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In the Bunker we will do a fun tactical carbine systems philosophy video!  After a lot of testing I pit the latest generation of the KelTec RDB 17 against a DelTon LIMA AR15 pistol.  Both have been reviewed separately here.  Now it may seem like an odd faceoff but if think of it in terms compactness it will make sense.  Patreon TNPrs have been telling me they have considered each for their 0-200m platform.

We will compare several interesting categories in the Bunker:  SAWC, battle worthiness, accuracy, cool factor, value, ergos, and more!  Lots of infield shooting testing is shown, some dating back to 2016 when we also shot the RDB extensively, including the RDB Survival.  That gun isn't here for the comparison and the results might be different if it was.  But this RDB17 is a solid platform and you'll see it has cured some of our criticisms from years past.

In the end the discussion may help guide your limited gun dollars to buy the gun right for YOUR philosophy of use.  Another touchstone Nutnfancy Systems Philosophy video!

SB Tactical SBA3 braces, still my fave, so xlnt, shown here:  https://shrsl.com/2fdfi

Your compact scope solution, the Swampfox Arrowhead, in testing now, seems xlnt:Check out the $468 1-10x option, the Nightforce NightForce ATACR 1-8x24 34mm is $2600!   https://shrsl.com/2fdfy

Lightning high value out the front knife, so xlnt:   https://shrsl.com/201x8

AeroPrecision Ultralight mounts, we use these exclusively, we buy them just like you:  https://shrsl.com/2fdgd

Holosun red dot sights, our go to red dot for over 8 yrs, we buy them just like you!https://shrsl.com/2fdgq

Deep Blue's amazing watches, they're all xlnt:  https://tinyurl.com/yahzkm8u

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KelTec RDB vs AR Pistol: Compact Tactical Shootout

In the Bunker we will do a fun tactical carbine systems philosophy video! After a lot of testing I pit the latest generation of the KelTec RDB 17 against a DelTon LIMA AR15 pistol. Both have been reviewed separately here. Now it may seem like an odd faceoff but if think of it in terms compactness it will make sense. Patreon TNPrs have been telling me they have considered each for their 0-200m platform. We will compare several interesting categories in the Bunker: SAWC, battle worthiness, accuracy, cool factor, value, ergos, and more! Lots of infield shooting testing is shown, some dating back to 2016 when we also shot the RDB extensively, including the RDB Survival. That gun isn't here for the comparison and the results might be different if it was. But this RDB17 is a solid platform and you'll see it has cured some of our criticisms from years past. In the end the discussion may help guide your limited gun dollars to buy the gun right for YOUR philosophy of use. Another touchstone Nutnfancy Systems Philosophy video! SB Tactical SBA3 braces, still my fave, so xlnt, shown here: https://shrsl.com/2fdfi Your compact scope solution, the Swampfox Arrowhead, in testing now, seems xlnt: Check out the $468 1-10x option, the Nightforce NightForce ATACR 1-8x24 34mm is $2600! https://shrsl.com/2fdfy Lightning high value out the front knife, so xlnt: https://shrsl.com/201x8 AeroPrecision Ultralight mounts, we use these exclusively, we buy them just like you: https://shrsl.com/2fdgd Holosun red dot sights, our go to red dot for over 8 yrs, we buy them just like you! https://shrsl.com/2fdgq TNP is now focused in Patreon, this is where the full blown TNP content is found, 3x what you see here in YT! https://www.patreon.com/Nutnfancy TNP stuff at: www.nutnfancy.bigcartel.com Subscribe to TNP for more videos like this Nutnfancy http://tinyurl.com/jaf8tz4 TheNutnfancyProject http://tinyurl.com/jg5cz6r Sub to Nutnfancy Twitter feed: https://twitter.com/nutnfancy Thanks to Gunnies Sporting Goods in Orem, UT ph (801) 226-7080 for the items sometimes provided to TNP for review. Look up gunnies online, say thanks!

