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Mad Men 3x13 Reaction (Patreon)

Published:
2025-10-23 18:22:05
Edited:
2025-12-06 19:36:09
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

this is our super bowl

Files

mad men 313

________________________ patreon - https://www.patreon.com/LMreactions twitter - https://twitter.com/LMreaction tv time - lola - skysstillblue, milena - oneofthe100

Comments

Zosko1

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyy

My Toasty Toast

Someone call a wellness check on them, they’re never this early

Zosko1

It's the one we've all been waiting for+

Erik D

Yes, us fellow yuros really appreciate these early releases.

priscilla

So early?? Not complaining tho! Thank you <3

My Toasty Toast

If there was ever an episode of any show to exist that needed to be edited/rewatched immediately, this is a good one

Jay Craig

I checked patreon almost as a joke to myself, there was no way it'd be up yet, AND YET

cheech

lol i’m in the middle of Oklahoma on hour 3 driving by myself, but i just pulled I into the Dairy Queen to watch this in the parking lot

Jude’s IFs

The creator said that Don telling Peggy that he would spend the rest of his life trying to hire her is his way of telling her he loves her and I think it’s so fitting for them

Alex Bernier

Omg. It's here. I've been waiting for this the last 2 seasons 😅

Zosko1

I wish I could relive watching this for the first time. Thank you for letting me do something like that with you!

PartyKitteh

I can't wait for your reaction to season 4, this is the first time I ever paid for someone's Patreon, but you really deserve it. This reaction was incredible! <3

Sebastian

NOW we can all gush about how amazing this episode is. The show does match it at points, but I never think it tops it. It's Mad Men at its absolute best. And then the energy actually carries over into season 4 which just keeps serving up banger after banger.

Griffen Rosado

A fun nod to the Kennedy assassination here. When Don and Bert enter Roger's office, Jane is talking with Roger about an interview a Secret Service agent provided about JFK's death, and Roger offhandedly mentions that she's obsessed with a book depository, which was the vantage point where Oswald took his shot at him. However the location of that depository in relation to the car he was sitting in has been a constant point of debate regarding JFK's Assassination, so Jane being an early Kennedy conspiracy theorist is quite amusing.

Cobalt

I loved the difference between Don and his dad when it came to doing business. When their back was against the wall, Don's dad lashed out at those around him and it ultimately led to his demise. Don on the other hand works best when he's pressed, instead he worked with those around him to get out of the contract jam. He even put aside his ego to work with people like Pete and Peggy who he knows he needs.

Rok

I think Don seeing Trudy and Pete having a real partnership made him realize he could never give this to Betty and he decide to give her a call. Anyone knows what is something terrible that happened and is gone, a think that Don says to Peggy?

Mark M

He's talking about the JFK assassination. Saying that Peggy understands that nothing will be the same again.

Taya

I always thought he was referring to her traumatic experience (having a baby and giving it away). Don relates to her because he's also experienced trauma. He believes they are both able to connect to people's deep desires and longing to return to their previous selves, or ideal selves, through advertising. Peggy's pain is part of what makes her talented.

Kara

Don isn't talking about the JFK assassination, he's talking about what happened to him in Korea and Peggy giving a child up for adoption. These events fundamentally shattered the idea of who each of them were - they are points of no return. Peggy summarises this herself in S2: “Well, one day you’re there... and then, all of a sudden... there’s less of you, and you wonder where that part went, if it’s living somewhere else outside of you. And you keep thinking... maybe you’ll get it back. And then you realize... it’s just gone.” Don cannot go back to being someone who never got his LT killed then stole his identity, and Peggy cannot go back to being someone who didn't give away a child. Both of them have learned to move on from this (Don directly guiding Peggy on how to) but it still clearly haunts them, and Don's belief is that this separation and self-awareness allows them to create ads that resonate with people more on a deeper level. Perhaps because they are both now on the outside, looking in... they know the version of themselves they wished they were and they know how to sell it to people.

Kara

@Rok: (i replied with my thoughts above)

Kara

An important detail is Archibald lashed out at people + refused to sell as a collective AND THEN was forced to sell anyway, so it was completely pointless, just like his fellow co-op members suggested. It was both stupid, selfish and ultimately pointless: even if he didn't get kicked by a horse he would still have to sell, likely at an even lower rate than the coop got.

