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S7E29: Otter Things (Patreon)

Published:
2023-09-05 05:07:04
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

Bret Easton Ellis shares a festive Labor Day gift he received, talks about a terrible TV show he cannot look away from and recalls enjoying an unexpected treat at an unlikely location as he answers questions from Platinum listeners on the air.

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Comments

Neil G.

Thanks for answering my question. If anything, Adam, you hit the nail on the head when you said the BOMB EXPLOSION looks great in IMAX cause, honestly, that's what I was waiting for the whole time 😂😂...but, I will say: there's a lot to take in in terms of information, despite how directly it's presented, as it usually is in a Nolan movie. It's his maturest film, which is why Bret's probably feeling that way, not my favorite, as a lifelong fan of his films (and I mean it -- saw Batman Begins in a theater when I was 8 and it was the first dark movie I ever saw in a theater -- Scarecrow scared the crap outta me) and there's no way I'm personally taking it over The Dark Knight Trilogy...but I think it's one of those movies ya just gotta admire cause of how well made and mature it is. And I personally thought there was a bigness to the haunting, visionary flashbacks & the bomb, which made it "a drama that should play in IMAX". But I think regular movie screens should have more viewings, in a time where sadly IMAX is the only thing people (mostly) go to...and that usually means only 6 movies a year really being an event...that obviously needs to change... I thought there was something inadvertently woke about some of the statements particularly made by the little girl and the idea that patriarchy is "damaging and tyrannical" and all this stuff that seems to inadvertently tap into the most idiotic, pseudo intellectual version of feminism that a Cathy Newman or Helen Lewis may embody...and sadly have media positions...but I don't think the movie really "intended" that and it was a fun and, on a craftsman level, well put together movie. But the other problem was incoherence. It was a fun entertainment but as a work of art, it doesn't quite work, as its themes obviously don't come together well (so you could say it conveys how truly incoherent and illogical that pseudo-intellectual feminism is 😂😂, despite that not being the intention either) and the conceptualism is a little too ridiculous, particularly for a live action film...I think of it as "Last Action Hero" for girls. An Arnie movie from 1993 that just didn't come together as a commentary on machismo or the impact that action heroes have on little boys...especially because they kept shifting writers. This one kept Noah & Greta and STILL ended up being incoherent 😂😂...meh, they're hit or miss anyhow...in Greta's case, Lady Bird was too incoherent to be good, Little Women was wonderful, and Barbie was too incoherent to be good, but still fun. Tar was too ridiculous in ATTEMPTING to be ambiguous, and also inadvertently gave into woke BS. There is a fine line between something that is truly ambiguous & just trying to be, which is important to note. But Cate Blanchett gave a wonderful performance, as usual.

PETER GREER

Fantastic episode thank you….

OSOS

Thanks for answering my question Bret! The Guest was great, picked up The Girls and am excited to start that Was also pretty surprised how much I enjoyed Barbie, despite at the same time finding it’s feminist politics very commercial and hypocritical - don’t think there’s been a movie I’ve had that much fun with while watching while also slightly disagreeing with it I don’t think many non Gen Z or millennial listeners would like it but I thought the new teen sex comedy movie Bottoms was a much better summer comedy. It’s edgy and satirizes victimhood to a degree, while also having some feminist themes and making fun of those same themes at the same time.

Claude Henry Smoot

Sounds like you've been having a tough time Bret. Hope you're tracking alright.

Neil G.
>>116837466

why even say that to pseudo intellectualism though?? That legitimizes it...there is no "tyrannical patriarchy" and never has been...it simply doesn't work that way...not a school of thought but a FACT...on the other hand, I don't know if the movie really says there has been because it throws out the word "patriarchy" all the time, like a buzzword, and is very incoherent in what it's putting out...but anyway, there is nothing in legitimate feminism to disagree with and in pseudo intellectual feminism, it's simply wrong...feminism, in its legitimate form, is a trivial topic without much ambiguity, that can't have much disagreement and in its illegitimate, it simply wrong because it inherently is uncomplicated...unless you disagree on abortion, paid leave, the overall role of women in the workplace etc...

OSOS
>>116837466

I mean yeah, it’s take on patriarchy and depiction of how terrible men are is a bit stupid. And is 2000s Hilary Clinton (just put a woman in and the world will be better) feminism really the most important topic currently when suicide among young men is at an all time high and more and more are being corralled into dark incel like corners of the internet? Are we going to stop these terrible trends by reinforcing the idea that men are terrible - no… But at the end of the day it’s just a movie and it’s really not saying anything that seriously - it’s lighthearted and I guess you have to have some pretty dumbed down themes when it also has to be targeted towards children.