Comments

Paul Cabbie

That intro was epic. First of it’s kind on TNP that I can recall.

NatvMan

I get to "Orange it Out" tonight and tomorrow. Going on an overnight hike up to Box Elder Peak here in Utah. Keep the vids coming Nutn!

David Gaines

Awesome! I don’t have the RDB but still love the pf9 (second highest use summer carry gun behind the 365). I also have the Gen 2 Sub2k as my truck gun. I love Kel tech despite the mocking of the tacticool community. They are the only ones who ever do anything truly innovative/original and always have great price points. POU are my favorite discussions! I love finding ways to integrate gear. If a tool can’t pass that test, it doesn’t get bought.

The Nutnfancy Project

Nice David! I too like the POU stuff and it has always grounded my own purchases. As you note KelTec despite some faults stays on a cutting edge of design and usually value.

The Nutnfancy Project

Way to Orange it Out, Box Elder is awesome. Nice hikes up there. I usually launch from Dry Creek trail there. It's steep though. Should be cooler as you get to altitude.

Robert

I’d like to see the RDB in 6.5 Grendel or 6mm ARC

Guy Actual

The Anti-Gun Savior Case! I love it. It does bother me a little bit that you had the stickers to put in there. ;)

Guy Actual

I'm excited to see the 6mm ARC! My younger brother (God rest his soul) always wanted to see a .243 AR platform as he loved the 243 for distance. I know if he were still here, that he would be chomping at the bit to get his hands on one and see just how far it can prove itself. I have the 6.5Grendel and love it. I think the RDB would be great in either of these cals. My only problem is feeding non NATO rounds, although 6.5 CM has really equalized in price.

Greg Malcom

Perfect timing while eating my "getting in shape for WROL" lunch.

Matthew Sinn

Great discussion. I was able to find an RDB Survival locally last month and so far I love it. I’m one of those weirdos who doesn’t like the looks or the ergos of the AR-15s much.

Bill The Broken

The rdb c model (rdb hunter) has an offering in 6.5 Grendel I believe. Its actually an awesome model. Combo of rdb and rdb survival. Same chasis as rdb s and a 20in barrel. I love mine wouldn't trade it ever

NatvMan

We are going to head out on the Dry Creek trail.

Bill The Broken

One great feature I put on my rdb c is an aluminum m lock handguard from a company called the luckyirishman. Gets rid of any flex or wobble in the front end, gives you plenty of room to mount a white light, handstop etc, and the install is like 5 min. Best $170 I've spent on any rifle in quite a while. Thank you as always nutn for all you do. Its videos like this that have me check patreon every time I wake up in morning 😊

Robert

I don’t have an AR. Lol I have a No. 5 Enfield, but if I get an AR it would be in 6mm ARC. A friend of mine has a Howa in 6.5 Grendel. It’s a micro action and it’s pretty cool. If I recall, he’s shooting Lehigh bullets and loves it.

Scout154

I have been wanting a RBD since they came out. I have only seen one so far in a local store.

Jbocajs .

Unfortunately they won’t be coming down anytime soon.

Caleb11b

An awesome video to keep me up while donating bone marrow!

Drew Pitchford

Would love an RFB vs tavor 7 vs ar-10 discussion, here in Canada where you can own the first two but not the third. I'm guessing it would be similar to the points talked about here.

Beck

I agree, the Keltec would be my choice too. The extra barrel length is what does it for me.

James Young

Regarding the Draco, why a flash can instead of a linear compensator or a Krinkov style muzzle brake? They should work better and be more compact

Nicolas Royston

If I didn't know the situation before hand I would have to take the RDB for velocity alone.

RowdyRon

Between the KelTec RDB 17, and the DelTon LIMA AR15 pistol, I'd take the Draco. I have a M92 Pappy on guard duty as we speak. I think the ergo issues with the RDB might be a little overblown. Mostly a training issue? The only AR pistol I have is in 9mm (yes Glock mags). I really like some of KelTecs designs, but am leery of their execution. Great video Nutn! Thanks.

