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Housekeeping~ (Patreon)

Published:
2021-08-22 09:00:55
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

Warning: Not a roleplay, not meant for ASMR, and not regular programming. This is just me sitting down for a candid talk on recent issues in the community. 

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Comments

Xx_iTairy_xX

Sir, I’m trying to sleep 🥺

genevieve13x

Thank you for bringing this up K!

alisha

thank you k <3

Dayls

Thank you and I hope things will get better 💜💜

rose

it’s very valuable that you speak on this topic, and do not ignore it <3

MyBabyBear

Thanks for this K, you're awesome and nobody is perfect. People will always try to exaggerate and deliberately misunderstand stuff to make you looks bad, we all deal with that, I've listened to everything you do, you are always careful and clear and try to stay away from specifics, I'm glad that you're clearing things up but you have been pretty clear from day one.

Ari

just a PSA- ‼️If you’re not a POC, you’re not trans, you weren’t triggered as a result of shitty tagging, or you weren’t affected by any of this mans poor actions then this “apology” isn’t yours to accept. So stfu and don’t speak over people who were affected.‼️

Ash M

I appreciate the transparency. thank you K

Dayls

We’re grateful for you too and thank you for all the audios and we appreciate it and I wish you a amazing day 💜💜😊!!!.

aria

K, i'm sorry to hear that you had negative experiences with moderators. The fact that one of them was making accusations against you is so fucked up tbh. I've been a moderator on several communities for a while now and yes, unfortunately the drama is always there. You need to find someone that you actually know and can trust so yeah, i understand. You can never really trust the people on the internet lmao.

Ari

This is an adult channel, no?

unfrostedflakes

I had no idea about the requests for race based audios, but for me as a POC I already imagine that she is a POC. Maybe that's just me. 🤷🏽‍♀️ Aww.. we're grateful for you too. 😘I'm sorry that things have been so difficult for you. Hopefully this will clear up a lot of the messiness.

Yuna!

The way I had no idea any of this was happening. I must’ve been living under a rock lol. One thing I’ve been observing these past few years is a steady growth in parasocial relationship within our community. It’s almost as if some members have developed a sense of entitlement and act as though they’re above those who might be newer listeners. But I must say, I had no idea it had gotten this bad 😦 Either way, thank you K for addressing these topics and not sweeping them under the rug. Keep being awesome and we love you.

Ari

Hi, ofc as a POC you are entitled more than anyone to your own opinion, but the person who requested was white

Devyn

@Ari I think he’s talking about the “so stfu and don’t speak over people who were affected” and wants to keep things lighthearted and civil?

MyBabyBear

Correct but let's just be respectful, especially if K asks nicely. Peace and love.

Isabella

Silent listener here. Thank you for this statement. You are too candid and naive K. Because you are a good person. From now on be very careful with all your comments. The more the channel grows, because it will, the more complex it will get. A suggestion that I have seen with other erotic ASMR artists. Tag ALL audios with the labels: All characters in this audio are consenting adults 18+. Finally THANK YOU for everything. Your audios either relax me and calm me down or put me in right mood to have amazing sex and a loving relationship with my husband.

Ari

Okay that’s fine, you’ll have your opinion and I’ll have mine, but K if you’re going to request to not use any bad language, keep that energy for all of your followers, including the ones who will clearly do anything to back you up. Because the language some people were using in the thread was way worse than anything I’ve said but you stayed silent

aska

So I was observing this whole thing and staying out of the comments for a hot minute because quite frankly I don’t need diehard fans invalidating my feelings. Some of this is not my apology to accept, so I’m not gonna touch on any of that but what does irritate me is that with the whole ‘’being removed’’ and ‘’I haven’t heard from them in months’’ situation, either you are or they are lying. There are receipts of that person saying you were messaging back and forth in real time, unsure how to handle the demands that were made of getting that person removed. Also btw, removing someone and asking them to take a break are two different things. So either you are lying about not having heard from them in months (because they were saying you were talking to each other in July), not having ‘’closer relationships’’ with certain members of the community and talking to them privately or they are lying about being in contact with you.. and honestly both of these options are concerning. Someone who was previously close to the person that ‘’was removed’’ even suggested they should just come back under a different name. This whole situation is just confusing because one of you has to be lying about how this all went down. There were serious concerns about the person in question, issues beyond the whole racism situation, so I don’t quite understand why they weren’t just removed right away while other people are being banned in a heartbeat.

BoyfriendAudio

Yeah it's been about two months now. As for why some people were insta-banned recently, that is explained in the audio.

aska

I understand why some people were insta-banned recently but why were they kindly asked to take a break instead of just being removed too?

Kalpana M

Okay I've been unaware of any issue, drama until now. Honestly I never thought people could mistake Teacher-Student audio as endorsing relationship with minor? All your audios give vibe of only for adults? This is well put, clear and concise.. Thank you K(aniel) 🥰

BoyfriendAudio

I tried to explain that in the audio. I think there's a difference between people coming to me with their complaints from outside the channel, vs coming into the community and swearing at people. It was also my first time dealing with this, so I was as gentle as I could be. Hope that helps.

unfrostedflakes

I agree. I'm also mature enough to know that this stuff is all fantasy. My mind didn't even go to inappropriate relationships like that. Not even once. I really wish there was a way to make sure the listeners were at least 18+..but hey. It's the internet.

maplebooth

i agree too. a bit controversial, but it’s the same for cnc and other bdsm related fantasies too. (also, technically cnc is consensual since both parties consent but still) do the people participating actually want to do or experience the fantasies irl? hell no. it’s a fantasy.

BoyfriendAudio

Update: In the spirit of transparency, that commenter was actually right. That individual did try sending a message a month ago requesting I explain to the community why she was gone. Also to clarify she had an interracial child who had been mistreated. There, you have everything I now know about the situation. x

Kwan Kwan

Dear K, Just want to let you know how much I appreciated with all your efforts and hard work for all these audios. I m sure I m in love with your nice character and not just your sexy voice. Love you babe n once again , thanks for everything, you are a good man. ( Please don’t give yourself too much pressure, you know we all love you ) Take care and looking forward for more of your “art” work :) Thank you K Love you XOXOXOXO

simp city

On the topic of trigger warnings, obviously not everything can be covered all the time and they’re different with everyone. With audios like the one mentioned, have you considered a sensitivity listener maybe? Or does that run the risk of that person being biased?

Sapphy

I think it would come with the same issues of having a moderator. It would be hard to find a trustworthy person online

joan

Hi K, In the thread there was also a mention of upper tier patrons not getting the benefits they were promised. I think that’s a valid concern and that’s it’s unfair to not give patrons the content they are paying for. I was wondering if you had anything to say about that? Thanks

BoyfriendAudio

This is true. The $10 tier members should have access to a monthly thread to vote for and submit new audios. Between January and August we didn't have any. About five months, those are the same five months I was trying to put out these fires between people. It was hours, and very trying mentally and physically. And I sincerely apologize for this. This month I refocused on doing what I love, audios. And released a huge list of audios to vote on, sort of as an apology for lagging behind these last few months. Also, please consider the higher tier more as a tip jar. I'm just happy you're here and again I'm sorry about that. x

BoyfriendAudio

It's a good idea, and I have put some feelers out to see if someone would do that irl. But of course, there will always be some or experiences that some listeners have had that others haven't. x

채영

the fact youre more concerned about people swearing than the fact people are trying to express and educate ppl on the situation is so weird to me. especially when u only call it out when its people that are ignoring the situation. none of what you said in this really addressed the fact that poc, including myself are entirely just being spoken over. it isnt about any of us, its about you keeping uneducated people satisfied so they support u. which is fair, go off, but you really need to spend a little more time considering how your actions affect people, and do a better job of moderating your community, we dont identify as women of color, thats what we ARE. i will happily go out of my way to educate some of the people here, because some of yall need it.

dundermifflin

I understand what you’re saying about the comments basically all being smooshed together but as the channel grows, you really should to be more careful with what you like and comment on. I’ve seen two users (there could be more, I’m not sure) that I know are minors call you daddy in the past and you liked their comments. Obviously I know you’re not checking everyone’s birthdays before you interact but to be safe, I think it’s be best to just not interact with those comments (on YT) at all cause you never know if the inappropriate comment that you’re liking was made by a minor. I personally think those comments should be saved for Patreon. One user specifically keeps using the defense that you said you might actually kinda like it when people call you daddy and honestly that’s fine, but when minors are using that as their defense when people tell them to stop, it gets dangerous. I think anything pertaining to that should remain on Patreon where you at least have the protection of knowing that this is supposed to be for adults. Finally, thanks for addressing the concerns we had and I’m just hoping that we can all work together in making this a positive environment. As a silent listener, I never really felt the need to say or do anything other than like the audios and the lovely comments/posts in the community board. Uni and just life in general can be really stressful, so it’s nice how some of you guys constantly post positive messages and have fun discussions on there and I’m sure others can relate when I say it’s super sweet to observe these interactions. I hope K and my fellow subscribers are all doing well and staying safe!!<3

Nari Park

Finally home🥳

Romi

I just heard of this. But you will learn from your mistakes and just get better and better by time. thank you we love you x

bAsh

Ok I don’t usually comment but I just wanted to thank you for your efforts in speaking on/ addressing the important and sensitive issues that arise. Many people with influence don’t hold themselves accountable or stay silent on these kinda things, which is shit but I also understand why they would since it’s easier and less risky re backlash and further critique. I think it’s really important to have dialogue between the creators and consumers! And creators should be called out and held accountable. However at the same time I honestly think a lot of us hold you to a standard so high that no creator could ever meet it. And I can imagine you put a lot of pressure on yourself to meet our standards. So yeh idk what the fck I’m trying to saying but I guess I sort of wanted to say I appreciate that you work hard, respond to our criticism and come across very honest. But that I also hope you don’t feel too attacked by the comments etc Obviously we want to create a really safe and open environment but realistically you can never meet everyone’s needs (and that’s something that has to be said. But also thank you for always trying to do so!). You’re never going to be perfect and do everything right (I mean you’re human after all). But I genuinely believe you hold some great values and that you care about not harming and trying to positively impact your listeners. So thank you, it doesn’t go unnoticed!

RoRo

Hey K, thanks for your apology. Can you confirm if going forward these posts will be monthly? (I'm going to assume not since you've released 70+ audio ideas). If not, I think it would be fair to remove the word "monthly" from the benefit description. As I mentioned in a comment on the now deleted thread, I accept that once people become aware these posts aren't happening they can drop to the lower tier, but a new Patron signing up won't be aware of that. I think if you're not planning on doing them monthly then it's unfair to advertise it as such. Thanks.

amnie

hi just wanted to say that as someone who is very sensitive to a lot of the issues/triggers raised, i really think you worded the answers so well and did a great job of laying your cards on the table.. i was kinda worried how this would turn out as usually answering these sorts of questions leads to more of a mess but it’s clear that you were being as transparent as possible without sounding overly defensive or frustrated as any other human would be after facing such allegations so thank you for clearing it all up and for doing so in such a calm and open way. xx

Shiina

Re: race related request. Would commissions be a workaround for those who have requested it? Would commissions in general be something you'd be interested, or even able to do? Ages ago, I sent message about how I love that you keep the descriptions of "her" to a minimum. And still love that. I haven't been taken out of the moment in your audios because of, for example, "her" turning bright red or having a hair color that just isn't common within my race. (This constantly happens in fiction in across various mediums where the creator intends for any listener/reader to be able to see themselves but they forget that certain physical characteristics don't fit everyone) However, I would be lying if I said I wasn't interested in an audio with an explicitly black girlfriend. Not one about racial insensitivity though but just one where she's black. I just never asked because I figured: 1) the bulk of the audience who isn't black would have no interest in it. 2) because it would be so specific, it would lead to the need for a series of different race specific girlfriend audios and that would be... A LOT. Even amongst black women, we come in so many shades that an audio for a dark skinned black woman would still leave some black women out if her specific shade is described. 3) depending on how it's written, any black women who didn't ask for it would see it as kinda fetishist? It feels like something for which commissions would be a solution. I feel like you've answered a question about commissions though, but I can't remember the answer lol (Edited: good lord my typos!)

