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Fleetwood Mac's Rumours with Carolyn Kendrick (Patreon)

Published:
2022-12-01 22:09:43
Edited:
2022-12-01 22:10:11
Imported:
2026-06
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Here is your November bonus, a day late because this one was made with extra love--possibly a little bit too much on my part. You'll get your regularly scheduled December bonus later this month, our dear friends.

Just yesterday we learned about the death of Christine McVie, at 79 years old. A part of me believed the Rumours five would be around forever, and, as always, I was wrong. For her, the sun will be shining.

Love,

Sarah

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Comments

Kristen Johnson

I loved this episode. Rumours and Fleetwood Mac in general evoke powerful memories for me because my parents used to play this album on eternal repeat whenever we went on long car rides (as a Midwesterner, I spent half of my childhood in a car driving somewhere). These songs were hugely influential in the development of my own emotional vocabulary and navigating the growth from childhood to young adulthood. I never took the time to learn about the back story of this album, so thank you for sharing this.

Dana Anderson

Karen Carpenter part 2 had me tearing up. It’s parasocial love, but I don’t care. I think that episode is a great example of how sometimes parasocial connection is still human connection, and human connection is everything.

Lindsay Willett

I love Fleetwood Mac so much, and I have from a very young age, which definitely bemused my parents. My personal favorite song on this album is The Chain, and I’m not quite certain what that says about me. But if I were playing FMK with the songs, I would be: Fuck: Go Your Own Way Marry: The Chain Kill: Oh Daddy

Lise Dale

Heh, except a Robert Altman movie. Re overlapping dialogue in movies

Lise Dale

Wow I just realised that has been a thing for a very long time. My mother told me about a dinner party in which my father told some of his friends which of those three he would do with his three daughters, and how even within her cultural indoctrination she was disturbed. The sister that he would have sex with was at the time I think no older than 10, and was in the room at the time. What a thing for her to carry around the rest of her life about her worth. Another example of how we can harm each other so casually and inadvertently. Oh, i just remembered it wasn't kill though (thats a releif) it was who he would have an affair with, marry or have deep intellectual conversations with. Yeah, he was kind of a sociopath.

Thren

I couldn't put my finger on what sounded weird to me about the last year's episodes of YWA, but now I know—it's the never-overlapping dialogue. As an autistic person, it hurts my brain when people talk over each other and I'm expected to follow it, so I agree that that should be limited. But all this time I thought Sarah's guests just didn't like her because their reaction sounds are delayed till after she's done talking. It sounded to me like they weren't engaging with her, as if they waited for her to finish talking, thought, "Surely there's more...", waited a beat, and then reacted out of confusion or pity.

Ludicristi

Does YWA have an email? I have SO MANY THOUGHTS after this episode and going down a rabbithole and it’s a LOT to share here 😆

Gringa

When you explained podcast editing, it ruined my fantasy that you are a savant at conversation timing. And also made me feel a little bit less broken for constantly talking over, interrupting and other ASD unpleasantness.

Sabrina

Yes I'm biased towards her as an artist, but I have no problem taking Stevie's "side", given that both her and another ex having reported that Lindsey was physically and emotionally abusive.

Christine Pittman

I loved loved loved this episode. And now, I’m reading Daisy Jones and the Six, which claims to be vaguely based on Fleetwood Mac, and I’m hooked on the book, and am excited to watch the Amazon series once I finish it, and I keep thinking about your episode as I read. So, I’m just popping in here to say that if you’re trying to come up with future book club books, and tying them in with past episodes, Daisy could be a good pick. Love you all!!!

Sten Willander

Give ‘Bare Trees’ a good listen. (Spare me a little of your love).

Sara

I am 30 minutes in and I thought Stevie and Lindsey were a lesbian couple up until now 😂 I was thinking wow an openly gay couple in 1975? Slayyy

consuelo carrillo

Excited to listen. I was absolutely shocked and devastated to hear yesterday. It really did feel like they would last forever. )’:

Charlie

I've been looking forward to this from the moment you mentioned it was in the works. I think it will be cathartic to listen to in the wake of such sad news, thank you for sharing it with us all.

