Home
Creators
Search Recent Random
Posts
Search DMs Popular Hash Lookup Tags Random
Importer
Import FAQ
Register Favorites Keys Review DMs Logout
Community
Telegram ThePornDude
Home Creators Posts Import Register Favorites Logout

Why Does 5E Have A DM Shortage? (Patreon)

Published:
2022-12-09 10:40:46
Imported:
2026-06

Poll

Why Does 5E Have A DM Shortage?

  • The rules are too complex and create OP characters. 58
  • The scenarios are story-based instead of location based. 19
  • Streaming shows have created impossibly high standards for DMs. 46
  • Something else I haven't thought of. 43
  • 2022-12-09
  • —2022-12-10
  • 166 votes
{'title': 'Why Does 5E Have A DM Shortage?', 'choices': [{'text': 'The rules are too complex and create OP characters.', 'votes': 58}, {'text': 'The scenarios are story-based instead of location based.', 'votes': 19}, {'text': 'Streaming shows have created impossibly high standards for DMs.', 'votes': 46}, {'text': "Something else I haven't thought of.", 'votes': 43}], 'closes_at': datetime.datetime(2022, 12, 10, 17, 1, tzinfo=datetime.timezone.utc), 'created_at': datetime.datetime(2022, 12, 9, 10, 36, 49, tzinfo=datetime.timezone.utc), 'description': None, 'allow_multiple': False, 'total_votes': 166}

Content

I'm making a reaction video to Ben "Questing Beast" Milton's now famous video rant about the 5E DM Shortage. Weigh in below and shape my response! 

Comments

Flandre Scarlet

It's a headache that players can just create stronger and survey characters yet have nothing interesting... How can I provide a challenge if the players are meant to blow through it?

Gunnar Olafsson

All of the above. Some people say 5e is simple but the action rules are quite messy and difficult to learn. They do not stay constant.

Jimmy De Ruysscher

I don't think that a dm shortage is connected to an edition. I have always known that there have always been more people wanting to play than to dm.

Nick

Generally speaking 5e is a "gateway game". It appeals to casual players who don't want to learn a lot of comples rules. They want to show up, roll dice, and kill orcs. There was also a pole done a while ago that showed the majority of 5E players only played in short campaigns and one shots. The vast majority did not play in long running campaigns. So I think this all shows most players don't want to put in the sustained effort of running, hosting, scheduling, and finding players to populate a game. That's my 2 cents as a 5E full time DM who recently got his players to switch to OSR games (one of Deathbringer!)

Bryan Stephens

Looking forward to it. I am 52. Crunchy rules did not stop us in the 80s. Wonky rules and Story based adventures did not seem to cause a shortage of Storytellers for Vampire. I really believe what has happened is that the move from hobbiest to mainstream player Has caused a lot more players to come into the game unless people interested in being game masters. Even a casual hobbiest is different Dan a casual player.

Peter Leban

I think most of DMs moved to OSR or other systems.

Jonathan

Like many, I started out playing 5th Edition at the beginning of the pandemic to keep my friend group together and sane. I wouldn’t say being a DM for the group was an insurmountable task, but I was always on the edge of burnout that first year. Balancing trying to juggle between 6-9 players each session, have all their stories matter with the situations they were facing, and keeping the meta-plot of the campaign in sight was a huge tax on my time. Worse, it required several hours of planning each week to have a flowchart of events to avoid railroading. The payoff was extremely rewarding and the players clearly enjoyed it enough to keep coming back for more, but I started to realize that when I dropped the intense focus on directed story moments and instead just riffed things, we collectively had the most fun playing and hanging out together. Most importantly, I observed that neither the fictional nor the real world burned down to ground because I stopped worrying so much about a grand design and instead just gave my players situations and locations to play around in. Since then, Ben Milton’s Questing Beast recommendations, the advice of Professor Dungeon Master, and the guidelines offered by Sly Flourish’s Return of the Lazy DM have backed up that freeing philosophy. I love 5th Edition and I look forward to what’s coming up; but marrying that old-school philosophy to my games was a necessity to keep them manageable and fun for EVERYONE, myself included. Does 5E have a DM problem? I think new DMs absolutely suffer from their own huge expectations of what it means to run a successful game. Thankfully, that can be corrected if you stop worrying and just learn to love dropping a bomb on your players and seeing how they deal with the explosion.

