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#202: Before and After Science (Sociology of the 4th Reich, vol. 2) (Patreon)

Published:
2023-11-22 13:41:51
Imported:
2026-06
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  • 202 before and after science 4th reich sociology 2.mp3

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Content

Fritz Thyssen, Vaslav Tchitcherine, and your passport to the Raketen-Stadt.

Happy November 22.

Files

Comments

Brendan Garcia

There’d be nothing better than seeing the look on some asshole like Sean McElwee’s face when they finish explaining themselves to God, and God says, “fuck you.”

Shiv

“We don’t have Nazi-type vibes” except when we do sad 📯

glenn mohre

Nice focused episode. Talk about the 4 Eno glam records? Please?

Karl Childers

excellent episode, lots of dots connecting here

N

🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼

Jim Salow

Let out a “Hell ye dude let’s go!” When the intro music hit halfway through this!

Heath Iverson

Help me understand what the hell the Kyrgyz light is.

Jaime Christley

Dancing with my homies in the dooryard to the Death/Corner theme song late drop.

Jaime Christley

quick drive-by recommendation for the movie THE LOVED ONE (1965). there's some business in it that I think relates to Gottfried and the rocket. it's pretty mainstreamy and an all-star affair as these things go - Pynchon had to have seen it.

ggmacd

I've been eager to hear more from you about how the 4th reich is not a metaphor. A couple of months ago I finished Gravity's Rainbow as a little bedtime reading and then stayed up all night walking in a circle. The next day (could have been the following one, I didn't sleep well for awhile after) the "Hunka affair" happened. And yes, it was absolutely like opening the hood of a car that's not working and seeing a 10-foot python inside, and then with the added layer of I dunno -- turning on the radio to hear that today's weather forecast is "pythons"? I felt it was about as close as I would get to living in a John Carpenter movie. And then Oct 7 came around about a week later. So I'm pretty convinced by your thesis at this point, and want to be better able to articulate it to others also seeing the python under the hood, so to speak. Great episode, thank you for your work.

ggmacd

I read this mini-biography of fritz thyssen on the thyssenkrupp website before and after listening to this, and boy does it ever paint with a high gloss medium over many uh.. 'sensitive' aspects of his life. My favourite example being: 'His move away from NS thinking culminates in a clean break when he fails to attend the Reichstag assembly in Berlin to approve the German invasion of Poland on September 1, 1939, openly stating in a telegraph to Hermann Göring: "... I am against war. ..." ' you know when a quote is four words long, starts in the middle of a sentence and both begins and ends with ellipses you're getting just the good stuff -- only what's important. real "No, money down!" lionel hutz hours. Just an incredible thing to have on a company website. https://www.thyssenkrupp.com/en/company/history/the-founding-families/fritz-thyssen-and-amelie-thyssen-and-anita-graefin-zichy-thyssen.html

Eric The Bed Humper.

Otto stressor in his book Hitler and I talked about the first thing that came out of his mouth upon meeting adolph at otto's and wifes house for dinner was nothing but the jews.

Pigeon

I guess the similarity is just a funny coincidence, but I couldn’t help but think of name of the “Japanese Amazon,” Rakuten. Like Amazon, Rakuten tries by various means to put itself and its data collection between us and everything we do online. It’s all good though, “rakuten” is Japanese for “optimism”

Ian H

The description of Hitler as totemic idiot at the dinner table really put me in mind of Epstein asking the cream of the 21st century imperial scientific consensus "What does that got to do with pussy?".

Nic Bodiford

Thanks for this one, Michael.

Bored at Work

The horror all the way. No one cares when it was libya but thank god ppl are calling out Palestine. Also I pay invoices that go to Otis elevator...I'm part of the problem.

recovering.slothrop

Working in a Internet of Things (IoT) company as They call it, has given me a perspective that makes natural sense in my mind now. Lightbulbs are already talking to each other. They light up the corpse of progress like a black Christmas tree. Really enjoyed the episode, sir! Awesome stuff.

