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New and Improved Lorelai

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Tobias Keezy

It seems from Logan’s expression at the party that he doesn’t like what Rory’s doing. He doesn’t really want her to be like all his other dumb friends because he seemed to like her for her literary and studious side and liked to engage with her on that stuff. But you really should speak up, dude. One line about how she likes school isn’t going to cut it. And you need to set your own example too.

Tobias Keezy

Is it just me or did Lorelai look especially hot this episode?

Tobias Keezy

I think there’s a bit of inconsistency in the writing of Richard and Emily here. Not the betrayal of Lorelai, of course, that makes total sense for them. But they had higher ambitions for Rory than anyone. They actually wanted her to excel in academics and have a successful career. I just don’t buy that they would be so completely on board with just letting her bum around in the pool house, going nowhere.

pumpkincarvingjen (¬ ´ཀ` )¬

I really can't remember how I felt about this story arc on the first time watch! But I can definitely say that every rewatch I find Rory more insufferable at this point and I'm absolutely loving how hard you guys are coming down on her! 🤣 It's not exactly the same but my ex boyfriend's mother told me I must have only gotten my Software Engineering internship because I was filling their quota and I didn't fall apart like Rory did. Granted she didn't own the company and wasn't the top guy in the field but still, I dumped him and moved on lol I've never once thought you guys are misogynistic.. curious what the heck the reason for that was.

Mo

I agree with all of your thoughts about Rory, her grandparents. EVERYTHING

Stephanie P.

You guys are not misogynists. Some people are just ridiculous, lol. You two are the only ones I have a Patreon with and I’m a lesbian. I wouldn’t be watching if you two were spouting off ridiculous things. I think your takes are fair and it’s your first time watching. As for this episode, I think this really sets up the season and it’s a very different one from the vibes previously on the show, not that it’s better or worse, but they really pull at a different direction. Some people love or hate it for that, but I honestly enjoy all the seasons of the show and I think you’ll both enjoy it. I can see why people get tired of Rory’s behavior and attitude and frankly some of the wild decisions she makes, but I do think it adds an interesting layer to her character. Instead of it being about people being good or bad, it’s more focusing just on how these characters are flawed and there’s gray areas. I think this show is half about Lorelai’s life and half about Rory’s journey growing up and there’s a lot of swinging around all over the place from both of them at times. But Lorelai is definitely the one who earns the most sympathy while going through this season for most people and with good reason because Richard and Emily have cranked it up like you said. There is a scene with Emily this season that’s one of my favorites though. She can be insufferable but Kelly is such an entertaining actress.

Roland

I don't think we're allowed to say things like that anymore...but yes. :D I think Lauren Graham is just carrying herself (as Lorelai) much more confidently and her acting ability (and her stylist) make that shine through. Conversely Luke looks a mess (I think it's the hair, and Luke's hilarious inability to wear regular clothes comfortably). Credit to all involved. :)

Roland

I wish the writing of Richard and Emily was less whip-lashy, but Kelly is just amazing.

Roland

Is there a reason (there's no in-character discussion of) Logan heading for a felony conviction / jail time, possibly at the hands of the same judge? From his fellow Skull And Bones pals we know he has seen the inside of a jail more than a couple of times in the past.

Jonathan

Kevin yelling she’s not Einstein cracked me up. I really hated this Rory plot line first time through curious how I will feel this time.

Jonathan

Rory’s lawyer in this is used to playing rich people he was a main character on Falcon Crest.

Stephanie P.

It’s definitely all over the place at times. I always took this episode “The New and Improved Lorelai” at face value. They’re reacting to Rory in an emotional way almost out of desperation to heal from their past situation with Lorelai. They aren’t being smart about it. They see Rory chose them and it’s their last shot as a do over, and they’re not going to try to heal in a healthy way by fixing their relationship with Lorelai. It’s like they think it’ll be easier to just heal through Rory so I think they act a little nutty about the entire situation and very much in a betraying way to Lorelai. I also think they react in a selfish way by pointing Rory in this direction when they’re doing it mostly for themselves and not only for her. When watching the show I always feel like it’s “one step forward and two steps back” a lot of the time particularly when it comes to Emily and Richard when it would be so much better if they could just try harder to see things beyond their point of view.

Yasemin

I never saw that scene as "crocodile tears" by Rory.

Yasemin

As lovely as that scene with Lorelai's proposal has been, and she obviously realized how much she loves Luke when she saw how he cares for Rory, I also think that it kind of happened in an "unhappy" moment for Lorelai, ie, she was actively trying to numb her pain as well, which might not be ideal (for lack of a better word).

Yasemin

I really want to meet East Side Tilly. :)

Yasemin

Fun fact: Scott Patterson (Luke) had to shave off his hair for another part in between seasons, which is why he looks a bit strange with that longer and slightly blonde hair (a wig) here. :)

Yasemin

I love how you instantly clocked that Luke was going to propose (which they did off-camera). I have rewatched this a gazillion times and never picked up on that "full moon, moment's here" reference until someone pointed it out recently. LOL, always new stuff to discover with GG!