Jenn (Preemie Cuddler)

You, Sir deserve a medal for tackling this group of women and this all reaffirms why I am not on the community page. Your best is extraordinary and I appreciate you so much! Big bear hug and cuddle from me!! Go get a massage-you earned it!!😘💝

Jeanne

Thank you for putting this out, I hope it clears the air for some people ❤️

Lula C

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 you got it girl! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

Iced coffee

I have nothing to say just a very very very very big thank you K !!! Your words at the end touched my heart ❤ Liked the way you brought these misconceptions and discussed them respectively and with an open-mind !!!

BoyfriendAudio

Hey Roro, I want to use them as an opportunity to run ideas by you guys, workshop them and develop some audios together. For example, do you like option A in this script or B, etc. etc. and let people flex their writing skills. Thanks btw. x

Ana

You handled that so gracefully. You are amazing, don’t be too hard on yourself. <3

BoyfriendAudio

Thanks, I'm mindful of that and try to keep indications of race out of most of the audios. It's cool you picked up on that. =) I don't feel comfortable charging commissions for something like that. Bit of a pickle. But seeing people talk openly and constructively about it is a great start. x (edit: Don't worry about typos. I still remember the whanna catastrophe..)

Mira

Thanks K and happy to help 😊

Devyn

@BoyfriendAudio Don’t forget the “Kitichen” in the “Kitchen Help” thumbnail 😉.

alex

I’m usually a silent listener but I’m heavily active on twitter and I saw the thread and was SO confused. You’re amazing. Thank you for addressing this K. 🥺

Cypher Enthusiast

K! Thank you so much for doing this we know you are trying your best to cater everyone. Thank you for being honest and always being personal with us.

sarayu anand

As a POC, do not make an audio in specific because it wouldn’t be authentic no matter what you do. Also we are so many and so special and it wouldn’t be well received by us or by other either and you have nothing so gain. In the end of the day when I’m going to bed I listen to your YouTube beautiful it makes me feel loved and safe and your details about her are vague but it’s usually a nerdy girl. I wanna say a lot of us are nerdy girls here and hence were attracted to your energy. No matter our skin colour, nationality, ethnicity or sexual orientation, we are still these nerdy girl looking for affection. There is no comforting script you could write that would actually be nice to listen to after a day of dealing with racist behavior or when I have bi panic because only a person in my shoes can give me that. On those days I listen to the audios you have about crying for no reason and it’s the best thing. Ive had to deal with serious stuff growing up and even as a 26 year old I get triggered and the only person that can offer me comfort is my best friend because she has been in similar shoes and knows that exact pain. No partner can give me that. But he can love me anyways and try to cheer me up which what your audios are about. Also this is the internet and people can be awful!!! The only thing that had irked me as a bisexual is the jealous audios when you say stuff like guys will talk to you and girls will talk to me but I reply with “ if you leave me for her, I’d seduce her (evil laugh)” Edit: About the trigger warnings! I’m the bi support group that I’m a part, the admins usually post a list of topics that are accepted on the community as trigger warnings and anyone is welcome to add to it. When you make an audio and you aren’t sure just have a post and say Bumbles what you think of this and add the tag. The truth is something that I feel isn’t triggering could hurt someone and it’s better to ask than we sorry you triggered someone. I would be devastated if I caused that because I know exactly how horrible it feels like to be triggered.

ira

i did not know all these things were happening, besides the tw tag issue since it happened on this platform. i dont indulge in the community much, i only post comments here and on youtube and leave once ive consumed your content. but i decided to look up on twitter your name and was surprised by the “exposing thread” you were involved in. i get why this was necessary to address bc some things you were accused of def needed an in depth clarification. but youre right at the end, the internet is a wild place 🥴

amino !!

thank u for clearing things up! i didn’t even know about what was going on on twitter, but i’m glad u addressed the situation with sincerity and honesty. ur always respectful and it’s appreciated !! you’re only human, k <3

OhMyLawdt

Hi 🤟 silent listener here. As a woc, specifically a bw, I don’t think you need a specific race audio. It would be weird if you did this because the way you describe everything in your audios is so vague and general. None of what you put out there do I think “oh this is a white person you’re describing.” It would be fetishy if you did do something like this and not genuine. And it would be so so so forced, please stick to what you do because you do it well. Keep your head up! People need to realize we are all adults (and if you’re not well that’s another issue altogether) and have real lives to lead. The last thing I would want is for you to get attacked and shut this down because of the loud few causing issues (like professorcal). Anyways, thank you for this chat. I actually had no idea this all was going on besides the triggering audio.

OhMyLawdt

This is the main issue here. The silencing of people of differing opinions when we are trying to engage in civil discourse. I think you need to reevaluate why you joined this community and how you think these sorts of comments will 1.) get you taken seriously or 2.) will help you gain the resolution you seek. 😐😐😐just a thought😇

sarayu anand

Yes to gender inclusiveness even in day to day language because hey we exist. The only type of lgbt audio I think he can do could be a partner let him that she is bi and he being supportive of that. I really don’t think people from out of the community capture it well enough. It always falls short!

OhMyLawdt

Yea I mean points were made here. I get it totally. This is a random question (could be because I’m high) just to play devils advocate…he can do an audio using gender neutral pronouns for sure, but since we know he actually 🍆🍆 during his audios he has to sort of put himself in the mindset and believe he’s into the person he’s having sex with in order to make it believable for us the listener, right? He’s said in previous q&a’a that he is extremely straight and I don’t remember if he’s ever said he was into doing something like that. So I mean yeah he could do the audio absolutely, but would it be as good? Would he get the language and certain needs met that your looking for? 🤷🏽‍♀️

OhMyLawdt

But also should state I’m not lgbtq so I don’t really know. Just throwing this out there.

Strawberry Shortcake

Well If he’s extremely straight then why even offer to do lgbt+ audio in the first place. It’s wrong and misleading to those who have actually been waiting rather patiently for one when he’s been saying that can do one.

Emmoi

omg what happened ! Just leave K alone, why does people are so dramatic. He is already busy enough and he is doing his job so perfectly fineeeee. It is not his fault that you choose the toxic relationship, plus, in the trigger audio, you can absolutely know what gonna happen next, if you dont like it, turn it off, easy ?

Ash

@OhMyLawdt- he doesn’t have to picture a dude when making the audio, as a bi woman myself and with friends in the lgbtqia+ community we’re really just asking for gender neutral language to be more inclusive to everyone. if he can’t do that/ doesn’t want to do that, he should tag his audios M4F

OhMyLawdt

Ah, well if he said he would then he probably will. Just be patient he’ll get to it.

Clara Catlady

I think that’s not it. He is a hetero guy who creates boyfriend audios for women because he enjoys it. So this might sound harsh but for ex. men aren’t his target audience. This of course doesn’t mean that as a man you can’t enjoy/watch his content. But you see, if someone isn’t the target audience and you partially do it for your own enjoyment then you don’t change the content to suit that minority. Also, the description of his patreon is “I create female positive boyfriend relationship audios…” so I think it counts as being labelled M4F. I really don’t mean to come across as rude.

Ash

@Clara- i’m not saying all his audios need to be gender neutral, but it would be nice to have some M4A audios once in a while to include those who don’t identify as female. it’s not difficult to use gender neutral language and those who do identify as female wouldn’t even notice much of a difference. if he doesn’t want to, that’s fine, but it’s standard practice for audio creators to tag their audios according to their target audience. not everyone reads the youtube/patreon channel descriptions

simp city

@Sapphy on top of trustworthy, it would definitely have to be someone who’s very well aware of his demographic and willing to think very critically of the possibility of certain outcomes. So yeah, it would be difficult finding someone who checks all the boxes. @bfa there’s only so much one or two people can do and i guess what matters is making the effort and having a community that brings up the overlooked triggers

Strawberry Shortcake

@Clara You act like when I said lgbt I meant that K had to be gay in the audio. You can still have a vagina and not have she/her pronouns. And trans women are not men.

Laila

It’s really refreshing to see these comments. And thanks for this audio. Just confused as the account you said you removed commented earlier?

Ari

@barbie thank god someone said it, as a person with a vagina who is not a female I’m not “forcing” K to do anything different with his content, I just in the past really thought it would be nice to have gender neutral/ male audios, but then I realised that he genders literally everything and I was being very optimistic that it was ever gonna happen, so I just stopped listening, I face enough misgendering in my daily life I didn’t need it here aswell in what used to be a comfort and escape. And we are certainly not “trying to turn him gay” come on that’s just ridiculous 😭

RoRo

@Ashley I totally agree about people who identify as female not noticing the use of gender neutral language. There have been a couple of audios recently that K kept gender neutral and I honestly didn't even notice until the 2nd or 3rd time listening. @Clara Catlady I agree that K shouldn't feel pressured to create audios that he doesn't enjoy, but using gender neutral language wouldn't be catering to a minority, it would mean he could cater to everyone.

simp city

@untitled yes, I’ve heard both terms get used

Isobelwashere

That was very eloquent & well put together K & I think you've handled things really well. The community here & on YouTube has grown exponentially in the last 2 years & as amazing as that is it must also come with a lot of added stress trying to manage everyone's expectations & needs. You can only do what you can at the end of the day & it will be impossible to please all of us all of the time. Personally I think some of the things brought up are a real reach to say the least but at the end of the day everyone here is an adult & we should all be able to handle differing opinions without needing an intervention for every interaction unless parties are acting discriminatory or breaking community rules. Thanks for the content as always ❤

Tibbyies _

There seems to be a big fuss over nothing really, when he said he is willing to try making LGBTQIA+ audios. He didn’t say he “can’t” Barbie, but that it wouldn’t be up to par. But I do agree that that could be something LGBTQIA+ members could help him with. And that gender neutral language/ M4A audios are necessary.

Laila

Third choice of moderator….do not want to make assumptions lol, but I have sent you an email and it would be great if you got back to it. Finished listening to this entire thing, and whilst the racial insensitivity audio incident could have been handled better it´s done now and someone who was part of that discussion….I am extremely over it.

Emmoi

please dont stop the teacher series, K, that is my favorite scenario and i'm above 20 now, dont ruin it, people!

Velveteen Rabbit

Ebony, I hear the phrase "people/women/etc. who identify as X" all the time. One, it's an academic term (see Tanehesi Coates) that refers to the idea that race is a social construct. Also, I've heard the term used by "regular" people to reflect that idea as well. They also use it as a way to not assign a person an identity that they are unsure of. They're acknowledging that it's not their place to say that someone is X or Y. All they can say is how someone else identifies. I don't think that either - "women who identify as woc" or "women of color" - are wrong. Just offering another perspective.

That's NEED, Baby

You’re correct. I did comment earlier. I ultimately ended up deleting it because I didn’t have the heart to publicly say anything against him. Rather than jumping the gun and defending myself publicly regarding half truths, I went ahead and messaged him directly to give him a chance to explain why he said what he said. I want to make sure I am respectful to him, because no matter what he is/ is not being a 💯 truthful about, his work had a profound impact on me and changed the course of my mental state. I don’t want to rob him of that.

Rana

The audio was really put together and well handled I got emotional at the last part 🥺🥺 I'm so proud of how fast the channel and patreon are growing tho I knew it would cause some problems at times because no one can satisfy everyone all the time, I hope things get a bit calmer after this audio cause at the end of the day we are all adults and we are all here to have some good time and escape from the stress we deal with in real life . ☺️❤️ Thanks K for amazing 2 years and for your great content. ❤️

Kawaii

I know this was a serious audio and lots of important things were discussed . . . but did some people get a little turned on at the tone of K’s voice in spots?

