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What A Cartoon Movie! - Pinocchio (Patreon)

Published:
2022-03-28 04:00:03
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

This month on What A Cartoon Movie, we're covering our oldest subject matter yet with a super-size podcast all about 1940's Pinocchio! The follow-up to Disney's first animated feature, Pinocchio had to prove the studio's hit movie about a young girl living with seven tiny bachelors wasn't just a fluke. And while Disney's adaptation overly sanitizes Carlo Collodi's often grim source material—even for an audience that existed at the dawn of World War II—the animation on display is a sight to behold. So listen in as we discuss this heartwarming tale of wishes and nagging insects.

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Comments

Christoper Cross

Wooo yeah, my favorite classic era Disney film

The Terrible Secret of Space

For anyone interested in the history of Italian Unification, I'd recommend the Revolutions podcast, particularly Season 7, which covers the various revolutions going on in Europe in the 1840s and 50s.

frysjackett

Well it's not Bambi...buuuut I'll take it.

Blake R.

i was a little lukewarm to Pinocchio as a child and my biggest takeaway from it was Monstro was too terrifying. as I got older and began studying animation, really came around to being amazed by the artistry behind it and what might have been a peak in output in Disney's timeline that wouldn't be seen again due to the studio's (and the man's) oncoming struggles. re-watching it more recently i appreciated so many more little details and found myself asking "how did they do that?". I also got a big laugh out of Honest John's casual "a little wooden boy" right as Pinoch skips on by. been very excited for this months' WAC!

Egg Boy

Just watched this pretty much blind like Bob. Beautiful film, I’m not at all surprised the clocks in the beginning were based on real props, they’re so intricate. It kind of has this multimedia feel to it as well, with the more obviously rotoscoped characters like the blue fairy, the more rubber hose designs, and the 3D props like the carriage. Great episode guys.

Harry Thornton

I was worried you two wouldn't be fair on the film, as it's been a huge childhood favourite of mine (watched it over and over on VHS as a kid), but you guys were very fair! I understood and even laughed at some of the critiques, even if I didn't agree with all of them. That new translation of the Pinocchio book sounds interesting, I'll probably pick it up at some point. And I can vouch for that roberto benigni theory: He's a MASSIVE fan of the original book, so his infamous films are actually some of the most faithful adaptations of it. As much as I appreciate Disney, the whole "Snow White was the first animated feature!" really does bug me. It doesn't make Snow White any less of a landmark, and all it does is erase the presence of really unique films like Prince Achmed, the oldest surviving animated feature. I'm shocked Christian Rubb's Nazi sympathizing side didn't come up. There are interviews where the animators describe him going off about how great Hitler was, and them getting revenge on him by shaking the raft when he was acting as Gepetto for that scene's live-action reference footage. "When You Wish Upon A Star" as the theme for Disney dates probably as far back as the Disneyland TV series from the '50s, which used it in the series' intro. Leigh Harline also composed the music for the 1962 Cinerama film The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm, and in that there's a song that's just blatantly Heigh-Ho from Snow White, a hilarious case of self-plagarism (since he also worked on Snow White). The last traditional theatrical re-release was actually in 1997, for The Little Mermaid (not-so-coincidentally right near Don Bluth's Anastasia), and every re-release since has had to have a gimmick attached to attract viewers: There were IMAX releases of Beauty and the Beast and The Lion King, both with added scenes. Those same two films would later be re-released in 3D in the early 2010s. I can't stand when they replace the old logos for more recent releases, it feels like such weird revisionist history. As a historical fashion enthusiast, I can vouch for Henry Gilbert using the proper "bustle" term. Surprisingly even as a "modern" kid who was often bored if it was a film I didn't like, I was never bored by Pinocchio's first act or anything. As a massive Oz-head, I can confirm that film was released in 1939, just a few months before Pinocchio's release. In other words, there wasn't enough time for Billie Burke's performance as Glinda to influence the Blue Fairy. The Coachman's "AS BOYS" face also inspired Yoichi Kotabe's design for Wario, and I can absolutely see what he took from that, with those giant teeth. The Island being magical is also somewhat inferred with Honest John saying "Pleasure Island?! But the law! Suppose they-", which implies the place is known (and infamous) enough to the point where there's laws surrounding it. There's a gag in the pool hall's unusual architecture that was missed: It's a reference to the Trilon and Peresphere from the 1939 New York World's Fair, a round building next to a tall tower. It's like the 1940s version of everyone calling EPCOT's sphere a giant golf ball. I understand why you two wanted to see the villains pay, though for me it's still novel seeing a Disney film where the villain DOESN'T get a comeuppance. If it's any consulation, you CAN off the Coachman in the SNES game adaptation, as he's one of the bosses. While the Fairy just giving them a letter as a dove is a MASSIVE cheat, the fact the artists recognized it as such later is enough for me. It's ironic Wolfgang Reitherman was behind all these massive, ambitious characters like Monstro, the T. Rex, and Malieficent as a Dragon because the '60s and '70s animated films he directed were so breezy, casual (and frankly boring) by comparison. Even their infamous recycled animation was just what he did, it (shockingly) wasn't budget problems. That whole climax with Monstro is even more incredible when you realise that no one outside of Disney could've pulled a scene like that off at the time. No live-action techniques could replicate that speed, that power, that movement, which the Disney animators pulled off back then. I love how between Pinocchio, Bambi, and the Beast, they all go through physical transformations that are not nearly as iconic or interesting as their most famous iterations. There was actually an alternate design for a "real boy" Pinocchio that keeps a lot of his puppet design, that I think works way better.

