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Radio War Nerd EP #401 — Hamas's Surprise Invasion of Israel (Patreon)

Published:
2023-10-07 23:36:05
Edited:
2023-10-08 18:21:30
Imported:
2023-10
Tags:

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Content

Recorded: October 7, 2023

In this emergency episode, we discuss today's surprise attack by Hamas into Israel, just hours into the invasion, to make sense of why Hamas invaded their far stronger enemy and what they stand to gain & lose...

Previous RWN episodes on Gaza, Israel & Palestine:-EP #281 — Late-Stage Zionism & Israel-Palestine Wars, feat. Max Blumenthal-EP #280 — Israel's War on Gaza, 2021 -EP   #92 — The 2006 Israel-Hezbollah War, feat. Amal Saad-EP   #54 — Syria War Propaganda + 2014 Gaza War with Max Blumenthal 

Total time:48:42

Direct link to this episode's mp3 here 

Subscribe to Radio War Nerd at patreon.com/radiowarnerd

Sound production by Telescope Audio

Check out the Radio War Nerd Merch store here!

*Buy John Dolan's comic memoir "Pleasant Hell" now available in both audio and ebook  format.

Files

Comments

Ander Pierce

Reason #401 why RWN is the best podcast to have a sub to

Demented Avenger

I get Tet vibes from this offensive, and I'll have to tune in to see if that's right

Ilya Fishman

Get Blumenthal on here to talk about how rape of Israeli civilians is justified. Smh

A

This offensive is really making the genocidal Zionists come out of the woodwork. All of the sudden, when Palestinians actually fight back and succeed the mask comes completely off and now it's impossible to share a country with them and they need to be eradicated.

Erik

Damn, I guess the Allies shouldn’t have liberated Europe because some of their soldiers raped civilians.

Ilya Fishman

HAMAS isn't about liberty. They're about theocracy and genocide.

Ilya Fishman

Gaza is about to be Artsakh-ed.

Ilya Fishman

Gaza's birth rate is consistently higher than Turkey and Egypt. Some genocide lmao

Erik

Israel’s literally a country run by religious hicks who’ve been ethnically cleansing the indigenous population for the last 70 years. There’s your theocracy and genocide.

Demented Avenger

Places where Neo-Nazis hang out: * Hunka in the Canadian parliament * Azov in eastern Ukraine * Ilya Fishman in the comments

Doug Cartel

Man I miss when Blumenthal was just a troll and not a fuckin maniac

A

I hope you realize this same argument is used by Holocaust deniers, but I assume you don't mind having bedfellows such as those.

Doug Cartel

idk, I could read that as cynicism if it was a discord server

Ilya Fishman

Jews are indigenous to Syria Palestina. But who cares about that, right?

Ilya Fishman

Lmao yeah bro I'm a neo-nazi. And you're a Stalinist/Hamasnik. Right?

Demented Avenger

Hamasnik? Really? WTF? But you're the one cheering on genocide here. But I'm giving you too much credit. You're a troll, a dummy account with a made-up name that's implied to be Israeli or at least Jewish to give you faux ethnic credibility and deployed by some three-letter agency (or whatever the non-US equivalent of the three letter agencies is) against some random podcast your agency has decided to monitor. (Your name could be Thomas Bourne III for all I know. That's a more-likely option than "Ilya Fishman.") I now realize that Azov and Hunka were at least brave enough to take up arms against a fearsome foe, the Russian/Soviet army. You'd shit your pants if some guy in an alley waved brass knuckles from 50 feet away.

Ilya Fishman

See Erik, people like you don't care that the Palestinian Arabs have been used solely as attack dogs against Israel for 70 years. You don't care that Iranian Ayatollahs are behind this latest round of fighting. Will the Palestinian people benefit? Who cares as long as the Yahood are dumped into the sea. What happens after?;

Miko

Guys, thanks for putting this emergency episode together on such short notice. Hope the dental adventures wind down soon with a minimum of discomfort.

ploob

Sequestering/forceable removal is also a form of genocide.