Pamela

Hello K, First of all, thank you for explaining these topics. It clears up a lot. Now for the reason I am commenting. You talk about minorities, well I am a minority. I don't know how many other listeners you have on here are physically disabled, but I am physically disabled. I'm not scared to say it. When you posted the list of audios and one of the audios was a NSFW gentle about dealing with a physical disability, I was so excited! I know that you wanted people to vote on what they wanted to hear. I clicked on it so fast you have no idea. However, as a looked at the voting and the comments I noticed many of the listeners didn't want to hear it. I know it's nothing you can do, but what I want to know from listeners, is why don't you want to hear an audio about someone with a physical disability being in a relationship? The disabled community can have sex just like anyone without a disability can. Trust me I've had sex and it was amazing! K, I feel like I'm being pushed aside when it comes to hearing you do an audio that I know you would do an amazing job. I'm literally crying right now writing this. You are such an amazing person K, but I felt like I had to bring this up. Sincerely, Pamela

E.J.

Ahh yeah okay, fair enough, thank you for offering your perspective. I understand what you said about not wanting to assume someone’s race however in this context, there isn’t really anything to be unsure about because woc were already the subject of the conversation. All I’m saying is that a woman of color can only be a woman of color. There is no other identification. You either are or you aren’t. Saying “I identify as a woman of color” implies that there are other races I can identify as. I can’t wake up one day and say “hmm, you know what? I no longer identify as a black woman, today I’m gonna be a white man 🧍🏾‍♀️” lol. That’s kind of hyperbolic but hopefully, that makes sense.

MyBabyBear

Reading through some of these comments, ya'll just taking the fun out of these audios.

MyBabyBear

Can't give yoh the answer you're look for Pamela, but you deserve the same as everyone else.. 😊

Pamela

Thank you BabyBear. I appreciate it. Love your name by the way. <3

Here to cum ig

Lmao I thought i was so weird for it , i was on the verge of exploding

Devyn

I mean technically I don’t think it’s something he’s strongly opposed to, it’s just that he’s not gay. Imaging being a vampire, werewolf etc is all fiction but I don’t believe you could suddenly change your sexuality to fit the nature of the audio especially if it’s not something he’s vibing with. Although, the gender neutral thing I agree with.

E.J.

I’m Black, I will always be Black, and I’m proud to be Black. Personally, I would much prefer an audio celebrating bipoc, than trying to “comfort” us like we’re babies. But that’s just me. (Now I’m going to reiterate what I’ve already said) Even though an audio focusing on racial ignorance is not something I’m all that interested in the audio idea itself was not the problem. The problem was a white woman requesting this audio on a public poll on behalf of her interracial child. She had good intentions and she was hurt but no matter the proximity to bipoc you could never understand what we go through. It simply was not her place. When other woc spoke out she got very emotionally charged and attempted to silence and invalidate their feelings against the audio (basically calling them close-minded for not wanting the audio). Yes, woc are oftentimes unheard and people who aren’t even bipoc do need to stop speaking over us. Racism is not drama and calling it that is incredibly insensitive and ignorant. With all that said, I appreciate you finally addressing the issues and your willingness to listen. I did want to point out some things to keep in mind. I understand that you’re trying to be mindful but you don’t have to say “women who identify as woc.” A woman of color is a woman color. We can’t identify as anything else. Also, your audios may be “inclusive” but your Patreon thumbnails are not. In every single one with a couple, there is always only a white woman being depicted. It’s underrepresentation and it completely takes me out of the audio because it comes across that within the realms of the audio I’m supposed to be a white woman. I recommend either keeping the thumbnails to just a man or doing something similar like your Youtube thumbnails. Thanks, hope this was helpful.

joan

i’m glad you brought up the thumbnails, it’s something i’ve noticed for a while, but have been nervous to mention. it does take me out of the audio sometimes, it’s like a constant reminder that white is the default.

Eniola A

His thumbnails are literally just line art, it’s his style I generally don’t think they’re meant to be race specific

Eniola A

I don’t really understand the point of making a race based audio, whys the difference between how he would treat a white partner or poc partner ???

Tibbyies _

@Eniola Even so, it makes woc uncomfortable. In more than a few thumbnails, and even his twitter banner, it features a thin, white woman. And seeing how you presume they’re not supposed to be “race specific” it’s definitely specific to one race lol. Brushing it off by saying “it’s his style” shows privilege.

That's NEED, Baby

Yes, I did get emotionally charged; many of us did, but it was never my intent to make anyone feel silenced nor to invalidate anyone’s feelings. But yet for this, I have been labeled a racist, a bigot and, in Ks words, shunned from the community. I was not emotionally charged with the intent to silence or invalidate anyone, I was emotional because I was trying to explain the horrendous acts of racism that my daughter was experiencing, and I was feeling unheard and like there was no empathy for what she was going through... this coupled with the fact that’s we had just recently had to get police involved definitely had me in protective Mommy mode. The boys that had a restraining order filed against them are racist and filled with hate. I, however, am not. So, please, to all that have joined in this crusade, stop calling me a racist because it is just not true and is quite hurtful. ** Ebony, not all of this is directed solely towards you, it is more just a brief rundown of what happened from my point of view for all to hear... since no one has ever asked me, including K.

simp city

Eniola, while you might be referring to some of his older audios, anything from the past 9 or so months (at least) has been a photo. I’d imagine finding sensual pictures with mixed race couples wouldn’t be that hard, but would there be a point where it would come off across as fetishizing? Would b/w photos of non-dark-skinned women of colour actually come off across the proper way? A change in aesthetic, maybe? Would there be types of audios were depicting a woc on the thumbnail would be insensitive?

E.J.

Honestly there should be no difference. If you love someone you love someone no matter what race they are. But because society is stupid people in interracial relationships face more challenges and are more heavily judged and ridiculed as opposed to those in same-race relationships.

Eniola A

Yes I totally agree :)

Alyssa

The fact that you had to make this audio in a place where one can choose to stay or go at any time with zero repercussions makes me ashamed to be a human. Triggered? Stop listening. Problem solved. K...this is your little 'home' on the internet. We are visitors. Do what makes YOU happy in YOUR home. Like someone else said, you can't make everyone happy so do what you love and leave it there. You should never have to apologize for your art. As adults, we should all be well aware that eventually someone is going to say something we don't like. What happens then? Nothing. Literally, nothing.

joan

@simp city i do think it’d be hard to find a balance. like how often would the thumbnail be a dark-skinned woc? would k have to start like rationing thumbnails 💀 i think it can get complicated which is why i agree with ebony’s idea of keeping it simple. just having a man, or like a racy image of a mans hands or something. i feel like that’s a simple way to make the thumbnails more inclusive

simp city

@joan ah, the less is more approach sounds great! i know some VAs keep their thumbnails without people in it at all, just with scenes that reflect the audio but at that point i think it’s a personal preference for aesthetic ( not having people in the thumbnails at all )

Julia

As someone who was in the offsite discussion and functioned as a moderator during that call and had to stay impartial, this was what actually happened (for the record I’m a WOC and I have talked to people on both sides of the argument extensively). The contention wasn’t over the audio, it was the fact that when people of colour were talking to a white woman about issues that they feel first hand, the person on the other side was not listening to them and the end result was lets agree to disagree. It was the fact that while they women of colour were trying to calmly explain their points, the person on the opposing side was telling them that they’re not being supportive of her, among other things. Then when the WOC were getting a bit more heated, the other person had calmed down and tried to clam everyone else down, which came across as the WOC being silenced. While she had good intentions for the audio request, optically it wasn’t dealt with properly. While she had consulted with some WOC about their opinions on this previous to mentioning it to the chat, everyone in the call was against the sentiment because not all WOC are the same and we all struggle with racism differently. In the end an audio like that would boil down to “l love you because of your race” or “I love you despite your race”. Also K is a white man himself and it can come off as him being a white saviour, so in the end there would be always be someone who would have a problem with the audio and it could cause more drama than doing good. K’s audios keep the listener racially ambiguous, and while he doesn’t mention a race in particular, phrases such as “running my fingers through your hair” and “I can see your blushing” do make the listener more Euro-centric, but these are nuances that POC choose to ignore. Also because this person had frequent interactions with K, it felt like a power imbalance because people thought her request held more value than everyone else’s. At the end of the day, she was not being racist, nor would I say she is a racist person. This was ignorant behaviour, but not racist or bigoted behaviour. She was feeling invalidated because everyone in the room was disagreeing with her, but what didn’t come across to her was that this was deeper than just an audio idea. The point that the WOC were trying to make was that while she may be related to a POC, herself as a white person cannot talk over actual WOC that go through the experiences her relative does.

Julia

The reason why that person’s behaviour was brought up to K (even though it was an offsite discussion) was because people were told about the frequent interactions between K and the person in question. It was a situation of K being judged by the company he keeps around. In other words, If this person is racist (which they’re not), then therefore it means that K is racist because they’re friends. K and said person are two grown adults and in my opinion one’s behaviour should not reflect on K. I also don’t think that the people who weren’t included in the conversation should be passing judgement on any party because they weren’t there

Hannah Snow

Eniola is a Nigerian name, meaning this commenter is also black. While you may disagree, you can't say that she's "talking over woc" as if she's not also a woc

eia

Thanks for the clarification, Zee! It is helpful for us to know what REALLY went down. I do hope that all parties will learn after this incident, and K will do his efforts to prevent this from happening again. Shout out to those WOC on stating issues they face! ❤️

Jas

There is so much mature conversation going on in this comment section, it really is such a joy to see! As a black woman myself, I’ve always found the idea of POC-centered audios to be a very tricky one because there’s truly no way for it to be done 100% correctly because not all POC are the same and live the same experiences. While some people might take comfort in audios related to being comforted for experiences with racism/prejudice, some don’t enjoy those at all. For black women specifically, a lot of us cannot have someone easily run their hands through their hair or be able to tell when we blush, but there are many instances where those things are possible, because we are all so different. I do really appreciate K both being open to the idea and also taking the time to hear the opinions of POC/WOC and make a decision he felt would benefit everyone in the long run. As much as those audio types might be desired, I really feel like it’s not possible for anyone, let alone a white man, to execute it so well to the point that there are no complaints from any side. I think K has always done a great job of keeping his descriptions vague enough so that just about anyone can fit themselves into the audio, and while there are some small things that could maybe be fixed to make the experience more immersive (for example the thumbnails, which I had never even noticed typically tended to involve only skinny white women), I think he’s done a great job overall, and it’s so refreshing to see how open he is to constructive criticism.

E.J.

Thank you I was not aware, it was wrong of me and for that I apologize to Eniola for the combative tone of the comment and for making the presumption that she wasn’t a woc.

Pamela

Zey, I would also love to get an audio like this sometime. I think people need to be exposed to this.

sarayu anand

I get what you mean but I don’t think it’s his intention. It fucking sucks that there is so much stuff out there that white people relate to but POC can’t. These are the effects of racism from that last century. In general, if you aren’t a POC step back in a conversation. No matter what you feel they have it harder.

