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4x23 (Patreon)

Published:
2023-03-19 21:20:17
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

Last one of the weekend😭 we will post the next last of us episode as soon as it is filmed this week!

Comments

Gee.Ali

How are you guys sooo fast??!!,

Jenny

Thank you for the uploads!

D D
>>104436194

Every time they post I rush to the comment section to see if farkzzy got it. Congrats 🥳😂😂

Jenny

Yayyy it's good to see Levi again :D

TheRealBilaal

sunday and we alr done w all the episodes for the week, i wish there were infinite episodes forever😭

aotant

Thank you for all the uploads this weekend!!! You are amazing!

Kalib Holland

The titans in the wall were created after the Great Titan War. The war was between all the Eldian families who held the 9 Titans and after the war King Fritz fled to Paradis and created the walls.

Megan Kirby

I’m with cannon on Annie’s character. Although I empathize with her, it’s hard to forgive her when she sadistically murdered the scouts. She treated them like they were toys.

Megan Kirby

“There’s no way he told him that” welp😂 I mean trusted the right person to help make therumbling possible.

Arun Randhawa
>>104437275

its basically the same with eren. she did what she had to do to get back home. erens doing what he has to do to save his friends.

Melizé

"Just a harmless fellow" 😅😇 I miss Hange

James

I've always wondered how Levi is able to breath through those bandages covering his face.

nomorepartiezz

Mappa but all of their budget for this episode into the horse riding animation 😂

nomorepartiezz

small detail but i love the aesthetic for these few episodes after the rumbling starts. the constant sunset color is beautiful and its haunting just having titans constantly marching in every background shot.

Mia Malvik

Gabi should've changed her name to Mia. I'm not biased at all I promise

T K

It's taking all of Carter to defend Eren😭loyal to the bitter end lmaoo

Megan Kirby
>>104437275

Absolutely! I just didn't like how Annie went about killing those people. Like when she swung that scout around. Not that it really makes a difference, killing people is still wrong.

Santiago

Don’t remember if you guys answered this before but are we getting the part 3 reaction with Briggs?

James
>>104437275

At this point, I'm willing to forgive Annie for whatever she did in the past so that she can help save billions of people, most of who probably do not have the same hatred we've seen in Marley.

Mia Malvik

I'm with Carter tho. The innocent Eldians dying is really sad, but honestly I don't think Eren had the luxury (time, options) to execute the rumbling without any casualties. He was probably never gonna get another shot at it, so he had to just go for it. And if he informed the people beforehand so they could evacuate, literally everyone would know his plan and he likely wouldn't succeed. In terms of Floch, I think he goes too far in order to achieve the goal that is inherently a decent one. It's like he's gotten a bit lost in the power. I love your discussions about it🙌🏼

Reckless

bruh, who said that... Carter has the best takes so far

L.Lindberg

Zeke's plan would have caused the least harm, all things considered. They would still have the rumbling to use as leverage, executing the plan of a small rumbling to keep the world at bay, and then everyone could have lived out their lives "in peace". That said, a world at war it a shitty place. Marley and the rest or the world are using the past as an excuse to justify their greed, their wish to own and to possess, perpetrating the same old sins over and over.

Mia Malvik
>>104439343

Need to add that I never thought Carter would kinda side with Eren lol. Way back in season 1 I remember thinking he'd be so disappointed with his development 😂 I am pleasantly surprised

Santiago

Watching Floch shoot that guy in front of Jean reminds me of how Yelena killed Griez when she was explaining the euthanasia plan to Armin and the gang. Floch sees Eren as a devil and Yelena sees Zeke as a god. Both are fanatical and willing to murder whoever doubts their Yeagers’ ideology.

CHIEF

I just love that everyone suddenly sides with the outside world once they start losing, sucks to suck I guess. Eren didn't even know they existed before season 3 so why do you think he would care about them? I love this conversation I just feel like so many people aren't honest with themselves about what exactly is happening.

