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Episode 201: Julie K. Brown (Patreon)

Published:
2022-01-17 02:59:22
Edited:
2024-10-11 00:17:09
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

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Content

We’re joined by journalist Julie K. Brown to talk about the Ghislaine Maxwell trial, her interest in the case, and some of the less-discussed aspects of the Epstein/Maxwell sex trafficking operation.

Files

Comments

J3M

Wtf was this interview. Agreeing he definitely wasn’t CIA contradicts the entire premise of this podcast

Wawaweewa

I really like the podcast, literally have been going 1-present since subbing, this episode is an odd one.

SF

This one made people so mad lol

Paul Brewer

Limited hangout alert! Wee-oo wee-oo!

Yangervis Solarte

Epstein “was,” intelligence, is very different than Epstein “is,” intelligence.

Justin Sexton

thank you for the “they live” joke. today is John Carpenters birthday. bless us all : )

Graham Hoese

Let's go! On my 3 of 3 night shift tonight and was afraid I wouldn't stay awake. Now I have something to listen to at my job at the prison guarding Ghislaines cell.

otis

6th

Natty

Julie K. Brown has arrived!

kenzel

Maxwell will go to prison for the rest of her life for sure if the trial stands, so the prosecutors have no leverage with the perjury charge. I think it will be argued at appeal and there will be no deal.

mckinley faas

Anthony boredape...coincidence? 420/69

Brydon

3 goats.

matmohair1

The Epstein case isn't really new, similar CIA operations where taking place since at least the 60s. Don't forget he conducted blackmail operations for foreign dictatorships abroad too. He's just another loser who slipped off the cracks and got all the blame. Charles Manson was under CIA and FBI protection, so did many serial killers implicated in black mail operations throughout NATO countries, especially the UK. The idea that such people where too smart for the system doesn't make any sense. Its just a calculated excuse. Please revisit the Clown and the Candyman documentary. The names of the political clients haven't been released yet and the originals are said to have been destroyed. The surviving recorded file names where blurred in the show - keep up the great work, looking forward to more episodes

Bilbo

The only part of this I disagreed with was saying Epstein wasn’t government connected. If he wasn’t connected to government it’s hard to explain his original deal or his death in prison. Why would he be assassinated if he had no connection to power, and isn’t that power, if not in name but at least in function, the “government.”

Taggart

Happy holidays ❤️

Richard Hunter

"There's a certain kind of suit you can wear that if you wear it ... you don't even have to pass the bar ... they just let you in and say what you want.." - Would that be a LAW SUIT?

Adam Brosnan

Acosta literally said someone told him: ‘lay off, he’s intelligence’. All the evidence points to him being an intelligence asset. This is the first time I’ve heard hosts speak as if this wasn’t a foregone conclusion.

Null_null

They were just saying he is v smart.

Carine

I genuinely wonder if Epstein got the inspiration for the whole "I'm CIA" from Steven Seagal

Gordon Schmidt

I think Brown is underestimating the chance that Epstein really did have intelligence ties. Remember, Ghislaine was one of his closest associates- and who was her father? That's a pretty direct connection to intelligence.

Colin Clark

Y'all need to finish reading her book & have her back to discuss.

Anday

I don't understand...y'all make a million dollars a year on patreon now and you agree that Epstein probably didn't have intelligence ties?? What even is this podcast lol

SF

I don’t think Liz & Brace doubt the intelligence ties— they’ve emphasised them repeatedly on the show. I think it’s just that they like and respect Julie Brown and maybe didn’t know quite how to push back in the moment.

.lozenge.

Brace didn't say he thinks he wasn't Intel. He said he thinks it ended by 2005

.lozenge.

This seems like the case and isnt abnormal for people interviewing someone. I dont think they wanted to get hung up on that part of the discussion

Jeff Semmerling's Art Side Out Studio & MASK SHOP

This "expert" seems to have been bought. She repeatedly steers the conversation away from the ubiquitous evidence of an Intelligence modus operendi in everything about this case. It reveals an international nature to the covert control systems of power and she denies it. $$$$$$$$$ Our hosts are being sycophants to it making it taste very "Bread-tubey" to me

Jeff Semmerling's Art Side Out Studio & MASK SHOP

This "expert" seems to have been bought. She repeatedly steers the conversation away from the ubiquitous evidence of an Intelligence modus operendi in everything about this case. It reveals an international nature to the covert control systems of power and she denies it. $$$$$$$$$ Our hosts are being sycophants to it making it taste very "Bread-tubey" to me

