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Radio War Nerd #342 — Crimean Wars, 1853-2022 (Patreon)

Published:
2022-08-14 02:00:38
Imported:
2026-06
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Recorded: August 11, 2022

The War Nerd & Ames update the latest in Russia's invasion of Ukraine — the mysterious attack on Russia's Saki airbase in Crimea; possible failed Ukrainian counteroffensives in Kherson region; controversies over Amnesty International report, Olenivka POW camp bombing, Zaporizhya nuke plant shelling, force exhaustion...

At 1:04:00 - We discuss the Crimean War (1853-56), and its echoes today.

For more on the Crimean War, check out RWN EP 67.

Intermission music by Brendon Anderegg. 

Total time: 1:33:43

Direct link to this episode's mp3 here 

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Comments

Hugo

Hi can I be added to the email list so I can get the rss link? Thanks

Ander Pierce

Guys, amphibious invasions are the easiest thing in the world. A Ukrainian invasion of Crimea will be ez considering how much success they've had on Kherson :P Weird thing for Zelensky to say tbh but I guess I just don't understand his audience or mental state

David Andrews

Good episode guys. My only question is how did Suez influence the Crimean war when the former got started a dozen years after the latter?

Ander Pierce

400 military interventions O.o

Of course

My apologies for the length of this. Re Russia and the Ukraine and Feb 24, 2022, RWN has gone from: 1. War is tragic. (Agreed, but of course this catastrophe started well before Feb 24th) to 2. Bad repercussions will follow. (Agreed, but whether those outweigh the harm-reduction and benefits is another question) to 3. Under the same conditions, I would never had done what Putin did. (For my part, I can't agree, but even if RWN and I have very incomplete information, I think yours is a reasonable conclusion - but not the only one) to 4. What Putin did makes absolutely no sense. (Now we've moved into desperate gaslighting, perhaps to save face after "getting it wrong" re whether Russia would attack. Understandable to say this in February because of the shock of it, but to keep saying this today, after we've had an opportunity to look back and reflect, you'd have to ignore so much publicly available information: inc countless warnings over 30 years from Russian leaders, terabytes and library shelves of "Western" analysis, dozens of major and well-reported US/NATO provocations, and... any map of the region) to 5. Putin perpetrated the original war crime of aggression on Feb 24, 2022 and is singularly culpable for this disaster. (Well, we know that's a morality tale written by the would-be victors, the Raytheon board of directors, or whoever runs your favorite media, but it's like saying, The Korean War started when the uniquely evil Communist North was ordered by another nefarious Moscow baddie to invade the Free and Sovereign South on June 25, 1950.) Finally, given how consistently and globe-spanningly lethal, reckless, and potentially humanity-ending the US has been since the end of the USSR and Warsaw Pact, ... and in the absence of an effective, organized international left or even a "realistic" detente-ish liberal "Western" reformism,... the violence deployed to end exclusive US domination of the globe may be the only, if feeble, hope we have. It's depressing beyond despair to feel so powerless and hopeless, to be reduced to whispering ironic prayers to Putin and Xi to knock some sense into Washington. There has to be another global political economic settlement, and we're taking a deadly route to a less-than-satisfying "new normal". But Washington will not be the world's sole suzerain for much longer.

William

What exactly is your point? I don't know what you had in mind as "damning evidence" but I'm not seeing the major position change you apparently believe is occurring with Mark and Mr. Nerd. From my point of view their periodic reviews of the situation are the most fair and unbiased you can get. I have to do the minimal amount of work to critically examine what I hear them say. How many episodes on the 90s in Russia do they have to do to get across to you their position on the effects of US foreign policy on Russia? Have you listened to this podcast at all? I'd like to hear what exactly is the big difference between points 1-4 and also how each of these steps represents them putting more distance between their February thoughts and now

Doug Cartel

Somebody over at war on the rocks pointed out that historically and practically Russia has never used air power the way the US does, so people scratching their heads over why they dont have total air superiority right now need to at least see the russian perspective on what a jet is supposed to do rather than just assuming they would act like america

Scott Junor

Can I get an appeal on a ban from the Facebook group? There was a discussion about that stupid capital riot, with a bunch of dorks freaking about “coups on our democracy.” I was like chill out guys, they let those idiots into the building and then waited a year so they could have their investigation during an election year. It’s political theater just like Russiagate. I was then banned by a Patrick Connor for “fascism.” How are you guys going to let a straight up MSNBC robot be a full on admin on your Facebook group? Come on, man.