Kim555

16:55 asshole, I saw that smirk

Berndelta
>>104440760

It's not siding with the outside world, it's siding with not being a genocidal monster

freeeeee

Erwin did the same thing as Eren did in season 1 when he planned the entire thing to capture Annie. He literally let civilians die too for the greater good when Eren and Annie fought. That's a better example for your argument at the end instead of the final charge.

anna
>>104440760

yeah facts – i feel like many choose what seems moral to them as a reader/viewer, when if they were in that situation they would act in a completely different way and the morality of our world should low-key be disconnected from this story. And not because genocide is not wrong (it is, but that's not what this story is trying to tell you, it's already been established), but because of all the events happening before it it's not surprising it all lead to this. Someone would have done it, if not Eren then who comes after. Or after. Or Marley would have eradicated the island's population before that could have happened – which would not have been better from a moral point of view. Accepting Eren's action does not make you a genocidal monster because this is NOT the real world. It's about understanding what can possibly happen after a century of hate and discrimination. me how there are those questions "which AOT military regiment would you join?" and everyine immediately says "oh, the scouts 100%" when irl they would literally fight over the MP places lmao

Santiago
>>104440760

The point is Eren is basically becoming everything that he hated Reiner and the Marley warriors for. He’s continuing the cycle of violence on innocent civilians that had nothing to do with what happened to his home when Marley attacked. We hated what happened to our favorite characters on Paradise so why would we want that for millions of people who did nothing?

Izaya

Damn, the way Brigg got COMPLETELY DISINTERESTED in the show after episode 21 is crazy.

anna

Floch turned out like this because he went through literal hell. I think what happened to him is underestimated. Being the sole survivor while EVERYONE, even your commander was shredded to bits by giant rocks? I would have required constant care after that at a mental hospital. It's crazy. But I suppose he still had to find meaning in what happened to him and his comrades. And that something is not humanity in its entirety, but the survival of his homeland, what he thought all of humanity was for the majority of his life. He is ruthless and his acts are disgusting, but he became a devil to reach his goal - he is often compared to Erwin for a reason, and it's understandable people don't like that, but I find that lowkey hyporcitical because Erwin was painted in a very positive light the entire story while Floch is written the opposite way. The story wants you to see him as a negative character, an opposition to Armin and the rest but he really is just fighting for Paradis, sacrificing everything and everyone to reach that one thing. And I wouldn't have sympathy for a nation who killed all of my friends either. And I don't think many of the fallen scouts either, but the Alliance decided that they dedicated their hearts to stopping Eren when in reality there is no way of knowing whether, for example, Erwin would have supported him or not. Just for the credit, I'm not a Yeagerist and I don't even like Floch. This is just my take on him after understanding his character after countless of rewatch.

James
>>104440760

Eren maybe winning now, but I have never read or watched a story where the character who is consumed with hatred and revenge (turns into an actual monster), and is trying to kill millions/billions of people (for the better or worse), actually succeeds. I haven't read the manga yet, and I could be wrong though.

Shiro

Carter, I am disappointed, Cannon and Jackson were on point post-discussion. There is no comparison between Eren and Erwin at all. Erwin, being the commander, was operating with very specific objectives - their job was to scout the area beyond the walls and once they are introduced to Eren, his mission was to reclaim Maria and Shiganshina. Of course, his Stohess mission to capture Annie was a huge huge risk, and had they not captured her and had there not been the subsequent threat from the Beast titan and Ragako village, Erwin would have been hauled over the coals for sacrificing the lives of the civilians. Even though he gambles the lives of the soldiers, he is answerable to their govt. Eren, on the other hand, well...he is a god at this point and just wants to destroy everything for a perverse idea of freedom. It is a miracle that none of the OG squad, Floch, Gabi, etc. died when the walls came undone. I mean Bertholdt kicked the walls of Shiganshina and Trost and so many people died. This is nothing short of an earthquake that is greater than 7.0 on the Richter scale. Yes, there will be comparable damage on Paradis and beyond Paradis.