Kara

Welcome! Thanks for supporting! I can only imagine how fire your 14 episode binge was 😭

JBK405

The name of the new agency is "Sterling Cooper Draper Pryce", named for Roger, Bert, Don, and Lane. Pete is a partner, but they said that putting his name in the company would be something for him to work for in the future. Reno (Nevada) allows "no fault" divorce, so you don't need to prove anything. In New York, like the lawyer said in the beginning, the government will only recognize a divorce in the event of adultery, abandonment, and other such things. Going to Reno allows them to just say "I want out" instead of legally getting one of them on the record as having broken the "rules" of marriage. Don's original attempt to recruit Peggy is one of my favorite moments in the series, because Peggy is correct that Don DIDN'T ask her to go with him. He just assumed she would go along when he mentioned it was happening. Don does honestly respect Peggy, but he is so narcissistic and misogynistic that his respect isn't enough to break past his hangups. It's such a perfect encapsulation of their entire relationship. And that's why it's so great to see him finally admit (some) of these things later and make a (mostly) honest plea for her to come along. Most people view Don granting Betty an easy divorce as a moment of humanity and kindness for him. But there's a minority of the audience who view it as a much more selfish and calculating move: he wants their marriage ended quickly so she can't claim any of the new agency. That Don realizes if they divorce NOW, then she can't get any of the profits or ownership like she would if the divorce drags out and the new company is successful. This is definitely a much smaller-held perspective, but it's out there.

Sebastian

It's definitely up for debate exactly what Don refers to, and I think it's meant to be somewhat abstract. But I always saw it as having to do with how people were generally feeling throughout the 20th century, like everything stabilizing was torn away and replaced with alienation and unmooredness. The terrible thing is whatever shattered your illusions, either on a personal level like with Don and Peggy, or on a societal one, like WW2 or the JFK shooting. Advertising taps into people's longing and need for comfort, and desire to return to some imagined state of safety or wholeness. It's something Peggy instinctively gets, unlike someone like Paul.

Mark M

I rewatched this last night in preperation lmao. Love how much they enjoyed it. I love seeing Pete and Peggy get their due from Don. I think Don was being sincere to Pete. He was unfairly overlooked on the aeronautics and admiral tv work. Joan coming back and Lane standing up for himself are great moments too. Real getting the band back together episode. Harry is just a good example of how you make yourself indispensible at a company. Better to be the only media guy than the second creative or account man, as Paul and Kenny found out. I also love how they're fully on board the Roger Sterling train. Next season is my favourite too so plenty more to come!

Taya

I don't really buy that last point. Don doesn't care about money and has never been shown to be particularly greedy or calculating. I fully believe he would take care of Betty & the kids and give her whatever money or share of assets he's required to give, or even voluntarily if she simply asked him. (despite his line "You won't get a dime", he only said that out of anger in the moment).

Mike

CHIP 'N DIP SIGHTING

Mark M

Interesting, I hadn't considered these interpretations. It does read to me like a statement on the last episode. Something terrible happened that changed the way people saw themselves. The episode ends with Peggy and Don alone in the office, their conversation over an upcoming ad suggesting she understands the deeper concerns over the tragedy. But I can see how it could be taken as a broader statement too. Each person has their own individual 'terrible' moment that changed how they saw themselves. It could even be intended as a double meaning in that sense.

Kara

how did i forget to mention this..... its a chip n dip... Trudy put dip in the middle and chips on the side... they got two...........

Kara

There is a 0% chance in my mind that Don had even one thought about Betty's divorce settlement when deciding to make that call. This is the man who gives out large sums of money for shits and giggles with basically no regard for it. Additionally there are cleaner mechanisms through which he could avoid Betty owning anything, and presumably the new agency will be legally established before the divorce is finalized anyway.

