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S8E04, The Last of the Starks (Patreon)

Published:
2019-05-06 04:29:46
Edited:
2020-04-27 21:58:11
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

What did you think of GOT S8E04, "The Last of the Starks"?

Here's the Q&A livestream: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKT8NatDoZg 

Here's a playlist with all of the S8 livestreams:  https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLn6yDpEottdi4ezny3XOUy59gDfSOgKWV  

We're now working on the S8E04 Explained video.

Thanks for your support!

Files

Game of Thrones S8E04 Q&A discussion

We're holding live Q&A discussions right after each episode of GOT S8, at about 10:30pm ET Sunday. Patrons can watch past streams: https://www.patreon.com/AltShiftX/posts?tag=livestreams Subscribe: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCveZqqGewoyPiacooywP5Ig?sub_confirmation=1 Support on Patreon: http://bit.ly/ASXPatreon Twitter: http://bit.ly/ASXTwitter Merch: https://standard.tv/altshiftx Stream donations: https://streamlabs.com/altshiftx This is a review and discussion of GOT S8E04, using stills from the episode. This is fair use. [FAIR USE, stills only]

Comments

Kelly Theobald

I thoroughly enjoyed it! I think the key is you just have to pretend last episode didn’t happen. If you can accept that it’s gone back to good ol’ fashioned Iron Throne crap, then it was good. Good stuff: -The opening scenes genuinely had me tearing up. -Fucking Gwendolyn Christie. She is killing it this season! -I’m so glad that Varys is relevant again! Varys/Tyrion scenes are always my favorite. But uh...yeah, RIP in advance, Varys. -Rhaegal’s death was so gut-wrenching. I guess some people thought it was stupid, but I was devastated. Complaints: -The dialogue. AS USUAL. There are so many scenes where someone says something dramatic and then walks away. Even freaking Bran got wheeled away after his dramatic line (even though it was actually a good line). -Daenerys’s stupid fucking stupidity. -Ghost. I don’t need to elaborate. We’re all on the same page, here. -I don’t know how to feel about Jaime’s reversion back to a dickhead. On one hand, it totally makes sense. And I’ve been getting tired of so many redemption arcs—it’s nice to see the opposite. On the other hand, he’s been on an upswing since...season 3? So all that character development is down the drain? And now that he’s finally slept with Brienne he suddenly needs Cersei again? -Euron confuses me. I thought he was dangerously intelligent, but now I’m thinking he’s fairly stupid? 🤨 On a whole, it felt like Thrones again. It’s so stupid that the NK and WW are gone without a backwards glance. But if you ignore all that, I thought it was good. And I feel like there’s real drama now that Rhaegal’s gone.

Alt Shift X

I'm hoping this isn't about Jaime becoming a dickhead again, this is Jaime confronting his past before he can move forward as a better person

Kelly Theobald

I hope so too. But he was so definitive about it, I can’t help but think it was genuine. A moment of doubt, maybe—and maybe Brienne will follow him to King’s Landing and inspire some kind of last-minute heroism in him.

youngslorp

Pod is def a virgin, thats why he returned the money to Tyrion and Bronn. He lied to Tyrion and Bronn, and the power of "the word of mouth" worked its magic. He young and he was drunk, he isnt exactly a master of secrets.

Jenny Zina Tavares

I don't really get the episode's title. Question: will Euron figure out the baby isn't his because Tyrion knows about the pregnancy? Overall, I'm thinking HBO has really ruined ASOIAF. I was so believing a new pact would be negotiated to bring peace from beyond the wall with Jon and Bran being the negotiators.

Erik

I’m disappointed that I care more about the dragons than half the characters. Let’s pour one out for Rhaegal. How a flying dragon that can see for miles gets ambushed by a flotilla of giant pirate ships is a bit silly.

Patrick Long

nah there's a follow up scene where varys talks to ros where she confirms that they all thought he was casanova incarnate

Patrick Long

i think it simply relates to sansa's line that the 4 of them were the last of the starks

Leanne

Or possibly him trying to get Brienne to hate him so it hurts her less when he leaves? Some kind of noble BS is just barely possible, I suppose...

