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Will Daggerheart RPG Be the Next Pathfinder? (Patreon)

Published:
2023-04-23 22:07:53
Imported:
2026-06
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Videos

Content

Matt Mercer is debuting his fantasy RPG at GenCon. Is it a potential threat to D&D? PDM opines. 

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Comments

Bagel-Man

Excited to see your opinion on this topic, keep up the good work!

Bagel-Man
>>107004697

Hahaha! Yeah, I was already on my phone and got the notification. You're doing great!

RUNEHAMMER

"I was gonna ignore this" cute :P

MrGunn
>>107004697

@DungeonCraft He's round, he's fluffy, he's plain fast, he's everything, he's the Bagel-Man, it's how he rolls...

MrGunn

Clickus-Bateius defined as anything to draw a person into clicking on a video or internet post. For many it is the titillating or scandalous, for gaming nerds it is: Matt Mercer. LOL The reason there are so many micro-brews is that Budweiser is simply not good beer, it is barely mediocre beer. WizBros like many large companies has solely focused on the money and not the product. WizBros is completely out of touch with their customer base and it shows in their products. Their ham handed assault on the OGL, the push to inject a USA West Coast 'wokist' social agenda into the product, the steady decline of their products both in production quality and writing quality, their failure to attend conventions or play the game. The practice of outsourcing all their writing. Worse was their awful public relations fumbles, first no communication on the OGL, then prevarications and disdain of the gaming public e.g. white guys can't leave the hobby soon enough (ahem, almost the entirety of senior leadership at WizBros is white), then the epic fail to recover some of the public's good will via the DnD summit, where their tone-deaf myopia was put on display for all to see. WizBro's broke the 2nd Law of Gaming: Don't be a dick!, If you do break the second law, you break the First Law of Gaming: Have fun! I am uninterested in PF2e or TRAGICHeart or whatever... I've got ICRPG, Five Torches Deep, Shadowdark, Deathbringer, EZD6, and many awesome game system choices. However, good luck to Matt and his crew, I wish them every success and I think they will have a hit, because: No one ever lost money underestimating the intelligence of the public. Thank you PDM for your all of your hard work and the fantastic content you provide. Take care! PS So was DB's marriage a Love at First Massacre or 90 Day Stockholm Fiance sort of thing? How did DB and DH meet?

Jim Havoc

I'm surprised they didn't do a Kickstarter just to grab the cash.

Jeff Krus

It's good for companies to have competition. I also think this I great for small game companies.I am sure the WOtC will see how Matt's game is received. I bet too that WOtC will go to convention to promote the new D & D or just make appearances to promote D & D in general.

MrGunn
>>107007357

@Jeff Krus I think so too, wondering if they will go full on full tilt with a big GenCon presence to promote the 50th or if it will be more muted, or just at ComicCon, will be interesting to see.

MrGunn
>>107005959

@Jim Havoc I agree, maybe they think they can keep the cut KS would take.

shawn rader

I like the cliffhanger dealing with the Lost City.

SJBehindtheScreen

dumb analogy: many golf traditionalists didn't like Tiger Woods, but he moved the needle and changed that industry. Mercer changed D&D and now he can call his own shots. For a game that has peaked, it's going to be fun for the next few years.

James Mace

Am I the only one who now wants to see Deathbringer's ex-wife?

James Rubio

Professor thanks for introducing me to the indie ttrpg market. I dipped my toes in with eldritch hack and now I'm happily running shadowdark games. It's important and it's the community helping out the community.

Elvis Ramone

As far as Matt Mercer, indeed anyone who has made a living with ttrpg's, all I can say is I wish I had. Good luck to everyone.

Travis Sperry

Dungeons and Dragons is becoming a generic term..

Elated Muse

I never liked pathfinder. I left 3E because of crunch. I like 5E because less crunch. I may not like Windows OS but when win95 came out it made us all aware of what computers could really do for the masses. I am a fan of CR. I don't look to try to be them in my games. I have a different style. I am looking forward to shadow dark. I like 5E. I look forward to see what happens with D&D 2024. I don't like dndbeyond or what they intend with it. In the end, it's about community.

Jay

PDM, I was waiting for you to cover this after hearing the news about Daggerheart RPG a few days ago. I may not watch Critical Role but I am interested to see what they do with their DnD clone. Hope its at least good enough to borrow a few ideas from.

Jay
>>107005637

Clickus-Bateius had me rolling yet the definition is so very true. I also agree that Butt-wiper is not good beer. Makes me glad I gave up alcohol many moons ago. Never-the-less, the way I heard it Butt Light recently lost billions in sales due to going woke and public backlash. I will not likely buy the new Daggerheart game either but will likely take a look under the hood and see if there is anything worth borrowing. All the other games you mentioned I also play. They are much better than DnD. Hey that reminds me. I believe there was some news that DnD Beyond is now gone too. Not that I care but some might be interested. Anyway, 2nd Law of Gaming outta be in the rule books. So much good stuff in this post. Have a good one.

lars madsen
>>107005959

Again with this idea that people who create stuff shouldn't profit from it? People want to live their lives doing what they love AND make a living doing it? The horror! The horror! I have no intention of buying it. Vox Machina (the animated series) was entertaining, as was the D&D movie. Not my idea of a "perfect" adaptation of D&D to the big or small screen, but better than previous efforts. I, for one, don't intend to buy more stuff from Wizards OR Critical Role, but I don't begrudge them the opportunity to get paid for their efforts.