The Nutnfancy Project

Agreed. I don't see the days of cheap tactical guns coming back for awhile. The riots and threats are driving it and I don't see them relenting. Congrats to all who bought early!

The Nutnfancy Project

Noted, Tavor 7 vs AR10. Would be good. Hard to find the Tavor 7 though and IWI hates me for the X95 review.

J Ram

Appreciate the honest review Nutn, the data is what the data is...congrats to the winner Kel-Tec RDB. However as you said not all categories are actually weighted equally off paper, and for me 2nd cool (for some reason I think all bullpup styles are ugly) and ergo are huge (especially ergo from the aspect of maintaining bio memory OODA loops)...so like you I'll be taking my AR15 pistol with can home with me and admiring the numbers of the Kel-Tec from afar.

James Young

True, Krinkov brakes are HEAVY and linear comps offer only a slight improvement over your flash can but tend to be heavier and more money.

Lon N

A huge part of finding (or modifying)to get "the right firearm" is a sharp focus on POU. I have heard "POU" out of Nutn's lips 10,000 times. The goal defines the tool.

UczenBlood

Nutnfancy do an update video on the XCR - L :) they updated the rifle a lot since your grv

Racing Psychosis

Not a fan of bull-pups. I don't get the "their cool". I've never found them cool. I've found them quirky which for me in shooting is never a good thing. I've invested lots of hours into shooting regular rifles that are all quite similar in operation that transfer from one to the other. I Don't really need those extra quirks screwing around with my muscle memory. If it was the only rifle I had well, it may be a different story. In reality its not. Likely not a popular opinion.

JDCoy

I have two 10.5 inch PSA AR pistols built on 80% lowers, and neither one can get through a magazine without a malfunction. I called PSA and they sent out two new buffer tubes, buffers and springs. After swapping out the buffers and springs they got better, but still have light primer strikes very often. Any idea what to do?

Red dog 1

Nice eye candy even though it’s an air soft. I have noticed it for a couple months. Was the Barrett you had in the back ground for awhile also an air soft? Nutn id give you an academy award for you acting!

Phill Super

For LPS I'm guessing you want to look at the walls of the lower and trigger.

Phill Super

Well I didn't see that coming. In my opinion a well built AR pistol would win out in GTW: consistent manual of arms, AR simplicity and reliability, repair part compatibility and availability. The main disadvantage I see is the 556 velocity drop out of the short barrels. As a side note it would be interesting to see a 10 to 12" integrally suppressed AR upper.

darby shaw

So, what would the most important differences have been withe rdb-s? Do you think it would have changed the winner or made the rdb's win clearer? Excellent video.

HappyFrancisMacomber

Love the review data and comments from TNPrs here. Seems like pistols and pups been fun for all, but at the end of the day - full length system takes it.

T Boy

Big factor is replacement parts for RDB in WROL. 50% of houses in America have AR parts in them.

Trevor

I appreciate the content as always but I wouldn’t judge at pistol accuracy based on any particular AR barrel length has nothing to do with accuracy at 100 yards if you had one set up with a super high quality barrel it could easily be sub MOA with the right ammo

JDCoy

The weird thing is, that I put a buddies rifle upper onto those lowers, and they ran fine. Then I put those pistol uppers onto his rifle lower, and they ran fine. Wait, no I didn't, that would be illegal, , , so, , , I didn't. Like at all,,, But it's still true.;)

Patrick Brichta

Great video! Thanks so much for the information. Ironically, I just picked up a Kel-Tec PLR-16, 9.5 inch barrel, super light, shorter than the Delton since there's no stock or forearm brace. Super excited to get it out to the range and see what I can do. Maybe won't be calling to me in my dreams of a terrible night, but should be a fun little range toy, or a good truck pistol.

