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Thank you for the support! You guys and grrls are awesome!

Edit: As usual, I biffed the math here. People were saying 9 cc of material would make a sword that's measured in microns of thickness and I didn't understand how I messed up by so many orders of magnitude, so I sat down and measured out the sword on paper: 

Okay, let's lay it out. We'll say the sword is 5mm thick at the spine, and that 5mm thickness extends down the "flat" for 3cm, then there's a recess for the fuller that's 3mm thick, then there's another 3cm of flat to the blade, and the blade is 2cm from flat to edge, so that's 10 cm wide for 95% of the sword.

So let's say it's an average of 4mm thick for easy math. Times 10 cm width makes for 4 cubic centimeters of material for each cm of length. Okay, wow, I really did screw up Cora's estimate.

Then the question is how long is it? I think I drew it pretty close to the right scale in that first panel, so let's say the blade is 140 cm, which is just over 4.5 feet, and the handle is maybe 16 inches for some reason. I like the way long handles look on swords I guess, but we're not so concerned with the handle at the moment.

140 times 4 ccs is 560 cc?

Okay, I see what I did now. I wrote 9 cubic centimeters thinking it meant a 9 x 9 x 9cm cube, even though I know better. 9ccs is just 3cm^3. I meant 9cm cubed, which is actually 729 ccs. The funny thing is, I initally wrote 8 cubic centimeters (again, thinking I meant 8x8x8) and thought that sounded low, then revised it to 9 just before publishing the page. 8^3 is 512, which is actually pretty close to the volume of the blade. Of course, there's the handle and the crossguard, so I'll actually leave it at 9 cm cubed for Cora's estimate. I just have to change her wording slightly. 

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"Cosmic" energy is a comic book staple. In the real world there's the EM spectrum and kinetic energy, gravity, and uh... friction? Also sound, acceleration, centripetal force, but those are all variations of gravity and kinetic energy. And lightning, fire... cold. Cold isn't an "energy" though, just a relative lack of energy. Also radiation, but I think the EM spectrum covers... some of that? I know you can get into the nitty-gritty about alpha-particle emissions and ionizing this and that, but MY POINT is that in the real world, you kind of run out of interesting energy types pretty quickly when you're writing superhero and not too hard science fiction. Or straight up science fantasy. That's the category I put Doctor Who in. Weirdly, the earliest seasons of O.G. Dr. Who were borderline hard-ish sci-fi, but they got progressively... softer the longer the series ran. The new Doctor Who's are straight up fantasy in space. There's barely even a nod to science anymore.

So comics and sci-fi have to make up all kinds of crazy energy types to justify how the time traveling statue can turn back into an evil energy specter and possess that episode's lead female's father. That's hard to explain using just infrared light and uh, centripetal force.

I mention all this because Maxima's primary energy attack is a particle beam, which is totally a real thing. At least it is in a particle accelerator. I mean, a coronal mass ejection is... well, not a beam, surely, but there are particles involved. Arguably, a claymore is a particle... cone attack. It just depends on how you define "particle." In Maxima's case, there's a healthy mix of neutrons and protons, with just a dash of antiparticles thrown in for fun. It's actually a decidedly unhealthy mix, come to think of it. It's exceedingly hot and has a surprising amount of kick. And just a skosh of ionizing radiation. 

I think at some point way back, I mentioned the power scales of the Grrl-verse was more akin to the Marvel universe than the DC one. Or the DBZ one. Honestly, it depends on the writers for any given issue, but the DC universe tends to be on a much higher scale. I used to kind of limit myself to the Marvel RPG scale, but "Unearthly" strength only lets you lift 100 tons. Now, that sounds like a lot. I mean, sure, it's a lot of weight, but that's also only the weight of a tank or two. When you start talking about buildings or ships or trains, 100 tons is just dipping your toe in the uh, weight pool. So, whatever I've said in the past about strength levels, Maxima can lift Cora's ship. I have no idea how much it would weigh. It's about the size of a battleship? Maybe a little shorter and at least twice as wide. An Iowa class is 860 feet long and weighs 48,000 tons. It's made of sci-fi space materials, but like with Ultronium, that doesn't necessarily mean it weighs less than the stuff we have now. So I'm not going to put a hard number on it now, but Maxima can lift a lot. And it's a good thing her strength can scale with her power pool, because if you could lift a battleship, even using 1% of your strength to open a door would make it explode. Cause that would be 480 tons of pressure, and most doors aren't up to that spec. 

Files

Comments

Thomas Dorner

Doesn't handling a ultra-heavy sword increase the risk revealing her true nature? If some alien notices the flying power during a combat that is supposed to be on ground, it might put 1 and 1 together.

Ron Jarrell

Why does the maid service refuse to do maximas room? They don’t refuse, none of them can open the superreinforced door they put in for when she’s just waking up and forgets to tweak her strength and detonated the normal doors.

Autoskip

People get a bit… heated… about “centrifugal force”, because it’s really not a force at all - it’s what happens when inertia interacts with a rotating frame of reference - so I’ve taken to calling it “the centrifugal effect”. …on a less serious note, now I want to see a hero with “elemental powers” who can fling beams of hyper-accelerated atomic elements.