Jaime Christley

Rare bit of good news: that piece of shit Stuart Seldowitz - who I learned about harassing the 83rd St Halal cart guy via your Twitter - has been arrested. Charges include aggravated harassment and hate crime stalking. The lobbyist firm he was consulting for not only 86'd him but offered to represent the cart dude pro bono, if he chose to sue. I know it's not a lot, but I'll take it.

Em

In an episode from a while ago (I can’t remember which, but you spoke about Gnosticism I think?) you mention something about science as aesthetics. It just popped into my head again and I remember thinking about it a lot at the time. Would love to hear more of your thoughts on that.

Ryan Diederich

Any thoughts on Dave Emory’s work?

Horseloverfat

Oh my word she’s from Germany, it’s a simple country and the people have [sublimated and exported the reich into a horrific new global formation]

Jacob garrison

I wonder if anyone on this site has read CHAOS? It has some tie in to a lot of shit that Michael says and ties into the CIA and JFKs assasination.

Danielle

Thank you ❤️

Bored at Work

My best friend's fiancé loves gravity's rainbow but repeatedly insists that neither her nor I who are half arab/N. african are brown. Like sir you are missing the whole point. His kids are going to be brown which is why I think he is in heavy denial.

Samwell Ganges

Man I've had such a rough year. Worked janitorial at the college I got my degree at, and listened to this pod while it was delivering the final critical hit on my back and shoulders. I've finally broken down. I've been unable to listen but keep paying patreon. I'm just too tired to really absorb these posts right now. There's so much gold in here, keep doing what you're doing MSJ

T. S.

Why the hell were you at a choptle in west lafayette lmao

ultraviolet sasquatch

Even knowing it was coming from the thumbnail, Old Bill has me sobbing on the bus stop. Now THAT'S a podcast

Ian H

From the wikipedia on Theodor Herzl's use of the slur mauschel for Eastern European Jews and the anti-semitism at the heart of political Zionism, a fascinating aside: "Herzl confided to his diary in 1895 that he saw himself as a 'man who makes aniline out of refuse.' The idea is elaborated on in his story, The Aniline Inn where it may be read as a cypher for Herzl's own conversion to Zionism. An innkeeper tells a professor on the verge of suicide that what saved him from a similar despair was an encounter with a needy labourer, to whom he gave some money. The worker told him that that at his workplace, worthless refuse – coal tar – was transformed into aniline dyes with their 'beautiful, radiant colours'. The clear implication is that to Herzl, Zionism would be manufacturing a useful product from human rubbish." 👁️

voteforjefe

I highly recommend Jimmy Falun Gong’s deep dive into the Krupp dynasty for anyone curious. He dilutes several books like “The Arms of Krupp” into a 10(ish?) part series

voteforjefe

It took me a while to get there, but one of the most important things I’ve realized in the past year was that Putin’s pre-invasion speech about denazifying Ukraine wasn’t about Azov, but NATO

NYCM&AHole

Unrelated - what’re your thoughts on mesa boogie dual rectifiers? I see you played Bogners. Even with the synergy platform. NGL jealous. Feel free to DM and I know it’s niche but I love the recording gear talk and if you did a podcast on that, I would also subscribe and give you more of my money.

spouter

You're really on a good tear with these recent episodes; the 4th Reich is a great framework to understand our world today. Relatedly, I hope you'll tackle the ways in which Israel fits into the fourth reich. I know that it can be risky to directly take on zionism as a fascist ideology, but I think it's important that you use your platform to do so. I don't know if you've come across the important book, Zionism in the Age of Dictators by Lenni Brenner, but the text is available for free on Marxists.org. On one level, it is intuitive that the Zionists would have worked to collaborate with the Nazis to "answer" the "jewish question" and many people might find the Zionist roots in antisemitism unsurprising, but by the end of the book I had formed a new understanding of Israel: I previously thought that the Jews had been given Israel as a recompense for the harms of the Holocaust, and now I understand that the founding of Israel was in fact the last stage of the Holocaust. The Nazis wanted both to kill Jews AND to create a white imperialist settler colony in Palestine. First they killed all the left and Communist Jews who would oppose it, and then the US and UK took over the Reich project and empowered the remaining hard-right Jews to enact the Nakba, which was the true culmination of the violence of the Holocaust. I think you could do a lot of good for the world by reading Brenner and covering this history on the show.

carllage

I think you might have killed Kissinger with these last posts MIchael

Bored at Work

I've seen several videos of this years deb ball for the richest of the rich and one girl broke down where their family fortunes come from and....you introduced me to the concept of the 4th reich and now i see it everywhere. The first deb in the breakdown video is from the african family that took power during/after the namibian genocide and some how it got worse from there. Nazis?? Yes. War profiteers? Yes. Opium trade? Yes. Just a who's who of misery and death spreaders.