SiSilkzurre

While I enjoyed the episode I was not happy with everything. Just to name a few: 1. the parley setup made no sense at King's Landing, they are dealing with Cersei who is known to play dirty. Yet they line up in range near the walls, and even park Drogon there, when the ballistas are proven to have a very long range 2. I felt Rhaegar's death to be unbelieveable. You can't hit a flying constantly on the move target like a dragon and it's neck, especially with a crude tool like a ballista when its miles away. And 3 times in a row?! Nope 3. They shoot down Rhaegar with deadeye precision, but somehow Drogon gets plot armour and canno't be harmed while flying into a direct volley 4. Why does Varys think Jon is a good candidate for being king? Yeah he is a good guy and his heart is at the right place. But: he has zero politics skills, can be manipulated extremely easily and tends to make bad choices all the time. Basically he is similar to Tommen who Varys deemed unfit for the throne because he isn't strong enough. Varys even choose Daenerys because she can keep the nobility and the lords in check since she isn't afraid to use her powers. A good man don't necessarily make a good king, because sometimes the noble and good hearted decesions aren't the ones that make your people safe or your kingdom flourish. 5. How did they catch Missandei in the water, it made no sense to me. Also hearing Dracarys from a benevolent person from Naath was a bit weird. It felt out of character, even if she knew she won't get out of this alive. 6. How could Tyrion be so dense to bring up the only topic that you should not mention around Cersei? Namely her kids... (one of the smartest person on westeros makes a mistake, AGAIN) 7. The war tactics many times make no sense at all. No seasoned veteran would order such decisions we saw in the last two episodes. 8. Did we throw out this 'Break the wheel' thing? All of a sudden Daenerys lost her layers and vision and simply just wan't to do whatever the previous kings or queens did before her. No desire to change the system, even if she talked a lot about this before.

B

Why wouldn’t Bran tell Dany and his friends dragons are vulnerable to the arrows and an ambush will happen. Feels utterly stupid that no one is asking him or trying to utilize his knowledge. How about Tyrion? Shouldn’t he ask him some questions about what Cersei is up to? It’s been a big disappointment.

Patrick Long

i'm wondering whether jon can actually age now that he is undead? maybe he becomes an undying king much like the night king was

Carsten Behling

Why would Bran need to? Dany sat on a dragon that was being shot at, they know it already. They just somehow forgot to scout before sending in their expensive units

Joe Kenward

With regards to Rhaegal’s death, we saw last episode that he took substantial amounts of damage and early in this episode we saw him struggling to fly away from Winterfell indicating he was still pretty wounded. He wouldn’t have been able to dodge as easily as Drogon, plus the first scorpion bolt would have stunned him thus making him an easy target for the next two.

Steve Lee

Can someone please give me a show reason as to why it still appears to be summer in King's Landing? Season 7 ended with winter arriving and snow falling on KL.

Kazuhiro Sato

important question is: Is Vary a merman yet?

Janel Brattland

But the dragons are essentially characters on the show. Daenerys’ children. So we should feel upset when they die. Otherwise, they would just be props.

Kelly Theobald

Wow, that’s a great point about Varys/Jon. You’re absolutely right. And I was bothered by Missandei’s “dracarys,” too! Everyone on Twitter thinks it’s all badass, but...not really. That’s not who Missandei is at all. 😒

SiSilkzurre

Yeah you have some points, but Rhaegal was moving at the speed of Drogon and it was extremely far from the ships that were hiding behind the ridge. It felt like bad writing and lazy setting to be honest that ignored the details. First of all, the ships had no line of sight and it was a pretty big armada. There is no way that Daenerys would not notice them from a vantage point like that. Also ballistas are not that strong, and if you shoot it to such lengths upwards, it will loose its momentum as it flies, yet it rammed into the dragon full force and did ridiculous damage to the ship too. That is not how these siege weapons worked. o.O Also... it feels like nobody uses scouts in the Targaryen forces, they constantly get caught here and there by surprise. It's just not believeable that a navy like that won't be spotted as it moves, especially if you have a spy network like the spider's (Varys). Yeah I do believe that Rhaegal became a much easier target after the first spear, but the circumstances surrounding it weren't thought out properly in my opinion. The CGI and visuals were amazing, but I love GOT and ASOIAF for the nice attention to details, realistic and believable events. I feel like the final season is lacking on this department so far.