Kara

"Because there are people out there who buy things. People like you and me. And something happened, something terrible. And the way that they saw themselves... is gone. And nobody understands that. But you do. And that's very valuable." I don't like ranking seasons or episodes but if this isn't my fav ep, its certainly up there and the most memorable episode of the show. It's a stunning piece of television that fully delivers on 3 seasons, 3 years, 39 episodes of build up. It might be flawless. When I was imagining the "never ever gonna happen" LM Mad Men reaction, this is the episode I pictured. You're not even halfway through the show yet 💀 The angry Don / Betty scene hurts to watch but it's ultimately toothless because as Betty herself implies, all she needs to do is call the cops/army and tell them Don Draper = Dick Whitman and its over for him. Their marriage isn't even legal, I'm sure Henry knows people in the justice department. He has zero leverage except soft power over the kids + knowing Betty doesn't actually want to send the father of her children on the run / to jail. Don's scene with Peggy is the highlight for me and I cry every time. Imagine how validating that must feel to hear, when she has absolutely nobody else in her life who will even acknowledge the trauma that happened to her. But there's Don, this talented genius, and he's not just saying you're good and he needs you, he's saying he understands you on a fundamental level... your trauma is real and its the fuel for your fire. She probably already knows this on a deeper level too, we've seen her reacting with kids, with Trudy etc. Duck can offer her jobs with more money + prestige but not true synchronicity and understanding. I honestly don't have much else to say. It's just a really great episode and a great reaction. Bonus Thoughts: It feels like Roger went along with the plan just to be friends with Don again lmao, they're teenage girl best friend coded fr. Conrad is annoyingly right: Don built an amazing career from nothing, but he never actually built a company, he just worked there. Here we get our unfortunate validation that yes, Harry is good enough at his job for Bert Cooper to decide to bring him as Head of Media. On Discord we were discussing if there's ever been a show set in a workplace for multiple seasons and then all the main characters quit, we couldn't think of one.

Taya

it's practically four of something!

Julien

Why so much contempt for Harry from our reactors? What baffles me is that they constantly claim Harry is useless and talk about him having "invented his job" as a bad thing. Whereas the reality of course is that having the vision to anticipate the future of this industry and creating a department to address is the opposite of useless - it's a brilliant thing. That's what any business wants in their employees and executives. The answer to my first question (why the Harry hate) is actually very simple: Joan. Our reactors blame Harry for having temporarily accepted Joan's help with TV scripts, without recognizing her supposed brilliance. But that's not Harry's fault. it was a temporary assignment and the firm was always gonna hire someone else to do it so she could return to her job - office manager. This, is what the Joan glaze creates: apparently, anyone who "stands on her way" is useless and bad somehow. 🤷‍♂️

Kara

I've never interpreted it any other way but I see how you could. I legitimately don't think either of them would be basically crying if Don wasn't in some way talking about their shared trauma and what they know about each other.

Mike

I think that's a little unfair. Harry is a bit of a joke and the show treats him that way. That's why he's the one calling up because he can't remember the hotel room number. Now, that's not the *only* kind of storiy we get with Harry, because the show great and isn't interested in painting its characters with only one brush, but he is not supposed to be anyone's idea of a forward-thinking advertising genius. (I agree that they're little biased towards Joan, but everyone has their favourites #PeteCampbellForever)

Mike

Well, he's talking about a few things. He's talking about Kennedy, obviously. This episode is taking place a month after the 60s version of 9/11. Of course he is talking about that. But he's also talking about Korea, and Peggy's baby, and his divorce, because that's how the show operates. The historical moment blows up, the agency blows up, Don's life blows up. Something terrible happens, and he needs Peggy to move forward.

