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Mad Men 3x03 Reaction (Patreon)

Published:
2025-09-19 10:02:26
Imported:
2026-06
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Mad Men 3x03

________________________ patreon - https://www.patreon.com/LMreactions twitter - https://twitter.com/LMreaction tv time - lola - skysstillblue, milena - oneofthe100

Comments

Darrach

This episode isn’t missing from UK Netflix at the very least, even though there is a disclaimer saying it has been removed. Netflix as a company are quite happy to cut funding/cancel shows that are made by POC/centered around POC experiences, but they will remove episodes of shows like this to show how much they really care about social issues. They are so disingenuous.

Sebastian

It's such a performative, stupid move. As if anyone with a brain can watch that scene and not understand it's meant to show what an out of touch buffoon Roger is, and what kind of wildly racist shit used to be commonplace.

Darrach

Yeah my biggest takeaway was to show how normalised it was. Everyone is laughing and smiling, enjoying themselves except for Don.

Nina

Yes, it is just performative, they did it with Community's D&D episode because of a side character appearing in blackface for maybe 60 seconds. This character was already seen as a crazy (and racist) person and during the episode it was treated as out of line. Removing stuff like this only serves to cover their own asses and pretend they're being progressive, they're not trying to "protect" anyone. If anything it puts a target on poc audiences as people will claim they tried to "censor" an episode when they have nothing to do with it.

nzm

Paramount+ Germany also removed the Nathan For You episode about the holocaust because of Gaza lol.

Taya

If you go back and rewatch the blackface scene, Pete is frowning. It's pretty clear he doesn't like it. He only gives a weak smile when Trudy looks at him. Yay progressive Pete! Don didn't like it either but I think that had more to do with Roger just making a fool out of himself which irritated him.

Chris Truex

On AMC, this ep is there, it just has a little placard talking about the racism before the show starts. It's important to remember this, in regards to removing the episode: no one asked them to. And their goal was not to be anti-racist, or to fix racism, or anything. It's a corporate decision based on the (inaccurate) idea that people will be mad at them for having the episode. And if people are mad, they'll make less money. That is literally the entire calculation, they couldn't care less about racism per se. Ironically, it ends up feeling pretty racist in itself, because it's a company essentially saying "you know that THOSE people get mad at EVERYTHING". I will say that, in America, blackface is a particularly inflammatory thing. Other countries might acknowledge it as racist, but it's not as much of a gut punch. I think that's why this one was singled out by the corporation, rather than all the OTHER racist and antisemitic comments in the show. Even, so, it's still absurd to pull the episode. It's not like the scene is saying "isn't this great?!" It's a bunch of rich racist assholes giggling like idiots at cringeworthy racism that was old fashioned even THEN. Plenty of other far more heinous scenes of racism are included just fine in other shows. It's not like Netflix pulled the Hateful Eight because there's a scene with the Klan.

Chris Truex

I think you're spot on. Don found it classless, but I don't know that he was "oh no, racism is terrible!" More of the equivalent to him shutting down those men making obscene comments on the elevator in a previous episode. I also think he's uncomfortable seeing what is, basically, his own future, if he can't figure his shit out. And for Pete, I think this just feeds into Lola and Milena's (imo correct) theory that Pete would be a good dude in a different context. If I'm remembering correctly, he makes other surprisingly progressive comments later in the series, but it's been a long time since I watched the whole show through.

Kara

Don is extremely aware of the political climate due to research from his work. He knows that blackface 'minstrel shows' are already unpopular as of 1963, so it's not like he doesn't know its "wrong". But yeah, jury is out on whether he's more disgusted at the racism or Roger + Jane lol.