Mara

For my part, I think 5e has leaned a bit too far into the fuzzy numbers zone, especially in terms of stat/class balance and creating encounters. It has tried to project the appearance of being rules-light and easy to learn without actually doing the deeper work to make the system support that style of play. But that's also why so many people have been inspired to break off and create their own rules and settings. It's frustrating that those innovators are still drowned out by the marketing juggernaut of WotC/Hasbro, but without them there might not be so many people interested in this kind of storytelling. Lots of people would love to create and play in the fantasy worlds that 5e has made popular, but I think the artwork is promising more than the tools available to new Game Masters can deliver. When you take the artwork away and focus on the game itself, the shine wears away all too quickly.

Eric Avila

I’ll pile on to what Jonathan said. In a nutshell, I think the shortage is partially rooted in all the reasons listed in the poll, but Public Enemy #1 is the expectation that the DM cater to each player’s expectations, give them purpose and meaning, etc. No. It’s an RPG, not Maslow’s hierarchy of needs. It’s unfair to expect the DM to help you self-actualize. Find your own purpose and meaning, or die in the attempt. I’m currently in a 5e campaign as a player and my chief issue is that despite all manner of insane hazards, not one PC has been slain, dismembered, nihilated, obliterated, or otherwise killed off. I actually TRIED to get my PC killed and it didn’t work because of DM-ex-machina. The DM is trying soooo hard to “make everyone happy” and I don’t think thats the DM’s job. When the bulk of players expect it, that’s daunting to volunteer for.

Brad and Aidan

I think it's simpler than all that. Being DM means putting yourself out there and being held responsible for whether everyone else has fun. (Plus the silly voices.) That's a lot of responsibility. Easier to be a player.

Smarting

I would say, the problem isn't that WotC has done something wrong in itself. This is my experience: I started and kept being a player for one year or so, before I became a GM the first tine. However, I didn't become a regular GM in the system I started with, because, well, there were already regular GMs (how else could I have been player for so long? ). So I become GM for a system, that interested me, but I didn't know a regular GM for. That was at least my experience and if I may make an induction, I would say, that there are two factors, that are magnified by 5e's popularity: 1. All GMs are potentially players, but not all players are potentially GMs. You need to more than casual interest to become GM and that needs time. So the growth of players is faster than the growth of GMs. 2. Many new GMs tend to become regular GMs for other systems/settings (or variations of that system) instead of their starting systems/setting, mostly because from their individual point of view there are already enough regular GMs for that system/setting.

The Tabletop Engineer

For me, I left 5e because it was just too much with 50+ classes, 50+ races, tons of feats aand too many spells to try and remember. It bogged my game down. I've moved to OSE.

William
>>97227217

I am a university student in the UK and we have lots of people wanting to run vampires games (including me). I agree with you

baldrage

5E is all about catering to the players. Takes a special kind of selfless person that is willing to be nothing more than an ego-stroking, wish-granting, happy-ending story teller with no agency of their own.

Marc Rougier

Video games run without DM"s.

William
>>97228857

I had almost the opposite happen to me. The GM that introduced me to TTRPGs ran horror games therefore I became the 5e GM. Also, our home group went from 2 GMs and 6 players to an even split after 5 years. I agree, there is a delay between people becoming a player and people GMing. We might see an influx of GMs in a few years.

Bryan Stephens

Seth S is spot on when he says the most important thing is to have fun. If the DM does not have fun, no one will do it.

GM James

With the benefit of an extra day to clarify my thought process, here's my thoughts: The system itself is immaterial to why there's a "shortage" of DMs. A system can be as complicated as physically possible, and people will still love it and want to run it (DnD 3.0-3.5, for example). The issue is one of expectation and support. To paraphrase from a Matt Colville video, you can tell the way that a game is intended to be played based on what the company publishes. In this case, WoTC very clearly says that 5e is meant to be played in the form of long form adventures that take 1-3 YEARS to play through, as evidenced by the books that they publish (Strahd, Avernus, Dragon Queen, etc). Now, again, this in of itself isn't a problem. The problem arises when that's really all that they provide. So they give NEW Dms the impression (rightfully so), that the "right" way to run DnD is a sweeping epic that lasts for a year or more. And that's a really high barrier to entry to people that might want to try it out. It's tremendously intimidating for a new DM to jump behind the screen to run something like that, and WoTC doesn't do a great job of making short, modular adventurers available for DMs that are still learning how to run the game. Combine that with the fact that the DMG doesn't really teach you HOW to DM, and then add on top of that the crunch that goes along with adding as many options for players as they possibly can, it makes it really, really difficult for a newbie to break into DMing. Meaning that there's no new DMs to replace old DMs that don't want to run anymore, no chance for the "forever DMs" to get a break and play (if they want to), and all of that contributes to burn out, making the hobby less fun. It's a vicious cycle that results in too few DMs, all stemming from the fact that the way WotC presents the game and supports it creates an incredibly frustrating experience for new DMs.