WarOn WarOff

Spoke to a friend in Madrid yesterday who said Algeria exports sufficient energy supplies to Spain, and didn't say anything about being banned from using his a/c.

Wooobie

It would be nice if they put the link in the "membership" tab. Perhaps they have some reason for making the link exclusive to the newsletter, but it is inconvenient to rifle through my old emails whenever I change my podcast app.

radiowarnerd

As we said on the show, Britain and France had different reasons to enter the Crimean War. Britain was the global superpower and depended on the Suez Canal for a quick route to India, hence the term 'East of Suez'. The overhyped threat of Russia rolling into what was then Constantinople and cutting off British shipping from Suez was one of the common arguments made in the British press for going to war. Granted, the Victorian press did not generally require very plausible scenarios to start a war, but that was the argument (one of them). France under Napolean III had other reasons to end the war: LN III's urge to profit politically from posing as the defender of Jerusalem's Catholics against the Orthodox clergy's bullying, as well as the Victorian French obsession with accepting any junior partnership in British enterprises designed to promote France as an almost equal power.

David Andrews

Thanks Gary. I'm just confused about the timing since the Suez canal wasn't finished until the late 1860s (I think) long after the Crimean war was over. Prior to the Suez canal, didn't shipping to Asia from Europe go around Africa? Other reasons for the Brits and French wanting war make perfect sense. Protecting the canal doesn't make make sense unless my understanding of the maps and dates are wrong (which is possible).

David Andrews

I think this war actually started in 2014 but it didn't attract so much attention then.

CR

I’m listening to episode 67 on your recommendation/reminder and I’m dying at “maybe Bellingcat will correct [obvious Bellingcat bullshit about Syria].”

Doug Cartel

I take it you probably heard about the Marine Gazette op ed by this point? I was still pretty sure people claiming that the "sloppy" nature of the initial weeks of the invasion in February were just Russia simps, but I'll believe a marine general if he says it was a feint. Some people are claiming the anonymous writer was Van Riper but I bet they just listen to War Nerd.

Robert Rowe

Bellingcat is what it is, and what it is ain't Wikileaks lite. It's more like when the CIA/FBI/MIC started up Students for a Democratic Society, or when forest fire fighters light a controlled "back fire" to cut off a real wild fire from more fuel.

CR

That’s the joke.

Of course

I don't understand why the early Russian push to Kiev has to be EITHER a feint or a genuine attempt at occupation. It's possible that it was considered "all of the above", a military necessity to keep Ukrainian forces from the east, a diplomatic vice to get a quick cease fire out of Clown President Sexy Tshirt, and a hope-against-reason attempt to score another Crimean liberation with popular support/acquiescence. Unless the Russian govt or military has adopted the threadbare Rumsfeld Doctrine, Moscow sent in far too few soldiers to maintain a stable occupation of a hostile population.

Ben

You guys are wrong about the himars. It was sabotage.

a clash of purple

But Putin's invasion of Ukraine IS a terrible idea and he IS singularly responsible for it, from everything we know. Like, he can't 'win' this war, it's not going to help him or Russia in any way, and they really would have been better off if he had just sat there and done nothing. And if he wanted to do something, there's much better ways he could have asserted himself on the global stage rather than commit himself to a conflict that is doomed to become a counter-insurgency quagmire. Russia had plenty of other cards to play. Putin doing this was a blunder. He shouldn't have listened to whoever told him that invading Ukraine would be easy. American leaders aren't the only ones who do dumb stuff.

Hugo Turner

As someone following the Ukraine war closely, I must correct Your Donbass coverage. Although there have been skirmishes near Slavyansk for months Russia is currently trying to take the line of cities to the east of Slavyansk and Kramatorsk, Namely Siversk, Bakhmut, and Soledar. Currently Russian forces are actively fighting inside Bakhmut and Soledar Only when these cities are captured will they attempt to liberate Slavyansk. Also there has been some progress on the Donetsk front as well. As for the Himars it’s widely believed that the US must approve every target in advance so the strike on the POWS was no accident. Anyways if you want to follow the war download telegram and follow Slavyangrad for a quality pro-russian source.

Major bit me

Wild how Ukraine is shelling the Zaporizhia plant and then has the gall to claim the Russians are shelling themselves there. And how they continue bombing Crimea while claiming the Russians are accidentally blowing themselves up. Quite the PR game they are running

xxx

This is incoherent. What are you saying?

Mark Ames

agree, my point was that there's been so little movement in the campaigns to take Siversk, Bakhmut and Soledar that there's no movement to speak of to take Slavyansk/Kramatorsk. Maybe I wasn't clear enough on that.