Bored at Work

Bisan is posting an Mumtz are posting losing hope they thought that if we saw them as people we would help them. We treat them like the hunger games. Bisan is sick and moving to save her self and the people with her south and documenting all of it. shes asking what to do when she keeps being told to move south and then is filming active bombing in the south where the flyers are telling them to go. I have a meeting w/ my companies new investment plan and...i want to move my little money to whatever heroin sachrin family owns and lockhead martin. As an american, our culture is snake oil, cults, and Boeing/Lockhead Marting. If you cant beat ....no fuck them

NYCM&AHole

It is pronounced Tissin Krupp. That’s just zee Tschörmann pronunciation

Jake

I jumped out of my chair when you mentioned the West Lafayette Chipotle. I was there many times as an undergrad.

Jake

I'm a little behind on listening and I haven't actually finished the episode yet but I wanted to pop in to say that I: A) love the radio play bits and find them very funny, and B) have received the message and will carry out the mission Mashallah

Dogface Reilly

Michael I am also really grateful for this podcast, which I've just now discovered despite being a long-time Chapo and Trueanon follower. Why is that!?!

Protracted posters war

Hitler's table talk was actually originally edited and published by Francois Genoud and a group of Nazis who not only owned the publishing rights to Adolf Hitler and Martin Bormann's work but also constituted something called the "arabo-afrika gesellschaft" a front company for the BND which served to establish connections and funding for antimarxist wings of Arab and African National liberation organizations. They were also in contact with "the foreign research and development corporation" which by cross referencing a 1962 registry of foreign agents I found to be a CIA front company established by Eskrine Graves Blanchard. All of this information came directly from the CIA nazi war criminals archive because I don't think it exists anywhere else as most of the documents were released in the 2000s. Haven't been able to look into it too heavily but from what I've read they were involved with the FLN and they even had Ahmed Ben Bella the first president of Algeria (after a coup against the leftwing faction) in their custody during the Evian accords when he was supposedly in a French prison (according to Wikipedia) they were also responsible for funding the PFLP who Otto Skorzeny was also training but seemingly mostly through Waddie Haddad who conducted black September and was kicked out of the organization afterwards. On top of all of this they were very concerned about making sure Martin Bormann stayed dead so there would be no legal question about their rights to publish his writings.

aerides

I'm trying to listen to old episodes but I can not find part one of this one or the synthesis control one. I've scrolled looking and I can't find them listed nor an episode number nor a link.

Torgeir Tannenwald

At 42 minutes, listening to that part today gave me chills

Ollin

Just a technical critique - I think it was his father who changed his surname to hitler , which was also a family name, I think it was hiedler- and schiklegreuber was just the name of the biological father of the man who was not in the family but was more of a surrogate I think.

Iammax

Listening to an episode recorded almost two yrs. ago about an ostensibly purposefully overlooked and unthwarted PonziBoi as Trump 2.0 & Co. are right now literally robbing 'The Government' with 'receipts' for all the goddamned money they've adding up to heads cut from government/public sector jobs (plus some retarded fucking 'tariff equation', that i don't know enough about atm, but by all reports seems to be at best, simply retarded, and in reality, likely something that will have horrible repercussions for years to come) is really fucking somethin'. *We are laying a beautiful foundation for a beautiful, the most beautiful new America folks, let me tell you*

bouteilles de vin et polystyrène

I couldn't help but compare how fast Bezos,Cook, etc. have capitulated, and had to negotiate separately for trade; with Krüp/Thyssen actually running things.