling to Evermore because of your OG video. When I first watched it I thought “if I’m ever near Provo for work or something, I’ll stop by just to say I went” but the fact that your scathing review is functioning as advertising is such a wild case of all publicity is good publicity lmao

Ella M

Jenny's friends loving the archway, that's character development.

Aimee W

stained glass in the teenage run restaurant but not the church i cant stop thinking about that

Aimee W

even just put in windows and the fake stain glass window cling

Aimee W

paint a crude stained glass design on the plywood covering the windows

banhxeodacbiet

this video is my convergence event thank you jenny we love you but not in a parasocial way like with evermore fans and their unpaid actors (ALLEGEDLY)

Zhed

I can not believe that they actually had a code-translating quest that resolved in the equivalent of "Don't forget to drink your ovaltine." That's incredible.

Aimee W

im watching/listening to this while making a custom snail terrarium from recyclables and i just dont know how they keep fumbling so hard

Aimee W

use a plastic bottle fake stained glass windows .. just anything man

Rebecca Roberts

YES! I also had the same thought! "A crummy commercial?? Son of a b***!"

Aimee W

I want to shake him and tell him he is not the smartest one to do the job, literally just hire people

Aimee W

typical programmer behaviour though

Aimee W

that’s what it is! evermore reminds me of that one episode of hotel hell with the “posh” gay couple and their mansion overlooking the town

BD

I feel bad but the llama having a temper tantrum is so cute

Gary

I suppose if I was given the option I would prefer to haunt a theme park rather than someone's driveway.

T. Fazekas

Was Brayden (local third grader) there in Kiersten cosplay?

Robbie Agnew

A follow up to your best video? Can’t wait!

Poo In An Alleyway

Honestly I'm so happy for you that they finally made the shirts and totes available.

Jenny Nicholson

Yeah for people already in town I fully understand going out of morbid curiosity even after a bad review but you'd be surprised how many people come from out of state and even out of country. idek how they justify it unless they're also youtubers making content or something, given how few hours per weekend it's open

R.E. Beaulieu

A 2 hour long bonus video about evermore is like one of the best things that happened this yr. Also, does anyone else hear that weird sound in the background of the park footage? Like a cross between a cricket and a car alarm? It's driving me a bit bonkers lol

Jenny Nicholson

I think that's cicada sound but don't quote me idk if utah has those

Jodi Hoffman

But I guess to be fair, they are literally actors- so they’re literally a cast? But yeah, it is funny. lol

Jodi Hoffman

I think they did and Oktoberfest season with more animal handlers

Susan Held

Jenny: "$1000" Me: *tries to remember how much a thousand dollars is in Evermore lore before realizing it's actual US money*

Peachy Parfait

I just rewatched that one and knew it was reminding me of something - especially the random piles of antiques! I wonder if evermore’s were similarly overpaid for and worthless. lol

Chelle

I cheered when there were t-shirts, what a triumph

Ash D

i am so excited to watch this after work

Eleanor Lewis

Hey just want to say - I am that llama and I fucking HATE my job

Skyler

They were.

Adrianne

yes... thank you I will watch your feature length bonus evermore video :)

charredCnidaria

The fact that "fans" who have never even been to the park before are so ride-or-die for it on a purely conceptual basis...while the actual employees are willing to talk candidly about their negative experiences, and even give gifts to cool youtubers they like that have been less than complimentary of the place they work... Red flags. Red flags aplenty.

Taylor Calloway

This isn't super relevant, but @jenny and anyone who might want to weigh in. My boyfriend is taking me to knott's berry farm for the first time tomorrow because I realized our post comic con hotel is literally 6 minutes away and lost my mind and he is a sweetheart. What are the best things to do??? I've never looked into it really other than random mentions via ramble because I never thought I'd get to go. I will say, I'm looking for top lame things to do energy. I am currently disabled with a broken pelvis that is healing, I can walk well enough with my Cane but I'd rather not FLING my body around so no coasters unless they are literally for babies. Hopefully someone familiar with knott's sees this, or jenny can weigh in because I KNOW she knows the best non body flinging things to do c: cheers!

James Rule

Just to let everyone know: I'm selling tickets for the opportunity to clean my garage and mow my lawn for $2,000. But if anyone out there is a lawn care influencer I'll offer them free tickets to this prestigious event.

Ham

I want "Paid in Pizza and Pasta" on my tombstone

Bethy!!

As a larper, hearing that most of the actors are gone really takes away even the macabre desire to go to experience the "terrible". That was the last of the small appeal to make the park even remotely cool.

Skyler

I believe you’ve described the exact way they run every aspect of that park.

Bethy!!

I kind of wish I thought of the idea of a park binder, I have gone to hundreds of themeparks in my life and it would be epic to have the mementos.

Ed Butler

I'm thinking Jenny's voice is distinctive enough that the mask probably wasn't fooling anyone

Silky

Honestly that just kinda happens to tombstones, and I don't think anyone ever alleged stealing. A lot of people die every year, graves are usually only maintained for the deceased person as long as their loved ones pay for that, and what happens when they die too? Usually there will only be a grave for so long. Imagine how many graves we'd have on the planet otherwise, we'd genuinely run out of space! And what do you do with the gravestone then? My family has a gravestone in their backyard from a family member of people who used to live there. They didn't want to pay for the grave of a distant relation anymore so they just kinda stole the stone from the graveyard and let the upkeeping run out, and then they didn't know what to do with the stone. It's weird but in the end, it's just a slab of stone.

Skyler

The park is being sued by the contractors who built it. This likely included liens on the buildings. So other builders likely won’t touch the place in order to make repairs, and their on hand staff likely lacks the skill set required to finish it.

Sabrina Stern

You are in luck! During the summer they do this thing called Ghost Town Alive! Where there are actors playing old timey citizens of the Ghost Town and if you engage with them they can give you missions and things. Its super fun, also super fun to just talk to the actors in character, even if you don't want to engage with the full plot (things like who stole the town mascot and stuff). The Calico mine train is also great, lots of animatronics and not an aggressive ride. Knotts Bear-y Tales is a dark ride you should totally go on, and eat the fried chicken and boysenberry stuff since the place wouldn't exist without them!

Silky

Something I really enjoy are Jenny's comments pointing out small positive changes. They're interesting and fair and also serve so well to illustrate all the things this park DOESN'T have. Like, if it's notable that they painted over the logos on the church, that just highlights that that's the ONLY thing that changed. Biting commentary. This was also extra interesting because I've seen so many people say that it seems like the park has improved since the first video, but solely based on the promotional material. Surely they would never publish anything misleading!

Joel McDonald

I'm so happy to have more footage of Evermore, I think it's super interesting now. Alas this is not the comeback story of the century I was hoping for.

Taylor Calloway

Yes perfect!!! I was a bit sad because it seems like the park is almost entirely coasters after glancing at the website, and I LOVE coasters but i really shouldn't rattle my crunchy bones 😂😂 but this sounds absolutely stellar! Thank you so much :3

Penguin Lenin

At first I thought your friend in the suit was an employee following you and about to kick you out!

Shred Cadmium

Given a bonus video is what we'd call, you know, six minutes of out-takes I feel like we need a different word for something like this. Bounty? Bonanza? idk 🤷‍♂️

Michael Castleberry

I am dying at the cart recording thing just going on and on lol "only WHO can complete quests?... You have selected you, indicating me. The correct answer is you"

Laura Elizabeth

My friend wanted to drive 8 hours to see it. I told her, "Ehhh, let's see what Jenny's follow-up report says first." Thank you for the candid ramble at the end so I can convince her to go somewhere else!

Brogan Young

I've watched the Evermore video probably about 5/6 times since it's come out, watched this all the way through, guess it's time to watch the Evermore video again.

Matt Grippi

I’m so fascinated by how bad this theme park is. Every aspect of it is wrong. Even an audio recording meant to add atmosphere is a tiresome confusing slog. They can’t even leave a door open for guests to look in an empty building. Truly baffling

DadBodofThunder

Naw he got immolated by a warlock during his last visit. They're still in litigation.

Heidy J

If I was a Quincy fan I would've been gutted that the QnA had been cut off and even more so if I'd missed the initial tavern interaction. But this event would've really been aided by the other influencers making the event feel like a comic con. I half worry attendees really didn't realize that they'd gotten duped a little bit because there were many nice people there making up the difference. Even if I hadn't gotten the full Quincy experience, I'd still have felt (naively) the 80 dollar ticket justified if I'd seen like, even 3 people I followed on TikTok in person, gotten to play with other guests, and made the most of what atmosphere they did have. But I think someone else in the comments said it best. It's as though in the starvation for a nerdy experience like this, people are extremely willing to overlook it's shortcomings and wonder how they might have it better. I know these videos have gotten me to think more critically about the experiences I attend, even if I find ways to enjoy them in the moment.

MorbySA

We are so blessed, honestly. I wasn't expecting an Evermore followup even though it is now probably my favorite of Jenny's videos. Getting more Maxwell backstory was pretty neat, actually! I don't know how difficult this would be, but could you do a compare/contrast video for YouTube where you show how things have changed kinda side by side? That could make the differences a bit more stark.

Kinetics Video

Hearing the phrase "binder fodder" and thinking that means something is really good

Kinetics Video

Far from an expert, but animal shows seem like sort of an impressive, cheap, not a crime against God, choose two kind of situation

Kinetics Video

My mind palace for the Jenny experience but fully realized as an in person event is a large animatronic spider that chills out on a couch and plays video games

a.s.

'it's time to play with the monster that you created' summing up jenny's entire evermore experience perfectly is the best part of this whole saga

Kara

This video is amazing! IMO it's main channel content, especially for all the non-patrons who enjoy the OG Evermore video. At the very least it should be public somewhere, so I can link it to non-patrons!

Emily Dahl

First of all: thank you for this GEM. Secondly: we will never be Evermored out. I speak for all of us.

Priscilla Rapp

it's so sad that despite the welcoming and humble vibe from Quincy's tiktoks (I watched a few after you brought him up) it seems like he really didn't care or deliver for fans. Obv there could've been extenuating circumstances we didn't know about but that was the most egregious thing to me.

Gillder

So disappointed that you still didn't get to ride in the caboose. :( On the other hand, glad you managed to get your hands on some prime merch this round~ 👍

Jenny Nicholson

Yeah I feel like that's again got to be the faction who really want it to be good. A lot of people popping up literally on the park's socials being like, "I think this sounds quite fun. But have you addressed the problems in that video?" Then the park responds, "Yes. That video is EXTREMELY out of date and everything has been fixed now." And then the commenter is like "Ah very good! I cannot wait to plan my visit" as if a large part of my video wasn't centered on how badly the park (in my opinion) does false advertising

S G Matthews

I cannot imagine anyone watching Jenny’s Evermore videos and thinking “oh, I’m there!”

DefinitelyNobody

Especially because it's an actual European historical buildings that was brought here brick by brick. (Allegedly)

DefinitelyNobody

I actually talked with an archaeologist about the tombstones and sarcophagus at Evermore and she said that those things aren't really legally protected even if they are historical. Allegedly, Ken did honestly pay for them and that sadly gives him the right to do anything he wants with it.

DefinitelyNobody

Great ideas! Actually the Salt Lake City Crusaders (Utah's main buhurt team) was in talks to do exhibitions at Evermore but Evermore ghosted them (maybe it was too expensive for them).

Majima Cookie

what a fascinatingly terrible place. I hope you return in a few years to watch it devolve even further!

DefinitelyNobody

There are so many groups of people who have been trying to get in with Evermore to fix it but as long as Ken is involved it will never happen. It's his way or the highway.

Buddy Crotty

There needs to be a $1,000 Patreon tier that unlocks the un[Redacted] version of Jenny tripping over the "well lit pathways" (and includes a voucher for 1/3rd of a large cheese pizza).

DefinitelyNobody

So there is actually a schism in the Utah LARPing community about Evermore too. I can't go much into that because it could come back to me directly as a LARPer myself, but let me just say that a lot of LARPers here really don't like the park and feel that it is a disservice to people just getting into the hobby. Also, we all wish we could just take it over and make it right so Utah stops getting a bad rep, haha.

DefinitelyNobody

I can talk about this one actually! The guy who is in charge of the animals there (who is ironically more of a science and history guy than fantasy, but that's who they could get) is a big camel expert (which are close relatives to llamas, apparently). He would honestly probably rather have his own zoo with a bigger focus on education but Evermore throws more resources at him whenever he wants to leave so he just takes advantage of it as a chance to train animals he's always wanted to work with. (His team is way more into the theme than him so they run the animal shows.) There are two llamas, and they have an in-park stable and an out-of-park homestead. Dude loves them like his own kids so at least when he's handling them I promise they are getting good care.

Eric Smith

Oh, that's such a bummer 😕 Maybe Ken will be forced to sell and an owner with some openness to new ideas can revitalize the place!

DefinitelyNobody

Oops! I was just confirming this! Periodic employee purges followed by rehirings has happened enough times to be suspicious.

DefinitelyNobody

I can't count the number of times a returned employee has said "we're under new management! It's better now!" just to come back a month later grim and jaded with no financial stability. It's part of why I care about this so much; when you meet these people and see all the love they put in the park and then see them struggling to get by while Ken continues to scam people it makes your blood boil.

DefinitelyNobody

I mean, it's really hard to portray a fantasy European village without a European accent, and English is easier than many other accents.

Bani Kainth

As someone who actually DOES know who the people Jenny is talking about are (I very much am on that side of TikTok lol) I’m sad my parasocial relationship didn’t hold up to scrutiny lol. But shoutout to Jennings brower for apparently being cool! (The TikTok devil guy)

DefinitelyNobody

It would be even more awkward to build an American-style fantasy village, because that either means post-renaissance time periods or doing a very awkward appropriation of Native American stuff. American accents just sound modern because they are, so you have to do a different accent if you want to seem more old-timey

Emmy Pratt

Even for theme park/immersive experience enthusiasts it doesn’t make any sense! It really seems like they just want to prove you wrong, and that makes me sorry…For Them!

DefinitelyNobody

I honestly don't think they have a plan any more. They just eek by.

Ted Koutz

A petting zoo would make sense here but right now it seems like they'd be real bad at everything that running a petting zoo entails

DefinitelyNobody

$1000 is a stupid amount for any weekend event. I could go to Wasteland Weekend and have the most immersive LARP experience ever for less than half of that. Even Utah's own LARP groups will run weekend events where they rent whole campgrounds and turn them into little towns and run quests and combat encounters and stuff and those cost $150 tops.

DefinitelyNobody

I go to the free Saturday farmer's markets sometimes. I have friends that work there too. (I may have been smuggled into the park without paying once or twice)

Kelly Michals

"Disorienting word salad explanation about tiktok trend", yep I'm in the old category

DefinitelyNobody

Even employees and guests who have been burned and gone back will sometimes say "it's better now" even when those of us who have gone multiple times over its entire life can confirm that whenever one thing gets fixed another breaks or is discontinued so it doesn't get better. People just have this super abusive relationship with it and Ken gets money from it.

DefinitelyNobody

I think it's unlisted on her second channel, which means if you access it you can send the link to people

DefinitelyNobody

LOL! If I had the money I'd totally do it too.

Bear

sorry I only do weed pulling tiktoks but good luck on your journey!

Madeleine

NEVER ENOUGH EVERMORE. I loved hearing the way that Evermore has become a special interest for you all — it's definitely contagious. Sometimes I'll just google around, watch Evermore videos on youtube, look up Mr. Bretschneider.

Eileen Herbert

The saddest thing to me is that there are so many past and current employees and fans that see how great the park can be and are rooting for/working towards that vision, yet the people running the park take it for granted and don't seem to appreciate it. Regardless of the "ALLEGATIONS" and things that can only be guessed at, the things we know for certain have happened are enough proof to see that the people calling the shots are severely incompetent at best, yet they have so much going for them that a lot of other projects could never dream of.

Kara

It is, but it's intended to be for paying patrons so I wouldn't link people to that who haven't paid

Madeleine

Okay I was SO curious what happened from Quincy's perspective, and I found a podcast retrospective on the event from Quincy and his co-host: https://youtu.be/Me6nBXgG7UM Takeaways relevant to this video: - It sounds like from their perspective, they characterized this as basically a creator event that they hosted, with Evermore as their location. They thanked their team and then thanked the Evermore team. They described the Evermore team as “bringing them water.” They discussed wanting to host another "Convergence" at a different venue that was more accessible and required less food planning. - They said they stayed in a big Airbnb with “15 content creator friends.” Interesting! It sounds like all the influencers were in the same lodging. - At the end of the podcast they say they have to go — “We still have a few tiktoks to film with our friends” “a few more we gotta do." Is it normal to schedule group tiktoks? Maybe when you have a group of influencers all together. But I have a conspiracy theory that they paid Evermore in tiktoks, haha. I'm sooo curious how the compensation broke down all around. - He alludes to the meet and greet, and says he was surprised and disappointed at how short each greeting had to be, how long the line was, and that people would have to wait in line for so long. No explanation for why it was cut short. - He alludes to the Q&A as something that had technical difficulties, but nothing about how it was cut short. - They seem to have chosen and invited the DMs who came. They also talked like they chose and arranged the catering. - His co-host, who uses a wheelchair, commented on the accessibility. Said she wanted a more actually-accessible place in future — that it’s technically accessible, but she “almost ejected myself from my seat in one area." This very much checks out. I would be so scared trying to navigate Evermore with any kind of mobility needs.

al

So what you are saying is, this park is great if you gatekeep hard enough and ignore your actual opinions.

Kris

I will NEVER go to Evermore park! Promise!But could you please go from time to time and check if it's still bad and tell us about it? Just to be sure, you know.... that would be awesome 💕

ts_babyjane

1. i cant imahine being evermored out, i just love to listen to you talk about anything, your opinions are so fascinating and astute. 2. i had a friend who wanted to go and bring his kid, but i swear it was some extremely contrarian urge to be like “i can have fun doing anything!” lol and as a fan of incompetent media of all forms i get it but like, no, you’re not going to have a surprisingly fun time. youre gonna get there and see nothing. i can only imagine thinking its fun because youve never been to a theme park before.

Justin Hill

I'm a little confused regarding a final point. Like, I get that YOU think it's not worth the money, but if someone else buys a ticket and has a good time, then that's just a subjectively different experience. A review of something is to educate people so they can make their own informed decisions. Not to convince them to think like you and make the same decision as you. Because maybe to someone out there, going up to a tiny little prop and pressing a button to see it light up and play an audio file is worth $1000. You can't make that decision for them.

Markus D

But the fact of the matter is that a lot of the accents that they do AREN'T old-timey, they're just not American. Hell, historically-speaking, sometimes American accents are more similar to historic British ones than current posher English accents. Regardless, my main point is that the characters are in a fantasy world that's just BASED on Europe; there's no reason for the accents to be European because the characters AREN'T IN EUROPE.

Markus D

@Ted Koutz I'm not sure what they could run that they'd be GOOD at, so I'm just throwing something out there that's relatively easy to source.

Markus D

I mean, Utah's got a bad rep, but it's not because of the bad LARP-ish "theme park".

My Summer Rain

Did he end up going? Did he have a good time?

Luis

Been waiting all day to get off work and watch this gem. Thank you Jenny you're too kind to us!

MaxMin

LOVE this type of video where a place/topic is revisited after a video/report about them gets big. Even more when you can see the effects your video had. I've been wondering if anything had changed or if they'd tried to sue you. I went to their website after the video to see if any of the links had started working cause I couldn't actually go to the park. We need a patreon tier where you go to Evermore every year it's open, do a meetup with the employees and start an union lol. Also the witch being burned at the stake was VERY apt, like that's what Ken would have done if he caught you lol. This was a wonderful bonus video!!!

boobookeys

Brettschneider is probably scared that one of his close friends is actually Jenny in a Mission Impossible mask based on how deep she has infiltrated this park.

