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Episode 425: The Blue Light Killer (Patreon)

Published:
2024-12-16 14:24:14
Imported:
2026-06
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Joshua Citarella joins us to wildly speculate on the possible motives, politics, and ideological architecture of Luigi Mangione, the accused assassin of United Health Care CEO Brian Thompson.

Discover more episodes at podcast.trueanon.com

See also:

CEO Murder & the Dark EnlightenmentDoomscroll on YouTubeBrace on DoomscrollYung Chomsky on Doomscroll

Files

Comments

Jack

He’s a beautiful man

Fafy

Yay

Crisismethodactor

JOSH! Hell yes. Bring him on in the future, he's absolutely brilliant.

J T

About time Josh was on

Noah

I always knew Huberman had drillers 🔫

Flesh Colored Subaru

He got all the hidden activation message Brace has been sending him

Mao Lays Dong

Italian men can't do crimes anymore?

Ava

Josh Citarella!!! Christmas came early with this one

Vero

But if you do it…..

Mango Bolsonaro

It’s funny that if this dude had like a German or Polish background he would have gotten away with it. Those unmistakable Italian eyebrows…

Natalie

yayyy I've been hyping this one up in my head lol

Sam

Finally

Elizabeth

I gasped! This episode is about to be a classic!

Gator lord

Welcome citarella! Love your work

ploob

Ooh Josh!

JB

thank god

Jabroni Ludd

They got Marios brother locked up in Bowsers castle we gotta do somethin

NYCM&AHole

I love thinking that kind bars are made out of kids because kind=kid in German.

Peri

2.5+ hour episode on Luigi for this beautiful Monday, we are truly blessed 🙏

NYCM&AHole

Also the best barrels are the ones you let delicious single malt age in. Mmmm single malt scotch.

Andy Adolphson

Instructions clear, True Anon told me to do it.

LOAF

Josh on trueanon, what a wonderful way to start the week.

Alex Horne

Does anyone know the name of the face searching site mentioned at 28.28?

Zach Young

Folks don’t do it no doing it

H

Reeboks on, just do it

Michael

I’m hearing that we should do it

Bert

"Do it" - Emperor Palpatine 32 BBY, Brace Belden 2024 AD

Eddie Verzella

Braces fake name in the Philippines guesses?

tMinozaJ

Tito Shmuley

Zane

Hyperstitioned this one into being

MG

Love Joshua! Glad to see him on the show.

K H

Goyim McSaxan

K H

We all received the secret activation code at the end of that one episode.

K H

Rallying the Sardukar.

snapplepeachtea

thank you for the 2 and a half hour episode

CT

Italian Americans invented doing crimes

grant brown

TrueCar layoff might’ve been a factor. Layoffs can hit hard

Doc Adna

The Mangiorian candidate???

Mao Lays Dong

I actually think leaving TrueCar probably kept him from suicidal ideation thus postponing the event further.

Mango Bolsonaro

Damn this podcast has a taxi service now

Clean Shirt Piggie

Is it true that LM was carrying the TA “Gun Inside” tote at the Altoona McDonald’s?

Jacob Makes

brace is back and in rare form. i hope he had sex.

Robert Sayre

SFPD recognized him because his mother had filed a missing person report with them a few days earlier.

GG Allin Dulles

Donkey Kong knew this, which is why he died of cirrhosis

Luis

Mangione conducted an experiment on spooky action from a distance

Luis

Yoooo in wearing Reebok's rn

D

I looked through the comment history of a purported Luigi account (never followed up to see if it ended up being his, also still listening to the podcast so maybe y'all bring it up later) and the account was definitely from a bag head who posted in bag reddits. One of the comments was about his favorite bag being a compressible daypack that he carried in his larger bag(s). That could have been the sequence: dump the big bag, transfer stuff to a bag that kept in his bag. Also the daypack looked pretty nice and I thought about picking it up but I already have a different one.

ResilientBastard

As someone who played a lot of Civ I think there are also a lot of kids who come out of it and it’s sort of prescribed path of civilizational development with a pang wondering “is this it?”

Henry Ermer

I feel like while it's important to find out as much as possible about this guy he himself is not what is significant here

Nathan Palmiero

Getting a lot of mixed messages from the intro, but I think I understand what Brace wants from us

Zzz

I LOVE JOSHUA!! Thanks for bringing him on

Jim Veil

Michael Moore might be passé, but the last time I remember EVERYONE talking about our fucked healthcare system was when Sicko came out. It was really quite the phenomenon, which was totally squandered, of course.

Ben Degnan

Who does Liz mention for a leftist critique of human biodiversity at 1:40:30?

Michael S. Judge

Strategy of Tension becomes "Propaganda of the Deed" from the other side, and as soon as I heard this MF citing efficiency statistics in a manifesto, brother, you know that's vassal-type shit

Tim O'

Disavow! Disavow! Disavow!

Tim O'

Italian gunmen assassinating American economic leaders under questionable political pretenses? It's the reverse Years of Lead, baby!

12 o Clock in the Midnight

Who was the author Liz referred to that sounded like "Butai"? Maybe I'm not understand it correctly

Kat

Can anyone tell me what author Liz recommends at 1:40 ish ! Couldn’t quite make it out

Alex C

DISAVOW ME?? I DISAVOW YOU

Isaac Rainey

You can get decent 3D printers for under $300 now. Also, only the lower reciever is printed. The slide, barrel, trigger are not printed and can be bought online without filling out an ATF form.

mexicanhalloween .

It doesn't make a lot of sense because it wasn't him. They'll never catch the real guy, but the narrative must be controlled

friitz

It was a first draft of a manifesto

Vero

I think you mean clásico

grant brown

Georges Bataille, The Accursed Share

Adam Rogowski

Buddy of mine went to Gilman with Luigi - had him over to his house a few times and Luigi was good friends with his brother. He said that he had heard that Luigi had come out as bi while he was at U Penn. They were also in the Robots Club together at Gilman.

Isaac Rainey

Also, there are reasonably effective 3D printed suppressors now. PSR on YouTube has a video showing them.

Eric

This is my favorite episode in a while. Real good shit

friitz

Look reality can be very sobering to rich kids. He prolly had a schizophrenic break in the heels of him becoming aware of what is happening to americans. It's not that deep.

Tyler

Y’all are so wrong about 3D printed guns

wonderfell

Luigi Mangione: RFK Democrats’ Top Shooter

Alex

I have spent hundreds of hours playing the Civ games and am no better at it than when I started

Eric

Did u guys see Op Ivy there

Kat

Ahhh thank you

Degrassi Knoll

Thank Luigi for my newfound knowledge of veterinary (cough) pistols! Hilarious response from mfg on why they're silenced and semi-auto......"Imagine a truck with livestock has an accident - So a silent gun with several rounds is the best solution in this case." Sure.

friitz

SpON-di-Lo-lys-Thesis

Degrassi Knoll

Those abs slid me 6 inches further down the Kinsey scale

Swimaroo

2:24:29 I think they bleach them with chemical exfoliants and they don't think to fill them in

Degrassi Knoll

Hell yeah! Best current event episode ever.....45 minutes in and I've gotten 3x the info I've learned thus far. From now on media blackout and all news comes from TA!

Brian Ward

You're way off suggesting his writing is spergy, damn I'm het up this time

Paul Steiner

Hi brace, you were thinking of a quote from State and Revolution about the postal service A witty German Social-Democrat of the seventies of the last century called the postal service an example of the socialist economic system. This is very true. At the present the postal service is a business organized on the lines of state-capitalist monopoly

Cooper Twit

Need liz on doomscroll for the trifecta

Drew

Bag in a bag?

Alexander

🤓☝️ Alexander Berkman tried to kill Henry Clay Frick during the Homestead Strike, coincidentally not far from where Luigi Mangione was arrested. He served 14 years and wrote some influential anarchist literature

Charlotte Ring

I’ve been thinking about how actually non online he is. He spent a lot of money on that one substack, but he had a few hundred tweets, not thousands. Probably much fewer than the average 26 y/o! He was not especially prolific on any other website. He had many irl friends, was active, traveled, had hobbies. Very much against the mold of the typical lone wolf. Second, his chosen action is sooo against the philosophy of e/acc types which valorize elites - and it didn’t even seem likely he was assuming he’d get away with it- so he gave his own life/productivity for the “cause” which - you’d think he’d value his own abilities and life too highly to give that up from the e/acc perspective. Perhaps his chronic pain even turned him against his original philosophies in recent months. He was also described by all around him as a nice guy, which all those real tech freaks are generally pretty odious people. So maybe his ability to travel and be social prevented him from too much true tech radicalization. Lastly, my current theory is he knew the police were coming for him in the McDonald’s and wrote the manifesto on the spot, perhaps too tired or in pain to try to flee. ps it is honestly hilarious they are trying to take the incel angle but also chastise everyone for thirsting after him, ed or not he absolutely benefited from being super hot in a way that obviously detracts from the incel theory

(Noah J)

he kept the gun because there were more CEOs on his list

Jake the Human

best possible guest for this episode, can’t wait to listen

Goldie

YC bulking advice patreon exclusive episode?

Dick Waglin

Always funny who starts talking about who should be allowed to live and rule. Is there any more useless eater than an online intellectual?

Matt Jolo

He may have stashed the second bag at the bus station locker.

Kelley

Thank you YC for vouching for Civ. It was starting to sound like grandma and grandpa talking about video games for a second there…. Civ is a fun game! Also, the point about him 3d printing a gun rather than get a real one- it may be easy to get a gun in the US if you know the right people or if you already have familiarity with guns, but I’m guessing Luigi didn’t run with those types of crowds and so for him it probably was easier to 3d print it. And if he was a rich software engineer grad he probably already had the 3d printer and the materials

——

I don’t know much about printing much but I know guns. Where were they off, Sincere question.

Martin Ross

Do you think you guys could unlock this one?

abby

Berkman shot Henry Clay Frick

Vincent Butler

When are we getting that one on one zoom call tier?

Degrassi Knoll

Not talkin smack...but can you elaborate?

Liam Farley

@brace and YC someone on my steam friends list Has 25k hours in civ 5 I think over 14 years that's like 5 hours a day every single day

Degrassi Knoll

BUT if he did, TrueAnon absolutely didnt give him any ideas

Brian Ward

This is a stretch, but so is everything else about this case - I think there's an argument that him offing the CEO is consistent with effective altruism if he believed that the company had gone so far away from an e/ACC position that Luigi felt he needed to reset things.

SlamPig

Luigi Mangione the ALLEGED killer

blinkpup

love joshua and his work but what is it with the use of retarded

Degrassi Knoll

I like the Russian doll model suggested earlier, much more quaint

Bert

Crazy

Ben

Georges Bataille

ploob

He is NOT cute!

swervegriffin

Luigi very obviously didn’t do it

swervegriffin

Wish you commented more on the obvious planting of evidence

leftist bimbo

“the don’t do it, but if you do it” bit gets me every time

Shrimp Lord

Brace: I am a current competitor on battlebots (yes it's still going). It was on abc for a couple seasons, then it jumped to discovery channel, and now we compete in Las Vegas as apart of a live show that is like staged for the most part with the "real" fights at the end. It is, as you would guess, fairly mixed up with silicon valley freaks and the military industrial complex. The battlebots brand is owned by a neurodivergent fail son (Trey Roski) of a real estate billionaire (Ed Roski Jr). A different "professional" league called NHRL is owned by a guy (Austin McChord) who owned the company that hosted Hilary's private email server lol. There's a battlebots kids league called battlebots IQ, which was at South By Southwest this year - sponsored by the US Army. The event started with an Army general giving this psychotic uninterrupted patriotic speech promoting these kids growing up to develop tech for the military. A few years ago we had a special private tournament event for Jeff Bezos' birthday lol A lot of the older guys in the "sport" are liked og boomer dotcom bubble silicon valley guys who are chuddy libertarian types. The younger guys are recent engineering grads who have this sort of nihilistic pessimism because they're like leftish bernie bros who realized they spent years and tons of money to enter a job market that is like, 90% making missiles or drones for raytheon or lockheed martin. and then there's a couple bozos like me who didn't go to college but just like robots blowing up. tl;dr if you guys are ever in vegas lmk I'll get you into the show for free lmao.