__JMN
>>104439343

Spoiler if you haven't watched the final chapters part 1: I think Floch's death scene after shooting the flying boat made me understand him more. He genuinely felt the same way as Eren, that if his people/nation had any chance of survival, the full rumbling was the only way. He allowed Eren, "their devil" to commit the most egregious sin against the world on their behalf if it meant their survival. He just wanted Eldia to survive. It's also a big change form his character at the end of season 3 when he resented Eren for allowing Erwin to die instead of Armin.

anna
>>104442383

It's not just the perverse idea of freedom, but the survival of Paradis, what, mind you, Erwin also fought for, because he didn't know (just suspected) humanity did not perish. And he gambled human life for it, it doesn't matter that they were soldiers because no human life is expendable. None of the scouts signed up for death, they just accepted it as a consequence while still fearing it (like most humans do). Eren is not a parallel to Erwin, but in this one aspect he is similar to him, because he too focuses on something that sees as the greater good and sacrifices countless lives for it. And yes, those people were innocent, not part of the military, but they indirectly caused the discrimination of Eldians solely for hating them and calling the islanders 'devils'. That doesn't mean that they got it coming, but it's also understandable while Eren prioritises Paradis against them. Erwin is the goat but he is a morally questionable character, not the heroic commander people make him out to be (because the story portrays him as such).

Berndelta
>>104440760

@Anna it does lol. It's pretty simple. The "rest of the world" is an enormous generalization. The amount of innocent people who had absolutely nothing to do with any of this vastly outnumbers those people in power who ARE to blame. It's legitimately black and white. People are only supporting Eren because he's the main character that we've been with from the start. Look at Gabi. She was adamantly against the "island devils" but she was able to come around and see why she was wrong. To start seeing them as people. All Eren is doing is taking that chance away from the millions or billions of innocent people around the world who don't know any better and had nothing to do with things

Mia Malvik
>>104439343

Great point. The end of his character arc is excellent, it doesn't excuse his unnecessary violence towards his own people but it strips away everything and exposes his core values. I actually quite like him

anna
>>104440760

She changed her mind because she was directly exposed to 'the island devils'. You can't do that to the entire world because said world indirectly contributed to the continuation of hate against Eldians while Marley exploited their power, becoming no better than the Eldian Empire was. Said innocent people kicked and beat Eldians seen outside the internment zones (and the one in Liberio was supposed to be the best one...). It doesn't matter how many people were innocent because they were completely fine with blaming the entirety of Paradis for any problem they had. They could have negotiated, sure. They could have shown 'the devils of Paradis' are seeking peace. We all knew how that went though from a later episode. I'm just a first year psych student so I don't know much, but I know that it's a basic principle of social psychology is that people do not change their views easily. You are saying it would be easy for them to change everything they know. Gabi could be influenced to change her mind because she was still 12, how do you expect an 80 years old Marleyan to suddenly accept a nation who you had to hate all your life because that's what they thaught to you? Eren didn't want to gamble the survival of the island based on a "maybe'. Accusing people for being an "eren does nothing wrong believer" or a genocidal monster is pretty redundant because that means you did not take the entire context of the story into consideration and you are jumping into conclusions about people based on what they think of a fictional nation.

James
>>104440760

@anna Hatred leads to the cycle of violence, and this could be what this story is trying to tell us (actually, we now know what Eren represented to AoT's creator Isayama, but don't look this up if you haven't read the manga). I don't understand why it's so hard core that Eren either has to commit genocide, or else, the people on Paradis island will be killed. In literature, we call this a "false dilemma," and I haven't seen any evidence against the idea that both non-Elidians and Eldians can coexist in the world. Sure, some people on Paradis island have already tried changing the minds in Marley, but it's not something that can be done within a short time period. When some members of the Survey corps decided to team up with members from Marley, that was a first step in the right direction. What if the story does end up with a world where Eldians and everyone else are coexisting to a more or lesser extent? Are you going to be disappointed?

anna
>>104440760

Definitely not gonna be disappointed, but I didn't see a chance of that happening in the story. I read the manga so i'll leave this part at that because I saw you didn't so I don't want to say anything about it. But earlier (like when the scouts had that trip to Marley) it was shown pretty clearly how much Eldians of Paradis was hated. For 2000 years they couldn't live in peace (the Eldians and the rest). How do you expect that to change? I'm not agreeing with Eren, I just don't like how people are switching sides while completely forgetting what Marley did to Paradis. I'm not saying Eren's actions are justified, I just think it shows how many people outside the island indirectly contributed to the hate (just like in real life many unsuspecting, seemingly innocent citizens contribute to racism with even the smallest of actions) against Eldians and it was just a matter of time until a monster like Eren was created.