Jeff Semmerling's Art Side Out Studio & MASK SHOP

This "expert" seems to have been bought. She repeatedly steers the conversation away from the ubiquitous evidence of an Intelligence modus operendi in everything about this case. It reveals an international nature to the covert control systems of power and she denies it. $$$$$$$$$ Our hosts are being sycophants to it making it taste very "Bread-tubey" to me

Jeff Semmerling's Art Side Out Studio & MASK SHOP

This "expert" seems to have been bought. She repeatedly steers the conversation away from the ubiquitous evidence of an Intelligence modus operendi in everything about this case. It reveals an international nature to the covert control systems of power and she denies it. $$$$$$$$$ Our hosts are being sycophants to it making it taste very "Bread-tubey" to me

SF

dude i saw your post already you’ve copy pasted it like ten times

Bil

Shut the fuck up

TrueAnonPod

I say in the episode that he probably did work for intelligence agencies and that if he did it likely had ended by the early 2000s.

BryceSprungstein

Without the intelligence ties doesn't this become a podcast about 'our broken criminal justice system?'

SF

Hi Brace. I'm wondering, if this did end in the early 2000s, what would that "ending" mean in concrete terms? It does seem to me that he was still being "protected" for many years after that--- is that wrong, do you think? Genuine question, curious to hear your thoughts.

Matt Murphy

The 180 on tone about Epstein's connection to intelligence aside-- the music segues from yungchomsky were extra nice this EP. Looking forward to a full track

Adam Brosnan

It still felt like distancing him from intelligence. From my point of view, someone with those connections remains an asset/agent.

Matelda

I think if you're rich enough, you will have ties to intelligence, but it doesn't make sense how Epstein got that rich. The con theory doesn't make sense. But I respect the interviewee because nothing about it makes sense.

TrueAnonPod

Yeah as I said in the episode I think he worked as an asset for intelligence agencies

Adam Brosnan

Sounds like Da Gay Pussy-eater is a fed. I kid, I hope my comment wasn’t taken as a slight at the hosts. I just feel like the narrative, in the broader culture, is being steered away from the intelligence angle.

ClownBabee24

I get Julie's opinions on Epstein not being connected to intelligence, but the lengths to which the govt went to cover this up makes very little sense otherwise, unless youre suggesting one of Epstein's "customers" had enough sway in the govt at the time to cover it up. But that would make this whole situation much worse than him being an intelligence asset imo

Lilith

Julie K Brown certainly ties herself in knots to try to maintain her idea that Ghislaine Maxwell isn't a Mossad agent just like her father and sisters. I wonder why Julie thinks Mossad agent Lex Wexner gave Epstein all that money, and what she thinks he was doing with all those child rape tapes. Bring on Whitney Webb, Julie K Brown isn't a great guest.

Bent Mind

Re: intelligence connections— as a “real journalist” JKB standards of proof are different than Liz and brace (and mine). JKB needs a document or multiple corroborating witnesses etc who were told by someone other than Epstein. I disagree with JKB that someone would have leaked to her by now. Took about 8 years after Iran contra trials for someone to tip off Gary Webb that the CIA was selling crack in LA. It makes sense for JKB to challenge the notion Epstein was intelligence.. but to conclude her conclusion.. I guess this just isn’t the part of the case that is her expertise.

orc

exactly, where's the evidence on intelligence ties past 2005? Otherwise the evidence is circumstantial. That's fine for us podcast listening sickos, I buy that he was a CIA agent till the day he died, but that's mostly a matter of anti-establishment feeling

TrueAnonPod

It gets even weirder when you realize the sole source of that quote is Vicky Ward!

SF

Do you think there's reason to distrust her about this quote?

SF

This is an interesting discussion, and I know what you mean about different standards of proof for a journalist. I wonder though orc, do you think there's reason to think something might have changed between Epstein & intelligence around 2005? In terms of *hard* evidence I'm not sure there's a smoking gun for anything even before 2005 either. Like the two of you I strongly suspect intelligence ties though.

