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Extra Credit 036 - The Substance (Patreon)

Published:
2025-06-26 19:02:31
Imported:
2025-06
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We've got a thumbs-up / thumbs-down situation as we discuss recent potion-adjacent film The Substance. Tune in to hear the vicious battle!

Also, we talk about the Sandra Bullock 90s movie Love Potion #9. Just as contentious!

SO MUCH DRAMA!

Next up: THEWLY kicks off with The Sword of Spartacus by Richard L. Tierney

Comments

Iain Hood

This was my favorite movie of last year, I was hooting and hollering in the theater by the end.

Richard Horsman

Ooo, trying to guess who was up and who was down in this thumb war before I listen, and it’s surprisingly difficult. Seems like a film that has stuff you would both love and both potentially bounce off hard. Okay, my gut says Chad up, Chris down.

Jason Thompson

Aaaaggghhh I’ve got to finally watch this now so I can listen to your episode!

Pearce Duncan

Thr Substance was my favourite movie of 2024, so I can't wait to hear which of you was wrong! I saw it on closing night of the New Zealand International Film Festival, before most of the world got to see it. Before it started the woman sitting next to me said to her companion, "I think it's a horror movie or something?" The rest of the audience seemed just as unprepared and the vocal reactions of a crowd who'd turned up for Prestige Cinema instead of an angry and satirical body horror movie definitely added to my enjoyment. I also loved Coralie Fargeat's earlier movie Revenge, which is like Feminist The Crow in the desert.

Allison Albright

I don't usually like body horror (real life and having to live in a physical human body is body horror enough for me) but you guys sold me, I'm going to give the Substance a try. I'm in my 40s all of a sudden so the real life body horror is just starting to get a little real and this movie sounds relatable.

Jb Lee

My favorite movie of 2024. Gonna be some spoilers below! Best FOLLOW THE DIRECTIONS psa ever! The movie would be 15 minutes long if Elizabeth/Sue followed the instuctions. It's 2 hours and 20 minutes. And since the film won a hair/makeup oscar, a case could be made that Demi was snubbed, and Margaret was snubbed, but Monstro Elisasue went home with the gold! Good for her! My favorite movie monster since Brundlefly's final form (that is, before becoming Brundleflytelepod). And Fargeat has stated outright that THE FLY was a big influence. (Sue loses teeth, nails, and an ear, just as Brundle does at first, for instance. An homage! A GROTESQUE homage!) And Cronenberg said THE FLY was inspired by his dad's aging and terminal disease, so we're back to aging again. I was also reminded of Andrew Niccol's satire S1M0NE, but that movie doesn't get its point across like this one, because that movie didn't go as nuts as this one. Anyway, James Gunn has announced that Clayface is getting an origin movie, and it will be R-rated body horror (which it pretty much was in BATMAN: THE ANIMATED SERIES - sheesh! Wonder how many kids those cartoons traumatized!) -- I'm really hoping he can get Elisasue's creators to join the fun.

Ben Gilbert

I haven’t seen this movie. Looking forward to listening to your take on it. Have you seen the 80s Larry Cohen movie, Q? It’s one of those entertaining bad movies with a giant flying lizard (Quetzalcoatl) eating people in New York. Not to mention an Aztec murder cult. It stars Michael Moriarty and David Carradine.

Richard Horsman

Also if this means one or both of you have Mubi for the next few weeks, I highly recommend you check out: THE FALL: Tamsin’s labour of love, an international epic told by a child and set in old Hollywood THE PEOPLE’S JOKER: aka the best comic book movie of the last 10 years DEERSKIN: a horror movie about being possessed by the ugliest jacket ever, from the director of RUBBER

Richard Horsman

Man, Michael Moriarty is so good in that. Best hustling loser since Richard Widmark in Pick Up on South Street!

Karsa Torvald

This sounds to me, even more after hearing you two talk about it, like the Cronenberg version of Death Becomes Her.

Background Noise Comic

Chris, can you please post the link to that photoshoot of models slouching?

Steve

"You're trapped in the body you're born with" or you can just be in the body you're born with.

Steve

This movie also has a large part of the Faustian bargain. It's the quick fix which always costs you more than you thought. What are you willing to sacrifice?

Stacy Schumacher

I enjoyed this movie, though it was a bit oversold. I don't mind a good body horror film and had watched Men not long before this film, so in terms of gore, it's up there, but not that beyond others. One thing I struggled with a bit was the film trying to show one consciousness using both of the two bodies. I did not find that convincing, so it's hard to see why the main character would continue losing weeks, and eventually a lot more. It just wasn't showing the connection to the same consciousness I thought the film would have. So I guess I'd say i really liked watching it, not so much thinking about it.

Devin Morse

For those who liked The Substance, I recommend Seconds (1966) by John Frankenheimer, which I assume was an influence on The Substance since both films have the same general concept (i.e. middle-aged person contacts a mysterious company to assume a new identity via a scientific procedure).