Callias

As someone who's played D&D since the original whitebox set from the 70's (which I still have along with Chainmail) and who's played a lot of other RPGs (Harn, WFRP, DCC, etc. not to mention more modern take RPGs such as Aftermath, Twilight 2K, et al), its my analysis that straight 5e creates OP characters (essentially marvel superheroes running around in a high medieval period) that in order to provide challenge to the player (and thus enjoyment to the GM to make and run), one either needs to be incredibly creative OR one needs to start homebrewing and getting rid of 5e rules that are OP.Example, in my current 2 year old campaign, players HAD to be human -- no other choice, period. Thus, I eliminate the "everyone chooses a race with Darkvision" BS. In addition, just going up a level doesn't magically *poof* give you all the spells, you have to find, buy or steal them. My players were tentatively okay at first, but now, 2 years later, they say they'll never play straight 5e again as its too boring. And they're right -- it's too boring for players, it's too boring for GMs. No wonder players roll up new characters all the time by level 10; they're looking to rekindle that sense of challenge and wonder.

robert fransgaard

Jim Murphy just posted some interesting thoughts on this

Kevin

Your poll needs and "all of the above" option :) Lack of DM support in the books is probably a factor as well.

MrGunn

Wow, what an awesome group. I am blown away by all the smart, insightful, clever, and interesting comments y'all have written here. Just so happy to be a part of such a fantastic group.

Travis Sperry

I voted for streaming shows, but I can't help but feel there is a general lack of information on how to DM as well

Gridlock350 Studios

Most people I talk to have never seen a single episode of things like critical role. I know personally about 20-30 different roleplaying people & about 5 of them are the “forever DM”

Damon Cairns

There seems to be a certain mindset with many of the new generation of players that think that the DM is there mostly to cater to their “unique” character, story, etc. Their agency is all that matters and I think 5e has encouraged that kind of behavior. Unfortunately, that just isn’t very rewarding to DMs. They are there to have fun too, after all.

Mara
>>97229073

Never play Pathfinder! :P It's sooo much worse, especially 1st edition.

Paul Zinke

I agree with what Damon Cairns and others have said about too much focus on player powers and agency. This is the DM's game too. Back in the day it was mainly the DM's game, where players were invited to explore the DM's creation. I would add that our society is also in a place where D&D has become more mainstream. Thousands (or more) of people wanting to learn D&D, and it's far easier to jump in as a player than as a DM. Perhaps it's not so much that we're losing DMs, but more that we're gaining so many new players.

Ron Griffis

I chose one of the options but I actually believe it is “all of the above”. These three factors all contribute to the reluctance of people to want to DM. The ratio of folks who want to DM to those who want to play has always been rather low, but these factors make it harder for some to commit to DM’ing.

Elvis Ramone

The options given and responses absolutely weigh in, however there is no one thing at issue here it is a conglomeration. Add in trepidation with not wanting to fail your friends, family and most terrifying of all, people you just met, and you see why potential DM's may not want to stick their necks out. I also do not know the situation on the ground, but are groups expecting experienced DM's not the newbie who has stepped up?

MrGunn
>>97228252

LOL, loved this line: "It’s an RPG, not Maslow’s hierarchy of needs." great stuff

MrGunn
>>97229403

Indeed! When the fun quotient dips too low, it starts becoming work, I don't know about you, but I don't work for free. :D

MrGunn
>>97231106

Be honest did you really play Aftermath, or did you just sit there and do math with charts? :D wakka wakka!

MartyFarty

I think it’s simply because there is a ton more 5e players. It’s supply and demand.

