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On Patreon's recent fee changes (Patreon)

Published:
2017-12-07 20:31:12
Imported:
2026-06

Content

You probably got an email today about a change by Patreon on how they handle their fees. In short: Instead of charging me 5% + a varying percentage of processing fees (in the past something around another 5-7%) they will now charge me a fixed 5% and you 2.9% of your pledge + 0.35USD every month. This is NOT something that I think is OK, since it will increase the cost for you, and it also feels like a blatant money grab considering the flat fee of 35ct they tack on to every pledge. 

Like many other creators, I'm very angry about this change which I might add I also had no influence on at all. I'll voice this opinion as loud as I can in the hopes that they'll roll this change back, and I suggest you do so too on all available channels.

Your pledges are what allow me to continue working on OctoPrint and still have a roof over my head and food on the table, but in the end you also have to think of yourself and if that means reducing or even cancelling your pledge, I can fully understand. If you want to support me more directly, you can also do this on PayPal. Or maybe you have a good suggestion of an alternative platform?

Thank you for all the support thus far, I hope we can keep the project afloat despite this money grab by Patreon.

Comments

Paul McMaster

Lastly if youd like I could build you a website with fundraising options directly on it. You or any number of people can probably do the same but I figure I'd offer. No charge of course

Douglas Rector

I support 5 patreons, yours and 4 3d modelers. 3 of those modelers are per piece, so last month there were 14 separate charges. Do you know if the extra $.35 billing will be per patreon or per charge? In other words an extra $1.75 or $4.65?

Douglas Rector

In any case I would be happy to set up a recurring paypal payment to you - sounds easier anyway.

Douglas Rector

Paypal wants 2% to send to a friend in germany

Steve

Putting in my 2 cents because I've seen similar posts from pretty much all the artists/makers I support on Patreon. The proposed changes won't effect my support for anyone. I sponsor you for $2.00 / month - I don't think $2.41 is going to break the bank. I understand what they are doing by trying to equalize the payment processing costs. This has always been a big problem with any business model that relies on micro-payments. The credit card processing fees because a huge part of the expense. Someone is going to pay that. You, me, or Patreon. The new model is at least more transparent about the expense. I want Patreon to stay in business so I have a platform to support the makers of the world. So if passing along the credit card processing fee to me helps with that - I'm ok. Where I think Patreon has missed the boat is actually to reduce that expense for everyone. If they would create a "Patreon Wallet" for me and hit my credit card just once per month for all my patronages - it would greatly reduce the credit card processing expense. I know that doesn't work for everyone - but at least give people like me the option.

Stefan

This sucks, I use PayPal to pay and they charge my 1 time a month that total sum. So why do they have to charge multiple fees? Like for per post creators they charge for very single post. Noboby can tell me that summarise some numbers in their software is that expensive. I will now switch to different ways, I hope all creators I support can offer alternatives.

Joerg Gebhard

This is complety unacceptable. On the other side i donate a small amount per month and do not expect any exchange so i can choose any way to donate, i do not need a plattform for it.

Anonymous

It's unfortunate that their simple 5% scheme was not adequate for Patreon to meet their goals. Adding this extra layer of complexity is certainly going to hurt the creators during this transition. They're penalizing those of us that choose to support multiple creators, which seems to go against their reason for existing.

Kai Laborenz

As I can understand that patreon must cover its expenses (but fail to understand why 5 % and all payment costs is not sufficient for running a website like this) I am very angry about the fixed part. It is clearly targeted at small donations and adds a whooping 38 % fee on every $ 1 transaction.

Kai Laborenz

And it is completely unfounded to charge the fixed part for every single pledge on per-item-pledges when they collect the money monthly ...

Terrain4Print
>>8754259

The fixed part is not targeted at small donations. It is payment card companies that target small transactions. In the good old days people used card only for big transactions, not for buying an ice cream. But that has changed, at least where I live. Young people use their cards for every transaction. They never have cash. I hope this change in behavior will also change the payment card industry in the long run. But visa and mastercard must start to compete in this field. In Sweden, a system called Swish is starting to challenge the big dragons. You pay with your phone, peer-to-peer, not cards, physical or virtual are involved. This is much cheaper to use for stores. I'm sure similar solutions are also emerging in other countries.