Ilya Fishman

Hahaha I'm an Ashkenazi Jew from Zhitomir Ukraine. Been in a US citizen for 20 years. But how quickly you accuse me of being a shill for an agency. You think ANY agency would 'monitor' this podcast? It used to be interesting when it covered history. Now it's just sucking off Putler.

Ilya Fishman

Jerk off to the Hunka incident. You're the one cheering on a rapist gang as 'liberators'.

ploob

👎 Can't wait to see what you have to say once the IDF response shakes out.

A

Some real "global Jewish (Islamic) conspiracy" vibes coming from Ilya here. Hate to see it. But it is funny how the Zionists seem to mimic their past genociders so well.

Ilya Fishman

The Shia axis has been telegraming about this for months. It's pretty obvious what's going on. Not my fault if you're blind and biased AND want the Palestinian Arabs to suffer because HAMAS officials need to get that sweet Qatari cash

Demented Avenger

Sure, you're an Ashkenazi Jew from Zhitomir, Ukraine. I totally believe you, Mr. Bourne. But you've been monitoring this podcast, and it always covered current events as well as history. Like the Uighur situation in the Xinjiang, the Kashmir clampdown in 2019, Pakistani elections in 2018, and the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict that you referenced to start this thread. I would hope that someone would be monitoring this podcast for filthy lucre; someone who would waste his time here without getting money really is a loser.

A

Chill out there Himmler you might have a stroke. I know it's your duty defend the master race in the comments of some obscure history podcast but maybe lay off the coke a bit.

Ilya Fishman

Have you ever farted into a puddle? That's this comment.

Ilya Fishman

Once again - farting into a puddle

A

Once again. Just more enraged responses. Is this what you do with your time? I'm sure the IDF thanks your bravery fighting the good fight in the RWN comment section.

Alex Muir

This has got to be one of the greatest intelligence fails since the Trojan Horse, surely... But maybe the failure was more from the political apparatus, not the intelligence services - there's a great 2012 documentary called "The Gatekeepers" on Israel's internal security service Shin Bet, in which six former heads are interviewed. They're a very depressed group of men, knowing as they do the consequences of Israel's harsh occupation of Palestine but unable to persuade anyone in power to change policy, despite the Oslo Accords signed in 1993. It also goes into some detail about how Shin Bet was aware of the impending assassination of Prime Minister Rabin in 1995 but all warnings were ignored by the politicians & other state actors... Maybe something similar happened here?

Demented Avenger

Meaning, the politicians didn't care what the Shin Bet said since it didn't fit with their preconceived policy, or they DID care what the Shin Bet said and wanted it to happen for their own nefarious ends?

Ander Pierce

Not trying to be a dick, I don't remember them being in the woodwork in the first place. You have parades with folks chanting "Death to all Arabs", spraying Palestinian domiciles with skunk water etc. it's not like it's socially or politically dangerous to loudly speak in support of genocidal policy. It's a long and ongoing conflict, and it will be interesting to see how it unfolds.

Andrew

Thanks guys, starting the episode now… couldn’t wait for your opinions and you didn’t make me

Alex Muir

I'd go for stupidity & incompetence being to blame rather than evil genius in organizing an elaborate conspiracy that this would have to be, but that's just my personal prejudice...

A

But those people were never put on media channels and people in power in the west, especially political influencers, were never outwardly pro-apartheid. They always feigned ignorance or covered it in language they gave them plausible deniability. Now media figures in the US and the west are just outright calling for mass killings and occupation. Even more so, left-liberals who had tacit "support" for Palestinians have let the mask completely fall and are showing their true colours, which is full support for Israel. Yeah, you're right that these elements have always existed, but they have never become outwardly mainstream among political media channels. Now they have.

ploob

The ANAList one slaps tho

Ilya Fishman

Lmao. Peace and prosperity. Ever heard of dhimmi status? Sure Medieval Europe was worse but that doesn't mean that Dar al-Islam was always better. HAMAS is a corrupt, thieving organization which steals aid.

Ilya Fishman

I'm pro culling idiots like you.

Ilya Fishman

You're a liberator of Palestine to make sure an Iranian backed theocracy rules there. Good for you.