James C

Early Doctor Who fell under the old BBC guidelines whereby shows even partly aimed at children needed to have an 'educational' component. So, you had "travel to the future" or "travel to another planet" episodes for science, and "travel to the past" episodes for history (including a couple where 'the protagonists travelled here from the future' was the ONLY SciFi element in the episode)

Michael Obert

Ultronium: an alloy of Adamantine, Mithril, and Unobtanium forged in Nidavellir by the Space Dwarves. For the best quality Ultronium, use whatever was in Marcellus Wallace's briefcase (or in a pinch, that of possible Faustian deal-maker Kenny Loggins)

Czarzhan

There's actually a fix built into Maxima's character regarding the strength issue. She has an internal dial to focus how much of her power goes into strength, resilience, flight, etc. So she just keeps strength at a low ebb when she doesn't need it. On a side note, I loved it when you included where she was allocating her power in the first Vehemence fight.

Nathan Wilson

I don't think she's as worried about showing off her powers during this specific upcoming fight. She's going to have a different disguise, and will be up against robots and all kinds of crazy space magic. The plan is to allow her to cut loose.

Nematrec

I've heard it called an 'apparent' force. Which means it has effects like a force, even if it technically doesn't qualify

Nematrec

I imagine Maxima could benchpress the ship when under it's centre of mass, but would have trouble deadlifting it. And certainly not causually lift it one handed like she did with the ambulance when Sydneys tube was stuck on it.

Andrew Denton

A particle beam is what makes a CRT TV work. Not just real, but at one point, commonplace.

FeyOne

Reread the authors note. He specifically talked about centripetal force, which is the actual force applied to provide the acceleration necessary for the type of movement in question. Centrifugal “force” is exactly what you said. It’s the misperception of what’s happening in a way that causes people to mistake inertia for an active force due to their frame of reference and misunderstanding of physics.

Greg Morrow

Max isn't in Silver Age Superman's class, but she one-shotted a Fell battle cruiser and can outspeed a stasis field. She's definitely in post-Crisis DC territory. (Or MCU territory -- MCU Captain Marvel one-shotted Thanos's ship, comics Captain Marvel isn't close to that.)

Town Crier

Single-"edged". Max is such a sword newb.

Steve Brinich

She said she was taking that one to use at home, not for the arena.

Steve Brinich

That last comment reminds me of the bit in Order of the Stick where Redcloak summons titanium and chlorine elementals.

William Elliott

I mean, it was a scanning electron beam [easy to manipulate an aim with magnets], but you ARE correct. Just remember, don't cross the electron and the positron streams [it would be bad... as detailed in a previous supers fight IIRC]

William Elliott

Heh, Trial by Stone... nice "The Dark Crystal" reference

Czarzhan

Comics Captain Marvel literally stopped a nuke by absorbing all its released energy as it detonated. Or so I've come to understand.

Czarzhan

(Dabbler drops an alien doodad) Nom nom nom...

LucasTheLost

Captain Marvel, or Binary? 'Cause Binary is fully capable of operating in that scale, TWO suns... twice as powerful as Superman. Or something. And when MCU goes all out, she starts to look a lot like Binary.

Czarzhan

The comic segment I saw on Pinterest (though I'm pretty sure it was from an actual comic) showed Carol wearing the Captain Marvel uniform. I believe this happened in an issue of The Avengers in the 20-teens

Czarzhan

Captain Marvel #10 (2014), my Googling also showed she did so in 1989, Captain Marvel #1

Magraal

Just going to point out that nine cubic centimetres is really not even close to being enough material to forge a sword that size out of, unless it's literally paper-thin. Nine cubic *inches* maybe (and even then you'd still have something drastically thin). Think about it realistically- one centimetre by one centimetre by nine centimetres is nine cubic centimetres, which is pretty close to the size of your average pen.

Erin Palette

Oh cool, it's Heavenly Sword. I've been wondering where she was. We didn't see her in ARC training so I assume she either escaped the restaurant battle or was in jail.

codesurfer

I like to think its just her doing bad math than Dave doing bad math because that's a lot funnier

Jacob Bissey

With regard to heavy swords being unwieldy even with super strength, it honestly has more to do with how the blade is balanced than it is absolute weight. Generally speaking, the closer the point of balance is to the handguard (the cross piece in this case), the easier it is to wield using standard techniques. With how thick the handle is, if it's primarily made of the same Ultronium material as the blade itself, then it's probably much better balanced than a design like that usually would be (with the lack of pommel and absurdly wide blade), but given the blade is *not* centered over the handle but rather the edged side sits further forward than the flat side, that I going to throw Maxima's technique off far more than literally anything else could, the fact that it's so much heavier than a standard sword of that length will just exacerbate the issue, but if it were just the weight, I'd say her super strength is more than sufficient, even at her minimum level, to compensate for it.