Kara

I think it's import to contextualize that removal of episodes featuring blackface happened in the wake of the 2020 George Floyd protests, in response to Black people asking networks and streamers why they were hosting certain content, specifically stuff with blackface where the joke was that a white person was painted black, brown, yellow etc. Some really bad cringe stuff got removed, just straight up racist jokes. While there was likely an over-correction (see here, Community) it's not like it was random, we were in the throes of a global pandemic and protests irl and online were reaching a fever pitch demanding corporations do *something* at least. So there was a mass rush to remove or edit things that looked bad and blackface was an easy binary filter for corps staffed by white people who don't know better - "if it has blackface just delete it for safety" etc. A lot of those episodes got added back with context or disclaimers, some didn't. But yeah, it was a response to a real feeling, and blackface in comedy (played straight or 'ironic edgy' etc) is now effectively dead.

bondbond53

And thus we get introduced to Bobby #2 (technically Bobby #3 because there was a different kid in the Carousel episode photos from the past). I like how the girls didn't even notice. This is Sally's world and we all live in it

Kara

Trudy #2 is the goat!!! (im gonna ruin the joke and say this is NOT a spoiler, pete had a photo of a random woman as his wife in the pilot)

bondbond53

Oh yes I think that's a photo of Weiner's young mother?

Chris Truex

Oh, sure, that is important context to include, 100%. I just have zero expectations that the people calling the shots at Netflix were doing so out of a sincere desire to combat racism :D And I go back to my "this is more racist than the episode was" thought, because it shows that they really didn't grasp what the actual issue was, and were trying to appease, not actually investigate the concerns of POC.

bondbond53

An important bit about Pete and Trudy's dance routine is that it shows their privileged upbringing - the popular Charleston dance would be a mainstay at every country club frequented by only the elite. It was the top dance of their parents’ generation. They definitely took dance and etiquette classes that would prepare them for high society events, including debutante balls. In their positions it was expected you knew all ballroom dances and wouldn't embarrass yourself In this instance as well, you can see how carefree they are in the country club setting of this wedding whereas people such as Harry and his wife feel out of place because they did not have access to these establishments growing up. They are old money (quiet luxury as the kids say on TikTok lmao). Throughout the show we see how much more aware Pete is of these small subtleties of old money WASP East-Coast society. A nice little link to Paul's storyline this episode

Erik D

A little bit of background: they mentioned the New York governor Nelson Rockefeller marrying Happy for love. This was very shortly after both had gotten divorced and had been involved in an affair that was an open secret. Rockefeller was the presumptive front-runner for the Republicans in 1964, and the marriage was an act of hubris that ruined his chances for the nomination. Instead, it was the arch-conservative Barry Goldwater who rode a wave of grassroots insurgency against party elites to the nomination. However, events led to a landslide defeat in the general election, but this was later seen as a fundamental victory for the conservative movement.

Kara

funny to think there was a time when being "divorced" could seriously dent your political ambitions...... different times 💀

Kara

Very good point. I looked it up yesterday and the charleston dance became popular in the 20s, so its literally like a hand-me-down throwback thing that makes all the 50+ year olds happy cuz it reminds them of being teens 30-40 years ago doing the charleston. To build on your point about Pete v Harry, Mad Men does a ton of subtle worldbuilding including showing us Trudy and Pete live in a relatively expensive apartment w/ a beautiful view that Trudy's parents paid for, whereas Harry and Jennifer live in a boxier cheaper apartment we've seen a couple times. It's also interesting to think about Ken in this context, as a couple times he's spoken about his more humble working class beginnings (+ he has a sort of mid-century american writerly americana persona too) but unlike Harry he doesn't seem ashamed by it, and the result is he's got the same job as Pete even though he has none of the money or WASP-y New York privilege. So you have Pete who is WASP-y and leans in, Harry who isn't WASP-y but leans out, Ken who isn't WASP-y and leans in, and Don who isn't WASP-y and almost never talks about it. Just as a final little thing there's a throwaway line where Trudy and Betty both say they "grew up in clubs like this", which immediately connects them - Trudy is from a similar background as Betty but like ~8 years younger.

