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Episode 694: Ocarina of Time Out of Context (Patreon)

Published:
2025-05-30 10:00:10
Imported:
2026-08
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Stuart: Oh my goodness, what have I done? What have I done?! Thinking about, I suppose what I’ve done is play through The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, except in 2025 instead of 1998 like I was supposed to. Whoops!

After struggling through the game I had an array of thoughts, many of which concerning how my approach to playing such a resonant, important game may have destroyed my chances of ever appreciating it in the manner to which it is accustomed.

The last thing I wanted to do – and I believe I haven’t done – was make a contrarian-ass “your favourite game ever is bad, actually” podcast. You may find this challenging to believe, but that is not of interest to me and never has been. I wasn’t too sure where this one was going when it started, but it turned into what I feel is a pretty gosh-darn interesting discussion of the way retro gaming culture changes the way we perceive and enjoy retro games, using my Ocarina of Time journey as a launchpad rather than the be-all and end-all.

It is with apologies, then, that I announce this isn’t really an Ocarina of Time podcast – sorry. It’s about how Ocarina of Time led me to think at length about how important perspective and context are when we play classic games. And then I talked about it with my boys Dave Bulmer and Seumidh MacDonald. For just over 90 minutes.

Edits by Greg Leahy. Art by Leeann Hamilton.

08:18 - brentalfloss: "Zelda: Ocarina of Time WITH LYRICS feat. Dave Bulmer"

17:05 - Horse Race | Kaepora Gaebora

28:00 - Deku Tree

36:47 - Dinosaur Boss Battle | Hyrule Field

46:14 - Market/Battle

53:36 - Chamber of the Sages

1:04:52 - Ganon's Castle -Inside-

1:15:20 - Kotake & Koume

1:26:20 - Sheik

Closing - brentalfloss: "Zelda: Ocarina of Time WITH LYRICS feat. Dave Bulmer" (cont.)

Files

Comments

Wood Duck [Legacy Edition]

While I mourn for Stu (or anyone!) being unable to unable to enjoy OoT like those of us who played it under X-Other-Circumstances (I myself have never been able to retain attention through Super Metroid and enjoy it in fullness due to X-Other-Circumstances) my reaction to seeing this episode blurb is FUCK YES STRAP IN MATE. Looking forwards to listening tomorrow at work!

Peter Monks

This sounds similar to when I first played Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, but in 2024 and not 1997 as nature intended. While I did ultimately see why it was beloved, I really struggled to get into it because of a lack of manual, user guide (so many bizarre secrets!) and no previous knowledge of Castlevania games. I did play OoT at the time of release, I'll look forward to hearing a different perspective.

Andrew O.

Maybe it's because riding a horse was such an exciting concept it 1998 that it was on the forefront of my mind. Maybe it's because seeing Link riding one in the opening sequence was so impactful, but you skipped it and went straight into the game. I'm doing mental gymnastics here to understand how Stu missed Epona during his playthrough. The ranch is a major focal point in the center of the map. It's like not enjoying Mario since you didn't get any power ups. As if you passed every question block thinking "whatever" and just continued onward.

Wood Duck [Legacy Edition]

I could wax lyrical on OoT, my sympathy for people who had experiences like Stu, how people can approach and enjoy "sacred" masterpieces of various mediums, how I have my own personal heresy in loving Donkey Kong Country to death but not the sequels or Returns, how I'll never be able to enjoy the original Final Fantasy 7 or Resident Evil as originally presented as I never played them back in the day, how BotW was the only game to ever fully recapture that same incredible and wide-eyed feeling as OoT 20 years after the fact etc etc.... but I won't. Instead I will fondly recall that both Dark Souls and STALKER 1 had me turned off within the first two hours of gameplay and saying "I don't get it". Re-approaching them later with a different mindset (and having played different games adjacently, thus changing my expectations) resulted in them being two of the best games I've ever played and subsequently sinking hundreds of hours into them.

