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Heart and Hand Extra - Work To Do (Patreon)

Published:
2024-08-15 16:00:14
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2026-06
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Content

Cammy is here with this weeks Extra as he and David discuss Tuesday's UCL exit, current situation of the club, what's needed and look forward to Saturdays league cup game against St Johnstone at Hampden.

As always. this show is ad-free for Patreon subscribers.

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Comments

Stace1ofthePeople

Seriously rangers please sign some decent players 🫣

Vanb bryceter

We are in for a hard shift this season the next 2 weeks will tell us just how hard its going to be. The board should be front and centre now this isnt Clements fault. Its beyond embarrassing the constant stream of incompetent decisions being made by this board.

Bob MacCallum

To say this squad is poorer is nonsense, David. McLaughlin, Jack, Roofe, McCrorie - how many games did they play in last season? Barisic, Lundstram Silva? Nobody was clamouring for them to stay! Only Sima is a miss from last season. Squad, on paper is BETTER - if new guys get up to speed eventually.

Alan Weir

I’m not sure you meant to say it, David, but you said, “Dessers is a finisher.” I could instantly mention, from this season, three attempts at lobbing a goalkeeper from inside the box, two good chances at Tynecastle and an excellent chance v Motherwell blasted over the bar. Dessers has scored twice, but I would suggest a good, competent finisher would have at least double that.

Doug

I don't think we can have VAR looking at second bookings when the outcome could differ for two players with essentially the same situation. I'm not sure the "has a chance to substitute" reason is valid as that is equal to both scenarios prior to the second offence. You'd still be introducing a scenario that's imbalanced at the point of the second offence. Plus depending on the situation you may not have any subs available so it's not a guaranteed out.

8luenose1872

Clement is far too cautious and negative atm to be a good manager for us. I know he needs players but the negativity hes showing is a massive worry. I hope its 100% a player problem but i was certain he was the manager for us last season when he first came in but im not anymore.

Mr Ritchie

Given his performance during the rest of the game I think it's unlikely the referee would have changed his mind if VAR had been able to intervene.

Andrew Whiteside

As with yesterday the board need to give us somethings big to believe in.

Heart and Hand
>>146638066

Yes but that’s what he does. Not often enough, but his skillset is goalscoring. He doesn’t hold it up or run channels.

Alan Weir
>>146638066

Fair enough. Dessers seemed to lose the ball in the middle third a lot on Tuesday, putting our defence under avoidable pressure. And the one thing our defence could do without is…

Craig Mcwhinnie

I’ll be completely honest, after almost 18 years as a season ticket holder I am Probably one of the most Optimistic Supporters out there, I always try to find the positives all the time, but even I’m struggling to believe we can come out of this transfer window any better than we went into it.

John Davidson

When Clement signed his extension I posted on here that I feared that the length of his contract would not effect his job security, the only thing that would do that would be fans running out of patience if results were not favourable. And, despite it being clear that there would be no short-term fix, my suspicion was that the majority of the support did not have the patience for how long this was likely to take. 4 games into the season, and one loss in the UCL qualifiers, it gives me no pleasure to be proven right. I can see no more likely outcome than a fourth successive year of an autumnal management change. The cycle needs to be broken for long-term benefit but it's hard to see how unless the board are prepared to make themselves even more unpopular with the fans if we receive a sustained run of bad results or a doing at Parkhead.

Steffen McAndrew

We are miles off it. We need a RB, LB, CD, CM, 1/2 wingers and aT least 1 STRIKER. This could have been seen by stevie wonder.

David Innes
>>146645250

I think you’re probably right - a bad enough run of results will spell the end of any manager at a big club regardless of their contractual status. I really hope it doesn’t happen though

Alan Spiden

Just a thought, but if a referee gives a player two yellow cards, could VAR not then look at both bookings? If either are then deemed not to be a booking then the red is rescinded and the player remains on, 1 or perhaps even zero, bookings?