Jacob Bissey

That said, I really don't understand why she need a sword to begin with. Like, Cora's explanation of having something that can absorb magic seemed like a good idea, but then she chose one that explicitly doesn't do that, and while it synergizes well with her powers, it doesn't seem to have a functional purpose for her? Like, she's already very well trained in hand to hand, and her beams can already probably cut through just about anything, sure that doesn't really allow for delicate, precision cuts, but that's why she has a team, to have people with different skills and powers, and this sword is almost *definitely* not going to be any more precise than her beams are.

LucasTheLost

Does anyone else think Heavenly Sword is about to lop her own arm off with that parry?

Miles McDaniel

Huh, I guess I don't know how to add a newline on mobile. Anyway, 3cm^3 would be 27 cc. 9cc would be a 3x3x1 volume.

NickPG

She was with Deus on his vault raid, getting what looks like the same sword as the one she's wielding here.

MaxBigfoot

I'm a little stumped that no one uses Dark Energy. It actually exists, comprises possibly as much as 68% of the entire universe, and science doesn't really know much about it yet. It's a great fictional power source, yet I've never read anything using it. I suppose there probably someone who has written something like that, but I haven't seen it. Also, ultronium is unbelievably strong? If Max breaks it, will Cora quote Merlin's speech from "Excalibur"? ;-)

Erin Palette

Really? Huh. I don't remember that at all. Time for another archive crawl!

James C

As you say, precision. The sword can cut a thin line through something, rather than her particle-beam carving a thick gash through it. (Plus, there's still the reason why she carries a gun, from way back on page... 327?)

Patrick

I can't see the page.

Erin Halfelven at BigCloset

i've written a sci-fi/superhero farce using skotonic force from skotos, greek for darkness. it's posted on bigclosetr.us, Starstruck is the title i think.

Jacob Bissey

Except we know she can vary the width of the beam, I don't think we've seen the lower bound of that variance, but if it's just a particle beam, she could probably cut a thinner line than the sword can. The gun is primarily for intimidation and to do nonlethal ranged damage on people with enhanced durability, the sword isn't any *more* intimidating than the gun, and it doesn't serve a practical function in actual melee combat. And even if the sword is legitimately more precise than her beams, somehow, (I sincerely doubt it), that still brings us back to "this is why she has a team of supers with different powers and skills". This sword just doesn't seem to be fulfilling any actual function that isn't already filled better by something else either in Maxima's load out or by another member of Archon.

FeyOne

@Steve, I had completely forgotten about him doing that! That said, now I am stuck trying to decide if I’m happy with the sudden realisation that I and Redcloak think more alike than I had realised, or if I’m unhappy about it. 🤣

eddi_TBH

If Max looks intimidating holding that gun of hers, pulling this sword out of hammer space will be a moving experience for many an enemy.

eddi_TBH

She will just say, "That lasted longer than I expected."

eddi_TBH

Max is helpfully blocking her from doing that.

Steve Brinich

If nothing else, a big impressive-looking sword would fit right in with her "scare the crap out of wannabe bad guys" approach to crimefighting.

Jared Juetten

With how strong Max is, I don't think 32kg will make her sway TOO much. She just has to plant her feet (or fly, yes) and use her core. I've swung 24#(10.8kg) around when I weighed 180# (81.64kg) and didn't barely move if I was planted right. For Max, maybe 320kg would be more correct. :D But whatever you come up with and however much you want it to weigh, I think it's great. Thanks for the comics, Dave!

Tim Starliper

It is definitely likely to cause an enemy movement. Followed by an enemy change of shorts.

akrasia

Why would it be a BAD thing for Max to have wildly un-intuitive sword fighting physics? If she's the only one learning how to swing a sword like that, anyone fighting her for the first time is going to misjudge everything. Not to mention the unique movements that become possible with composite center of mass not being inside her body...

Sharien

hah yeah volume math is notoriously tricky to conceptualize - heck people often have the same problem with area (ie 2m² is a 2m x 1m area, not a 2m x 2m area) but the error compounds a lot harder in volume

davebarrack

I'm hardly a math expert, but I don't think that's right. Anything X^2 is X*X, not X*1.

davebarrack

The point is that you might not have moved much with properly planted feet, but 1) you probably moved a lot more than if you were swinging around a 1KG weight, and 2) how often do you have a perfectly centered stance in the middle of a sword fight?

Sharien

2m² not (2m)² - thats the exact same thing you talked about at the start - 4m² is a 2m x 2m square

Otoger

to be fair Dark Energy could be a kind of Mana and we are just in a Desert, like some storys like to do were the iskeai then comes into contact with it or the Apocalypse happens once it reaches earth and diffuses into it

Steve Brinich

The last thing she needs while acting as a ringer is anybody thinking "hey, something ain't right about this"...

akrasia

I have one more stupid question. When not flying or doing anything else super-powered, how much does Max weigh? Trying to judge what swinging a 32kg sword would actually do to her functional center of mass..

Jared Juetten

Hopefully you're always minding your footwork and balance. hahahah But concession made for sure.

James C

I suspect that attempting to bypass that cognitive dissonance is why people sometimes talk about "square meters" instead of "meters squared". It helps to confirm that 2m² is two squares of one-meter side-lengths (two square meters); rather than one square of two-meter side-lengths (two meters-squared)