MrGunn
>>107005637

@Jay Thanks for taking the time to reply. Wishing you and yours the very best.

MrGunn
>>107005959

@lars madsen Huh, not sure how you inferred; ‘this idea that people who create stuff shouldn’t profit from it’ from the conversation, I don’t think anyone was implying that.

Brent Norton

So when should I be expecting my text to play Lost City? Between Daggerheart pulling Critters out of D&D and Shadowdark pulling another percentage can’t wait to see what the overall percentages will be next year with the different companies. It will be interesting.

Ian Butterworth

Seem odd that Wizards are not at GenCon. GenCon is a Gygax invention, you can find an advert for it in the back of the B/X rulebook. As the market leader, not only should Wizards be there, but they should also be dominating GenCon.

robert fransgaard

if you compare Darington Press' 7 minute announcement with Wizard's D&D Direct, Darington's had more substance, more content, felt more relevant to me and had both humour and heart. I don't even watch Critical Role, but like the Vox Machina series and I am very excited about Daggerheart.

Graham Kane

I agree that before the OGL debacle and the D&D movie failure 5E had plenty of growth left. I don’t know how long Mercer and Co. have been working on Daggerheart but recent events may have tipped their hand and the Gencon appearance is a clear sign that they are going for the throat! I also think this will genuinely worry WOTC with CR being probably one of their best billboards for the game. But unfortunately I think it’s too late for them to do a thing about it.

Cee-Jay
>>107017040

Although I prefer other systems, 5e has a lot to like about it. And as you said, Mercer and Critical Role are great (even though it's not at all the style of D&D that I enjoy). Best case, all of us TTRPG players see ourselves as part of the same big team.

Cee-Jay

I mean, the OGL debacle was probably targeted in large part at Critical Role (and the VTTs) to prevent Mercer et al from cashing out on their own game... which from a business perspective was a totally reasonable thing to want to stop, but WizBro handled it so poorly. It does seem like D&D may be peaking right now, but we'll see. Waiting for a big announcement in which Mercer's games have an exclusive deal with one of the VTTs. And a Vox Machina video game has to be in the works, right? Spicy, insane take: In 5 years, Mercer buys WoTC from a struggling Hasbro. I know it's not remotely feasible right now (WotC is very big), but ya never know. Mostly joking here.

Cee-Jay

I hope 5e stays alive and I hope Mercer's games do well. It's good overall for the hobby. Also, I want the culture police busy-bodies to have a couple of big companies to focus on so my games don't get destroyed. Let them worry about made-up racism with D&D orcs instead of paying attention to the scantily clad women and grim violence in my DCC games! Everyone is welcome at my table... and nobody is welcome to tell me how I have to play. There are some advantages to being the little guy, just small enough to stay off the radar.

Frederic Schmitt

You are right. I don't like Matthew Mercer clickbait :D

Jeff Jones

Savage Worlds for the win!

Chuck Thorin

I tried to watch some Critical Role and thought whatever. But I'm willing to at least to give Daggerheart a look. But I am wondering, what's the line for an independent publisher? CR is already making millions so it just doesn't feel that indie to me.

Rufus Lynks

I studied Hasbro in grad school. They made a call in the '80's to own anything played on a table. It was a counter-strategy to Mattel given their competing toys (GI Joe etc) are never able to actually compete w/ Mattel's Barbie and Hot Wheels. Remember, they own Parker Borthers, Milton Bradley, and my personal favorite Avalon Hill. At a level above WOTC, they may see a field opening up with aggressive and successful competitors as acquisition targets. Were I driving the ship, I"d look to form/buy another company to compete directly with WOTC - to drive internal competition for total control within the genre.

Frank Bath

Is it just me, or should we read something into the name of the proposed new game? I mean, Daggerheart, it could be pretty prophetic. I guess time will tell. I'm looking forward to seeing what the new game is all about. I've watched a few sessions of Critical Role and it's pretty good.

Flowers

I expect Daggerheart will be a love letter to the ten-page-backstory crowd

MrGunn
>>107046015

@Rufus Lynks Still salty about AH, their is so much IP that could be released/updated.

jnlsn family

I'm surprised it took him this long. More drinking with Hank stories please.

ViggenCA

I'll give it one thing sight unseen - it's a cool name, imo.

James C
>>107056371

It definitely sounds like Mercer wants to create a game that tells a long evolving story with player characters that are expected to survive and grow. I don’t think it’s a terrible idea and most newer players seem to prefer it. OSR caters more to dark dangerous dungeon crawling so having a different RPG with a different goal might be something that may expand the player base.