Alex

HE WAS THE BEST GUY AROUND

Aaron Enold

Liz on doomscroll now pls

earthlandingfake

It seems worth considering that he could definitely have bought or acquired the 3D printed gun from someone else? There have to be libertarians online who will sell you a ghost gun for a modest sum of crypto

Michael S. Judge

What with Lived Experience of Chronic Pain (21+ years of continuous migraine, health insurance useless, made me into a junkie for 5ish years) – severe chronic pain often prevents you from doing things because you can't afford the consequences you absolutely know will follow. I could, in theory, do most of the things I've ever done, but I would be utterly fuckin' wrecked for days/weeks/months after, depending on the activity. So the backpacking thing, combined with the "alternative wellness" shit, isn't too surprising to me – this reads like a guy who was trying to live the way he'd lived before, and who was faced with the consequent suffering in new and exponentially increasing ways when he tried to retain his personal idea of normalcy (including the failures of traditional and "alternative" "wellness"), until he had to do SOMETHING concrete. And when there's nothing concrete to do about becoming more and more crippled, trust me, you start thinking of concrete acts that are just relevant enough to make your goddamn point.

iceland

Liked the part when they go on and on about what Luigi plagiarizing his Ted K goodreads review says about his character then brace looks it up on his phone and informs everyone no, he properly quoted it, then they just move on flying by the seat of our pants here

abby

direct line from HBD back to classical eugenics à la Francis Galton, inventor of the bell curve as a device for ranking and measuring deviance in “innate” mental traits like intelligence and also — which I think is not incidental for the popularity of this stuff in the tech world — grandfather of statistics. big secret is that all these AI models are just regular statistical models made powerful by huge quantities of data

Sampz

Brace—Clay is the smallest size class of mineral soil particles, diameter <0.002mm. Others are silt and sand.

Matelda

Maybe the assassination wasn't directly related to all that other stuff about him. Like you don't have to go much deeper than Michael Moore, plus have a major medical episode, to be radicalized against the US health insurance system. Maybe he just had a lot of interests, but there was his big source of rage.

Alex

Bro just needed a new office chair, damn

Natalie

I had back surgery and have been in pain for like 7 years now, but I'm able to do stuff like go on walks, carry stuff etc. I'm just always in pain and I move through it. But I'm always angry about it and it's really fucked my life/affect. I think people are underestimating what you can do after surgery, but also how much pain can change someone.

Bad Air

So stupid shoulda dropped that backpack in the east river

Sai

So citronella's a fed right? Jk

MKatieUltra

What's the count on the True Anon "don't do it" cold open?

roz pea

to be clear, the Gilman school is, of all the expensive private schools in Baltimore, the hands-down most fascist. I took my SATs there because I guess that's where they were that year and they had all over the school what I can only describe as "Hitler youth-esque propaganda ." I'm talking a norman Rockwell style painting of a blonde guy and an American flag with some shit like "for god and your country be the best man you can be" or something. not an environment where a CEO killer would come from just imo

syd

Beautifully put!

Sai

Yep. Most Americans aren't nerds/ have beliefs that aren't easily categorized. Stav Halkias did a good impression of Luigi writing his letter to the cops, "honestly I haven't done all the reading, but I know something's fucked up and I'm gonna let my Glock talk for me" Something like that. I think it captures something essential about Luigi and why he has so much broad appeal. He was motivated more by the unfolding of history than any meticulously constructed mental labyrinth of justification.

Jack Ross

“It’s gotta be longer and have a little more thrust”

Ben

Wym? I think he is almost for sure. I say this as someone who was in that discord in 2020

K H

The steel of a normal gun lets it remain viable indefinitely. 3D printed guns don't need metal but the likelyhood and severity of failure is much higher. He's a rich kid. He likely has the means to print whatever can be printed. I also remember they said he left his wallet which...did he or not? I don't believe anything the police have said. I don't believe the casings match from what I've heard. I think he may have had a gun that took the same ammunition, which proves nothing. A lot of bullshit still to me. Unless I somehow get picked for the jury. In which case idk I'm hella apolitical and undecided.

Sai

Idk. I'm just a lil paranoid and I get a weird gut feeling about him. I know it's bad to cast such aspersions wildly tho. Idk what discord you're talking about, don't use the app.

Doug Cartel

Yeah the cops were probably getting a bazillion tips but they somehow zeroed in on the one from the old lady at the mcdimbles? The same dopes were calling the cops calling helicopters drones like 3 days later

Stevie Nicks

Don't do it!!! ...but, if you do it...

Mood Slut

It’s hilarious how this obsession with identity/identity politics is embedded in American society. Internet leftists crying because Luigi isn’t left enough and therefore not a true working class hero, everyone rushing to pour over his life history and profile the dude to pinpoint where his catalytic influences are and why he’d do it. It’s not unusual to come from a privileged background, work in tech, be a bro but also an autodidact with a lot of interests who likes to read things that may be within and outside the scope of personal beliefs. If he’s already a somewhat altruistic person, experience with life altering chronic pain and dealing with the US healthcare system would probably be enough to expand someone’s desire for effective action beyond the personal to systemic. It’s not that deep, all that is beside the real point: this series of events is showing us, in real time, a glimmer of class solidarity emerging because of the assassin’s actions, and Luigi’s reception in culture and media is an interesting angle of it. That’s far more interesting to me, idk. Also, we don’t even know if Luigi is the actual guy, there’s all kinds of unanswered questions about the manner in which he was IDed and some kind of strange theatrics going there too, but wait and see there I guess.

Sarah Bee

I always have at least two purses in my purse so it makes sense to me.

Ben Green

I first encountered communism on Civilization 1. It worked best and the people looked cool.

Biglacheese

The weapon malfunctions were almost certainly caused by the suppressor and whatever ammo he used. I won’t explain it because it’s boring. Also MEN CAN EAT LUNA BARS ITS OK TO EAT LUNA BARS IF YOUR A MAN ESPECIALLY THE COCONUT AND THE LEMON ONES

Oliver Clozov

if anything this episode is a great argument against committing acts like this, because who would want their entire humiliating online life picked apart by a bunch of podcasts and newspapers. i shutter to imagine "did craven moorehead's appetite for bisexual encouragement femdom porn vids motivate them in any way?" thanks but i'd much rather be unremarkable and never do anything newsworthy ever

T

I’ll speak for millennial white boys everywhere - we worked hard to stop saying the B word and the F word, can’t we just keep saying the R word occasionally as a little treat?

Sean

i wonder if Luigi played MGS2

Mood Slut

This is the first time I’ve listened to him but I don’t like him a super lot either. Cites being “from (the) art” world for every other claim he makes. As an artist, that’s first of all annoying and sus, and second of all, shut up, artists and normies know we live and work in a separate universe, but we all have access to people who know about 3D printers it’s not some special art thing. Anyway, I’m now lurking for details about this discord

Sarah Bee

It shouldn’t have been that hard. And no.

Sai

What discord u talking bout Ben? Did citarella run some group?

Grace

I know a few people who went there… all grew up to be ontologically evil consultants

LilBigBoy

Beware the poster trying to start a discord 🙅 avoid the funnel. WE DISAVOW

K H

I vaguely get wearing the same outfit to save time, but I think if you can't decide what to eat to the point it is meaningfully impacting your time it indicates a mental impairment. Like every thought or decision is obsessive and tedious. Brace is also giving effective altruism guys too much credit. I think HAL would harm itself to further the mission, but ea guys only ever work backwards from what is most self serving, no matter how minor or petty. They are the same kind of ai as Bender.

K H

Cops are fucking liars.

Oliver Clozov

the fact that he was from a wealthy family just vindicates his point even more. the american healthcare industry has so little social utility that it can't even effectively serve wealthy people. his family's wealth just illustrates that the existence of private health insurance benefits literally nobody except the insurers. it should be more of a talking point, that this isn't about a few people on the very very margins of the economy; you can have a lot of money and still not be able to access quality healthcare in america.

Mood Slut

Yes, absolutely this

K H

Honestly that is sometimes all you need. Arc of history is a Nike swoosh. That's why we lova Luigi and Hillary is hated despite all her calculations and being a far better killer.

K H

Also it makes it easy for normies like meself to pull answers out of them with 0 effort.

K H

Thank you. Yes. It builds a kind of fury you sort of live with, until you don't or can't I guess. Can't imagine chronic injury you perpetually feel every hour of your life. Even a few months put you in a villain arc(you not me, I don't do that, I disavow it).

Nate Herter

GEORGES BATAILLE MENTIONED!!!

K H

Dont!.....

K H

Doesn't really matter does it? You get what you need for the deed.

K H

My retarded friend says it's cool if I say it.

K H

Myfitnesspal It's free. Calorie counting by food is easy. Sets a daily goal for you. Counts macros. It's not complicated it's just hard. Like blicking a ceo.

Andrew Bates

Its a 3D printed gun because pistols are virtually illegal in NYC correct?

K H

I think you are overthinking his actions. Hated the guy and ALLEGEDLY killed him. Happens all the time.

Louise

From the neurodivergence angle, like you may be able to clock it but what is it actually? Like my theory is that it's a byproduct of a whole constellation of comorbidities that get neglected and ignored. Like for example I can feel my organs leaning against my ribs and gravity pulling my bones out of joint (not to mention the psychological torture of the lights and sounds of modern life) and sure that stuff annoys everybody but I'm sure if someone were to suddenly feel the way I feel all the time they'd be rolling on the ground and screaming. Which no caregiver has the patience for when the causes are inscrutable. So you pretend everything is fine and normal when you should be rolling around on the ground and screaming while memorizing the state capitals or whatever. That does something to you, and that something is popularly known as neurodivergence. And then eventually the wear and tear of ignoring the pain and its underlying causes catches up with you and you can't pretend everything's fine and normal anymore. And then, crazy is mostly just what other people call you when you're dealing with pain in a way that annoys them.

Michael S. Judge

Luckily it manifested in the opposite form with me, Junkie Mystic Hero of the World's Downtrodden, until they took the drugs away and I became Mystic Hero of the World's Downtrodden Who Will Respond to That Email Soon, Probably Like a Couple Days, Sorry, Reading Text on a Screen Makes Me Nauseous When the Pain Gets Bad

Seth Aronovich

Yeah but you can just go to like any other state and buy a pistol. It would be more reasonable to do it if he was still in Hawaii and doing the deed there, and had been denied a pistol permit (unlikely). Building a 3d printed gun, let alone using it, is inherently a political statement, unless you are a felon with no friends to buy guns for you.

Horseloverfat

Kafkaesque is absolutely appropriate for describing the us healthcare system. Reading “the trial” with my students rn, and the depiction of a system that justifies its power by referring to rationality but makes its actual mechanics so opaque and idiosyncratic as to defy any rational scrutiny is so recognizable if you’ve ever dealt with an insurance company.

Axel H.

The chronic pain angle is interesting to me, but what I’ve always wondered is, what is the ideal approach there? On one hand, I’m hearing that the necessary drugs are not being provided, but on the other, I’m hearing that those drugs lead to addiction and are too easily dispensed. Or is this just a matter of something that has no good solution (I can think of a family member with chronic pain, with good health insurance, but anything they’ve tried really hasn’t done much to alleviate it, so it’s just a constant cycle of trying new drugs that aren’t having much effect) and a possible violent reaction to living with what is essentially daily torture?

Seth Aronovich

As someone who was formerly a racist libertarian, I'm surprised that someone who's recently been connected to that milieu- let alone EA/centrism/moldbuggery- did something so entirely morally justified, even if he might have done it for selfish reasons. Now, call me an INSANE CONSPIRACY THEORIST, but, frankly I wouldn't be surprised if he had actually become a genuine honest radical, whether left or right, but thought it would be funny to badjacket losers like this Gurwinder freak who had been tricking him for all those years. He's certainly smart enough to do it. Just hypothetically, if I was to do something, I would- before even making any physical preparations to carry out the direct action- wipe all my electronic devices and online accounts except for a YouTube account with a playlist of Lex Friedman interviews with Ben Shapiro.

Mood Slut

The “oh maybe he’s on the spectrum” thing annoyed me - like maybe he is but who cares? And you’re totally right, chronic pain is enough on its own but when you add the 24/7 sensory hyper-awareness it would be so excruciating.

