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Study 125 - The Time of the Worm (Patreon)

Published:
2025-03-20 15:34:15
Imported:
2025-03
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Possessed in mind and body, the characters in The Time of the Worm have a very bad time! Tune in as we discuss this fascinating but brutal story by Bob Leman.

Special thanks to our star reader Andrew Leman!

Next up: we're talking vampire movies including Nosferatu, Byzantium and The Vourdalak! And then it's Aickman in April!

Comments

Rafe Ball

"It's all stick and no carrot, it doesn't do anything nice for these guys. If it can get into people's minds, it should be able to do pleasurable things" - hey, this thing is the Anti Space Candle Ghost! If you don't know what that is, then hop over here and educate yourself! https://www.patreon.com/posts/episode-332-tng-121487243

Pam Winkler

Man, this story hit like a truck.

Carter Stepper

The story reminded me of Philip K Dick’s “the father thing.” The style reminded me of Dick as well, especially as you were talking about Science Fiction. Dick rides that same line of being classified as science fiction, but his science or technology ideas are hardly plausible, and so he is some mix of science fiction, fantasy, and horror. It is very difficult to get this collection in physical format, but it does appear that some of it is available online, fortunately. I’m going to have to read the whole thing if possible.

Jason Thompson

This Bob Leman dude is 3 for 3! What a good horror writer!

Ethan Cordray

Wow, this one made me queasy in places. I hate centipedes. And I hate mind control. And I hate sad inescapable family trauma. So I was really affected! Perhaps to ease the horror, I found myself thinking of the parallels between this story and David Nickle's "The Sloan Men," which is also about inhuman monsters using mind control to dominate their family members. If the worm woman is all stick, then the Sloan men are...all carrot. If ever two monsters deserved to meet each other, it's the Sloan Men and this goddamn worm woman. Yeesh.

Richard Horsman

I have read along with every story you two have ever done. I can confirm that this blew past Bloch’s “Manuscript Found in a Deserted House”, and even got the edge on “The Screwfly Solution” to clinch the title of Most Depressing Story. Holy hell did Bob Leman do an incredible job here. He makes it unflinching without being lurid, clinical without being cold. Those parallels with real life abuse narratives landed so hard, while not blunting the surface level horror of the story. The other thing this reminds me of is Charles Darwin finding out about parasitic wasps. You know, the ones who lay their eggs INSIDE living caterpillars? And when the young hatch they eat their way out? And then start the cycle again? Yeah, reportedly Darwin stopped believing in God when he found out about those.

Our old pal Brendan Gardiner

The fiancé returning to the “gray pointless life” that is the lot of plain girls. Holy moly! is this story ever unsparing. Just when you’re done being served up the secret trials and trauma being carried by the kind of outsider kid that you in your own youth may have stood by and watched be bullied, or whom you actively shunned, Leman sticks your face right in MORE of it with that description of the limited prospects for happiness that can be hoped for by plain girls. Like hearing Janis Ian’s brutal song “Seventeen,” you’re forced to acknowledge the part you play in who’s in and who’s out. What a bleak heavy story.

ESTY

All killer; no filler! It’s as if Leman weaponized language. What a great premise, and wonderfully executed. The Cycle will continue. I would *love* to follow up with Harvey’s unnamed widow. ‘Driving the new, baby worm back home, in her unremarkable car. A single pair of headlights, dimly scanning her boring street, then turning into the parking lot of her sad apartment building.

Patrick Ziselberger

Ah. The origin of the internet meme: "Would you still love me if I were a worm?" And you *have* to answer yes.

Allison Albright

This family trauma metaphor was freaking bleak. The living in squalor part really got me in the gut for some reason, but just knowing this kid had known nothing else his whole life was really hard to think about. As dark as it is though, these dynamics are so common that most people probably know someone with something similar in their lives. It's upsettingly familiar.

It's a Ghost.

The worm monster in E.F. Benson’s Negotium Perambulans was scary, but this is way scarier (and far more brutal). Like in Negotium if you forget to light the candles one night, the scary worm will come and kill you by sucking *all* your blood from your body, but then it’s just over. The total mind control in this story over the course of years for yourself and the person you care about the most is absolutely horrific.