Spoon

If we have got to the stage where the only way to better our output is buying our way out we are in real trouble. At no time in recent years have we shown any indication we are good at scouting players or spending money effectively. When did we bin set up or coaching as a route to improve ? In my own view the continual focus on players quality just doesn’t add or tell he full story, it is a component of the problem but not the main issue. None of our problems are exclusive, each issue probably amplifies the others but the idea we just need to accept that until we change the majority of the players we can’t set up a team that can consistently win doesn’t work for me. It ties into the critique of players which while I often agree with the over riding premise that the player isnt doing what we need I’m not always sure the working stands scrutiny. I will avoid labouring the Dessers assertions, “he isn’t this, he can’t do that” etc which I simply don’t agree with. The guys hold up is decent at times good, his link up is constantly improving but he is hamstrung by little in terms of quality or support from his colleagues. We aren’t a clinical team, we don’t set up to have meaningful control or pressure in games the way others including our rivals do. When we do have concerted pressure we don’t have anyone in the middle to front who is good at working a chance, taking a shot or finishing and while some might focus on the 9 what are the rest doing? Sterling, McAusland, Lawrence all missed chances midweek but only Dessers is labelled the problem ? Not for me gents. Are we genuinely setting up to maximise the only fit striker we do have ? I don’t think so and it now seems we have just accepted and excused Clement for being wedded to a strategy and philosophy despite seeing it fail week on week. Use what we have better should be the first goal not bemoan what we dont have, or worse slate what we do. The biggest problem any player has in the current squad is that they play regularly or have been here for a few seasons and become the ‘reason’ we are crap. As soon as they aren’t a new signing they are branded rubbish and not good enough where guys who sit on the bench, in limbo or play a few games for the B team are suddenly world beaters, its not only madness but incredibly short sighted to my mind. Danilo is a classic example, he is rapidly becoming the new Roofe and yet the weight of expectation on him is immense. It seems to just be accepted now that him coming back will immediately improve things, to my mind he wasn’t that great before he got injured, he didn’t hold up the ball any better than Dessers and he wasn’t any more clinical. We have absolutely no idea what he can bring to the team or if he can even produce the levels he had pre injury. It’s just a weird blind faith or desperate hope. I also think his size and style dont suit our league or the lone striker set up but I may well be proven wrong, I cenrtainly hope so as for £30k a week and £6 million he will need to go some. For some time this team, squad, set up hasnt been prolific across the line up. We have at times had the occasional guy who chips in with decent numbers, ironically most recent the whipping boys Tav and Dessers being the biggest contributors. The fact we havent even shown an interest in Shankland or the manager apparently doesnt seem to rate him is worrying, not only would he be the perfect back up 9 we could finally bin the single striker nonsense and play him up alongside Dessers, with Igamane if we very see him or even as the mythical 10. The big issue, for me at least, isn’t the players, it isn’t the off field stuff (that is an issue but shouldn’t impact match day) , it isn’t the injuries to me it’s is the manager getting the most out of what he has, is he developing players and can we see a path to better things. I don’t think he is and some of his comment and responses to pointed questions is concerning: I didn’t like Beale, I didn’t believe the hype and I absolutely detested being told to pipe down he just needs to get his players in and a chance. I didn’t see the bounce others did, to me the players who had downed tools just briefly picked them up until it got hard again. The guy was clueless, classless and a charlatan in how he acted and behaved. I watched Gio hounded out the door after finding himself a goal away from euro win and a board doing his legs while fans cut him zero slack for not getting the players he needed. I just can’t buy in again to this it’s not Clements issue. Yes he doesn’t have a great squad but it’s no worse than it was at various times in recent years and we still got more out of our team. I’m not articulating this well but I can’t just give Clement a pass when he is falling into the Beale banter trap. I can’t relate to the Dessers is view when we hounded out the last goal scorer we had in Colak instead of working out how to maximise his talents and minimise his deficiencies, I can’t invest in Danilo who’s played a handful of minutes and can’t get fit enough to play. I don’t have the energy to buy into the new guys coming in for a few games showing flashes then becoming the next great white hopes. I can’t see the transfer strategy of buying loads of guys for the future that we hope to sell on when we dont improve them or win enough to make them desirable. We might get our money back on some guys we sell but we rarely make profit we can then invest to up our levels and improve our squad. The money we made from guys like Paterson or Bassey was simply wasted on guys like Dowell or Davies. Like many others I’m just scunnered watching what seems to be some avoidable mistakes, some poor decision making but mostly the reality that we have no real plan from the board to fix this. The amount of resources, time and good will this board have burnt through is incredible. It’s finally taking its toll. It’s clear that this he solution can’t be bought for us, we could maybe expect to see a few lower level signings but its hard as we sit here to believe the board have targets that would improve things significantly in the short to medium term and every year our position erodes and we start a bit further back. I understand the views you guys put forward on the pod, I agree totally with the sentiment and the themes just not sure if worked to the conclusion the same way you guys did. At least I got another free Rangers therapy session from H&H so for that I thank you !