Jeanne H-B

The year Rumours came out, I was one year out of high school, going to Brookdale Community College part time, working retail full time, and practically living at the college theater. Half my friends were gay and the closet was a constant situational negotiation. I was a theater dork, folksinger, occasional beard, non-religious virgin, bisexual (when hardly anyone thought that bi was a real thing, sigh), poet (we were all a poet), living on the Jersey Shore. This was before AIDS, before Reagan was president, before Times Square was sanitized. We had a huge gay bar in Asbury Park, midnight showings of Rocky Horror had migrated out of NYC and become our beloved thing, where suburban boys could wear fishnets and throw toast and we were all a nascent, nerdy, rainbow, safe in our numbers… this was the world that I was in when Rumours came out. It is such a perennial album, and managed to be a deeply important part of the soundscape for generations, so hooked into sensory memories. Thanks for this episode, and for the memories.

S kenton

The sexiest part of this whole episode is when the engineers went out of their way to save the master track!!

Angellee S.

Carolyn talking about the precariousness of media and where we store it made me think of all the fires that have happened. The masters that were lost at Universal and previous fires where many silent era films burned. Not too long ago a factory in Banning, CA burned. It was 1 of 2 places in the world that made lacquers. It took me several tries to even figure out what a lacquer was and why it’s so important. I have a CD with a Tom Waits recording of “It’s Over” that’s so much better than the version available on Apple Music or Spotify. Why did this great recording only make it to the soundtrack of a movie time forgot. The streaming era is still missing so much.

sarah lapré

Sarah I have a t-shirt that says “Silver Springs Belonged On Rumours” if you want to borrow it sometime

Charlotte Ackroyd

I need to get my husband to listen to this episode, because even though he’s a bigger fan of Peter Green’s Fleetwood Mac (Need Your Love So Bad was our first dance), he would greatly enjoy the Lindsay Buckingham slander.

Nurelle H

It's so funny that you made this episode now. I have been joking for months that Rumors is my song of the summer for 2022, because it has been playing almost everywhere I go.

Jessie Hoy

Ayyyyyyyyyyye! I see someone traveled near Springfield, MO with that Kum and Go reference.

Jessica Norman

As always, I learned so much from this podcast. When I tell people about this podcasts and list what I love about, one thing i always say is its amazing how remarkably good you guys, and guests, are at not talking over each other. I had no idea. I also used to listen to this album as a child and didn't think much of it until going back to it after this episode and realized how much I really really love it.

Caitlin Smith Rapoport

I love this episode so much! Oh my god. And it’s lovely hearing Carolyn’s perspective here. Amazing

Allison Akright

Hahaha, I work a block away from their headquarters.

Allison Akright

I make everyone I know watch the 1997 live performance of Silver Springs with me. It's a masterpiece.

Danielle Povlock

I was so ready for this episode! I had a totally Stevie Halloween (dressed up as her and coincidentally there were some Stevie-themed events I attended), and I think I’ve listened to Gold Dust Woman and Sisters of the Moon every day since then.

Danielle Povlock

Oh yeah, one of the Halloween events was a drag show and the entire bar booed Lindsey Buckingham. It felt so right.

Tiff Reagan

This episode was so delightful. I especially loved what Carolyn's technical knowledge brought to the conversation.

Sophia

So my 60yo mum is dabbling in dating apps at the moment and her main observations have been: - Every man is lying about his height and all mum wants to know is what shoes she should be wearing on dates as a 5’8 woman. - They all like camping. - They all love Fleetwood Mac. Given that a huge degree of her dating demographic is likely to be other divorcés, I think Rumours really explains that last one. She’s just finding it jarring as someone whose favourite music is New Wave and Punk.