Kevin

Lack of a good open-ended intro adventure, ala, B2 KotB

David Ford

There has always been a DM shortage. These rare beasts are seldom seen outside of their native habitat. I don’t have my finger on the pulse of 5E so I don’t know if this current shortage is exceptional or not. But, back in my day (god, that makes me sound old) trying to find a DM was a full time job.

Elated Muse

I believe that the players that play dnd have to be enjoying it as a team effort. Perhaps due to the automated dnd beyond and then a dm that isn’t like a video game players don’t want to continue. Or perhaps they put a lot of effort into their character and too much expectation to be amazing when it’s a team effort.

Flowers

In a Reddit thread on r/dmacademy a poster asked how to improve his DMing skills during downtime. All the most upvoted advice was around voice acting and writing. There was only one answer that said “learn the rules.” Matt Mercer effect in full force.

Flowers
>>97231792

This was my experience playing online during lockdown. A LOT of the players were there for DM story-time. They had silly backstories they expected me to build the adventures around, and barely engaged with anything that wasn’t directly about their character. It really spoiled the experience for me.

GM James
>>97229944

And just to piggyback on my own comment, regarding the issue of streamed games and the "matt mercer effect": Streamed games are great entertainment that help bring new players into the hobby, because they're looking for that kind of fun. The issue arises in that those kinds of streamed games aren't representative of what the work of being a DM looks like -- viewers are seeing the final product, so to speak, rather than the process. This isn't to say that the streamed games are bad, or that liking them is bad, or even that wanting to play in that kind of game is bad, but rather it all comes back to what I keep harping on -- lack of support for NEW dms. A brand new DM who has never experienced running DnD goes to youtube looking for advice on how to be a DM, and more than likely falls upon a Critical Role video. They can ABSOLUTELY be expected to believe that the most important part of DMing is doin g the voices and being theatrical. They've never had a chance to see the *fundamentals* of DMing, because the fundamentals aren't as entertaining. Matt Mercer, Matt Colville, et al do a great job of trying to reinforce the idea that anyone can DM (and anyone CAN!), but they also represent an incredibly skilled set of DMs that have spent *decades* honing their craft. So it's easy for the new DM to get discouraged when they aren't up to that level yet, because they aren't familiar with the basic skills that they need to develop to run the game. So yeah, I don't think that you can lay the blame on the rise of actual plays, and I don't think necessarily that they create an unreasonable standard. I tend to view them the same way I view sports or movies -- these are professionals at the top of their fields showing the pinnacle of what can be achieved. Hockey is a great sport, and it's perfectly fine to aspire to playing at Gretsky's level, but if no one ever teaches you how to skate or shoot the puck, you're only gonna get frustrated when you don't reach that level of skill.

Tyler N

I don't think it is 5E. I've played off and on since the mid 1980s, and it seems to me that there have always been more players than DMs. There is nothing wrong with players today. There are 101 ways to play the game. Play what you enjoy and be open to trying new approaches.

Scott Spears

It's a supply and demand issue. More people than ever are wanting to play D&D so demand is high but the supply of DM's is low. There have always been more players than DMs. Some folks are not cut out for it. We have to train up more DMs. Somebody should create an on-line DM school. (Hmmmm that's a good idea. Maybe I should do that.)

Ejo

As far as I remember, it's always been this way. Most people want to be the hero, not the hundreds of defeated corpses left in the hero's wake.

Chuck Thorin

Like MrGunn said, y'all are great. And like Kevin said, "All of the above." There's always been a shortage of DM's. I think it's the accumulation of all of the above. Many unrealistic expectations have have been placed on DM's recently. Let me give another example. D&D has often been compared to improv. Player has a character. DM sets up the scene and asks, "What do you?". Now, I feel it's a bit more like Player has an 8-Page Back Story and asks the DM, "So how are you going to make me the hero?" And anecdotally, just yesterday I got into a "discussion" about D&D is for everybody. Yep, sure the game is but that doesn't mean that every game and every group fits everyone's taste. Apparently, that was bad wrong. But I do want end this something that I feel is positive. Head on over to Runehammer's Youtube channel. Look for the Hermetic D&D video. Hank starts on the meat of it at about the 13 minute mark and he mentions another of Ben's videos but I don't know which one. In a nutshell, the theory is that there's a whole other D&D community that really doesn't participate in all of the online stuff so they aren't showing up in the "stats". They just do their thing.