Jason Thompson

I thought of that similarity too!! It also reminded me of Body Melt in the overall mix of cartoony satire + pharmaceutical bodily mutation.

King Dinosaur

Just starting this now and DREADING it, as I and my girlfriend seem to be the only two people in existence who hated this movie. That being said, two things redeemed the viewing experience: 1. We saw it in Mexico City and when I asked my girlfriend how much in American dollars I had spent on the movie AND popcorn and she told me about 5 bucks, I was able to relax a little, and 2. The fact that is turns into a GWAR video at the end. To be fair, it was so ridiculous, it had us both laughing pretty hard by the halfway mark. Okay, going in now to see what you guys think...

King Dinosaur

Q is so good! Any Larry Cohen movie is worth checking out.

King Dinosaur

Thatbwas my main problem with the movie; although she is supposedly created from her own DNA and is supposed to just be a younger version of her, they have zero connection and are clearly two different people. The movie violates it's premise immediately.

Jason Thompson

For myself, I accepted the “split consciousness sort of becomes a split personality” theme. I thought it was cool. Believable level of self-destructiveness. The whole idea of the alternate self or double self is very interesting and who knows how consciousness really works?

Eric - Speaker in Digressions

I've been doing portrait photography for a couple of decades, including self-portraiture to help with self-image problems (recommended, but even after 20 years not foolproof). It's definitely helped put my mental image of myself in line with what I see in mirrors and photos, for better or worse. And now I have a record of gradually aging from the best shape of my life to my current middle-aged dog-dad-bod. That must be valuable somehow. When I have photoshoots with other people, it's definitely always fraught when they want to look at what's on the digital viewfinder while we're still shooting, making them self-conscious about their appearance and me about my photography skills. And yet we do it for fun! Weird.

Andy U

So many potions! Some taken out of vanity or the hunger for power or a disastrous self-image. Some taken just to survive in a world that rejects who you are to the point of pain or death. Whatever your life-hack, moderation is probably your best chance at surviving the potion. Going to the gym, alcohol, school, pick-up artist books, vocal coaching, playing the guitar, cooking lessons... So many potions.

Ravewolf

The idea of a TV lady needing a youth potion to stay relevant was already done in that old episode of the 80's Twilight Zone, Aqua Vita, and so many other short stories etc. besides. Not saying one can't use the old trope to do or say new things from time to time, but not sure this was that, and the way this film was hailed in some circles as something original and so interesting did seem a bit much considering it's one of the most overused concepts in weird fiction.

It's a Ghost.

Loved this movie. Well, "love" might not quite be the right word, but I really enjoyed it, watched it twice, and feel like I could watch it again and get even more out of it. Chris said that Demi Moore’s character seemed more real and understated than the rest of the characters, which I suspect is the point. She is the main character dealing with the reality of living in a world of fake-ness. Also, I found it strange or certainly of note that Elizabeth and Sue never tried to communicate with each other. They would call The Substance phone number and complain about each other, but they never tried to write each other a note or try to create a shared plan or approach to using The Substance.

It's a Ghost.

I too had a problem with or was confused about why they were each behaving the way they were if they shared a consciousness, but in the end, I don't think they're sharing a single consciousness at all. I think Sue is a duplicate of Elizabeth with all of her memories up the the point of the split, but from then on they are different people that are also tied together. If one cheats and uses more than 7 days, the other pays the price. And if one dies, they both die. The duplicate (Sue) is Elizabeth experiencing the benefits of the younger body, but the original Elizabeth can only watch from a distance and experience Sue's successes vicariously.

It's a Ghost.

Which is to say, The Substance literature and The Substance guy on the phone both emphasized that the two of them were in fact "one," but they clearly did not act that way. And when you're battling with yourself, you are only harming yourself.

witchhousemedia

I've been trying to find them again, but it just sends me to 'how to pose' videos and images. Maybe I dreamed the whole thing... (I did not.)

David Halstead

Haven't seen substance, but kept thinking about the movie Death Becomes Her as I listened.

Mooncubus

I'm trans and I was on HRT for a few months. My body started changing to be more how I wanted and I started feeling a lot better about myself. Unfortunately, because of financial reasons, I had to stop taking it. The weeks that followed seriously felt like body horror. My form started to revert back, even my face changed a bit, and my body hair came back way thicker. Felt like I was turning into a damn werewolf. This discussion definitely reminded me a lot of that.

Tara Murphy

Where can we see your photos?

Eric - Speaker in Digressions

There isn't one simple answer, as newer stuff and older stuff aren't in the same places. Anyone who wants the more complicated answer can message me (is that possible here?), probably most easily via the Strange Studies Discord, where my username appears more or less as it does here. Thanks for your interest!