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The West Wing, Season 2, Episode 5 (Patreon)

Published:
2023-03-30 19:15:12
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

It's from HMS Pinafore! It's the one about duty!

Files

Previews only

The West Wing, Season 2, Episode 5

Comments

Roland

They're all about duty!

Weird Magic

Originally airing on November 1, 2000, "And It's Surely To Their Credit" is Episode 5 of Season 2 of The West Wing. It is the 27th episode overall and has an IMDB rating of 8.4, placing it as the #13 ranked episode of this season and #48 out of all 155 episodes.

sandrinegeller

I forgot about that scene with Sam! I love it and him so I am glad he made up for how much of an ass he was being to her. Yeah I do like Ainsley as an addition in the most part. The little sexist moments get to me, but these good moments are great. Good episode

Weird Magic

I do think it was important to show a couple of jerk Democrats since they showed a couple of jerk Republicans (Ainsley's friends) in the last episode. The show does lean left overall but it has to since they are in office, just important to realize they did try (IMO) to keep it as balanced as they could when possible.

Youtalkingtome
>>105258873

I liked that they tried to switch it up a little. Introduce some new ideas to keep things fresh. Was it a total success? Who knows, but it did give us an incredible moment from Sam. Plus I like that they are trying new things!

Mithroch

I recently heard an interview of LeVar Burton (coincidentally by Rob Lowe) where he talked about Gene Roddenberry and how despite Gene being this icon of social commentary... he was still very much a product of his time. Sure... he had women in important roles... but they wore miniskirts and were usually someone's (Kirk) love interest. We also have seen on more recent years the fall of Joss Whedon... who wrote brilliantly strong women... but seems to be bit of misogynist when it comes to his interactions with actors. I don't know that I had a specific point... just your comments on Sorkin reminded me of these thigns.

Anna

I don't know the background of the talk about Sorkin writing women in any sort of weak way. I do know that growing up I had a limited list of favorite women actors but Allison Janney was always at the top because of C.J. Cregg. I think the women of the West Wing are powerhouses and goofballs all in one. I love them to pieces.

Pam Nail

As a New Hampshire native, the President should really know what "leaf peeping" is. I have always felt that the condescending way men on this show talk about women was "truth in television." It's cringy, but probably pretty accurate, unfortunately (though maybe not so much anymore). Sometimes people in fiction have to do something shitty so that the writers can call it out and have a character like CJ push back.

Youtalkingtome
>>105276592

I wouldn't put Sorkin in the same category as Joss Whedon. He seemed like a genuine monster. Of course we don't know what happens behind closed doors, but still I think there is a clear difference. Maybe it is similar to the Gene Roddenberry situation, he is a product of his time.

Youtalkingtome
>>105283382

C.J. is for sure the exception. She is fantastically written and just as powerful and important as anyone on the show. There are a few other projects that he has written where women aren't portrayed as well.

Youtalkingtome
>>105288581

As two non New Hampshire natives, we had no idea lol. You are right though as shows age certain aspects do as well. While 90% of this show holds up there are some aspects that show its age. I would imagine this is what it was like in the world at this time.

Luca Siracusa (Bob)

You guys used the right phrase to describe this episode "It was complex", yeah, it was. Think about it, REALLY think about it: this episode had so many little storyline and changes of mood between lighter and more serious moments The whole bit about leaf peeping, Jed and Abbey ready to have sex, Tribbey storming in rooms with a bat, the Englishman thing, Josh suing the insurance company On the other hand we had Josh and Sam about the Klan, CJ and the general, Abbey and Jed addressing how much women are not rightly praised, Ainsley and the two idiots, Sam apologizing to her and firing them. It all happened in a single episode, just one. Get ready because season 2 will NOT slow down. This season is packed in every episode for every single frame. There is no "plot b", there are only a lot of plots in every episode and every one of them is so detailed and they all cohesively work together to make every episode better, greater, bigger and fuller than you could ever expect This one was particularly so funny and the bits about the President and First Lady ready to have sex ALWAYS make me laugh so hard: you have this very important and masterful figure that when is around his wife become a young teenager that cannot wait to jump her. These are the little details that make every character realistic and tridimensional: nobody in that white house feels like someone they wrote, they all feel like real people that change in situations, handle different things in different ways: bicker, get angry, argue, laugh, help the others. Season 2 is the peak of this show and you're just starting to notice it

jimmy2k4o .