That's NEED, Baby

** I think everyone can figure out that I am “said person* and I honestly have nothing to hide, so I’m fine with people addressing me by name. Also, if you are not interested in details of what I have been involved in, you should skip this comment** Thank you Zee, I think that is a good summary of what happened and I appreciate the detail. But, If you are saying I am not racist, then why was there a need to involve K at all? Because I am ignorant? Because a group of people claim that me encouraging community board participation is considered me being a dictator? That I discouraged people from participating in the community? It just doesn’t make sense to me. I know that a group of you would answer “yes” to all the questions I just listed and there is nothing I can do to change that, but to say I was a bigot, a negative force in this community and that I should be removed is absolutely not fair. I did nothing so bad that K should be chastised for, just for being “associated with me”, to the point he wants me gone. I got screwed big time, and not in a good way. The only times my interactions with K were explicitly brought up to the group were 1) his response to 2 celebration audios we made for him and 2) me telling them about the SFW posts I was going to make, per his request to me. Outside of angels, only 2 other people that I trusted knew any details about further interactions with him. I just can’t wrap my head around the thought that patrons, or K, think I did something so damaging that it warranted having my name and reputation dragged through the mud, or me being asked to leave. I feel completely screwed, and not in the good way. In have also been receiving horrible, cruel messages outside of Patreon that have been very upsetting. So please do not attack me, I have had to deal with enough of that from some of you over the past few months. The inconsiderate way I have been dealt with is honestly making me feel like an idiot...like the 2 years that I worked so hard to help make this a supportive and inclusive community has been taken for granted and like it was all for nothing. The majority of this whole situation is supposedly happening because I did not know the etiquette of speaking over POC. I bet most white people here had no idea either, but I hope hearing the impact my ignorance made on POC provides them with a lesson that I learned the hard way. I hadn’t really planned on going into detail in the comments, but it seemed like a good time given others were bringing it up. And if you think I am divulging too much, trust me when I say I had to edit this comment a few times to edit out details that, had I brought the up, I would later regret cause that’s just not my style. I now know that it is not the that intent that matters, it’s the impact... but please believe me when I say I had nothing but good intent in this incident, honestly. For anyone that was hurt by my ignorance, I am sorry. Truly. Thanks for letting me speak and again, please don’t come at me, my mental health has taken a beating lately and I just can’t deal with more hate. Edit to say: this is not so much directed at Zee, just more general thoughts.

Julia

I’ve never said anything about you nor have I ever attacked you. If anything I’ve tried to defend you and try to make people see things from your point of view. Also I’ve never come for you. I didn’t even name you in this post for that reason, it doesn’t matter whether or not people know it’s you, I don’t want to be part of talking ill about anyone on the internet. All I’ve done since March (before the drama even got to K) was try to mediate situations with people who had a problem with you, and while this is a response to my post and not meant to be directed at me, it could have been worded better to be more generic as opposed to a singular “you”

Kawaii

Hey Patti, I just want to say that you made the community feel warm and welcoming. I remember when I first joined Patreon a few years ago and was disappointed there was no action in the comment section. It was completely dead. I didn’t even know if we were supposed to post there. Then you started posting and livened it up and sparked conversation and helped people connect. It got fun and made this place feel like a community as opposed to a monthly subscription. Thank you! I’m sorry you got stuck in all this drama. It seems the community has chewed you up and spit you out. I’m sorry. I’m not saying who was right or wrong because I wasn’t involved in those discussions, but I liked you in the community and I miss the energy you brought.

simp city

@Patti: Ok but Zee did state that this is *her* opinion and she has mentioned made the separation of yourself and K so I don’t understand why she should be put on the spot to answer that question. I honestly hope that you are not suggesting what I think you are, but that’s a different thing entirely. And while I just now see the edit, I would like to point out that the phrasing there should’ve been taken into consideration before Zee’s comment. This is a nuance people pick up, but if someone has hurt someone’s feelings, the way they express themselves later on becomes crucial. A lot can be read a certain type of way and it was through no lack of effort from the admin side that there were multiple attempts to mitigate this from the ground up. This behaviour that people are coming forward with clearly wasn’t that subtle because the amount of messages I have got about it has given me whiplash. Should these messages have been directed to the person in question? Absolutely! But it is also a matter of how the vibe comes off across and if others feel like they can approach someone with concerns. At the end of the day, I can not and will not speak in place of how WoC would feel with certain interactions but in the year 2021 saying that one is not versed in “the etiquette behind talking to PoC” is at best, neglectful; there are resources to do better when engaging in sensitive topics. At the end of the day, people were hurt, and while everyone is entitled to their own opinion and their own experiences, there is something to be said about the power imbalance that was perceived in that discussion. The hate messages, btw, are absolutely deplorable. It is wildly inappropriate to be harassing someone in private not to mention not productive at all. It is a big stepping stone to come out and confront this head on. You’ve been a pivotal part in this community and that could also very well be the reasoning behind the gravity of the situation. I hope your willingness for transparency helps ease some minds. All that being said, there is always space to learn and do better. It’s not easy but as one’s surroundings grow and as this community grows, it is necessary. Please consider this moving forward.

sarayu anand

Saying that you do not know to interact with POC is a ridiculous excuse given the last year. From our shoes, we deal with a long of ignorant people everyday and even if isn’t intentional it does sting and add up. Even as a POC I was ignorant and said thing that caused pain to others and I am incredibly careful to not repeat that ever. I never made excuses of explained myself. I was a wrong and I knew it even if I was ignorant 17 year old. I caused harm. You could have made an honest mistake but I really don’t think you get it by the comments I’ve seen on this post.

That's NEED, Baby

Wether my wording passes the your test or not, it was clear this was not mean toward you personally. So as I pleaded already, please don’t come at me with semantics. What I have to say about your involvement is this: instead of feeling the need to insert yourself to help either me or K, I wished you would have just had all concerned parties bring their issues directly to me and K in the first place. Regardless of their comfort level with me, this was my battle to fight and I never even made it in the ring because you felt like it was ok to speak on our behalf to this group. I feel that if I had been involved from the beginning and had been educated on the problem at hand right away by the POC who had grievances, I could have had a chance to make this right by them in my own way. I know you told me you made up stories on Ks behalf without his permission to appease them, so surely he would agree (but I can’t speak for him). Thing that get me is this - you knew I was confused when I was sent that email from the anon chat and, even tough I was crystal clear with you about not knowing who sent the email, nor their grievances toward me, you chose not to let me know. it wasn’t until until a while after the12 page document was in Ks hands and after he and I had a conversation about it, that I had any idea that this issue was still circulating. I left that phone conversation from February thinking everything was ok, that we all understood each other and all felt like we had a chance to say our piece. I had no clue until K brought it up to me. Not 1 heads up from you. I would have thought I’d get a hint or something, especially since you had an explicit phone call with me after the chat assuring me that you were on my side. I feel like all parties involved have a slightly different story than the next. I was only trying to share my experience in all of this. I have politely pleaded to the group to keep interactions with me friendly for the sake of trying to keep the conversations as mature as possible. Please. Everyone deserves to read about comments that are civilized.

Yoshi

What the hell happened here. 😕

Julia

Instead of coming at me and responding from an account that K “removed” to make a point, why don’t you do some self reflecting on all your actions that have led to this point and the fact that this seems to be an issue people only have with you. This is a private conversation to be had, but since you want to speak on everything publicly, I had told you on multiple occasions about what it means to act as an admin and coming in with accusations and asking people “why haven’t you been active on the comm board” or stirring things up by privately talking ill about people in the community was not appropriate. Nor was it appropriate to come in guns a blazing when anyone remotely disagreed with you. It is very hard to talk to you when everyone has to tip toe around the topic to spare your feelings, and it’s quite disappointing that you don’t offer the same courtesy back. I was on the phone with one of the angels for 2 hours because she didn’t know how to bring up the 12 page document to you. So yes I didn’t tell you because as soon as you found out about the issue, your solution was to take legal action against the people who hadn’t even posted anything publicly. Or about the time you closed the chat after the POC audio discussion because you viewed the members who disagreed with you as “shit disturbers” in your own words. Let’s also not forget that your reaction though this entire ordeal was being worried about how K would perceive you. Not once did you stop and think about the precautions of your behaviour. I encourage you to think deeper before you want to come for me because there is a lot that I choose to keep quiet about out of respect for all the engagement you’ve garnered for this community.

simp city

I absolutely will not be talking about personal issues on a very public place.l, mostly because there are bigger problems at hand.

RoRo_62

I agree with everything you said. Thank you for bringing up the thumbnails and I hope he reads that.

That's NEED, Baby

@simp The question were rhetorical. I’ve made an effort to learn as much as I can since this incident and now you’re gonna tell me I was neglectful. I am just so over being picked apart.

That's NEED, Baby

Kawaii, if you see this, thank you for saying those things. Even thought I did not personally know you, your support means so much to me right now. I am glad I was able to help you experience the community in a positive way. I miss it too.

Yoshi

So I’m not really one to comment, but after fully listening to the audio I have a lot of opinions/suggestions. I think it’s really good that you’re listening to all sides of your community, the good and the bad- it helps grow and refine your actions :) I would really suggest looking into moderators,, even though they can be spotty.. It’s hard to judge a random person (especially one on the Internet) just through a couple of words for sure,, but getting to know a potential moderator might help a bit! Your community has grown a lot, and it won’t be as easy to manage things by yourself anymore…

eve l

I'm really not trying to instigate here, but if K has given you multiple warnings and then politely asks you to leave the community and not be involved in it anymore, you shouldn't come back and so desperately try to clear your name.. that doesn't make it seem like you're sorry, it makes it seem like you care more about clearing your name and it's sad especially as a WOC

Yoshi

As for poc-inclusive audios,, I believe it would be best to avoid nsfw audios specifically dedicated to poc women.. I am a poc myself,, and the idea listening to an audio hyper focused on “black female attributes” makes me incredibly uncomfortable? It could come across as fetishization rather than appreciation if that makes sense.. But just because I would want you to avoid those kinds of nsfw audios doesn’t mean you shouldn’t avoid the poc community and their issues! You should try your best to learn more about the poc community, and if that means asking questions then by all means do ask :)

That's NEED, Baby

Ok, Zee. If you think I had all these chances you speak of, your timeline of events and facts regarding what I knew and when I found out, are off, greatly. So until we reconcile yours vs mine, you are going to keep snapping at me and incorrectly stating things about me. Also, I thought I was direct but you have a really mean and hateful way of trying to get your point across. It’s just not called for. Yes, I am talking about what happened, but in a civilized manner. You make it dirty with your cruel approach and how you you are choosing to address me. And yeah I was concerned about K, of course I was. but not about how he would feel about me, just concerned this unnecessary drama would deter him away from doing audios. And again, at that point I had no clue who sent the email so how could I know what I needed to do to fix it. And for the record he did not remove me nor did he ask me to leave, but this is not a place I no longer feel safe in l, so I will be leaving soon. I wished everyone (not talking about POC, specifically talking about the admin group Zee is speaking) want worried about being PC all of the time, this is supposed to be a fun place and I honestly thought I helped make it that way, not seeming made it miserable for everyone.

Yoshi

Anyways,, I hope what I said made sense- I’m incredibly tired right now so if I’ve said something stupid please correct me! I’d like to hear other people’s thoughts :0

Julia

Good for you Patti. Do what makes you happy.

eve l

You wished everyone wasn't so "worried about being pc all the time"? That comes across as very trivializing considering how many WOC have been hurt and felt stepped over by you. It's just not fair to say that

That's NEED, Baby

@eve thank you for educating me. I added a note, I hope this is enough.

That's NEED, Baby

@ eve I did not get a warning at all, much less multiple warnings and like I said, I was not asked to leave. I’m not trying to clear my name, just tell my side of the story.