A B
>>116837466

I haven’t listened to this episode yet but chiming in to agree I loved The Guest and also immediately bought a copy of The Girls because I needed more of her writing. It put me in a hypnotic state.

OSOS
>>116837466

Yeah it was great, Bret does a great job talking about it. First book in awhile that I’ve flown threw. I was always put off by the girls bc of the cover (call me vain) but from what I’ve read so far it’s a great read too

Alex Waller

Thanks for answering the 27th City question. I'm not suggesting anyone will think this is Franzen's best book besides me and I fully recognize the greatness of his 2000's onward work. Just would be interested to hear people's thoughts as there is surprisingly not much discussion about it. Have been listening and enjoying the podcast since the podcast one days, but still cannot get any type of read on what modern films Bret will like or not like. I'm a big Greta Gerwig fan going back to her indy actress days but pretty much saw Barbie as her trying to launch the next phase of her career. I honestly didn't think the film really had a coherent story, and don't think they ever really weaved together the societal critique with Barbie's Vanilla Sky-esque journey to accepting real life and all of its imperfections over the artificial dream world. In terms of ideology, I think she pandered a bit(I've never really heard her take the bait in interviews where they try to get her to align with current causes of the day), and also offered some different viewpoints, but I'm not sure what it really added up to other than some funny jokes, which is cool enough I guess. Very surprising to hear Oppenheimer get slammed. These are the moments where I wonder if Bret is just simply impossible to please so we can stay with the film is dead and irrelevant narrative. I'm not saying it must be praised to the heavens or anyone has to act like it was the greatest thing ever. But it was a very encouraging sign that the movie experience is not dead and that they just need to make some better movies for people to return and see something other than cgi films. Overall this summer was pretty encouraging. Asteroid City did pretty well, No Hard Feeling had a respectable performance, Oppenheimer did amazingly well, and of course there is Barbie that while an IP was very much an individual(s) vision rather just something bland. Meanwhile, Flash, Blue Beetle, Indiana Jones, and Haunted Mansion all flopped. Fast X underperformed as well. We are reaching a certain absurdity with these films and the audience appears to be slowly dwindling while more original stuff is gaining a bit of traction.

Mr.Pink1996

Has Christopher Nolan ever been on?

richard owain roberts

am going to listen on my run. will say more later, after my run.

Ryan Dacko

Can't wait to hear Brett's take on Barbie. I took my daughters to it and all they talked about was Ken on the way home. Gosling pulled a Travolta and took the spotlight over. The feminist messaging flew over them like a stealth bomber, invisible and undetected. Looks like I have to get in line for Ken dolls to match their Barbie's this Christmas. Mattel walks away the winner along with Gosling, both stocks are up.

Pp358

What was the name of the book about the lady sociopath?

Jon A.

Oppy is a masterpiece! I’m glad Bret doesn’t agree though because it’s so enjoyable hearing him getting so worked up taking the polar opposite stance.

Alex Waller
>>116944002

That came across as more contrarian than sincere. It’s the first film since the pandemic to bring some hope back for film fans, and to challenge Bret’s notions that it’s all over. Rather than discuss any of that he just lashed out. Very Lame

Jon A.
>>116944002

I thought maybe like Tár he would soften on it with another viewing but he does seem very resolute here. I honestly had to see it 3x before it really clicked for me. Hard disagree that it skimps in the spectacle department, though. Also think it’s borderline ludicrous to declare Tenet superior. We haven’t heard the last of Bret’s Oppy thoughts since it’ll obviously be a major player around award time. I think there’s little chance Nolan goes home empty-handed that night. Director and/or Adapted Screenplay, book it.

Paul Richardson

I really like Abel Ferrara’s The Blackout (1997), which seems to me something BEE might dig.

Alex Waller
>>116944002

Haha yeah, the part of finding it so bad he had to get up and pace around the theater was ridiculous. Nolan’s done the auteur action thing to death and I really liked that this was more about people talking in rooms with Nolan’s cinematic touch on it. It was something new for him and fun to watch. Can’t believe after all the critique of cinema popularity / culture that he actively wanted to avoid talking about Barbenheimer. Don’t understand that

Casey

Re: Abel Ferrara, I’d love to hear Bret’s take on THE ADDICTION and NEW ROSE HOTEL. I’m a big Ferrara fan but I agree he’s wildly uneven. Those two however might be interesting for Bret if he’s never seen them. I also liked his recent TOMMASO quite a bit though I wouldn’t argue it’s his masterpiece or anything. I do think BAD LIEUTENANT is pretty close to perfect, but it’s a Ferrara kind of perfection which is inherently messy and flawed. It’s about the peaks he achieves in stretches of the films that you really don’t find anywhere else.