nomorepartiezz

lol its only perfect that cannon and carter would end up being on complete opposite sides lol. this is why season 4 brings lots of arguments despite how good it is lol

nomorepartiezz
>>104440760

“why should he care about them” them why is he racked with guilt and literally sobbing like a maniac to Ramzi about it in the latest episode? he literally knows what he’s doing is evil and wrong, he just chooses to do it anyways because his desire for “freedom” overrides his sense of morality.

nomorepartiezz
>>104440760

“why should he care about them when he didnt even know they existed before season 3” ok so do you support Gabi killing Sasha, bashing that random guards head into a pulp, and then constantly going on racist rants and trying to kill Kaya multiple times? she never met the “island devils” or knew they existed as actual people until season 4. even she eventually realizes thats wrong when shes like 12 years old.

Synad
>>104439343

I'm actually surprised I rarely if ever see people talking about the controlled rumbling option. Shiganshina was evacuated beforehand, Eren could have tore down the walls there as planned by Armin and the MP with minimal casualties and performed a nation level threat display for those who refuse to have a diplomatic angle (as originally attempted). All that though needs Eren to be all there, which I think he's not anymore. I really think the poor man has lost it by this point in the story since he's seeing past and future memories and it messes with his head to the point where maybe he's not really thinking straight. That's when we get his "all or nothing" attitude where he just goes all out with the rumbling. I think a lot more people should look at how our own history developed, at least in Europe, where for hundreds of years nations rose and fall, wars ravaged the lands and yet at some point the people attempted for diplomatic way of doing things. It didn't work the first time, of course, the League of Nations that was formed after WW1 was a proto European Union that needed to be refined as an idea after another tragic war, but after a lot of hard work between the nations Europe is now relatively peaceful even after such a blood stained history. For how long it may stand, I don't know, but it seems to be working for the most part, just look how Germany and France are NOT trying to kill each other. I know it might be silly to compare real world history with an imaginary story, but Isayama's vision is nuanced enough I think that considering these parallels are not too dumb. I think Armin had the right idea thinking that a controlled rumbling could have helped them, at least when it comes to this world's geopolitics. The 9 titan issue, however, I don't know a proper fix for that.

Berndelta
>>104440760

@Anna nobody is calling anyone here a genocidal monster lol. The only genocidal monster is Eren. And you keep saying "they" referring to the outside world. Who is "they"?? I know you wanted to separate the real world logic from fiction, but is every citizen of every country responsible for what the others do? Was every German responsible for the Holocaust? Is every middle eastern citizen responsible for terrorist attacks? Or even for thehatred? You brought up racism. Was every white person in America responsible for the racism against black people? For segregation? Hell, even for slavery? It's easy to just say "they" and generalize entire countries or even the whole rest of the world. But that isn't right.

James
>>104440760

@anna Yes, I understand now. You're looking at this through the eyes of a psychology student with objectively analyzing the different perspectives from all sides which is fine. Most people in here are approaching this debate through feelings and instincts, and you're responding to people who are seemingly anti-yeagerists who are not considering what had lead to the building of hatred in Eren. Now when I think about it, Marley precipitated the environment that lead to the monster Eren has become, and Eren's action are not justify, and based on pure hate and revenge. I don't think either side is "right," and understanding what leads people to become so destructive can help us in the future.

anna
>>104440760

@berndelta You are right about that, but then the author could have went out of his way to provide some evidence that there were people for example in Marley who had no problem against Eldians, island devil or not. But we didn't get that, everyone who changed his mind were people directly exposed to Eldians or Paradis, eventually seeing that they are good, and ciitzens of other nations mainly fighting for their own gain (Hizuru, volunteers). And I find that to be Isayama's fault, because despite being an amazing storyteller he didn't give this arc enough development. I wasn't reading the manga in real time so I have no idea how much time passed between each chapter, but there must have been a rush. Also a lot of pressure. I think he also wanted to end the story specifically on chapter 139.