Pamela

K, I know I don't really talk much on here. However I do agree that since you have more Patrons here than you have in the past, you might look into having Moderators. People who you can truly trust. Maybe ask if anyone would like to have a role as a moderator. Explain what all entails in the job and what the qualifications would be. I know as a moderator, one must not hold favoritism, must look at all comments with an open mind, take all sides of the topic. Know when to step in and when to not. Most importantly not have a biased opinion on certain subjects. Also not be afraid to take criticism and grow from it. I don't know if you want to have moderators, but if you do, hopefully some of these ideas of what a moderator should do would help you decide. Hope you read this. Pamela

dundermifflin

In no way am I coming for anyone in this thread as I was hoping it would have been settled by now, but there is obviously some confusion that probably needs to be cleared up in order for this to end. K says he asked @that's need baby to leave(or take a break?), they are saying he didn’t. I’d hate to think after listening to that audio and believing that he was being genuine and transparent, that he was actually not being 100% truthful in some aspects. I hope he comes on here and clarifies because that would just be wrong if he wasn’t being honest. Not only to the listeners, but honestly to @that's need baby as well. I do think it definitely was not her place at all to request an audio like that but, if she really wasn’t asked to leave then that kind of changes how K claims this went down:/ PS~ Zee I think you explained what happened in a very mature and clear way in my opinion. Edit: I was trying to edit a typo I made and accidentally deleted this lol sorry:)

maplebooth

K, You said you gave the individual a warning, and asked them to leave the community as a whole after a second complaint was lodged a few months later. You said you asked them to leave. However, the individual has explicitly said on this post that they did not get a warning from you at all and was not asked to leave. It’s just that you sounded so sincere saying all that. I’m not trying to accuse you of lying or anything but, what you are saying is the complete opposite of what they said. Would just like an explanation on this <3

Mila^_^

I don't usually comment but I felt the need to do so. As many others have mentioned, moderators are a great idea. I know you expressed your hesitation due to bad experiences, but you need them. Your following is too big and you will end up drowning. Many things can be missed since your are only one person. I would suggest getting to know your moderators before deciding. Like you said you take time to make decisions and that is smart, pls do the same with this. I just don't want to see things end bad for you. You seem like a really nice guy and your getting even better with your audios each time. I believe you handled this with the delicacy needed and admire you for it. I hope you continue do well :) Edit: After going thru the comments once again… someone is lying because these stories are polar opposites. I’m sorry K but replying to individual comments is not doing it right now. Ppl tried to keep everything private but it’s all out in the open now. Ppl are still hurt and from what I’ve seen “said” person is still being insensitive in replies. This situation is a lot bigger than you made it seem. This is not just something we or you can walk away from. I’m not saying make another audio. You can do whatever you want it’s your platform but you need to clear the air with full transparency. This is a chance for everyone to learn since the damage has already been done. I just feel as woc we’re going thru the trenches again with another VA. I wanna be positive about this but the light audio vs this comment sections is too much. Take your time, do what you gotta do but please address these comments. That’s all I got to say. Also in a situation like rn, these comments? Could have been handled privately because obviously we were not supposed to know everything since the specifics were barely discussed in the audio.

BoyfriendAudio

Patti, I have tried my best to be as gentle as possible. I went back and read everything to see if I'm miss-remembering. The first time we discussed this, I listened to your side. I was very positive and optimistic that this was misunderstanding, or a falling out of friends. You've done a lot of work here. But yes, you were on watch from that point, it wasn't personal, just a mental note that a complaint was filed. I was satisfied there wouldn't be anymore issues of people feeling talked over. I was relieved. The second complaint, I stated the grievances, and I asked you to take a break. You said you wouldn't be seen again. After consideration, I felt it was for the best. I cut off all communication. I haven't seen you around here since. Both of you believe I'm taking the other person's side. And this is where you and everyone gets a fair place to state your positions. And now, I'm closing this chapter. x (Edit: Please do not send negative emails to people. If you can't tell, these are all people whose hearts have gone through the wringer. Thanks)

BoyfriendAudio

I thought it was correct because we have trans people in the community who could also be people of color. So I probably should have just said people of color. My bad. x

MyBabyBear

Honestly, I agree with this. He will not impress everyone, somebody, somewhere, somehow will be offended by it. He really can't satisfy each and everyone's desire, There's 190k subs on YT and over 4000 here, that is ALOT of people to please. I manage a group of 20 people at work, I don't even remember half their names. The one thing K does is listen to us, he goes with majority, that's why he has polls and such. We are so many, it will get to a point where one way or another somebody will be offended by something.

sage ❦

sorry Mila I didn’t mean to respond to your comment I was trying to just regularly comment :)

BoyfriendAudio

It's on the docket. Beginning of next month, and long overdue I'd say. Hope I can do justice to it. ^^

Mila^_^

No prob sage 😊

BoyfriendAudio

Definitely aware of this. Basically I collect cute clipart, couple goals, relationship goals, cuddly goals, and it's hard to find diverse clip art like that that doesn't show faces. If anyone has any suggestions or sweet clipart, send it my way! (And I said identified as WOC because we have trans people here too. So I probably should of said people of color. My bad.) x

Alyssa

Cute, Safa but you're comparing apples and oranges. Not even in the same wheelhouse. 🙄

Here to cum ig

Race is inheritable, it’s always pre-determined. You can’t identify as another race. In contrast, gender and sexuality are not. You can’t determine the gender nor the sexuality of the baby and their identity, it’s not something you “inherit”. That’s why trans people have to identify as what category they feel they belong to. And with you referring to race being a “social construct” it’s in some way justifying transracialism, which is disastrous.

Here to cum ig

Such a gentleman 🙄 (hope you get the audio you want, pamela)

joan

people who were triggered couldnt just stop listening because there was no trigger warning initially. that was what was making people upset. obviously the rude language and fighting wasn’t necessary, but the situation really was never as simple as ‘stop listening’

Here to cum ig

Also it’s important to mention that people are paying monthly to listen to these audios to feel safe and warm, and have a nice “relationship experience “. Telling people to simply “stop listening “ because theyre triggered ,as a result of the previous criteria not being met, defeats the whole purpose of all of this.

Alyssa

No actually it IS as simple as stop listening. You can cancel your sub at any time. Also, Safa, saying "annoyed?, keep scrolling", is exactly the same as " triggered, stop listening". Seriously, EXACTLY the same! 😆

Here to cum ig

Omg!! Really? glad you figured it out!! Thanks for letting me know!! You’re genuinely so smart<3

RoRo

Requesting that people who have a problem just leave is exactly the kind of invalidating and dismissive behaviour that K is apologising for in this audio. And presumably he doesn't agree or he wouldn't be going to all this effort to address these issues. To suggest that people just leave is dismissive of the work he's putting in to ensure that all his listeners have a safe and enjoyable stay in his "home".

Alyssa

And NOW, so are you! Peace, love and education.

E.J.

Ohh I see you meant people of color who identify as women. So in other words... women of color 🤣 all good though thank you for clarifying.

Alyssa

Goodness, I'm sorry ladies. I guess I've just been in the real world for way too long. We never even used the word triggered until recently. With all due respect, if you have had emotional or sexual trauma, it's just not a good idea to listen to 18+ audios. I'm sorry for everything you have experienced but really it's just not the responsibility of random content providers on the internet that you will never meet. YOU are solely responsible for knowing what you can handle. Take care of yourselves out there. ✌❤

Alyssa

Resorting to insults indicates you may not be old enough for this forum. If you are old enough, I apologize for triggering your issues. Be well. 👍

Alyssa

It takes a lot to hurt my feelings, Ana. In life, nobody cares about your feelings except your own circle. That's really the point I was trying to make here. It's a cruel world. I'm not quite as old as your granny, not quite as young as you biut I've been on my own since I was 16. I have learned that my feelings are mine to deal with. No one is responsible for how I feel. I'm not trying to be the forum Mom, but I am trying to share my life experience with anyone who may benefit. We are all in this together, just at different life intervals. I truly love all people and if I see someone setting themselves up for hurt, disappointment or failure I'm going to try to help. Sometimes it's tough love, though. Stay kind, my friend!

Pamela

K, First off, thank you so much! When I received the notification that you had responded and that you were going to do the audio, I literally cried. I can't begin to tell you how much this warms my heart. I know for a fact you are going to do an amazing job! Now I know you said NSFW gentle, but if you want to add a little spice into the story line, it would be fine by me. ;-) Sincerely, Pamela

Velveteen Rabbit

First, I am in no way justifying transracialism. But, race is totally a social construct. (That doesn't mean it doesn't exist.) This has been established scientifically, medically, etc. Race does not exist biologically. We as a society created the idea of race to explain the differences b/w groups of people based on their geography and physical characteristics and to then justify the exploitation, etc., of peoples. Gender is also a social construct. Society decided what things signify "male" and what things signify "female," etc. Sex is not a social construct and is biological.

OhMyLawdt

THIS!! " It’s almost as if some members have developed a sense of entitlement" Yes! And unfortunately what happens is the obsessive need to "control" these VA ends with everyone just quitting because they don't feel like it's worth the hassle. I can name at least 10 VA off the top of my head this has happened to and it makes me sad. Can never have too much a good thing I'm afraid.

Lula C

Alyssa I agree with you especially with these words: "my feelings are mine to deal with. No one is responsible for how I feel." And " K this is your little 'home' on the internet. We are visitors. Do what makes YOU happy in YOUR home.... do what you love and leave it there." Sorry for the bad moments some of you have experienced, but we need to understand that K hasnt the power to read our minds or lifes, he is just doing audios, and that audios are fantasy! Bumbles dont take them serously please 🙏🏼 And K , remember you cant satisfy everyone's desire.

Kawaii

K is right. It can be really hard to find thumbnails of people of colour. I had a project in Saudi Arabia and tried SO hard to find stock photos that represented my clients. I couldn’t. Sometimes it’s nearly impossible. It isn’t right and there needs to be better representation in stock art and stock photos.