I’m a conservative and I’m used to people taking immediate dislike to me, genuinely believing me malicious and stuff and it does get to you. I’m not being literal here but it is a type of prejudice that is socially acceptable. Ofcourse the right are guilty of this too but in my social economic class and geographical area I’m a minority, I live in the British equivalent of New York or LA. Even in my family I’m a minority and Scotland is very politically heated and divided over the issue of independence from the UK. This episode is very special to me, it’s comforting and reassuring. Like when you share that side of yourself in real life and the person receiving the Info accepts you even if they don’t agree with you. You believe that your country really is pluralistic and civilised. Nobody is born progressive or conservative, right or left. We’re humans first and as clechè as it is, the things that unite us far out number the things that divide us. I’d go further and say our divisions, while tense and unproductive, are a part of our system, our culture. The things about the west that’s wonderful is that in the west, there’s more than way of living life. We all have different values, beliefs, politics etc but we live together and respect each other’s autonomy. “I disagree with what you say but I’ll defend to the death your right to say it” If I had to sum up my beliefs to one quote it be that one. So inspite of all temptations To go after reputations We remain some western men We remaaaaaaaaine some western men Great reaction. Glas your channel is doing well following the horrible attack at rosalin. I’ll never forget where I was when it happened…….I was at home watching west wing. 😞

Balazs Foldes

This is such a fun episode. I never really knew much about Gilber&Sullivan before watching this, but had to look up a lot afterwards. You live and learn. :) Oh, hey, I was mentioned and listed! Just for the record, the proper pronounciation of my name would be something approximately Bow-lush Fell-dash> or maybe using a German transscription: . Hungarian is such a nice language. :)

jimmy2k4o .

Is it sexist when they have plot lines surrounding men that play into stereotypes and clechès? Is there no such thing as banter anymore? Can’t we say things we don’t believe for comic effect and comradely? The things my friends say to me is beyond offensive…..if you took it serious and not ironically. And these guys are rivals, opponents! Can’t they engage in a bit of sh*t talking. Ainsley burns the dems quite a few times. Everyone makes fun of Sam: Knock knock Who’s there Sam and his prostitute friend! Why must we all talk like politicians and HR people. In truth, do you really think social interaction is better or worse since PC rebranded as woke and exploded onto the scene in 2014. At first we mocked it and didn’t take it serious, and inch by inch they grew in influence and power. In my country they recently tried to put a convicted rapist in a women’s prison because he suddenly claimed after his conviction he was trans. This sort of thing doesn’t help real trans people, it hurts them because it creates a false perception about trans rights in the minds of the centrist majority. More often than not people tell me they support equal rights for trans people but the movement is going to far, and as it does people will have less sympathy and patience for the issue. Like how environmental extremism hurts the cause of environmentalism because it repels the public. The extremists seem to always seize control of a good movement and push it til it breaks against the will of the majority. Like how tea party idiots or trump hurt the republicans. How occupy Wall Street, AOC and congresswoman Omar make the dems look bad. Bolsheviks make the Russian revolution look bad. Islamic jihad made the Egyptian revolution look bad. Isis made the Assad rebels look bad. I’m sorry I went on too long…..great video.

MarkyO

I am sooooo late... anyway My absolute favorite part of this episode is at the end when Ainsley switches on the lights and the song starts playing. The way he grabs her coat and pulls down is the exact same way it happens in the play. And also she waits to take her first steps on the same beat that the play does during the down beat of "For he himself has said it" Also the whole line of how the President likes people who disagree with him is a Sorkinism that's a callback to a line from a show he also wrote called Sports Night, "If you're dumb surround yourself with smart people. If you're smart surround yourself with smart people who disagree with you." Sam firing those two guys is one of my favorite scenes in the whole show. So satisfying.

Youtalkingtome
>>105323950

So far we are floored by how good it has been. You're right, they have their foot on the gas and it's just so great to see what the characters are up to. Each episode tackles new subject matter and each character has a different opinion on it. Love it.

Youtalkingtome
>>105325143

Hey! We appreciate your kind words and you're right. Bipartisanship is important to us. We believe in it and no matter what your personal or political beliefs are, as long as you're a good person with good morals we like you!! This show is so good that it can bring people together and that's what this channel is all about, coming together and watching some damn fine television. Thanks for being here.

Youtalkingtome
>>105330610

Our bad! Part of the fun of having Kevin do the shout outs is how he pronounces the names! Thanks for being here Balazs!

Youtalkingtome
>>105353548

We walk a fine line today. Times are changing and not always for the better. However, progress is important. We believe that being too far left and too far right is not the answer. We could all do with some middle ground. That's just our opinion.

jimmy2k4o .
>>105353548

Absolutely, I feel despite the extremes getting all the press your country and mine are nations of moderates. The polarised the left and right become the more the centre gets stretched and damaged.

JVTrickypants

Sorkin was a musical theater major so definitely see that in this episode. Also, Sorkin had on staff people who were political staffers that were both Republican and Democrat because he would have people write basically position papers on each side. He is of course very liberal, but wanted to hear from both sides to make the arguments.

JVTrickypants

Also, if I recall correctly, at the time of the original airing Clinton was the first president without military experience and it was much more of a big deal than it is now.

Youtalkingtome
>>105597574

I love that there was some bipartisanship on set. Also did not know that about him! Makes total sense as he does write for theater as well.

Zachary Loeser
>>105283382

As much as I *love* Sorkin's writing, it still irks me that it seems the only way he can write strong women is to give them masculine or androgynous names. Studio 60: "Harry" (short for Harriet) West Wing: CJ, Joey, Ainsley A Few Good Men: Jo American President: Sydney The Newsroom: Mac, Sloane Sports Night: Dana

Calina Crandall

Not true. Many, many presidents have existed without any sort of military training. Taft was one. Lincoln another. Both were lawyers before being President and Taft became the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court afterwards.