Seth Aronovich

I think it's just a general reference to Discord. Discord the company is incredibly dodgy, a lot of their admin staff are open supporters of the 'minor attracted person' movement (i.e. nonces). Discord will shut down anything political outside the CNN/Fox endorsed mainstream line- unless it's weird freaks who say the Nazis were cool because they had a bear and a eagle rip jews apart in the Holocaust or something like that. If you're using Discord, and you're under 16, you're either being groomed to post nudes or groomed to join an FBI funded 'nazi' group. If you're over 16, it's just the latter.

Axel H.

I guess but I’ve been mostly impressed at the still positive outlook toward this guy and what he did, even with all the personal stuff coming out. I haven’t personally seen many leftists whining about him not being left. Mostly I’ve seen liberals pearl-clutching about how murder is glamorized and that he should’ve voted harder or some shit.

MKatieUltra

Luigi has spondylolisthesis (SPON dee lo lis THEE sis) which is when the arch part (which covers the spinal cord) of your lower lumbar vertebra breaks, so then the vertebral body (cylinder shape that bears weight) slides forward on the sacrum or vertebra below it. The surgery moves the sliding vertebra back into position and fuses it to the one below it. In his x ray it looks like it’s still sliding forward a good deal. Apparently he was happy at first but maybe there was some kind of failure?

Mood Slut

All the left “we can’t claim him!” whining I’ve seen appeared in comment threads on instagram etc. Probably less frequent than liberal pearl clutching but my feed doesn’t show me a lot of that

Seth Aronovich

Oh, absolutely, but we should not reject statistics (or, in my opinion, intelligence research). The problem with HBD in my view, is that most proponents of being 'open thinkers' are nothing of the sort. It's just motivated reasoning for weird nerds who want a justification for why they (while getting no pussy) (nor having real political sway- while the relative morons who run the companies they work for actually do have that) are in fact superior to the rest of the human race. Wheras a normal person could apply knowledge of genomics and statistics and being a moral human bean to generalize from the fact that they still really care about their dumbass cousin who was born that way and want to make sure they stay off the pipe and can take care of their daughter, to generally caring about making society better for everyone, including those who were born dumb.

Seth Aronovich

God bless the martyrs and those who love them.

Seth Aronovich

It wouldn't have been necessary. The actionist used, as far as I understand it, a regular Glock slide and barrel (I believe there was a reference to a 3d-printed barrel- definitely not the case). So all he would have 3d-printed is the receiver and suppressor. Fairly straightfowrard

D

Murder also happens to be illegal in NYC too. My guess is he thought if he had to ditch the gun for some reason he didn't want it traced, included even if it was a private sale. But also I think he kept the gun because he wasn't finished.

Seth Aronovich

I can't believe they planted crack in your glovebox

Seth Aronovich

@K H always glad to meet a fellow collector of retard passes.

Rob Douglas

As a person that had an Ankylosing Spondylitis diagnosis at 19 (degenerative imuno disease, used to be called Bamboo spine) I can fully attest to going dark especially in my 20s. I used to scream and cry on the drive home from work every day during a flare up which would last months, and literally crawl out of my car into bed. I am so grateful that I live in Western Australia, where at least some of my treatment was covered by Medicare including, hydrotherapy and chronic pain management classes. I still paid for specialists which was also covered in part. I felt despondent and helpless during those times even with support. I can only imagine how mentally fracturing dealing with something similar in the U.S. would be for someone.

Seth Aronovich

@Nakatomi_Jones @Degrassi Knoll The gun definitely did not have a printed barrel, not even a printed slide. Just a 3d printed lower receiver/'grip' and suppressor. If he hadn't used the suppressor- or experimented with different ammo or a Nielson device- it could easily have been tuned to fire reliably for the intended purpose.

D

Even this episode engages in this where the guest has plotted this cosmology of terminally online reactionary dude spheres and he's test fitting mangione into each one. Also the latter part about this dude building the systems of control that ultimately turn against him and how poetic that is is absurd -- this is not how being a low level tech employee works. Its just a job and mundane one at that.

Seth Aronovich

It sounds like you need to deprogram yourself with Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri (TM).

Gus

Like a record, bb

Daniel

Joshua Citarella I received the secret messages you sent me in the intro and yes I will fall in love with you (I am a gay man)

Bilbro T. Baggins

I'm so okay with glowing up this dude, especially if he is on the wrong politics. Maybe this could replace those assholes going after schools and shit.

Seth Aronovich

That's a really good question, and one that the current state of the Ammurrican empire allows no solutions for. I would only give the example of what an alternative healthcare paradigm allows. With a tiny fraction of a percentile the budget that any capitalist pharma (or health insurance) company has, the Cubans managed to develop CimaVax, a vaccine (also effective for those already affected by the condition) against the most common form of lung cancer. Imagine what America's health researchers- many of whom are as capable and intelligent as those clever Cubans, and who would have access to far more funding- could do in a society where every 'health' 'insurance' CEO, and those of usurers like BlackRock encountered non-conventional solutions to their sabotage of human society?

Mood Slut

Ha, I struggled to keep listening when Cinderelli started laying out the cosmology. It’s giving Pundits Struggle to Comprehend the Non-Binding Nature of Categories; Personality and Held Beliefs are Not Static or Logical

Michael S. Judge

If you do have some manner of mental impairment or "divergence" or whatever, though, that kind of shit can make a real difference. I wear mostly 5-10 (I haven't actually counted in a while) copies of essentially the same thing, same pants shirt shoes hoodie + more stuff if it's cold, because OCD will drive me to panic if I give the broken part (or, more realistically, one of many broken parts) of my brain enough new factors to worry about. The solution doesn't make any sense on a finely-sifted philosophical level, 2 pairs of "the same" black jeans are still 2 different pairs of pants, but sensorily, it's apparently enough to quiet down the obsessive-compulsion on that particular front. (When I was a kid, for reasons I don't understand, I was intensely obsessed with the collars and necklines of shirts, sweaters, etc., and with the feeling that I was being "choked," and I would scratch my neck and whatever you call the place where your neck and head meet, under-jaw?, till I was bleeding, because I had to "check to make sure I wasn't choking" at least once a minute for the entire day. What this does or doesn't reveal about Mr. Lucino Gorgonzola, I couldn't tell you, and there's an enormous and frankly, from the bottom of my trench, venom-inducing affectation of bullshit like this around Silicon Valley and Reddit "philosophy" types, because they know investment capital wants to see Hyperfocused Autist Warlock and throw money at it – but when you've got it bad, however they quantify "it," you have to take absolutely every goddamn chance you're given to make It back off, or you will, one way or another, find yourself dying)

iceland

Love the show but this episode annoyed me. Delving deeper and deeper into every interest this guy had as a 26 year old tech guy—implying that IQ race science has something to do with the shooting? Maybe it does. Idk. But sure seems more likely he did this bc he’s lived in chronic pain, had first hand experience with the injustice of the system, and bc he’s a proactive tech guy—and not some loser online leftist—he went and did something about it Most ppl’s brains are a nebula of contradictory shit. That doesn’t mean his anger at the healthcare system was related to Lindy man. It’s stupid It’s a little offensive to frame someone’s righteous personal anger as incoherent bc he gave Sapiens 5/5 stars

K H

I usually wear literally the same shirt and pants everyday(10 shirts...the exact same shirt, not 10 different looking shirts, 4 pants same deal). I have 3 outfits determined by purpose, not even really a subjective decision. I get taking a long time to pick clothes because there are a lot of factors to consider and optimize which leads to recursive changes. Eating you only need to decide if you would like it or not and nutritional content(if applicable). That is some woman coded tendencies taking that long to choose what to eat. I ain't using no fem autists for my technoempire.

iceland

If we agree everything is downstream of systems than we also need to 1) grant individuals grace for not having our exact politics and 2) stop taking so much personal credit for whatever incidental series of events lead us to being leftists

Ellen Grace

I live in Canada and get weekly injections for chronic pain and it’s free, I looked it up once and if I lived in the US it would cost me 120,000$ a year

b2b saas purveyor

aw, loved the first few editions of Civilization but fell off after 3 - its a drag to hear it's all tech founder-y now

Eddie Strange

I’m a neck (cervical) and back spondylosis sufferer, basically have to constantly adjust and click and stretch my head and neck and shoulders back into not-as-painful positions, which over the last handful of years (combined with food sensitivities that I’ve been slowly figuring out that cause general inflammation and intense joint pain, and a genetic mutation that means I can’t methylize/process the artificial form of folate, folic acid, which is added to fucking everything) has turned my life upside-down and forced me to change and adapt to so many things most people take completely for granted. I was a professional illustrator/artist that basically had to stop at about 30 years old because it was so painful and debilitating. I can absolutely relate to and empathize/sympathize with someone being radicalized by that type of pain.

iceland

“He was motivated more by the unfolding of history than any meticulously constructed mental labyrinth of justification” Which is why his “manifesto” was on a cocktail napkin. Which is way more broadly relatable than if he had written an actual manifesto

Eddie Strange

On the folic acid thing, it is pretty wild that the government, in an attempt to combat spina bifida by getting folate into the diets of pregnant women (especially those that might not know they are pregnant yet and thus don’t know they should be taking a prenatal vitamin or something) has added SO MUCH folic acid to enriched foods (meaning a ton of people are probably taking more than they need or should be taking), and in the small population of people like me that have the MTHFR gene mutation, any amount of folic acid in our diets builds up over time and causes intense physical and psychological issues, including depression and schizophrenia-adjacent symptoms. So, like, I was unintentionally being poisoned by the government ever since I was at least 7 and it resulted in symptoms that would automatically make me seem like a crazy person, especially if I were to talk about it in those terms 🫠 so yeah it is hard not to be angry and resentful of certain authorities and systems that treat people like expendable acceptable losses, lol

Eddie Strange

To be honest that was a bit of a weird take to hear, kind of a stretch especially from someone who thought 4 was the last one that came out

Louise

I've noticed brace likes to point out people's neurodivergence the way a weird kid at school points out a different kid as weird to throw off the attention

retrocalie

anyone know the book Liz mentioned around 1:39:00, I cannot for the life of me decipher what she said

roz pea

he's misrepresenting it, the games have always had "near future tech" like the cyro stasis cells on civ 3 for the spaceship. it's all pretty standard light sci do stuff like gene splicing and cloning and, yes, artificial intelligence. it's not tech bro-y at all. you should check out 5 for sure

Special Adeline

Yung Chomsky with the Squigglevision reference... Real Home Movies heads will understand

Alex C

Accursed Share is the name I think.

Sean Kelly

Damn this ep may have the clunkiest “I’ll drop the r-word to showcase my irreverence” instance ever put on wax

Eddie Strange

For some reason I heard “Accursed Throne” and thought that sounded metal as hell

Liz MacBride

I think she said not a specific book but just to read Bataille

XvinzXznivX

I follow this guy on insta he’s hot

The Marvelous Meredith Marks

Guy who found out about the Trump assassination 2 weeks after it happened because trueanon was on vacation

Liz MacBride

waaait i did some further research with spotify autogen captions and she acc says “the accursed share” specifically xox

Arjun Jayaraman

What a great episode, truly. Great job guys.

PT

I agree with this very much. It was infuriating. I’m also a bit sick of them tying every single code monkey into this e/acc AI startup culture nonsense. It feels like working backwards from a foregone conclusion.

Shfifty_five

I feel you dude, had 3 cervical disk replacements then fusions. The 2nd and 3rd were revisions. Pain is okay now but after 10 years it fucked up my head/career a ton. Also in massive medical debt I'm pretending isn't there.

T Sur

His family is very prominent in Baltimore and very close to Pelosi's.

Gabe P

Scott Thompson of Kids in the Hall is very much alive.

Genevieve Kuzak

I don't care if he is a real leftist or not!!! Who cares?!

Uso Dayo

Were you in a relationship at the time? My wife would laugh at me if I wore the same thing more than two days in a row

Alexandria

Lyme, you say? That changes things......

K H

Eventually women will comment, yes. I do have other shirts I can wear to bait and switch, I just almost never do. I also try to mostly stand behind them to minimize the effect. A small price to pay for Jobian productivity.

