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Mount Rushmore - British Prime Ministers (Patreon)

Published:
2024-06-02 13:30:49
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

Andy Barnett is back with his show looking at getting the mountain-worthy faces from their fields recognised and set in stone.

In today's show he asks Rob Shorthouse and David Edgar to select their four candidates from the ranks of British Prime Ministers.

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Comments

Phileas Fogg 55

Great stuff lads, I'm really looking forward to this, although I would have really liked Martyn's input , ...never happy 😜

John Smith

Churchill Walpole Peel Wellington

Richard McLuckie

Ohh, a UK "Presidents" show .. should be a great listen

John Davidson

Hot take from Andy citing John Major as an example of a PM whose tine in office was categorised by economic stability! Black Wednesday says hello. Great show and, as someone who is on the leftist of the left, it is actually nice listening to very different perspectives from my own.

David Kiltie
>>139715831

Major’s premiership was defined by the chaos of Black Wednesday but the economic performance which followed was actually pretty good. In May 1997 Major could point to a mass of favorable data in terms of healthy growth, low inflation, falling unemployment, budget close to balance, trade position the same. Blair was very lucky- the perception of economic failure won him a landslide, whilst the reality of economic success meant his incoming government didn’t have to administer painful medicine. Bill Clinton was similarly lucky a few years earlier. He beat Bush Senior on the “it’s the economy, stupid” ticket. The recession under his predecessor was far shallower than thought and the US economy was growing at a healthy rate at the time of the 1992 election.

John Davidson
>>139715831

Reminds me of the Day Today sketch where the swimming pool attendant is justifying the safety record following a death in the pool. "In 1992, noone died, in 1993, noone died, I'm 1994, noone died...in 1997, someone died, in 1998, noone died..."

David Innes
>>139715831

My recollection is that Blair’s victory was less to do with the economy and more about people generally being sick of the Tories and all the sleaze scandals, David Mellor etc

Heart and Hand
>>139715831

Yeah, it was. Blair seemed new and lively compared to a clapped-out government. And the same applied in 2010, when Cameron provided something new and fresh to take over from a Labour Government out of ideas. After a decade plus, parties need a spell in opposition. Just to re-energise.

David Innes

Whatever the opposite of Mount Rushmore is: Chamberlain Callaghan Johnson Truss

Heart and Hand
>>139742380

Lord North often gets mentioned, but he was dealt a bad hand. I always felt Asquith deserves more criticism than he gets.

Gregg

The greatest PM we never had - John Smith RIP

Alex Oliver

This made be think of Barney Gumble Lord Palmerston vs Pitt the Elder 😄

stevan castrissios

The mountain towering over Mt Rushmore, Everest (the bankers outlive and always win). I am curious about those, then and now. During the Thatcher era my family acquired a 2 bedroom terraced house. My dad haggled the price and terms with the council. He won, unthinkable today. Reading about tyrants, dictators that keep the peace, Ghadaffi (spelling) did so well for pulling his people out of poverty. So sad. Politicians (lower management when it comes to power, then and now) enabled this failed state and the consequences. Sorry this is a modern studies rant. Enjoyed your pod.

LD

As someone who is old enough to remember school milk, it was disgusting. It was a blessing when it was stopped. One of the good things that Thatcher did.

LD
>>139747714

John Smith is like one of our injured players, they get better the longer they don't play, Smith was just as good/bad as any other politician, nobody knows how he would have reacted to events if he was in power.

Moody Marco
>>139789280

My memories of school milk cartons in the 80s are being a) impossible to open; folding back the cardboard flaps and trying to pull forward the remaining cardboard, I was hopeless at it and b) a girl in my class in P3, whose dad was a farmer, bringing a spring lamb in one day for everyone to pet and we all fed our milk to it and it was the cutest thing ever, until the class nutter set about it with one of those pointy things you use for drawing circles

Moody Marco
>>139747714

I’m anything but a Labour supporter but for my money Smith was the last of his breed who were actually in politics for the right reasons

Gregg
>>139747714

He seemed like a man of integrity - we haven’t had a prime minister with that characteristic in a long time. But it’s a fair point that it’s easier in opposition than in power.

Andy Barnett
>>139715831

Mine too. Blair continued with many of the centrist policies that Major already had in place. Major, Heseltine and others had moved from the right into a more progressive 90’s, but as David says - folk just wanted a fresh change.

John Smith

Always feel sorry for Spencer Percival

Andrew Burnside

Great show as always. Need another History Boys show soon too. Btw anybody have any recommendation on good books on British PM’s? It is amazing that there are loads of books that go into great detail on the history of the American Presidents but not the same choice when looking at PM’s of Britain

Andy Barnett
>>139841483

There is a distinct lack of books covering the PM’s throughout our history save for Churchill, Thatcher, and all the 21st century ones with their biographies. Try ‘British Prime Ministers’ by Robert J Parker. I haven’t read it, but it’s on my list as I found myself asking the same question.

Heart and Hand
>>139841483

You are right Andrew, the lack of books on PMs is pretty shocking. For overviews, The Prime Ministers by Ian Dale and Gimson’s Prime Minister by Andrew Gimson are good starting points.

Martin Boyd

Great show but Thatcher really? For nothing else it is too close who knows where her policies will end up , just because the country needed change does not mean the way it was changed was correct.

Heart and Hand
>>139886857

That’s a matter of taste. The question is people who succeeded in the terms they set, which she did. She is unquestionably one of the most important leaders in UK history. Liking or disliking her isn’t a criteria for consideration.

Jim Milne
>>139886857

I was raised to hate Thatcher as a kid. It's only as you get older you can still despise her for the poll tax especially, but she is IMO great even by today's standards. Like her policies or not, she did what she said she would do. She didn't just say this to be elected and not follow thru. She followed thru on what she told the electorate what she'd do.

Martin Boyd
>>139886857

Leaving my own feelings aside, I just think she is too divisive a person to be considered.

Andy Barnett
>>139886857

Divisive she certainly was. But I made the point about Lincoln being divisive, given his presidency oversaw the Civil War and Emancipation. As was Washington. History remembers great leaders not because of their popularity but because of their convictions. Thatcher falls into that bracket 100%

David Mckenzie

Great show guys. Really enjoyed all of your insights and research into each of the PMs. Thanks

Graham Roy
>>139886857

It’s over 30 years since she stood down so fair to say there is a good enough amount of time to judge her. By the same argument would you argue Churchill couldn’t be judged as a leader until the 70’s ended?