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'And so they buried Hector, breaker of horses.'

Welcome back to the Trojan War, where the bloodshed is now reaching its heights and Homer's sublime epic draws to a melancholy close.

We're discussing the deaths of Patroclus and Hector, Achilles' return to the fight, wisdom from pain, the first audience's imagination, readerly battle fatigue, ancient burial customs, rage vs grief, how to confront our mortality, ekphrasis, regret, revenge, pride, love, and what happens after the events of the Iliad.

Please do feel free to enjoy the discussion even if you haven't read these parts of Homer's Iliad yet. You can enjoy our talk before, during, or after your reading in the way that best suits you.

Timestamps:

0:00 climax of Homer’s Iliad

1:00 the death of Patroclus

3:00 Homer’s tragic tradition

4:00 a pain that is a pleasure

5:00 instructive power of pain

6:00 love, literature, knowledge

8:00 vice of pleasure vs pain

9:00 fight for Patroclus’ body

11:00 Homer’s nature metaphors

13:00 Hector steals the armour

15:00 pride goes before the fall

16:00 first audience’s imagination

17:00 the theatre of the mind

18:00 Christopher Nolan’s Odyssey

19:00 the reader’s battle fatigue

20:00 Achilles learns the news

22:00 Hamlet vs Achilles

23:00 grief in Ancient Greece

24:00 the epic of Gilgamesh

25:00 how to confront mortality

27:00 rage vs grief of Achilles

28:00 ‘I loved him and killed him’

29:00 from regret to revenge

30:00 we die for what we live for

31:00 how to be your life’s hero

32:00 on overcoming deep grief

33:00 the appearance of Achilles

34:00 ‘fated to redden the earth’

36:00 the blacksmith Hephaestus

37:00 Homer’s influence on Milton

38:00 appreciating great ekphrasis

39:00 Keats’ ‘Ode on a Grecian Urn’

41:00 the new shield of Achilles

43:00 poets are creator gods

45:00 the artwork of weaponry

47:00 a world within a world

50:00 what is the power of art?

52:00 being motivated by loss

54:00 division of epics into books

55:00 Achilles & Agamemnon

57:00 Homer contains all stories

59:00 being blinded by delusion

1:00:00 idealised image of Achilles

1:02:00 the hero refuses to eat

1:04:00 what is your ashen spear?

1:06:00 chariot & horses of Achilles

1:08:00 the gods unleashed in battle

1:10:00 breath as divine life force

1:12:00 flesh, breath, directing mind

1:14:00 appreciating Virgil’s Aeneid 

1:16:00 Aeneas faces Achilles

1:18:00 bad luck comes knocking

1:20:00 Achilles kills Polydorus

1:22:00 eye for eye, tooth for tooth

1:24:00 no mercy shown to Lycaon 

1:26:00 revenge speech of Achilles

1:28:00 on the tragic & sublime

1:30:00 fighting the river Scamander

1:32:00 Homer’s ecological warning

1:33:00 the epic becomes apocalyptic 

1:35:00 the Trojans flee into the city

1:37:00 Hector flees from Achilles

1:39:00 realism in Homer’s epic

1:41:00 Achilles fights Hector

1:43:00 the death of Trojan Hector

1:45:00 dragged behind the chariot

1:47:00 Andromache’s lamentation

1:49:00 desecration vs honouring

1:50:00 Ancient Greek burial customs

1:52:00 Achilles dreams of Patroclus 

1:53:00 the Achaean funeral games

1:55:00 how does the Iliad end?

1:56:00 Priam’s meeting with Achilles

1:57:00 the final line of Homer’s epic

2:00:00 what happens after the Iliad?

2:02:00 how does Achilles die?

2:04:00 Trojan horse/fall of Troy

2:05:00 preparing for Homer’s Odyssey

2:06:00 Dumas’ The Three Musketeers

2:08:00 what did you make of the Iliad?

Resources to Explore:

  • Ancient Greek Pottery: I'm obsessed with the vases and urns of Ancient Greece. The artwork on these vessels is gorgeous and functions as historical record and storytelling. This video from Christies showcases some beautiful pottery from Sparta and Athens a couple of hundred years after Homer. This video from World History Encyclopaedia tells us about the history, development, and designs of the pottery. This video from the British Museum shows us a vase detailing a scene with Achilles and Ajax. And, if you want to go really deep into the subject, this lecture from archeologist and professor of classical art Dr. Tyler Jo Smith is fascinating. And for a compelling discussion about the artwork on the shields of Ancient Greek warriors, as detailed in Homer's Iliad, this video is excellent.

  • Film Appreciation: Did you manage to treat yourself to a viewing of the 2004 film Troy? If not, now would be a great time to give it a watch. Let us know what you think about this loose adaptation of the story. How would your perfect adaptation look? And do you have high hopes for the upcoming Christopher Nolan adaptation of the Odyssey? For fun, here are some clips from Troy: Achilles talks with Agamemnon, Menelaus vs Paris, Hector's farewell, Achilles vs Hector, the Trojan horse (not in the Iliad, of course). And, if you're as fascinated with the lost epics of Ancient Greece as I am, here's a funny video about the history of the Epic Cycle. What do you think it would have been like to have access to the entire story spread across multiple works?