That's NEED, Baby

@K I have no reason to lie, aka a channel to protect, but was trying to be mindful that you did. But, after you posted this people again started sending me messages calling me and lunatic stalker, bigot, dictator, and other things that I will not repeat. I NEED to make these people stop. Like I have previously said, my mental health is not good right now and these attacks are not OK. Unfortunately, I feel like the only thing that might make them stop is to give details that show why I think you are either 1) not being honest of how this went down or 2) your "gentle" communication style is very misleading. That said, here are the facts, strait from my DMs (I am speaking to various parties, so my language will change back and forth accordingly): 6/22 -You claim in your Housekeeping audio that you gave me a warning because you believe in second chances. However, you literally just said in your comment above that you "made a mental note" and to me a warning is only given if you actually inform the other party. And why would I have any reason to believe I was on watch (your words) when you very clearly made me feel like I did nothing wrong. And I think I am justified in feeling this way because you said to me, and I quote " honestly I read all the screenshots like three times and I didn't see anything wrong with any of it!!" and "And honestly yeah, it's made me feel like shit. But I also see you here posting and encouraging people and making them feel amazing! And actions speak so much louder than words. And you have been such a crazy positive force. I'm pretty sure you kept this ship together more than once haha." they did ask me to remove you, but I think we just need to relax." was another indicator that all was good. And then you ended this conversation with " thank you for letting me vent". Based on all of this, how was I supposed to know you considered this conversation as a warning? 6/27 - I reached out to you said " If me leaving would make your life easier" I will do it. 6/28 - Your response to this was "No way! Please don't stress over it". There is still no indication that I am on warning, and you seemed pretty firm on the fact that you did not want me to leave. ~ during this time more emails were sent from the anonymous group to K. and from private email addresses. And yes, you did tell me what the grievances were in these notes, but again, you never heard me out regarding these new claims. ~ 7/5 - This piece is important because it explains why I am still here. This is the day you claimed to ask me to “leave”. Did I misinterpret when you said, “I’m not asking you to leave, I’m asking you to take a break” and “I don't know the heart of the matter, and that is why I'm just asking, please. Stick around but take a break.”? Because to me none of that says hey Patti, see yourself out. It meant take a break for posting and commenting. In addition, if in your mind you were intending to rid of me, I would really hope some sign of thanks or appreciation would have been conveyed, which there was not. You said that I told you that I “wouldn't be seen again” when my actual words were "And I do understand where you are coming from and will 100% support" and "I will respect your wishes, of course". Again, I thought I was not agreeing to leave, but to stay silent until further notice, seeing as you told me we were going to "play it by ear". Also, when you say that you considered my side at length before making a decision, I disagree. To me this is the most important part of why I am frustrated. I specifically said to you that night (7/5) "I would love to defend myself", which you did not acknowledge. Yes, you are correct in that I gave you a very high-level recollection on 6/22 of what I knew was going on at the time, which wasn’t very much because at this point, I did not even know exactly what the grievances/reason for you to come to a conclusion about me were. Had I known at the time that you were looking into things at that level, you wouldn’t have even had to ask, I would have told you on my own will because I also felt very unheard and dismissed. But I didn't want to bog you down with my grievances if it was not absolutely necessary because I didn’t want to add to your stress. Turns out it was necessary. There were so many moving parts to all of this; and I did not find out that grievances remained or that certain people were involved until 5 months after the incident. By then, everyone that was involved was already at peak frustration level because they felt like K was not responsive and was not following through with what he said he would do. And I am sure K was at peak frustration level also. It wasn't until then I even knew that any of this was going down. It sucks because I feel like this all could have been avoided if the WOC and others that took issue with me had been directed to me or you instead of others stepping in to mediate. And yes, I know it is being said that people were not comfortable coming to me directly, but that still does not give anyone the right to step in on my behalf without my knowledge. At a minimum, I should have been made aware of what was going on. I do not know everyone who was involved in reaching out to you, but I do know for sure it was an orchestrated effort (yes, I have receipts). Lastly, in the Housekeeping audio you stated that you went back and looked at messages and that I tried to reach out to you one time you a month ago to ask you to send a note to the community telling them I was gone (I NEVER sent a message like this). Why would I ask you to do that if I never even left? Makes zero sense. What I did send to you on 3 different occasions, among support messages, were notes that I was concerned that me still being around would backfire and suggested that I leave, so you had to know I never left altogether. *Worth noting, I also suggested to one of the mediators that I leave and provide proof to satisfy their demands, but I was told that was not good enough because they wanted K to actually remove me himself to make a point. The intent of this post is not to go back and forth with anyone about small details or cause anyone to get defensive - it just is what it is. The intent was to give facts about how this all went down so that people could come to conclusion that is based on hard facts in hopes that harassing me will STOP. K, I know you are just trying to navigate your way through something that is extremely sensitive to all parties involved, and I feel for you and wouldn't want to be in your shoes at all. But I think you are smart enough, and I thought you were loyal enough, friendly enough and that I had done enough for community that you would have figured out a solution to satisfy both sides instead of just one party. I am again left feeling foolish because I really thought that after you saw that I had grievances of my own that you would hear me out and then re-evaluate your decision. But your “And now, I'm closing this chapter” squashes that I suppose. And please know that it is killing me to make this post but clearing this up once and for all is the only hope I have of getting the harassment to stop. I never in a million years thought it would end like this. So, after 1 100K milestone celebration, hundreds of hours planning for the community, tons of posts, 3,221 comments, 3 angels, 44 VIP bulletins, 88 DM conversations between us (yes I counted them), a few life stories and musing, and countless good feels, I just want you to know that I am grateful for everything you have done for me and want to remind that when you are feeling down to go listen to all the messages that were made for you on the 100K audio, and always remember that you are special and that you impact so many lives. And since I won’t be around to tell you, congrats on 200K subs and 5K patrons. I sincerely wish you and everyone here the best. Be good to each other! And K, always remember you are the best there is. 💙

Kawaii

Thanks Patti! I’ll miss you if you leave. Really, the community section hasn’t been the same without you. Your comments were funny and smart and encouraging. You did put in a lot of free hours to build the community. Thank you!

Kawaii

Patti, I like you a lot. I’ve learned from past experience if you want hateful messages to stop, stop responding to them. I know it’s hard, but if you keep responding you keep fuelling the fire. You have cleared your side as best you could. If you stop responding to emails and private messages from other people they will tire out and stop messaging you . . . eventually. I’m not trying to silence you, just giving some real life advice I’ve learned.

Eniola A

Thanks it’s alright :p

Sara

Wow that was quite some detail. I'm not saying I don't believe you, buuutttt...typed out quotations aren't always reliable. 'Pics or it didn't happen' as they say. May I also ask what a VIP bulletin is? I was under the impression there were no VIPs or elite cliques around here? I'm sorry you've had to deal with unpleasant messages, of course that is absolutely unacceptable whatever the situation.

Nova

Silent listener here, I’ve never commented before but I often read through the comments for a laugh and it has generally been quite pleasant. I’m sorry to see the current discord that has spread and I hope you’re OK. Taking away titles of Creator and Patrons, for one sole person to receive such messages is upsetting and I say this as a listener who has only read a handful of them. I can imagine the idea of mods is pretty daunting perhaps the higher tier may be able to help? As a Patron, I’ve enjoyed all your work and benefited in more ways than one myself and I believe you’re more than capable of continuing to take care of this creative endeavour of yours. As it is just that, yours. But I hope you’re keeping well and looking after yourself.

Here to cum ig

When is it my turn to privately chat with you, and tell you a few life stories ,k?💀

Hannah Snow

out of curiosity, what are angels? I've been here for years but idk what that is

Van

Hannah, K has made it clear since his Q&A part 4 that they are people who have helped build this community. I don't think it should be regarded as an elite clique. They were here for a long time, they are pivotal in turning this into a welcoming place for patrons, as evidenced by Kawaii and Pamela's comments. And Safa, I know you are being sarcastic, but K has said he considered to make Patti a moderator. And I think its reasonable to get to know someone before allowing them to monitor his community. After all, as most people here have suggested, he should find someone he trusts.

eve l

heyy i just wanted to say i agree with you! as a woc i really, really wanna feel like i'm welcomed in this community but it's kinda difficult right now. i'm hesitant to say much at all though because we're often reduced to being over-dramatic. D:

Mila^_^

@eve I get you. Don’t ever let anyone make you second guess what makes you feel unwelcome or uncomfortable. Your POV is valid and needs to be heard. It’s seems like too common of a practice to speak over woc voices in every community sadly. Hoping for change 😞

Hannah Snow

thanks for the response! it was just a genuine question. even tho I've been listening for a while, K's audios aren't a huge part of my life so it's easy to forget names for things. now that you've said that I'm familiar with it, I just couldn't remember that they were called angels. I never said or implied that it was an elite clique and I don't think it was really necessary to act like I was trying to say that. I was only asking for the sake of having a bit more context

Van

No Hannah my apologies for not being clear, I was actually replying to you, Sara and Safa at the same time. I should have made it clear. Sorry for making you feel that way.

maplebooth

Thank you Patti for your honesty and transparency. You don’t deserve hateful messages and emails being bombarded to you. Nobody does. As a POC, with the information on this thread, I don’t think you’re racist either. Rather, ignorant. I agree with Zee and I believe what she has said here. That’s all I say about that though as I wasn’t involved in the conversation. Regardless of how you treated other members or how you were behind close doors, there’s no doubt that you and the other angels made the community more lively and made newcomers feel welcomed. If what Patti said is true, K, you have broken my trust and I’m sure, the trust of many others here. I didn’t want to believe that you would lie, but it seems like you did. You weren’t honest to all of us and to the person that has been said to be the closest to you. As much as I hate to think it, I can’t help but wonder if you’ve been dishonest about anything else other than this on here. Feel free to prove if these accusations are just plain accusations. Despite all this, I do believe you are a good person with good intentions. That’s why I’m still here. You’ve helped me and countless other people with your audios. I appreciate you and could not thank you enough for what you do. Thank you. <3 But still, there were things handled poorly you’ve made bad decisions. A lot of people were hurt due to the way things were handled. People outside and inside. Let this be something we all learn from so no more people get hurt in the future. Like @Mila said, It’s important for you to clear the air with full transparency so that we can all move on once and for all. Only then should you close this chapter. Take your time if needed <3

Sara

@Van - Thanks for your explanation. To be clear, mine was also a genuine question. Are you saying that the VIP bulletins are something pertaining only to the 3 angels? I think it's fair to be confused at the use of the phrase 'VIP' when K has clearly stated that there are no elite cliques in the community. Having said that, if the angels were just a group of people who have helped build this community and didn't actually have any official moderating powers etc., then I don't actually think it's unreasonable to refer to them as an elite clique. There are plenty of people posting comments/community board posts everyday. A community is built by everyone within it, not just a few. Regarding your point about K considering making Patti a moderator, I think it's well known to people who have been here a while that Patti has been a long time 'favorite' of K's. He didn't get to know her because he was considering making her a mod. He was considering making her a mod because he had got to know her. To be clear, I don't think that's a problem per se, K is entitled to get to know whoever he wants within the community, but if what Patti has said is true then he has clearly lied about not being in close contact with any listeners, which of course begs the question, what else has he lied about? And to be clear, me saying 'pics or it didn't happen' also applies to K.

MyBabyBear

Anybody else feel super irrelevant? 😂, K, I can help out with the channel too, you need advertising? I got you!! On a serious note though, it's sad to see what's transpired, we live in very sensitive times, anything said can easily be misunderstood and taken as offensive, especially when it comes to race - but we also need to accept an apology and be quick to forgive. To Patti (I think that's her name) I'm glad you apologized, that's the way to go and I'm sorry that you're receiving any kind of hate, nobody deserves that! I wish you nothing that the best, peace and love in all you do. To K, also sorry that a channel you meant for positivity, fairness and fantasy has birthed this kind of chaos, I come here because you represent something that I/We desire in a relationship, in love, and I believe that was the point. You said this is the last you're speaking of this, I hope you stick to that because I see the more you try to explain things, the more questions will arise and before you know it, this channel will be centered around that. Thank you for such great content, please keep it up. You are appreciated. ❤️

Britney

I really hate confrontation and drama but I really think people, especially woc, deserve to know what he meant by “honestly I read all the screenshots like three times and I didn’t see anything wrong with any of it!”, and “they did ask me to remove you, but I think we just need to relax”? Who needs to relax K? The woc that were trying to explain to a white woman that it was not her place to ask for an audio of such nature? The woc who were basically being told that we need to “take a breath” when she was the one victimizing herself as if she didn’t do anything wrong? Also it doesn’t matter if she wasn’t the only one to request an audio like that, the point is she is close to you so it felt as though even if we said no, you would still end up making it(especially since she was defending it so hard). No, I definitely do not think she’s racist, but she was without a doubt ignorant and was extremely dismissive to the people that brought these points up to her(by all means she does not deserve hate though. I don’t get why people would go out their way to harass her and I truly hope whoever they are will stop). Now after listening to your audio K, it seemed like you did the right thing, but if anything in @That’s NEED baby’s comments are true, you were basically not 100% honest and that sucks. It’s very exhausting when woc try to get their point across and all we are reduced to is basically “omg calm down”. We are calm, but we are also really tired of hearing the same thing over and over. I get that these are just audios, and I’m most definitely not coming at you for forming a friendship with her because obviously that’s your private business, but everyone should feel valid here. How are you gonna act like you were taking this serious and like woc deserve a place here in your Housekeeping audio, but then basically tell your friend that you didn’t see anything wrong with those screenshots? It’s as if you’re telling us what you think we want to hear, but then saying something completely different in private, and then only told her to “take a break” because a whole lot of people were still complaining. If her receipts are true, this is just disheartening and disappointing at this point honestly.

Tibbyies _

To be fair, I wouldn’t even entertain the idea that these “receipts” are accurate without actual screenshots; especially considering the source. K should address what she’s claimed to have happened, but on the same note I feel that receipts should be provided on her side given shes implied he’s somewhat sided with her.

Britney

@Tibbyies_ Honestly I don't know her well enough to know if she would fabricate that whole thing yk? I agree with you though. I personally don't want to see any screenshots or anything because that's their business lol but at the same time I guess if pictures or at least solid proof aren't involved, it's really her word against K's. I just hope he wasn't actually saying he didn't see anything wrong with what she did/said during that disagreement because that would be him basically taking her side privately and then lying to us publicly.

Here to cum ig

@van I don’t think he was talking to her to make her a moderator ,as he didn’t consider the idea until it recently was proposed. It’s the other way around, as the comment above me just stated. I was being sarcastic obviously, but i think there is something to be conveyed from it.