Jason Perez

JENNY NICHOLSON SWEARS (NOT CLICKBAIT)

Amara Moss

Not to be rude, but I think that if someone has $1000 to spend on a light up button and audio file, then maybe they shouldn’t have $1000

Greta

hi jenny

Aimee W

Oh DEFINITIVELY. I would bet any amount of money on it

Austin F

the employees got you the shirt...that means...YOU FINALLY GOT AN EVERMORE T-SHIRT!!! (technically)

run_away

if anyone reading this wants to play d&d for the first time but you don't know where to start, here are some legitimate options. -D&D Adventures' League and/Pathfind Society. These are 'organized play' groups that run at game shops all over the world. You sign up and play. The DMs are available to run games for you. The material they run is created by Wizards/Paizo and is specifically for organized play. It's usually free-- the highest charge I've ever seen was $5 a head. Look on Facebook or meetup or contact your local game shop before you go so they can make sure to have space for you. -convention play. most nerd cons, including anime cons, have volunteer groups that DM games for con attendees. they usually DM for free and are paid in a ticket to the com after doing X hours of DMing. For players, once you're in the con, playing is usually free. I've never seen an additional charge. -ren faires. this is getting to be more common. similar to con play, above. usually free though may cost a small charge. never seen one above $5.00. -facebook. find a local roleplaying Facebook and see if anyone is looking for players. -online play. roll20 is a digital tabletop environment that I think has a looking-for-group feature. discord is a chat service that has hundreds of room dedicated to finding groups. there's also a lfg (looking for group) subreddit, not sure how active it is. -Paid play. jenny mentioned that you can pay DMs. you can, that is true. you will be paying them for both the time they spend DMing and also the time they spent prepping, so it can be expensive ($200 ish, at least when I was doing it. I can see people charging more depending on their services). I really only recommend this if it's a birthday party type scenario. contacting your local game shop is your best bet to find a paid DM. -after school groups and adult social clubs. just depends on your area. Facebook is a good way to find these. and finally -summer camps. some summer camps are starting to incorporate d&d. if you have a kiddo who wants to play, you can always see if one of them is in the area. Hope that helps the curious. Don't get scammed. Paying $1,000.00 for a single session with a DM is batshit crazy unless you're also getting, like, a private cabin or something with it.

Justin Hill

Amara that is not your call (Or Jenny's) to make. If people want to spend their money irresponsibly then that is their choice. Not unless you can prove that they are spending their money irresponsibly at the EXPENSE of taking care of a child or some scenario such as that, in which case this discussion would switch to CPS and the morality of if and when children should be taken from their parents. I personally would never pay any money to collect plushies. I consider collectables a scam. I'm sure collectively, Jenny has spent well over $1000 on plushies. I also think she's well within her right to do so. I have spent thousands of dollars on a PC. I'm positive there are many people who wouldn't think the MARGINAL gains I get over a PC half the price are worth it. That's fine. They don't have to.

Ted Koutz

Forum culture isn't as much a thing as it is now but I played a pretty good zombie TTRPG heavily based on the movie The Mist via a chat program with a bunch of forum members, we were all part of the same fandom and sorta knew each other so it worked out ok

run_away

But also, to clarify. Convention DMs are not usually paid, they have a target number of hours to DM and they will receive a ticket in return. Which is an awesome deal at, say, PAX. So that is standard practice.

tofu nugget

Honestly any content with topics you’re passionate about is never boring for me. So yes, although I’m not into theme parks in general, let alone evermore, I still very much enjoyed listening to another 2 hours of you talking about it 😭 appreciate the extra content!!

Eric Englebretson

These Evermore videos remind me of all the basic psych classes that talked about "Intermittent Reinforcement." It *mostly* doesn't matter that 95% of the stuff you try and interact with does nothing - the 5% that does will keep most people excited and trying everything and pumped up with anticipation.

Benjamin A.

This was most entertaining!

Mr. Creosote

The force perspective mountains they built are impressive.

Anemone Plenary

It’s both admirable and sad that this is some of the best undercover journalism I’ve seen lately around employee and consumer protection. I’m so moved by Jenny’s passion and appreciation for all the hard work that goes into creative industries. It makes me realize how lazy so much corporate reporting is these days—if this reporting has been done by a major news outlet, they probably would have interviewed a few actors who said one thing, interviewed the CEO who said something else, and then printed one picture of the park along with a headline mocking people for being interested in nerd culture in the first place. But if anything we should be paying more attention to service and entertainment companies like theme parks—they represent huge investments in arts and tech and provide jobs less likely to be outsourced or replaced by AI. So how this this company treats its workers and customers is an important case study for all of us.

Ash D

redemption for the stone arch

Megan Cox

The park doing dnd weekends would be a good idea I mean if they did them right and paid people properly and cooked themed food. Sometimes in trying to save money you end up losing so much money. Love the video so much!!

Rob Fitzsimmons

"Ebenezer Scrooge's going-to-sleep hat" is much better than "nightcap"

Megan Cox

Thank you for listening to this and summing it up!

Eleanor Woods

i dont know if someone else has mentioned this, but at about 1:27:30 when the train is stopped at presumably the tavern for the meet and greet, the shorter guy in the back literally was quincy as far as i can tell. a little strange that hes behind the building ppl are lining up at and not inside it so people can get a picture inside quincy's tavern with him, but also i dont know the situation, just thought it was kind of odd and funny

Liz Jones

Our local Ren Faire takes place in a fully themed land with permanent buildings and has actors doing a storyline that changes every season, interesting vendors, a variety of food and drink options, and great cosplay from guests. What Evermore is trying to accomplish seems just like a more fantasy-inspired Ren Faire, so I'm just baffled by why they can't seem to get it to work better than this.

Madeleine

Jenny made an informed decision to spend her video time talking about how it feels when patronizing nerd culture people disregard workers’ rights. Who are you to make the decision for her that that is not a worthy use of her video time? You can’t make that decision for her.

Allison

my favorite addition to the park was the huge corporate warehouse eyesore behind the train tracks that lit up at night!

Anna O.

It's sad, because this is such a cool idea, and with the right creative and management team, it could be really special.

David A Behlman

But she's not making anyone's decision for them.

David A Behlman

I feel that Jenny is truly at her best at theme parks. That hat is amazing and I love her passion for animals! But what made me to comment is how she thought those buttons might do more than thing. That shows how optimistic she is about the potential of this place even after all she's uncovered about it.

Justin Hill

David. It was literally her point. "People keep going to the park even though 'I' say it isn't worth it. And sometimes they like it." Like am I missing something here? If they think it's worth the money, that's their problem, not Jenny's. I legit don't care that Jenny made a tiny little "hypocrisy." We all do it. It's perfectly fine. I don't want to cancel her. I've been a patreon for a long ass time. But I'm not going to pretend like she didn't think that comment through.

Jenny Nicholson

Yeah at one point after my video I *believe* they changed their website description from theme park to "permanent renaissance faire" (I tried to verify for this video but it looks like they changed it back again) And that was also silly to me because like, most ren faires are much bigger, with comparable buildings, way more vendors, entertainment sometimes including actual jousts, and a whole themed food court area. So even compared to a ren faire Evermore totally falls short

Hannah

maxwell the necromancer covered panic at the disco songs. how did people not realize he was going to be a villain?

Alex Andra

I think she's just referring to The Cooler Jenny where the patreon videos get posted. If you go there you won't find anything because all the videos are unlisted.

Jenny Nicholson

Idk why you think it's inappropriate to consider value in a review of a product that costs money. If the ticket was $1 I'd tell everyone it's worth it for the pizza alone. Things/services have commonly understood value & reviews are a subjective piece of writing where you say whether your recommend something. If someone is selling a mystery bag for $100 and it has 1 balloon inside most reviewers will say it's not a smart purchase and I don't think that's out of line

M Roos

You know, for a moment, briefly, I saw the chapel in the low light and thought that it might finally be a building that had all its walls. I was disappointed, though not surprised, to find out that it did not. Which I guess sums up the whole experience—especially for the park employees it seems, which is extra disappointing. That said, I loved getting a follow up, and the video itself was great!!

Cody Fenton

The Return to Evermore, in my opinion

Luis

Holy crap I didn't think Evermore could get worse D: Glad Jenny got all that cool merch tho :D

Justin Hill

Jenny, I never said that your recommendation was out of line. Again, the whole point of a review is to give a cost analysis. Which is fair. My issue was the sentiment that the people who watched your video and pay to go to Nevermore anyways are somehow wrong. Maybe I legit just didn't understand your point.

Cleo Oops

I think it's fair for Jenny to say that people should expect their money to get them more than that.

T. Fazekas

Mourners leave curiously wanting frozen pizza.

Jenny Nicholson

Thanks for the summary, I didn't know about this video! Re: "having" to film the tiktoks, now you mention it I think there was a larp cosplayer who went around the time my video came out, had a mediocre or negative experience, but said she still was obligated to release some kind of tiktok content about the trip because that had been the condition of getting a free pass (That's also kind of interesting to me because it's not really standard practice for influencer marketing. Usually if you get hosted somewhere for free, the *understanding* is that you'll post content, but if you don't they have no recourse, they just take you off their influencer list in the future. Usually companies can't/don't contractually demand you release the content unless actual money has changed hands)

Birthe_bird

I feel like they should make the experience with the park that you get like a leaflet in the beginning with your quest and then make it some proper puzzle (there could be like maybe different options on what kind of puzzle quest you could do) and then get some park employees who are positioned throughout the park to help you if you get lost or something. At least you get like a proper kind of experience.

Frita Gee

The fact that they basically eliminated actors…… This trip seems way worse to me than your last one even though I know there weren’t that many actors then either 😭

Brittany Rees

In regards to the actor bodyguard thing, I'm kind of surprised they don't have out of character handlers. Not only is it something Disney does, it's something Sleep No More does. If I remember correctly, there are people on each floor in each scene that blend in with the guests but have a different color mask to indicate they're employees.

Justin Hill

Cleo. That's a nuanced point. I agree. And I also think that was one of many points she made. And the issue I have was not that point specifically. Here's the timestamp: https://youtu.be/OCyoRWFMAl8?t=8338 She DOES end it by saying, "that's on them" but like, why bring it up? Why go on this long tangent? There's clear implications that the people ignoring her advice are somehow wrong. "In one ear out the other" Again, unless I'm missing a greater point she was making. Although I appreciate you making a real point.

Eric MacMillan

Shout out to Jenny's friend doing the Maxwell recreation at the end, had me dying laughing.

Steve Ray

Hie Thee Off To Kolob, Markus!

Brittany Rees

Not sure if it's already been mentioned but Jenny's conspiracy theory has been a little confirmed by Quincy himself. He did a podcast on the Convergence and said he flew out around 15 of his content creator friends and put them up in a big Air BnB.

Brian L Hughes

I played the MMO Everquest when it came out in the late 90's. I thought the quest system was awful, we called it Neverquest. The rewards were mostly pitiful and the quests quite sparse. The 1st update "Kunark" gave each class an epic weapon quest that was so difficult that only large guilds could band together and finish them. Most epic quest lines contained steps that every player of that class had to wait through usually a rare NPC spawn that they would have to "camp" for days waiting for it to spawn in the game, it was horrible for players. I was lucky enough to finally finish my Enchanter epic but our guild folded soon after and without friends I left the game to play WoW.

Brian L Hughes

I was Wysi Wyg on the server Xev in the guild "Ancient Fellowship" which spun off into "Concordance"

Brian Tatosky

It wouldn't be a LARP scene if it didn't schizm and turn on itself at some point.

Ella M

Maybe she could get one of those Official Worth Decider diplomas Dan from Folding Ideas has?

Brian Tatosky

Seriously. Just go around Ghost Town. See the real blacksmith there. I think they've reopened the Museum of the West, which is just that. Go into the school, which is an old west actual school they moved to the park grounds. *Several* buildings there are original. Ghost Town Alive should be lots of easy on the body fun. See the stunt show! Just make sure to get early enough to grab a shady spot. Food is *shockingly* good for a theme park so, grab some food. I don't think the Boysenberry Festival is still on, but when it was, there were all kinds of Boysenberry food and treats to try out. I think they also are doing like some summer tasting things in the evening, so they might be fun to try. There's lots of musical performances; go see a show in the Birdcage Theater, see Krazy Kirk and the Hillbillies, the famous Disney performer who they were stupid enough to get rid of and Knott's scooped up immediately. Knott's has plenty of non-ride things which are actually entertaining.

Brian Tatosky

It would be devastating for my finances, but "talk to Jenny about theme parks regularly" would really sucker me in.

Tabby

I had a brief moment of thinking that it was a little paranoid that you went in disguise out of concern for being recognized, but then I remembered that you managed to find the world's only gatekeeping Flintstones fan on your spider quest. If something like that *could* happen, it would definitely happen to you.

Steve Ray

Evermore is a true-to-life Mormon experience, where a charismatic leader tells a community, "All of you whose hearts have yearned for something better, something *amazing*, Follow Me! and see Heaven in the desert... ...a Heaven we will build ourselves."

Liam Walter-Smith

The implication, which she cited, is that people give patronising responses as if her opinion in the review isn't relevant because she doesn't get this particular aspect of nerd culture like *they* do and ignore everything she says about actual problems with the park, including things like employee abuse. It's kind of weird that you would feel strongly enough about what she said in order to comment on it here but also completely willing to ignore her point and instead give your own patronising response.

Logan Swafford

Ok but I did kind of like Maxwell's little song, especially if the additional verses were just actors riffing when they didn't remember the words. That feels very folksy to me in a way that is quite charming, but I may be giving them too much credit.

sgthebee

You could say it got a... redemption arch

Tim Price

Your original Evermore video was one of your best in my opinion, and this is a great follow-up. The alleged labor abuse alone is, in my opinion, too egregious for me to ever visit the park in person, but I am jealous of the shirts and the character deck. That's solid merch, in my opinion.

Tim Price

I am relieved to hear that the llamas are taken care of even if no one else is.

Tim Price

Also RIP to the dwarf band, allegedly gone too soon.

pegsies

this video is amazing, and i love jennys content, but it's a genuine tragedy that she has not one, but TWO bibble plushes, and what seems to be a bibble hat!!! im this 🤏🏽 close to selling a limb to get bibble themed shit. i hope jenny is just being extra cautious by saying people might not enjoy this content because i can't imagine anyone not being interested in this stuff? idk, i dont care about theme parks, i dont play dnd, and somehow, jenny makes everything so entertaining, keeps the audience curious, and does ungodly amounts of research just to cover every facet. i really hope no one is actually miffed about these videos. also its so funny to me that jenny hasnt watched and is extremely unaware of lucifer, the tiktoks of that guy made my whole body shiver and retreat, i thought id implode from second-hand embarrassment, but its nice to know hes a good-hearted person, or at the very least cares about his fan interactions! even though i dont know if it's video worthy, I'd imagine jenny &co. would enjoy watching the drama of lucifer. I've met a lot of nerdy people who act like they're royalty for being on a higher level of nerd than i am, and i think the last part of the video was very well put. i remember one of my coworkers condescend to me about how "naive and immature" boycotting, or even being uncomfortable about supporting unethical institutions is, and that overlooking the blatant abuse or amoral actions was somehow a sign of being a superior being, who is unconcerned with the meaningless quibbles of us mortals. i felt like i was transported into one of those mobile game ads where the level 50 player knocks me, a mere level 5, down and laughs at me and walks away with a big boobed side character. ⁽ᶦᶠ ʸᵒᵘ ʳᵉᵃᵈ ᵗʰᶦˢ ᶠᵃʳ ᶦᵐ ᵗʳᵘˡʸ ˢᵒʳʳʸ ᶠᵒʳ ᵗʰᵉ ⁿᵒᵛᵉˡ ˡᵉⁿᵍᵗʰ ᶜᵒᵐᵐᵉⁿᵗ⁾

pegsies

yeah, the magnificent office park backdrop really brings the ambience to a next level, now you, too, can immerse yourself in a fantasy land of magic and wonder, while being humbled by the gorgeous landscape of white collar urban utah!

pegsies

her point was that people explicitly ask HER for HER opinion, then categorically ignore HER qualified advice and opinion, while condescending to HER, whom they approached, about how SHE just doesn't get it. 1. It's incredibly demeaning and rude to suggest that jenny is somehow uneducated in a subject she spent 18 months researching, 2. its emblematic of a larger problem of women being gatekept in nerd culture, she touched on it a little bit in the bronycon autopsy (not implying the people she talks about in this video are men or knowingly sexist, but even other women who are unaware of the intricacies of sexism in our society tend to believe mens opinions and advice over womens), and 3. its a very good point to make, that some people are so willing to ignore blatant abuse and immoral treatment of workers just to misconstrue her words just so they can excuse, or use, her "glowing recommendation" for their unyielding support of a half-baked plot of dirt and plywood. yes, everyone is responsible for their own judgement and its very possible someone is happy with the price they pay for evermore, but its important to highlight the desire people have for spaces like this, and the lengths they'll go to in order to get a touch of what was promised. it's an especially important point to make after a review in which you're highlighting improvements made to an inferior product that is still struggling to meet a standard they've set for themselves, in which people could take those points, and disregard the rest of the review, hence her saying it was in one ear and out the other. TLDR; she mentions how these people ask her, she gives them an honest review, and they insult her integrity by purposefully bending the truth, which if they don't enjoy the park they can claim jenny misled them or scammed them, or that shes a shill, which even if she has proof is untrue, is still a bad thing to do, and it could reflect badly on jenny's rep, and it allows the person to shake off the blame. i do think you fully misunderstood Jenny's point, but i'm not jenny and i dont want to put words into her mouth, this was my understanding of her explanation mixed with what i already know from my own experience and the teeny bits and pieces ive gleaned from journalists and critics. aka this is alleged, in my personal opinion, jenny pls dont sue me.

pegsies

well, as long as i get a third of a pizza it will have been worth it

pegsies

they explicitly stated that they wouldnt do that, it feels extremely unnecessary to order someone not to do x task after they clearly express zero intention to do x task.

pegsies

right? i felt so weird watching jenny list all the parks "improvements" when all they did was barely meet the bare minimum threshold, and i felt even worse when jenny felt she had to repeatedly express that the park still isnt good because people hear the premise and they so badly want this concept to work. i think ken struck gold by targeting a nerdy hobby to co-opt, because it really does seem like he can just get by doing nothing at all, firing all the people that genuinely believe in the parks potential, and slink about evermore taking pictures of the trees.

pegsies

it felt staged how everytime jenny would hear a pause and reach for the button he'd keep going, genuinely hilarious, that disembodied voice is very well versed in comedic timing lol

Matt Quigley

As an avid consumer of Jenny's content for (jeez!) nearly five years now, and a patron (on and off) for four -- one who, like you, has no great interest in virtually anything she talks about specifically -- I've long felt that Jenny makes her content with the portion of her audience that doesn't share her interests at the forefront of her mind. She provides tons of background, always makes a point of contextualizing things, and makes sure her whole audience is up to speed. Personally, content regarding things I really care about always runs the risk of triggering my most nitpicky and pedantic impulses. With Jenny, I can just take on faith that her opinions are correct. Everyone's been to theme parks, I'm guessing that more Americans than not have been to at least one of the Disney theme parks at least once in their lives, everyone watches movies and reads books, and most of Jenny's audience is probably fixated on various things, and in a way I think her content is as much about that as it is about the topics she discusses. I watch, as I'd bet most of her fans (and, not for nothing, 20k patrons, so I'm certain caution isn't necessary) do, because I relate to how she cares about the (ostensibly) "silly" things that occupy her mind. Granted, she's immensely talented, genuinely witty, disarmingly bright, etc., and not just any old plushie obsessed theme park buff, who used to love 'Star Wars' before it betrayed her, could do what she does. Goodness knows, many have tried. But, I feel like Jenny's cautious declarations of "this time I may have gone too far," in terms of indulging her very specific interests, are more of a warning that things are about to get a bit esoteric and/or arcane. Jenny seems aware that she has a sizeable audience that doesn't share her interests. I understand how that must be confusing for her (to her credit, I think).

pegsies

but make sure to address that it isnt a party, they cant just lounge around!!! youre kind enough to give them this masterclass, they shouldnt dawdle! also make sure to lock up the garage early, afterall, $2,000 isnt nearly enough to get to experience the magical land of James' Garage™ past the COMPLETELY NECESSARY one and a half hour limit!

pegsies

ikr?? i also feel bad that no body seems to be doing anything about it?? idk, i worked with llamas and alpacas a lot in high school and they were all incredibly good natured if you treated them with the respect they deserve, poor guy was probs overwhelmed. i feel bad but the footage of him kicking his legs in the air, then after getting 0 attention, promptly getting up and pretending nothing happened is incredibly relatable and cute.

pegsies

this thread is such a rollercoaster of increasingly cheaper and desperate, but obvious and undeniably profitable stuff that could be done INSTEAD OF HAVING A PLYWOOD CHURCH. reminds me of the shirt fiasco in the first vid. this man is truly doing everything wrong despite being in a financial hole. p.s. your snail terrarium sounds facinating, and well worth $80-$1,000 dollars to see. its at least more interesting than anything offered at evermore.