Lindsay Weinberg

Can you do an OJ compilation? I want to revisit your OJ/Nicole episodes. Can you compile them into a grouping for us? ❤️❤️❤️

Liv Collom

I’m a musician in college and my bandmate and I just broke up romantically. What Carolyn said about falling in and out of love during the creative process is so insightful and made me feel so heard. This episode also really helped me process the death of Christine McVie, who was a major inspiration to me. I needed this episode in so many ways. THANK YOU BOTH 💗

Virginia Shea

What amazing timing, releasing this today! I have to confess that although I've listened to the "Fleetwood Mac" and "Rumours" albums countless times since I bought them both at Jamesway* when they were brand-new, I am not familiar with "Silver Springs" (because I rarely bought singles) and need to remedy that tonight. No trip to Jamesway necessary. Regarding the relationship between Stevie and Christine, they were actually close friends and allies in the band. More here: https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/01/entertainment/stevie-nicks-christine-mcvie-friendship-cec/index.html *Jamesway was like a slightly downscale Woolworths --imagine if RIte-Aid and Kohls had a baby that was kind of ugly.

Kay

I listened to this high while making art and it was a beautiful pairing! Thank you both

Katie Crowley

This episode was such a treat!!! Listened to the album front to back afterwards. 🤌 thank you Sarah!

Abi

Probably my favorite episode to date, love you guys 💖

Amanda Goulet

RIP Christine! I am a huge Fleetwood Mac fan, thank you so much for this episode!

Sheala Bacon

The idea that you only know what you think you might say is very comforting to me who so often gets tongue-tied.

They Coined It

This was wonderful on so many levels. It took me awhile, back then, to get into Fleetwood Mac - I was raised with a more purist rock/folk ethic (with a healthy side of Broadway), and they always sounded too commercial to be cool. That whole explanation about not being loud was enlightening - the loudness is also a messiness that they did not have, and eventually I came to respect that - they had such restraint. In a lot of ways, the (almost literal) heartbeat of Fleetwood Mac, even before Buckingham and Nicks, is Fleetwood and Mac - that rhythm section, drums and bass, is so solid and grounding. Also I am a singer, and, especially as a kid, I would imitate whatever I was singing - it used to freak my sister out when I would be singing along to the record and my voice would switch from billygoat Nicks to cool deep McVie.

They Coined It

I do think your partisanship filters your views on some of this, Sarah. I'm not saying I'm team Lindsay, especially after what I learned about him from this episode, but she always sounded like a pain in the ass. "I couldn't comfort him because I was mad at him" doesn't quite sound as giving as you're making it out, and your take on Silver Springs - an AMAZING song - made me laugh. Yes, it has all the complexities of emotion, but ultimately it builds to AN ENTIRE CURSE ON HIS HEAD and him just yelling the harmonies back at her while he takes it, on stage, night after night. I've never been able to figure out what quite happened in that relationship, but I think we can agree that they were better off not having it.

Virginia Shea

Having been privileged to see the full Rumours Five in concert when they reunited in 2014, I learned two things about Lindsey Buckingham: (1) he really is an incredible guitarist, and (2) he is much more in love with the sound of his own voice than anyone else around him is. I also read a memoir by Mick Fleetwood at some point, and that made it pretty clear that they were five messed-up people who all did some fairly shitty things — to each other and to a lot of other people too. I think it’s telling, though, that after all those decades, they finally fired Lindsey for good in 2018. But it’s also amazing that they were all able, for so many years, to stand up on stage and all work together so magnificently while singing songs of love, rage, and betrayal ABOUT EACH OTHER. As much as I love Stevie (which is a lot), at heart I’m a Christine partisan, and as Sarah pointed out in the podcast, she did pretty much the same thing to John with “You Make Loving Fun” and probably some of her other songs as well. Anyway. To me, perhaps the most impressive thing about their music is that it holds up equally well whether or not you know any of the back story. I was in high school when “Fleetwood Mac” and “Rumours” came out, and I loved both albums passionately long before I was dialed in to any of the fascinating gossip about the band (this was a lot easier before the Internet). Ultimately I just feel lucky and grateful to have been one of many recipients of all that music.

mya

wow haven’t stopped thinking about this since i listened. i’m not a huge fleetwood mac fan beyond liking the couple of songs i’ve heard but this really made me want to dive in. i also read daisy jones and the six a month or two ago and i had read it was partially inspired by fleetwood mac but didn’t know anything about the band. listening to this was so crazy because of how much of it is reflected in that novel, while still having its own very unique storyline. totally recommend if you’re intrigued by the music industry in the 60s-70s-80s. also highly recommend the audiobook, it has a full cast which works so well because the novel is structured like a documentary, telling stories thru individual interviews with all the different people.