Here to cum ig

So like…. The request for that audio…was for..a child? Whether it is an NSFW or an SFW audio, are you gonna play that for your kid that’s experiencing racism? Hopefully, that child is over 18, or 10, at least.

A little Unseelie

Aww K, I had no idea any of this was happening. I’m more of a sometime silent listener. I know you put so much into your audios and I have never mentioned how much I love what you do. I do have to say though as a woc, I don’t think you need to make a specific audio for woc only because your audios are done where I can easily insert myself into the situation. I’ve never felt unwelcome here. You’re incredibly talented and over the last two years that I’ve been listening to you, you’ve helped me discover so much about myself. I cannot possibly thank you enough for that. It broke my heart to hear the hurt in your voice because I realize you do put so much effort into your audios and it shows. I hope this won’t deter you from making audios because we all enjoy listening to you and I know you try your best to be fair to everyone. I hope you’re at least taking care of yourself and thank you K, your amazing! ❤️😃

Sara

Is anyone else still kind of confused/disappointed? Or are we all just over it? I was hoping K might respond to what Patti said but it seems like that's not going to happen. Feeling like he's lied about something like that sucks, but I also don't want to come to a conclusion without proof. It just feels like his silence is really loud right now. Anyone else have any thoughts?

Sara

True. I thought he might reopen it to defend himself though. Maybe he feels it's safer for him to keep it closed...

Isobelwashere

I think drawing a line under it is the best thing to do personally, this back & forth wasn't going anywhere. I think what happened between Patti & K isn't our business, he has addressed the issues people had & dealt with them as he saw fit. The rest is heresay between the 2 of them. I'm here for the erotic audios at the end of the day.

ITFOFF

Same, I want to move on but the possibility that he lied doesn't sit well with me. It's hard for me to just forget and listen to his audios if the trust is broken. I really hope he does respond and clear things up and anything that happens after that, we can decide how we feel about. I just feel there is still a lot left to be clarified, especially for poc. Edit: idk about everyone else but this whole situation has really spiked my anxiety, which is smt I never thought I'd feel in this space :(

Britney

@Isobel I completely agree that what happened between them is their business 100%. I do not think anyone here is asking for specifics. However, what I am getting from Sara's post and what I gathered from this whole thing is that if @that's need baby's posts are true, then we were lied to. That makes it our business or at the very least involved in some way, especially the woc who were told that we have a place here. We are all here because of K's good work, but when an issue like this arises, you can't just brush it aside.

Lidia

I feel the same Sara 😔 but I honestly don’t think he’ll make a housekeeping 2.0 since he said he’s done w the topic/closed the chapter. At the end, and even if we see him responding, there’s anything we can do but moving on, and/or deciding on what works best for us on a personal level, and ofc hope this doesn’t happen again in the future.

Friday

Same here tbh. As much as I would like to just focus on the audios, it doesn't really sit right that there's a possiblity that the housekeeping audio was just lip service, especially as woc 😕 granted it is the internet and can never really tell when people are 100% truthful at the end of the day...

Strawberry Shortcake

Yeahh that makes sense... I understand now that it’s concerning to wonder if it wasn’t entirely genuine and that he really just told us what we wanted to hear especially when that’s need baby said that K told her initially he saw nothing wrong with the screenshots, that everyone needed to relax and he never actually told her she ever needed to leave (and gave her “warning” even though he said he only made a mental note). Not to mention, she was closer to k than he made it seem being that she was part of this “3 angels” posse...

Sara

Thanks guys. @Isobel, I understand your point, if you're happy to draw a line under it as it currently stands and just get back to enjoying the audios then that's a valid stance and I wouldn't blame you for it. But I'm kind of the opposite, as it stands I feel like I'd probably prefer to stop supporting him, but I don't want to be too hasty in that decision. I'm not interested in the specifics of their friendship, but I agree with Britney that this has kind of become our business as it pertains to K's feelings towards a significant proportion of his audience. If what Patti said is true then it implies that K was just saying what we wanted to hear, which also doesn't sit right with me. I'd kind of prefer it if he was just honest about it so everyone knew where they stood, however disappointing that might be. I wasn't expecting another audio or even a long statement, but I did think another comment would be appropriate to confirm either way. I guess I just don't see why he wouldn't want to defend himself here. Despite him saying the chapter is closed, his silence just seems very telling to me.

Isobelwashere

@Sara @Britney I completely understand your views & apologies if I came across as being dismissive of any bumbles outlooks on this as it was not my intention. I appreciate the mature dialogue about it all. Wishing you all the best. Xx

Ash M

Im a little confused here. Im normally a silent listener so I rarely engage in the community/comment section but, regarding what Patti posted, hasn’t the damage already been done though? What would her detailing the specific conversations do besides give a contextual perspective that isn’t even complete to the rest of us? Did she not still do the ignorant/racist thing that started this all? I find it odd how it was stated that the issue at hand had “so many moving parts” with some trying to moderate between K and Patti, so wouldn’t there be valid reason to assume that things were taken out of context by all parties involved? Or that perception of conversation led to differing interpretations? Why assume someone lied but not assume otherwise? Im not trying to invalidate anyone’s feelings about wanting to stay/leave this space or the need for clarification from K. You are all heard and it sucks to feel like your safe spaces are no longer safe. I just want to put out my perspective here. Sorry if i’m mistaken.

ITFOFF

Ash M, personally I don't want Patti to give details about specific conversations. I'm more interested in k's response to patties comments because the two stories presented are polar opposites and its getting confusing for me. As a woc my main concerns are that he doesn't understand why woc were upset and he said what we wanted to hear whilst siding with Patti in private as well as lying or at least miscommunication about the banning. Without a response Patti's claims make it look like k may have been the one who lied which makes it hard for me to continue supporting him. I also don't wanna make any hasty decisions before he has had a chance to clear things up.

Ash M

I absolutely understand your point. I just think there needs to be room for consideration, and i’m referring to the whole situation at hand not in part to your reply specifically. I can take K’s silence against Patti’s word as both him potentially lying or, just not bothering to explain further because its just not true and delving deeper into details and semantics can just make the entire situation worse than it already is. Either way, I guess we’ll just have to wait and see if K does offer a final response or not. I hope for your sake and all the other POC/WOC(myself included) in this community, that we get the validation we deserve to continue enjoying being in this space.

ITFOFF

I understand that and I feel like I am being considerate in the sense that I'm not immediately concluding that k lied. But the doubt is eating away at me tbh and the silence isn't helping. I don't think it will make things more complicated if he's honest and transparent about if he really said what Patti claims and whether he did actually ban her or not. I feel like leaving it like this won't help us move forward at all. I want myself and others to feel comfortable in this space and reassured that are concerns are acknowledged and validated and right now it doesn't feel like it. I hope this makes sense, I'm finding it hard to put everything I'm feeling in to words. But yes all of the poc people here and the people who just trust k to be honest deserve some clarity. I really hope we get it x Edit: I think this is the most I've ever commented in the almost two years I've been listening to k but I felt the need to express my views.

Ash M

Yes this is also the most I have ever commented since my time being here and for the same reasons of wanting to express my views or ask for clarification. Thanks for sharing yours too x

eia

To my fellow Bumbles: I'd like to think he's traversing all the drama again and reflecting. It is not that easy to repeat it all over again, but what Patti, K and all the party need is a honest dialogue. From my perspective, the WoC have spoken their grievances, and Patti was ignorant, and has hopefully apologized to them. The situation is definitely hard for K, who is a white man to be able to contextualize their struggles. I highly relate to it too, as a WoC. What I mean is I'm in the country which the majority of people are PoC, and I personally find it hard to relate to their struggles of those PoC in countries in which PoC are the minority. My online PoC friends share their stories of discrimination and struggles culturally and emotionally, and the only thing I could offer is someone who can be there for them. However, K, as people have said, they feel unwelcome and unsafe in your community due to this drama. I know that being a teacher, we need to promote an environment that our students will feel safe from all those struggles that they feel outside (I'm also a teacher). The silence may be comfortable for you and for some, but not for everyone. I will personally wait for you to have a better headspace and clarity to fully close this chapter. For my fellow Bumbles, we need to be patient: the more we pester K, the more he will be unable to have a better understanding from this issue. He has to have clarity from himself, to be able to share it with you. I don't want to have more unanswered questions and more drama if it is another half-hearted audio trying to appease to everyone. It will take time. I know you are a great person, K. I am not to judge a person based on one mistake, but remember: you are the head of this community. We all appreciate your audios, may it be NSFW or SFW. The community wants answers from you, for all of us to finally close this chapter. x

RockyMountainHighBabe

Long time listener, rare poster here who has gone back and forth about whether to post this. Clearly there was miscommunication/ misunderstanding between K and @ That’s Need, Baby that could have been handled better, period and hopefully this is a learning experience. @ That’s Need Baby coming into the comments with a one-sided timeline and an attitude of “I didn’t want to do this but now you’re making me” is ridiculous. Please own your behavior. Not to mention that the language in their posts has a guilting/ manipulative undertone with enough red flags to make a scarf out of. The big ones- Sharing intimate details of your personal life with strangers and requesting an audio for your child who is being bullied/ harassed (my social worker senses are tingling- an ASMR boyfriend audio is not the solution there, please find a mental health professional for your sweet child). I sincerely hope @That’s Need Baby is not being harassed anymore for their sake. Please correct me if I’m wrong, but it is a choice to help a content creator grow their community- the creator does not “owe” you anything. I really hope this whole situation can be handled appropriately so we can get back to the important things, like K’s talent and passion for writing/ recording panty-dropping audios.

eia

This!!!!!! I truly was not hoping for the DMs to leak. But when I saw Patti post it, it was concerning to see that. DMs are private matters, and airing it us did not help K and the community. In fact, people are now doubting K even more, in result. I'm not saying Patti is correct, K is wrong and vice versa, but it was, IMHO a bad move from her to post that. I will bet my subscription that K didn't want that either. And that audio for a child as well. I saw some comments that aired confusion on what is the goal for a sweet child to have an boyfriend (?) ASMR audio for them. Is it really for the child? Or is it for her (Patti)? I don't know. I will never judge Patti since I don't know her personally, but her behavior was kind of angry and manipulative. Maybe K was surprised with this request of a specified audio. It didn't help that those angels were afraid of her either (according to Zee). The WoC were sharing their experiences offline and she just shrugged it off and made a scene, to he point that the WoC were silenced (according to Zee)! Besides all that, I do pray for her, so that she can start resetting her life for herself and her family. Her family needs strength from her. I agree, K must treat this with care and use this as a learning experience. I hope this is a step in the right direction, so that we can go back with appreciating his talent in ASMR.

Ash M

omg I thought I was the only one who felt manipulative/guilting vibes from her post especially the quotes she used to make it seem like K was on her side thru this ordeal. Im not picking sides here, but i’m glad to know now that I wasn’t the only one with this perception. Also, 100% agree with turning to content creators to help you deal with your irl issues. Please know when and where to draw to line with your dependence on people online. It creates such unhealthy and inappropriate dynamics. I would expect a grown adult to know better.

RoRo

I agree that Patti releasing details of private correspondence probably wasn't the best way to go about this, but K was given the chance to defend himself against these allegations and if she felt wronged by him then I suppose the same courtesy should be extended to her. Regardless of your thoughts on that, or Patti herself, it's done now. The information is out there, and I don't think people should be expected to ignore it. Of course, if you want to, that's fine too. Personally, I feel like such a detailed account must have at least an element of truth to it. If K is planning to respond then I agree he should take his time and consider it carefully. This is a very sensitive subject after all. However, if he's not planning to respond I also think he should make that clear. He's said he's closed the chapter but for a lot of people, in light of Patti's comment, that simply isn't sufficient. If people are still waiting for an explanation I don't think K should completely ignore this, particularly when the people waiting are doing so because they want to continue supporting him. In my opinion, having nothing more to say on the matter is a valid response, but if that's the case I think he should confirm that so people can move on if they want to. I just don't think it's fair to leave people hanging on for an explanation that will never arrive.