Natalie Arnold

I agree. I feel like it could work in a proper musical where the different characters have verses about their own struggle. Or in a movie as a montage sequence thing. Not so much as a sing-a-long, for all that it stays in my head.

Natalie Arnold

You're right it totally is! That's so weird, you'd think the meeting would be at the actual bar of the tavern like in the promo video.

Natalie Arnold

Ah, but Jenny is also a voice actor. All she has to do as talk to employees as Applejack. It's foolproof!

pegsies

thankyou!!! people overlook the fact that british accents mostly developed over time (explicitly from an upperclass need to sound distinguished), and the colonies were just cutoff from the old world so they didnt develop with them. plus, maybe im just naive because im not from the US, but isnt there tons of hilarious old western accents, or transatlantic ones, even mixing up accents/registers from around the isles would be nicer, give me a scottish wizard, or an irish inn keeper! idk maybe thatd ruin the fantasy setting for some people, but making fantasy tied exclusively to british accents feels odd. id kill for a season of character actors with old timey news boy or carnival barker accents, all the while fantastical plot stories happen in the background. hell, the rival guilds could adopt the different accents of different mob families. idk maybe its more fun in my imagination, but jenny mimicking "youre in the thick of it now" from the haunted house actor from the first video is all i can think of with british accents and it totally takes me out.

pegsies

id be extra worried about the fate of those animals considering their **incredible** treatment of their human employees tbh

Charles Lotspeich

The guy that showed off tip-top looks like the guy that talked about going on a trip with Gandalf/being sorted from the main video.

pegsies

ive got so much love for llamas and alpacas, i got to work with them a little and theyre so amazing and so unique, that man has my dream job tbh. im glad hes giving them love and proper care, otherwise id have to travel to america and kidnap those llamas

pegsies

just what i was thinking!!! every once in a while i watch the lil snippet and seethe quietly about not having a bibble plush or both the princess and pauper singing barbies.

pegsies

as someone with a lot of dietary restrictions i was looking forward to visiting one day just to throw some hands with that guy :(

Petie

"I suppose if I was given the option I would prefer to haunt a theme park rather than someone's driveway. " - Is winding up as a theme park ghost also called "The Scooby-Doo Ending"?

Cleo Oops

You know you can just not agree without making a big old argumentative thread about it, right?

pegsies

i did a paper on jack the ripper courtesy of our school's elective criminology class, they even sent out the highest graded papers to scotland yard, whitechapel's jack the ripper museum and the crime museum! (i have no idea how that worked or if it was a scam but it was a cool thing to think was happening regardless) i wish id taken up an invitation to the US just so i could have visited this (most likely dingy) event! my favorite PhD specialty ive just learned of is the zooarcheology, dope as hell. also, id love to read your thesis when its done, i cant believe evermore will be mentioned in a genuine doctoral candidate's thesis, i cant wait for future generations to second hand experience all this shit.

Michael Castleberry

Is it weird that I want to go to Evermore now BECAUSE it looks like it sucks?

Michael Castleberry

You gotta really grade on a curve for theater kids from Utah

Michael Castleberry

I gotta hand it to to them, they introduced unskippable cut scenes to the experience.

pegsies

you're so right. i think the way she makes her videos is more what i watch for. i've bored and driven away people by rambling and going on tangential, hours long, talks, and she does it so perfectly, its never boring, and even if i don't think im interested in the topic, the pacing, the reveals and the lil jokes keep me coming back for every single one. when i first became a patron, i didn't think I'd like the Ramble posts because from a glance, they aren't about anything i know of, but i watched them regardless and have 0 regrets. It's also insane how often i genuinely come out of watching the videos having learned something super important about the way i analyze things. shes figured out the perfect recipe for edutainment, now all thats left is to create a themepark, just to put in a rosetta stone cypher that hints at a recipe book for her content.

Clara Margot

that sounds so cool! zooarchaeology is awesome, my dad nearly did a PhD in the exotic animal trade in the Roman empire, which is related to the discipline I believe. I'm also going to mention the imported headstones in Evermore if I can fit it in my thesis, that is one of the wildest instances of morbid theming I've come across lmao

Keith Hasperg

I had the same reaction. Except seeing those like office buildings or shopping plazas or whatever in the background…I don’t think I could travel there for that 😂 But it appeals to me as a fun trip to see something weird I know something about because of these videos

Cleo Oops

I put my money on you winning that fight.

JinksByNature

Please do so many Evermore videos that you have to start naming them like F&F movies. I personally look forward to "4Evermore: This Time It's Personal" where you fight Kevinbretschneider in the parking lot

Sabrina de la Garza

"Now say something so quiet we can't hear you" a FANTASTIC performance by your friend, i literally cannot stop watching that last bit over and over. It's so good

Jordan

Really enjoyed this return to Evermore. Very interesting!

Ty Schalter

I came to the comments just to hear more about this. Ugh.

MW

In 200 years, the tombstone ends up in a shitty theme park in utah

The Huldra King

Seconding Niminae, the first change that could ever allow for Evermore to begin to be 'fixed' is removing Ken from power. SO many people (recently including both the now-former Head Creative Director and VP of Operations) were sold the narrative that things could be fixed, only for Ken to eventually throw them under the bus and undoing any good changes they may have made in spite of him.

alice

I love that one of Evermore’s primary villains was an evil theater kid lol. The fact that he can be summoned through song in a Bloody Mary style ritual is even funnier.

MW

I just keep coming back to 1) Meow Wolf which I have been to the Santa Fe and the Denver ones; both amazing immersive worlds that IMO take Evermore's premise and do it a million times better; and even though it's in one large building instead of an outdoor theme park my friends spent at least 7h? trying to complete and see everything. 2) Conner Prairie which is in Indianapolis (where I'm from) and is a large historical re-enactment site set in the 1800s (different areas have different specific years). With character actors. In the off seasons there's fewer people in the actual houses and the newest area does use some video looping vs real people, but it works well. The actors definitely have a character but they generally stay in their one location and therefore every guest that walks into the house gets the same general spiel, but you can ask them other questions to learn more. Also sometimes they will give you fun tasks to complete (often to children, but when me and my late 20s friends went last year they let us feed apples to the pigs so that was fun) I've just seen ways this concept should work, and its baffling that Evermore is just unwilling to make even tiny tweaks. Also to treat their employees better. Conner Prairie also hires a lot of high schoolers in the summers to round out their cast for peak season, you can't tell me there aren't high school drama kids and/or DnD nerds that would do a summer job filling out the cast at Evermore. (not that they should based on how their current employees are treated, but in a dream world)

The Huldra King

When Evermore opened, there was a lot of work on accents, and the worldbuilding had Evermore to be a town located near the North York Moors in Northern England, that had a lot of portal magic going on because of its positioning on major leylines. They fired the dialect expert after the first season (because he was also a lead actor, the arborist, and one of the directors so he was paid a lot and they weren't making the money they thought they would).

The Huldra King

God this is too real. And it's because these past years after the mass layoff in 2021, they worked so hard to whitewash and sweep everything under the rug and get fresh, blue-eyed new customers on board via tiktok and influencers, people who wouldn't come in contact with people who knew the darker side of Evermore's history.

The Huldra King

@Jenny yes I have seen that so much and it grinds my GEARS "everything has been fixed now!" and even prospective customers parroting "oh they're under new management now!"

Justin Hill

"You know you can just not agree without making a big old argumentative thread about it, right?" For fucks sake. I'm not even taking what she said in BAD FAITH. But no, I guess of all places a Patreon is where the echo chamber should be the loudest. No honest criticism here.

Jillian

👻✨hey girlies ✨👻

AU

RIP 2 hours!

Jillian

I have to constantly remind myself that I don’t actually want to go to Evermore, I want to go with Jenny’s crew and experience the silly chaos that are these trips 😂

Jenny Nicholson

I'm doing a ban for Quarrelsome Behavior carry on everyone

Sarah Jesness

Yeah, that's what gets me about Evermore, it's a lot like a Ren fest but it's open year-round and has a bigger budget. With more competent leadership, they shouldn't have much problem with the concept of "expanded Renaissance fair".

Brennan Lux

loved this video, thank you!!

Caitlin Nothhard

I recently came across the website for a place called Ancient Lore Village, located in Knoxville TN, that definitely seems to be in a similar vein to Evermore. From the website it appears to be pretty small and not have a lot to do there, but it looks like all the structures are at least complete and they’ve got themed cabins/hotel rooms. It might be worth visiting just for the sake of comparing/contrasting it with Evermore, plus you could knock out a trip to Dollywood at the same time if you wanted to do a video about Dollywood or get b-roll for discussing Dollywood in some sort of larger themepark video, especially since you did mention DW when discussing park ambience and spaces just simply being nice to exist in.

Sarah Jesness

I guess people just like the concept so bad that they're willing to ignore the execution.

Cate C

I am also not a preexisting Quincy fan, but if I had been one and bought a ticket to see him, that business with the Q&A would've made me drop him forever. You're telling me they don't have a single canopy they could've put up for the rain that was already happening before the event started??

Marissa Collins

OMG I can't with this dude's fake tavern-y accent

Sarah Jesness

Right? Like, a good menu shouldn't be hard for them to implement.

T. Fazekas

I’m just glad the dude in the suit was in their crew. When I first saw him I yelled. “Evermore lawyer! Jenny he means you harm!” Also “very generous” of Jenny to offer the button push in the super scary mausoleum when the threat of jump-scare was at its highest. :)

Dan Gibbins

Just fascinated at this look into a big ol' "special event" and the layers upon layers of skullduggery underneath it all. For all the improvements Jenny mentioned it still seems to be generally run like a travelling carnival trying to stay one step ahead of the law. Also as someone who dearly loved the Lucifer TV show... I admit I understand why Jenny assumed it was on the CW. Like, fair guess.

Kyle Williams

Reading the title and description I thought this would be a nice 20 minute update. Then I saw it is 2.5 hours! I feel like I should hate that but I know I'll love it!

Janine

It's so funny to me that Evermore is not even as immersive as an escape room

The Huldra King

Cast need their own space, to be fair. Space for cast has historically been an issue at Evermore.

The Huldra King

Unfortunately it doesn't matter if the CEO hired the right teams, he would still undermine them as he always has.

erin 🤸‍♂️

four actors all weekend…… what’s the fucking point honestly

The Huldra King

IIRC (other cast correct me if I'm wrong) Maxwell's serial killer backstory and relationship to Inspector Ozymandias Flynn was floated pretty early on in the creation of those two characters. Maxwell's actor had established a pretty brilliant rationale behind the character, but due to the longstanding issues of Evermore as a medium, none of this would necessarily be consistently conveyed to the audience very well.

The Huldra King

Also some context you missed in the Betwixt and Between when Lich Maxwell was summoned, was that leading up to that, there were verses mysteriously added to the song and other references made to the song, so the song does tie into the summoning in that regard. But again, the bits & pieces issue...

Kelly

JENNY please i love your squishmallow hat. where did you get it

Jenny Nicholson

Thank you I just order patches on etsy of things I like & sew them to blank hats I like!

Emilie Marcello

Hi Jenny, I'm one of the two employees that came and talked to you after the train, I was also the one you spoke to in the Tavern. I'm so glad you guys enjoyed the merchandise and Realms decks. You guys were such great guests, I really enjoyed meeting and talking to you! Also it is true that both me and the other employee you spoke to were fired this last week. It was really painful because we have both tried so hard to make the place better and those efforts were never recognized. If you'd like further details, let me know!

Kelly

wait that's such a good idea thank you! i'd love to see a squishmallow collection tour I bet its top tier. I love the bugs ones

Simi Parquette

The Evermore song Maxwell sang is literally Welcome to the Black Parade

The Huldra King

Welcome to the club! (genuine) In case nobody has told you yet, you deserved so much more, you didn't deserve the shit you had to deal with, and everything good you accomplished at Evermore was to your credit and in spite of Ken's mismanagement. Wish you the best healing and joy in future endeavors.

Wekless

It's so sad to see that some stuff improved to a degree but at the expense of so many other things. You can really see the potential for this park, but management seems to just squander whatever there may be. Out of curiosity, does anyone know if the quality of ticket purchasing/overall website functionality got any better or is it still a train wreck?

Booger

I can't wrap my head around the whole plot thing because like...does important stuff like a character dying only get performed one time? Just for the guests that happen to not only BE in the PARK that day at that specific time, but happen to be in the immediate vicinity of the event? Or do they do an event script daily for a week-month so more people can see it? Like can you just miss a very important saturday or be in the shitter while your favorite character dies and never find out how or why unless someone happened to record and upload it???

Emilie Marcello

Thank you so much! It's so true. On one particular occasion, after I had been berated by Ken and was sobbing at my desk, a fellow employee reminded me that at the end of the day, he's just a small man and we're all ultimately bigger than him.

Jaime B

You killed me at the part where you point out how the candy bags are now placed upright instead of just tossed into their little cubbyhole. Now that's an oblique observation!

ashton

sorry that happened to you. i hope ken gets run over by his fucking SUV.

Skyler

They have done it a variety of was. They tried to make the park a place where the story progressed each day. They have also done repeating days, both due to story reason or just operational. However yes, the big character deaths like Maxwell and Wen weaver happened 1 time. If you were not there then you missed the event. They did try to get people to these big “tableaus” by having an event or scheduled time for people to gather. They would do what Jenny talks about them using the train to pass on as well as a few came back as ghosts for a few days.

Jenny Nicholson

During the Maxwell arc yes. They've had seasons where they experimented with repeating stuff, but in the park’s most active/staffed years they had stuff happen only once. I agree it's a bad system A lot of old podcasters/superfans who did go a LOT of the time would still complain about having to like go to an out-of-town wedding on the wrong weekend and consequently missing a big story moment. And the fandom was small enough that there weren't even really resources to use to catch up

melmelmelmel

I REALLY loved this video. Such a great follow up to the evermore video, I don’t see why anyone wouldn’t wanna watch this! Thank you Jenny for such a good exclusive video ❤️‍🩹

The Huldra King

fuck that breaks my heart but that totally checks out

Ariel

This comment is perfection and really sums up all 4 hours of both videos very succinctly.

Aimee W

would you watch snail content? I have so many hobbies that could be content but the idea of marketing myself makes me cringe

Aimee W

another example I wondered why Anna Faris left the show Mom in the last season. That led me into a month of reading her books, listening to some of her podcasts, 300 reasons why I hate Chris Pratt, deep appreciation for her comedy (specifically House Bunny), Chuck Lorre, and so on. I have nothing to do with all this information. Is this why people make youtube videos? who cares about my opinion of type-casting in hollywood etc etc

Sarah

doing window color/window paintings would be a cheap and fun community activity too. Like, have a fake (or even real!) glass artist there who shows off their craft, and guests can help colour in designs made to match with evermore history.

Chase Cargal

I feel like this video could do well on the main channel (though I'm sure you have good reasons.) Hate to see a place take advantage of both attendants and employees, and maybe your criticisms actually are pressuring them to address some of the problems.

Madeleine

You and your coworker are so sweet — your act of generosity and kindness to Jenny was one of the brightest parts of this video, and genuinely feels like it was the very best of what Evermore can be. It’s so sad that you were fired. I don’t know what’s next for you, but I’m so sincerely wishing you all the best. I hope you’re able to land in a more peaceful workplace where your skills are respected, and where you’re safe from that kind of disrespect and abuse. You deserve so much better. 💖💖💖

Sarah

Maybe they could pivot to hosting general roleplaying/fantasy conventions? The location would be really cool and people wouldn't expect to get as much out of the park itself. Do little workshops in sewing, prop building, character work, maybe a big area where people can try different pen and paper rpgs that aren't quiete as heavy as dnd, panels by influencers, panels by authors...Then again, a convention does requiere competent producers who have the authority to tell Hypothetical Man In Charge to shut up and pay for a gazebo so pepole don't get rained on or sunburned while waiting in line.

Luis

I was on the edge of my seat the whole time seeing how the Quincy meet would go and omg what a scam...in my opinion.

Sarah

wait, so then why did that guy have to apologize so much for killing maxwell?

Jos A

Not very relevant, but your content helps me so much with my anxiety! Thank you for your humorous and insightful commentaries that take my mind off of the world :)

Waffle

Evermore is strange. I'm local and have been watching it's growth since they put up the first billboards to announce it was coming out soon in small town Utah near the national park. The billboards were bad they just said EVERMORE and a picture. I've never gone cause its a schlep from where I live but I really wanted to when it was going to be a lot of structures and a theme park. Since they opened and it wasn't that I never went but I was always curious so I'm really grateful for Jenny covering it and keeping up with it. Would love to see more.

Iris

I love this so much. Our 'bonus video' is 2.5 hours long. Jenny, you're the best. And I hope you do unlock this for people to watch, because this stuff is important. Evermore and Elizabeth Smart's Theranos are more similar than you might think! Charismatic Silicon Valley types trying to use their smarm in the real world and failing- I feel like these cautionary tales are massively important for the future.

Isaac Jordan

“i bet most of you are super evermored out” jenny, i have watched the video so many times that i’ve lost count. seeing this bonus get posted felt like christmas morning. i now have an insatiable curiosity that can never be quenched

Shannon Marie MCGovern

As someone who helps run LARPs, the amount of wasted potential is so infuriating. We will put on a game in convention center room and work our asses off and have spent several thousand dollars over the course of a few years to give our space a fraction of the ambiance and theming that they are wasting. And just the small amount of effort that could improve things so much, if the people in charge just put in the time or money.

Minnie

so grateful and excited for this content!! thanks, Jenny!

Madeleine

Omg you’re so right! It’s totally him

Jackie Clark

i hope the evermore videos continue for… evermore

arlo

she probably is very aware of this! lol

O

They didn't even have the dragon hand puppet!

Kav

Oh, dear God, how did I miss this the announcement email? It's currently 3 a.m. where I am, I have to work tomorrow, I went to quickly check something on Patreon (that the excitement for this video has caused me to forget) and I'm still tempted.

Nickel Brady

Jenny!! Did you also return to *The Grid* while in Utah?

Kinetics Video

I mean, that would entail Evermore escalating as an artistic and business failure, so uh, careful what you wish for

Austin P. Smith

I love her Nerd Commenter Voice because it is exactly how I read that type of comment too

Jenny Nicholson

Oh this isn't Evermore’s fault but bonus lore for this video: this time we stayed at the hotel that shares a parking lot with Evermore and our room vibrated. It came in waves, at all hours. The first night I thought maybe it was big trucks rattling by but in the daylight I could feel it happening but see the road was empty. I think we must have had a room next to some AC or heating unit, or maybe the whole hotel was like that The vibrations were powerful enough to wake me up at night (I'm an extremely heavy sleeper) and in the morning doing our makeup we could see the mirror shivering. I've never experienced anything like this lol. We were so tired the whole trip

Eric MacMillan

I half expected you to say you looked out the window and saw Ken driving his SUV.

Emilio Bustamante

Jenny's Friend: “Greetings!!!” Lady in costume: “Hey girlies” Literally the most delightful interaction I’m sure Jenny and her friends had this entire wretched trip – Evermore should hire crypt lady, as it seems its business model is to have people just do stuff for them for free anyways. Man, that really sucks about that Quincy dude. I was curious about his content when Jenny started the vid but now I’m most definitely not

Emilio Bustamante

I mean, I feel morbidly curious now. And the enviroments do look kinda pretty... if you dont loo to hard. But I would NEVER fly there. I woulnt even really take a long car trip either.