  • Poetry: Did you enjoy the extended scene in which we see the blacksmith god Hephaestus forging the new armour of Achilles? W. H. Auden clearly enjoyed this part of Homer's epic, as it inspired him to pen this poem: 'The Shield of Achilles'. I also believe that the ekphrasis in John Keats' 'Ode on a Grecian Urn' had to have been inspired by the poetic detailing of the visual arts in this grand epic. For a fun exercise in appreciating Homeric influence, you could compare the creation of Achilles' shield with how Virgil details the forging of the shield of Aeneas. Speaking of shields, here is how one English jeweller rendered his vision of the shield of Achilles.

  • Epic Expansion: Now you've seen the heights of the Trojan War, you may find it rewarding to explore its consequences by reading Virgil's Aeneid (or earmarking it for the future). You'll be able to contrast and compare the difference between the Homeric/Greek epic tradition and its heroes and the Roman/Virgilian tradition. For translations of Virgil, I'm personally a fan of the Fagles and Fitzgerald renderings. Or, taking things backwards in time, you might like to check out the oldest epic hero and trace the origins of such sublime storytelling back to the Mesopotamian and Babylonian tradition with the Epic of Gilgamesh. You could also come much further forward in time via our previous lectures and dip into the epics of Dante or Milton well-armed to spot the Homeric allusions.

  • Translation: Which translation got your through Homer's Iliad for this read-through? And are their any other translations you're curious about trying in the future? You might like the idea of picking up another translation and saving it for a future reread. I'd recommend picking one that is radically different from the translation you just enjoyed. So, if you worked from the Lombardo or Wilson this time, you might go for the Fagles or Fitzgerald next. If you worked from either of them this time, you might choose the Chapman or Pope for a really different feel next time around. And, when we return to Homer with the Odyssey, will you stick with the same translator? Or will you test-drive another one?

  • Action Exercise: If you followed our previous action exercises, you would have committed at least one great passage to memory (even a few lines stored in your heart is incredible) and you would have tried to apply your favourite Homeric wisdom to your current hero's journey. On top of this, writing around the passage, either in a dedicated notebook or in the margins of your edition, is a great way to impress specific passages upon your mind. To take the challenge further, make it an aim to share your personal 'one passage,' with someone dear to you, either by directly reading it to them or figuring out a sneaky way to slip it into conversation (e.g. 'this is exactly the kind of thing that solicited the wrath of Achilles). Or share your favourite passage with us and get your fellow readers appreciating it with you. My winning formula for consolidating great poetry is this: read, reread, read aloud (slowly), apply to your life, share with loved ones.

  • Our Next Great Story: Congratulations on bringing yourself so powerfully to Homer's Iliad. You should feel incredibly proud of your achievement. We are now going to treat ourselves to a rip-roaring, swashbuckling adventure that couldn't have been born without Homer. This weekend coming, we will be moving into the next exciting part of our reading journey with our introductory 'how to read' video for Alexandre Dumas' The Three Musketeers. This read-through will give us breathing space to allow the homeric sublime to digest, and then, once we have enjoyed Dumas, we will return to Homer to journey through the Odyssey. In our intro video for The Three Musketeers, we will discuss everything from our practical approach, pacing, and translation to themes, genre, socio-historical context, and much more. You don't need to read anything just yet, so, if you like to keep in line with our lectures, use the time to wrap up the Iliad. But, if you are keen to dive into Dumas' novel, you may want to kick things off by reading the author's preface and the first chapter. I will be working from the Penguin edition in paperback translated by Richard Pevear, but the Lawrence Ellsworth is also a phenomenal translation, and you also have the first translation into English available from Everyman's library. As always, feel free to use the edition that you like and that comes most easily to hand. I am tremendously excited to share this next appreciation with you and am so grateful that you have made our read-throughs for the first half of the year so rewarding.

Questions to Consider:

1) What did you make of the epic's ending?

2) How can you be the hero of your own life?

3) What is your greatest takeaway from battling through the Iliad?

4) What area connected with Homer are you most interested in?

5) How would you persuade another to read Homer's epic? And what advice would you give to facilitate a meaningful reading experience?

And please do share with us your impressions, favourite passages, and personal insights from the end of the Iliad.

Congratulations on reading Homer's Iliad, everybody!

Files

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Comments

Paul Fincher

I would like to offer up my opinion on translations. I read the Feagles two years ago and it was good and had great information. Read the Wilson translation this time and for me it was easier to read and more enjoyable. Looking forward to her translation of The Odyssey.