Kara

pete is never beating the mommy issue allegations

Eric Viola

Really good point, I had no idea that their dance was a distinct type of dance at all lol. I would add that though they both had rich families and had wealthy upgringings, one distinction between the two is that Pete is a true WASP, blue blood, old money upbringing whereas Trudy's family is nouveau riche (you can sort of tell by the mannerisms of Trudy's father vs Pete's father/mother).

Kara

Great reaction, another great example of how dense these eps can be. Mad Men really knows how to use every second of a ~47 minute runtime. I like the context of the party and how 'everyone knows everyone', Roger knows this "henry francis", lots of important business people are there hence Don tells pete "dont hand out your card" cuz its cringe, you're supposed to organically meet people and form connections. The man at the bar tells Don: "It's different inside", which is something only outsiders like them would know. Privilege is not even realising how easy you have it being born 'inside', rather than being outside and having to fight, charm, earn or gamble your way in. By 1963, the popularity of blackface 'minstrel shows' had almost fully declined in the US and by the end of the decade (with the rise of civil rights etc) it will be effectively dead. So Roger doing this is already a sort of cringe racist throwback, in an alternate universe he's saying "everything is so woke these days, you can't even put on a bit of shoe polish and sing a song any more 😩". When you rewatch the scene you see that the only two people visibly uncomfortable are Don and Pete, which is interesting, though we don't know if Don is more disgusted by the blackface or Roger + Jane being "foolish" 💀 I replied elsewhere but the removal or editing of media featuring blackface was a response to the 2020 George Floyd protests, you can find that comment for more context. tldr I agree that pretending racism didn't happen within historical contexts is generally bad. Adding a disclaimer (which Netflix eventually did) is probably the right choice. I think people had a hard time discussing the show during S1 because we're poisoned by future knowledge, all the tiny details about character that we get over many seasons. Like as you say, your take on Paul Kinsey is now informed knowing he is a scholarship boy who abandoned his working class roots to sound educated, privileged, 'posh'. He lived in a cool converted apartment with the Black girlfriend, he smokes a pipe and imbibes rich cognac and quotes poetry etc. In S1 you said that Mad Men is about performance, and I think so far the show keeps proving that true. I also find disdain for scholarships so funny, to quote Roman Roy "Apparently we're meant to hate Peter because he was smart enough to get a scholarship, and bought his own furniture." rich people are a different species fr. Bonus thoughts: Maybe im cooked but Betty letting a stranger touch her pregnant belly felt more intimate to me than Don fingering Bobbie Barrett in the Lutece bathroom 😭 Olive is a great example of economic character development, you understand her completely within like 2 scenes. Picturing Pete and Trudy rehearsing the charlston routine always makes me laugh, though they probably just know it from growing up in rich white circles. Don vaulting the bar and rizzing up a stranger while mixing the worst neon cherry muddled mid-century old-fashioned ever is deeply enjoyable.

Julien

Would Betty have grown up in a club like this? Seems like quite a bit above her station, judging by Gene and his house. The Hofstadts did well for themselves and groomed Betty to be married by the kind of guy that's in clubs like these or would end up there some day. But I don't know if they themselves (so child Betty) would have had this kind of access. I'd think Betty's social elevation to a place like that came from Don's $$$.

Biberius Caldius Mero

It looks like Gene is having Sally read "The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire" by Edward Gibbon, a late 18th century classic. Certainly a strange and difficult book to read for a nine (?) year old. (Makes me wonder: Has religion ever come up with Don or Betty?)

Kara

@Julien: I'm actually listening to the commentary now because I was curious (particularly about Trudy saying she grew up in a club like this, when we know she's newer money) but Matthew Weiner spoke as if Betty did grow up in a club like this (and they said nothing about Trudy) so I think we can take it at face value. Maybe her mother had some connections.