Tvvvv

The only relevant political activities left in the world are right wing. It’s like Hamas. Is it left? probably not. Do I celebrate their efforts and wish for their victory? Obviously.

Carson D

Well hell yeah

Alexandria

The King of crib-skull? Gavin Newsom. That shit is a straight up cliff. Babies require intermittent rotation for the first 2.5 years, like gas station hot dogs.

Brian

“Why isn’t the manifesto more niche?? What did he actually expect to get out of the shooting??” y’all are not fun

Baked B

Halfway thru and I’m absolutely gooped. Love the guest he’s a real smarty pants

12345

One thing, although I'm not an orthopedic doc, looks like there is still poor alignment post surgery.

I am become reply guy

I don’t have chronic pain per se but I do have some old injuries/ imbalances that are exacerbated by a physical job. I do shrooms every 3 to 4 months and that shit gets sorted out pronto.

alex

“you can touch people” thanks brace! im gonna make this my new thing

Gallo Altanero

Lived with a dude for three months in Mexico doing medical school rotations who ended up shooting a DEA agent (they called him ISIS fucking least Muslim dude ever—just schizophrenic—he was Muslim—bought a whole necklace to protect him from voices and aliens) perfect shot I guess through the chest. All on CCTV. But went into a Starbucks before wrote his real name backwards and that’s how he got caught. I have a feeling his girlfriend also at the time had a role in it to tell him to do it. But guy had serious anger issues and drug issues. Otherwise good guy. You can look it up.

Shiv

“We disavow you, we don’t know you,” #dontdoit #butifyoudoit #nodoingit #noBut

Burner Von Burns

Did someone (Brace) say “pyramidal pussy”? I might have died just a touch.

Danny

hm I actually HATE civ

Shiv

he’s efficiency pilled hence the minifesto

Gallo Altanero

I did orthopedics my intern year, but knees, hips and occasional amputations. But yeah the doctors may have messed up and usually the hospital pays out. Or used to.

Shiv

have been looking for this, cheers

Carl anderson

As a law clerk I read a preliminary hearing transcript for a homicide case where Luigi’s PA attorney represented the defendant. Objections every other line

Tranche Devereaux

“I was told by various females that Lara bars are ok” - Brace. I can’t believe you used the F word

ploob

Whoa

Aaaaaaaaaaaron1

You guys should check out Print Shoot Repeat on YT if you want a quick primer on where 3D printed arms are these days.

Christopher Price

i thought it made a lot of sense, because for one thing that long zoom call was basically his last contact with the broader world before getting caught. meanwhile the discussion of his pain showed it crystallized his feelings and motivated him to act. if it were just about the back pain, it would've been a different insurance ceo, but the e/acc background led him to choose Thompson.

Christopher Price

fellow AS sufferer here--are you on any meds? I can't imagine going through it with anything less.

Christopher Price

drugs don't necessarily mean painkillers. I have a similar issue and I've been taking biologics, not narcotics, for 24 years now. idk about his condition since that seems to be more related to misalignment of the spine, while mine is inflammation.

ploob

Yes, stand behind women!

Christopher Price

yeah, he makes a pretty good case that the gun and retaining it was ideological for him. like if it's just supposed to be a ghost gun, why not throw it into a pond at central park? if you want a cheap gun why not buy one in the fucking South before coming north?

Christopher Price

i have a similar deal, but it's my workwear that's going under my uniform and shit. i'm actually trying to expand, so i'm not so monochrome on my days off.

Ligma

Might be my cynicism but I'm so tired of hearing about this guy already. I'm not shedding any tears for the ceo, it was pretty awesome for the first few days but literally nothing has or will happen. Luigi will be America's folk hero but the system still remains. We have a tendency to turn everything into entertainment and not action.

Christopher Price

that part was really good, actually. some nice irony in it and explained what he took from Ted K.

People's Housing Project

Hell yeah. Super knowledgeable and knows how to talk about his knowledge in a cool way 😎

Calvin

Luigi loves tech!

People's Housing Project

I dunno though, I work in tech and I really hate these people. They're so often technically brilliant but just so fucking socially stupid, but since they are pretty good at computer they think they know everything. It gets really old really fast

Christopher Price

yeah, i woke up with my left knee inflamed and dragged myself to the soccer field to train for an hour, because i like doing that and i wanted to tell the pain to go fuck itself. i'm sure it'll be worse tomorrow, but hey.

Tvvvv

Thomas Matthew Crooks was a Home Movies animation style character.

JD Nonce

Where can I find the 26 hour iceberg deep dive Matthew talks about?

earthlandingfake

Oh for sure, I wasn't meaning to imply that he must have acquired the gun from a 3rd party, I was just pointing out that it's a possibility, with regards to the speculation over what the mindset of someone producing their own firearm would be. Talking about what motivates someone to acquire a 3d printer, seek out the designs, likely need to research materials, possibly iterate on producing the final product, sourcing the additional parts, etc. but I think it's not out of the realm of possibility that he didn't ever own a 3D printer at all, and that while I think everyone can agree he trained with the gun, there's nothing conclusive that says that he was in fact the one who made it. I don't necessarily have any reason to believe he didn't make it either, but like I said, I just think it's worth considering that he could have acquired it elsewhere.

Jesse

I’m gonna keep it real with you guys…the vibes are off on this EP.

Mona Messier

Laughed too much at the Huberman polycule episode on the timeline that I had to rewind to hear the other issues on timeline.

Mona Messier

For some reason (my horrible personality) I'm friends/relatives with a large number of doctors. In addition to their largest market cap they're well known for having the highest rate of refusals (30%). And even without knowing the actual percentage doctors hate United Healthcare more than any other insurance company.

Khemith

One of the coolest Canadians to have ever lived.

Louis Wilkins

Critical support for the old guy who beat up 12 year old brace.

Peter Annee

There is no better Monday treat than a fresh 2 hour+ TrueAnon ep

K H

Praxis is one small benefit.

Vero

He pronounced every letter, too

Vero

Yeah wtf

Rob Douglas

Firstly, I'm sorry to hear of your diagnosis. Its a hard road, but can tell you at 43 now, the flare ups subside and are less intense as you get older. I was on all sorts of meds during the worst of it. Steroids that made me fat and gave me acne, strong anti inflammation and pain medication, and anti depressants and self medicating to numb it all. It was fucked, I was fucked, and this was with an Australian Health Care system that heavily subsidised most of it. Pain management therapy was the most impactful treatment, but also community, my local hardcore scene saved my life just through jams and hangs. You do have to sort of accept your lot and not let it rule your life. Take it one wave at a time and know that it will pass and it WILL get more manageable in time.

Your Mum

CHRISTCHURCH OTAUTAHI MENTIONED???

Sai

Wait what? Whaddya mean all talk of him has been wiped from Twitter?

Pug_luvr

Georges Batailles, The Accursed Share

dan

yep, he’s just a normal righteously angry tech bro, which is why this sort of vigilantism is so common from these sort of guys and happens all the time!

Tammy

Up yer sister.

Tammy

🚨“Desert” ALERT 🚨

iceland

Yeah, because the “tech bro” part of it isn’t the important part, lol What do you think the inciting incident was, Dan? Being a 26 year old with giant screws in his back? Or following Lindy man

Tammy

That is a fascinating share, thank you fellow traveler!!! Going to look that up right now. Many events lately remind me of Jaswant Singh Chail, the most well-documented earthly Sith Lord. Would be a fun blunt roto/poker game w all of them! Of course you and Sarai would also be invited. I would invite Brace or Liz or YC but I would want to listen to the Boston Marathon episodes lol.

JD Nonce

ya got me 😤

Michael Barrett

Feel like I've been stuck in a TA/JC timeloop for the past few weeks!

einbert

Good episode but the guy saying "bernie is a radical" did make me laugh out loud. Bernie is a shitlib, who supports genocide. Nothing radical about that monster.

Hardcore Virgin

My issue with this episode or why I didn’t find it particularly entertaining and perhaps with time I will, is as follows. Brace talks about how ineffective the propaganda of the deed is which fine, fair point, rarely does a death galvanize a people etc. It does however seem to be what happened in this case. When that happens who Luigi is or what he believes ceases to matter since he’s more of a screen onto which the public can project whatever sentiment. Hence becoming a folk hero. Death of the doer if you will. A detailed look at his life is certainly warranted but I’d be much more interested in a deep look at the mechanisms trying very hard at this moment to stop the public from lionizing Luigi. The Well Actually notes sung here are pretty grating. Which is why I stopped listening with another two hours to go. Maybe what I’m saying gets addressed. Idc. I’ll listen in a year. TLDR. Who care what Luigi believed. He gave up his life. He belongs to the people. Free Luigi.

goblinshoes

this episode is throwing me back to my ethics for computer science students class at UBC. described here is literally what the average software engineer believes especially in Canada 😭 Canada is where the tolerance of socialized medicine comes from I think.

goblinshoes

and shoutout to the Punjabi community

Ligma

Fellow vancouverite

Porphyrogénnētos

ok i struggle reading philosophy/“serious” cultural critique & economics because i’m a fucking idiot, but i actually tried reading the accursed share. i would welcome a semi-literate person correcting my takeaway which was: society creates a surplus above & beyond what is needed to survive, and that surplus simply can’t be reinvested indefinitely. so it has to be spent. and generally it gets spent on “wasteful” luxuries (georgie has a hot take on what constitutes wasteful/unproductive) or affirmatively evil shit like war, instead of making the world a better place by curing cancer or housing the homeless or whatever. and the way we spend that “accursed share” is a basic characteristic of & enormous influence on the structure of society, and highlights/reflects the internal contradictions of capitalism. america is perhaps the society most obsessed with profit/productivity, and thus creates the most “excess,” but that just results in americans spending it on the dumbest, least productive, most suicidal shit of all time.

Porphyrogénnētos

call me a hopeless romantic but i stan for the pflp & leila khaled

Porphyrogénnētos

for people who routinely ridicule the left’s self-sabotaging obsession with ideological purity and extremely online nerd shit, they’re really going out of their way to reach a cynical conclusion about luigi

Cosmo Pappas

Another thing that’s just uncanny and off is the typical phrase is delay deny defend not delay deny depose

blinkpup

because it makes you sound like a child

Red Herring McGuffin

I'm only 6 minutes in but do they fr just accept that he actually did it? He somehow got a rhinoplasty, new eyebrows, and a differently shaped face in 5 days, if we accept that he did it. Or, hear me out, the guy who "wrote" a manifesto which sucks off the feds in the first sentence, who supposedly didn't dispose of the murder weapon in five days, and took five days to get to Altoona even though it only takes half a day on the slowest and shittiest buses imaginable is a patsy. The shit about how the pigs were tipped off at the McDonalds glows to high hell (was it someone who worked there, or an elderly dude, or a rookie pig? who knows?) but you're just accepting the narrative? Lmao ok, I get why people call you feds.

Joe

Also, shouldn't we by harnessing that real frustration into leftist movements if we have any chance at succeeding? That's what the right does and that's why they win. With things like gamergate, right wing shitheads who seized that movement weren't like "oh, well he actually voted for Obama and liked GIRLS, so we shouldn't try to radicalize him".

Joe

Everybody, but the left especially, needs to abandon the idea that politics is nothing more than the media one consumes.

Tom

Maybe there’s some nuance to be found in the next 2.5 hours my guy..

Jed Levin

Did they take blood after arresting him? Curious if Luigi has any addictions we should know about, even if he could afford them.

Johann Krautz

Very unlikely that the kiosks at fast food franchises are proactively streaming video to law enforcement; simply not realistic when the bandwidth and processing involved is considered. Signal to noise ratio for useful information would be staggeringly bad. If tech was involved I expect it would have been good old-fashioned SIM card tracking.

Cletus Bocephus

Did anyone catch the name of the book Liz recommended at 1:40:30?

jeanetteclairee

people trying to figure out his politics need to understand that he’s Just A Guy. i really don’t know how you live in America this long and never encounter A Dude.

Joe

The right does not do this and this is why they win.