Mike

Something I'm wrestling with: The show really hammered the point that Don signing that contract was equivalent to him signing his freedom away. And then, as soon sit becomes an issue, he just... easily wriggles out of it like a genius? That aside, this is obviously a thrilling episode and one of the best of the series. I especially love that "Who the hell is Henry Francis?" scene. That's not a side of Don that we see very often, and it's really not a side of Betty that we see very often. That's much closer to the "Whitecaps" breakup that people were expecting in Episode 311. Don is terribly cruel towards her -- of course Gene wakes up crying when he calls her a whore, that's called writing, folks -- but, like all good arguments, there is a kernel of truth there. Betty was building a life raft. Henry didn't "trap" her with his offer to provide for her; she was never going to divorce Don and go it as a single mother. She was looking for a new version of the life she already has, because that's all that she knows. Sidenote: In all the talk about at-fault divorce, it's worth remembering that, even if Betty and Henry haven't sealed the deal yet, she did cheat on Don in the S2 finale. Not that it wasn't deserved, but (if I'm understanding the lawyer correctly) it would technically disqualify her from divorcing Don in NY based on *his* adultery. Now, there isn't proof of either case, which is apparently required, but from a psychological/character standpoint, I do think that matters. Anyway I think it's obvious why this is considered the end of one "era" of the show. The first three seasons of Mad Men are incredible, but when I think of this series, I think of the post-SC era. Can't wait for what's to come. Edit: Coming back after watching the discussion. Regarding the Pete,, yes, they knew/assumed that he was planning to leave Sterling Cooper. Don and certainly Roger have been in the business long enough to know that, when you pit two employees against each other for a promotion, you'd expect the loser to be disgruntled. So on top of the character dynamic stuff with Don (which is also a factor), that's why they go to him: They know he is already prepared to leave and to bring his clients with him. (And some of the clients might even be prepped for it, too.) Roger asks what Pete already has in his saddlebags. There is an expediency to bringing along the guy who is packed and ready.

on crip ...

he's simply boring and crucially deeply uncool

Kendall Roy 🇧🇷

Don is many things, but he would never leave Betty and the children helpless, and he would never use money against her. The only two times he made any reference to financial power in relation to her were on two specific occasions when they were fighting and hurting each other with words. Otherwise, there was never any indication that he would take this kind of action.

Julien

Lots of reasons are being given but the Kennedy assassination is *obviously* a critical part of it. They are advertisers. A terrible thing happened (Kennedy) and few people understand how to handle that (Peggy's trauma) and "that's very valuable" (advertising). Don is telling Peggy that she isn't just an exceptional copywriter but that her trauma can help them contribute to (and profit from) the national therapy that is needed. Harnessing emotions for profit is the very essence of American capitalism.

Kendall Roy 🇧🇷

So much happened in this episode that Don's scenes with his father are somewhat overlooked, but it's one of my favorite moments. The way he makes a different choice than his father did regarding their respective businesses was quite interesting and also revealed another trauma he's living with: seeing his father die in front of him. as Milena has already mentioned in some reviews. I also can't see how he could even begin to deal with everything he went through, and precisely the fact that he doesn't deal with it makes him incapable of being a present father and a good partner.

Julien

"but he is not supposed to be anyone's idea of a forward-thinking advertising genius" - yet he was exactly that, a forward thinking executive, which is exactly why they brought him onboard. So yelling at him and saying he is useless is completely nonsensical. If he were, they wouldn't have brought him. Harry is not necessarily a sympathetic character but that doesn't make him some useless dolt whose contributions are mystifying. That's what our reactors seem to think and it's flatly and objectively wrong. Anticipating the future and creating your own department to handle it is brilliant, actually. I can't believe I'm having to explain this.

Chris B

omg, an episode so good we got a caption!

Mike

Harry is failing upwards. That's the main character trajectory here. He accidentally invented his job, didn't realize that PPL promoted him, didn't understand why Bert called him into the office, and just became Head of Media at the new firm by default. I'm not saying that he's a totally unsympathetic character (or that he doesn't have some good instincts, as the abortion episode showed) but the show simply isn't trying to tell a "Harry is an under-appreciated business guy" story.

Julien

I'm pretty sure the broad consensus is that this is the best episode so far. Remarkably, the consensus is also that the best episode is yet to come. Three seasons in, how amazing is that.

Mike

@Bernardo Yeah, I think an important factor here is that, despite his philandering, Don loves Betty. Granted, he loves her in a weird, broken, impossible way. And he doesn't treat her well. But this divorce is shattering for him. He lashes out because he's angry. He calls her and relents because he's sad.

Mike

@Juien and the essence of the show! Urpx, vg'f gur svany fprar bs gur ragver frevrf. Lrf, V unir na (V guvax?) zber plavpny ernq ba gur svanyr guna zbfg.

Mike

I'd like to take this opportunity to hype up the S4 premiere as one of the top 92 episodes of the series. (I actually do think it's great.)