Fernando

Thanks for the recommendation of Clown and the Candyman, now going down the rabbit hole. Sick shit

orc

I doubt will ever know, unless some very serious communications get leaked. I can only speculate that his involvement was somewhat "freelance" and shielded through layers of middlemen and fronts, so it's hard to define an a formal ending

Connor

YC, is the music in between segments “engine” by jeff mangum? Hate to out myself as a one time NMH listener but I’m pretty sure that’s what it is

RB

As regards being an actual “agent” or “asset”, without viewing the Epstein case in the parapolitical or deep political paradigm, such labels barely mean anything. Of course he’s caught up in the mix of political intrigue/high finance/and other deep state fuckery without needing to be part of an “intelligence operation”

SF

Yeah, this sounds right to me--- hard evidence is unlikely to turn up. Mostly I was just curious about Brace's suggestion that Epstein might have once been an intelligence asset but only up to a certain point, perhaps around 2005. I'm unsure what might lead someone to suspect there was a change like that.

SF

Yeah, this stuff is so murky that we're unlikely to ever know the exact shape of what was going on. Mostly I was just curious about Brace's suggestion that Epstein might *once have been* an asset but that this might have changed (somewhere around 2005 or earlier). I'm not sure what there is that could point towards a change like that, and interested to know what the reasoning was here.

orc

One funny idea is that in the mid-2000's women such as Gina Haspel and Avril Haines and others were starting to get into leadership positions within the intelligence establishment. Maybe as a result of this, Jeff Epstein's actions and proclivities were re-examined and he was burned as an asset.

Evan Scott

absolutely psychotic comment section. have you people never had a conversation with a person who isn't as internet poisoned as you

SF

Sorry if I've contributed to that, haha. As I said upthread the sense I got is that Liz and Brace probably don't agree with Julie Brown's conclusions re: the intelligence connections but that they like and respect her and didn't want to contradict her mid-conversation. She seems like a nice lady who's done a lot of good investigative work. Speaking for myself, I'd just be interested to hear Liz and Brace elaborate on their thoughts about this (e.g. Brace's suggestion today about Epstein maybe having once been an asset but only up to a certain point in time, which I don't think I've heard before)

RB

Go fuck yourself

BryceSprungstein

with the exception of one person, I don't think its JKB that people are responding to as much as it is brace's comments which seem like a fairly big departure from the way that this story is usually presented. And I know someone's going to say that 'well he said that he was maybe tied to intelligence up until 2005' but even that is a stark contrast to the way that they generally talk about this stuff, and to to say that's what they meant all along really sounds like the people who were trying to defend Biden by saying 'no, he meant you'd get $2000 in total, not $2000 cheques'

Woke Batou

How do we feel about Epstein CIA vs Epstein free lancer for highest bidder?

River

great ep

Alexander Fuchs

Maybe having friendly journos claim youre in the CIA is the agency version of reaching for a cops service weapon for suicide hotline

TrueAnonPod

The 2005 thing is based on Ghislaines departure around then and a few other things; I don’t know if that’s the case or not but I suspect it is. I say “maybe” because I think he was based on a shit ton of mostly circumstantial evidence and connections but yeah I can’t say 10000% for sure cause no one can. We also don’t know exactly how much of his trafficking overlapped with whatever sort of tapes he was making/entrapment schemes he had. These are things we’re literally trying to figure out so we don’t have to say maybe or allegedly in front of things lol

TrueAnonPod

I base that mostly on him and Ghislaine splitting up plus he seems to start getting much more obsessed with his own sexual proclivities

SL

She never addresses the girls being exploited for sexual blackmail, which is kind of weird. Epstein's estates were outfitted with pinhole cameras everywhere, even in the bathrooms. If not for intelligence, does she have another explanation for the recordings?

SF

Thanks for your reply Brace! That's an interesting thought--- will mull over it.

SF

Thanks man! Sorry if it seemed like I was trying to catch you out or anything like that--- def not my intention. Was just genuinely curious about the thought process and this helped clarify it for me. Love the show

noobmaster

this seemed like a controlled opposition episode real poor quality, the way liz talks about Acosta “gesturing intelligence connection” when he absolutely said it was over his pay grade, not mentioning Robert Maxwell mossad connections, Epstein so called suicide, dismissal of intelligence connections because they didn’t leak anything is absurd, forgetting the cameras planted in the mansions, epstein is painted as a criminal master mind with the best lawyers on the planet not better then the netflix documentary. If Trueanon doesn’t rectify yall wont see me here again

noobmaster

this episode really put a dent in my confidence in the podcast, they dismissed so many clues pointing to intelligence involvement its crazy from the mansions full of hidden cameras to Acosta actually saying that intelligence protected epstein

noobmaster

barr senior who was on the OSS gave him his first job and wrote weird books about sex slaves, Maxwell dad was in the Mossad, they had cameras planted everywhere, Epstein and Maxwell dad died in mysterious conditions, Epstein wealth was practically given to him so many connections just brushed up in an episode that sounds like something from CNN or the BBC or CBC or the netflix documentary really poor performance they did not challenge her at all and brace may have said he had intelligence connections before 2005 but gave no reason to believe it stopped then other then his own words