Acele

‘The Accursed Share’ by Georges Bataille

Petrorenminbi

Andreessen feels like a guy who would love the Prussian 3 class franchise, especially the part of it where they calculated how much in taxes you would pay if you paid taxes but you don’t actually pay taxes and you still get to be first class

J98

"I'm from art"

PineBat Jo

I had a dream I was making out with Luigi. I think I'm online too much.

iaguz

Liz being horrified to learn the 4th X in 4X stands for eXterminate, aww. She'll never understand games. That's fine.

Gallo Altanero

The house they raided and got him was the one I lived in for 3 months. A lot of strange shit went down while I was there aside from the cartel stuff we would see in the hospitals, sneaking patients out in trunks, colleagues killing colleagues, some family murked the head administrator for stealing money for basic life saving medication. It was the best of times and worst of times. Learned a lot.

Gallo Altanero

The head FBI guy looked like Michael Scott from the Office and I took him out on his 50th birthday. Guy had no friends. I felt so bad and I took him to what my name is here Gallo Altanero. Great place.

Trevor Wookfield

Luigi decided to be the Karma police for a day. Not sure it gets much deeper.

Natalie

I got over Brace saying it but still confuses me why people in their 30's are obsessed with saying retarded? It just makes you sound like a forum edgelord or like you're from Boston! Otherwise a very interesting episode, thank you guys for delving so deep.

Jordan

I think that’s a bit of a leap

Aaron

he was saying that’s how msm categorizes Bernie lol

BeanCurd

Agreed. It's cruel, infantile, and bad for solidarity.

Rachel

Really good episode. Thank you

Axel H.

I honestly found the concepts they were talking about more interesting than any attempt to directly link this to Luigi and his act. I think, as a curiosity, and to learn about these ideas that may not be as fringe as we think, it’s good to go down the rabbit hole of what Luigi was listening to and reading, but I’m not sure any of it really explains what he did. (But it also may be too early to say that).

Task Unit Boozer

Altoona PD is crooked as fuck. You can google that.

I am become reply guy

Missing from the hypothetical involving the baby and the Picasso is that someone has to buy the painting for it to have any monetary value … why not just save the baby and take the $150M whatever Croesus is holding us hostage? Anyway, the whole thing is absurd because none of these guys is running into a burning building for any reason, they are cowards and believe in nothing worth risking their lives for.

Nat

liz bataille mention hell yes

Doink

What book does liz mention at 1:40:34?? I cant make it out ♥️

hhannahh

calling everything a cliff (cuz it’s a GOAT convention) from now on

jeanetteclairee

It was infuriating. I can’t believe I just wasted 2.5 hours of my life listening to the *only* ppl on the left discount & minimize this shit. It was honestly pathetic.

Maxwell

‘If Anders Brevik cited Bill Maher’ KILLED me. Maybe the greatest offhand Liz comment

Ashley Naftule

There's good stuff in this ep but I really felt like y'all lost the plot when talking about the manifesto. Why is it so surprising that a fairly normie tech dude would have such basic bitch references? Would it really be more credible or effective a statement if he included a bibliography of Zerzan/Bey/Malatesta quotes? If anything, the shortness & clarity of it seems like a much more effective approach in our social media addled age than dropping some rambling 5,000+ word polemic. It's much harder for the media to paint him as a psycho with THAT statement. As to the critique about the statement being too vague for not offering a plan of action- it seems pretty clear to me that he meant for his bullets to do the talking.

Fredric King

Why doesn’t anyone talk about how Luigi Mangione’s family owns multiple B level eldercare homes that collect millions from healthcare insurance companies, including UHC. Maybe Luigi’s rage stems from family estrangement leading to the assassination. He may have been acting out personally against his family.

FFK

It seems like luigi was largely inspired by his back pain and lack of access to treatment

Kern Mailer

Endlessly circularly discursive ostensibly radical leftist podcasts when someone commits an actual real life radical leftist act: BUT BUT BUT IT DOESN’T ALIGN WITH MY SYLLABUS!!

lolwuthappend

What is the guest's purported field of expertise? Online radicalization? He talks as if from a place of advanced knowledge, yet everything he says is fairly common knowledge if you're halfway politically conscious and online. Does he do legit research or reporting or is he a know-it-all podcast interviewer?

Seth Aronovich

The only good thing Anders Breivik did was try and badjacket s**tbag zionist 'counterjihad' scum by frequently citing them in his manifesto.

Goldie

I’m pretty advanced, my macros are absolutely fucking dialed. I’m having trouble timing my 4th meal and I’m getting bored with my food variation.

Liquidated Damages

Brace, to answer your question on what clay is, it’s the smallest component of mineral soil the other two being sand and silt, with sand as the largest. Individual clay particles are orders of magnitude smaller than even the smallest grains of sand.

Kern Mailer

Yeah, well said. This is possibly the worst episode that TrueAnon has ever put out because it’s the first one that actually sounds like cowardice. Distancing intellectual hyper rigorous pedantic analysis as a form of self protective cowardice. Ick.

LB

Alexandria

Them rolling the "rookie" cop who made the arrest out in front of the cameras to share what happened had me lmao. That guy is so fucked

Michael

TrueAnon best podcast but this episode was terrible imo. The guest very smugly and clumsily trying to squeeze a complicated and obviously mentally struggling kid into some e/acc type bc he played this videogame or read that book was very grating. Speculation is fine but excessive and condescending typecasting of a struggling and sympathetic kid sucks. Please do not have guests who for whatever reason feel compelled to remind listeners that they ‘come from the art world’ three times in the first hour. Edit - needlessly mean/bitchy on my part, was just super annoyed at this ep bc Luigi gave up his freedom to make a lot of bad people scared and create a rallying point for millions. Don’t care if he comes from money or doesn’t follow the right people on Twitter dot com. Making this about Tim Urban is CIA behavior.

Samantha Geovjian Clarke

great episode but i gotta be real, the autism jokes are getting really old. mostly because they don't actually feel like jokes... not everyone on the spectrum is Elon Musk just "calling you in" a little bit here

Michael

Luigi was clearly inspired by the fascist-adjacent PC game ‘Civilization 4’.

Michael

He said some variation of this like 3 times in the first hour

Tea for the Tillerman

I say this sincerely the “From art” quip by the guest was more unnerving than anything I heard about Luigi’s bio or the supposed online freaks he followed

Bunghole man

I’m autistic and every time I make a decision I pause and ask myself… what would Elon musk do?

Patrick

what was the author liz says gives a leftist critique of all the racial/rationalism? at 1:40 mark

phoebe L

Shoutout to the apple pie lara bar!! So good

Amber💖

Brace we need you to give us a rundown of your gun recommendations

absoluteboi

i know this guest had brace on his podcast... but you dont need to repeat the favor

Red Herring McGuffin

8:28 'We should say, is still a suspect... we shouldn't work backwards, even though we basically are' 12:59 'Luigi Mangione, 26 years old, from Baltimore Maryland... he shot and killed Brian Thompson the CEO of United Health(care)' 15:14 'There's a very famous moment where he lowers the mask, to smile at the clerk at the hostel' I'm sorry if you think the guy in that photo is the same guy you're actually face blind. 16:19 'He hits a Starbucks, big mistake, on 56th and 6th, they get a second picture of him' Again, they get a second picture of the same guy who has an entirely different face. The only thing in common with Luigi between the two is hair and skin colour. 19:05 'So he's walking up, we see Luigi approach him from behind... Luigi walks up, he's what, maybe 8 feet behind him, and has a gun out' 21:12 'To speculate a little bit about what he did during this dark 6 month period...' 21:38 'We're just following Luigi for now, so Luigi, famously... he gets away' 23:10 'When he gets caught later, he has the gun which matches the ballistics' 28:56 'I wouldn't be surprised if this stuff (McDonald's surveillance) is being used, even if he has a covid mask on, by just seeing like the shape of his nose and his eyes' It'd have to be a false positive if that's what it's going off of. I'm over half an hour in. Still waiting on the nuance. I'll keep going and see if they ever bother to question the narrative the pigs have put forwards, cause it's been a hot minute of uncritical acceptance so far.

Red Herring McGuffin

Also what Joshua says about his 'tech interest in the unabomber' is BS. His former landlord in Hawaii, who is pretending to have been a housemate, told him to read it. Prior to that all his books on goodreads are the most normie dumb guy reading imaginable.

christian

bro you paid to be here

Tammy

Your story is super fascinating!

K H

Syllabusssy

Tammy

I am aware. I take pleasure in saying it, because you have the #1 worst profile I’ve ever seen on Patreon. It’s not funny and literally made me nauseous and excited to make fun of you at the same time. And I blame you and your shit profile for making me feel that way.

K H

He has this one WEIRD trick ceos HATE

JD Nonce

First I’m hearing that it’s not funny. Received lots of good feedback so far. Thanks for your feedback but it will not be taken into consideration

Tammy

Lololol one of Steve Carrel’s first gigs was being the host of the adult themed, VHS only, version of America’s Funniest Home Videos where he badly(actually horrible fr) makes fun of elderly women losing their tops on water slides and jokes about young women losing their virginity from riding the water slide.

Jack

Empires spread deserts which they cannot survive. True whether you like it or not

Dean Watson

Scott Thompson is one of the kids in the hall ; which brace has now outed himself as a fan of

Dean Watson

Yeah I dunno man why wouldn’t he just directly target them then ? Plenty examples of this, not just the Menendez brothers

Jameson .

Please kill me if someone judges me based on some graph I engaged with

George

Pretty terrible guest that didn’t seem to understand any of this. I know some of this stuff is not Brace’s or Liz’s bag but really should’ve just gotten Young Chomsky to properly third mic the show. He’s been doing great lately

George Gallowgay

The way they acted like there must be more to the story that he cited Michael Moore was so confusing. Most people are basic and tons of people have seen that movie… why shouldn’t it radicalize someone?

bab89

Agreed. Felt the episode featured almost no pushback on the narrative provided by law enforcement. Liz makes brief mention of a possibility the manifesto could have been planted or written under duress, but I felt like we were missing any consideration of the constructed narrative presented by Luigi's social media history, or the possibility of him in some way being a patsy?

jeanetteclairee

when brace asked him if he was unemployed I died of laughter

Whitehomothugdeluxe

Good episode . Damn near everyone in the comments is hella weird .

sara brown

I thought the guest was great and knew his shit…. I’m normally on the side of the majority of commenters, but not today, apparently.

sara brown

Genuinely surprised at these comments!

Ella

Fanon says something about how oppression eventually leads to violent revolt, but class consciousness won't organically come about even when people have reached their breaking point. Mangiones actions make more sense to me from that lense, rather than him being a political radical of any kind.

K

The accursed share by Georges Bataille, I think!

Terry Buckley

"mother had a pyramidal pussy" enduced a coughing fit so harsh I nearly passed out

catherine white

Chronic pain patients used to be converted into opioid addicts. Now all this energy that was once focused on drug seeking goes into being radicalized online?

Gallo Altanero

I paid for the whole meal and drinks which was annoying cause I was a student at the time, but he told me, they are looking for bounty hunters in Mexico and I was like I am doctor. I don’t hunt wanted Americans, but looks like it pays a lot. But not my focus so any listeners FBI is interested.

Chas Padunski

The people saying “he did it because of back pain” are missing the point. Tens of millions, if not hundreds of millions, of Americans get screwed over by the healthcare system or are close to someone who goes through insurance hell. So far, very, very few have shot somebody over it. The question is why this guy actually did it. As a bunch of Leftists, it should probably be interesting to us that this guy is a based rationalist, not one of ours.

Chas Padunski

I once had a software engineer tell me they hadn’t realized technology had ethical content (until they’d done a specific ethics fellowship)

Kevin Price

Same here, Joshua is usually insightful tbh

Tammy

LMAO! Very fascinating fr! Sounds like it was a hard experience too so I hope you are in generally safer places now. I’m probably going to take PTO today so I can check it out lol cheers to you 🫡

Tammy

did this guy hang out w Michael Aquino or Jolly West or anything?

Tammy

I don’t think a bounty hunter can take PTO

Tammy

🚨 DORK ALERT 🚨

Christian Bendillo

There’s something to be said about how literally one of the only arguments for keeping the private insurance industry is that it employs so many people and they are now literally automating jobs away without lowering costs.