Heart and Hand
>>146651862

His hold-up play is occasionally good but he has nights like Tuesday when it bounces off him constantly. But yeah, I absolutely agree on the coaching. If it’s the case that a manager can’t improve us without buying, we’re in bother. (I accept he might not be able to coach us up to league-winning level - that does take quality - but I don’t buy this ‘he can’t do anything’ idea.)

Spoon
>>146651862

David, absolutely agree on consistency of output from Dessers, as Gattuso once famously said “Sometimes a little bit good, sometimes a little bit….”. I totally get the frustration and limitations of Dessers, I can’t accept the often totalitarian views of him, eg he can’t do X, he absolutely can do most things a striker needs to, can he do it regularly enough to paper over our current issues no he can’t but thats a wider problem thats not fair to put solely on him. If he could do the things we want him to be able to I simply dont believe he plays for us or we can afford him. That then comes back to how do we cover his faults with others and give him the best platform to perform for us to an acceptable level, thats where Clement is failing. As I say mate, Im hurting like the rest of us, we all hurt slightly differently and focus on the areas that frustrate us personally. I totally agree with what you and Cammy said just perhaps think some are in danger of creating bogeymen that really aren’t the scariest part of what we are seeing. I also think it gives a bit of an out to others or avoids other equally concerning issues to focus solely on player quality, we used to take guys like Broadfoot and make them players in a team and set up that gave them clear roles and asked them to do what they were good at. Sadly it all feels like a house built on sand and when we sort one part another collapses. Seen worse over the years but the pain you live with is always worse than the pain you get through. The pods keep me sane and give me a vent, i write these to unload baggage and I am constantly astounded when someone actually replies and doesn’t just write me off as an old (ish) man shouting at clouds. H&H should be publicly funded as a third sector support network !

Scott Watson

If we want a CEO who's already been a football CEO and done a good job, what market are we shopping in?

Mikey anderson

Davey…I’m sorry you just said ‘Dessers is finisher’ What 😂😂😂

Billy Forrester
>>146651862

Spoon I agree with everything u have said, i wish u could sit with our board and manger for half an hour and explain all this to them as they are either blind to the obvious or they are too pig headed to change. I didn’t see a great deal from Danilo prior to his injury so I don’t pin a lot of hope on him whatsoever when and if he returns. He will be no better than Dessers.

Billy Forrester
>>146638066

Shankland would have double his goal tally by now, that boy is a proven finisher who doesn’t miss half as many chances as our striker. I can’t for the life of me see why we don’t sign the boy, our team is crying out for him and he is also a very very good player who can link it and play in others

Billy Forrester
>>146637263

To be fair to Bob he has a valid point, what did the guys who left add to our team last year, mcrorie didn’t play, Jack was injured constantly, roofe same, Barisic was poor and fans slated him, same with lundstrum who towed caravans, silva was horrendous so I don’t get either how we are weaker. Apart from sima and Goldson who we now have cerny and propper in place of I can’t see either how we are weaker. We screamed blue murder to get rid of 90 % of them last season. I think this team will be stronger when we get a rythm going and the evidence is there as we have 4 points from 2 games so far, last season we had 3 from 2 and also lost qualifiers

Greg

" we are going to come on to cyriel dessers" I swear it's cammys favourite subject