Don Dorsey

I think the published adventures are too long and comprehensive. They are daunting to some to understand and run, and limit your options as you progress through a campaign. I would advocate for the old module system that only commits you to ~3 levels of advancement at a time

Matthew Crismali

Speaking from my own experience, I have avoided being a dungeon master for 5E because of its rules complexity. I started looking for a game that was less crunchy with rules; that's how I found Index Card RPG, Knave, Old School Essentials, and EZD6. I have since run games as DM with my kiddos using OSE and EZD6. I've also played a ton of ICRPG and OSE and a lot less 5e. 5e character creation is so time-consuming and I don't enjoy it. The other systems I listed have breezy character creation and leveling and I love them for it.

lars madsen

I don't think the rules are too complex, especially when compared to systems like 3.5/Pathfinder. Complexity in game rules arises from overpublishing rules content, which I think WotC has managed admirably. Likewise, I don't think story-driven adventures are an issue. If there's a story,there's a plot and if there's a plot you can connect the dots - easy peasy! As a 30+ year DM, it is IMPOSSIBLE that I haven't thought of EVERYTHING! Therefore, the only remaining possibility is MATT MERCER DID IT!

MrGunn
>>97241160

Excellent points Mr. Thorin! "I got into a "discussion" about D&D is for everybody. Yep, sure the game is but that doesn't mean that every game and every group fits everyone's taste. Apparently, that was bad wrong." Uh oh, was someone canceled b/c they had a different opinion from the 'we are so inclusive (until you disagree) crowd. Stick you your Gunns ;), cuz you know what to say to people who can't take a joke.... }|-[>

Ben Chance

Players sometimes make it not fun to DM, by complaining when the game turns against them. In my previous experience, the issue can sometimes be players who act like they want one thing, but then when it comes want something else. I've had several cases where a game was billed as "this is a world where you have to prepare in order to survive, and your actions have consequences," and then the players get upset and accuse me of being too "Player vs. DM" when the party TPKs because they prioritized wealth over self preservation and refused the lifelines I threw them, or they go into a survival horror game and are surprised when characters start dropping and poor target prioritization leads to them failing to stop a bigger threat.

MrGunn
>>97240370

Oooohhh, Not online, it should be a 4 week intensive boot camp. We should insert a commercial with a montage here. I can see it now: Inspiring music, a DM drill Sgt screaming at rookie DMs, scenes of newbies identifying how many sides each die has, curling d20s, proper dice throwing instructions, flash cards with rules, using graph paper, pictures of railroads with Xs... EPIC!

Graham Kane
>>97227276

If that's case (which I think it is) then what was causing them to move away from 5E?

MrGunn
>>97229944

Exactly! "Streamed games are great entertainment...." Indeed, players want you to DM like Mat Mercer but can't play like Laura Bailey or Sam Riegel.

MrGunn
>>97235876

Sadly, players want you to DM like Mat Mercer but can't play like Laura Bailey or Sam Riegel.

MrGunn
>>97240236

Like your historical sweep here, thought provoking comment!

Jim Van Cura

I voted for "something else you haven't thought of". Our current societal norms are that of easy access to lots of things. You can stream anything on demand, there are billions of hours of content on YouTube, Vimeo, social media, or whatever. With that, there are lots of takers and few makers. People want something for nothing. They want to consume content without having to work for it. Game prep is hard. Passively rolling dice is easy. Let the other guy run the game. "Tell me where to be and when, and what number I need to roll. I have other things to do."

Graham Kane

It's really a combination of all of those factors to different degrees. It's all been explained in the excellent comments above.

Skyhammer
>>97241496

"I think the published adventures are too long and comprehensive." YES! I've been running Tomb of Annihiliation now for 2.3 years. Just got to the tomb... In hindsight i wouldve never run so a large campaign. I much prefer the old Dungeon mag style games and modules where it was a 3 month, one and done, then you moved on to the next module you were dying to try out... 3-month modules > than 3-year campaigns for me.

Brian Grooms

Long story short; It’s much more fun to be a player! It takes a bit more courage to start DM’ing. I’ve always noticed though that once a person starts DM’ing, they really get into it. Most players (if reasonable) aren’t that picky, as they just want to play.