Tammy

Def going to try and look up these people and see what I find! If you want another rabbit hole to go down, I’ve been researching the history of conversion therapy and how all the dr’s pioneering trans-gender health care(post WWII, this is key) were pretty much psychotic and didn’t care at all about trans folks: Dr Tom Money is the O.G. possibly, but this rabbit hole led me all the way to Black Dahlia murder connections and Nazis and crazy shit

Karl from the Simpsons

Yeah I was excited about this one but it just seems to be guilt by association based on who he followed on Twitter?? Very surface level takes that just end up with them spoon feeding us why Tim Urban is bad

Tammy

Lärabars are Swede coded

Tammy

Iiiiiiiiinteresting…(to me, didn’t know that!)

Gallo Altanero

He was a smart guy who didn’t get treatment. Couldn’t cook an egg. But could solve complex medical stuff. And got hooked on adderall and marijuana. And was Muslim.

Tammy

Wtf is your expertise bitch? Heavy cope going on. lmfao y’all really think cause he’s not as ugly as you or like Slavoj Zizek he’s like getting ahead somehow??

Gallo Altanero

Yeah, well I made the choice to go to a lot of conflict zones in Africa and the Middle East and Latin America while I am still young. One day ideally I go to some beach in Europe and don’t have to worry as much. Currently in California and people complain too much for what they get. But you put that smile on.

Michael S. Judge

it just occurred to me that "Marc Rosario" almost certainly resulted from a pseudonym process that started with "Mario"

Tammy

So you’re def down with other “radical leftist acts” like burning down the Reichstag or when my lib neighbor yelled at someone at the bus stop?

Sai

For real, him "studying internet radicalization" is fishy... Like, to what end? I guess literally any political faction has an interest in understanding how people become political, but idk. It's one of those things that almost seems too obvious to really "study" out of mere curiosity. Like yeah, no shit people get influenced by each other and ideas online. Imo the more interesting thing feds/ ruling class would care about would be mapping existing influencers/ politicized communities online and irl so they know which cell phones to target with drone strikes if the shtf. Otoh, maybe he's just a goofy nerd trying to have a media career 🤷‍♂️

Sai

People like to say whatever they want. It's more alienating to normal people to police language.

Natalie

Wahhh I don't like people suggesting I edit my language I'm gonna be a reactionary now 😡😡😡 Even iDubbbz grew up at some point man

Clammy_Damp

See De Humani Corporis Fabrica for footage of this kind of back surgery. Also it’s in French i.e. art or whatever

Nite Life Jesse

A critique of Josh Citarella but make it incel

K H

Wtf are you talking about Tammatha?

zombie

guest a little funky wit it not gonna lie. spent the whole ep clumsily (incorrectly) typecasting the kid and then is surprised the kid killed "one of his own". Lol.

Mood Slut

hello fellow Vancouverites and UBC attendees

Mood Slut

Haha, I have had the thing about tight collars my whole life too. Can’t stand them. Thankfully wouldn’t scratch. Can’t stand wearing pure wool against my skin. And yeah my day to day wardrobe is a variation on the same formula which has only become more essential since a concussion. In the days after I’ve recovered from a migraine, you bet I’m throwing on whatever does the trick and working it

goblinshoes

thunderbirds lock in!! i love our alum network hahah

Mood Slut

I’m still not over how absurd that refrain is. Might try using it in a client meeting

JengleBellz

Woah, I just had Herbert Marcuse’s grandson, Harold, as my professor in a course on post-war Germany at UCSB. Had no idea they were related til this episode… Thanks True!

Tammy

I’m not mad. I am an attractive leftist.

Ross Moore

Does this download as being named "1" for anyone else?

Red Herring McGuffin

Trueanon in November 1963: So this guy Oswald shot the President of the United States, and we're gonna spend two hours going over his movements leading up the assassination he committed from the 6th floor of the Texas Schoolbook depository building last Friday.

Sai

lol

Natalie

Editing your comment 100 times to make several different points shows me you don't know what you're mad about to begin with

Menikmati

take it from me (just realized im not under a Bataille moniker for this account, very rare), Bataille's idea od expenditure will not help understand economics with any relevancy to the post war unless...

Katy Gruenbaum

Genius episode- thank you all so much, saying and exploring deeper what our intuitive sides were screaming internally!!!!

Sai

Hey I'm friends with lotsa retards 😡

Natalie

This is why I'm fine if people feel "alienated" lmao

Tomas Vall

Excited for the Brace shamefully watching all of the MCU films out of curiosity to understand Thanos arc. He slowly realizes he loves them and starts a GeekTalk pod with Liz (TrueNerd? DorkAnon?)

Sai

Hey, I learned manners at democrat college too dude. Then I realized PC culture is anathema to mass politics in the USA. I've been on the other side of this argument in the past, but its a losing battle. You can't control how people talk. You just end up being an annoying scold 🤷‍♂️

Natalie

Shrugging off the casualness of using dehumanizing language because it makes less waves is a bit pathetic. You can change peoples minds without scolding them too. But that isn't really an internet job I suppose. This is just where we all come to yell.

Sai

Actually I'm not afraid of human beings, I just changed my mind about a thing.

canyon ryan

at 1:40:30 what does Liz say? read Batai for a leftist critique of extermination-racism in a decaying capitalism society? Accursed Chair?

Sai

If scolding is helping you achieve your goals that's great. I wish u luck... unless your goals are evil of course 🙏🙏

Katy Gruenbaum

Also I know Lara personally lol I’m going to show her this episode

Natalie

It's very easy to choose to be a nice person and value people's dignity over edgelord forum humor

Mike Bilbe-Taylor

She's referring to the The Accursed Share written by Georges Bataille

Sai

See that's the thing... I don't think saying rude words makes me or anyone else a "worse person." I think feeling superior to others because they didn't happen to adhere to my particular language code was the actual bad thing. I also think it's kinda funny, the idea that the "retard community" would be up in arms about it. Like, is there someone who self identifies as a retard and says, "That word belongs to my people!" Idk. I knew this kid once whose brother was very disabled and he really took offense to people using the word in conversation. It just cracks me up thinking about him saying "Hey man, my brother is a retard! That's offensive!" Like buddy nobody is calling your brother a retard except you just now. He was part of this thing called "Campaign to end the word" which of course only had the effect of making people use the word more. There's also the thing that happens where PC culture just makes the word a more effective and attractive insult to use. It's more deviant. You'll never stop people from saying words you don't like 🤷‍♂️

grant brown

“The point [of the scolds] is to genuflect towards the rich and powerful, communicating that they are not part of the disgusting poor hordes cracking wise about Brian and Luigi - they’re one of the good ones.”

robynwynn

Woah wtf I was thinking the exact same thing!! I took that class and this one guy was a big ted kazinsky fan, made everyone uncomfortable

robynwynn

We should have a UBC trueanonhead meetup

Kinetics Video

In Civ's case about the worst you get is the caveman guys doing little Looney Tunes executions on each other. I guess nuclear war is technically possible, but I don't know if anybody actual does that in regular gameplay since Civ II

Michael

I agree, but also think it’s very important to remember that people are idiosyncratic, can have incoherent or strange politics, trajectories. Even with his posts, his goodreads etc, I don’t really get the sense he was locked into any ideology or camp. If you’re a young, curious engineer it’s just likelier that you’re reading ‘Sapiens’ rather than ‘The Libidinal Economy’

Michael

Accursed Chair is an excellent title

Kinetics Video

A lot of really lazy left strawman beating this ep. I have not heard anyone claim Luigi was any kind of leftist, really not sure who is being so aggressively corrected here.

Natalie

This entire comment is just the decade old iDubbbz logic again. Maybe you'd geniunely benefit from watching his apology video. Sure my methods could be better, everyone's could, but this is also the comments of a podcast, not a public speech. It's ultimately just not hard to have respect and refrain from language that degrades the dignity of others. We rightfully do it for many other words, yet not this one. I know what CTETW is and had some participation in it in HS too. It didn't always have the intended effect but it was still impactful and tried to do the right thing. And no, defending the disabled people in your life is not the same as using the word against them yourself. That's completely moronic and only seeks to shift personal responsibility away from yourself. People are ignorant and want to do what they shouldn't and they don't change overnight, this is true. I think exposure to different kinds of people is sometimes the only way to change others. But if some want to dig their heels in the ground and die on stupid hills, I'm fine with leaving them there.

Axel Otto

Man there's something about your brain that needs cured

Axel Otto

Oh wait is this bait

TrueAnonPod

That's a very longstanding patreon issue I'm afraid

Willie

“Deny defend depose” I’m so sorry im not trying to be an ass, love y’all

Matty C

Why the fuck are we talking about the ingredients of Kind bars as if they have political prevalence to someone who shot a CEO explicitly because of said CEO’s adherence to the profit motive?

Pranjal Dwivedi

People only do that if you do something worthwhile

Matty C

“[His] whole life experience is venerating tech, venerating entrepreneurs, and then decides to kill a CEO which really does not make sense.” Healthcare in America sucks. He experienced how much it sucks. He read into the corruption and then decided that, because he was isolated and privileged enough to not have others relying on him, he decided to do something he had the balls to do. It makes absolute sense if you’re not a fucking dork obsessed with dissecting people solely based on their Twitter presence or reading list.

George Gallowgay

That’s a good point! Seems like something that could have been touched on during a 2hr discussion of this topic at least

K H

Do you think one of the casings actually said depose, like "get deposed bozo" or do you think there is widespread misreporting of it being "delay" "deny" "defend?"

Hunter Ladd

Literally so many people (Americans) are like this. Vibes based and apolitical until life is so innately awful that they’re forced to care. It’s just often easier to blame immigrants or racial/ethnic/religious minorities than reflect on how fucked our system is and our roles or responsibilities (or lack thereof) in creating change.

Hunter Ladd

As someone in public health, with a degree in biostatistics, advocating for housing and healthcare access: There’s nothing new to say about American Healthcare. It’s always been about profit generation and monetary gain over health outcomes. The issue is that we’ve known for a long time it’s cheaper and better to invest in community care and universal access than it is to privatize it all. But shifting that framework divests money from billionaires - and that’s not allowed.

K8

I allegedly know the barista who allegedly rang him up at that Starbucks and he bought a peanut butter perfect bar, an ethos water bottle, and a sausage cheddar and egg sandwich

zombie

"if there's anything that can make you go full kaczynski is realizing you spent your entire life designing a system that is now punishing you and causing you physical pain" lmaooo bro, he was fixing bugs in Civ you giant dork. some of the laziest analysis ive ever heard on a podcast.

AKorgar

Yeah exactly civilization is pain

Alexandria

These comments are weird. This podcast is allowed to cover whatever they want however they want. I appreciate some critical reporting on this guy and the guest was great. No, this guy did not "spark a movement" as some comments would lead one to believe. I ask in all seriousness where's the movement? What changed? Tell me what LITERALLY changed. Where are all the copy cats?

Axel H.

Nothing changed, it's just memes and vibes. That's really all we can hope for. People are just upset they seemed to attempt to "explain away" Luigi's actions, going on fairly little. It was still an interesting discussion, though. And I don't think either Brace or Liz are actually anti-Luigi.

Alexandria

Read the comments here then. Everyone seems pretty peeved at any criticism of L for whatever reason. Idk if everyone just wanted an episode praising him or something

PT

Nobody is saying anything is gonna change at all lol. It’s ultimately a pointless act of violence that people will move on from onto the next thing within a couple weeks. People are just saying the analysis sucked in this episode. It’s moronic to take relatively anodyne media consumption and social media activity patterns of the alleged perpetrator and engage in amateur psychoanalysis based on that alone.

Kinetics Video

I did read the comments. Who are you talking about?

Kinetics Video

They're allowed to talk about whatever they want however they want, we're allowed to be little debate goblin freaks in the comments. It's win-win-win for them, us, and Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ

Michael

People who don't ordinarily preoccupy themselves with politics are talking about this. People who self-identify on opposite sides of the US political spectrum are talking about this with a similarity of argument and emotion that feels more unique and pervasive than anything in recent memory. The more people publicly discussing oligarchic control and monopoly rent-seeking capitalism and its ruinous effects on life, health, and happiness the better.

Michael

Exactly this. Very dispiriting that anyone with a platform on the left would completely ignore this and instead dive headfirst into Dimes Square style contrarian critique fixated on Luigi's cultural consumption patterns and preferences, gleaned from some digital crumbs of a young person maturing into one of the most aggressively dumb and unstable moments of recent US history.