Spoon
>>146651862

Billy, I certainly don’t want to write the boy off he might well be a decent striker and could indeed just have the X factor we need. I just can’t get excited about a guy who’s played limited minutes and even if we project his goals return on the small sample he was on track for the low 20’s which is no better than we have. In his best seasons 20 is a high water mark for the boy in terms of goals and it is still puzzling why Beale went for a guy who was in effect an impact sub in Holland for a lot of his time in the top league thinking he would make him a starter or main striker. He might well just click better into the system, or by being more pacey give something different but I tend to think that in the £3-£6 million bracket you pretty much get the same level of striker with the same output, the strengths and weaknesses might be different but the overall output is probably about the same. I don’t think our set up gets much more than 30 goals out of a 9 at peak and that still leaves the rest with a lot to contribute. If we gave Dessers the pens and he scored 50% of them he would be a 30 goal striker. If we get rid of Tav or he stays but can’t reach the same levels, or isn’t used the same way and kept back we need another 20 goals from across the team. It’s hard right now to see where those come from. I just can’t logically give the guy scoring goals the flak while ignoring the others missing or not scoring at all. The link up and ball through to McAusland mid week for example was perfect, McAusland was through on keeper and choked a shot straight at him but Dessers gets labelled as having no hold up or link up in some quarters. Even more telling is that had Dessers missed that chance he would be getting called a dud by some, Sterling had a great chance to score with the head, Lawrence dallied on the ball in the box unable to get it out his feet and shoot but the focus is on Dessers for some. Again though, he isnt perfect and I do want more from him, the difference maybe is I can see enough in him to hope he does better, gets sharper or kicks on with better people around him. Some seem to want to go the other way and denigrate what he does. I can see their point to an extent but not writing the boy off or making out his contribution isnt one of the only positives we are getting from the squad where it seems being injured is favourable to playing every 90 but missing a few chances. Let’s hope we are both wrong about Danilo and he comes back physically and mentally strong. I wouldn’t even be adverse to seeing us having a D&D partnership up from playing together to try and get the best from both, I still maintain the 9 is too isolated and the 10 as we play it currently isn’t effective either in the press, the chance creation or the transition into defence. Sadly, and I am in no way saying I want him out, Clement seems to be maximising the weaknesses of the squad the way its being used and the focus on players coming in to improve us but when they land he doesn’t play them for ‘reasons’ is a bit bizarre. Most managers would be throwing new guys in hoping for the freshness and energy they bring and to change it up. My biggest red flag recently was seeing Barron become the ghost of Lundstrum sitting in the 18 yard box. IF we nullify that boy by dragging him into a role where he takes the ball from Propper or Souttar both of who are ball playing centre backs then I will be close to done. I cannot watch a box to box midfielder wasted like that, especially when anyone can see of all our options the most natural fit for a screening defensive mid is Sterling. Am I the only one worried that we have seen a lot of young enthusiastic player come in only to have the spark coached out of them and dragged down to our turgid levels. Playing Sterling as the 6 doesnt get you the killer forward pass (Dio and Barron would do that) but it gets you dig, legs and energy in the engine room and covering the space in front of our defence to in behind our creative guys. Im not tactics expert but it seems obvious and if you are looking to play forward quick he can just be missed out going forward if we go long. You get security and a fire fighter snuffing out danger and let the more creative guys, well create or drive forward. The whole mood isn’t helped as the worry now is always that we are back to square one or we have seen this movie before and though some of the actors have changed we know how the story plays out. Lets hope this time theres a plot twist, and its not that Barron takes of his mask scooby doo style and its Lundstrum in there !

jason hart

On the tactics agree you can see some degree of logic in what he was trying to do BUT the whole contain them wit until there tired then bring on cerny .. surely this is what you deploy away from home .. but the toothless performance is beyond me .. deploy that tactic with such a fragile limited squad is risky .. if they score early were in big trouble ... getting beat is hard to take but going out without a fight is soul destroying

Granters
>>146651862

I disagree. I thought Danilo looked a level above Dessers pre-injury. Much better all round game. Remains to be seen what we’ll get from him post-injury, but if we can get him back to what he was then he starts ahead of Dessers every day of the week.

Gordon Millar
>>146637263

I agree Bob, although it's maybe too early to declare this? The support to a man, woman and child called for a clear out, a reset in our playing squad at the end of last season, some even agreed that it would take some time to correct the many errors in our recruitment that our Board sanctioned. I accept that things could have moved at a better pace in this window given the importance of the early games, but surely nobody can't deny that a squad rebuild ihas begun. It seems that we are a support that has run out of patience, understandably, but we simply must get behind the manager and team.......as much as I am frustrated at the ridiculous position we are in, we cannot go down the same path of replacing a manager mid season, we must allow him to rebuild the team and hold our nerve.....why, because we cannot replace the Board and we can't magic up money to buy the quality we need now. My hope is that we can add some quality using whatever means possible, players moving our etc before the window shutsi. t's a completely unacceptable position to be in but what sensible alternatives do we have?