Xilema95
>>104444445

ikr? Im literally wishing to have some popcorns while Im watching this debate they're having

anna
>>104440760

@James yes i completely agree with that. I'm not an expert in human psychology though so I most likely make mistakes as well. When i first watched this season I actually heavily opposed what Eren did too and supported the Armin and the others with my whole heart. I don't think either side is right either, from a moral point of view I agree with the alliance the most. But this entire debate within the fandom perfectly captures the split within Eren's group too, it's interesting how different humans think

nomorepartiezz
>>104439343

idk to me you can’t use the excuse of “im doing it for my people” when you kill tons of them and dont even show an ounce of remorse for it. people seem to forget that Zeke turning all the people into titans was literally part of Eren and Flochs plan. maybe Zeke was the one who set it in motion and did it, but clearly they were fine enough with it to go along with the plan overall. When Hange confronts Floch about the wine he literally laughs at her like a psychopath and mocks her by shushing her. isnt he supposedly Erens mouthpiece? lol. he also clearly has no remorse for any of the millions of Eldians outside the walls that he’s trampling to death including his own grandparents. i guess he never considered them “his people” but its still worth noting. Eren still had four years left. he could’ve used a partial rumbling to buy a few decades of time and then figured something else out.

Joie Dianzon 🇵🇭

I remember someone saying that Levi could have woken up once just to yell at Hange for recklessly throwing him on that wooden thing. 😂 Anyway, I love the contradictions between Carter and Cannon. Whoever guessed that Cannon would be a Jaegerist was so wrong, I thought he would never get onboard such a crazy idea. I was wrong about Carter, though but it's okay. That is what makes their reactions interesting. 😁 I like Magath, actually. He's not so much as an Erwin type leader but more of a father type. I believe he's a Marleyan (no armbands) but look at how he treats the Eldian warriors. If Erwin had been alive and they interacted, I can see them having so much respect for each other.

nomorepartiezz
>>104439343

i also think its kinda weird when people/Carter dismiss that sort of stuff as “necessary casualties” or kind of shrug it off like “they were probably gonna die anyways.” im more with Cannon. like huh…? those are all individual people. you cant just brush that off. people love to talk about Erens mom and how they understand where he’s becoming from because of what he saw but then when Eren is purposefully creating that same situation MILLIONS of other times across the entire planet including for his own people its just dismissed like an abstract concept.

Mia Malvik
>>104439343

I personally don't bring up the controlled rumbling option simply because I think it's a bad plan, and there's no guarantee it would secure Eldia's future, which is the main objective. It might scare off the rest of the world for a short period of time, but it's very likely it would only be temporary, and that in the future they would be under attack again. Then it would be too late. And I love comparing aot to the real world and our history, but in terms of picking a side in this scenario, I don't think the real world is very relevant. Purely because of the huge difference with the fact that eldians are biologically a threat to other human beings. There's no way they can truly convince the rest of the world that they're harmless, because their dna says otherwise. I think it's naive to believe that the rest of the world would feel safe with their existence when they know they can turn into actual monsters. So basically, I only see conflict download the line and the most realistic outcome would be that the rest of the world unite to wipe out their common enemy, the eldians

nomorepartiezz
>>104442383

no reason to be disappointed lol, id rather he give his real opinion. personally i might get heated bc its a really well written moral/philosophical debate and im a passionate arguer lol. but like its also just a show

James

These reaction videos make more interesting and entertaining when Cannon and Carter have opposing views.

anna
>>104442383

exactly though, they are stating their opinions. no one is paying here to get a carefully curated answer based on what the fandom may or may not think. so i'm glad they are honest and it's interesting to see their arguements and their way of thinking.

Markus

Jeez, I can't believe how many people see this whole conflict as either black or white. No nuance in the slightest, it's either of the two extremes: 1. Eren's 100% justified in killing the rest of the world, screw the x amount of civilians and Eldians or 2. Eren is a genocidal maniac, always has been. Paradis should just accept their fate, because it's the most utilitarian option and it will lead to "world peace"

nomorepartiezz
>>104441684

the difference is that while Erwin might have also been viewed as cruel for throwing tons of lives away for his goals, he was ALWAYS right there with them. whenever he had to throw a shit ton of lives away he was doing the same. thats how he lost his arm and how he was one of the first ones to get smashed in by one of Zekes rocks. I know Floch had his fighting moments and lead the fight at the ports which i respect him for, but its not the same to me. When Erwin overthrew the government he did it without violence, he simply outsmarted everyone, showed them the error of their ways, revealed the truth to the world and let everyone react the way they wanted. Floch immediately goes psycho fascist the millisecond he gains power. His very first instincts are to bomb his own military, turn half of them into titans, pressure recruits into beating the life out of esteemed and respectable commanders, and then start executing people and ranting about submission. clearly not the same. it really annoys me when people act like Floch is carrying on Erwins legacy or is the same as him.