Emilio Bustamante

That seems like something you would not want to admit. It makes him look bad

Emilio Bustamante

Ive been to a viking villages with some pop up buildings (not like actually built longhouses) and I can tell you, even though the place was clearly more amateur than proffesional (it wasnr like, the Yorvik Living Museum or anything) the experiance of that was 100 times what you could get out of evermore

Emilio Bustamante

1000 dollars is an outrageous amount of money, like Im getting anxiety just thinking about it. Not even for Matt Mercer himself over several days would I forkout that cash

Isabella

Yes!! I thought the same thing

Emilio Bustamante

Right, if I had to work in Evermore I would probably end up snapping and killing someone too

Emilio Bustamante

Ive been to an amateur "living viking village" and I can say that the accents people where putting up there where a lot more consistent and believable than discount middle earth here.

Marisa Leon

Big "Be sure to drink your Ovaltine" energy at the Rosetta stone thing

Emilie Marcello

Thank you guys so much for the kind words! They really do mean a lot. It's been a tough few weeks. I've always believed that Evermore should be about giving back and connecting with each other. It's really sad it isn't able to be that because of a few people.

Sqand

He was just foreshadowing his necromancer arc!

Kyle

I can't with them decorating the park with those Temu lights at 35:55 lmao

Sam Hetherington

If you go back again, you should cosplay as the CEO’s SUV

T. Fazekas

So what I’m hearing in this comment is that while Jenny doesn’t recommend the park, she did like this comment about the park, so the park is good? Great! (skips merrily to the airport to buy a ticket to Utah)

T. Fazekas

No mention of The Grid?! I believe that one of the reasons these videos are so popular is because this is “every employee in a “start up” experience” since 2015. Dude gets rich in the 90’s, doesn’t fully understand how, starts (blank), flails uncontrollably

T. Fazekas

Quincy didn’t strike me as a shoot from the hip, unscripted, public speaking guy? I immediately thought the Evermore crew needed filler and added that to the agenda, surprising him as much as anyone.

purplehayes

These videos end up being so disappointing. I love ren fairs and would love a dedicated, year round, highish budget ren fair park. Also if you can't use some of train cars because the train isn't powerful enough you should probably remove them to help shed weight in addition to not putting people in them. Maybe then your cast members wouldn't need to push it in the rain.

Ruthy K

Just wanted to comment and say that your hair looks so beautiful in this ❤️ I was so distracted. So shiny!

T. Fazekas

They may just lack the human capital. In any given geographic area there’s only so many people willing to act, cosplay, create art, or enthusiastically ren faire. Nothing against Utah but that’s probably a shallower pool and Evermore managed to burn out or alienate them all in its first few years.

Stranger Kate

As a local, I would just like to say, IN MY OPINION, Magleby's food is extremely overrated. It's the resident "fancy place" but it's basically just an Olive Garden with a paint job. So the catering would've also been a rip off, IN MY OPINION.

Clementine Danger

"Many people thought 'exclusive access to the park' meant the park would be open" I'm crying.

Clementine Danger

I haven't finished the video but I SINCERELY hope they've gotten better at actor safety because that beautiful boy at about 46:30 is going to get Panned.

R.E. Beaulieu

No that makes sense. Guess Florida cicadas are less annoying lol 🤦‍♀️ certainly won't stop me from watching this video 400 times

Rae Leo

I thought you meant critically panned at first but yes total pandom energy right there

Stanley Wu

Was the VIP ticket $999 or $1000? If it was $1000, that might suggest Evermore prioritized showing the "value" to influencers rather than encouraging non-influencers to buy VIP tickets

Taycen Timothy

Evermore has continued to shown that they’re indefensible, but in the interest of full accuracy: The Convergence was a private event that used Evermore as a venue and not a primarily Evermore-run event.

Taycen Timothy

I *believe* the management being let go and the post from the female performer who was paid less were unrelated and just coincidentally happened almost right on top of each other. The implication I understood from one of the former employee’s personal posts was that they worked themselves to death when they were put in that position in order to fix (and were likely prevented from making most of the fixes they wanted to), and after years of this they finally started setting boundaries for their mental and physical health’s sake and were then fired for “no longer doing their part”

Taycen Timothy

They experimented with different takes on it over the years. The first year actually had dialect coaches and training as part of the actors’ training, and before Ken threw away all the original IP in a fit in 2021 the worldbuilding included relatively more consistent and logical linguistics for the different fictional cultures. Now it’s largely “yeah just try what ever vaguely English-sounding accent you can idk”

Taycen Timothy

@Sarah yep. Which is its own tragedy.

Taycen Timothy

@Jenny yeah, it has been extremely frustrating to see them use the time of your visit as an excuse to discount ALL the feedback that was given. I will say though that the person running the social media is a young intern who ALSO acts AND does makeup for the park. They were probably told how to respond to those comments and were then forced to keep repeating it with no nuance.

Brian Tatosky

Yeah, it was clear at the beginning the owner intended to put money from The Void VR money into Evermore, not really making The Void work first (if it even could).

Taycen Timothy

Thank you for your efforts, Emilie. We didn't interact much but I'd still like to say you were appreciated by all of us who actually had boots on the ground in-park.

Taycen Timothy

It was a private event at Evermore, not an Evermore-produced event. The normal season has a full cast of characters. (again, not defending the park's abhorrent practices; I just want to avoid the park using inaccurate details as an excuse to dismiss the response again)

Taycen Timothy

Oh god, the even worse irony of the lack of access to standard park experience for the Convergence is that Evermore did have an entire cast waiting in the wings for their new season to start and we were all *explicitly told* we would not be working it. If Quincy and Co. wanted Evermore staff to populate the park for their event it should have been able to happen, so I have no idea why it was advertised that way.

Taycen Timothy

There was/is an entire cast in place for the regular season that opened very soon after The Convergence. Why we were not included I have no idea, but I speculate that the Convergence was a partnership between Quincy's Tavern and Evermore and Quincy's Tavern couldn't actually afford to rent the full-park experience for their guests.

Taycen Timothy

There are still actors- just not at that private event. However, all the long-developing story and consistent worldbuilding was thrown out in 2021 and any story or gameplay experience is very minimal.

Taycen Timothy

I think a very real fear is that if Evermore fails this type of experience may not ever be available elsewhere. The infuriating part is that developers considering a similar concept may look at Evermore's failure and think "nope, this concept isn't viable" even though Evermore's failure has everything to do with it's ownership and management and nothing to do with the concept itself

Serolfic

Absolutely NOT Evermore'd out. If there's anything more to say about it I'm keen to listen 😄

Andrea Bee

I don't know if llamas behave the same as horses in any respect, but it kinda looks like he's attempting to have a roll on the grass (like dogs do, but bigger lol). Jenny's probably right, though. He was being feisty!

adjective

Oh GEARS. Thought you said FEED HIM HIS EARS. TIPTOP NEEDS EARS

Luis

Is this the same hotel that had sludge all over the windows?

Fiona

#let Jenny ride the caboose

Madeleine

Oh wow, so interesting to hear that there is a whole cast! Do you have any idea how many actors will be at the park on an average day?

Sarahodo

I don't understand why they keep using the word "immersive" on all their promotional material when they absolutely cannot deliver that type of experience 🙄

Taycen Timothy

For the current season that is open Fri-Sat until August 5th there are about 20-25 characters that are present for at least a portion of the evening. For reference, I would estimate that ticket sales have been around 300-600 a night. During Lore, the Halloween season, the total amount of actors approaches 60, but the majority of them are scare actors for the haunt and aren't characters that people can stop and interact with. Ticket sales during Lore range from 1000-2000+.

Taycen Timothy

cast member here @51:50 That analysis by Jenny is exactly correct. Those buildings were designed and built as places that guests walk through once, not locations people spend time in. The current decor and furnishing is the best attempt by a team of maybe 5 people who are in charge of the physical facilities of the entire park and have no resources to counteract the building's design. @53:15 the columns around St. Apollonia have been there since the park opened and are actual antiques; I once heard they might actually be the oldest artifacts in the park. Another fun-fact about the park that has no real benefit and was probably stupidly expensive to implement. @53:40 very little of the park's original or "hard" construction has any 'relevant' details, because Ken designed and built a "story-experience park" without ever writing a story. More recent "soft" set-dressing details have some relevancy, but most of they characters they refer to are 'invisible' and never make an appearance. They only exist as an attempt to justify some of the park's design details like the building having names attached to them. For example "This is the Nettleton Mill!" "Who are the Nettleton's?" "Uhh...." and then some letter with those names will be put somewhere to make it look like it was planned that way all along. @1:08:30 the details in the set that seem to lead to story aren't really quests, just Easter Eggs that have little to no relevance. As Jenny said, these are fun if they're extra on top of a baseline experience with actual characters and interaction. Once again, there *are* actors employed by the park and there *is* a (minimal) amount of story and interaction to experience, but **APPARENTLY** it was decided to *not* include that as part of this VIP event. I'm actually surprised there were any actors at all present and I was an actor hired by Evermore at the time of this event. @1:13:30 I find it funny but also very frustrating they they finally made some small changes after Jenny's video. No disrespect to Jenny, but many of her points of feedback in the video was hardly new to Evermore discourse and they just ignored it all until a big famous YouTuber said it. @1:17:00 that stage is where circus performers and fire dancers sometimes perform, and occasionally has story events there as well. You know, when they actually have circus performers and fire dancers and story events. The stage was damaged by weather and wear and tear over the winter and it took until midway through the summer for it to be operational again. @1:19:55 while I don't know the specific answer in this case, it's yet another example of the park's design prioritizing form over function. So much of the physical park was designed as if people would never get within six feet of it or look at it for longer than 30 seconds. This despite the fact that the park is supposed to be 'immersive' and 'interactive' @1:21:05 I think that only happened on one occasion (dead characters riding away on the train. Lots of characters died.) lol. Also I'll remind everyone that all the story and characters was thrown out and reset in early 2021 and all the creative staff that ever worked on those stories and characters were laid off. Any characters or story events that Jenny discovered in her research no longer exists, are no longer canon, have no relevance to anything Evermore does presently, and anyone who developed them no longer works for Evermore. I specify this not to discount Jenny in any way, but to emphasize that before 2021 there was extensive creative work that was produced in-park that had enough of a positive response from guests at the time to warrant it being thoroughly discussed, recorded, and remembered. Then it was all thrown away. In comparison, any story or characters that have appeared since then has had nowhere near that level of engagement. @1:28:50 I don't really have any perspective on the Quincy's Tavern involvement because *officially* The Convergence was a private event organized and hosted by a separate entity from Evermore Park that just happened to use Evermore as a venue, which is why some facilities were closed and Evermore cast wasn't present*. But as we can see from Jenny's experience they really seemed to go out of their way to market the event in an ambiguous way. This makes it hard to say if problems with this specific event were due to poor planning by Evermore or poor planning by Quincy's Tavern, *but* it does show that Evermore is ill-equipped to handle special events like this which is yet another major missed opportunity. *Except for the 2-4 characters who were actually present, apparently? This was news to me and I was an actor at Evermore during this time. Imo, if the characters are meant to be interacted with then there's a minimum amount that needs to be present. If that minimum can't be reached then maybe it is better to have none at all. @1:42:30 I have no further insight into why these hard-working, passionately invested employees were fired other than that no hires were made to replace them. People underneath them are now taking on their responsibilities in addition to their previous work, and I fully suspect any pay-raise they may have been given is much less than the salaries of the let-go employees. It's like the park thought they were spending too much money on shoes so they decided to fully cut their legs off. @1:45:50 Here's some more information about Realms: 1. The project was completely profitable for Evermore. Not enough to place a dent in Evermore's overall deficit, but the costs in developing and publishing the card game was easily made back from sales. So even if you're purely financially motivated, canceling this project made no sense. 2. There was another full-sized deck completely finished and ready to be sent to the printers when the game was canceled. I'm particularly hurt by this because characters I played weren't included in the first deck but were in the second deck. I got to see their art and it's incredible. It's my likeness and is likely the coolest I've ever looked and I can't even share it because it's Evermore's IP. 3. Yet another reminder that all of the IP that those cards were based off of was unceremoniously thrown away and those characters are not only no longer present but not even canon anymore. I keep bringing this up mostly because it particularly upsets me. @1:51:45 I think the writing team from that time deserve a bit more credit, but Jenny is completely correct in that communicating the nuance of the story was all but impossible to the general park audience. There was a lot of experimenting with different methods of doing so to different degrees of success. Ultimately I just wonder why a so-called "story experience" park was designed in such a way that so poorly facilitates storytelling, and I think that the people who decided to build and engage with the story despite everything working against them don't deserve any blame. @2:02:30 Evermore absolutely does not communicate this well, or at all, but the weeks before and including The Convergence are essentially a transitional off-season period where they open to let people walk the grounds and shop at the vendors and not much else. During the major seasons there are usually characters present, and unfortunately neither of Jenny’s visits have been during a typical major season. @2:04:20 The dragon appears every night during the current season (ending Aug. 5). I don’t understand why the park didn’t want to go all out for The Convergence if they were trying to take advantage of its marketing as a VIP event either, but their official position is that The Convergence was not an Evermore event but a Quincy’s Tavern event that happened to be hosted at Evermore. @2:11:21 Nonsensically, the tavern was not designed to be at all functional. It was built to look pretty as people walk through it and stay no longer than a few minutes. Naturally, guests want to spend time in the tavern and expect it to facilitate people sitting and socializing and maybe even having a refreshing drink because it’s a tavern in a fantasy village in an “immersive” and “interactive” theme park. How it was never understood that would be the case when building the park is one of many unfathomable mysteries around Evermore. @2:13:25 No. Well I mean they could have but then they would have to pay someone to do that. Evermore has essentially 0 money, and they don’t even have any assets they could sell because the only asset is the park itself. They are still trying to find ways to save money by minimizing staff to a dangerously low level. Overall I would say that the majority of Jenny’s feedback is still valid and that Evermore’s actions are unconscionable and indefensible, but it is unfortunate that she still hasn’t experienced a typical Evermore night or been able to really interact with any actual cast or characters directly. Her first visit was during the most barebones period when the park first opened after COVID closures, and The Convergence was a special event in partnership with a separate entity that wasn’t necessarily meant to include the typical Evermore experience (though it’s stupid that wasn’t made clear in the marketing).

The Huldra King

The IP flush during the 2021 layoffs is something I will forever be bitter about. Not only was that second deck so close to being released, the 5e module for Aurora wasn't far behind, lots of work and playtesting was put into it. Even if the IP created wasn't superb, Ken just never gave an actual shit about using IP strategically for revenue.

Crispy Año

I could never go to a park like this in the first place because the secondhand embarrassment I get from even these brief clips of the actors is PALPABLE

Miguel Sandoval

Unfortunate that this video isn't public. The Evermore people could probably use the constructive criticism/feedback, if they did in fact listen to some of the advice in the last one.

Taycen Timothy

I don’t remember (or more likely, never knew) the specifics but I’m sure there was plenty of backstory and details that justified or explained Maxwell’s actions. And if you so happened to be one of the handful of dedicated guests who specifically seeked out these conversations and then converged afterwards (usually at Denny’s until 4 am) to piece it all together you would know this.😂

Taycen Timothy

And if you had no exposure to the story it would probably require an essay to explain all the context necessary to properly understand it. The Evermore writing team was creating a modern Epic that could only be properly appreciated by probably less than 100 people, but boy did those people really get into it. I think they got so excited about writing a cool story (and it did genuinely have its moments) that they lost track of writing a story that was fully communicable in a theme park setting to the average guest.

Taycen Timothy

To be fair, those types of moments happened very rarely compared to the hundreds of hours the park was open and the vast majority of typical interactions you would have had with these characters. Those parts just don’t get filmed and posted to YouTube.

Bridie Bowler

i can't get over the maxwell actor singing panic at the disco so passionately

Jenny Nicholson

Tbf I think the people who listened to my advice on their behalf have now been fired

Jesse “Heinous Crimes” Lovelace

The fact that a group chat exists that knows about an obscure line a character actor said once that got printed on a card, something probably nobody in the world knew or joked about before this video, delights me so much. Thank you so much for sharing that with us 😂

Madeleine

So interesting, thank you! And do you know if the buddy system Jenny observed (actors travel in twos) is something that’s going to continue going forward, or if it was just a fluke for the convergence?

tobo

Thank you for the update video! Your Evermore review has been living rent free in my head ever since I first saw it, so I was overjoyed about this extra content.

Taycen Timothy

It wasn’t a fluke, and it’s a system that’s been in place since before Jenny’s video was released. Characters are either never alone or at the very minimum placed in a very open and public space where they could get someone’s attention quickly. Actors are not only allowed but required to keep their phones accessible on their costume at all times in order to ping security or management immediately if there are any issues.

charredCnidaria

True, but I think the funniest (saddest?) part of this whole situation is that the ultimate reason Evermore is struggling is because it didn't actually *want* to be a LARP-specific park. It was gonna be a whole Disney-esque experience, and got demoted (from the CEO's perspective, I imagine) to what it is now. So I genuinely think that if other people set out from the *beginning* to make this type of park, it would do much better and have the same fanbase of people willing to patronize it.

Kelly Michals

A few months back I was driving from SLC south several hours for work, Provo made a good lunch stop. Got a sandwich and found Evermore and just parked sideways in its empty parking lot and marveled at how bad the curb appeal was between it and THE GRID. Took a few pics and drove off, shaking my head. That's how I visit these train wrecks, basically a drive by peace-sign-by-a-grave meme

Megan Smart

If there weren't supposed to be actors provided by evermore, is it possible that the actors present were brought in by Quincy for the event?

Hayley Mills

It's wild how Ken managed to fail so spectacularly, when so many people were willing to basically run the park for him without pay.

Sarah

Thanks for all that info, very cool! This stands out to me personally "@53:40 very little of the park's original or "hard" construction has any 'relevant' details, because Ken designed and built a "story-experience park" without ever writing a story. " That somehow made things click for me. And it makes sense if Brettschneiders actual relevant experience is really just designing Haunted Hauses and maybe the Void Experience, very guided experiences where the players walk through an area and can't really ask follow up questions. It doesn't really work like that in a pen and paper game, where your players _will_ ask questions like 'who are the nettletons? Hey random dwarf, do you have beef with the baker? do you want us to beat up the baker? Hey what's the history of this place? Oh that guy is a grizzled Veteran? What war did he fight in? There's a murder mystery going on, lets see if we can find clues! Oh the funny charming bard is secretley evil? Why? Lets talk to him'. I love that sutff, and i prefer games hat encourage all players to participate in worldbuilding, but Brettschneider seems to prioritize aesthetics.

Devin M

Let’s say people spent $300-400 on a flight plus $400 for a hotel. For $1,800, you could literally book a short trip from the US to an actual medieval European town. Liiiiiike.

erin 🤸‍♂️

ohhh i see. i still think that for $80 for the base ticket they should pull out all the stops- i don’t understand why they would understaff when there is already so little to do i guess

Taycen Timothy

@Megan the clip she showed was of one of my coworkers. My best guess is they didn’t want to pay for a full night of wages but still wanted to take the opportunity to promote the upcoming season by having a small few characters present.

Austin F

obviously ken sent one of his overpriced ghosts to your hotel

Jeremie

Utterly delightful. I’m glad I rewatched the Evermore video first because it made me feel even more like I was part of your friend group, understanding the in-jokes and everything (parasocial relationships ftw). I’m glad the Maxwell costume was explained because it was one of the most puzzling things (I love that the explanation is totally Evermore). I would love another Evermore video someday… it has to be a trilogy, right? Also I found the masquerade costume incredible and I wish more of it had been shown!

Jeremie

So sad to hear you were fired, I hope you land on your feet soon. It was refreshing to hear reasonable criticism in the tavern - you should have been in charge instead of people who overpromised and underdelivered.

Jeremie

He was awesome and made me laugh so hard.

Dash

Hi Jenny—just wanted to mention that as one who is on the record as being potentially sensitive to shaky-cam effects, the difference from the use of the gimbal, while subtle, did seem to eliminate any dizziness issues so thanks so much for the use of the implement! Also, at this point, SUV appearance = feature, not bug 😆

Yana

Great video Jenny :) ‘The park will get a little better every year’ … At the end of the world is a great big mountain of granite rock a mile high. And every year, a tiny bird flies all the way to the rock and wipes its beak on it. Well, when the little bird has worn the mountain down to the size of a grain of sand . . . that's the day Evermore Park will be worth the admission price.

Chrombus

What do I put in the search to find her second channel?

Christine Govas-Robert

I'm sad for all the employees at Vanders Keep but I'm also a little satisfied to see that smug head chef having eaten his words. Maybe if he'd been more empathetic toward people with dietary restrictions...

Geoff Clarke

I gasped when I saw that the grain silo was the skeleton of the famous tree. I think it perfectly captures the gap between what was promised and what was delivered.

Sarah

i’m absolutely not evermore’d out. i’d looove a video where you go over the whole character lore and narrative arc for the old version of the park. great video, thanks for making it :)

Tzivia Kleinbart

The first video pissed me off with how little they seemed to care about their guests experience or money, but this one enraged me. Charging $80 for the same bullshit experience as before is so gross. They improved the part maybe 2% but removed the actors, ran an expensive event where half the offerings didn’t exist, and the main draw didn’t do any of the promised events. I cannot believe they had the audacity to lie on social media claiming your video didn’t accurately reflect the improvements to the park, but I guess that’s on me for being surprised by anything they do at this point.

Alexis

Excuse you but some of us actually appreciate the quiet beauty of a desolate construction site with unobscured views of office buildings. I guess you're just not enough of a nerd to understand.

Kathleen

Wasn’t it CW and then Netflix?

Kathleen

I went to one of The Void’s non-Utah locations and it wasn’t terrible. Problem was it cost $50 for a VR experience that was made for a comic-con promo for a certain big franchise about wars in space. So a cool experience for free was a let down at $50/person. It was also maybe 5 minutes long?

Kathleen

Almost a decade ago I worked for a not-a-theme-park popular nerd project as their marketing manager. The grift was so incredibly strong— my boss constantly strung along major sponsors while my colleagues and I scrambled to live up to her pie in the sky ideas. One of them involved renting an RV and driving it across the country as a marketing stunt, which is hilarious for a place that could barely keep the lights on (not because it didn’t have $ but because the $ was going to the grifters.) Watching both the Evermore videos gave me flashbacks… it was a cool job with so many opportunities but also made me so ill my doctor told me I had to quit (they fired me first!) There’s nothing quite as bad as a for profit enterprise sucking the life and passion from its employees who are trying to do their best by the fans under impossible circumstances.

T. Fazekas

It’s the ultimate behind the scenes tour!

T. Fazekas

I just subscribed so if we could shut this line down, thanks. It’s raining and cold outside, people have been waiting for hours after spending over a $1,000? SHUT IT DOWN!

Dan Gibbins

I did always wonder why his apology didn't include "But in my defense he had gone crazy and started murdering people willy-nilly."

Dan Gibbins

Fox then Netflix, which might have been better? The CW-that-was was so slow to cancel things that they might not have moved to Netflix, where they did their best seasons.

Jenny Nicholson

Yeah and iirc one of Maxwell's murder victims might have even been Dervell's little sister. I don't think he and Cecily will ever see eye to eye but maybe if they each take turns stating their positions a few more times

Aimee W

recycling the old vr promos

teacupful

I don't have a business background, but I've worked in Parks & Rec and done some small-scale event management as a librarian. These videos got me obsessed with how a version of Evermore could actually WORK. The Disney model is all wrong. There's an awesome Everglades-adjacent fruit stand in Florida called Robert is Here, and to me, THAT'S the realistic model. The actual stand was small, but on a lot of land. It always drew HUGE lines for it's outstanding smoothies and milkshakes (I will drive two hours for their key lime milkshake). They used to have a few small cages for rescued animals out back, but now that whole area has been paved, has a big chickee hut aviary full of rescued birds, has a mountain of boulders that the goats love to climb on and the big Sulcata tortoises rest under when they need some shade.... they also reworked the queue for the shakes so it winds back in this shady area instead of becoming a barrier across the front of the store. Evermore should have been a small fantasy-themed restaurant or cafe on a lot of land with Instagramable, wish-fulfillment food. They should have really focused on honing the experience and the product small-scale, and then gradually built out as they had the funds to do so-- maybe add a patio garden eating area. A turtle pond (because if you have land, why not use it as habitat for rescued animals). Have farmer's market-style festival weekends where local artists can sell their goods. Work in something environmental like composting for a garden that's actually used in the restaurant or a dragon made of recyclables, some permanent features that set it apart from a Renaissance Fair. I dunno, LOL. That's what I'd want to see! Why promise Disney and fail when you could start as the D&D equivalent of a maid cafe? Start by actually finishing the TREE, forget the park! This place just seems so unappealing to me across the board-- it's none of what make a Ren Fair fun, even. People just want to go eat in a D&D tavern. Have literally three high quality menu items but in a carefully crafted setting.

Aimee W

“so you wanna move rooms?” “no this is the evermore experience”

Aimee W

punk ass book jockey!

Zachary C

Most of it gives me that vibe. Even the nice lady with the dragon puppet from video 1 kind of made me cringe. I don’t even think this idea is embarrassing, just something about it at evermore weirds me out.

Ann Parker

I'm really sensitive to shakycam too, and this footage was much easier for me to watch! I didn't have any effects, it was great.

Ann Parker

I hope you do make this one public too; both because it's great and because people need to know. Unlike the Convergence's 15 min, you actually did provide 4 (now 6.5!) hours of Evermore experience!

Rachel Cook

So I watched this last night and it was awesome. Then I watched a video about a park in France called Puy De Fou, another theme park with no rides, and I think you need to go there as a palate cleanser.

Ren ☆

That’s so sweet that the staff gave you gifts! I assume their relationship with the park is just as complicated as yours is

Hillary

That was my feeling, too. It's almost not even fun to watch as a train wreck (I mean, it is, but) because it is SO shady and scammy and gross and coupled with the way they treat their employees it's just kind of awful? If it were me I would 1000000% release this video to everyone, but I just feel like if a company is going to be that incredibly money grubbing they kind of deserve it.

Sarah

themepark tie in kitchen in the middle of an office park in uta is surely a choice to be snobish about food

Sarah

The joy Jenny radiates when showing off a discontinued cardgame for a failing themepark is something i can only aspire to bring into the world one day.

Dash

Yay! Glad it wasn’t just me

Jen B

I'm just going to go ahead and admit that I didn't know the "speak up buddy" line was just a joke. I am the problem.

TJ LaFollette

Subbed just for this video. Evermore is honestly so far removed from my interests and lifestyle but I can’t get enough of your coverage lol.

Patrick

why is everyone in evermore European? did they all have a meeting and just decide to each pick a different area of Europe to imitate?

Jenny Nicholson

I would loooooove to go, it's on my list! Their themed hotels also look extremely cool, idk how I'd even choose between them. And I love the vibe where it's seemingly all connected so you just amble down long pathways into the park like it's summer camp

Dan Black

Honestly, it sounds like you DO have a business background. I just watched her original Evermore video and this one in a row, and I was always trying to figure out how a theme park like this could work -- how it could be successful and deliver what it promised with methods that could scale up to the number of people it would require to keep it financially solvent. I think you have very good ideas for a realistic business model. For one thing, it appeals to me as someone who doesn't really have any interest in the larping, quests, or semi-scripted character interactions. I don't mind other people doing it and enjoying it around me -- in fact, I love watching people at ren faires with their amazing costumes. But I just like the aesthetics of what now probably gets defined as fantasy cottage-core and want to experience that kind of environment… including, of course, the food! So your ideas for centering around food and mixing it in as a wildlife rescue really appeal to me. I'd love to go to something like that.

Marion Heisenberg

As a French viewer : please come to France ! A puy du fou video would be incredible. Your theme park videos are my favorite ones, I watch them on a loop

Dan Black

@Shred Cadmium - So the one publicly visible video on that channel… Is that… TAYLOR SWIFT?!?

teacupful

I think it's just having a public services background LOL... seeing how public spaces are used. Preparing for programs where maybe no one shows, or maybe 80 people show. I've seen how the wrong kind of space can determine whether or not you even get a certain demographic of patrons to stick around. How do people feel when they walk into a place? Thinking about that is a part of running a good nature center or library! And there's a lot that sucks about South Florida, but we have some amazing nature centers and parks. I thought of Robert Is Here because it's so unusual (and a private business), but Evermore could have easily just been Morikami. It's a Florida garden/commemoration of the immigrant family who used to live here with Japanese buildings and a small indoor museum with rotating modern and historical exhibits. What makes it special is the way they have invested in specialists landscapers who have shaped native Florida plants to resemble the botanical forms typical of different eras of Japanese gardens. It gets money from our (substantial) retiree crowd, it gets cosplaying teens and vacationers on the weekends, it hosts amazing artists and classes and (pre-COVID :<) festivals. SoFLa is not, uh, a ~cultural hub~ outside Miami, so it's one of the most special and popular places around. Basically, when I see all of that space and wasted money, the first thing I think is, "this could have been the coolest PUBLIC PARK/community center of all time". Morikami is basically a successful Evermore, if you had scheduled LARPing instead of garden tours. You could even keep the LARP element as, like, a summer camp! Do a kids camp during part of the year and a camp for adults at different times! Argh! I've had to do so much with so little as a nature camp director and librarian that seeing resources squandered like this feels personally infuriating. It sucks specifically because this guy is determined to be a bad Walt Disney instead of a decent parks director.

Jenny Nicholson

I've also been eyeballing Futuroscope which is pretty close to Puy du Fou because of their knockoff of the star wars hotel. But that one definitely looks like a one-day park since it's mostly 4d films. How many days are good for Puy du Fou? It looks really big

Clementine Danger

I came here to ask that! I'm European and I don't get it so this is a sincere question: how come when American productions do something fantasy or "medieval" they put on this weird all-of-the-UK accent? Like, in the park as it was imagined, wouldn't it be a hurdle for guests to interact with the world if they felt obliged to put on this weird accent? Doesn't that ruin immersion and create distance much more than just using a standard American accent would?

Clementine Danger

The "no it's a Quincy’s Tavern event" stance from management baffles me. That should be an all-hands-on-deck situation! I don't care what you have to do and which fired employees you have to beg on your knees, you go all out even if it isn't ""officially"" your event! Guests are going to associate it with your park no matter who signed which contract. If you get it right the rewards are huge and if you get it wrong it's not like unhappy guests are going to go the the Patreon of a creator who did a video about it once to see the follow-up to read the comments to find out oh, not their fault, it wasn't """"officially"""" their event, guess I'm not mad at them anymore. So did the Quincy team set the prices and schedule? Were they the ones that "catered" the VIP events? Either way, thank you for sharing all this. Couldn't agree more that everyone involved deserved so much better.

Clementine Danger

Full time animal handlers and care and permits are not cheap!

Clementine Danger

I get it. I'm a writer and I'm fully committed to the draft I did for a blow-off side project romance novel about a starry-eyed actor in a failing Utah theme park and the lonely fan who needs to overcome her parasocial urges to truly love him. As for everyone who isn't a for-hire romance novel author trying their best, I've got nothing.

Clementine Danger

If you splice together that episode of Hotel Hell and the Hoarders one with the once-wealthy lady being evicted from her palatial home, you've got the Evermore behind-the-scenes

Clementine Danger

Ugh, sick of this lawntok hype. The ship has sailed find a new niche!

Clementine Danger

Before these Evermore videos I had never heard the word "caboose" and now it's branded onto my prefrontal cortex

Clementine Danger

I'm European and I was trying to figure out what part of England he was from by watching the promo and getting nowhere. Fell out of my chair laughing when he did the not-Q&A in standard American.

Clementine Danger

This is why you keep your write-for-hire work separate from your passion projects. Obviously give it your best and respect the material and the client, but keep your true passion for your own projects.

Clementine Danger

The "returning as ghosts" thing could have been an opportunity. Plenty of people and especially nerdier people are familiar with the concept of ghost being stuck at their time of death and playing it out again and again. For guests who missed it you could easily do a catch-up event, a "come see the ghosts of the characters re-experience the moment of their tragic demise!" kind of thing. "Some say Wen Weaver still haunts the steps where she died every full moon!" Pour a bag of flour over the actors to make them seem ghostly, use some spooky music and lighting to indicate this is a ghost event, you're done. But then Evermore's problem was never that they didn't have enough creative people with good ideas, is it?

Clementine Danger

The dragon puppet conversation seemed very natural to me! I think it helped that she wasn't required to (or just didn't) put on that weird accent and talked in a conversational tone, just a normal chat about her normal job.

Clementine Danger

I'm European and I'm devastated to report that none of our towns exist outside of linear time

Clementine Danger

"Mom can we have a tree with a face?" "We have a tree with a face at home." The tree with a face at home:

Geoff Clarke

Plus, there was almost a train wreck

urban_radagast

This park looks like any gentrified district in the midwest

Kit

ah so instead of taking the "treat your actors better" advice they opted to just... not have actors

meg

Maybe someone has pointed this out already but llamas should never live alone, they need another llama or atleast sheep/goats/alpacas for company. I hope the llama has a friend back in the stinky stable!

Jonas

Your friends suddenly caring about the arch that they didn't care about the first time around is my favorite example of character development in this series of videos

The Huldra King

@Clementine I get what you mean, but you gotta understand why that’s so fucking hard to do though. Artists crave channeling their passions collectively, and sure, you could find people to collaborate for your personal projects, but that takes so much time and effort alone.

avataris

In my minds eye in this tale of Evermore, the Ken Bretschneider character and Jenny character are like, scooby-doo type adversaries. Ken Bretschneider just watches Jenny’s video and is like “and I would’ve gotten away with it too if it weren’t for you meddling kids”.

avataris

Also any and all evermore content is absolutely appreciated im so obsessed with this I’ve seen the first video like 10 times.

Az G

When you first said they had the actors paired I thought “oh great, that will help them improv since now they have someone to bounce off of at all times!” But then they have one of them hang back like a bodyguard instead 😭

Az G

American fantasy fan here! So I think because most traditional fantasy is very historically rooted, based on the works of Tolkien and/or a European legends, it feels logical to a lot of people to give the characters UK/Vaguely European accents. The US wasn’t a British colony yet in the real time periods traditional western fantasy is often based on, so because of that an American accent will take some people completely out of the fantasy, and because of that a lot of American fantasy things will just try their best to sound Not American because they think it will it feel more “authentic” to the audience that way. I think it’s silly personally, because it’s all made up anyway, but that’s the explanation I was always told about it

Jenny Nicholson

On my first trip I talked to the redheaded guy who was in charge of most of the animals (and he still works there so prolly still is) and iirc most/all animals just come to the park when it's open. They might stay overnight on the weekends but I think it's just holding pens & they live somewhere else. So hopefully it has friends!

Clementine Danger

Oh, I know! I wasn't saying that because I've got it all figured out, I was saying that because I know that pain and had to learn from bitter experience. I didn't LIKE having to adopt that mindset but I did have to do it. Trust me, I feel this so hard.

Clementine Danger

Thank you! I guess it feels weird to me because none of this is even vaguely related to actual mythology and history, especially not the stuff labeled "medieval" overseas. This whole vibe feels about as rooted in history/legend to me as a Lisa Frank trapper keeper so I didn't make the connection with real world timelines. Still kind of confused if I'm honest, but I guess it's just a self-perpetuating tradition at this point.

Clementine Danger

He doesn't even realize he's trying to get away with something! I'm picturing more of a quivering-lip "why would she bully an innocent DREAMER????"

Brett Ferrin

As a Utahn... THANK YOU for all the incredible Evermore coverage. Keeping my fingers crossed for Lagoon content one day :)

Woody Sims

Jenny, two (semi-rhetorical) questions: 1) at what point did you realize you were going to have to make a second feature-length film for what was once upon a time a 30 minute one-time travel blog. And 2) did you laugh or cry? Amazing video as always

MW

I think the train ride was the only time I felt it!

Evan

I think this cements Jenny as the Woodward and/or Bernstein to Bretschneider's Richard Nixon.

Dash

Hope it wasn’t too bad!

Candice

I can't believe I didn't know that Patreon would have all these videos! Subbed for Evermore but now instantly working my way through the backlog. Absolutely worth the membership!

Steve Ray

Thank you, Ariel. 🙂

Arin

I can't watch this without daydreaming like 298715 plans on how to improve the park for 5 bucks every 5 minutes, please send help

Brian Balster

i don't mean to sound TOO Judgmental.. But the abandoned Flintstones park seemed WAY COOLER than Evermore... Maybe, when Evermore goes broke, and is in ruins.. THEN it will be a cool place?

Brian Balster

wait a minute.. Are you saying this was an example of a Character Arc (Care Actor Arch) ? I tried Really hard on this pun, so please groan

Markus D

IT'S SUCH AN EASY FIX! Just have the character be security AND a companion, but noooooooooooo! It's not like fantasy characters ever have companions!

Markus D

It's a very silly thing, but I think the U.S. popular culture still has a strong "fantasy = British" connection because of stuff like Tolkien. Honestly, considering how unconvincing a lot of the accents are I wouldn't have them bother though.

Clementine Danger

I think one of the MANY reasons the Evermore video is so popular is that we're all just sparking off about the 1000s of ways we could make the park better at zero cost

Clementine Danger

To be clear I have nothing against it! Have fun with it. I am pro fun. It just feels odd to do it for an interactive experience. I know I would feel a bit confused about joining in and not knowing whether I have to do the accent too or if I'm ruining everyone's fun if I don't. "Wouldst thou have me lie with him??!!?" "Nah queen, nah, boy ain't shit."

a.g.

The music playing in the commercial for the convergence/taverntok event thing is a cover of a track from how to train your dragon 2, “for the dancing and the dreaming”. I wonder if evermore got permission for that orrrr Edit to add that the cut to the pallbearers carrying that coffin was one of the funniest things I’ve ever seen

TalkieSoundBox

Honestly it might be a generational thing. I grew up in the 90s where larping would have absolutely gotten you beat up for caring about anything so I can't get past the cringe either :/ I can fully recognize it's a me problem and not really a them problem.

LKB

Seriously same! LMFAO!

LKB

I cackled, it was so WTF

LKB

Make sure to indulge in the Boysenberry funnel cake, but be warned, the serving they give you is big enough for at least two people

LKB

Agreed. I can never get enough content on this fascinatingly awful place

Becca H

Okay I did not realize until this video quite how unobscured those unobscured office building views were. Whew! That is a clear view. Wow.

Becca H

I just found out someone I know DM'd one of these games!!!! If I find out anything about that side of the experience I'll report back.

The Huldra King

(at least before the 2021 layoffs/IP flush) it was actually built into the worldbuilding, Worldwalkers were people who entered the portal from wherever they came from into Evermore, so park characters were expecting all sorts of people. I mean, when it came to improv, it was particularly fun to play with culture clash, I remember how we would refer to WWs' phones as "fae boxes" or "demon boxes" or what have you. Some of my favorite WWs who were very involved in character interactions were just literally playing as themselves if they had entered a magical realm.

Tom

I can't believe there are now sometimes ZERO actors! This place is a scam!

Clementine Danger

Oh, makes sense! That's adorable actually, I like it.

Julian Greer

i thought according to her looking at the fan discords people were still struggling to find even 1 actor on some regular season nights?

Alive_in_tucson

I would go to Disney just for the merch and shopping. So that park does look fun at all to me. Maybe they could give out packs of cards as you go in? Anything tangible to take home. I think Jenny’s big nerd status is confirmed by everything behind her.

Andreia Christ

i wanna a third video, i am invested. much love from Brazil

Jenny Nicholson

Hi Emilie, wow I didn't know you were on here! I'm so sad your Evermore experience ended badly. It was clear you were passionate about it and I'm sure given time (and the freedom/budget to do so from ken) you would have continued to make it better. I hope you can work on something else in the creative field, preferably someplace where they'll actually appreciate your efforts!

Sara Jane Webster

The part where the audio cut out. She mentioned tripping at that time.

Pacm3ns

So i know im quite late on this but, if the guess of having the tickets be a thousand bucks so they can give them out for free is actually true, then the VIP tickets will not provide a revenue stream, but they will have added expenses for food, dnd and the quincys tavern crossover, which is probably where the remainder of the eighty bucks went that are for general admitance. I dont think they made that much money if i had to guess.

Birthe_bird

So in Germany for example, it's often that you have a grave plot for like 25 years or something, afterwards your remaining family has the option to buy it, if there's no one left or they don't want to keep it, the bits that remain of you kind of go to a different spot and the grave gets used again. The family would own the tombstone though, so you can easily buy used tombstones, which can be repurposed again to be on another grave or be bought up by a crazy american millionair. I just remember that after the grave of one of my great uncles grave was due, one of my aunts then had his cross in her garden. I do wonder if in Evermore they kept all the names and stuff on or just put something else there. There's also a few parks around here that used to be graveyards but got repurposed and they just have a bunch of random gravestones still around.

frisky dingus

This is such a sensible way to look at this. Thank you. Instead of buying a social media company the guy just went in a different direction. Now I understand lol

Katrina Clare

I don't think I'll ever get tired of you talking about this park.

Adison

yesss lagoon is the best

Starlit Rain

same!! i am so excited to watch this

Joie Laney

I saw a tiktoker who would start their videos by saying like, "Get ready with me to go to Ren Fest," or "Spend a day with me at the Ren Faire," and then it turned out to be Evermore which is so hilarious because to compare Evermore to any of the big, established Renaissance Festivals in the US is like...idk, comparing your local kiddie park to Disneyland. I mean, the Texas Renaissance Festival is basically it's own theme park with rides, merch, food, shows, etc. Evermore can barely maintain one of those categories.

Alexis Goss

I want so badly for a park with this concept to be real and actually good it’s such a shame it’s so awful — especially the employee stuff!!! That’s the worst!!!!

Petie

I want to thank Jenny's patreon community and Jenny for the comments here. The video is, as always, gold, but the comments make it more fun to re-watch, especially Taycen Timothy's with the timestamps. It's like director's commentary on a dvd/blu-ray kinda sorta.

Petie

That might actually be worth the thousand dollars.

Evan

The idea that someone could watch your 4 hour video and come away thinking "well clearly she just didn't commit to the concept of the park enough to have fun!" is kind of stunning honestly.

Emily Ryan

I don't see why they dont just focus on finishing the sets and architecture and like... rent it out to a 3rd party to host ren faires? Let someone else bring all the people and the stuff and then maybe keep a couple of the restaurants open. Ren faire has gotten so much more popular, (the LA one was so over-crowded this year) I'm sure you'd get a lot of attendance. Maybe in a few years they could start opening up the park again in the off seasons.

Megan Onuma

45:55, “does anyone want in on this?” - friends join Jenny in showing off/ dancing in front of Pigmyweeds Inn. These are the sweet moments I subscribe for!

Macaroni Magpie

Yes, I feel the same way! Based on what I've seen from these videos, the ren fairs I've been to are actually BETTER than this park and had more to do. Plus, there's people selling crafts and teaching you cool skills at ren fairs. Just think how cool this park would be if they had, like, learn how to blacksmith stations. I mean, Dollywood has it! Why can't Evermore?

Taycen Timothy

It’s unfortunately all but impossible to find decent summaries or archives of the old IP because they don’t exist. Evermore rarely made efforts to record or archive any of it (at least not publicly), so what little can be found is piecemeal over various platforms from posts by fans. It would be a massive undertaking for someone who wasn’t there at the time to put together an accurate picture. It was unfortunately very much a “You had to be there.” type of thing.

Taycen Timothy

That being said, as someone who was there for a lot of it, I have been considering making content along those lines if there’s any interest for it.

Taycen Timothy

I don’t know when precisely they would have been talking about. But I can confirm that for at least the past year there have been actors in the park during the main seasons (Mythos, Lore, and Aurora). However, 1. Evermore’s calendar often changes suddenly and those changes aren’t always communicated as widely as they should be. 2. They don’t go out of their way to clearly confirm whether an off-season night or special event is or is not part of a larger season. 3. During Lore, which is by-far the busiest season, the park will hire twice as many actors but 60-70% of them will be scare actors that are only in the haunt which is an additional cost in a segmented-off portion of the park. Crowds get large enough that the remaining 30-40% can be hard to find if you don’t know where to look and interaction time is limited with so many people.

Sunny

I could literally watch you talk about Evermore forever. It’s my favorite dumpster fire topic. Also it’s kind of amazing that Kenny boy is so bad with money. I wonder if he’s a nepo baby with no concept of budgeting; I was genuinely floored by all the useless crap he spent money on before finishing the buildings.

Abby Snail

it really is crazy how people @ Jenny for "not liking anything" as if she's some mercenary killjoy when she so clearly *loves* what this park could be; she's running around excited for every opportunity to see something maybe kinda cool, she's collecting and treasuring memorabilia, she's spending countless hours learning about the people who made the park what it is, I mean come on

Zaiav

The fact that they removed so many actors, there’s minimum things to do, the honest park feels like it’s growing worse each time I check on it lol.

krakenaut

I grew up close to both of these! For both Puy du Fou and Futuroscope, a day would probably be enough to do the major things. Two days would let you do either of them very comfortably, I imagine. I’ve only ever done single day visits to each of them, though usually I did long days (get there around opening time and stay until the end of the night shows), and typically got to do everything I wanted. Happy to answer questions about either of them! :D

betp

i just found out from this post you have a second channel

manya

Jenny made a comment about how the local evermore fans treat the park's shortcomings as an act of god rather than feeling betrayed by the folks running the park - I would hypothesize that this is because most local fans are mormon, and taught both to respect bodies of authority absolutely, and that "contention is of the devil". mormonism breeds a specific kind of positive-midwest-passivity that's honestly pretty strange to encounter (and weirder to be raised in lol)

Corynn

Jenny & co: "It's a ghost! Greetings!" Ghost: "Hey girlies." lmao that sent meeee

Moonriddler

I love your coverage of evermore as someone who lives in Utah and been following it. I've come to terms with the fact that they just want to be dragon quest island without any of the money or follow through that the other park did.

hypercube

a real...redemption arch

Wes Theriault

No I didn't mean to delete my comment. What I said was this is apparently a perfect video to watch during the downpour. Also I idly Googled and you can still purchase convergence tickets!! The page is still open! What

Ugino

justice for the apothecary cart

Nick Priddy

Thank you for making such amazing videos for your patrons ❤️

Skyler

Evermores acting Vice President has responded to some things from her first video. As well as discussing their recent management change and how things will be different. https://youtu.be/Wyix5U_O7Bo

Becca Yaga

lmao as someone who was raised mormon, YES. we loooove to throw ourselves into the possibility of things without critically considering a) its shortcomings and b) who it's harming

Becca Yaga

Jenny, do not listen to other Utahns who might tell you otherwise--Lagoon is not worth your time. Time travel to 1910s or 1940s Saltair instead!

Stephen Dole

I mean, at least this suggests they got the flights and hotel paid for

Jessica Gallagher

Your OG evermore video is what inspired me to be a patron so I am here for the extra material

Michelle Deapen

I am always happy to get more Evermore content. Its such a rabbit hole.

Chelsea Counsell

I like these videos. I know you were like "you guys must be evermore'd out" but I'll watch whatever theme park stuff you decide to make for sure.

Chelsea Counsell

ALSO thanks for being so pro worker's rights! Seriously it's cool

Kieu

I absolutely am obsessed with your content about theme parks but especially your content about evermore, it feels like a hole that just keeps getting deeper. For my own moral conscience and money I truly think I will never even go near this place, but I'm so so glad I can watch you go there

Dannielle Moriondo

I actually think this would be great on your main channel. Based on the tiny changes they made, you might be the only person that can hold this company accountable

Kimberly

I spent yesterday afternoon watching this + reading all the comments. Still not Evermore'd out. Would love to see this made public, with minor edits to include the intel from Taycen that this was a ~private event~ — because I think Evermore would use that to minimize your criticism. Even with that caveat, Evermore doesn’t look great in this. Why would they not bring their A-game for a crowd of *influencers*? Theoretically a rental fee should cover operating expenses for that day - what a great opportunity to have all hands on deck! Why was it not communicated that this was a private event and the park wouldn’t be fully functional? And why was Ken milling about during a *private* event? Quincy doesn’t come out of this looking great either. Since he was presumably collecting proceeds from the tickets, it should’ve been his priority to meet every single person who was there for him. That said, Quincy deserves some grace since this is presumably the first time he and his team have attempted something like this, and it was an ambitious event. Evermore doesn’t have that excuse. They were the experts in this scenario; it was their job to partner with Quincy’s team to deliver a fantastic experience. They flopped.

The Doom Merchant

this whole saga is so fascinating to me, lol. these videos are, i'm sure, a lot of work, but i'd LOVE like. an update every time you visit Evermore lol. they don't have to be, you know, 2+ hours, but it's like a morbid travelogue + a trainwreck i can't look away from.

Lambda34Delta

After rewatching this video a few times I think my main takeaway is: I know you said you were dismayed that they implemented your specific suggestions and didn't even include your consulting tree, but I can't help but feel like with the state the park is in that would have almost been insulting. Like to implement it as a consulting fee would imply they not only listened to your suggestions and did their best to implement them in good faith but also that they had somehow succeeded and improved since the initial trainwreck you found the park in. But instead they're just continuing along the same lines with only minor improvements offset by the things that are worse and on top of that they haven't even done the extremely simple and free first suggestion of "treat your actors better". And in fact doubled down on the bad stuff by also firing everyone who did in fact take on your suggestions and try to improve the park in good faith. At his point? They don't deserve your consulting tree.

Taycen Timothy

I‘m undecided on how much blame and for what Evermore deserves for The Convergence. Evermore didn’t take any percentage of ticket sales to the event, Quincy just paid a flat fee to rent the park’s physical facilities. So while it’s fair to consider some of its pricing a scam, that’s all on Quincy and not Evermore. Evermore is rented out frequently and Evermore’s entertainment is usually not included by default; the client would have to make additional arrangements for that. I just have no idea what packages are offered to groups looking to rent the space or how they are communicated to them. But it does definitely highlight how the park is poorly equipped to host these types of events, despite the fact that that’s an angle they seem to pushing lately. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Kylie

Snail content sounds amazing.

Javiera Scarratt

i assume they just stole the under-floor vibrating/subwoofer machinery that was missing from the star wars hotel

Christine Govas-Robert

I just watched this and omg, they seem extremely salty and defensive when they got to the topic of Jenny's video. Claiming she took direct credit for certain changes made? Did they even watch the same video I did? She also got weirdly defensive and rude when talking about actors' complaints. I don't see the park improving in the near future if this is the person leading the way.

Elyse

Right?? Just have one be like a squire or whatever if you HAVE to have them in character garb, and they can say, "My Lord, we can't be late for our meeting with the archer guild" and shuffle them along. Having two actors present without having two actors to interact with meaningfully is such a waste.

Tence Bakpao

I love these Evermore video's, at first I thought you were being followed by a security guard....but that was one of your friends. Also today I learned what a caboose is.

Katie Adams

This is off topic but just commenting to say, Jenny I think you would like Secret Cinema if you have those in the US. The three i went to were good, plenty of opportunities for RP and it's inside so not cold haha (altho no cameras allowed inside so not good for filming but more just for fun)

Hayes Von Holder

they start talking about Jenny at around the 50 minute mark, also they're patrons lol

Paschal & Di

Jenny Nicholson - "Cannot be Sued"

HeyitsTom

I just had to pause at the moment at 1:25:20 where Jenny notes that the guys who literally pushed the train uphill got suddenly fired. Like... I don't think there can be any clearer indicator that Evermore does not deserve the devotion it has somehow earned from its followers. I really hope all the workers and fans who love this place find a more deserving output for their passion.

Chris M. Dickson

Like many others, I joined your community just to see this video, so thank you for making and sharing it. I confess that I may be succumbing to the reality distortion field, but I get the impression that the changes that have been made, if you could put aside all the shady-at-best business practices and all the past advertising for something that it clearly is not, have improved the park to the point where it's just Ordinary Not Much Good - and you're absolutely right not to put those aside. If ever you consider a trip to the UK, your community will surely have plenty of recommendations. If that's not in your plans, at least keep half an eye out for https://blooloop.com/theme-park/news/phantom-peak-immersive-experience-us-expansion/

Herapath

I think the most interesting thing is the Quincy situation, the fact you didn't get to meet him along with him cutting his event and lines short is wild, especially when the event is centered around him, people are suspected to go for him. You were right to call it out, and im glad you gave your thoughts. I am so confused on evermores hiring situation. I know they need people working for them, why are they just firing people like that? Seriously even if the lore stuff was weird for not fans in the parks having actors makes a majority of the park, without actors you have nothing basically. I really hope the park gets its act together, seemingly it's kind of doing that, slowly but surely. I hope you keep covering this!

Winja

from Jenny's recordings it seemed like the most visually impressive thing to see at the park was the costumes of other guests. Which isn't really a great look for an immersive Fantasy park.

Amy Shine

Jenny, you need to come to the water parks in Wisconsin Dells

Regina Cuddeback

Apparently at least one of the leading staff is a patron who watched this video. Someone posted a link from a livestream down below

B Hair

It makes me super happy that the employees gifted you all that merch. Your excitement over having those products just makes me smile

Madhavi Baiju

I watched the whole evermore video just to watch this. I love that Jenny is just singlehandedly getting evermore to improve as a franchise

carissa

me too!! it kind of made me nauseated to read that, after watching the employees come running when needed to do physical labor to push a train (that should have been created to not need that, obviously) & were kind and made all the guests laugh. the disregard for people is so disgusting!!! not to mention that they don’t even have actors at all anymore…

Taycen Timothy

*a sort of third-party that is very close to the park is a patron and communicated some details of this post to management

Maggie and Justin

I wonder how many people don’t get upset simple because they are happy any park exists at all- I don’t know of many other immersive fantasy parks :/ but I agree. I’ve never been but just by your video it was depressing they charged so much for soooooo little.

JoelSyverud

Clearly, a medieval tavern, inevitably run by a clever barman or barmaid, would have found more ways of separating their guests from their sacks of gold… C’mon Evermore, we need IMMERSION 😑

Caroline Kropka

I did MagiQuest as a child and I really think Evermore should've learned from them! I don't know exactly what it was, but the wands had some kind of RFID thing in them or something that let you actually interact with objects, and it would somehow communicate the information you had such that you couldn't jump into the middle of a quest by mistake--it would say something like "you need to do X quest" if you tried to jump ahead. Seems like not a bad thing to integrate into a fantasy larp park where you're trying to do quests while cutting back on actors.

big bird

I will never tire of your Evermore coverage, and not just because the park is hypnotically bad! I feel like any amount of pressure on the company's treatment of its employees is a good thing (even if it is of detriment to the park's revenue. if a business needs to abuse its employees to continue, it should simply not continue!). I don't dare to hope that any restitution will come out of it, but people should at least be warned - especially as a counter to any promotion the park is doing while still being shitty to their employees (the ones they haven't randomly fired).

Shannon Foreman

I'm glad your friends had more to say about the arch this time.

0takuma

I really like the long coverage! The evermore lore coverage is just: c h e f s k i s s

Ello Asty

After seeing your reviews, I definitely think my wife would have taken away my vacation-planning privileges if I made us go to Evermore like I was ready to do a few years ago.

Water Witch

I didn't watch all of the video but they seem extremely salty about a lot of things lol. Like they're very willing to be like "ugh! management before us, what were they thinking?" which. Idk if I was representing a company I would feel very wary about doing.

mango

I’ve been to Puy De Fou and I highly recommend it!!! Personally, I much prefer rides and walk through attractions to the shows that Puy De Fou tends to prioritize, but I still think it’s worth at least a day. The sets, costumes, actors, and special effects are genuinely incredible. I’m hoping next time I’m in France I can finally knock Futuroscope off my list 🤞 last time I was there I just went to Disneyland cause I’m basic lol

Kavi Montanaro

Is the train thematically out of place, or is it just me? dgmw I love trains. A lot. But I think as the park drifts farther and farther away from their original concept, which had steampunk/elfpunk elements, into a more generic D&D theme, the train is starting to feel anachronistic, and I don't know how you justify it thematically without the multidimensional-whatever-stuff they tried out earlier. What I wish they had is a system of canals with boats, but obviously that requires them to not be flat broke. Instead, I propose a Dwarf theme just for the train, Dwarves are more teched up than humans and Elves and it could be dressed more like a mining train, and the doors in the tunnel might be the portal to the mines? Maybe they could put a vendor situation behind the door and the train could stop there, where the Dwarves sell pendants and ocarinas or something. Granted, the park is obviously broke but the vendor might be willing to pay for some decor, who knows.

Nathan Shandy

This had to be my first watch after joining. I think learning that the weird, truncated cylinder building (what I took to be a wizard tower) was supposed to be The Tree might have been the saddest moment for me--emblematic of all the broken promises and wasted potential of Evermore. People wonder why I'm such a grump.

sawyer tsaregorodtseva

i do appreciate the ashlee simpson-esque jig @ 1:35:26 from quincy's cohost

Taycen Timothy

The concept of the park is that the town itself is in Victorian England and the fantasy beings are visiting from other worlds.

Celozon

I really feel that guy walking out of the hobbit house while you all are posing outside like 'oh I'm very much in the way.' I've watched your original Evermore video like 7 or 8 times now and would absolutely continue to watch any more you made tbh. I'm very fascinated by all of it.

Kristina

It's because they're outta money. Covid really did do a number on them, but on top of that, Ken's still in lawsuits with all the builders he didn't pay (hence all the unfinished buildings/projects). I imagine he can't get loans with the state his business is in, and no one's gonna invest after looking at his numbers. Given his penchant for buying antiques instead of paying the people that could make this a well-run business, I can only conclude that he's just that bad at money. But since he can't seem to admit that he doesn't know what he's doing, the only way I can see it turning around is if someone buys it from him, finishes it and then turns it into a profitable business.

Kristina

It's almost like how things go with lottery winners, where they can fall into the trap of thinking they have enough money for anything they've ever wanted. But with the addition of incredible entitlement, where if anyone challenges him or doesn't want to volunteer their labor for his vision, they're the bad guy.

Kavi Montanaro

Maybe what they need is a video game to clarify the concept (with what money, I don't know) and raise their profile? Because they aren't willing or able to maintain the creative staff that would need to carry the story along. It's certainly a trendy enough genre. 'Evermore' calls to mind Gaiman's 'Neverwhere', which is firmly elfpunk. They have to work harder if they want that, because of the pull the D&D/high fantasy tropes have with the general public. If the larping at the park was consistent with an available game, they'd have something. But they can't even manage a fountain at the moment, so...

Kavi Montanaro

These guys desperately need some trees or barriers between the park and those dreary apartment blocks and industrial buildings. Fake trees would be welcome at this point. Or at least raise an earthwork ring around the park - they certainly have plenty of dirt available, it's kind of the main theme right now, expanses of dirt.

graham blair

Breaking News! Rumor according to insider info is that Evermore park is closing permanently on Oct 31, likely declaring bankruptcy soon after. Jenny’s exhaustive video is now important as a historical record

Eggy

I love your Evermore content, its so entertaining. I hope you one day release the hours of stuff you haven't even talked about yet

Markus D

I don't know if you want to have a poll on it or what, but I personally think that this would be good main channel content and I wouldn't be upset as a patron to see it shown to other people!

Collin Vickers

It seems to me that Jenny's video last year inspired the whole influencer gimmick. Oh, the irony.

Collin Vickers

Seems like they were inspired by the talking shrunken heads at the Harry Potter experience, for example, but didn't have access to technicians capable of matching that degree of sophistication.