Julien

Well, Don was fired. Presumably the contract allows for this. That said, much like the season 2 finale with Duck, this episode is an enormity from a legal perspective. You can't just steal company property and go create your own firm. PPL would have immediately sued our wayward partners and by the end of the week (and nowadays, literally by Tuesday), a judge would have issued an injunction grinding the new business to a halt while the rest is sorted out. That's just not how any of this works. But this is a TV show, so we go with it. 🤷‍♂️

Julien

Having the vision to anticipate the direction of the industry and creating a department to address it is the opposite of failing. You don't have to like Harry (I agree that recently he's been portrayed as an oaf) but I don't understand how you don't understand this.

Mike

Well, he was fired because he thought of the genius plan of getting fired. Anyway I'm not worried about the legal practicalities of it so much as I'm saying that, thematically, the show treated the contract like Don was signing away his freedom. Now, only a few episodes later, I'm not sure it tracks thematically how easily he frees himself from the situation.

Julien

An external, cataclysmic event (the sale of PPL) changed the rules of the game and opened up new possibilities that make the existing constraint an obstacle that could be overcome. Thematically, that's a well-worn narrative convention that was brilliantly executed here.

Kara

Harry was the sole hiring manager for the role he replaced Joan on and he hired the brother of a friend of his who had zero experience. It's in the dialog, but also confirmed on the 2x8 commentary this it was a pure nepotism hire. The actual answer is not "Joan Glaze" 🙄 it's that the show has shown us Joan being good at her job more than it's shown Harry be good at his. Harry does make up his job... "anticipating the future" is a very charitable way of saying he stole the idea from other agencies without understanding what the job actually does. This lack of understanding creates the Joan situation in 2x8 because he didn't even know he was supposed to be reading scripts. His fuck up is then rewarded with a direct report (which he did a nepotism hire for). The next thing we see him do is get randomly promoted during the PPL re-org, even he is shocked. He textually fails upwards. Really, the only "good work" we've seen Harry do on screen is pitch the initial controversial abortion ad slot to Belle Jolie, which got him the TV job. After that he's quietly working. We've seen Peggy, Pete, Don even Ken etc all be objectively great at their jobs. If the show wanted us to think Harry was amazing it should have showed him be amazing. Examine how the girls feel about Ken now compared to S1, and he's not even a character we follow. Bert brought Harry on board the new company because they need a media person that they trust. Harry is there, immediately available (if Lane fires him), is familiar with all the clients and vendors, and more importantly is easily controlled (they bully him on-screen into saying yes without calling his wife or leaking). I don't think he's bad at his job, but they need someone who can start buying ad space on Monday. What were the other options? Even if Harry sucked at his job, he wins by default. He is also obviously uncharming and sexist, a panicking fence-sitter in multiple situations, cheated on his wife (but told her tbf), did nothing when Lee Garner Jr called which led to Sal being fired, Pulled his wife off the dance floor out of embarrassment... the list goes on. The best thing he did all show is describe a cave painting. Really cool guy.

Mike

Respectfully, I don't think you have the right read on his character arc. I'll agree again that there is plenty of nuance here (particularly in stories with his wife) and that Harry isn't altogether a bumbling moron, but watch this and tell me that he isn't succeeding in spite of himself (a warning for any curious first-time watchers -- there are SPOILERS past the end of S3 beginning @ 2:50 of the video): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtK39O0LMJ4 Like, two seconds before he is (un)ceremoniously named Head of Television, he thinks he is getting fired for opening Ken's mail. That is not a tactical success.

Kara

+1 to above, people also just say deeply mean shit they don't really believe during heated arguments. don on the phone at the end is clearly in some state of regret.

Mike

An external event that the writers created, yeah. I don't think the show sucks; I just think that this might have been a touch too easy, considering the narrative weight that "Seven Twenty Three" gave to signing the contract. The episode is still terrific. I'm talking about a 10,000 ft view of the season as a whole.