Kai Laborenz
>>8754259

The outcome clearly is. I read their blog posting and it seems they are planning to bill each post/pledge individually - not clear wheather that is one of different options or the only one available. If they bill each post/pledge individually it may be justified from an financial perspective but it would be highly unefficient use of our pledge money! Consider donation money to desaster relief and being told that 38 % was spend on bank charges!

foosel

As a small update on my side on this: I reached out to a contact at Patreon and only got the same bs speak. The update on their blog explains a bit why they thought they needed to make this change (or at least it gives a somewhat valid reason - if you actually do micro transactions against the credit card companies instead of batch payments once per month of course the payment fees increase), but it completely misses the point of this new approach being a bad idea to begin with for multiple reasons. I'll be looking into alternatives more, but I also have 1.3.6rc3 to push out today, which I'll do first (because I need those of you doing RC testing to test this over the weekend ;)), and then I'll continue looking into other options. I already setup a librepay account earlier this morning, but that doesn't allow for "the goodies", so I'll have to find an alternative way for that still. Also looking into adding a couple of "recurring paypal" links. I wish I could already present you with a good solution on how to proceed here, but right now I don't have it yet, and the timing of this couldn't be worse considering what I already have on my plate at this time of the year. Still extremely frustrated and angry about all this, but also extremely grateful that I didn't wake up to all of you gone ;)

Arthur Lutz

+1 on the librepay migration (I'm going to shout out to patreon too)

Soronlin

The whole point of Patreon was that it made microtransactions viable by batching all the donations into one CC/Paypal transaction. That is the sole reason it makes sense to make many small donations to many diverse creators. All the website stuff is just window dressing -- it's nice but it isn't the reason for the platform and everything it provides could be handled just the same in other ways. The one thing that pulled in creators and patrons was that patrons could pay small amounts without gifting an arm and a leg to credit card companies. And they've just destroyed it.

foosel
>>8757659

Exactly, and for some reason they claim they need to get away from this "for the creators". I'm struggling to grasp what made them think this course of action would be a good idea and go down well for anyone.

Anonymous

Like most people I try to support multiple creators with small $1. This new price change implies almost 40% of my total funds to patreon. I'll switch my account off and send the creators their annual patreon money donation via paypal transfer starting with this one... See you over at Paypal.

Aaron J Peterson

Sorry, I'm cancelling support to you and all other creators I'm pledging to on Patreon in protest. $0.35 + 2.9% = 37.9% of a $1 pledge, which is totally unacceptable. Obviously. And it sounds like you're also charging creators 5%? So you're taking money coming and going. Pretty crappy. Here is the reasonable suggestion: * recurring charges are incredibly convenient for Patreon, so no fee charged to patrons, regardless of amount pledged and number of pledges, ever. One time donations might charge a flat fee. Exposing cc fees to holders is never okay. * 5% taken from creators * Patreon, as a simple fascilitator rather than evil, money-grubbing middleman, and lacks the merit of being either creator or patron, absorbs the cc fees and humbly accepts the remainder to keep the site up and pay a small number of employees reasonable salaries. No rent-seeking executive class at all, no constantly growing company seeking ever greater riches.

foosel

I'm working on alternatives but I need some time to figure out the logistics and such. See also my newest post on this.

Ricky Theil
>>8754259

I write software that charges credit cards, and I work closely with merchant banks on fees. We don't run ANYWHERE near as much revenue as Patreon, but we don't get charged per transaction fees, no matter how small. We pay a percentage, which is variable depending on card charged, and daily batch fees. Even Square charges flat 2.75% with ZERO per transaction fees, even if the charge is $1. If I charge $1, I receive $0.97. Additionally, American Express expressly forbids charging fees, and 10 US states have laws against charging transaction fees, my state being one of them. US Federal law also states that companies are supposed to charge people actual fees incurred when charging card fees, not to exceed 4%. While I don't know the nitty gritty details of that law, it sounds like Patreon is collecting 38% on a $1 charge. The 2.9% and $0.35 per tx stuff, sounds like a way to generate more revenue by overcharging for the fees they actually incur.