Tammy

Someone’s deleted their incel-core comment!! wtf is wrong w you coward.

Billie Grey Heck

Brace "there's alotta other shit I gotta deal with in this life" Belden

Benphish

After the CEO was blasted Universal healthcare's stock value jumped a bit so say what you will about Scott but the man delivered for his shareholders right up to and even a little beyond the end.

oblong pans

The people say he "sparked a movement" are just childish unserious internet leftists. At best it is a moment that highlighted class unity on healthcare. It's clear as day healthcare is an issue that you can organize around.

Matty C

For real. I don’t think Liz and Brace are as bad as whatever-dudes-name is in this ep but it was infuriating. If anything Luigi should be the indicator that “what makes sense” is still material conditions and whether someone is alienated, same as it ever was. Motivation, opportunity, and intent are what’s needed to close the triangle on any violence, except this time it was someone who was smart enough to make a proper plan and sane enough to actually not make their target and elementary school. This hyper fixation on what kind of video game someone plays to “understand” them is exactly the kind of ivory tower bullshit the “content creators” on the left need to confront themselves about. Again, that’s mainly criticism of the guest because I at least know Liz and Brace understand how bad health insurance sucks and can see that as the issue.

gocka

Good ep good guest

More Human than Human

I like how all the tech intelligentsia and Substack ppl really do just restate ideas you’d cover in philosophy 101, ethics 101, moral philosophy as if they are some outside of the box, innovative thinking. It’s extremely stupid. Usually they have ZERO familiarity with arguments that have been made over literally all of human recorded history, they have zero interest in engaging with the substance or the gifts handed down to us from great thinkers over 1000s of years, while displaying an intellectual arrogance that is astounding. When Thiel is asked to defend his obsession with efficiency as a normative value, or his mutant utilitarianism he cannot even make a logically coherent argument on the level of a college freshman, the absolute bare minimum for making many kind of moral claims, you at least need some kind of internally, logically coherent argument that can be engaged with. He basically just states “I don’t like how ppl act and I feel this way”. It’s astonishing how pseudo intellectual garbage has captured that entire cohort.

AbsenteeUncle

Mon AM butter coffee mid veggie whey smoothie dinner pad Thai Tues AM butter coffee MID cava or little beet bowl PM steak or fish rice sweet potatoes Wed AM Butter coffee MID Smoothie PM pre planned homemade dinner (wife and I set dinner calendar prior Thursday) Thu AM butter coffee MID smoothie PM pre planned homemade dinner Fri AM butter coffee MID smoothie PM BURGER NIGHT YO Sat AM butter coffee Mid BLT PM pre planned homemade dinner Sun AM butter coffee MID tuna sandwich or sushi PM pre planned homemade dinner. HIDE YOUR CEOS. But seriously it’s not about optimization, life is just easier with a plan.

Jolene

It’s the opposite of lazy. “Too much” thought was put into it

Jolene

I’m fascinated by your choice of just typing L instead of his full name. It makes me believe in free will again

Jolene

UCSB <3

colby smith

Reminds me of Sam Harris, dude thinks he invented moral philosphy

c8ln

butter coffee?

Jack

wildly speculate is the sixth and seventh word of the description guys

AbsenteeUncle

Blend unsalted butter and a little MCT oil in with coffee and you get a very filling zero carb breakfast latte essentially. Came up out of the keto craze but it stuck with me bc I don’t do well with a carb heavy morning.

Maxi Hellmuth

Smoothe brain here, at around 1:40:30 Liz mentiones a book/text whateva but I can't understand what the name of the text or author is. Can you gumshoes help me out?

Maxi Hellmuth

Only hype moments and aura. Thats it.

iceland

It’s only interesting if you think he did it BECAUSE he was a based rationalist The smaller bucket here is “26 year old high achiever crippled by back pain” I honestly don’t think the ideological vector of his personal politics factored much into it. They’re the incidental politics of an Ivy League high achiever. THAT is the fulcrum point. High achiever his whole life, when he became radicalized he becomes the valedictorian of civilian assassins What likely separates Luigi from other would-be assassins is not his politics, it’s that he’s insanely goal-oriented If you toggle the Luigi-dials 20% more leftist or conservative nothing changes. He still watches Michael Moore’s sicko. But if you make him 20% lazier, he’s probably at home addicted to painkillers

iceland

They brought on the dimes square understander to mindhunter luigi

brian

georges bataille - the accursed share

iceland

It’s a good movie!

Derek

Great episode, I’m so glad you spent so much time on this. Would love a part 2 after the Eric Adams perp walk, hear more about his and diddy’s attorneys the agnifilos, and dive deeper into the Mangioni dynasty in Baltimore and their connection to the Pelosis.

George Gallowgay

Even if it was a bad movie, it’s so podcast-brained to see that and be like “this reference is too basic! There has to be more to the story…” lol The more I think about this ep, it really feels like this conspiracy podcast has jumped the shark

Michael

Excellent analysis, fully agree - I felt already that his preexisting political conviction played at best a minor role in his trajectory, that whatever politics and patterns of cultural consumption that marked his past are as you say largely incidental, increasingly default for his milieu + intellect + occupational track. But I hadn’t considered the ‘high agency’ angle - or what happens when doing politics doesn’t terminate in socialization, social signaling of cultural preferences (which is what almost this whole episode is about), but rather a sequence of specific, nontrivial, private acts - like he’s resolving tickets at his dev job. Lot of different people out there

Michael

Yeah, agreed - I’ve been listening on and off from episode one in 2019 and this is the first time I’ve felt compelled to get into the comments. It’s kind of disturbing how off they are here. I’m not at all one of those types that accuses ppl of being feds or CIA, but if I were CIA I would probably try to signal jam by broadcasting to leftists that violence is cringe bc it’s what techno-chuds with lame bookshelves and unresolved contradictions do. Still love the podcast (and I’m not at all a podcast guy) and the Dylan Saba one they followed up with was great.

dan

I think the inciting event is almost certainly the recognition that his chronic pain and mobility issues would never be addressed under a for-profit healthcare. But I still think it’s worth considering how someone educated at the graduate level at an ‘elite’ institution can end up with such poor capacity to understand and articulate the causes of his (our) predicament. I don’t blame him, and I don’t think his hodge-podge of beliefs is particularly rare, but what is interesting (and makes this episode worth considering, imo) is how, by doing everything ‘right’ (rich family, private school, Ivy League, good job), he ends up with exactly zero radical ideas—until one thing goes horribly wrong for him. And then he is radicalized by the fact that his centrism cannot address what causes his pain. The places he ends up turning to understand his predicament are fucking weird and I think they’re worth knowing as more and more techbros become excluded from the bourgeoise and lumpenized.

dan

I was hitting the MCT coffee daily for a few months until I took a blood test that showed my triglycerides were insane and raising my blood pressure lol.

AbsenteeUncle

Sucks. I’m at slightly elevated triglycerides, but I think it’s mostly due to me naturally not sleeping a lot. VLDL is optimal and I run 15+ miles a week and lift 4-5 days a week. I’ve definitely dropped from 3 tbsp to 1 MCT since starting about ten years ago.

Pranjal Dwivedi

It’s so funny so many commenters don’t even know but they fully believe in propaganda of the deed, something that Brace explicitly singled out and talked about how discredited it is, guess time will tell but willing to bet that this does not inspire more people

cinchal

"where are all the copycats?" sounds like this is a copycat, he dropped out of contact around the first attempt on Trump

Inge Teloo

the problem is not that it won't inspire people necessarily bcoz it may inspire some, but that it doesn't LEAD the masses bcoz propaganda of the deed is entirely within the realm of common sense. it's spontaeneous, it raises tactics 2 the level of strategy, it's carried out on individual or small group inclination. the public response shows what should have already been clear enough, that ppl broadly get that the bourgeoisie are their enemies and that resistance is necessary (on a related note im convinced part of the reason the whole affair is such a sensation among out of touch leftists is that it shows them what they would have already known about the masses had they been doing real work, thus making pop discourse feel new and exciting). the problem remains that the masses lack a genuine strategic conception and do not understand the significance of class organization, which are questions propaganda of the deed can never hope 2 answer.

Myrmec

Great EP. Seems pretty clear he was radicalized by ending up on the sharp end of his own lifelong ideology. Shock to the system

Myrmec

lol spoke too soon. Guest just said the same at 137:00

John Cameron

Hard to articulate what rubbed me the wrong way about this episode but think it has something to do with how the guest at one point (47:40 or so) voices his opinion that it's "curious" - implicitly, almost beyond belief - that a guy who "venerates" tech would kill a CEO (in an essentially unrelated field). Doesn't seem that unbelievable to me, and definitely not so unbelievable a premise that I would ever find myself basing an entire podcast appearance on it.

John Cameron

I do think, on reflection, I'm being a little uncharitable here. But it really does feel like - much like everyone projecting leftist ideas onto Luigi - a set of preconceived ideas are being kind of crowbarred into something where it doesn't all quite fit.

Hardcore Virgin

Why are you being so dense? Not a single comment here is saying u can’t criticize Luigi or this is the start of the revolution. What many are finding annoying is the Well Actually nature of this arm chair analysis And me personally—I find it peak limp peen to ignore the undeniable fact Luigi has transcended the left or online. I mean—do you work around normal ppl!? Everyone is talking about him! And the way the mainstream media is trying to get us to stop lionizing him… I think right now we’d be better served by analyzing those forces at work. Rather than whatever dumb crap Luigi believed or didn’t. Who care! Luigi doesn’t exist anymore. He’s a screen. But yeah nothing is going to change I’m not doing anything I’m stupid I’m lazy I piss on the toilet seat No one will organize me or you or anyone and the bombs will continue to shred the children in Gaza. And the poor animals we torture and all that In all seriousness. I am so glad you were able to “enjoy” this episode.

M Mmd

Call me crazy here, but I'm pretty sure that's not what they meant by that statement. Dude was an ivy leaguer, engineer, stanned CEOs, rich family orbiting the healthcare industry (which he worked for) so my take is that they are referring to him working within industries and consorting among the elite of these industries and stanning the people within these industries, and then being woken up by the actual pain that system is causing everyone else that wasn't in his privileged position. He was part of the elite and suddenly was treated with the same disdain by the system we normal folk live, and die with, on a daily basis. It seems like you listened to absolutely nothing that was said over the course of this episode.

zombie

"stanned ceos" ? you're just making stuff up man

lugubriousmoron

No you are correct. He crowbarded it in the conversation twice. They did okay reporting on some facts - but the opinions or "discouse" in this episode are kinda shit, especially near the end when everyone weighs in on chronic health issues. I come here for the hipster jokes but I'm not expecting to walk away with much more than that.

lugubriousmoron

Please never share your insights on what it's like to live with chronic pain. Like seriously just shut the fuck up. You aren't doing yourself any favors.

Demented Avenger

STOP TALKING ABOUT NETSCAPE MARC'S PENIS. I JUST ATE!

nick b

Love the Accursed Share shout-out

sam

I’m from art

Leah Lynn

My 33 year old sister is visiting from Minnesota and had no clue about the assassination. To be fair, I do think she mostly just plays video games? I did love seeing her reaction when she saw Luigi’s pics 🔥

Militia Etheridge

$1500 rent is expensive? Where the fuck does this clown live?

Kinetics Video

Feels like post-Bernie there's this oppressive need to police any kind of optimism in a left or liberatory project. If a line of reasoning can't immediately deliver the goods than it needs to be aggressively shamed lest we get out two inches over our skiis again. Kinda think the last generation of left-progressive commentariat needs to retire before we can start building again.

Omar Hashem

Citrella is such a grifter can't believe he convinced anyone he's an expert on "radicalization"

Tammy

I will keep checking you fools. I got some stupid pussy dork poser to delete a comment cause they thought better of it, mission accomplished.

josh F

what's the context for this hate? he seemed decently informed and articulate to me brodie

lolwuthappend

You don't gotta front to kick it Tammy. We all wish we were tough, but alas, we pay for podcasts.