Kalpana M

I am a silent listener and quite a new patron (say 3-4 months), so I am pretty much unaware of whatever has happened. But, when I listened to K's explanation and subsequently reading couple of comments by Patti (I think) - I too felt the same. I think there must have been severe misunderstanding from both the ends. I hope whatever the issue is gets resolved amicably. One thing which people forget is K or any other creator, though they're providing comfort audios and/or erotic audios - they can't be a substitute for a loving partner/therapist. Out of kindness in heart, they can be a good friend, a listening ear - but beyond that one can't expect more. So if she needed comfort audios for child- sounds wrong. Rather a therapist is better. Because audios are often one way communication. Say the child wants to pour, there's no actual person. Max it is as good as motivational speech. Regarding promoting K and being active participant on community- it is beautiful and touching for any creator to be cherished. They'll be grateful and be more kind towards such people too - but it doesn't mean we as supporters own them. Sure we crave that special attention and it's very exciting to receive. But they're not obligated to fulfill everything. They don't owe us. It gives us joy to support K. Do more like polls, fan edits etc... We shouldn't forget that we do out of love for the creator. Not because we'll receive something out of it. I wish these issues are handled in due course of time and K gets to do create heart stealing and soul warming audios 🥰

Strawberry Shortcake

Not saying she was right but from patti’s perspective I can only imagine it being extremely frustrating and disheartening to hear someone who you’ve exchanged friendly correspondence with support and defend you privately on a matter like this only to have them stab you in the back and throw you under the bus. With that being said, she said she wanted to “clear her name” but the irony in that is it really only made things messier. Still, I wish her the best. On another note maybe it’s just me being a millennial but often times I see the “I don’t owe anyone anything” abused and used as a way to excuse and justify someone’s problematic/toxic behavior. I do see a difference in owe and deserve. For instance I think everyone deserves love and respect but you aren’t owed it (I hope that makes sense)... woc deserve to feel safe within this community and him leaving them out of the conversation because he doesn’t “owe anyone” I think is wrong and unfair. I would love to hear other’s thoughts on this though.

RockyMountainHighBabe

@Strawberry Shortcake your point about creators not “owing” anyone is a good one and can certainly be abused/ used as a justification. Thank you for sharing 😊 I should have clarified because I absolutely agree that POC deserve to feel safe and included in the conversation here. When reading @That’s Need, Baby’s posts, I felt that they sounded like they felt owed something for having been around the community for so long, which was all I was referring to in my original post.

Strawberry Shortcake

Ohhhh ok, well when you put it like that... I agree! I got those vibes as well. I’ve been stuck trying to understand the logic and maybe I never will... She proposed this audio idea with the goal to share this with her interracial child. However as noble as that may seem, at the end of the day K is a 30 something year old man roleplaying as people’s boyfriend (he calls you pet names, makes innuendos, etc) so the thought of him being directly exposed to a child just makes me very uncomfortable. Secondly, she wanted the topic of the audio to be about racism... and just like how it wasn’t her place to request an audio like this it’s not k’s place either to speak out about it. Having a white man lead a conversation like that just shows a lot of privilege. I would just imagine the audio essentially boiling down to “Hey baby, racism sucks but I love you...want some cuddles?” And yeah he’s been in an interracial relationship(s) but using that as justification can not only come across as a bit performative and trying to be “woke” but It’s similar to the “I have a black friend” defense which is linked to racism. All that to say— I’m really glad he listened and didn’t go through with it.

Sapphy

The thumbnails have been bothering me for a while too. Like I would look at them and roll my eyes a little. I don't think K does it intentionally though since he's mentioned he likes the tumblr aesthetic and we all know tumblr isn't very diverse or inclusive (which is really sad that woc are often excluded from that aesthetic ). I hope K realises this though and makes an effort to find more inclusive thumbnails.

OhMyLawdt

At the end of the day K is an anonymous person on the internet. You may think you “know” him but you don’t. this impacts a small fraction of your “internet life” but not your real one. So like what does it matter? You should be here for the audios and expect nothing more. As much as I like K and his platform, I don’t trust anyone online unless I know them in real life. No one is perfect and trying to hold anyone up to this impossible standard of perfection is turning a teachable moment into this lingering…..idk. You get what I’m saying hopefully.

Strawberry Shortcake

Sorry @ohmylawdt I don’t really get what you’re saying. Expecting someone not to lie to you is not holding them to impossible standards of perfection or maybe we just have different ideas of what basic human decency is? Is this place not supposed to be a warm, welcoming, positive, respectful community if that’s the case then it does matter. Or perhaps that’s too much of an idealized mindset being that this is the internet and all.

Laila

I think its the second option considering he had a corp job for a bit and then lived overseas. But to be honest I dont blame him for not being specific, he could easily dox himself.

Kawaii

Yeah, that’s what I think, that some details might be embellished to protect his privacy — and create a fantasy world.

eia

@Kawaii: About the labels in the education field, I'll try to explain: 'Teacher' is most commonly used when someone is teaching at schools, from kinder to high school. K might fall under this category, assuming he has the appropriate licenses for K-12 teaching. I fall under here since I teach Elementary Special Needs students. 'Instructor' is used for beginning teachers in the university level. It can also be used as the people who teach at associate degrees and tech-voc fields. In my country, there is 5 levels of this (university) level. He may also belong here, if he really has a master's degree and a post-grad cert in TESL/TEFL. 'Professor' is the highest of them, and it is usually reached by those who have PhDs and has committed to their field. That is a brief primer for non-education people. But yeah, whether K exaggerates or not, it's his created persona. Hope that helps! ❤️

Willow

Hi. Silent listener here that's been with K since his second YouTube video before the glasses even showed up. Can we all please just be nice to one another... This was such a wholesome and loving environment and now I just feel uncomfortable like the happy bubble has been burst. Its not so difficult just to be decent human beings. We all love K and he loves us. Simple.

ITFOFF

Is it just me who feels like their concerns are being ignored? I don't feel like we're asking for much, literally just honesty. I tried to listen to this new audio but I couldn't get into it all I could think was if you have time to upload audio, you have time to give us a response. I'm not trying to drag things out unnecessarily but I think that these concerns are valid ones that should be addressed and all we're getting is radio silence. It's rlly disheartening.

eia

Yeah, it was kind of weird tbh. They want answers, K. But yeah, I do think that when he commented 'closing the chapter' sealed the deal honestly. I just feel so disheartened to those WoC that needed answers. Sending hugs to you ITFOFF and all fellow bumbles x

ITFOFF

@eia, thank you x. Sending hugs right back. I'm glad I'm not the only one. I don't want to be a damper on the mood but I just can't shake it and it just feel like he doesn't care that some us feel uncomfortable. I'm at a loss.

Ari

Not just you love, all I want is honesty and basic human decency and respect, none of which has been provided recently which is just rlly sad ;(

Britney

@ITFOFF all I want to know is literally how hard is it to just say "@that's need baby is lying"? Like does he not understand that some of us just want to know if those statements she claims he made were true? I couldn't care less about details because I don't believe it's fair to ask him to air out their private convos just because she did the same but man, it's hurtful how he's just ignoring it and honestly, I will probably be gone by the morning in order to not continue ruining everyone's good time. The last thing I want is to be this nagging person while everyone else is raving over his work (it's insane how keeping your secret was my fav audio idea of his and now I'm having a hard time enjoying it). I have not one time been disrespectful to him nor do I think I've rudely asked for an explanation. Just shocked that this is the same guy I found on YT a couple months ago and honestly, seeing users that I've seen constantly commenting on here just leave because of how this whole issue (starting from the tagging incident) has been dealt with by him is crazy to me but hey, that's the internet I guess. I just genuinely hope there is a little more priority put on woc's feelings in the future here.

ITFOFF

@Britney I feel exactly the same way, even if he'd just admitted that he lied or there was miscommunication I would have been more forgiving but him blatantly ignoring our concerns has made it so much worse. It just sends the message that he doesn't care about our worries. Don't feel like your nagging at all they are valid concerns and if you and others feel uncomfortable we deserve to be acknowledged. After all the stuff that went down with twitter VA's k was the only one I listened to and now I'm also debating leaving. It's awful to find out that a creator you thought respected you doesn't. Sending hugs and I wish you well if you do decide to leave xx

Strawberry Shortcake

Sending hugs as well, all your feelings are valid. I understand not wanted to dampen the mood but if anyone wants someone to talk to my discord is shortcake#1652

Iben

I completely understand when we feel a certain way that we want someone to address how are you feel right now. And we’re all entitled to our opinions. I hope that will all remember from listening to audios and YouTube that K has been true for us. This other person has no other plans other than to tear down what he’s been building and the way we feel about him. Crabs in a barrel we’ve all learned about them this person seems to only want to make sure that they have her K I don’t know what that’s about. K has told you that he does not condone anything dealing with racism or sexism or homophobic. I choose to enjoy the service that he is providing and I hope that everyone will feel Positive and continue to enjoy as well. I don’t know guys opinions are like assholes we all have one. Be blessed!

Aurora

Me either! I must say that this was handled by K better than I would have.

F

@ITFOFF I’m sorry but I currently don’t have the time to listen to the audio and I don’t know who Patti is but could u tell me what is going on?

Hollyanna Wilson

Im not on twitter like im so confused @ITFOFF can u or anyone explain i wanna make sure im supporting the right ppl

Abby

Is all this gonna stop me from listening to boyfriend audio? No. However, if Patti’s recollection checks out, he did her wrong and lied to all of us. Only 2 people know the truth, but something doesn’t add up so just fess up to what you did , we all make mistakes.

Chippy Chips

What makes you so sure he has anything to fess up to? You're right that something doesn't add up but that doesn't mean K is the one lying here.

Abby

Yeah my fess up comment was directed to both of them, not just K.

Chippy Chips

Okay fair enough, but Patti has gone...supposedly, so presumably she's not going to say any more on the matter and it doesn't look like K is either.

Tuva Nwafor

you know what, i have no idea whats going on but i might as well comment. I'm not gonna talk abt the situation in itself because i personally can't idk whats going on. But i am simply gonna forget i saw this post. Fr like K rly saved me from a lot of bad stuff in my life and even though i promised myself to just distance myself from creators who are "problematic" i just can't do that to K rn 🦆 goofy gawd damn ik

Kwan Kwan

Support with Love , love you K XOXOX love from J

Foxy kitty

Hey k I usually never comment because I’m shy and I do always worry about what others might think because I’m 38 and listen to audios I have had my fair share of bullying mainly on yt cuz on yt I’d comment to give the artist kudos for how talented they are and you wouldn’t believe how many people attacked me for that so that’s why I never comment I myself have hidden disabilities so it hurts me a lot more then it would others when I get comments like that which is why I haven’t really commented here but after hearing you and how caring and supportive you try to be with everyone in the community I felt I needed/wanted to because you are one of the few artist who actually is sincere I know other are to don’t get me wrong but I can hear it in your voice how much you want everyone here to feel welcomed and accepted and it hurts you that people are sad or getting treated poorly just like it does us and that means so much thank you k for standing up for us without a voice thank you for caring so much thank your for just being you and thank you to all the beautiful people in this amazing community for being so understanding and wonderful let’s come together and not let hate in anymore let’s do this for k and for each other so we have a safe happy place to come to when are real life’s suck or if we just need to get away for a bit

Mak Mak

It is hard (I think impossible) to please everyone, man. It seems like you are doing your best and do care about all of us and that is all I can ask for ❤️

Nicole Pettway

Wait, I'm late to all of this and don't understand what exactly happened? I'm sorry but I'm a little confused. Can someone explain what happened from the beginning?