Janel Brattland

I felt a sense of despair between the end of the episode and the preview of Dany looking out the window at Dragonstone. After putting her quest on pause to help Jon and the North, she wasn’t much thanked by them even though she lost nearly all of her adopted people (the Dothraki), her dearest friend (Jorah), and half her army. Her lover essentially rejects her, and in what should have been a relatively happy moment returning to Dragonstone, she loses a child/dragon and one of her nearest friends and advisors. At the last ditch parlay, her eyes are red as if she has been crying, and there’s nothing she can do to stop the death of Missandei, someone who chose her as her leader. At this point, what has she got left beyond her quest for the iron throne?

Larysa Jaworski

1: Is Euron the Valonquar??????? My thoughts are that Euron will work out that Cersei's quite a bit more pregnant than she should be (if it were his). The word 'Valonquar' means 'younger brother', not necessarily YOUR younger brother (Your younger brother would be 'ñuha valonquar', whereas the witch said 'the valonquar'). What if it's EURON who strangles Cersei? He's certainly got the right 'personality' to get angry enough at her to strangle her. I thought Tyrion really missed an opportunity when he was talking about her pregnancy, he should have made it obvious and said something like 'Jaime fought with us against the dead and thankfully your child will still have its mother AND father'. I would have loved a good tight-shot on Euron's face at that time. 2: Missandei - WHY oh why didn't she grab Cersei and jump????? I mean, by that stage, when Cersei said the bit about her last words, she must have known that she was doomed, she should have thrown her arms around Cersei (her wrists were chained together, so there's that) and JUMPED. I mean, I know that would make the next two episodes a bit defunct, but I think it would have been awesome. Although, Dany's now well cranky. My other comments have to do with stuff that's pretty well covered already; Jon leaving without giving the good boi a cuddle (is it a foreshadowing of Jon leaving behind his 'Starkness'?), Dany not swinging Drogon around behind the ships and going all Dracarys on their arses, etc... And - is anyone else disappointed that the army didn't stop off at the Glovers for a 'little chat'...? (or do you think that'll be on next week?) It was also sad that Gendry got friendzoned - HARD. I feel sorry for him. All my other thoughts, re: Rhaegon being killed(?), Euron's fleet being 'invisible' etc have been posted.

Janel Brattland

Knew there would be a battle at Kings Landing, but didn’t expect Dany and the Unsullied to be going into it with this emotion. Had expected it to be more along the lines of The Spoils of War.

SiSilkzurre

Yes I was disappointed too, because I felt like it betrays the character. It was certainly badass, I don't deny it. However the encouragement of mass murder and destruction is not fitting for Missandei and probably tipped Dany towards thoughtlessness and pure vengeance. I did not expect this push from her. If they wan't to go by the route of complete unpredictability at least stay true to the people they portray. In my eyes it does not worth sacrificing set characteristics just for shock value. It makes me question the writing instead. :(

Ragnar

NK is dead. Winter is over. Snow goes poof?

Donna

The ending is turning out to be all bitter, no sweet. There are all sorts of spoilers floating around that are just horrible. So much for the coming together to fight together. Things fall apart. Nothing lasts forever. This isn’t a spoilers as it wasn’t mentioned in any of them. But Gendry wasn’t legitimized and granted Storms End for no reason. There is no wasted screen time in this show. Could we be headed to a Baratheon restoration compliments of all of Dany’s blood, fire, and sacrifice? That would be a twist.

Beth Brycki

Hey, did any of ya'll happen to notice at the end of the new title sequence, there are 4 dragons on the banner, one LARGE (Drogon) & 3 small (from eggs not yet discovered/revealed?) I think that's fairly significant, as nothing in the intro isn't well thought out and intentional.