Butterfielda

Remember, in 1940 Disney also had another massive box-office bomb with 'Fantasia'. Like Pinocchio, it too had a massive budget (and a soundtrack system which couldn't be reproduced in most cinemas), as well as limited audience appeal. So it's understandable that Disney thought there was no point being innovative or artistically-minded because the audience wouldn't pay for it. Why give 'em fillet mignon when they'll eat meatloaf instead? I hate it, but that's capitalism. And Disney was a capitalist.

Erin Hardy

I'm rewatching for the first time in at least 25-30 years, and I'm shocked at how many of the small details are still embedded in my brain.

Dylan (batmanboy11) Freitag

Honestly this might be the first time I've ever seen this movie (or at least, with a brain that can form memories properly) and Henry's upfront discussion of the movie being visually great with some lackluster storytelling really hits the mark. It's ASTOUNDING how good it looks, especially considering it was made 80 years ago, and I could really appreciate it on that level, but animation as a medium really advanced their storytelling in the decades since. -- I was shocked at how little his nose growing came up since that's pretty much Ponicchio's THING in pop culture (endlessly made fun of in Shrek and its ilk) besides the "I have no strings" song, but it amounts to bupkis in this movie. I knew that other Disney tales had been heavily watered down, such as all of their "takes" on Grimm fairytales and the Hunchback adaptation, but I did not know how bastardized this was. In some regards this makes sense, but ultimately Pinocchio's naivety and borderline stupidity get very frustrating when he just blunders his way in and out of scenarios, rather than someone who makes bad choices intentionally and has an actually character arc of growth and change. He DOES act selflessly and heroically in the end, but it's not like he was willfully an asshole before that or even that selfish, he was just dumb and easy to lead around (almost like Forrest Gump, in a way), so it's kind of like... did he really need to DIE to earn mortality? -- I hope Del Toro's take on the source material has more depth in that regard, though at this point I'm also just kind of skeptical about ANOTHER Pinocchio story (even from someone with his pedigree).

Jonathon

The talk about Disney re-releasing films to theaters reminded me that the one and only time I saw The Great Mouse Detective was in 1992 during its second theatrical run. Fantastic episode, as always, and this really is a marathon of a podcast. Appreciate all the work you put into these.

mavrick

I'm going to Jazz Island

Zena Klein

Loved learning about the history of this classic, we appreciate all the time put in and the research done-and I’m going to grab a copy of the original story for myself, if only for the super dark illustrations! Also, not sure if you guys mentioned it, but the actress who voiced the blue fairy was in a Shirley Temple movie, the little Colonel. Hearing her voice reminded me of her in that film I watched (due to my mother’s love of Shirley Temple). but she really was beautiful and the spitting image of the blue fairy-in brunette form! Finally, at the end of the movie, the choir singing “when you wish upon a star” sounded eerily similar to the same choir/music singing at the end of Cinderella and sleeping beauty and probably some others I can’t remember off the top of my head.. It just made me feel as though I was watching a different Disney classic movie…not sure if anyone else felt it too?

Alex Irish

I did get to go to Pleasure Island a fair few times at Downtown Disney in Orlando, back in the halcyon days of 2006. However, I was 18 turning 19 then so I didn’t get to enjoy the pleasures of beer and spirits at the nigh clubs. Anyway, I fully agree Pinocchio is the zenith of 2D animation and still holds up today on a technical level, and the Roberto Benigni live action version is just as bad as it sounds. If you can somehow check out the 2002 Miramax dub, it is both notoriously bad and oozes that Harvey Weinstein energy of calling in favors from his blackballed Hollywood acting cabal. I grew up as a wee ‘un on a consistent diet of Disney’s version and the 1996 JTT version.

To Boldly Joe... Moore

Loved the podcast, guys! Great job, as always. ^_^ Btw, I was waiting for Henry to bring up the Ultron connection and he didn't disappoint. :D

Steven Babb

Wow, well done - great history part - super interesting! Thanks!

glowstickjuice

Not to promote another podcast, but Totally Trans did an episode about Pinocchio with a trans reading on it. It's obviously not canon, but the 'wishing to be a real boy' sentiment a lot of trans guys felt in childhood feels relevant. I recommend it to anyone interested in trans readings in media, they have episodes that cover a lot of different shows and movies so there's something for everyone.

Lorin Bernsen

You fellas did a really great job with this one! Even better than I was expecting, actually. A perfect mix of historical context & irreverent humor!

FootFungus

To follow up on a question about current kids attention spans when watching this movie. I saw this with ny 7 and 6 year old boys. They both were fully engaged with the movie as was I (well I had to take my mandatory dad nap in the middle).