Ilya Fishman

Shit I cannot be a long - time listener can I? Must be a spook. Lmao. What a joke

Ilya Fishman

There are fewer Jews now than in the 30s you utter fuckstick. Compare the Arab population of Palestine now to 1946.

A

Ilya just making things up at this point. It must be frustrating to try and hold such opinions. I know it's hard to justify them.

Ilya Fishman

Shoot your children. UNRWA is strong with you isn't it?

Ilya Fishman

They do. Cashed my check today.

Ilya Fishman

I agree. 17 years of NetanyaHOO policy of making fake deals with illegitimate potentates around the Middle East instead of fixing the conflict at home.

A

Calling victims of the genocide you support corrupt and thieving.... Hmmm Himmler, you're getting a bit TOO on the nose here. And no, I don't mean the coke, but you should still lay off it.

Ilya Fishman

Dw fam. The swamp is about to be drained. Ayatollah whores and their HAMAS/Hezbollah dogs are about to be hided.

A

Yes we know you get off on pogroms and ethnic cleansing, you don't need to keep demonstrating that to us Himmler.

Ilya Fishman

Yah thieving aid from their constituency. Making sure the ONLY way to prosper in Gaza is through HAMAS. But again you don't give a flying fuck about the Palestinian Arabs. To you they're just matches to burn in your faux-liberation fantasies.

Ilya Fishman

You can call me any name from Milosevic to Dracula. Still won't change the fact that EVERY Arab government has shat on the Palestinians. Their job is to die in the name of Arab/Ayatollahs' hatered of Israel.

A

Himmler, I know you want to convince the red army not to support the Warsaw uprising but don't you think arguing that they're just using the Jews as matches to burn is a little much?

Ilya Fishman

They used Poles as matches though. Armija Krajova for example. Red army supported the Warsaw Ghetto uprising?! Lmao I assume you have no source for that info right, Jeffrey Dahmmer?

Ilya Fishman

Bet you saw that photo of a mutilated Jewish/German woman on the back of a HAMAS truck being spat on, and got a massive Free Palestine boner. Right Jeffrey Dahmmer?

A

Exactly right Himmler. This is why the western allied and red army should not interfere in our affairs. We're just trying to cleanse our country if these THIVING and CORRUPT and violent Jews! Look at them fight back! Look how violent they are when they resist our oppression!

Demented Avenger

Jewish population of Palestine, 1931: 174,610 Jewish population of Israel, 2021: 7.145 million The Israeli population has really fled in the last two years!

Ilya Fishman

The red army didn't support the Jews. Jewish Partisans were often killed by Stalin's army. The Allies avoided doing anything about the Holocaust. Remember Mr.Dahmmer, the British limit on Jewish immigration to Mandatory Palestine? The mandate which the League of Nations granted them to create a Jewish national homeland. But I'm sure you believe no human is illegal. Unless they're Jews escaping a genocide. Your idea of a liberated Palestine is a terror state with HAMAS at the helm, Mr.Dahmmer.

Ilya Fishman

Mr.Dahmmer, your rape cult will not win in Palestine.

A

Incredible work Himmler. The best way to get our enemies to stop aggression towards our country and to stop them from foiling our final solution for the Jews, we must convince them that THEY are actually the real anti-semites, that they are really the ones who do not like the Jews! Yes indeed this will sow discord between them surely, then we can focus on our plans! Seriously though. You are not good at this. Dahmer? Really? That doesn't even make sense. If you're going to troll, atleast TRY.

Ilya Fishman

D fuq are you on with this comment? Jews were Nakba-ed out of every Muslim country right after 1948. Plus ex-USSR Jews. It's called immigration

Ilya Fishman

You think libration of Palestine is through rape and mutilation of civilians. Would you prefer Son of Sam? Chikatilo?

Jared Marnin

Something about Hannas tunnels 🫤 🙊

Ilya Fishman

The best way to stop aggression is what the IDF will do to the 'resistance axis' in the next week or so.