Bazayer

Bret's right - Abel Ferrara's DANGEROUS GAME is Madonna's best film performance. But Abel's best movie is definitely KING OF NEW YORK. I also think Bret is a bit of a closet Madonna fan......would be interesting to hear his take on some of her classic records.

Justin

Hope you're doing well, Bret. Thanks, as always, for the great podcast!

Darren Ankenman

Best director’s commentary on a dvd: the hilariously wasted junky ramblings of Abel Ferrara on Driller Killer. And re: last week. John Simon has many books compiling his hilarious and brutal film reviews.

Dave Mason

Who is Two Pack? LOL

David Morgan-Brown

Bret has got to watch the Ferrara films again, they're amazing, particularly Bad Lieutenant, Dangerous Game (as he mentioned), Mary, Welcome to New York, and his most underrated masterpiece, the Matthew Modine-starring The Blackout. Tremendous stuff.

Bobby Miller

Go see BOTTOMS! Would love to see what you think.

Lionel

Bret would you consider doing a twice weekly underground hip hop podcast. You could meet upcoming hip hop artists, visit their hoods, hang out with their friends and have dinner with their family. You could end each episode with you reading a chapter from one of your books over a hip hop beat and then have the guest jump in with a freestyle of his own. You could call it American Sky Yo!, reflecting the podcasts aspirational message. At the end of each season you could select one of these rappers to mentor and I think this could provide both a well needed healing moment for the nation and a fulfilling third act for your life/career.

Raymond Smith

Went to B-Bar summer of 2018 was great Brett is right felt like a club at time. Definitely the Premier intern bar.

Dan
>>116948783

Think Brett was mostly right about Ferrara but disagree that he doesn’t have a couple of great ones in him. The King of New York is definitely one. There are enough scenes in that movie to warrant a great tag but you’re right there is still a messiness and a wayward nature to it like all Ferrara but that’s part of the charm and ultimately part of the brilliance

Eric Macom

What’s the 60s LA book mentioned? I’m blanking!!

BUtterfield8

Regarding Antonioni, I can't believe Bret didn't mention one of my favorites, Red Desert. Check that one out for sure folks. I believe the issue with The Passenger was that there was fighting and Antonioni lost creative control for the edits. (This is from memory, so please correct me if I'm wrong.) So, there ended up being some gaps in the story, and the logic of the story. But, heck, see it for the amazing shots and brilliance that is there - including the amazing tracking shot at the end. I'm surprised Bret mentioned trouble sitting through this film. I never had that problem. If you enjoy the trilogy, it is a really trilogy + Red Desert in my mind, definitely seek out the earlier work which is also very enjoyable and interesting. Antonioni was still finding his more mature style, but there are a whole bunch of quite good films. The documentaries he did are also worth seeing.

Matteo Persivale

A treat to listen to BEE on Antonioni, marvelous; I generally agree with him 99% of the time but on Oppenheimer and Barbie I’m his polar opposite The Mirò/Moureau thing the sidekick came up with was just sad, though. Hope it was a joke, I’m not so sure.

N.M. Janice.

I love Antonioni. I even like the The Passenger and Zabriskie Point. I agree with BEE on Opp. I’ve never been a big Nolan fan, and this one kinda sealed it for me. I found it to be a very boring, conventional and mannered film. I also thought they spent way too much time on the trial and the communism angle. I don’t share his enthusiasm for Barbie. The reaction to this film really baffles me. I didn’t hate it. I just found it a more or less run of the mill summer comedy, and it’s so preachy and on the nose. I mean you literally have characters delivering monologues on like freshman year feminism. Maybe a need a second viewing.

Brian Rooney

Legit, every episode makes me wanna write a book.

Henry Hinder
>>117150930

Hey, I loved this! When's the rest out? I've also got a book in a similar style to yours that I'm looking for beta readers for - if you're interested, message me at contact@hwhinder.com Thanks!

KC Sunshine

I live in Sherman Oaks (or as the kids call it nowadays, ‘The Shoaks’) and I’d love to know what Bret thinks of the area now compared to when he was growing up, and if there are any restaurants he likes on this side of town?