Anjali Agarwal

Rory just comes across as incredibly spoiled right now. She has the privilege of having an Ivy League education, an opportunity that not everyone gets. And honestly, if she wants to take a break, fine, that’s her choice. But going behind her mother’s back and turning to her grandparents to take her side, especially when she knows how strained their relationship already is, is not okay. It feels like she’s playing one side against the other, and that’s just not cool. This is where her immaturity comes into play. Also, Kirk is my favorite supporting character. I love him! :)

Riley Swain

Not that you need the validation, but yeah, I cannot imagine where the hell that "extremely misogynistic" complaint/comment could have come from. Coming from a woman, you both exude great energy and are always extremely thoughtful with your comments

fire12wife

As many times as l've watched this show, I still feel cheated that we didn't get to see the Luke, with a ring, and a full moon, proposal!

Youtalkingtome

We certainly misspeak sometimes (my mouth sometimes does move faster than my brain), but I really do feel like that one was a stretch.

Youtalkingtome

Yeah, I feel like she knew she was going to get ganged up on at family dinner about dropping out, so she preemptively went to her grandparents to manipulate them into taking her side.

Youtalkingtome

Maybe not, it's ambiguous to me. But I certainly feel like she went there specifically to get her grandparents to side with her against Lorelai.

Youtalkingtome

I had no idea it was still available in Japan. It was definitely widely treated like a "chick drink" as Luke said, as men were socially discouraged from drinking it.

Youtalkingtome

It's like people who drop out and say "Bill Gates dropped out, and look at him!" Man, you are NOT Bill Gates.

Riley Swain

And also, of COURSE you misspeak or say things that you may later disagree with! A first reaction is just that— it’s not a video essay! Your patreon community is likely better off without that person

Youtalkingtome

That's a great question. Since he's being tried separately, he might not have the same judge (I don't know know in what court, or even its level, he is being tried). The details are all unclear. My guess would be that he is much richer, and therefore going to get off easier in the world of the show. That way it never has to be addressed.

Youtalkingtome

I think you're right. We will see how he handles all of this.

Youtalkingtome

You had a normal, human reaction. If Rory was dedicated to her goals and ambitions in any way, she would have just said "well, I will show this guy what a moron he is," and move on (I believe that's exactly what Paris would have done in the same situation). Good for you on making the smart choice!

Youtalkingtome

Thank you, and we love that you are here! I agree, Rory is tougher to take sometimes precisely because Lorelai fought her way through life without relying on her parents for the most part, and Rory is absolutely using them as a path-of-no-resistence crutch.

Roland

In the UK we had a friendlier nickname for these kinds of drinks: "alcopops". We also had a much more obnoxious nickname (of course, because British)....

Yasemin

OMG that is sensational! I used to love Falcon Crest as a kid, and would never have made that connection! The show also had such a great theme song! :)

Yasemin

Hm, fair enough, I guess I cut her some slack :) and feel more like it was the next logical step for her after Lorelai clearly told her she couldn't come back to Stars Hollow if she was quitting or taking a break. So...not as a malicious plot against her mom, but rather her own way out of a messy situation (or attempt, at least).

Yasemin

I agree. And I think while it's obviously not Logan's fault that his dad's lawyers did a better job, it always strikes me as strange that Rory has to do 300 hrs of community service, while Logan is facing zero consequences.

Yasemin

Fun fact: She is also suddenly wearing an extra necklace with a blue pendant in that continued proposal scene, plus has a different hairstyle (proposing does that to you, lol!) which was obviously not intended for streaming services and to be seen back to back. :)

arthistorian

YouTube says it's blocked, even with a VPN on! Help!

Ari

I'm a little late for the first time EVER, but I enjoyed this reaction. I completely agree with everything ya'll are saying about Rory, and I was looking forward to getting to this part of the show to see what ya'll would think. Also, I have NEVER gotten any misogynistic vibes from either of you, so I can't imagine where that is coming from. I def. don't think disagreeing with Rory's horrible choices has anything to do with misogyny.

Jonathan

I’ve actually been binge watching it this week so it was a funny coincidence.

Carl Wilson

I felt that the moment when Lorelai proposed was so romantic and authentically emotional that I am glad there wasn't another on-screen moment to compete with it.

Yasemin

That's a good point! In a way, the off-camera thing was the best choice.

Carl Wilson

I don't disagree with you, though I think 300 hours does feel like a lot as such sentences go for a first offense - the judge is making an example of her. But even so, it's still very doable under her circumstances, whether she did it full-time for about a couple of months or spaced it out over a longer period. For someone who really did have to work to support themselves or a family it would be tougher.

fire12wife

That's true, I definitely wouldn't want to change that!

pumpkincarvingjen (¬ ´ཀ` )¬

I remember back when Rory went behind Lorelai’s back to secretly invite Richard and Emily to Lorelai’s graduation. You guys said something along the lines of “this is the second time she’s done this, I feel like we’re setting this up to not work out in the future” and oh boi did I have a giggle! 🤭 I think we’re at the point it hasn’t worked out!

pumpkincarvingjen (¬ ´ཀ` )¬

I think it’s a bit of both, she’s genuinely upset and doesn’t know what to do, but still feels manipulative

pumpkincarvingjen (¬ ´ཀ` )¬

I actually love this arc for Rory, even if it makes me dislike her character a bit more, I think it’s a very brave and realistic story to tell. I also think it’s healthy to show complex and flawed female characters. There are other shows that would keep Rory perfect and that’s just not how real people and women are. It’s important to show her making mistakes and not put her on a pedestal like a lot of the other characters in the show do :)