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Gotland Class SSK (A19) (Patreon)

Published:
2019-09-07 20:00:02
Edited:
2020-04-25 09:41:40
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Videos

Content

**Correction** the Subs speed is 20kts submerged not surfaced.  11 knots is surfaced transit speed.

The history, development, construction, operation and mid-life upgrade of Sweden's Gotland Class submarines.  In 1995, the United States Navy designated the new AIP diesel boats SSP (for AIP systems).  Most Navies refer to it as an SSK (hunter killer).

Files

Gotland 2019.MP4

This is "Gotland 2019.MP4" by Jive Turkey on Vimeo, the home for high quality videos and the people who love them.

Comments

Adrian Johansson

Actually HMS Näcken got an AIP section in 1988 during her MLU

Aaron Amick

AIP means a lot of things. The USS Nautilus had AIP in the 50's. Americans call it a Reactor.

Adrian Johansson

She does 20 knots submerged and 11 knots surfaced like all swedish post war submarines shes faster under water

Aaron Amick

She does 20 knots submerged on the battery. Not Diesel or AIP.

Adrian Johansson

Aip is 5 knots but the knew A26 class get 3 Stirling engines instead of the two on Gotland

Adrian Johansson

But she cant do 20 knots on the surface. In 1981 HMS Neptun a Näcken class sub had was getting outrun by a Soviet Tugboat that tried to pull a Soviet Whiskey class off the rocks outside the Naval base in Karlskrona. Its not the same sub but its the same hull type

Aaron Amick

My source has AIP at 9.3 knots submerged.

Aaron Amick

I think I mixed up the slide surface and submerge numbers.

William C Rather

Great job as always Jive. I first started following you when you were featured in The War Zone for your whiteboards. I quickly became a Patreon after that. I considered dropping off since you slowed down on those and watching you play videogames just isn't my thing. But I am glad I didn't as these sub briefs are more than worth my small contribution.

Alexander

Hey Jive, what is your opinion on the vulnerability of the US CVBG of today. Considering capacities and ongoing improvements in the Area of conventional submarines on the one Hand. And the seemingly obvious reduction in ASW-Assets by all NATO-States but most importantly the US Navy. I mean did the Two years of "embarrassment" by the Gotland, gave the Navy sufficient Data to compensate the loss of the S-3 Viking, all Oliver Hazard Perry-class frigates, all Spruance-class destroyers and if I am correct a replacement rate from P-3 to P-8 of 3 to 1. Point is during the Cold War the NATO Ground forces in Europe were more or less one big Anti-Tank Force aiming at the Fulda Gap. And there equivalent at sea a giant ASW-Fleet to guard the Atlantic. I ‘m not worried about the russians to much but considering the State of my Navy a strong Allied one would calm me down a lot. As always a long one form me sorry for that. Thanks another great one and bear with me Alex

Adrian Johansson

Read that source again 5 knots is 9.3 km/h. The stirling engines are much weaker than diesels. I suspect the A26 will do maybe 7 knots with its third stirling engine. Or do a slow battery charge at 5 knots

Joseph Orr

TY Jive for another excellent video. Is it just me or do all of your sub instructional videos have frequent pixelized whiteout breaks? Its not terrible but it is a bit annoying. Maybe its a Vimeo issue. Audio is fine throughout.

Aaron Amick

Thank you for sticking with me while I figured out what to do with my Patreon. I was close to shutting this down because I wasn't sure what to do with it. But, now we have a purpose.

Aaron Amick

I think our CVBG is still very vulnerable. The lesson learned by the Gotland experience seem to have been forgotten. Admiralty egos seem to be larger than corrective action would demand. Flag Officers like Big ships and they will sacrifice the small ships to keep them.

Aaron Amick

woah, good catch. Damn Google images, never trust a google search.

El Portal24

Diesel subs don't get me excited, This new Diesel Electrics still just sit around mostly on the bottom hoping someone passes over them. Yes, the are the ultimate stealth - But boring. great video. Tell me something Captain... If one of these boats is sitting on the bottom all silent, and a drone flies over it within the thermal layer, will an active ping detect it.

El Portal24

BTW, those old USS Nautilus, Seawolf did some amazing things all polar, even ice bases. The Trident trip around the world, the Skipjack... All Amazing Boats deserving of an episode, just a tought.

Aaron Amick

It is possible to detect a diesel boat on the bottom with active sonar.

Aaron Amick

It's something to do with the Vimeo service. My master video are not pixeling, but I do see what you are talking about. I don't have a solution yet.