Taya

Hate it when my dads Roger and Don are fighting :(

Julien

In the US, this episode comes with a warning about a depiction of racism. These warnings are irritating and infantilizing. I'm a black man who spent much of summer 2020 in the streets of NYC in rage and grief, and I roll my eyes at stupid shit like this. This is *not* what we were demanding.

bondbond53

the girls are fighting

Erik D

A real masterpiece and also the inspiration for Isaac Asimov's Foundation series.

Sebastian

Infantilizing is exactly the word for it. As if adults are so unable to handle something possibly unpleasant that they need to be warned beforehand, lest their pearls fall to the floor and go just everywhere.

Oslo

Mad Men frequently used these kinds of literary and historical references to add layers of meaning. Notice that when Sally is reading the book, Roger performs in blackface at his country club, Roger's generation can't see their own flaws or change with the times, just like the Romans couldn't.

Alex Bernier

Gene was definitely of that sort. He owned his business (his son works for him) and he drives a Lincoln (Almost 2x the price of Don's Cadillac, the most expensive car on sale at the time.) Plus he also had a summer house in an old money summer house area (forget which one. Providence or Connecticut, or something.)

Thomas Fahey

Every vignette in this episode smacks you in the face with class; what is it, who has it and who doesn't. People hold their noses at Roger's behavior not so much because it's racist, but because it's déclassé.

Kara

Matthew Weiner said at the start of the episode commentary that the entire episode is about class. Also that the blackface scene was an anecdote from a real 60s country club and that it didn't stop in the 60s 😩

Kara

@Alex: Yeah, I'm also now thinking if Trudy's parents got into the country clubs when she was a little girl she would have still "grown up" in them. Pete said her dad was the "youngest exec at Vix chemical" ever, so he could have joined as a guest because his coworkers loved him so much then got membership, if Trudy was even like 8 or 10yo she would have spent her whole teenage years coming up in the clubs, debutante, proper schooling etc.

Thomas Fahey

From the opening scene of the series it lurks in the background..

La Baanga

I just remember it's what George and Mary were dancing when the dance floor opened up underneath them.

TylerNorCal

L&M reactions to The Rehearsal by Nathan Fielder would be amazing 😂

TylerNorCal

Really does say something about us that we remove and decry an episode where a guy stupidly paints his face and sings a song...but it was fine that we watched a woman get raped by her fiance on the floor a few eps ago. Obv there's heavier weight and context to both but I'm just making the point...it's ridiculous smh. Great episode nonetheless.

Julien

I denounced the trigger warning and censorship of this episode below as someone who that is supposed to protect. But it wasn't just a guy "stupidly painting his face and singing a song" and *you know it*. Your intentional attempt to minimize blackface is gross, but entirely consistent with the tenor of your previous posts about this show. The funny thing is that if they had posted a trigger warning about the rape, you would be here bitching that too.

Mike

Roger's performance (and the reaction to it) is fascinating because even he knows that it's a throwback. This is a Kentucky Derby party; there's an intentional antebellum cosplay vibe to the whole affair, and he's putting on this show as the centrepiece. The party gives a permissible framework for the racism the same way that Halloween does for other racist costumes. I guess what I'm getting at is the contrast between Roger's actions here ("fun" and "in on the joke") versus more direct instances of racism in the show, like Joan insulting Kinsey & Sheila or Gene accusing Carla of stealing his money... It reminds me a little bit of the "Joan reads scripts for Harry" story last season. There, Roger was totally in the dark to Joan's involvement (and interest) in the job. He made the decision to hire a man because... why would a secretary want that job? It was a kind of soft misogyny -- not as overt and immediately gross as Harry asking the Patio model to do another spin for the guys in the office -- and the without-a-second-thought nature of the decision actually underlined pervasive culture of misogyny in the office and time period. This is certainly the most *memorable* example of racism in the show to-date, but it's not directed at anyone specifically. There's no real malice to the act. I don't think viewers really hold it against Roger going forward. (The main takeaway from the scene is that he's being foolish, like Don says.) But like the unconscious mysogyny in the Joan/Harry story, it's the cavalier attitude here, by Roger and by 99% of the guests at the party, that feels worse than Gene outright accusing Carla of stealing his money.