A

The allied soldiers are raping and murdering their way across Germany! The horror! The barbarity! You are correct Himmler, this is no civilized way to fight, unlike our glorious master race!

Ilya Fishman

You're 💯 right. Rape is barbaric. If your standard for 'glorious master race' is no rape in war, you really must be a rare POS.

A

Exactly right Himmler. This is why I love you. You know that the German army is civilized, clean, and most of all, very responsive and considerate to Innocents.

Ilya Fishman

The Whermacht raped and mutilated too. You should know this. You doubtless wank to it all the time. The Mufti of Jerusalem sure did! Make sure to wipe off with an authentic Herbawi keffiyeh you puddle of pig jizz.

A

HIMMLER, YOU ARENT SUPPOSED TO TELL THEM THAT! You are only supposed to call the allies the rapists and mutilators!!! Get back on track, you were doing so well!

Ilya Fishman

It's ok. IDF will take care of Gaza very soon. Full liberation. Maybe the Saudis will get it as an offering. They need a Mediterranean port.

A

Yes Himmler. Full liberation. The FINAL solution.

Ilya Fishman

Finally got it Mr.Dahmmer! Time to liberate the Palestinian Arabs from HAMAS and the Ayatollah whores. Enough of the rape of Palestine!

A

Correct Himmler. We will liberate the east from the judeo-bolshevik yoke. Then commence the FINAL solution.

Ilya Fishman

From the river to the sea baby. Just like Sheih Yassin always taught! Inshallah!

Karl Childers

good lord man, citing the palestinian birth rate as a genocide defense, just ... you could at least try to be subtle about it, you might even convince some people if you toned back the obvious psychotic hatred by like 10%

grey

Settle down fishman. Nobody said that.

grey

"Nimrod Aloni" hahaha 'Nice Going Nimrod!'

Robert McHugh

Artsakh-ed? So you admit Israel will be carrying out an ethnic cleansing in Gaza?

No

♫One night upon my motorcycle through the desert sped♫

No

Warsaw Ghetto Tet Offensive Hang Glider Uprising

No

There's a video of probably the most Israeli thing ever which is a desert rave festival going on near the Gaza fence, and there's explosions in the background and people are still dancing. It's arrogance more than complacency. That said, where do you practice motorised hang gliding in Gaza without anyone noticing?

a clash of purple

Based on the success of this counter-offensive, I think it's time the U.S. started providing critical military aid to the Palestinian people to support them in their defensive war against the unprovoked aggression of Israel. The Israeli regime's claims that they are only invading Gaza in order to remove extremist elements are a transparent excuse for a mad land grab, unprecedented and inexcusable in the post-WWII era. If the U.S. isn't going to bring Palestine on as a NATO partner to safeguard their sovereignty, the least we can do is arm these brave fighters against imperialist aggression. Seriously, the contrast between the treatment of Palestine and the treatment of Ukraine is really something to behold. Zelenskyy is expressing support for the Israeli regime! He might as well cheer the Russian army on for battling against dangerous radical elements in Ukraine! Disgusting.

Ilya Fishman

I have a better job than you.

William

Does this have a tet offensive effect in some way?

Jared Marnin

No, “Artsakhed” is bad because Muslim Azeris do it to innocent Christians; but also Israel is not implicated in its drone sales to Azerbaijan. Please pick up on the Hasbara nuances 🙃

Karl Childers

i'm just guessing same as anybody but imo it's not a good analogy, at the time of the tet offensive the north vietnamese already had a full scale traditional army fully equipped and deployed, hamas has pulled some novel & bold tactics here but unless their military infrastructure is like an order of magnitude more sophisticated than anyone has yet suspected i find it hard to imagine how this results in anything other than severe reprisal from israel (although as mentioned on the episode, the morale victory for palestinians here is not to be underestimated)

Doug Cartel

Rumor is that Mossad has been observing Hamas training with paragliders for about eight years now, which gives off a lot of "mass shooter was under police surveillance for years" vibes

Ilya Fishman

Congratulations on 600+ dead Israelis you utter puddle of pig wank. Hope you don't rub your pecker raw jerking off to 'falastin'.