Rae

Eren's my favorite character in the whole series but he really is a half-assed piece of shit and worse than Reiner for doing what he's doing. He even said so himself in the recent episode. He's doing the rumbling to protect Paradis and his friends but he also said, "It's more than that... when I learned that humanity was alive outside the walls I was so disappointed. I wanted this... I wanted to wipe everything away." His selfishness and twisted sense of freedom just adds more complexity to his character and I absolutely love it.

Savannah Balderas

Loved the discussion afterwards, Im always stuck in the middle between this argument. I just see both sides so well that its hard for me to say just one side is right. I guess Im team Carter and team Cannon at this point 😂

nomorepartiezz
>>104441684

and like Cannon said Erwin threw away the lives of those who volunteered for him and were specifically in his responsibility/care. he orders people to throw their lives away alongside him but he also gave them an opp floch and eren are throwing away lives by simply not caring who they trample on or murder in their way, innocent or not. its the the difference between leading and bossing around.

Mia Malvik
>>104446602

I don't think this is accurate at all, picking a 'side' doesnt mean you can't see the complexity of the situation and the pros and cons of all possible options. It's just a tool to help the discussion and honestly it's a lot more fun lol. I can genuinely agree with both sides but I lean somewhat more to one so I'm picking that one because being stuck in the middle doesn't get anyone anywhere

Allsports Athletics

Can someone ask Cannon what about the Civilians in Stohess District that Erwin killed just to capture Annie? HE killed hudreds or innonocent people back then but nobody dared oppose him? Hange and Levi literally praising him, yet now when Eren does it its different?

Andrea Hernandez
>>104440760

@anna We start from two realities: Objective is that which we cannot deny and that regardless of whether we understand it or not, it will affect us all equally, just as gravity does with us, no matter if we are good or bad gravity exists and affects us equally. Subjective is that which is proper to the subject, they are points of view that may well differ from those of other people or not, but even so, they do not affect the objectivity of the object in question, in other words, my subjective opinion will not affect the existing reality of the object. Objective truths are undeniable truths, which even by attempting to deny them you actually deny your assertion, such as the statement "There is no truth". Morality is objective, the way in which people have applied it is subjective. Subjective morality poses the ignorance of objective rules. Each human being is free to dictate his own rules of behavior, therefore, there are no moral or immoral people. For example: We are wrong if we believe that torturing puppies for fun is a morally wrong act, or the actions of a pedophile. For in such an action there is no objective property that tells us precisely that it is immoral.

anna
>>104441684

I'm not saying he is carrying on his legacy or is the same as Erwin. I said he was a parallel to him, but Floch was painted in a more negative light than Erwin was. I cannot justify his violence because I hated him for it as well. but i also want to add that they were facing two very different situations. Erwin had to fight against people trying to cover up the secret of the outside world, something which would have eventually led to them getting genocided without even expecting it. Floch had to deal with an imminent threat which required fast reaction, having the support of people already on his side. He could have tried to outsmart the higher-ups as well but I don't see how it could have happened – that doesn't mean him blowing up the supreme commander and shooting everyone was the right way, i'm just saying it's a different situation. I think there is no way of knowing what Erwin would have done if he was in his place.

anna
>>104441684

I think even if those were soldiers Erwin bossed around they were still humans whose lives shouldn't have been treated as chess pieces. They were not expendable and he should have operated in a way that required the LEAST amount of human sacrifice. But he didn't and sadly that's what made him so successful. Maybe I shouldn't bring up Stohess as an example since something like that only happened once, but that operation required many innocent sacrifice too, but Erwin still agreed to do it.

anna
>>104446602

@mia you are right but there are definitely extremists in the fandom lol – these too ends of the spectrum are not necessarily present in the comment section, at least not in a significant amount, but some people do pick a side only seeing one of the two absolutes

Andrea Hernandez
>>104440760

the fact that many of you project your responses onto others, and dare to label them as "politically correct" is laughable, since you yourselves use a "reality" to justify what is abhorrent: "If you were in that situation..." you say; but what do you know how many people would act like Sasha's father?. