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Fireside Chats, Episode 20: The Rise and Fall (and Rise) of Star Wars (Patreon)

Published:
2018-01-16 17:00:59
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2026-06
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Content

As a child, I was obsessed with Star Wars. The primary reason for that was because of the influence of my brother Dagan, who was (and is) also a huge fan of the franchise. We sat down for a meaty, nearly-90 minute discussion centered around The Last Jedi, a talk that quickly spirals into a chat about the other movies, and the Star Wars Universe as a whole.

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Comments

Brandon Soto

Fantastic episode Colin. Didn’t even know Dagan was on Fireside Chats. The Knockback Prequels episode will be a good one.

Michael Ferrari

I have never been so let down by a movie. Heaven forbid Rian Johnson still gets to make his own trilogy. The world doesn't need 3 more terrible films.

Owen

Yea its really weird that with TLJ the second viewing changes your thoughts on the movie. Maybe it's just the diehard fan in me, but on the second viewing I disliked a lot less things than I did on the first viewing. I didn't think the movie was bad. I didn't love it either. That casino scene is pure shit. And I just don't understand how TLJ fits as a middle movie to a 3 movie arc. That being said, there are a lot of good things in it, and I still love Rey. As much as I loved Finn in the first movie, I didn't care for him in the second movie. To many humorous moments. Some of them are great. Luke's shoulder dust off, Chewie eating the porg, Poe at the beginning. All good funny moments. But they just tried to put to much comedy in it, it felt like a fuckin marvel movie these days. -- All that being said I can't wait for episode IX and i'll continue being excited for every star wars movie. It's my favorite movie(s) ever. I eat this shit up

Carson Smith

At the end of the day, I am mostly positive about The Last Jedi. The worst parts were the casino planet and the purple hair character who sacrifices herself via lightspeed (was a cool moment just didn't like her character).

Leonard Jacobson

I admit that I'm a pretty non-traditional Star Wars fan (really enjoy them, don't revere them). So to me The Last Jedi, despite it's flaws and my strong belief that Johnson favoured his personal philosophy over characters, is a solid step forward in the trilogy. It sheds the trope baggage brought in with Snoke (Palpatine wannabe mother fucker) and forces Rey to take control of her destiny (no convoluted bloodline story here). Kylo Ren is interesting given his internal conflict. He's unpredictable and isn't just bad for the sake of being bad which sets up a better villain. Hopefully they bring the Knights of Ren in to back Kylo up next movie. The praetorian guards were not the knights according to Johnson. I didn't like the Canto Bight part, even though it thematically fit (failure plus showing grey areas). I thought Rose wasn't a great character, I thought she could have been better served as motivation for Finn through her demise (she still might). Leia in space was bad. I thought it was jarring and there were better ways of showing her use the force. In saying saying that I think Leia as a character was better in this film than The Force Awakens. I particularly enjoyed her scene with Luke, which I think is why she shouldn't have died in the bridge explosion scene. Poe was good and it was good to see him show restraint during the final battle scene. He'll be strong going into the final film. What I had the most issue with was that the three key heroes of this trilogy didn't have enough time together. I really hope they fix that in the final movie. I think Johnson became a slave to his vision and themes and that came to the detriment of not only the overall plot, but also to even character development. It's a good film though. One that had me thinking for a weeks afterwards. This sits behind TFA and Rogue One for me but ultimately I think the strength of this film will be actually be defined by how well the third movie sticks the landing and incorporates themes from not only TLJ, but also TFA!

Damian Kubski

Instead of Holdo, Leia should lightspeed through the ship, it would have been perfect sendoff for her character

Chad Lewis

Where’s that Jared petty podcast starting to remind me of that Sony bend game.

Lucas Gremista

I am an officially hardcore CLS fan because I just listened to an entire podcast about a movie (and series) I couldn't care less about just bc it is Colin and Dagan chatting :)

Peter Campbell

Interesting to listen to, even if I disagree a lot with what is said. Like many Star Wars fans, there was definately a "I have very clear expectations" viewpoint and biases. But that's to be expected from fans. We all have passions or views of how things should be. I was always a die-hard fan of the original trilogy as it came out (showing my age) but by the time of the prequels, I was over it. You can't get that childish emotion in adulthood. By the time of Phantom Menace I was way more interested in Eyes Wide Shut and The Thin Red Line. I should note I studied film. That's my thing. So the prequels didn't get to me. There was no way they would ever live up to the originals. They're very flawed films but so what. Very flawed interests me. I definately watched them as Lucas films and as extensions of THX as well as Star Wars, but also to films he put money into like Mishima of the Kurusawa films. They were nowhere near the quality of the films but if you've seen as many films as I have, there's so much worse out there. Try Cuban 60's films. Ugh. Anyway, the new ones came out and I, unlike many fans, started volcanic. Because of that Force Awakens final act and the brazen stupidity of the death star with trees. But then something terrific occured. Rogue one. First half very much a spy/war movie, second half a battle movie where everyone dies. Then The Last Jedi comes out and despites the flaws, its beautiful. It gets my genuine curiosity going about Star Wars going for the first time in years, beyond simple nostalgia. Because every idea the heroes have fail, and their back-up's fail, and all the plotting is about surviving failure rather than the stated goal. And finally they end by having a personal fight that counts as myth, to those who will tell stories about it. So to me, it was something great. So that's my take, as I think the point of the podcast seemed to be giving a viewpoint. Isn't it a lot easier just to give a take rather than getting offended that others points of view don't match your own. No-one will change anyone else's mind by being dickish about their point of view, which I see a lot of on Last jedi coverage.

John Kamoulakos

You and your brother have a great cadence during this podcast. I was very much looking forward to your review/opinion about TLJ and it’s great to hear actual discussion and back and forth rather than “it’s terrible and your opinion doesn’t matter, like in other discussions”.

BettyAnn Moriarty

Glad to listen to this since I fell asleep on the sofa as I watched you guys recording - not because I wasn't interested but because it was 2 am and my body and brain just finally shut down for the night. 🙄 I really need to see this! Sounds wonderful. What am I waiting for?! 🤔 Love the banter between you two. Fabulous! ❤️❤️

Smokey Joh

Great points in this convo. I think TLJ has some of the best parts of the entire series (lightspeed crash, guard fight, force projection) and also some of the worst (casino horse thing run, rose crashing into finn, luke milk) but overall my feeling is that they weren't consistent to the established rules and context of the universe. We are told certain things in the previous movies that they explicitly say they don't care for. The past is dead, kill it. And thats fine if this is a reboot or the first in the series but when TFA was so safe and adhered to some of those conventions, having a middle movie that throws all that out makes me nervous for how they plan on wrapping up the third. Clearly, the theme will be that anyone can have the force (the kid with the broom and the copycat scene looking up at the moons, if what kylo said to rey about her parents being nobodies is true) but that in itself breaks the universe. Also, I LOVE R1. It showed me a darker side to the rebellion (Cassian killing their informant), had a grittier and desperate tone throughout and fit perfectly in the story.

desperateLuck

Having Colin and Dagan go back and forth passionately in their chocolatey east-coast voices about Star Wars has some ASMR-like qualities. Also, Revenge of the Sith is the best star wars movie.

Cameron Paterson

I love Star Wars and I have loved it from a young age to now I got a Boba Fett tattoo once I was old enough to get tattoos. I thought the Last Jedi was fucking awesome. It's movie that I keep thinking about and every viewing makes me fall in love with it even more.

Last Stand Media
>>9513369

The lightspeed thing bothered me because it just broke the entire fucking universe. Why didn't they do that to the Death Star? Makes no sense.

Michael Trees

Star Wars is dead! Long live Star Wars. I’m excited to see how JJ cleans up this mess.

Brock Thomas Walsh

Only half hour in, but really loving hearing you and your brothers back and forth. It's is great hearing two different perspectives from two life long Star Wars fans who happen to be brothers

Last Stand Media
>>9513726

I'm happy to admit that I'm in the minority that didn't much care for The Last Jedi, though I'm authentically surprised that so many people see it as a positive step. I don't even think it's a neutral step. To me, it was so muddled. BUT! That's the beauty of opinions. =D

Last Stand Media
>>9514567

I never recorded with Jared. I had scheduled both Jared and Angie while in San Francisco, but they needed to cancel.

Last Stand Media
>>9520325

It's interesting, because I agree that the aesthetic of everything is really well done. I love the thought that has gone into making Star Wars a visually pleasing and cohesive universe. I just could do with more plot, I guess.

Last Stand Media
>>9522226

Dude, Rogue One is so great. That Han Solo movie comes out in a few months, though, and we've seen nothing!