Harold B

I told you guys he was avoiding Oppenheimer and Barbie because he thought they were mediocre I TOLD YOU but nooo you all are so obsessed with this notion that Hollywood can be saved if you prop up a few summer blockbusters as some sign that movies in general are back. IMAX and AMC might have gotten bumps but they’re still disaster stocks AMC that they’ve been engaging in all sort of stock manipulation shenanigans. God just let it go. It’s over. Move on. There will be no more good big budget movies moving forward just mediocre ones nostalgic old people insist everyone watch.

Alex Waller
>>117230030

BS. Oppenheimer got box office because it was a well made film with an appropriate budget with a subject that interested people. It's not rocket science, movies took a hit during the pandemic, now that we're past it, movies are recovering. Bret has avoided it because it goes against the narrative he's been pedaling and this weird comfort he takes in declaring cinema dead.

Neil G.
>>116837466

Right but so many people who write about the film reveal EXACTLY why people would have a problem with it and EXACTLY what the critics (the people with common sense) points out is what drives them crazy, and it is the responses that the movie is a profound statement that is EXACTLY what those same critics (again, people with common sense) point out is wrong with society...writers in media sources like Hollywood Reporter are so stupid, they ACTUALLY think the movie is an accurate view of society...this is how stupid they are...and yet the far right is always called "the stupid ones"...🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

Matt Vogels

Bret may have dodged a bullet not seeing Talk to Me. I wanted to walk out of the theatre. Water torture would be preferable. Sincerely, Patient Australian

Duke

Barbie wasn’t woke???

Keith campbell

He pronounced “La Notte” semi correctly ! Yay!

Phoenix

I had to stop watching Just Like That after the strap on dildo scene with Miranda and Che. It was unbearable. I couldn’t even hate watch it.

Jorge Espinha

"I never really cared". Oh god! If you could gold plate an answer this would be it. I personally go further than Bret , I don't care about Hip Hop, period.

Mara Capozzi

Was the audio on this podcast sped up? Even the song sounded faster than usual to me..

Dan Citriniti

I can’t recall disagreeing with Bret more on a movie. Oppenheimer is either my favorite or second favorite Nolan movie and I absolutely loved every second of it! The first time I saw it digitally it was really good but the second time I made the trek to the closest theater that showed it in IMAX 1570 it floored me, what a movie. Oh and Barbie was a good time too, the feminist aspect of the movie wasn’t well done but the overall girl power part of the movie was fun.

Thomas Matich

Interesting that Bret compared Tar and Oppenheimer. I think Bret maybe does need to watch Oppenheimer again to let it “sink in.” Both movies are very talky. While I do think Tar is the better of the two, these are both excellent films and likely to be viewed as two of the best of the decade.

Thomas Matich
>>117346932

Then you’re missing out 😉 Bret is clearly a hip-hop fan, but just didn’t care about the violence, although it seems he’s watched the documentaries. I think he was making a larger point, like with Springsteen, about the people behind the music, separating the art from the artist.

Michael McGrath
>>117150930

Yes, "anti-woke" is indeed the main selling point. Presently, there is a paucity of anti-woke literature in publishing. And while publishing is a business, I believe publishers should value the free marketplace of ideas. Unfortunately, they don't, which is why my book is so welcome (it got published, so the editor clearly thinks there's a market for it). I find it interesting that you would say it's not 2016 anymore. In some ways, it is 2016 all over again. Wokesters are still annoying (more annoying than ever, really), and Trump is running for president. Round Two. Ding! Ding! P.S. I don't care about "good form." I am not polite. READ THE BOOK, OR DON'T.

Michael McGrath
>>117150930

Not doing it well??? I'm not grifting AT ALL. Grifting occurs when someone obtains money dishonestly. Meanwhile, I'm not obtaining money at all. When you said, "Good luck with your grift," I think what you're trying to accuse me of is the shameless plug. That I'll cop to. Anyway, thanks for pointing out the formatting issue. It's a small press, and the editor doesn't make any money doing this, so understandably he couldn't read the book that many times looking for errors -- in fact, I think he only read it once. As a result, the book, like many published books, contains a few small errors. Not the end of the world.

Neil G.
>>117261482

it was confused between woke and not woke, which is a reflection of its creators' retardation and pseudo intellectualism

Neil G.
>>117261482

and the woke can't pull a trick...they are too retarded...unless, of course, it's the retards who swarm to praise that movie as a profound statement because they are mentally deficient...sadly, many of them are in the press...come on, now

Alex Holt

Adam, thanks for pushing back on Bad Lieutenant. Bret, I think you have to be a depraved Catholic baseball fan for that movie to resonate deeply. But rewatch it in a theater; there’s new layers to it—he’s executed outside a Trump Hotel.