Shammer

Dang, I didn't recognize this song at all until I heard that chorus: Time cast a spell on you, but you won't forget me I know I could have loved you But you would not let me I know there's got to be a musical term for the way the tone rises but I have no idea what it is. That rise is the key to the whole song for me.

Oren Beckman

This episode was great. Awesome to hear Carolyn talk about the inner workings of recording music alongside the exploration of personal drama and the creative process. I end up wondering would the end result have been so good if it hadn't been so hard for them all? I suppose we'll never know. Also my partner and I like to sing Little Lies to each other, except we change the lyrics to "Feed me fries, feed me sweet little fries."

Michelle Hofmeister

Absolutely loved this episode, FM has long been among my top loves and Landslide really carried through my dad's passing. Can we have "if you can't take the heat, perhaps contact OSHA about proper ventilation or something" on a tee?

Kirsten Greenwell

I loved this episode and learned so much about music from Carolyn. I am v attached to Rumours bc when the pandemic first hit my husband and I decided we would listen to Rumours once a day every day we were in quarantine, which brought us so much joy until we were at like day 75 and realized the pandemic wasn’t going anywhere. We realized we had to stop or we’d ruin the album for ourselves. My now-expert opinion is that You Make Lovin’ Fun is the best song on the album by far.

Gina Marquez

I’m sorry about your dad. And also, I love your T-shirt idea.

Holly

My parents had The Dance on video and CD, so I grew up loving Silver Springs. I cannot believe they kept Oh Daddy on the album and not Silver Springs. The audacity! The injustice!

Linda Maleh

Was waiting for this one! Did not disappoint

Kaiti Vannoy

I really don’t like this episode because I can’t even listen to it for 20 mins without pausing it and going to listen to “Rumors” 😂 Lovely job, Sarah!!

O C

This is my number one favorite album. I don’t think there’s such a thing as giving it too much love! And timely; RIP Christine ❤️

Vanessa Lucio

Great episode, and so timely 🥰 "Rumours" is a perfect album in my opinion. I love them all!

Mary Murray

This was an amazing episode! So, so good! I hope you open it up for others to hear. I loved the trademark empathy over a chaotic situation and adored getting the perspective of Carolyn’s musician and sound engineer expertise. I llke knowing that all this was going on while I was in high school across the bridge in SF. My WTF moment was when Sarah said something about Paul Kantner and Stevie Nicks getting together. If you see this Sarah, I’d love clarification! Did they actually get together? I babysat for his kids , and my brother was close to him, so I knew him a bit.

Hannah Cann

Thanks for bringing Silver Springs into my life 💖

MollyR

Loved this episode! I've been listening to Rumours a bunch this year since hearing "The Chain" on a pivotal episode of Our Flag Means Death, lol. It's one of the few albums I can listen to top to bottom, no skips. I loved your discussion of Stevie's writing style and the emotions she layers in. Love her more than ever.

Allie Wood

Thank you so much for this! I knew a lot of the songs on Rumours (who hasn’t?) but had never listened to it in full, and now I can’t stop. Silver Springs—!!!!!

Cheryl Edmonds

Love the episode! I’m pretty sure Micks wife that divorces him at the time is Jenny Boyd, sister of Patti Boyd Harrison Clapton.

Rachel VIll

I'm not really a big Fleetwood Mac person but I loved this episode. A great story and production is such an interesting perspective to take. Really cool to hear about how the music-making process has changed!

Steph

I loved this! This bonus episode made me go back and listen to Rumors. I've got it on repeat now 😅

Sheila

Can we get a release of the 8 minute version of silver springs a la Taylor swifts all too well?

Barbara Roseman

Excellent episode. I loved hearing the connections you drew between FM’s production process and your own.

WOOD, MORGAN

I think this is hilarious: we used to drive all across the country when I was little, and this was the time of tapes. My dad LOVED "Rumors" and made a tape of it off the album, but he hated Christine McVee, and so he didn't record "Daddy" on the tape.

WOOD, MORGAN

I heard the album a million times, but never that song, so now to this day I always think it's weird when I hear it on the album, because I'm not used to it!

tara s

Their BEST song!