Chronus

Thanks Jive! I enjoyed the Gotland Class briefing. Hey what do you think about doing a segment on AIP overall, past, present, and future of the technology?

Dennis Mitchell

As usual Jive very well done "Brief". Thank you.

Alexander

Sad but universal through all western services! Hopefully it works the same way for our potential adversaries. Littel side note to that my Navy just commissioned there first new F 125 classe frigate with a 4 years delay. Just to realize that the land-based training facilities are not going to be ready befor 2025!!! LOL Thank you for the quick Answer be safe Alex

Tuning3434

Question raised on one of the other channels I've subscribed on: How would the Battle of the Atlantic part II in the Cold War play out? And is it possible to define periods where NATO vs Warschau pact would have the undeniable advantage?

Aaron Amick

Warsaw pact had the naval advantage in the mid 1960's. 1963-1967. That had more subs and better weapons. That was very dangerous time for America and NATO.

Allen

Jive, great brief! And your absolutely correct that we (in the US Military) need to give more attention to the defeats in our wargames. A winning formula works​ until it doesn't.

Tuning3434

Weird, cause this I only notice this on your uploads on Vimeo. Maybe some render setting?

Jeffrey Allan

Not an expert on swedish pronunciation by any means but as far as I know Nykvist is pronounced like Nyquil. All in all great brief

Tuning3434

Thank you for the swift reply, my good sir. Do you dare to elaborate on the kind of advantages? Better missile/ cruise missile capability. Or just better anti-shipping torpedoes? I can imagine that in the pre-nuclear age all subs where basically on par before the Thresher/Permit and Sturgeon came into service in numbers. Or where those early nuclear submarines mostly capable in range instead of anit-shipping performance?

arash

Thanks to you I'm learning to love all kinds of submarines, as a kid I was a space junkie but to be honest submarines are much more fascinating than ISS

Conor Wright

Hey Jive, random question. Can you make a video on your experiences (if you have any) with USOs? By this I mean, during your time patrolling on the 688 class, did you ever pick up any strange sonar readings or things that couldn’t be explained by conventional theory. Given the recent interest in UFOS and the “Storm Area 51 Movement,” I was curious if you ever encountered anything. Thanks!

Aaron Amick

I will do that on the YouTube channel. Free for Everyone.

Joseph Orr

No worries, the content is great. Today's was very informative (on YouTube). It's the same PQS layout we have in Naval Aviation. We had less time to learn the aircraft, but that's because there's less of it!

Loka

Thanks for the Brief - I'd just like to point out that as much that I'd wish that 2.2B SEK are the same as 2.1B USD (that would make my vacations abroad sooo much cheaper), it's actually not :( Divide the SEK by 10 and you have it in dollars, so 2.2B SEK is 220M USD.

Aaron Amick

oh, man. I put too many zeros in the SEK to $ converter.

pin_die

Obviously you have played the boat in More Subs mod. Tried it again recently and it made stealth in 2000s easy (while not particularly impressing me with passive sonar, it seems to be a great boat for anti surface needs). My question is: is the boat in game overpowered?

Mats Karlsson

Its more like Nyii-quist. /Mats native Swede.

Chronus

Hey Jive, great Gotland Class Brief, thank you! What are your thoughts on the type 032 class from China? Looks interesting, like a do-all submarine. 2x SLBM's, 4x VLS, 1x53cm and 1x65cm. Diesel, AIP. I figure they'll just spam those left and right.

Johnny B

Huge fan of these videos- never thought I’d be this invested in submarine warfare coming from the ground side of things!

Aaron Amick

Not all submarines have all of those components, but each of those systems are becoming more popular on future subs.

Roger Wanhainen

I joined in just to see this video of the Gotland. Money well spent. A correction 2.1 billion SEK is 216.8 million USD.

Aaron Amick

Yeah, I screwed up the conversion. Good catch.

Seahour

Awesome brief Jive! So this sub could do its whole underway under water? So this is like a cheaper easier way for not having to be reliant on the atmosphere? Just without the 20+ year fuel lifespan of nuclear power? Sounds almost to good to be true, or is the technology not quite there yet?

R Lee Hawkins

His name spelled phonetically is Yens (not Gens) Ny-Quist

Kevin L

...late to the party. Great brief! ...but a missed opportunity of having Abba playing softly in the background.

TheFreaker86 .

Jens is pronounced like a "Yes" just add the letter N. Or basically swap out the J for the Y.

Aaron Amick

Thank you, my pronunciation is the worst. I need to find an app to help with these names.