Skyhammer
>>97246670

Only push back on this is that I remember playing Pathfinder 3.5 for like 3 years straight before 5e and I dont recall having to flip through the books for a rules clarification has as much as I do now. Maybe its a fallacy in my mental memory but the gritty long rules of 3.5 were clear and resolute. With 5e no matter how much I and my 5, decades long players try, we always end up looking tons of stuff up :(

Kevin
>>97241496

I feel that a numbes of the published adventures are really CYOA novels disguised as modules

Andrew
>>97249802

I suspect there is a lot to this point. It's a fourth point to the ones listed above.

Bark Madly

My "forever a Player never a DM" friends say that they don't DM because 1) they are too afraid of making rules' mistakes and 2) they don't want to create a whole world and history and epic story. For number 1, DMs make happy little mistakes and rulings all the time. Sometimes the best way to learn a rule is to mess it up and enjoy the odd result haha (or just make up something fun in the moment as a rule). DnD is not a clockwork toy you wind up and set it off. Rather it's a game of taking turns coming up with fun ideas with the added chance that things go really unexpectedly. But for number 2, 5E focuses so much on premeditated story. Matt Mercer and official campaigns imply that you need an amazing pre planned story for your characters to unfold. I prefer minimal planning, and we all just play to create a story--look back at the end of session and opine what we think is going on. The juiciest opinions get put in the DM salad shooter of my brain for the next session. What players see is a DM who has a rule for everything and brings the players into a rich world. But the sausage is actually made by making things up on the fly and using ideas in a piecemeal fashion.

MrGunn
>>97248491

Le Gasp, you mean our characters are not wearing plot armour!!! Ben you already know what to say to people who can't take a joke.... }|-]>

GCDV

Part of the answer might be how the “everyone is a winner, everyone gets a medal” aspect of modern culture has bled into the game. The maintenance of Balance for each and every encounter has become sacrosanct, and rules mechanics governing PCs seem heavily set up to encourage extreme optimisation. The notion of player agency as the main driver to success (as in OS versions of the game esp. 1e and earlier) is replaced in large part by specific rules to ensure performance even if players make stupid decisions for their characters. Hit points and resources, including gold (!) hold little value for players when they know their poor DM is obliged to keep all encounters balanced to level and most games involve story based levelling for the whole party rather than xp driven by the loot found by a party facing death around every corner. Frankly this is why I’m trying to convince my table to either switch to OSR or adopt a set of hard mode rules as have been discussed numerous times on this channel by Prof DM!

GCDV
>>97251653

In my experience good DM’s also make the best players as they develop an appreciation for the challenges DMs face and they usually manage their own character in such a way to make life easier on a DM, and require a lot less “baby-sitting”.

MrGunn
>>97231196

Fantastic, thanks for sharing. A great video, a bit long, but great advice and a great perspective.

Ben Chance
>>97248491

Well, when you scare off an NPC cleric by being ridiculously chaotic evil, then the new cleric wastes all his spell slots healing his GF in the first encounter, well safe to say they shoulda bought or asked about buying potions.

Andrew
>>97254563

There's a lot to this. I know lots of people are intimidated by developing their own campaign world. To be honest, I started back in the early 1980s with Greyhawk, and a whole lot of published modules. What is apparently called location style campaigns, we called module hopping. In my little group, we took turns running games. Without those published modules, I don't think we would have been able to tackle coming up with adventures. That comes later after you've run a whole bunch of published modules and plowed through published campaign worlds. You need some time on a bike before you attempt the Tour de France. There's a real point to the perfect being the enemy of the good, or the good enough.

Andrew
>>97241496

I was actually going to ask about published modules. I don't run or own 5e., and everything I learn about it makes me want to avoid it like it's a bubonic rat. I know from my own experience, in the 1980's when my little group began cutting our teeth on the game, we took turns running modules. One weekend, one of us would run something like N1, Against the Cult of the Reptile God. It might take us two sessions to finish single module, but then someone else would run something else. I don't think any of us would have been able to come up with everything on our own right out of the gate. Easy to run, published modules and the World of Greyhawk gave us ideas for how to design our own adventures and campaign worlds once we got into our twenties. Does 5th ed not do this? If they aren't, that more than anything else might be a real reason people aren't running games.