SF

don't let the door smack your ass on the way out

noobmaster

they will never bring Whitney Webb sadly, this is becoming a BBC podcast, Brace always has been suspicious because of his collaboration with heavily intelligence infiltrated kurd militias you should listen to subliminal jihad if you like some of the based information Whitney webb brings to the table

noobmaster

she does not that’s why they don’t mention it, they could have challenged her a minimum but chose not to. they could of discussed who gave him his first job and what kind of book and OSS involvement Barr senior had, the mossad super agent ghislaine had as a father (she even brought him up!!!!! ) where epstein got his money ( read Whitney Webb articles in mint press on this subject!! ) OR EVEN how suspicious was epstein death ?!!?! but nothing nada this is really unbecoming and they should really try to get Whitney Webb on the podcast cause she did much more in depth research than true anon with 1/100 of their budget but they wont cause maybe she’s a bit vaccine nut but overall she’s based af maybe too much for this underground MSM podcast

Lilith

Why will they never bring Whitney Webb on? She could give a few clues about what's going on re the vaccines/mandates/role back of our human rights as well, which this podcast sorely needs. They have conspicuously not covered this seemingly highly relevant to there theme (of the ruling elite systematically f**king us over). The longer that they just don't cover this, this more difficulty I have continuing to give them the benefit of the doubt over not covering this. Frankly it seems like cowardace.

Lilith

Well that's charming SF.

SF

noobmaster, you're kind of proving Evan right by having a prolonged psychotic meltdown in this comment section

JV

btw speaking of palestine, everyone check out Gaza Mutual Aid Collective on patreon! Ya'll are already on patreon so just sub to them too for whatever you can afford and 100% goes directly to Gazans to help them rebuild. If enough of us do it we'll make a real difference!

Bent Mind

yo Fuck Vicky ward!!!

Zachary White

i think there’s a difference between being a CIA agent and probably having CIA friends. still great to hear from a pro researcher. Joseph McBride broke the story of HW Bush’s CIA history in 80s and now has a JFK assassination book. HW being a case of a high profile figure who’s agency ties were successfully concealed for decades

noobmaster

If discussing the fact that this “underground “ 1M/ a year podcast had a MSM guest and chose to not challenge her when she dismissed all intelligence connections when all clues point to it from ghislaine father (that Julie brought up), the cameras everywhere in the mansions, the source of epstein wealth, his mysterious death etc its sad that factual criticism is treated as psychotic

Null_null

Imagine how this interview would've gone if they had challenged Julie K. Brown at every turn lmao. That's not how this works. Brace and Liz's ability to modulate their interview style and tenor per the subject's onlineness is expert level shit. This was a very good interview and Julie K. Brown provided the kind of insights you would hope to get from somebody who has looked at this case from the perspective that she did. Goddamn.

SF

yeah, it’s not a twitch debate stream

Skip scrambler

Thanks for the podcast! Really nice way to wrap up the trial coverage. Happy you guys are taking a break next week. That trial coverage must have been incredibly taxing. Pumped for this new project.

Michael

Ngl, didn't love this interview. Don't really like this woman, and she said some B's that I feel should've been addresses. Brace and Liz are to nonconfrontational with their guests sometimes tbh, like if you're not gonna push back when a guest contradicts the main premise of the podcast, why have them on at all?

uleg0

👎

uleg0

i dont think this is the right kind of guest

uleg0

is it really unclear how they met though? Jeffrey and robert maxwell worked together in the 80s?

bugsick

why the FUCK did Liz and Brace not press this Miami Herald journalist on Ghislaine's NAMBLA logo demon statue

Ricky

and theyve (repeatedly) said they hate “gotcha” interviews and honestly that would deter people from coming on the show

Ricky

whitney has come up but brace says she thinks he’s intelligence. from his tone of voice and the context, I think he was serious, and honestly lol if she does think that

böll

Could ya'll please do an episode about Aafia Siddiqui?