Jess Stuart

Awesome video, as usual! :) Slight correction. Sterling engines work by using some external heat source, but are not combustion engines. While Sterling engines have pistons, creating pressure by combusting the fuel does not move the piston. In a combustion engine, the fuel is burned internally, in the piston tube, and the explosion forces the piston to move. In a Sterling engine, the fuel is burned to produce heat outside of the piston tube.

Jan Negrey

It is cool and in a way cheaper and "easier" way to stay submerged and powered. There are however 2 major drawbacks - assuming you get rid of other problems. 1. Is very slow speed. Different AIP's have a maximum speed of 4-6 kts. and their Autonomy varies between 14 and 30 days. Remember I am using Open Sources. And not the newest ones. I don't remember which Sub did this, but I think they continuously traveled on AIP for 17 days, from (I think) near Azores to near of East Coast of US (which given that they didn't submerge right after leaving the port, nor did they emerge in Hudson River, actually agrees with calculation of 2040 nautical miles that 5 knots over that time would give you). 2. They still require fuel. While Sterling engine operates on temperature difference, if you were the crew hugging cylinder, while the other end was cooled by Water, then a) you'd induce hypothermia in your crew if b) you'd get any decent efficiency. I doubt you'd get enough to power basic systems. So you still need a heat source - usually burning some kind of gasoline/oil to make that difference big enough to generate sensible amount of energy. Almost all, if not all AIP's use the AIP engines to charge the Batteries and sail on electrical power. Which is why some (like newest of Japanese Soryu, and also the South Korean subs) are switching back to conventional drive with a lot of newer and better batteries (Li-Ion before weren't used on subs, because they have some drawbacks). For the moment it won't be better in longevity compared to AIP's, but given how much those countries are investing in new Batteries technology there may come a point - and it will be sooner rather than later - hopefully, that they will be superior to AIP's. Because then between the recharging the sub will make no mechanical sound. For now there is a reason why those types of ships are built with Ocean going capability, but are mostly operating within close proximity to home - like Baltic Sea, Ryukyu Islands, and North Korean waters with some capability to go and "visit" Chinese ports in Qingdao and the one in Liaoning province. Think North and West of North Korea. I've read on the subject extensively, but it was 2 years ago, so take the numbers with a hefty pinch of salt. If you want I can re-check the article and sources.

Ben Baselet

Slight correction. If you plan on correcting others how something works it's a good idea to first learn to type the name correctly if you want to appear more knowledgeable than whoever it is you are trying to correct. It's stirling, not sterling.

Adrian Johansson

Kockums Shipyard in Malmö was shut down several years ago.

Johan karlström

Really interesting video. Just noticed an error with the upgrade cost at runtime 17:50. 2.1 Billion SEK is approximately 235 Million dollars, not 2.2 Billion. just a small detail, but i wanted to point it out.

The Junkerer

I was accually on a guided tour at a swedish naval base back in -99 (must have been 99) and the last step in that tour was a guided your onboard the HMS Halland, one of the subs mentioned above. It was awesome to see. Got to take a look through the periscope. There were some areas cornered off that were "secret". We didn´t get to see the torpedo room. But that didn´t matter since I got to pierce through the periscope in night vision. That was one awesome day.

Peter Riedel

have been working on them when I was working on one off the shipyards

Craig

Used in modern warfare? What war has Sweden been involved in?

Paul D Berkebile

I just finished this brief and the one on the German Type 212. Next, I got the latest issue of the USNI magazine "Proceedings," (the Oct. 2020 issue) and found an interesting article on AIP and lithium ion batteries on submarines. It was written by 2 Spanish Navy officers. This issue also has several other submarine articles in it--the October issue emphasizes sub warfare. Quite interesting!

Clive Dorer

Technically the first AIP boat was the Nacken (generation between Vastergotland and Sjoormen) which was extended during refit and had Stirling Mk1 inserted. She was operational used as such. although I guess its fair to say Gotland was the first AIP as-built boat - of the modern era, I'll avoid being a pedant around the Russian Quebecs etc.

Joonas Karhunen

Great review! Allthought one little detail bothered me - the FMV logo in the beginning was one of Turkish educational institute instead of Swedish Defence Material Administration ;)

Axel Kanne

What are the advantages/disadvantages of different sonar array configurations, like Gotland's cylindrical array vs a spherical array?

Aaron Amick

Great question: Analog beams are raw data from the array. Analog is best audio. Analog beams only look where the array is physically pointed.

Aaron Amick

so, a sphere that looks in all directions can produce the highest quality audio without digital beam steering.

Aaron Amick

digital beam steering is required to look up and down in a cylindrical array. It's basically the difference between a vinyl record and a CD audio file.