Laura

Bran’s not having kids, and Sansa and Arya’s kids presumably wouldn’t have the Stark name. The name dies with this generation.

Maria Isabel Mendonça

It was quite interesting and curious when Tormund said to Jon he belongs to the real North.

Daniel Johnson

Varys’s issues with Dany are consistent with his character and not out of left field at all. Varys hates magic (it was a magic ceremony that led to his castration) and all authority based on such mystical power. His championing of Jon as the only plausible candidate based largely on gender and bloodline grounded the show in an in-world logic that’s been increasingly missing in recent seasons. And this was not out of nowhere. He’s never been a true believer in Dany and has seemed skeptical of her from the second he stepped foot in her camp. It was a relief to see Varys back in play and in a way that was true to character and past episodes

Janel Brattland

Was Rhaegal hit where he was injured in Ep 3? Undead Viserion scratched him on his belly. Did Viserion also bite him in the neck?

Coxer

I think this is the episode that showed clearly that when Martin said that the endings "would be pretty much the same" he was talking in a very broad sense. Maybe who will be in the throne, who will be alive etc.

Daniel Johnson

Nobody gives my theory any credit, but it would explain the mysterious dragon sound that scares Euron. So I'll say it again :). The books seem to foreshadow this: according to the WOIAF book, the stone dragon statues on dragonstone were forged using magic spells. I think they can be reawakened into real dragons and will at a pivotal moment. The foreshadowing is a moment when Davos is crossing the bridge on Dragonstone and the firelight flickering across the faces of the stone dragons gives him an eerie feeling that they are alive. There is also a line from Dany's vision in the house of the undying: From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire.

Naughty

I think Euron Greyjoy's the Valonqar. When Tyrion made his way to the gates to talk to Cersei he mentioned she should save her child from what is to come. How could Tyrion know she was pregnant by Euron's child unless she was pregnant before? Euron was standing right behind her when Tyrion said this and he certainly is not a stupid man and I'm sure he must be a bit weary trusting Cersei.. Euron could very well be the one that kills Cersei because of this. He fits the Valonqar prophecy because he is the younger brother of Balon Greyjoy. There must also be something for him to do as the newly raised "bad guy" in the next two episodes and I think it's this.

Kazuhiro Sato

Atl ShiftX explained it in e1 reviewing video.

Kazuhiro Sato

Cersei kind of implied to Tyrion that she was pregnant in episode of Dragon pit. The story misled viewers because the negotiation scene came after Euron & Cersei's conversation about her pregnancy. I thought WTF at first as well. But Euron is not that moron to kill her because her queen slept with her brother, it's common knowledge in seven kingdoms.

Kazuhiro Sato

What is a sex in ASOIAF (GoT), in general? Does it mean something other than acts for pleasure? The show has a lot of sex scenes; Arya and Gendry and Brienne and Jamie, which ended up terribly. Insects happened all over the realm; Cersei and Jamie and Jon and Danny(historically, Targaryen for bloodline).

Bungo

I think, aside from spending what little time they have left in the show's run on inconsequential party and "sex" scenes, one of the most frustrating things for me is that it feels entirely worthless to read anything into each episode. It seems like everything has to be a surprise and that foreshadowing doesn't matter, they dont really give you any scenes or lines that you can look back on during the rest of the week and draw any conclusions about how the rest of the series is going to play out.

B

My point is trying to highlight the stupidity of the writing. They made the characters utterly retarded. Not even Tyrion and Varyes have remotely good ideas that make sense. It’s insulting to the fans. The writers should be boycotted for this level of carelessness.

Tyler Wise

Can't Bran use his powers to spy on Cersei and get information? It's implied that Bloodraven used the same powers to obtain information as Master of Spies so why not have Bran do something similar with his powers?