Kara

Don coming up with the idea is the tip of the spear. The rest of the spear is built up over the season: PPL mistreating Lane yet giving him absolute authority, thinking he would never undermine them due to English class + culture beliefs. If Lane knows and is secured + feels valued or is staked in PPL, none of this happens. If Roger isn't desperate for "things to finally go back to normal", none of this happens. If Bert doesn't regret selling his company, none of this happens. Hell, if Don doesn't randomly woo Conrad Hilton in a bar, this doesn't happen. I don't personally feel that Don's freedom is earned unfairly because he is platformed by others.

Kara

seeing your mean abusive(?) dad get kicked to death by a horse at like age 6 or whatever would be enough trauma for a lifetime. then everything else happens to don 😩

Mike

@Kara That's fair. Like I said, I'm wrestling with it. "Don only gets freedom because he works with others" (i.e. Roger) is definitely what the show is saying -- that's why we get the Archie co-op flashback. I don't know, it just feels a little flimsy to me. Or maybe, because I love this episode so much, I wish they didn't belabour the point so much Seven Twenty Three? But of course they had to for this plot twist to work. It's a necessary evil to get this (great) episode, but I do think it's a little weak. After all, what did signing the contract really cost him, in the end? I guess Don's resentment over it kind of blew up his relationship with Hilton? But that was fucked already.

Kendall Roy 🇧🇷

that's why I'll never be able to hate my boy, it's so fucking tragic that all that's left is empathy

Kara

While it functionally ended up having little impact (actually probably helped, cuz otherwise Don would just leave lmao) it was an existential loss for Don. He gave in and ceded control. He took the ultimate spiritual L. Ur jvyy pneel guvf jvgu uvz sbe gur erfg bs gur fubj vzb, vg jvyy qevir uvz gb fvta gur rkgerzryl erfgevpgvir F7 pbagenpg naq nyy gung qenzn gung cynlf bhg.

bondbond53

That's a combination of such foreign words for someone European like me lol

bondbond53

Christmas came early this year lol On one hand, it's so fun seeing you girls reach these milestone episodes but on another hand I genuinely can't believe we're already on season 4. Time flies when you're watching quality TV. On that note, HOW can anyone say Mad Men is boring when you've got episodes like this. P.S.: Roger lowkey is the star of this episode what with agreeing to the plan, getting Joan back and dropping absolute banger jokes all episode. What a guy

Mike

V qb guvax gung gur eryngvir rnfr gung Qba rfpncrf guvf wnz shryf uvf oryvrs gung ur pna zntvp uvf jnl bhg bs cebsrffvbany ceboyrzf va shgher frnfbaf. Jr haqrefgnaq gung Qba fhpprrqf urer guebhtu grnzjbex. Ur... qbrfa'g yrnea gung yrffba. Gur boivbhf pbzcnavba gb guvf rcvfbqr vf "Sbe Vzzrqvngr Eryrnfr", jura ur naq Grq havyngrenyyl qrpvqr gb zretr svezf, juvpu fphccre gur VCB, naq vaivgrf Wvz Phgyre vagb gur ura ubhfr. Jr xabj ubj gung gheaf bhg.

Scott

Probably my favorite episode of the series (not saying the best, subjective)

Mike

It is darkly funny that Don's equivalent of saying "I love you " is "I want to hire you to work for me".

Taya

Ladies and gentlemen, I think we just witnessed a perfect hour of television.

Infode

Although we knew about Don's father's death, it just hits different seeing it happen. The ep. was so packed - phenomenal

Infode

Also I love how when describing the episode during the discussion part, LM use basketball analogies but in the video's subheading, its referred to as watching the superbowl 🤣😭

bondbond53

I'm sorry but I just genuinely didn't know Harry had shooters like that. Good for him I guess lmao

Eric Viola

Such a great ep and reaction. Mad Men is the only show for me that could pack so many great moments and story into one episode. The best. I always loved the way this episode ends with Don conceding the end of his marriage to Betty. As much as it was so obvious that Don's heart was not in his marriage, its end really is one of the most devastating moments of his life. Achieving his dream of an idyllic wife, kids, home that he thought so assuredly would make him happy to collapse because of his own actions is catastrophic for Don. That phone call contrasted with Don gazing adoringly at the new SCDP, closing with Roy Orbison's Shahdaroba, hinting at a venture of unknown possibilities couldn't make Don Draper's hobo side happier.

bondbond53

Omg it's like seeing a celeb

Thomas Fahey

This is the most fun I've had since the pigs ate my little brother.