JRP

Love the vid Nutn

Tim Bone

About time someone did a comparison like this. Good job!

Christian

Just got my patches and my tnp shirt. Thanks Nutnfancy and TD!

Mobius 1

Dude I got my patches too! Proudly display "TNP" On my backpack :D

Brian Jones

I missed who made that gun case you were talking about.

Rob B

Along the same lines as the Tavor 7 vs AR 10 review that Drew asked about (see above), I think a reality check video would be appropriate for some of the internet ninjas. A REAL comparison of a realistic AR15 fighting rifle vs a realistic AR10. Include ammo, mags, pouches, molle, etc. Talk about weight, cost, bulk, capabilities, etc. CLEARLY demonstrate why the US & every other 1st world military switched to intermediate cartridges & rifles for the average infantryman. 7.62x51 is awesome, but SAWC is king.

Bluegill097

As always, super late to the game here! My lunch breaks have been interrupted lately lol. I had an AR pistol for like a year and then I sold it. It looked super cool but I could not stand shooting it! Sucker was so loud I thought it was blowing up every time I pulled the trigger lol. Great review I really like the feature length with philosophy thanks TNP

Hunter

Duuude the mini draco got nothing on the PSA Akp that thing comes loaded optic ready hinge cover, with moe furniture I’d love to see a comparison on the two, if even send you mine to try out! ❤️

John Krywy

I love my AK-P. Their Krinkov brace is awesome. I will be going to the range on Monday with it. Definitely would be a nice matchup against the Mini-Draco. Only thing I’m looking at is a red dot... likely Holosun. Either the 403C or 503CU. Kind of leaning towards the 403C, since I really wouldn’t be taking an AK with that short of a barrel out too far.

Micah G

Thanks Nutn, I have some experience with short barrel ars not much with bullpups but much prefer the ar any day of the week.

Micah G

I've built a 10.5" in 5.56, carbine length gas tube. And an 8.5" 300 blkout, pistol length gas tube. The 300 has blown up gas rings before so my advice, stay carbine length gas tube. I honestly don't notice an insane noise/flash difference between 10.5 and 16" and that's just with a birdcage. My data: 16" - 2819 avg. ft/s: 10.5" - 2546 avg ft/s. That 10.5 is 26.25" Overall, and 6 lbs 13 oz with optic, light, sba3, and bcm kmr rail (8"). For me, that 10.5 is just about perfect for a compact rig. Just my 2 cents fellas (I don't have it all down just yet) Nut'n I really appreciate all your hard work, and most especially, telling it like you see it.

Tim Bone

Interesting. What ammo were you using when you chrono-ed your 5.56 10.5" and 16"...and what make of 10.5" barrel is that? Sounds like you found a sweet spot with your 10.5" shorty.

Micah G

That was with 62 Grn. PMC X-tac for both the 10.5 and 16. The 10.5 is a m4 profile Radical Firearms Melonite 1/7 twist. The 16 is an m4 profile 1/7 Nitride but not sure who the manufacture is. Those were 5 shot groups back in May in 88F for what it's worth. Kind of want to try different loads now to see if your right. Best regards

Steve Richardson

Hey Nutn......Who makes the Violin Case you were teasing us with??? Great comparison!

Sheepdog

Love the 'stealth' gun case with the "Ban Guns" and peace sign stickers! ROFL :-)

TacticalSunBro

Have you looked into the Troy Claymore linear comp muzzle device? Would love to see a review of that from you. Although I think you have only done one video dedicated to a muzzle device in the past. Even if you didn't ever review the Troy claymore would be cool to see a comparison of different muzzle devices that you have tested across the years up to this point.

Jake Woody

Hey Nutn, I know that you have some friends over at KelTec and wondered if they knew much about the Sako/Grendel rifle? I inherited one a while back and with a little research, I heard that Grendel was a predecessor to KelTec. Its a super light little .308 bolt gun that I've had a lot of fun with.