Mike

The Pete / Harry contrast is funny, because a lesser show could make it a story about how money doesn't buy happiness -- it's the (comparatively) poorer Harry & Jennifer, with their loving marriage and their newborn baby, who are *really* happy. But nope, Mad Men makes it about how, actually, there are many ways to be sad and disillusioned with life! Everybody want what they don't have, even if they already have it great.

Mike

Don thinks Roger is making a fool of himself. He thinks that because Roger is doing things he considers embarrassing: blackface, singing for his wife, being "conspicuously happy". It's not *just* the racism, is my point.

Mike

Lol at the pre-show conversation trying to guess why this episode was "banned". Sorry girls, you aren't going to predict this one. Lots to love in this episode: I'll shout out the incredible whiplash of Pete & Trudy dancing into Kinsey reciting Eliot. That's how you do it, folks. Some extra credit reading on the Kentucky Derby, minstrel shows, racism, and the song that lends this episode its name: "In South Africa they don’t sing songs about apartheid before a cricket game,” Bingham says. “In Germany they don’t sing songs about the Holocaust before a soccer match. How did it come to have this kind of weight in our sport and our state?” https://www.si.com/horse-racing/2022/05/06/once-again-churchill-downs-will-ignore-the-racist-ties-to-my-old-kentucky-home

Kara

Good points! The missing piece is essentially what you said in the beginning: that the country club crowd know that the minstrel show can only take place within the all white members, guests + workers country club environment with no cameras, journalists etc. They know it would be distasteful if a random Black person saw them doing this, that it would be a newspaper article and that's why it takes place in private here. On the commentary Matthew Weiner says that this event was a real anecdote from a step-father of one of the crew, and he said the sort of thing kept taking place at the clubs for many years, long past civil rights into 80s, 90s, even 00s, and he said the main reason to include it wasn't to shock the audience or to "do it for doing it" but because "it happened" and he wanted to highlight in this episode about class that these so-called 'classy' people also painted their faces black, sung these songs and laughed and clapped along. Shakespeare was fart jokes and rich WASPs thought blackface was peak "olden days" comedy. I'm basically just rewording what you're saying here lol but I doubt Roger or most of the guests even think this is "racist". They know its considered "not okay" but in a sort of "you can't say anything any more", "I should be able to say the n word when I rap", "its tradition its not meant as an insult!" sort of way. A racism of willful ignorance as opposed to an aggressive, active white supremacy. Roger is racist but he's not, so far as we've seen, a white supremacist... though it'll be hard to tell the difference sometimes. ROT 13 spoilers: Jr jvyy yngre frr Ebtre unccvyl jbex jvgu Fuveyrl gb gur cbvag bs orvat fnq fur'f abg wbvavat jvgu uvz, naq Wbna jbex jvgu / erfcrpg / orsevraq(?) Qnja. Bs pbhefr guvf vf n cebsrffvbany jbex frggvat qhevat gur punatvat fvkgvrf naq enpvfgf pna "unir Oynpx sevraqf" boivbhfyl ohg vg fgvyy ervasbeprf lbhe cbvagf nobhg gurve enpvfz orvat n qvssrerag sbez gb gung bs bgure punenpgref jub jbhyqa'g funxr n Oynpx crefba'f unaq.

Mike

It's also a tacit approval of all the other instances of racism, sexism, homophobia, etc in the series so far. No, *this* episode is objectionable. Everything else is just fine. Having said that, it would be funny if HBO added a disclaimer about "historical racism" at the start of every episode single of The Sopranos or something. "The early 2000s were a racist time and place. Thank god we're past that, right?"