Taya

Harry is unlikeable. It's as simple as that. If he'd shown any endearing qualities, the girls would like him regardless of his job performance.

bondbond53

This some 'Deadwood' shit

JJ

I think you just took the wrong thing away from that in terms of what the contract meant to Don. Or more so, what *not* having one meant and then being forced by everybody in his life to sign one.

JJ

“Out there” as in what? A Reddit comment with some likes? I know people see things differently, but it’s just really hard to imagine there were many people that came to that conclusion. While that is a byproduct of them getting divorced now instead of later, there is nothing in the show that would suggest that was Don’s intention. And it wouldn’t matter anyway, Betty is clearly taking Henry’s offer to take care of her and words of “not owing him anything” to heart.

Joseph G.

@bondbond53 If you ever wind up in the vicinity of a Dairy Queen, treat yourself to a DQ Blizzard.

LSTER

Ooh that will be a great series for them to watch after they finish Mad Men

Sebastian

Don signing the contract is to set up the fun Houdini breakout in this episode. This episode doesn't undermine that plot development, the plot development literally exists for this episode. The whole heist vibe wouldn't be as fun without the iconic "fire us" moment.

JJ

Whew. Don really bounced around the stages of grief this episode… From denial of him being the one to break up his family with his cheating and lies, to seemingly accepting it when he tells Roger he needs a lawyer and then anger when he infamously wonders “Who the hell is Henry Francis?!”. Deserved or not, it has to hurt finding out your wife is leaving you for another man... but probably even more so when you were just beginning to process her leaving you for entirely different reasons. Interestingly enough, the Don/Betty confrontation was a lot tamer than I remember it being. And it was still rough. Kind of amazing though that after all that build up, their entire divorce essentially took place in *one* episode. Don being afraid Betty wouldn’t love the “real” him was 100% a self-fulfilling prophecy caused by his own actions. But at the same time… was he wrong? The lie got bigger the more time went on, but there really was never a point in time a lie that big would have been an *easy* pill to swallow. You guys wondered how he was processing this and while Henry was a catalyst, Betty leaving him right after she finds out has to be top of mind. Betty is certainly a woman of her time shaped by her environment and upbringing, but relative to her time she has more agency than I think you guys give her credit for. She didn’t *need* to marry Henry. She wanted to. Between her half of her dad’s house and her divorce settlement (which she would have gotten if she wanted it) Betty would have been well off. But she never wanted to be Helen Bishop and she probably wouldn’t trade places with Peggy or Joan if she had the chance. Like you’ve said many times, it’s very easy to imagine Betty being happier if Don simply was a better partner and she felt connected to him. But like others have said, this is just a great episode. I wouldn’t even know how to rank it because I honestly feel the same way I do about this episode with at least 1/3rd of the show. But this one definitely stands out, just for the sheer amount of things that happen. The inevitable Don/Betty split. The end of Sterling Cooper and starting a new agency. Cementing the Don + Peggy bond. Pete getting his validation. Just a great culmination of 3 seasons of world building.

Jude’s IFs

It’s the best you’ll get from him haha

Alfie Harrison

And the fact that there are several arguably even better episodes than this is a testament to how much of a true masterpiece Mad Men is.

Taya

Finally, the prologue is over and now the real Mad Men begins. (just kidding... or am I? 🤔)

Kev
>>191378539

I was wondering when they would come around to finding Roger funny. I truly think all it took was noticing that he is funny once or twice, and after that point every line he says has made them laugh.

cheech

Spoiler Roger gets even funnier

cheech

Yeah that’s gotta be the most American sentence I’ve said in a while 😆

Isaiah

Honestly so true. S1-3 feels like a prelude on rewatch

Michael Hubbard

Also, to be pedantic, the ship has already sailed. The new company is already operating, and even in Reno it’s six weeks to establish residency. There’s no way for the divorce to happen without the new agency being potentially part of it.

Jenny D

End of an era ❤️ (and the start of a new one!)