James

Kyiv did next to nothing in the first 45 either. The teams were very balanced. We can all see the deficiencies but the money isn’t there to radically change thigns. We seem to be in a spiral as a support where we see the worst in everything. It isn’t helping the team or the manager.

Graham Jones

Good analysis and rational discussion of where we’re at. The fact we hadn’t appointed a CEO going into this game, when over two weeks ago we were told an appointment was imminent concerned me. It speaks of a lack of focus within the club. To be honest I expect something else to pop up, mainly because of the lack of a structured approach to doing everything the club needs to do. Bennet loves the club, and nobody would doubt that, but that isn’t a qualification to run the club. John’s good at making money, but not by building a business and running it every day. He makes money on the stock market, not through a business like a football club. He has criticised things at the club that have happened under his watch or while he was on the board. That doesn’t mean step down a chairman, but put someone in charge of running the football club. David Holmes was put in charge of running Rangers and had the power to make decisions, and I think we need someone who can act in that way again. Dave King had his faults, but I just think he would’ve avoided a lot of the pitfalls that the present board have walked straight into.

Spoon
>>146651862

Granters, didn’t see it myself, his pedigree doesn’t suggest it either, time will tell. He goes a few games not scoring the pressure will mount.

chris smith

The ref was at it all nite. Period.

John Myles

It’s the sympathy vote kyiv knew this and played on it all night

stevan castrissios

The discussion reminded me of a Transglobal Underground sample. “Lookee here, good things come to those that wait”, “Yeah but i think you and me been waitin too long.” Enjoyed reading the comments. For me and for this season we just need to bring in some players please, good ones that don’t get injured. This would dilute my exasperation and encourage a bit of patience. We are where we are and it’s painful. Note to self, don’t get too down this season and enjoy what there is to enjoy. I agree with Spoon re Danilo. We will see.

Alastair McGeoch

Not a criticism of the pod, but again we are searching for hope. “The board need to take responsibility” - they wont. We know this because they haven’t over the past 3 seasons. “We need a reaction from the players” - will I be surprised if it’s an insipid exit from the league cup at the weekend? I’ll be raging, but not surprised. This squad is weaker than previous seasons where they have failed multiple times to react to bad results. And this squad are clear that both the fans and the manager don’t rate the majority of them anymore. We clearly don’t have the cash to do anymore this window so it’s going to be season where we stand still. It’s all a bit meh…

Graham Ellis

This board should have budgeted for Europa League with Champions League being a bonus. I say should as it's hard to say what this board do when it comes to planning, with little obvious signs of it happening. I won't be surprised if there's no new arrivals. We NEED several players who are starting quality, but honestly don't see it happening now. We have little to tempt quality players to come right now. I may just be unable to see the positives right now due to recent events, but can't see us signing anyone of note between now and the end of the window.

Chris Graham 🇬🇧🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

Cammy highlighting that these are not new problems for me is exactly what I have been feeling This isn’t a new thing Direction is rudderless and has been for easily 2 years maybe more

Luke

In terms of the rule, they should check both yellow cards at the time of the red and make sure they are happy with both.

Alan Weir
>>146638066

The obvious reason is we have no money, and still have Cantwell, Hagi, Wright, Tav, Lowry, Matondo taking a wage.

JimGLW

Really good analysis lads. Very sobering and we're in for a rough season.

Al-WATP

We’ve only got a couple of weeks to bring in much needed signings and they’ll then need what, 4 or 5 weeks of easing them in to make absolutely sure they’re as fit as can be before we’ll see them properly ? Who knows what position we’ll be in then😬

Al-WATP
>>146651862

Some amazing posts Spoon 👍🏻👏🏻, completely agree with everything you said particularly around the manager, Danilo and Barron. Spot on brother.

DEREK DICKSON

Since Gio was shoved out the door we have nose-dived in all respects to do with the running of the club. Playing home games at hampden is the straw that broke the camels back. I'm fearful of reaching an even lower low than just now. I have absolute zero confidence in the board. I really am shitting it with regards to how bad it needs to get before it gets better. Clement has my backing but even pep would struggle with this job at present. I don't see enough players sweating their balls off for the club which is annoying as I can see it in other, no disrespect intended, lesser clubs. I love my club and I can't remember a time when I was more frustrated than I am now.