Ilya Fishman

There's no genocide. Their birth rates are higher than in Turkey in Gaza. Lmao. What was the birth rate in Dachau? At Shark Island in Namibia? Citing statistics that show population expansion to prove no genocide is literally the most obvious evidence.

Ilya Fishman

They're already ending HAMAS rule in Gaza. Inshallah the Yahood army will also end Hezbollah.

Jared Marnin

The Mossad officers are at a McDonalds with a Hamas militant 😜

Hilary is Pant-suited Syphilis

After decades of watching Israel brutalize Palestinian men, women, elderly, disabled. Shoot journalists, ambulance drivers and blow up press buildings. After hearing them brag about putting Palestinians “on a diet” and even the “doves” in Israeli politics worried about the racial question and the hawks openly calling for genocide. Crowds of Israeli’s watching from hill tops and cheering as bombs blow up Palestinian cities and end hundreds of lives. The hundreds of Palestinians children every year being shot. Hearing settlers and Israeli soldiers brag and mock as they aim at Palestinian protestors and laugh as the body/crumbles and collapses. Seeing crowds of Israeli’s smash Palestinian homes and stores and lynch them on the street. Watching hundreds of Palestinian homes and farmers fields being bulldozed to build luxury homes for settlers with well watered and manicured lawns as Palestinian children and families suffer from food and water insecurity. Seeing the Palestinian resistance launch a successful mission that destroyed their oppressive explicitly and often openly genocidal apartheid state’s adversary’s bases and soldiers was quite amazing. Unequivocal support to them. It’s good knowing that some of the bastards who shot at the overwhelmingly peaceful protestors and killed hundreds of them were likely killed or captured in this recent counter attack. That protest which was met with brutal violence where hundreds were killed and tens of thousands injured and wounded didn’t garner a peep compared to the condemnation coming in now.

Faisal Sultan

Again: you guys proving that youre the only ones with nuanced and informed takes. Thank you. Happy to be a supporting member.

J. A.

Its crazy you think they shouldn't be able to get their get back considering you've supposedly listened to rwn. Have you no sense of justice?

J. A.

Arrogance is right.

J. A.

Thats a script about Ukraine with the word Ukraine switched for Palestine and the word russia swapped with Isreal. It is in fact you who is a clown. Bitch.

Jared Marnin

Except the Rabin assassination is, essentially, what put Bibi in power, and this 10/7/23 incident is what may force his departure

J. A.

They seem a lot smarter than that.

PostmasterFenian

Lol the IDF should all ritually off themselves. Getting the shit kicked out of you even for a day is pretty embarrassing when your opponent's airforce has paragliders and you have the most "sophisticated" fighter bombers in the world.

Ilya Fishman

You fucking wish. IDF will non-ritually gut the 'resistance'. While you, and the rest of your pig wank ilk will continue to jerk off to a free falastin. Look at Gaza. Lebanon to experience this very soon.

Ilya Fishman

You wish. The syphilis is you and the IDF will very soon administer the penicillin ridding Gaza of HAMAS and liberating Palestine from West Bank to the sea.

Ilya Fishman

I hope you like me are an American. And I hope to stand next to you when we and our families experience the brand of 'justice' you're supporting.

Ilya Fishman

Oh sheet. I'm a bitch? Hahaha watch HAMAS in Gaza burn. MashALlah!

Ilya Fishman

I'd rather be a bitch than endorse rape and mutilation of civilians pretending it's 'liberation'. Puddle of wank.

Ilya Fishman

I admit that the terrorist regime of Hamas will go the way of the unrecognized, corrupt regime in Artsakh.

PostmasterFenian

You should volunteer for the infantry in Ukraine Ilya show your patriotism since you like war so much

Ilya Fishman

I'll take your advice into consideration yawn

Ilya Fishman

How did every war from 1948 through now go? Is Palestine 'free'? Judging by the IRGC telegram channels who have started showing poor suffering Gaza instead of gloating over raped Israeli women, the 'liberation operation' is currently being drowned.

Ilya Fishman

I hate war. But humans are monkeys and we have to live in reality. ;)

a clash of purple

I think you're being disingenuous. As a matter of fact, they've always been complimentary towards Chechen fighters, who are far more vicious than Hamas, and they've also always spoken positively about the PKK and Hezbollah, who are no angels. If you've listened to all of RWN, then you should know where their sympathies have always lain in this conflict. That's not going to change just because a couple hundred Israeli civilians died in this war for a change, as opposed to the one-sided slaughter it has been for decades. War is horrible and compels all combatants to do horrible things. That's why the first and worst war crime was adjudicated to be aggression at Nuremberg. That's why Russia can never have the moral high ground with their invasion of Ukraine, no matter how bad NATO is, and also why Israel is the "bad guy" in the war against Palestinians. The Israelis are illegally (even by their own law) occupying Palestinian land and villages, and enforce their hideously oppressive rule over the subject Palestinian population through violence and the threat of violence. Hamas is killing Israelis both for self-defense and for revenge only after many years of attempted diplomacy and multiple warnings and demonstrations of their willingness and ability to hit Israel back. I'm sorry, but Israel has no right to cry when they get a tiny taste of their own medicine. I certainly have no sympathy for Israeli civilians, not when they all unconditionally support the IDF and are in favor of ethnic cleansing and genocide.

Demented Avenger

When you claimed that this podcast only recently plunged into current wars and earlier only covered historical ones, you proved you cannot be a long-time listener. Either you’re a spook or a crank. I’ll try to think highly of you and say spook, since if you’re doing this for free, you need serious psychiatric help

PostmasterFenian

pretty sure the people calling for ethnic cleansing (you) are the barbarians.

a clash of purple

I'm sure the Israelis are jerking themselves off right now imagining their brutal reprisal. I really doubt it's going to go the way they hoped. However good the Israeli military might have once been, by now they're clearly only useful for torturing and massacring unarmed civilians. RWN has been speculating for a while that there will come a military engagement where a modern First World army is annihilated by an apparent underdog using new tactics and weaponry. That's not to say I think Hamas can win a war against Israel, but this might be another Yemen situation, where the Israelis completely fail to achieve victory on the battlefield and resort to starving their victims to death. Regardless, Israel has already suffered (by their standards) massive, humiliating losses. If they're dumb enough to march their army into Gaza, I would not expect them to get it back.

a clash of purple

Based on your other posts here, Ilya Fishman, you don't hate war. Don't lie. You're openly fantasizing about the IDF murdering everyone in occupied Palestine with masturbatory glee. Also, "humans are monkeys" and "we have to live in reality" doesn't justify anything.

ploob

But rape

Kiel Cone

Spotted the NATO-narc. Add in a diatribe about how we need to keep trying to overthrow and occupy Syria and we’re good.

Doug Cartel

Max went psycho over the vaccine I think, but I dont really think about him anymore anyways

Eric

Well we now know the “invasion” essentially consisted of the murder of civilians at a rave and on a highway. Those paragliders sure did look cool though.

James Evans

Because I (or anyone) said Israel (or anyone else) dropping a bomb on an apartment building is “just a fact of life”? Some straw men are certainly getting routed in this comment section, tough night for them.

Jimothy Realname

The IDF are pussies and they can't fight anyone of military age without wetting their pants

Ander Pierce

If we are talking about the slaying and mutilation of civilians, Israel has a sizeable lead on the scorecard. You're a cheerleader for one set of civilian killings, and seem to believe that if you lived under Israeli occupation you would be OK with having your freedom of mobility limited and private property seized by illegal settlers. Personally I would not be OK with those things, so as much as I dislike Hamas I can empathize with the Palestinians.

Ander Pierce

"If they're dumb enough to march their army on Gaza, I would not expect them to get it back." I wouldn't count the IDF out. Sure, they've gotten soft by running counter-insurgency (mostly shaking down civilians and isolated militants) rather than a war against a peer, but they're technologically sophisticated, wealthy, have a larger population, etc. etc. It will be brutal and high-casualty street-to-street fighting. Don't think either side is going to be a push over.