Lesley Anne Noelle

Donald Trump to Howard Stern, ‘an abused teenager? (That would be) the best person to f—k.’

Lesley Anne Noelle

Nobody is quite as ugly as👉🏾Alan Dershowitz. I JUST LOVE watching the ‘debate’ between Norman Finkelstein, on Democracy, Now, and the minute his brain slips (let-it-go-let-Alzheimer’s-descend-upon-an-evil-just-once!!)and then~~perhaps HE could live long enough to see eggs thrown at his house…!! (ps: what happened to the first Mrs. Dershowitz…?!)

Lesley Anne Noelle

i hope that on one day, or after one crazy dream, or just during one moment of Jeffrey Epstein’s staring at the bed above him, and i honestly hope that the realization hit, and spread from that pit, and made his heartbeat happen too fast, as Epstein felt a whole new sensation : fear, uneasiness, and dread. I hope that he couldn’t stop the words from blooming in his mind, ‘I-am-final-ly-fuuuuuuu-cked.’

Nicolas

Lol did you guys know theres an actual Epstein-Barr-Virus? Not related though...

Camille Shultz

I remember that convo...fuckin' evil

E M

Super spot on - Seymour Hersh's stance on the Frank Olson murder is a really good example of this. I think it's pretty despicable but it's what happens. Errol Morris' "Wormwood" does a really good job of revealing this relationship between deep state coverups and "responsible journalism".

Lilith

Not being into "gotcha" interviews isn't a valid rationale for not pushing back on or even disagreeing with anything that your guest is saying at all. That is just sycophancy, propaganda, or not knowing how to interview (professional media) people and being a little bit out of your depth.

John Swan

bro say "please"

tristan

Everybody here got some smart shit to say about heterodox narrative intelligence asset but what I have to say's I like the guest's funny philly accent.

Brad

Just listened to turned out a punk thank you for saying that burning spirits sucks Death Side is one of the worst bands ive ever seen live

Allan O / Left Of Texas / Variance Within

Matt lech from the majority report recommended trueanon to us one day on the show. I've been free listening to old episodes on yt and stuff. Just subbed.

michaelkuca

idk what to do without a new ep

noobmaster

subliminal jihad try it it’s something else

paul

i am lost. please come back from vacation.

linda jean

im gonna stop taking my meds until kubrick episode

Kevin Reid

Perhaps they could have at least eluded to that in the post interview wrap up. I love the show and am fine with being understanding but that was pretty awful in the first half and at no point good. Though they may be afraid to get hit with the voice deforming gun used on rfk jr and julie brown.

Kevin Reid

Most complaints I've read relate to wild deviations from rational thought.

Kevin Reid

- brace, alt account

Kevin Reid

Where's the link to that? I don't doubt it aside from this being the first I've heard of it.

Lilith

This episode, and their ongoing silence around the vaccine/covid/great reset happening right under their noses is starting to make me wonder if Whitney Webb is right about Brace and Liz (she has a very good track record about being right about things).

Kevin Reid

One with no internet connection would find the conclusion that Epstein was just particularly sharp and fooled people like acosta to be an incredibly dense and incurious angle towards a conclusion. The above assertions to the contrary therefore come across as either insincere, or equally dense and incurious.

Patrick

You all should do an episode about Michael Scheuer, first Chief of ALEC and now a Q guy who married Alfreda Bikowski in 2014

Miss Lourdes

Become buddhist. End personal suffering. And become Liberated

Lilith

If they go on the majority report then I will know for sure that Whitney Webb is right about Brace being a fed and will unsubscribe immediately!

Allan O / Left Of Texas / Variance Within

Why on Earth would you think that they are feds because they go into an anti-fed, anti-cia Oriented show? Man I hope you're being ironic or something

Lily

It's normal in any interview for the guests to screen what will be discussed and vice versa for hosts. For someone in Julie K. Brown's mainstream journalistic position, it could be used against her in a serious way had the episode allowed for less than plausible deniability. The fact that she came on the show is what's extremely meaningful. She likely understands what the podcast is and just her appearance there bolsters its credibility too, something done by everyone involved intentionally. It's awesome that she got on the show!

SF

Lilith please for the love of god just unsubscribe already, you are insanely annoying (emphasis on “insane”)

SF

Cool, don’t let the door spank your ass on the way out

Alex Gullen

Oof, a lot of discombobulation in this episode.