Dayna

I can’t believe I actually finished this. Never thought I would read Homer and before this book club, I would have never picked this up. I really came around to enjoying this read in the last third of the book. Thank you Ben for the wonderful lectures and to all the club members for your great insights and conversation.

Andrew

Hello literature fans . I’m up at the Edinburgh Fringe and I can heartily recommend this show . Anyone else up here enjoying the shows ? I’m sat here in a famous U.K. book store cafe with a copy of the remarkable “Let us believe in the beginning of the cold season” by Forough Farrokhzad Happy reading friends 🙂 https://edfest.com/whats-on/achilles-death-of-the-gods

Svetlana Monroe

I honestly can’t say Iliad was the best book I read or even that it was gripping -I made myself go through it, rewarding myself with marking poetic passages, hillarious epithets – hillarious on their own and especially when they appear in contrast to violent subtext. But it grew on me, to the point that I came back to reread earlier chapters. I read it in Russian translation, and those hillarious moments are just not present in english. Nothing is funny about “ But the other trojans and the well-greaved ahaens fought in the open air with sharp sunlight around them and not a cloud over the mountains or plains”. But if you read russian you will not help but smile at the same: «рати другие троянцев и меднодоспешных ахейцев Бились спокойно под ясным эфиром. Кругом разливались Ясного солнца лучи; ни следа не виднелось тумана Ни на земле, ни в горах. С передышкой сражалися люди». Or the innocent english “ Hector, stepping into his well-made house, didn’t see his wife inside” next to hillarious “Гектор внутри не увидел своей непорочной супруги»… Of course, Ben’s insights were most refreshing and treasured, the reading would not be the same without the lectures.

Danny

What do Russians find humorous about that scene? I put it in google translate and apparently the Russian humor just doesn't translate to English—or else google translate sucks.

cliff freeman

Achilles in The Iliad according to Monty Python: "I'm not dead yet!".

Mike DiMartino

Thank you Ben for another great lecture series! The Iliad has been on my to read list for years and these talks have really helped my appreciation of it. The biggest surprise was just how violent and gory some of the action descriptions are. Overall enjoyed the read and looking forward to the Odyssey.

Tiffany

What is your greatest takeaway from battling through the Iliad? I finished The Iliad a bit ago, and I decided to listen to it on audio while reading so I could hopefully get a bit more motivated to finish. My greatest takeaways are more personal than anything related to the text at this time: 1). I realize that I am not really interested in reading epic poems. I have tried to do this in the past with other readings, and I struggle to get through them. I struggle with reading poems in general, so this makes sense. But, knowing people like either the Odyssey or The Iliad more, I am hoping to enjoy the Odyssey more. When I do start it, I am going to listen to the audio as I read, as this helped me tremendously. 2). I am not really interested in reading about war and battles. This doesn't appeal to me at all. This epic just solidified it. I don't really enjoy battle movies either, so I know to avoid these in the future. 3). I do appreciate The Iliad as a historic artifact. It is so thrilling to think about reading the words from thousands of years ago to see slices of life and beliefs of ancient people.

NicoleA

It feels great to have finished The Iliad. I loved how I felt rather battle-weary at times when reading the long lists of characters or deaths. I loved how Homer doesn't ask us to take sides. I have learnt that in a battle, war or argument there are no winners. And in a world that currently seems to constantly be demanding us to take sides, I find it refreshing.

Valentina

This reminds me of when Faulkner says in the Sound and Fury “no battle is ever won, they are not even fought…the field only reveals to man his own folly and despair and victory is an illusion of philosophers and fools”.

Kim B

Thank you so much for these lectures. I have participated in book groups through the years and always felt at a deficit next to the English majors and avid literature readers, and I always felt that I was missing at a deficit going into books, reading blindly. My degree is in Political Science, not English, and there is SO MUCH I do not know about the world of literature. With your lectures I really love that I can start a book with some back story of the author, some historical context, and some understanding of where these books and authors fit into the long history and fabric of writing, authors drawing on authors from centuries prior and continuing stories and creating conversation. I have learned far more than I imagined I would, and I am so grateful. At the outset of this year I wondered if I would enjoy the Metamorphoses, The Iliad, and The Odyssey. Would it be too much? No, it has proved to be endlessly entertaining, captivating, provoking. I enjoy how you bring our common humanity into the readings. The Iliad was such a wild ride. The Gods' and Goddesses' interplay with human affairs was so intriguing. A chess game in war for humans, and another one played out with Gods plus the interplay between the two. The graphic violence was surprising to me, but the inclusion of human emotion in the time of war and as a result of loss really made this whole work so timeless. I asked myself at times which side I was supposed to be on, but later which side I was on. I couldn't choose. Both were wronged. Both had legitimate issues. We humans still have not learned. So beautiful! I read the Lombardo translation and dipped into the Wilson translation at times. I would love to read Wilson's translation sometime and another as well. As you had said, it's a good idea to return to Homer every year. I probably won't return every year, but I will over time.