Ander Pierce

I appreciate you making the implicit take an explicit one. Will steal this gleefully.

Ander Pierce

Understandable and sorry to see you go. Israel has monopolized the violence to date (compare the number of dead civilians on each side by year if you disagree), and this attack is frankly ground-breaking. Genuinely can't stand Hamas, and at the same time I can't imagine that I would sit idly by if I was occupied by a foreign power (Israel in this case). War is terrible, the Israeli-Palestine conflict has been an endless string of atrocities going back to 1948, and I am curious to see what comes of this most recent escalation.

William

Sorry, who asked? No one gives a shit if you leave or stay

William

Shut the fuck up bitch, I wasn’t asking you

William

@karl - I know it’s not a good analogy- I guess I’m thinking along the same lines as mark where he imagines Israeli credibility being questioned in security circles. But now that I think about it, israel’s strength is that they can test all their heinous shit on Palestinians, not really anything else

William

Lol Israel taking nothing but Ls this millennium. They’re so powerful and smart and advanced they lose to an “inferior “ militia and just got their shit rocked by a handful of people they’ve been trying to starve and kill into submission for decades

James

Holy shit, that's the lamest thing you've said on this thread hahaha

Jason Thompson

I really wish this could become the start of a change for Palestine. I wanna share Gary & Mark’s excitement. And maybe (probably) it’s a fool’s game to try to appeal to the sympathy of the Western public and media. But still, if the West didn’t give sympathetic coverage to Palestinians during the last 14 years of images of Palestinians being brutally assaulted and bombed, I dread to see the West’s coverage of images like those Hamas/Jihad guys driving around with Shani Louk’s body in the back of their pickup.

manus

Mark, and especially John, have shown unequivocal support for the IRA. They've also "gloated" about some of the bloodier terrorist acts the PIRA committed. How is this situation different?

a clash of purple

I think it's pretty clear now that Hamas are the technologically sophisticated ones, not Israel. Just because your military hardware is expensive doesn't mean it's effective.

a clash of purple

Look, no one should excuse Hamas's war crimes and atrocities. But the ultimate responsibility for all this lies with Israel. None of this would be happening if Israel didn't start this war. The Palestinian resistance can and should be held accountable for their actions, but the same is doubly true for Israel, as the aggressor and the stronger power. That's the context that people like Ilya Fishman conveniently ignore when they talk about Hamas doing terrible things.

a clash of purple

I think both Israel and the Palestinians are starting to wake up and realize that all this PR crap is a waste of time. The empire will always back Israel to the hilt, and Palestinians are never going to get support from the West. It doesn't matter whether people think one side is nicer than the other or whatever, there are material reasons why the empire thinks it needs Israel no matter what.

Karl Childers

classic problem of trying to appeal to the humanity of people who do not view you as human

Ramses Manzo

Not only did Israel think hamas was weak, Bibi actually propped them up to create division between the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, they thought they could use Hamas for their colonial project.

Ilya Fishman

None of this would happen if the Joos just packed up and dove into the sea. Like HAMAS and the 'peace process' and all the Arab leaders and Iran have always wanted. Just like Europe intended.

PostmasterFenian

How are they not trying to drive gaza residents into the sea? Feel like theres some projection on your part buddy. Why don't you go hang out with the dudes wearing runes in lviv.

A

James, the people shown that were killed by Hamas in their most recent offensive were settlers occupying illegally stolen land. They absolutely are complicit, and are the main drivers of israels current apartheid state and genocide of Palestinians. I have zero sympathy for them. Just as I have zero sympathy for the European colonizers that were brutalized by the natives. It's just interesting that you choose to ignore all the brutality Israel has put Palestinians under and now when some Palestinians finally let their anger out it's somehow untenable to support them anymore. Just very convenient. Almost like you were always looking for an excuse not to support them.

PW

Egypt says they had let Israel know something was brewing. So either the system really did break down or some folks like the hard liners running the gov said "Go ahead let them attack and then we'll have our excuse to finish them once and for all." Apparently not realizing that the house cat now has serious claws.