Sim

The last day would bring back Maxwell at the top of the stairs requesting for a town meeting but no one can hear him.

Sim

Especially if you had to sing Panic at The Disco.

Taycen Timothy

Quincy’s Tavern paid a flat fee to rent the park, then set their own ticket prices. Evermore didn’t get any money from ticket sales to that event, only the fee and concessions.

Kristin (cthulhuhoops)

oh god that makes me so sad. this thing could have had promise if the idea went into anyone else's brain but the ceo's. it's also bitterly ironic that it'd happen on halloween, aka the whole reason kent got popular in the first place thanks to his halloween-themed decorations at home.

Derick Gadd

2:19:00 Don't worry Jenny I trust you! I won't go to Evermore! I mean I never would have anyway but hey, I trust your expertise. Also this video is how I learned Jenny is into D&D and has appeared on some shows, I know what I'm watching next!

J B

Jenny, the last time I played d&d I was an elf/bard/woman of ill repute named Cher'bolgna. I would shoot arrows at everything, when I missed i would sing " if i could turn back time" my moods entirely dictated by a. Complex, and real, moonblood counter system, and I was quickly kicked out,well imwas eaten by an owl bear and our paladin refused to revive me. The gm Jesse said "you're really not going to revive him? Ok you're alignment is now chaotic evil, good luck casting any of your spells" it was really sweet because he meant that shit, but I felt bad bc obviously the guy who wanted to be a cleric was kind of a douche and i really didnt care i was just adding excitement.

Caio Santos

man the Quincy thing was so bad, if I had paid to go out and see this guy and only got 15 minutes of QnA I'd be fuming

Scott Reyes

But don't Mormons hate fantasy stuff because it's adjacent to paganism or something?

manya

not in general - that's more of a mainstream conservative Christian thing from what I understand. in my experience mormons can get really into fantasy and "nerdy" stuff like DND because there's lots of "family friendly"-type content available. lots of YA fantasy/sci-fi writers who are mormon, too, like Orson Scott Card and Stephanie Meyer

thnksjordan cosplay

Love the Evermore content! If there’s enough there for it a deep dive and timeline of the Evermore lore would be incredible.

resident_shevil

I've only seen his content here and there prior to this video, but I took a look at his TikTok page since watching this. It kind of seems like he's fairly new to the big events/brand deal thing? Correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I can tell, his internet fame is relatively new, and this type of public event may have been a first from him. I'm really peeved for the people who paid extra money and waited in the cold to not see him, and to witness that Q&A. I would be really interested in a retrospective from him later down the line, though. I kind of wonder if he's contractually obligated to stay silent about it right now, as I haven't even seen TikTok comments even hinting at The Convergence not being a great event and a wonderful time.

def

Brandon Sanderson too! My impression is that Mormons are if anything, more nerdy on average. They all have jobs in tech and theres no alcohol or partying or really much of anything besides church, so I can see how being into fantasy stuff (whether its literature or d&d) might be way more common.

sophia c

Something silly I just found on their site is that on the About Us page, if you click on the picture of the guy representing the "Jobs" link, it shows you a menu for Barter's East.

trojanteapot

Couldn't agree with you more. There is a successful fantasy/D&D themed tavern/board game cafe in my city and I think that scaled up the way you said would just work so much better than what they got.

zarratm

Selling $1000 tickets is completely deranged. Even as an outright scam! Coachella tickets cost like $550. Disney World peak season tickets are about $200 a day.

Gemma

I watched this over time and totally forgot "Quincy" was a tiktoker and I thought Quincy was Tip Top omg

alex

please i would absolutely love an anna farris deep dive

Bob Goodrich

I subbed for a bit just to get to see this video, because I am fascinated by all the ways Evermore fails to live up to its potential and implements ideas that are either too ambitious or out of step with what a theme park should necessarily be going for. Also, that guest with the costume at 1:00:38 throwing their hood back and going “hey girlies” was extremely funny, good edit there Jenny

Amanda Avery

Jenny, have you heard the rumor that Evermore is closing permanently at the end of this month?

degree

God taverntok sounds amazng I would sell my soul to see someone prepare medieval comfort food

Aria

Honestly I'd be tempted to go (despite all of your warnings) because of how much of a trainwreck it is. I feel secondhand investment in watching the facade crumble. Then I come to my senses and salute you for being the one to bear this curse.

Thorn

The cyphers give big "buy more Ovaltine" vibes

VermiciousKnid

Great video! Ah yes, Maxwell. The evil necromancer who looks like he used to work at Knott's Berry Farm, one of my favorite parts of the first video!

alexa k

Not to be super negative or anything, but that clip of Maxwell singing with the dwarves took me back to being a freshman in high school theater around competition season and it made my skin crawl.

Song-Kinsley Productions

I paused the video to rant to my wife about this, and then I scrolled through the comments to check if anyone else noticed - thank god you did lol

Carlie Young

I'm so late to the party, but I have some more Evermore tea to spill! My friend was a fire dancer back in 2018, and she said she and her troupe (who were actually shown a bit in b-roll in the original video) had a hell of a time getting paid what they were promised. It took months, and they had to threaten legal action. One of her actor friends who worked there allegedly discovered that she was getting paid less than her male counterparts even though they were at the same level. She connected with other actors, and they allegedly compared payment, and it was true that male actors were paid more overall. I think this took place mostly on Instagram, though I couldn't find posts. I can ask my friend if she could direct me to them. Also, not tea but fun, one of my other friends did the voice of that witch in that portal room. I was startled when I heard the voice and I was like, "that's Suni!" As a Utah resident, though one from Salt Lake City and not the Pleasant Grove area (there are some noticeable cultural differences between people in the Salt Lake Valley and those around the point of the mountain in "Happy Valley"), I rarely ever hear anything about Evermore. The only reason I knew about it was because I went to see my friend perform. It seems I caught it a bit more in its heyday because it was bustling with actors then. It's like they don't advertise at all, even locally. It's a bummer they just can't seem to get it together down there, but I completely agree with your analysis of its most glaring flaws and how most of them could have been solved/avoided with a little more effort and forethought.

norree

Hi Jenny, what is the redhaired doll in the McDonalds outfit in the background? I'm a doll collector and that really caught my eye. Dolls are a special interest of mine so if anyone knows what brand that doll is, please let me know, thank you!! (Awesome video by the way, I love this Evermore saga!)

Jules 🍞

As someone who has actually been on quite a few LARPs, I just keep thinking about how vastly inferior this is to actually LARPing. The one thing it does have over regular LARP is the location, which with all its faults is really cool when most LARP events take place in a field or on camping grounds. I honestly think if Evermore just invested into upkeep of the buildings and rented itself out exclusively for large scale larp and other big events, it could be really sick!

Ginger Jones

Lol the guy who talks at the hearse and the mailbox sounds like Jerry from Disenchanted

a.s.

i'm actually shocked that this is the first comment ive seen on any of the videos that suggests this and i couldnt agree more

a.s.

i love rewatching this because i always find new favorite things jenny says and does that i think about all the time. 'trains smell like fish-' abruptly cutting to the train arriving long mournful shots of office park buildings and houses during the voiceover while theyre stopped on the train 'we will. we WILL come back tomorrow night and we WILL MEET QUINCY' the way she says 'that guy was /working/' about tiktok satan 'bro stop asking people if they'd like to play' background woman's brief look of terror when she realizes she walked into a surprise panic at the disco cover the part where they summon evil maxwell through song, which reads like a jaystation video if it took place at a ren faire 'but should YOU go to evermore? NO!'

ashton

i think that might be a winx club doll

norree

I think you're right, thank you!

Aryan Peralta

Its cool to hear that Jennings Brower (the tiktok CW Lucifer cosplayer Jenny mentioned) is actually a cool guy, I’ve been following him on TikTok for years.

Sleepyrogue

I'm local to slc and went during their 2023 Halloween special event with my dnd group who were all cosplaying and wanted somewhere cool to take pics. I wasn't expecting much after hearing about it for years, but in the grand scheme of things I'd love for a place like this to do well. They closed down literally 2/3 of all the buildings for a Halloween haunt but were still charging full price for tickets - a fact we didnt know when purchasing and afaik wasn't said online. Apparently this is a known thing they do but still super scammy. The haunt was an extra 17$ on top of ticket prices. The only buildings that were available had huge lines even just to walk through (the tavern and the candy shop) and the only other one open was drachen haven. It was actually pretty crowded due to it being advertised as a special event and the weekend before halloween (which edit; I realize now was advertised as their last weekend too lol). I think I saw two actors? One that didn't seem at all interested in talking to us even when prompted, and another that ran by and said there was a dance but pointed to an area that was blocked off by the haunt?? I don't blame them much but it definitely feels like salt in a wound. Also rumor from other guests, there was a costume contest with a supposed 1000$ prize that my friends in cosplay were told about. We were way too cold to stay the night and doubtful that they even had money to cough up but I'm curious if a contest happened at all? Seems wild, though doubtful

Jantonaitis

I'd never heard of Quincy before this video so I was curious about his numbers by comparison. On YT, Quincy has 42.2k subs, 5M on Tiktok, 211k on Insta, 329 on Patreon. Jenny has 1.07M subs on YT, 85.6K on Tiktok, 82.7k on Insta, 28k on Patreon.

KaylaLeigh025

I know you wrote this several months ago, but I just wanted to agree with you because Jenny's one liners get stuck in my head all the time. And they only make sense to me so I can't make jokes about it in real life lol

happycomposer

I love your engagement with Evermore as like a historian! This is how I’ve been engaging with the Destiny video game franchise (yes super nerdy I know) so it makes me happy to see someone else doing the same with another niche interest

Kodak

Omg I feel like Jenny has experienced the worst of dnd nerds, like when she talked about the nerds who will hear how awful it is but ignore that and go. I’m a dnd nerd and I would never go it’s so clearly not better than playing with my friends at their house. But there definitely is that type of nerd who is just? Idk? So willing to spend money on anything related to their hobby no matter how bad it is

wheeliescoot

I’m so baffled that this “park” is doing so badly yet every time y’all tried to engage or buy things they SO OFTEN refused 😭

Thomas Benko

This park is so fascinating in all the worst ways. In retrospect, nothing about this event should have been a surprise but of course, you want to give them the benefit of the doubt.

Dan sulin

Probably late to the chat here but I’m a long time D&D nerd and helped work a lot of conventions and I feel like the reason that Evermore got away with abusing the staff like the did is because it’s kinda common place for cons. The majority of the staff is volunteers, DM included. If you put in enough shifts they may comp you a room and if you are “volunteering” for a specific company’s you probably will get free merch and maybe a a few staff meals. But overall they really work you to death for the honor of helping them. To be fair most of my experience is a decade old at this point but from what I hear it’s still the case. For a small independent con that makes sense but cons like Gencon are making millions, the can afford to pay staff.

Nonny

I don't think a park like this would be my cup of tea, but after watching this video and the previous video I'm VERY glad they didn't attempt to make a botanical garden(???). Gardens take a lot of work, knowledge and love. I was raised by horticulturalists and the thing that just blows me away is the absolute terrible landscaping. Dead plants, unplanted stuff, bare dirt, no ground cover except weeds and grass, it's very sad to look at.

Author

My personal, very ungenerous theory as to why nobody can ride in the caboose is that the owner rides in the caboose and takes his friends around in it and as a result he just believes he is the only one who can ride in the caboose, like a VIP car.

OtterofLore

I had no idea Jenny had a (public facing) tiktok account! As someone w/o a tiktok its such a strange platform to me, I feel like viewers and views there definitely don't translate in the same way youtube viewers do.

ViolaTyrant

so sad that the singing dwarves were executed for their part in the T Swift V Evermore incident 😔

Mary Monigold

Should we touch everything? OW!!

Joshua White

Fun fact I’m friends with the Faldo actor. And around 2019 Evermore did a fanart contest where you drew your favorite park character/actor for some free tickets and merch. I still hadn’t gone despite being a local so I thought I’d enter. I really liked my art of Faldo I think it turned out well, unfortunately some influencer with worse fanart but a larger social following won the contest, ah well. But I always laugh when I watch the part where you say “speak up buddy.” Bc it’s my friend Faldo. 😅

Eli Lass

Late, but Jenny, as a french person, bear in mind that Put du Fou is founded by a far right nationalist whose explicit goal in Puy du Fou is to create a nationalist and dreamy version of french and european history. It's still a fascinating park but I hope you keep this in mind if you ever do a video about it

Liv

Are there any reviews out there of the VIP experience? This is the first time I’ve seen anyone be negative about the Convergence, which is so wild since it seems like a huge scam in retrospect. I thought for sure they’d at least have the big dragon they kept posting on TikTok. What do llamas have to do with DND?? And I wanna know what was going on in Vander’s Keep 😭

Atheist Addiction

The giant porg sees into the heart of Evermore and is not impressed.

saige

i was screaming

degree

i completely forgot i made this comment lol

Star

I assume this is gonna be commented on at a later date but I cannot get over the lack of shock at seeing your shadow and realising you're giving the tour of evermore in a giant wizard's hat

Timothy Geiger

quincey definitely fleeced Evermore LMAO no way.

Mickey Miles

Haven’t seen this yet since I just became a patreon member, but me and my gf went within days of you posting the first video since it’s in walking distance of our house and you piqued our interest and I can absolutely say 18 months later it’s just as bad or even worse. So I think it’s funny that blaming the customer is still their defense.

Armored brass assault cat

Went one last time like 6 months ago for their Halloween mabob. Didn't see the buttons, the actors were around but it was a Halloween mabob. The state of things was bad bad. The food was not great, and the park was falling apart in a more serious way. And now the Centralia scale dumpster fire that their business was finally finished burning down and now it's out of business. Oh well, c'est la vie. Apparently someone bought the dying body of the park a few years ago and now owns the corpse (they literally had loans forgiven and no rent in the space so I don't know how they still managed to go out of business). Supposedly something better is coming in the space, I'm not sure what that looks like because of what evermore park was but there will be more information soon-ish™. I hope they turn it into a big public park with vendor space but who knows at this point, I know there is some serious demolition work needed to clean that space up before anyone can do anything with it (buildings like the chapel aren't meant to remain un-covered like the chapel was in a half built state, so I wouldn't be surprised if there is a fair bit of structural damage at this point). Here's to hoping for a better future for the land, whether that's as a competently executed theme park or as a large public park with vendor and event space.

Mariana Trench

My biggest question will always be...why do they all have to be english? If it's a fantasy realm, they could have all sorts of accents but instead they've gone for....not the best english accents

Michaela

All of the gifts the workers gave you is so beautiful 😭😭

Kristin (cthulhuhoops)

im so obsessed with that maxwell dude. why is he evil? why does he have a song?? nothing about evermore's lore suggested it ever had to fight off tyranny or even be in any war at all. why was he the evil necromancer and not, yknow, wen weaver, who was already known to have destructive magic and was repeatedly mistreated by the town??? why do i keep thinking about this?

Kristin (cthulhuhoops)

i still can't get over how inconsiderate and selfish quincy was through this. i hope he had at least some blowback from it.

QueenSciel

The Saga of Maxwell is GOLD. I'm so glad i found this channel 😂

Angelika

we stan hot tiktok satan

Scrum Diddely Umptious

I just love the weird energy of the song, its so rambly and improvised sounding. Without relistening my impression of it is like and we will fight fight fight fight fight and fight some more because we fight fight fight fight for our right and we will fight with our dads and fight for our dads and we will fight fight fight some moreee. Like they focused in on the word fight way too hard way too soon? It comes on too strong like youre going to pick a fight with the first person you see, like when i wake up cranky from a dream and go seek out my boyfriend purely out of malice- i dont have a cohesive narrative for what has occurred I just have the vague impression ive been wronged and I just start listing things I see around me that arent up to snuff, maybe an empty chip bag is near his computer area, and throwing wild accusations just to see what sticks. (For the record I snap out of it when I wake up a little more and apologize, im not a monster haha)

Jonny

Yea, and it's crazy because you know some of the people that work there probably watch D20. You would think the messaging of unionization would be strong lol

Jonny

I'm glad they finally got rid of that terrible CEO, hopefully the landowner realizes that the only way to fix it will to be getting the actors back and growing a community again. He needs to be a dreamer that understands logistics or have someone like duo team like Disney and Roy. But hopefully, the landowner is gonna implement something like this. Or at least get the already dedicated people to group think something better.

Ella M

My honest guess is just because the actor wanted to.

Brendan Trosper

I've seen this video so many times and never noticed. I screamed. This is how we get worms in our feet.

Gigglebyte

Having just went from Starcruiser and now a deep dive into Evermore "lore" (see what I did there? I feel like Im down a rabbit hole so deep I don't know where the next turn will land me. And also like a guy just tipped his hat and said m'lady

Evan

This whole fiasco really makes this Quincy guy come across as kind of a douche

Robert Romero Jr

I’m glad at least Jenny got to enjoy her time at the park allegedly in my opinion. From what I heard

V C

Man . . . it just looks like such a dump, but all the history - and horrible practices - of Evermoor are so engaging. Engaging in the worst kind of way, of course, like watching a trainwreck. Either way, thanks for sharing the experience, Park Historian Nichelson. I've never cared about themeparks but you've dragged me into the lore of Evermore, at the least.

ashlen 💫

the in n out catering change is funny bc as far as i know in n out catering is very difficult to book and is often booked a year or more ahead of time ,,, i know this because my job wanted to hire them but did not book in time

Collette Voeller

It’s the easiest accent that Americans can do lol

Collette Voeller

Has Jenny ever done a make up tutorial? I need to know how she does her eye makeup

Mariana Trench

There could be Americans in fantasy lands

Madeleine

I enjoyed my trip in fall 2019 cuz I felt like there was a lot to do and I was incentivized to come back but also looking back there was a big story event that I couldn’t participate in because we weren’t at that point in the quest. At the time I just pushed past the disappointment and thought that I’d participate the next time I went but honestly that kind of sucked. I hadn’t been part of the fan forums or known how to play the game I guess so I didn’t know that I was supposed to prepare for it like a lot of the other guests. it was one of those season long quests where you were supposed to be tracking the story to participate. I do think it was fun at that point in time for me. There were guilds, random activities, and the main quest so it felt like a lot of options for things to do and I really wanted to take a dnd party back there eventually but seeing how inconsistent the park is with their game mechanics makes me hesitant. It makes me sad like it’s such a fun fantasy concept that could make for a great trip for dnd nerds but they just can’t get their shit together. Also I love faldo. When I went I loved his design and I found his actor really snarky which entertained me a lot. I think I had a really good impression but again, when they change the game mechanics every few months and treat their employees horribly I’m not really incentivized to return.

Liv941129

Or more appropriately the easiest accents Americans can't really do..

Maddie Arnautov

You know what’s funny? The investors the owner wanted were really just the passionate folks who believed in the park and wanted to see it thrive in any way they could. People who invested their time and their talents, and who clearly would have worked really hard to fundraise or do whatever was needed—and from an outside view it looks like the owner just threw them out like garbage time and time again instead of recognizing their value and leveraging their passion and their talents to build something really cool. It might not have been Disney, but it would have been really special. I guess the real investors really were the friends we made along the way.

Nina Røste

I audibly said "Wooow" after Quincy cancelled the meet and greet just like that. What an uncharming man.

Nina Røste

Also, what fight against tyranny is the song even referencing? Granted, I've never been to Evermore, but nothing I've heard about or read about it suggests there's any kind of tyrrany or rebellion going on in the story.

Autumn

I just looked up the convergence to see any content about it, and there are still tickets being sold. on hoopesevents you can add tickets to your cart and there's a payment screen

Crescent Minor

1:59:20 describes maybe the most ghoulish thing in history. I think it would be a joke on the town Paranorman is set in for there to be a public photo op about an ancient execution. And, unfortunately, an awful photo op for bad apology videos.