S Jayne Bradley

I love this story so much, it's wonderful when you two show me something that gives me the heebs and/or jeebs. That being said, I do not like worm time. Gross.

The Spider Incident

"That was her true and *permanent* form; but during daylight hours...she was able to assume the form of a woman" I don't think "permanent" means what Leman thinks it means ;P (But pedantry aside, what a story!)

Gideon Falcon

Oof. I'm going to go stomp on some centipedes or something.

Carter Stepper

Fun story: I was in Spain some 28 years ago and staying at what is basically a youth camp. We were watching fiddle on the roof in the main hall one night, lights off of course, and suddenly someone goes “what is that?!” On the lights go and I tell you what, that was the biggest centipede I’ve ever seen. About 6 inches long, yellow with a black head, pincers probably an inch long. Someone ended up putting it in a big jar filled with water, and it drowned, just floating there slowly spinning like a dna helix from hell. This story is when that centipede made its reappearance into my poor brain.

Jenny Richardson

The 'all stick' talk reminded me of Red Dwarf episodes. The despair squid in S5 and and then eventually the hope/joy squid in S 9

Aaron La Vene

Wow I keep thinking, alright however many years in, we have hit all the gold there is to be buried . But then THIS, what could possibly be the more horrific story ever presented in this podcast and I lapped it right up. Brilliant concept. Utter terrifying creature with no reason, no exposition, it just is. and it just can. And because of that. It just do..,The story is brutal. There is no need for a carrot when the carrot changes nothing that the cane cannot. So why bother with these lower being. He is nothing more than a tool to be used. He wasn’t a bad person , just a normal guy. There was no comeuppance like we always look for. This was truly one of the most lovexrafgian stories we have studied in years, and there was no good at all in any part. Beautiful

Jim Cannon

Its not just stick. Its abject cruelty. Once the worm is able to masquerade as a human, why does it need Harvey at all? From a cold numbers perspective, it only needs humans to drive a car once in a while to assist with the cycle, and since it can dominate any human mind, it doesn't need Harvey specifically. But it keeps him around to torture him for decades. Awful, awful stuff. The 1981 Gypsy moth explosion was a formative event for me, and where I acquired my absolute hatred of invertebrates in general but worms, caterpillars, and centipedes especially. Just carpets of the Gypsy caterpillars in the woods, or falling out of trees on top of you. So a five foot psychic intelligent worm with legs and malevolence really hit those atavistic parts of my brain where fear and revulsion dwell. And then Leman throws child abuse on top of that. This one is going to stick in the craw for a while.

It's a Ghost.

Centipedes are super creepy, while I think millipedes are really neat, so I hate to say that the worm sounds a lot more like a millipede than a centipede. Its legs are underneath itself like a millipede, and it eats root vegetables, which is similar to millipedes, which eat decaying leaf and plant matter. Centipedes on the other hand have larger legs that stick out to their sides, and they are carnivorous.

It's a Ghost.

Thinking more about this story, I wonder if the worm is just doing what a worm of its type does. It doesn't seem sadistic about what it's doing, nor, obviously, does it seem empathetic towards the people it controls. It just seems to be doing what it knows to do. Also, here’s a title for a potential kooky sitcom: Worm Mom.

Iain Hood

This episode made me go back and listen to the episode on Its a Good Life by Jerome Bixby, and since I don't have any worms or toddlers controlling my every thought, I am gonna put forth the head cannon that Anthony from that episode is one of these worms at their most powerful. This also got me thinking about what the worst fates we've heard on the show, like could we do a March Madness Bracket for characters who end up in the worst situations? Would you rather be controlled by a worm from infancy through adulthood, have to think nice thoughts for Anthony or be trapped in Tsathoggua's stomach having to listen to aliens scream for all eternity?

Stewart

Wow that was bleak. As someone else pointed out, Lovecraftian in a Colour Out of Space sort of way. That said, I can't believe that in March is for Draculas you read an entire story about a worm and didn't make a single reference to Bram Stoker's (whatever the opposite of a magnum opus is) Lair of the White Worm. I think it's fair to grant the worm honorary Dracula status, during Lemarch is for Draculas. It's got the shape shifting, mind-controlling parasitic parts down, at the very least.