Sebastian

Without a doubt. S1–3 are good, but the show definitely gets more lively and fun from here on out.

on crip ...

highkey on this rewatch, the episode feels like fan fiction (derogatory) and not good imo

on crip ...

gonna unbury my blasphemy subreply to see if anyone (dis)agree highkey on this rewatch, the episode feels like fan fiction (derogatory) and not good imo

Kara

you'll have to explain what you mean but no, it doesn't feel like "fan fiction" because it subverts a ton of expectations. Things that feel obvious and telegraphed on the rewatch were not obvious on the first watch to most viewers so it doesn't feel like it was "written by fans" at all. If you mean it's satisfying to fans, then..... i mean yeah. it's satisfying to see the culmination of several plots (and several years) play out on screen and it has a broadly hopeful tone. Something delivering on what you want in a satisfying way is good actually. How often do we even get that on television? Aren't we more often disappointed, let down, rug-pulled? "I wasn’t sure what to expect from the third-season finale of Mad Men. I know I didn’t expect the equivalent of the second season Alias episode “Phase One,” which in a tight, exciting hour essentially wrapped up all old business and created a new status quo. In fact, if you’d told me that going in, I doubt I would have believed you." Keith Phepps, AV Club: https://www.avclub.com/mad-men-shut-the-door-have-a-seat-1798207478 "Last night’s episode wasn’t just a culmination of the entire season; it was a culmination of the entire series to this point. Leave it to the creators of this show. Two weeks before the season finale they gave us an episode as shocking as any season finale and now for the actual season finale, they give us an episode that feels like a coda to the whole series. Every action taken by every character made complete and total sense for that character based on their experiences. Every story felt like it had naturally flowed to this place. They could have just titled the episode “Of Course.” It was an incredibly satisfying payoff wherein each character got to have a character-defining scene and various relationships were re-defined and re-affirmed while others were ended." Tom + Lorenzo, https://tomandlorenzo.com/2009/11/mad-men-season-3-episode-13-shut-the-door-have-a-seat-tv-reviews/

Sebastian

I don't think actually giving us a crowd pleaser of an episode is fan fiction. There's a tendency in a lot of prestige tv (or prestige media in general) to think that anticlimax and dashing hopes is more mature. Mad Men isn't immune to this either, which I think makes it all the more earned that something fun and exciting and optimistic is actually allowed to occur.

Kara

@Sebastian: I could go on a very long rant about how a desire in writer's rooms to create "unpredictable plots" that Reddit detectives can't guess, plus a general desire to subvert now well established prestige TV expectations, has generated some of the worst TV decisions of the past decade. Game of Thrones is the crowning example where the creators literally went on record saying it was for shits and giggles, but it filters down into so many shows in small and big ways. The Westworld creators were desperate to avoid twists being guessed by Reddit so ruined their own show by disregarding "the obvious things". Killing Eve went with an insane, retroactively series-ruining ending despite the books its adapted from having a perfect built-in ending they could have lifted wholesale. It's happening with Yellowjackets in realtime now. It's controversial but I think shows people enjoy, like Severance, The Boys, The Last Of Us, Handmaid's Tale etc, all suffer too. Writing satisfying television that delivers on promises isn't good enough any more, it has to be capital-C Clever and the sad truth is most tv writers aren't smart enough to do a Twin Peaks level artistic subversion that both undercuts and delivers..... because its really really really hard. Ya know what show people love? Breaking Bad. The show with an ending that many people predicted almost every plot beat of. 'Crowd pleasing' as a soft pejorative is always funny to me, like.... oh no, we pleased the crowd, we made millions of people happy! Noooo! /s

Julien

@Mike: I don't agree with your take at all as far as the contract and this episode go, but in retrospect, speaking ONLY of the contract, I can see where you are coming from: in essence, I think you would have liked an episode that demonstrates the constraints of the contract on Don (e.g., normally he would do X but because of the contract, he is forced to do Y), before this finale. And because we didn't get that, it feels like the contract that the show made such a big deal of, was "wasted" (given how easily Don overcame it in this finale). That certainly would make sense thematically, but I don't think the absence of such a development/subplot hurts the show. It's clear that for you, the contract was a set up for a further development. Can't say I really saw it that way. Anyway, just wanted to note that I think I understand your objection better now.

BobJ

I am having so much fun watching this show with these two