Challah Back Girl

So I got to the part of the video where Quincy cancels the QnA and obviously had do go down a rabbit hole of his videos. The October following the release of this video he dropped an 8 minute TikTok video following someone in his comments calling him a grifter. I would 10/10 recommend people watch it, not because it’s good, but because it demonstrates that he is, in fact, a grifter 🤠 while I get that people derive value from his content….he absolutely does utilize the whole parasocial relationship vibes to get his audience to pay for his content and many if not most of his audience are children. Idk…weird vibes.

melody grace

in this video it looks like she does a brown/neutral shade on her lid with hilighter that is blended from the corners of her eyes to roughly the middle of the lid (i find putting a tiny bit of concealer underneath the hilighter after i put on the eyeshadow makes it look brighter!) with a cat eye and bottom lashes blended with a black eyeshadow but not fully connected to the wing, making the eye look bigger and more open. hope this is helpful!!

Gorgon

Got to the part where they return to the crypt to speak to the “actor” and just hearing them say “hey girlies” made me laugh so hard I had a choking fit

Chris Gonzales

This is my third time watching the video and everything involving Quincy is just so infuriating lmao

Sophie!

Can't get enough of this topic

Madison

I’ve always disliked Quincy and it’s good to see my gut instinct was right. Also finding out he set the prices and took the money and ran is crazy.

Madison

He has super weird grifter vibes. He set the prices too. He didn’t have time for Q&A but had time to plug his book like huh 😭

Madison

Quincy set the prices not Evermore which is just crazy 😭

The Huldra King

Yeah yours was much more compelling, that vector art thing (at least what it seemed to me...?) he tried to do with a photo of me just did not speak to me.

Joshua White

Hey friend! Yeah I mean I may be biased but I thought so. Despite everything I wish I had still had the chance to come down and check it out at least once especially during your time there.

Mike Kelley

He also sounds like a spot-on impression of Grog from the D&D cartoon Legend of Vox Machina.

PurpleIsDebeste

There's a lot of fun and interesting stuff in this video, both """"interesting""" (extremely depressing), and actually interesting, but truly nothing can beat the joy i felt seeing your friend do that impression of Maxwell at the end

The Huldra King

I just now saw this comment about my Faldo and it really does mean so much to me aaaaa. The fun I had with patrons is the only thing I have left of everything I put into that character.

jellybones

this is an old comment but its something that needs to be STUDIED. as someone who reads a lotta graphic novels and am currently trying to go through the few marvel/dc comics that stand on their own as decent works, wading through the nerd community around superhero comics is so enlightening.

jellybones

they literally admit to and almost... bond(?) over how much they hate what they consume and perpetuate mistreatment of artists. i hate nerd and geek culture so much; we need to stop acting like letting people enjoy things isnt just worthless bootlicker thinking.

jellybones

mormons are like genetically engineered super soldiers but instead of combat their programming makes them the ideal machines for producing unimaginative but marketable and inoffensive ya fiction.

Charlotte

(Umpteenth rewatch:) Honestly, the Maxwell song is kind of a banger.

GraceH

Whenever Jenny mentions the chapel, for 0.5 seconds my brain goes “CHAPPELL ROAN???” before remembering the literal building type that’s existed for hundreds of years 😭

Gabby

I can not overstate how uncomfortable I would feel on a train being physically pushed by people, I would feel so horrible and terrible

Gabby

The overwhelming evidence that they watched Jenny’s video is so funnyyyy

Katicorn

Seriously, that's the type of thing you ought to be giving employees a bonus for!

jess f

such a weird shout but does anyone know if the voice from the thing where jenny was trying to press that button & get a quest is the same voice as one of the people who did the audiobook for den of vipers 😭

gal fieri

i love that maxwell ended up being the Evermore version of the Dan Gossip girl reveal

Nat L.

The real reason is that the bulk of modern fantasy is heavily inspired by Tolkien and English literature. Consequently, we end up associating high fantasy with the British. But also this is Texan cowgirl Evermore character who watched her whole family be eaten by werewolves erasure.

emily !!

the comments on that tiktok make me feel like im going insane. a complete echo chamber of "omg quincy you did NOTHING wrong!!". thank you for sharing this

Echo Cian

As a musical enjoyer, I really love the idea of getting the audience into a sing along to make a plot point happen, but... THAT song for summoning a VILLAIN...? Maybe it makes more sense in context but I have my doubts given the overall quality

PurpleIsDebeste

thats a good theory but i dont think we should rule out the idea that only he can sit in the caboose because it's extremely dangerous and structurally unsound so only his friends can ride it without risk of suing him

Claire Newhart

The Maxwell villain plot *could* have been something. I love writing detailed backstories for my dnd characters so "member of an acting troupe that felt slighted by the town makes a deal with an evil patron" is something that they could have worked with. Maybe have some other characters make some not so nice remarks about him, a plotline of an evil being in the background striking a deal when he's vulnerable, his best friend trying to talk him down after he starts getting in too deep but in a moment of anger (or maybe on his patron's orders?) he kills him...They try to summon him with the song he wrote but he interrupts with a reworked "villain song" version? IT COULD HAVE BEEN SO GOOD BUT THEY SERVED US A BIG OL' NOTHINGBURGER

Parker B

In theory allegedly in my opinion, I love all evermore videos

BrawlerNothing

Way late but im losing it at the fact that maxwell’s song intro is clearly inspired by “the black parade” by mcr looool

Hilda Mistwater

Quincy from the Tavern Talk game !?!?!? What a bummer to hear he was unprofessional in this way I loved his cameo in that game :(

Knitter? I hardly know her!

The issue with a fish smell with no fish source is that it often means Bad Electrical Problem About To Start a Fire... So HOPEFULLY it was llama pee 😬

Neil Dutton

Possibly a llama had peed on exposed wiring.

Neil Dutton

I'm sure someone's mentioned this already, but if the conspiracy theory is correct (and I believe it's at least partially correct) then they didn't make $100k on VIP tickets. Assuming Quincy paid a flat fee to the park then maybe the aggressive half assing of all his meet and greets suggests that he didn't make anywhere near as much money from the even as he was hoping for.

a.s.

i cannot believe i've watched this video as many times as i have & did not pick that up, it's so obvious in retrospect lmaoooo

a.s.

this reminds me of the whole discussion around how evermore could be run the way it was and still be considered acceptable by fans within utah's culture-- it's fascinating how much this all overlaps demographically with 'nerd franchise' fandoms where people accept what's given to them despite how bad it is. it's a fascinating relationship to power (though i hesistate to make specific claims about how mormon culture ties into this) but i do also think its bc nerd franchises became mainstream so recently that there's still a scarcity vibe like we NEED to consume the ip slop that's offered or else they'll stop seeing it as lucrative or something

BrawlerNothing

SO WE FIGHT. AND WE FIGHT. AND WE FIGHT NOOW FOR FREEDOM

Madeleine

Omg I can’t believe it’s you! My friends and I loved your character so much you were so rude to us and it was hilarious! You really made our night :)

Katherine

Ok so I know this is like basically two years later but I wanted to explain a little microscopic deep dive I did on something in this video. At around 53:56, Jenny and friends enter a little decorated house full of vampire hunter-y type lore. It’s purple in there, it’s covered in the genuine fake antiques we know and love and has a bunch of those confusing lore letters all over the place. But the thing that caught my attention was the ambient mood music they had playing in there. I swore I had heard it before. At first I thought it sounded eerily familiar to music from a video game I’ve played a lot called V Rising. Which would make sense considering it’s a vampire rpg. Or Vampyr, another vampire themed rpg. I scoured these scores looking for the familiar music that I heard in the footage. No luck. I kept thinking that it Had to be from some soundtrack and was being streamed thru like Spotify or Apple or something and that there was no way they were using like license free music. It just seems like a level of effort that they simply would not have gone to. I listened to it over and over. Turns out it’s from Assassins Creed Syndicate’s Jack the Ripper DLC. Which was released in 2015. For those curious, the track is called Cobblestone and Fog. This makes me think that maybe at some point early in development they made a free Spotify playlist with anything they could find that was moody, victorian or Jack The Ripper themed and then just used the same playlist every Halloween. Like they really went hard with the Jack the Ripper idea until that fizzled out. All in all, not That big of a deal, considering now that the park is dead and gone, but it’s just another element of (in my opinion) bad show on their part.

Katherine

Also this is just to add that I consider this to be a bad look because (other than their own history with legal battles involving music licenses), a pirate themed museum near where I went to college got sent a cease and desist for playing the Disney Pirates OST outside their doors. So I think the park was lucky that it was small potatoes enough to not be noticed or Ubisoft or whoever was not litigious enough to send mail.

abby

btw evermore never had writers! the actors had an INSANE amount of authority over story and the overall look of everything!!! -an ex evermore employee

kelly m

huh, in the video where she watches the q&a they said burnout from writing so much plot was an issue, so that means that was definitely a lie lol

kelly m

the impression of maxwell at the end fucking killed me lmaooo the body language was so accurate

oldandtired121

I lowkey think you got that part of the video muted lol

Hollow.wish

Idk. I'm English from the border region with Scotland so I have a mixed accent of sorts (my accent is "Northumbrian") and their accents are passable for America but absolutely laughable as someone who hears the accents they're immitating on a daily basis

disciple of shawn

that’s what i was thinking too. obviously the attitude sucks but im thinking he was having his own problems with the park

mlmohara

i thought i was going insane i heard the “when i was a young lad” lyric and had to do a double take

Crescent Minor

At 1:57:01, he gave up all hope that someone else would start for him, shot a quick look at who he was counting on, and began to sing that galumphing song.

A. Ortiz

Hello from the future. It’s still up.

Magistrissa

Every single time I watch the Maxwell jail clip I can only think of Wheatley from Portal 2. Just that exact same speaking style, except trying to be a bit more menacing, if flamboyant in his evil.

a.s.

i love this because them keeping a single long holdout of jack the ripper just feels so right.... ken in 2016 wearing reading glasses with spotify open on his laptop and that's like one of four key phrases he can think to look up for his halloween vibeset.... also props for eventually finding the extremely niche source, the feeling must have been unimaginable

a.s.

when i was... a young lad.... my father...... took me into the theme park...... to see some singing dwarves.........

Frankie Gallagher

Good news, it's still up! You can even buy up to 3 of the 1k VIP packages XD

MollyBoBolly

maxwell... we will fight we will fight

Danny Young

I know this comment is ancient now but MagiQuest was peak! I think you're so right that Evermore could and should have taken inspiration from them in terms of implementing tasks and quests.

yazzle

As a lover of games of all kinds, it really never fails to shock me how little the people behind these experiences understand basic game mechanics 😭 and even if board and video games are somehow too hard to understand, it's not like no one has ever brought game mechanics into real life, escape rooms and game shows exist

Marla Owl

Still working now!

Sydney Ranno

i was pleading out loud for maxwell to stop singing death of a bachelor

Axel HV

In a recent video in Bob's chanel (Bob At Evermore) there's an interview with one of the writers.

Axel HV

"His Date" Isn't the guy supposed to be married?

Axel HV

This comment is so weird. Jenny literally says in the end "If you don't care is scam that's on you". I guess for some people listening is relative.

Rowan Kal

fascinating how as americans we are so used to ugly things that we will spend so much money and travel so far just to go in the most average of all time british building🙃

a.s.

i had theorized this so thanks for confirming 😵‍💫 well for what its worth you guys did well with what they gave you (nothing)

a.s.

evermore said ''here's our chance to redeem ourselves after the most exposure a small park could possibly get! to prove the haters wrong we will bring in One Llama because jenny said she didn't think the Llama Footage in our weird summer camp ad was realistic, and then do literally nothing else''

Ginger Jones

Come to New England, everything is quaint and charming here

VorpalThumb

I'd have loved even just some kind of theme park experience where like... a "quest" means going through some RPG dungeon-themed haunted house. Like the catacombs, or maybe a pirate's cave or a dragon's den, with a cool elaborate scene at the end like an animatronic dragon or a pirate's treasure or a spooky ghost that you have to push those buttons to banish. And then you get some souvenir, like loot dropped by the boss. Admittedly this is something I thought about for my dream attraction if I struck it rich, before I ever heard of Evermore.

VorpalThumb

I may or may not have joined your Patreon specifically because I heard there was more Evermore content here. It's such a disaster, I can't help but learn more about it. I'm glad they added some of the things that you'd suggested, but it's still very bare minimum and I would love to have seen more actors and even animatronics - like, say, a tree with a face. And why did the hearse randomly have "Evermore" written on it? That's weird for a hearse.

Arizonia

I'm rewatching and one thing that is bothering me, during the train ride, around where the pirate skeleton was, I feel like it would have been a relatively simple fix to plant some trees or large bushes on the other side of the barrier fence to block out the office building and improve sight lines? it's such a little thing but they could have fixed that in like, a weekend lmao

a.s.

holy hell you ate up with this. we all agree you have to steal that ip btw

a.s.

upon rereading this i do get an overwhelming cia plot vibe

VorpalThumb

"Why did you do it, Maxwell?" "Wouldn't you like to know, weather boy." The lyrics of his song are baffling to me. O Lorekeeper Jenny! Help me understand! Were there actually any wars or villains besides Maxwell that would warrant him to sing about fighting so much?

Magistrissa

Boy those are some shaky accents. Moreover, Quincy has all the charismatic acting talent of the second lead in my high school production of Guys and Dolls. Not sure how the channel became that popular.

Magistrissa

1:53:02 I might've said it before, but something about Maxwell's explanation for the murders is just uncannily similar to Wheatley from Portal 2 when he's being evil.

Owen JS

Am I tripping or was that Dan Olson from Folding Ideas in Jenny's friend group? 😆

Doug Targon

Maxwell’s performance really gives a guy who thinks he’s talented and intimidating but is overall mid and kinda cringe, and it feels more like the actor is also like this than an intentionally incel-y manchild character

Magistrissa

I've probably said this before, but Maxwell as a villain gives the same energy as Wheatley from Portal 2, but more poorly written

Frankie Gallagher

I'm just gonna update this each time i rewatch the video: still up 🙃

Frankie Gallagher

Wait... shit, it's.. it's spelled "Evermore", but you spelled it "Evermoore", and that's so much better? It's a geographical feature that sort of is what the park looks like in its default state! *looked lol

The King of Tiny Accidents

It’s cool that he’s nice or whatever but I have an innate hostile attitude towards people whose whole thing is “I look like a CW character from a show that makes the guy writing this want to start eating the walls and floors out of anger” and it doesn’t remotely comfort me that an adult like that is sociable and charismatic because I KNOW most of the audience for stuff like that is children Quincy falls into the same category of “my content has a large portion of forming these uncomfortably parasocial thirst trap dynamics with an audience of mostly children” like hey maybe fucking don’t

The King of Tiny Accidents

This is how I feel about the entirety of the CW Lucifer show and i am fighting my autism like a wild horse to not derail and crash out over that,, that is not what we are talking about on the evermore video 😂

The King of Tiny Accidents

Disney’s really been upping the energy that they’re the sort of megacorp to start trademarking body parts and suing people for having them

The King of Tiny Accidents

It’s the weepy platitudes with a mostly child audience for me. I don’t trust like that. I don’t trust that guy to honor that children are people who u need to be extra responsible around

The King of Tiny Accidents

It’s already scummy and kinda creepy but that really amplifies with a creator who knows they have an audience of mostly children. And I’m not comforted by his persona or the weepy self help angle— I was alive thru early YouTube and was also in the pop punk scene. I don’t trust like that. Like obviously the ceiling of that distrust extends into like, real crimes, and I don’t know enough about this dude to have any say on that. But like. The skeleton for that is technically set up, and it makes me so fucking uncomfortable.

The King of Tiny Accidents

I get that I will not be remotely popular on literally this channel for this, but Disney has its own actual corporate faith cult and I do not think more things should be like that.

The King of Tiny Accidents

Respectfully we are enemies now, it sounds like a joke but it isn’t. White supremacycore Satan is deeply unwelcome, it’s not counterculture, it’s not.. I don’t… I feel like I’m the lady who made monopoly as a condemnation of capitalism being shown the monopoly official app

The King of Tiny Accidents

I choose to believe the tyrant is Ken “Brett Schneider” Bretschneider, local billionaire

The King of Tiny Accidents

Same reasons that there are many. Many. MANY. People who still say shit about it “breaking their immersion” to see anyone nonwhite in a fantasy film. It’s supposed to be a safe feel-good fantasy for Americans, and when stuff like that is said, its language is kinda meant to confuse people who approach that in good faith, but the underlying answer is that you’re supposed to either not even notice or happily notice the total absence of all non Eurocentric cultures and go “ah yes, lovely! No woke 1 ruining my fun good time!” Because it is the politic of American fantasy stories to all be set in some European bleach slurry that allows us to fantasize about being even more important etc., elevated and embraced by a world so normalized it reads as apolitical. What else *could* there be, right? Your question is invoking an honest universality that although often taught, genuinely isn’t intended to be applied consistently. Uncritically embracing a sterile elevated Europeanness that lets Americans larp as fantasy British aristocracy is what you’re supposed to do as an American. Especially in Utah. I cannot stress enough how much America’s worst behaviors are like amplified into a compressed buzzing disc of Bad Times by Mormonism.

The King of Tiny Accidents

He’s a billionaire with a theme park in the state that’s got a massive issue with being majority run by a polygamist death cult spawned in upstate New York. Him cheating on his wife and thinking it’s impressive to show a mistress his private caboose of his dinky train that goes around the health and safety violation playground he made himself for fun would be like, the least surprising thing to learn about him Exmo content helped me deconstruct from a different cult. I have to use my weird amount of Mormon knowledge for something 💀

The King of Tiny Accidents

You think media criticism is a personal attack against you specifically don’t you squidward

The King of Tiny Accidents

That’s what the Satan guy gives me but apparently if you’re remotely nice the media you uncritically parrot means nothing to most people. And I knew this already but it disappoints me every single time anyway

The King of Tiny Accidents

I am once again begging people to normalize doing things themselves or at least trying to like, for fun or whatever. Y’all got a cooking friend? Do some stuff with them. Become the cooking friend. Make a cooking friend. You don’t just have to watch some grifter whose career hinges on his parasocial relationship with a ton of kids. Pretty sure there’s a YouTuber called like, eating history or smth that teaches people how to cook a lot of ancient food including medieval food. You deserve to get to eat the food you watched happen

The King of Tiny Accidents

It’s giving that guy who was selling pony bead crochet jewelry he made for like fifteen thousand dollars

The King of Tiny Accidents

Thinking about the logistics of who would have a train and why is more energy than Ken ever put into Evermore even one time.

The King of Tiny Accidents

I will simply not be giving grace to rich adults who do this sort of crap for attention and money. I think often times we forget how lucrative it can be to be an influencer whose content blows up. We do not need to extend excuses towards people who even if they don’t know better could just pay someone to know better for them wherever they want, but they’d rather just hoard their money and get to have total creative control regardless of their lack of creativity and interest in making things better when their parasocial audiences will just gaslight themselves into believing everything’s as good as it could be you guys, they’re doing their best!

The King of Tiny Accidents

… and their works are overtly Mormon in a way that’s also so American it’s taken years for the very fucked up stuff in them to be taken remotely seriously. Idk what I’m commenting this for. People don’t care.

Becca Yaga

You know what? Super fair haha

kelly m

definitely a huge issue in utah specifically like how do you take the most gorgeous landscape in the country and turn it into strip malls and crumbl cookies

melatonin bruv

it wasn't intentional i would hope but yeeeeeeaaaaaaaah it was like..... why are we fighting. against who. for what. what does that mean. just like. could this stand up to a critical eye? (no)

melatonin bruv

that sounds gorgeous. i have some experience doing the actual operations of mid sized events, and the thing i always think about is: do people have water and bathrooms accessible? if the experience offers a lot but you have to leave or haul stuff around to fulfill basic life functions, it's not going to be a good experience.

The King of Tiny Accidents

Joseph Smith’s ghost trying to shake y’all into giving more money to a scam you know is a scam (in character for him)

The King of Tiny Accidents

It’s so funny to think they would do this. What’s Evermore’s role in the strait of Hormuz 😂 what is the Evermore psyop. What would they even be trying to do. Op I love your comment

Angelika

i'm not sure either tbh 😭