Julian

This was a great episode, and a great discussion. I know you were at pains to make sure the nuance of your criticism came across, Stu, and it definitely did.

Justen Brown

As far as Gippisodes go, this is among the most insightful. I agree that games don't age it's that taste changes and we don't have the unlimited free time to explore unbidden. But I think the largest hurdle is that old media has left the public conscious. Ocarina is 1/100th the size of Elden Ring so what makes people more receptive to scouring every inch of its massive world compared to a 30 year old game with a dozen major locations? I believe the zeitgeist is important in engagement and when a singular voice is discussing media that is no longer in the public conscious it is either taken as the gospel (influencers declaring "this old game is unequivocally bad") or worse, completely ignored which heightens frustration. What helps me engage is engrossing myself in the media of the time. Ocarina wasn't played in isolation, I talked with my friends who were playing it, read reviews, and mailed letters to the Counselors Corner. Before I play any vintage game I'll dig up any reference material I can on the internet archive. It allows me to engage on the game's level and enhances the experience that I'm approaching a creative work as someone who can appreciate where it began and the legacy it left behind.

Wood Duck [Legacy Edition]

Actually usable as a quoted comment comment - Does anyone else have the habit of *not* regularly playing their "sacred" all-time favourites? I only tend to play/read/watch my absolute favourites (OoT, LotR, ogStar Wars) once or twice a decade simply because I never want them to imprint in my brain to the point that I have memorised every second of them.

PurpleComet

With regards to which version of an older game to play, my method would be to find the latest official release, check to see if there are any problems with it, decide if those matter to me, and then proceed accordingly. If I decide those problems are a dealbreaker, I see if there's a way to play the original. To that end, I'd suggest Stu play the 3DS remake of OoT. All of the changes are improvements IMO and Amazon shows used versions available for $20. If not, that I hear the NSO version has improved considerably and now Nintendo will allow you to customize controls on a per-game basis in NSO.

TeamVenom

Great episode, really enjoyed it, but seriously you didn’t get the horse?!?!?!

PosiVibez4evr

Love hearing this trio again! This was a genuinely fascinating conversation. Was wonderful to get the perspective of someone new to the game paired with the perspective of someone with extensive experience and first hand experience at the time of release.

CapNChris

Are there any spoilers in this episode? I would like to listen, but I haven't gotten more than a few hours into OoT. I absolutely love the concept and if I recall, I heard discussion of the concept on a previous Retronauts episode (possibly about OoT specifically; was it Chrono Trigger that Diamond still hadn't played?). I remember Eric Van Allen (Axe of the Blood God) did a Twitch stream of a play through of FF6, a game he had never played (though for different reasons, but with similar relevance to the topic). I was only able to tune in for a few sessions, but it was a joy to watch someone experience FF6 for the first time. If someone can confirm there were no spoilers, I will gladly listen to the episode. I suspect Stuart has a much more critical perspective on the matter.

littleterr0r

Queensryche reference right at the start, eh?

Shrunken Shrine

"what are we but muck on the feet of God" is the first good post-episode plug I've ever heard

Guybrush

Since OoT game was one of the first games to get 10s from IGN and Gamespot, there really was never a time where heavy expectations and the dreaded capital D Discourse weren’t surrounding this title. For better or worse, the pure experience of OoT can never be extracted from its legacy. I even remember my initial playtime in 1998 had plenty of moments where I wondered if it could actually live up to the hype. In the end I loved it, but I can certainly see how it might have gone in another direction for someone else. And even more so in 2025.

Tripodtrilogy

Just want to say I love every time I get a podcast with the three of you. I always know I'm in for a good time.

Multiplayer Dungeon

I just wanted to say that I'm sad to be so far behind in your podcasts because I love having my comments interacted with by the retronauts crew. Great episode btw. The UK crew and diamond (not pictured) sometimes veer off into untrod territory which is often intellectual and interesting. And like... Spooge or something too. Looking forward to one day catching up on the 'casts!