Adam Maag

I also feel that with the rise of new interest in D&D people want to be a player. If they are watching a stream they see a player having fun with a story made for them. They want to experience that. They have more exposure to players vs. dm’s. The only people watching dm specific content are dm’s. But produce a player focused how to on the newest character build. Lots more will engage.

lars madsen
>>97246670

That's weird, did you play beyond level 9 in PF? That seems to be the magic boundary beyond which all devolves into endless spreadsheet accounting. I recently dipped back into a high level Pathfinder game after pretty much only playing 5E for a while and it's a beast to keep track of all the typed modifiers and overlapping rules.

james O'Boyle

The cr system, constant power creep. Unnecessary complex rules. Not everything needs a sub system

Peter Leban
>>97227276

I think the main shift happened when 4e hit us and then people just stayed with OSR. But regarding 5e I feel it was power creep, CRs and calculating balanced encounters. It felt like an amusement park instead of a real adventure because of this. We did like the Lost Mine of Phandelver though.

Jason Carpenter

I think that what’s going on is a shift to other games, be it simpler games like OSE (million dollar Kickstarter) or more complex with player options and predictable like PF2 and to or more old school but new design styles like DCC getting some upticks in trending and all these games, aside from Pathfinder, are cheaper options. Other genres of games are receiving an uptick as well, Starfinder has lasted longer than intended for Paizo with an increase in support, which is great because I love the game. The announcement and response to D&DOne hasn’t been well received as changes are not being as well received as the survey’s would indicate to WOTC. 5e needed a much smaller revision than they envisioned and they’re going whole hog new edition while making 4e style videos, promises and proclamations that don’t offer anything that other VTT companies have either failed to deliver or don’t have in the works at a lower cost. So I think D&D doesn’t have a DM problem so much as it has a new edition announced problem and people burnt out on the game problem. Plus the shine wearing off and the trend away from what was once 5e’s selling point. When 5e came out it was very popular because it was so easy to house rule and the text and artwork was praised for its inclusiveness. Now people make videos about how tired they are of “fixing WOTC’s broken game” meaning having to… houserule it. You see influencers telling people to not read the DMG and the same people on the other hand praising Prof. DM and Matt Colville who… are always talking about their awesome houserules and how they change things to play the game how they want to play the game and how it’s is encouraged by the game going back to its roots in 0e. But newer players take the off-ramp to whatever game the “tired of fixing your broken game” video is selling.

MrGunn
>>97257250

I like this! Tell your players that Deathbringer's axe on their neck's is the only kind of participation 'metal' you give out... }|-]> muhahaha. Good luck getting your players to go Hardmode/OSR. More grim more dark.

Mighty Zeus

I said the same thing on YT page- D&D has always had a DM shortage. Fact is, people by and large start playing D&D with the desire to run PCs, not modules. Even your favorite DM would rather be playing. The problem? DMing is intimidating af, and the massive published adventures do nothing to help that (nor do streaming shows, imho). The solution? Run five-room dungeons, and require everyone in the group to take turns DMing. People will level up their DM skills naturally over time- larger dungeons, introducing plots, more interesting details, better monsters, etc. Look, your kids will never learn to read until you make them (exceptions, oc), and in the same way, your players will never learn to DM until you make them (exceptions, oc). In my groups, DMing is not optional- you gotta pay if you wanna play.

MrGunn
>>97274099

MZ, I must disagree, I actually prefer DMing to playing.

samurguybri
>>97229073

I stared to feel this way as a 3.5 DM. 5E is better, but still,the same problem set.I don’t want to plan and “build “ super complex enemies and consider the innumerable feats and combos the players have.

Rogue General Hunter (RGH)

To me it boils down to support. Perhaps it's there and I just miss it, but it seems that almost all the support material that comes out these days is primarily player focused. New "this" and new "that" to make your character's more and more powerful. For the DM/GM (I prefer GM since I consider DnD to be only a small facet of my gaming history) very little except to assist you with using these new rules to to make the player experience better. DM's are players too. Where are all the books (for players) on making the GM's game experience better? More and more often it seems that DMs are 3rd class passengers rather than the ship captain. I may be reading it wrong, but the OneDnD interviews that came out recently made me feel like this will only get worse.

Craig McKenzie

I agree with the majority which is why I don't allow multi-classing. Most of the hyper-stupid builds rely on multi-classing. Problem solved. It's an adventure, not a loophole-exploit game.