Ligma

Mct coffee was the only thing to cure my decade long chronic constipation. Now even just thinking of drinking it makes me run to the bathroom

Ligma

I keep coming back to this ep but I still can't finish it. (Not every ep is going to be a winner!) I think what rubs me and others the wrong way is the fact that what books he read or who he follows on Twitter is irrelevant. People are not inspired by his personal beliefs but his actions! So you don't have to worry about anyone being a follower of "manigone-thought" or whatever. Brace brought up The Deed, and I think talking about the history of left-wing terrorism and its fallout would have been a much more productive conversation.

CD

They mention they did an ep on the Christchurch shooting -- which one was it? Can't find it on the website

Aaron Snelling

At 1:40:30 Liza talks about a publication or something called i believ the "The Tithe" or the tide? Not sure what she says but she calls it a leftist critique of the centrist sam Harris politics inevitably becoming roght wing as societies shrink and there needs to be a justification for population reduction

F S

Ep 238 Nihil River, I think

George Gallowgay

I thought he wasn’t too bad either at first but after reading these comments I tend to agree with the listener consensus. He keeps telling us he’s “from art” and his blinkered, overconfident analysis does seem to back that up.

George Gallowgay

Whoa holy shit I just realized this is the guy who does the highly produced YouTube interviews that look like they they have the Kamala campaign’s budget for set design. Ooof…. This is rough

Andrew Yang

The accursed share by georges bataille i think

BeanCurd

You sound like Bill Maher

BeanCurd

Nah I mean the other guy

Brandon

i tend to think Fanon is a key text for all this stuff and I rarely hear him invoked, but I'm stupid and Wretched of the Earth is like the only book I've ever read.

Alexandria

Idk to me I feel like it's fine to look into who he is/what he's read/his background/how he might think etc. Its odd to me many are taking this ep as criticism? Like are we not allowed to be curious anymore? Especially about someone being made into a "hero of the left" of sorts or whatever. Btw I love what he did. I'm sure we all do! This show is not all of a sudden Pearl-Clutch Save America just for asking questions. He's obviously a complicated person

Alexandria

Why don't we feel this way about every other guest? I'm befuddled

Alexandria

Consensus seems to range from "says he from art world = asshole amirite" to "well who cares about Luigi's 'background' or whatever the fuck anyway"

Alexandria

Exactly this. Research and subsequent critique (or whatever!) of this person has folks pissed? hat happened to our brains? Love what the guy did and very physically attracted to him also, I must say! But that doesn't mean I want him sainted by the left when we truly don't know him

Sai

I think it's good to be curious, but his motivations seem pretty evident from his letter. He killed a social-murdering parasite. Didn't he also scrub his digital footprint in the last 6 months? I bet his ideological development in that time was significant as well.

Sai

I can't speak for anyone else but Josh weirds me out a bit because he's building a media career around an inquiry into "online radicalization." Everyone's an extremist in one way or another (a run of the mill Democrat may have supported the imperial invasion of Iraq for example, or the Holocaust in Palestine, or mass surveillance)... And radicalization (or politicization) happens to everyone who cares to learn about the world. I just find anyone who's focus is the political development of others to be sorta fishy... I know that plenty of people who support the status quo (politicians, the ruling class) would love to use "online radicalization" as an excuse to further censor the internet and other modes of communication. Maybe he just wants to be famous online or whatever, but his area of inquiry happens to be of utmost concern to people like the FBI and CIA and anyone else who would like to preserve bourgeois rule. Is the purpose of his inquiry to give the worker's movement tools for recruiting/ radicalizing more people? I hope so, but idk. So to me he's fishy. Kind of a gut feeling 🤷‍♂️

Alexandria

Well case closed then

N0tagayman

What’s your problem with him? Also those interviews are just in a room with nice lighting, it’s not a crazy high production value thing

N0tagayman

Literally the best episode in months lol

George Gallowgay

I couldn’t tell you I just really find the way his videos look to be very off putting and I just saw that this awful guest is the same guy

Dakota

What was the book Liz talked about at ~1:40:30?

Red Herring McGuffin

it's likely to do with the fact that he's no longer around to testify about all the insider trading going on at uhc

George Gallowgay

Personally I just found him to be offering shallow observations on this news story while constantly hyping up his authority on the topic which was based on just his own vibes. Usually this podcast has guests on that have a real area of expertise

George Gallowgay

Personally I thought it was crazy when he said that Luigi couldn’t possibly have been influenced by something as normie as Michael Moore. I think he’s getting criticized on here not because he keeps saying he’s an artist, but because he said a lot of silly, internet- brained takes that diminish our understanding by replacing the facts of the story with whatever version of facts that comports with his already decided upon narrative

Degrassi Knoll

"we gave the FBI $4,000,000,000 to help cure the Fentanyl crisis, you won't guess what happened next!"

Degrassi Knoll

In the US, where I work in a mine to pay for my Stelara for Crohns - hence replying 3 weeks late....First time i saw the copay info (I pay $50 every 8 weeks), I thought it was a typo. $36k per dose. WT everliving F

Hardcore Virgin

The fact luigi is now totally off the table and there seems to be a blackout confirms 100% He legit shook them and instead of trying to find some “coherent ideological” motive for the guy, you basically did the mainstream media job for them. This episode stinks I say! You owe society and me most of all another Luigi episode but more focused on how the machine has tried to…ya know…nip this “outpouring” in the budcheek

Hardcore Virgin

God you are dense. That is not what people are pissed about. Your whole position is even more moronic now that Luigi has been excised from the “mainstream” discourse. Pro con the debate has been sidelined. (Especially post Adam’s pier perp walk where Luigi looks fucking bad ass) What processes were put into place to stop this albeit very minor social sentiment / contagion from spreading? How was the MSm trying regain discourse control? What “discursive” technologies were being deployed? That would’ve been a far more productive episode. And isn’t that Liz’ post structuralist beat anyway??What the DEED means in the moment independent of its author and how the MSM is responding. That’s what we wanted! Instead it seems like true anon did a very MSM episode “Oooh Luigi isn’t coherent we shouldn’t make him a hero and blah blah” Shut up. No one was doing that. When TA covered Jan 6 they didn’t carry water. Why on this episode? Is it the fear that if they clap their fans might too?(please understand the pun) God forbid the people strike fear at those above us God forbid a few loose screw types get a little nasty I mean brace even sorta sheepishly called it the one good thing that happened this year in the end of the year ep—and yet in its wake he joined in on throwing water on the fire. Do your Luigi deep dive a year or two later. This episode had post Epstein Deep suicide is a problem article energy Very NPR very lame very Not good You being all over these comments well into January almost overcomes my absolutely demented commitment to hating on this episode. You and Liz and brace (not yungchomsly he is always faultless) should be ashamed of yourselves!! The one thing podcasters and like Jon Stewart and the Comedy Central ilk before them continually say—we don’t have power we are making jokes etc etc. this isn’t politics etc. They may not like it but they have some power. They can say we are gonna be here at this place Feb 5 or whatever and a good number of ppl will show up there and listen to what they have to say. How can that power be utilized? Should it be? Can it be shared? Is that organizing power? I don’t know. It is funny how must stuff sorta stops at “fundraising” But methinks in the year of snobbery these questions will seem more and more “childish” to the holders of microphones I don’t listen to this show for its political valence nor its effectiveness. I am here for the parasocial fun and trio chemistry. But this episode really did rain on a parade. And you Alexandria Alexander seem quite intent on justifying the soggy state 👎🏄‍♀️🍗🍗🫁🥷🏾☄️

Hardcore Virgin

I must add and I said it in response to this episodes number one fan. This episode reeks of post Epstein “Suicide is a problem” article energy. Not good! They didn’t neeed to do this I hope they will put an asterisk next to this one and then sentence it to episode jail You didn’t need to help the msm pour water on the fire. Even if it was just an ember and nothing would come of it ,still ,,,you didn’t need to do this when you did

George Gallowgay

Has any other episode of this podcast been ratio’d like this?

DJC583

1:32:35 interesting to mention Sam Harris and the Quilliam Foundation because the Quilliam was started by Maajid Nawaz who co-wrote a book with Sam in 2014l5 called "Islam and the Future of Tolerance"

Kelby

going to wade in here and say that the ties to the bay area's rationalism and effective altruism are absolutely essential in understanding Luigi Mangione's propaganda of the deed. Watch this space!

Zachary Manenti

HOT OFF THE PRESS. Has anything yet been written on “The Ghost Gun” (of Luigi’s)? Well let me be the first! There is TOO MUCH to say…. Luigi Mangione’s alleged political act of murdering a mass murderer is, in effect, also a relation to and a type of writing. The brevity of his ‘manifesto’ is explained by this, that his performative act needs little textual supplementation, since it is itself already an act of writing founded in the historicity of the Printing Press. The 3D PRINTED GUN, the ink that is now the blood…the “doing/writing” of his political intervention in reality… is an act of writing originating from the pen to the type, to the gun, out of the originary technical aspect of writing and printing in which the success of writing as a technique was born…. and thus Luigi’s act is NOT a psychotic act, outside of language/writing. His gun is his pen is an act of writing, perhaps a writing in code rather than ‘ordinary’ language, but a writing nonetheless. Language and writing always participates in a kind of figurative violence (unlike the literal violence of the Health Care Industry, that expresses its unconscious motivation to kill bodies out of its contempt for the unrepresentability of the organism); though it is writing that’s long been seen as killing ‘the thing”, the fantasy of the thing. In the “advance” of technology and the technical, the pen becomes more tangibly a gun. The “ghostliness” of the gun also avails a linguistic dimension: anything in language exists by virtue of all that is repressed in its name, and what is repressed haunts like a ghost what remains in the coming to be of what’s signified. The inextricable link to writing (and speech) that the shooting of the UHC C.E.O. confirms: think only of the deliberate writing on the bullet casings, a writing that literally penetrated the C.E.O.s body, the 3 D’s inscribed that redouble a reference to the very textual production of a ghost gun from a 3D printer: “Deny, Depose, Defend.” It is an ironical act that also demands to be read and interpreted—publicly discussed in lieu of the discussion and action that should have taken place: a Medicare public option!

Zachary Manenti

To follow up …. Luigi cribs and plagiarizes reddit post… bc like AI he acrubs the internet to be able to cite the nnowledge, and also, … like the unabomber, Luigi has ‘trouble’ with language, particularly writing well. He can’t write in the way we r accustomed to judge good writing….. he writes on bullets… the bullets become a form of violent language. We should look at this symptom overall w these ‘tech accelerationist whateverists”… true Brace, they r already AI ro ots in relation to written language.. the best they can muster is language as ‘code’ … also oart of schitzo symtomotology ( see Deleuze and guattari, Freud and Lacan)…. A certain ‘failure’ at the level of writing or language is also linked to this type of ‘political’ or social violence….. it’s not scitzo- Leftist… it’s schitzo-right…. but productive perhaps of conversation about problems socially/politically. Makes us all curious… and rallies us around seeemingly ‘heroic’ actions, but at base, have to do w a certain breakdown literally of language, ability w language. And this is increasing w media icons and code- logic.

Noodlz

I was also a teenage anarchist who thought propaganda of the deed was really cool lol.

Zachary Manenti

In a ‘post-literary/literate world ppl may not leave long manifestos. Also, as a part Sicilian myself… NEVER underestimate a sicilian… or southern italian even one generations removed in terms of taking whacking action. They got the balls for this type of thing if truly convinced of its necessity. no joke! but yea a joke….

Logan

The Accursed Share by Georges Bataille

Marcelle Roulin

Scott Thompson is the gay guy from Kids in the Hall btw

regular bird

The worst explanation of civ I've ever heard

M Mmd

Brother I went through college and trained in clinical psychology / child development and also studied Freud, pavlovian theories, Jung, and alot of historical areas of psychology on into anthropology and biology and I have no fucking clue what you're talking about. You have either taken too much of, or not enough drugs

Natalie

Wahhh I don't like people suggesting I edit my language I'm gonna be a reactionary now 😡😡😡 Even iDubbbz grew up at some point man

Natalie

Wahhh I don't like people telling me to change I'm reactionary now 😡😡😡 Even iDubbbz grew out of it at some point man

Natalie

Wahhh I don't like bring asked to change I'm reactionary now 😡😡😡 Even iDubbbz grew up at some point man