Paul Barry

It’s funny; I find myself quite enjoying these episodes on a first watch, but as they sink in, I get more and more cranky until I almost can’t bear to rewatch it. Perhaps I should decide “And now my rewatching has ended.”. The two things that drove me crazy this time was the Jon/Dany scene, when surely Jon must’ve though back to poor Ned Stark, spoiled his honour by claiming he had a bastard, never told Jon, his wife, his family, his friends, his king, until he died. And if the similarity didn’t jump to mind (he did tell Dany the story only 2 episodes ago), surely she would’ve reminded him? Seems like pure contrivance to me. And Arya going south, presumably aiming to kill Cersei, how hard would it have been to have a discussion with Sansa ‘okay, so you want the soldiers to rest, I’ll go and try to kill her and y’all follow in a few weeks to mop up’. It’s just setting up another ‘surprise’ which again is due to pure contrivance and characters not having conversations you’d fully expect them to have. Don’t start me on the lack of scouting, but I’m used to that now, so I pretended to be surprised when the ballista shot appeared. Groan, it’s over in two episodes and I have to say, it now feels like an old friend who has gone off the rails, screwed up his life and never fails to disappoint. Now and then you see glimmers of your past friend (ep 2) so you hope for the best. But you know deep down, it’s gone.

Paul Barry

Though I should add, even on a rewatch, I did find the favouring of Jon and steady move against Dany more convincing than the Sansa/Arya plot last season. More nuanced and you can see what’s coming with Dany getting more burny and that being exactly what her detractors fear. That’s quite deftly done. Yeah, I hate that Jon didn’t listen, and Sansa didn’t keep her word, but it is in keeping with Sansa’s character. Varys is a frickin wind vane. She should’ve killed him long ago. But I care what happens, and can’t exactly predict how it turns out. That’s a vast improvement on last season.

Janel Brattland

Instead, I think Drogon will be wearing armor and that’s what Euron is scared of. Qyburn’s scorpions are then worthless against an armored dragon.

Caitlin E Wilson

In the trailer for episode 5. At 1:33 the fleet of ships.. The place looks like bravos when the waif was after Arya. You see the a bell tower like that. Maybe the faceless men will be helping and they are taking some faces of the lannister's victims with them

Kyle Geralds

It is the Dubrovnik (Croatia) clock tower and the view is from Ploče Gate, which the show uses as the view from the Red Keep.

Daniel Johnson

People are always referring to the prophecy that azor ahai will be reborn. But where EXACTLY does this prophecy exist? What is the book evidence for it? As far as I can remember it’s just a hunch that Melisandre had. Is there any more to it than that?

Kenny Arnold

I think that still jives with what he said in the 60 minutes interview. The major plotlines will likely be the same. Jon & Daenerys falling in love, complications between them because of Jon's parentage, Daenerys struggles in Westeros, Daenerys possibly burning kings landing. Not sure how the white walkers in the books and show will be different now because of what the show did.

Brennan Arceneaux

RE: Purpose of Bronn, I think this threat from Cersei is what pushed Jaime to go back to kill her. Pretty important plot point if that's the case. If only Jaime had been more clear about his motivation when he talked to Brienne, lawl

kamakazi

I interpret Ghost going back to his roots, his environment as a reflection of Jon's choice to partly let go or put aside his Stark identity to adopt and explore his Targaryen heritage . + a budget thing.

malina cureton

The whole Dany being a mad queen absolutely makes no sense and it is destroying her character and her arch. Such a major disappointment

Matthew Paddon

What exactly is the point of the three eyed raven? Ive been thinking about it alot lately and I cant quite make sense of it. So the TER represents the worlds memories, but why is this? Why can he see everything that was, is and is yet to come? What is his purpose? Im convinced this has to be answered in the final 2 episodes. The last oh shit moment thats been talked about?

Matthew Paddon

The more I think about it the more confused I get. Maybe Im looking at it way too deeply?

GothicSith

Literally Total War general speeches are better than Jon's haha

Hope Snow

I agree with you, Daniel. I think she’s going to wake those stone dragons on Dragonstone. Maybe she’ll need some blood magic though. Jon? Maybe we’ll get some Nissa Nissa after all.

Alt Shift X

It's coming in like ~12 hours! Sorry for the lack of updates, we're crunching to finish the vid