Jeremy Impson

Regarding Chad's feelings about murderous and abusive mind-controlling worms: I thought we agreed to please keep politics out of this podcast

Bogbarian

Of all of the short horror stories I've read or listened too this the only one that actually caused me anxiety as I read it. I was actively hoping that the father would be able to floor it out of town even though it was obvious he wouldn't make it. While an actual mind controlling super worm is thankfully far fetched, you could replace it with an abusively controlling and manipulative real family member and have a horror story all too real.

Sweatin' to the Great Oldies

This one seemed to me a prime example of someone reaching for even the most outrageous explanation to have *some* explanation for the horrors in their home. Far better to think that Mom was replaced by a worm than to come to terms with the reality that mental illness or a brain injury can completely change a person's personality - make them alien. Far better to believe that you cannot escape your situation because they have control of your mind than to feel that you might be culpable in your ongoing abuse (you aren't, truly). And, once grown, far better to imagine a centipede egg hatching than to take on board that you, too, might twist one day - or that you are attracted to people with that same propensity to twist.

Falconhoof

You know the old saying: "behind every great man, stands a mind-controlling worm masquerading as a woman"

Karlandos

It’s so weird hearing this story as well as the conversation regarding the sort of neglect and abuse associated with families and how it carries on. I have been shamelessly listening to these AI voiced reddit stories where there is usually some manner of justice for the person and this was just a visceral gut punch in how the end was conveyed. Better still that it has some shade of Color out of Space in that we’re not given any real explanation except the perspective of the victims.

Daniel Weber

This story really affected me. The way the worm snuffs out love, something rare and precious for humans, to secure itself potato-fetchers is such a brutal example of Lovecraft’s idea of an alien Other for whom humans – and the things humans value the most (love, partners, children) – simply don’t matter. The idea of losing your beloved wife and being forced to serve the being responsible for that loss is genuinely awful. I was just crushed when Harvey and his erstwhile fiancé were ripped away from each other just as they made that first, tenuous, magical, moment of connection to one another. “There seemed to be a substantial number of things that had to be said without delay…” They are so excited about each other and want to talk about everything. And then he’s gone. Ugh. Brutal. This reminded me of the stories It’s a Good Life and I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream for the specific flavor of horror from being under the total control and at the mercy and whims of an all-powerful Other. This story also evokes domestic abuse at the hands of a cruel partner or family member, with its additional horror of having to keep up appearances and play a fake role while out in the world to protect the one abusing you. This story resonates with first- and second-hand experience of living with narcissistic, abusive individuals. I had actually described one of them as being “an alien bug in a human suit” for the way they pursued their own wants without regard, or even apparent understanding, for how they hurt others. I had written down in my notes “all stick, no carrot,” too. If the worm had used rewards or manipulated Harvey into loving it, it would have seemed more like a the relationship a cultist has with the cult leader, or mythos deity, or whatever they are devoted to. Thanks for an awesome and devastating episode, guys.

Apollo Sitting Up

If my memory is correct this show covered Bloodchild by Octavia Butler which has similar themes in mind control, birthing centipedes and interspecies relationships. There was definitely a bigger worm genre than I was aware in the 80’s. Also convinced that Slurms Mackenzie was a revival character from one of these stories 😀 Great show!

Eric - Speaker in Digressions

Such a rough story, but so good. To lighten the mood for myself I kept thinking of the old "Earthworm Jim" cartoon: "Good morning, neighbor!" "Good morning, hideous freak of nature!"

Fredrik Bridell

I want to see this get reprinted. We already have a great blurb for the cover: ”Certainly not a feel good kind of spectacle”.

Matt Baldwin

Oh wow, after this story I may need to increase my antidepressants! 😂😂🤪

Professor Murder

Loved this. Super unsettling and the both of your reactions helped to sell just what was upsetting. The worm is physically repellent yes, but its the ongoing violation of the will of its victims that is the true horror.

Amillionbears

Hurray! My name got read on the miserable worm story!

Fulgencio Martinez

This might be more my generation, but there's an online discussion in relationships where someone asks their partner "would you still love me if I was a worm" a funny question meant to truly ask "would you still love me if I had nothing to offer you" but now that question will from now on and always mean "would you still love me if I was an abusive supernatural Oedipus complex worm that controlled your mind"

Timothy Fraire

what a good story. I hated the ending :))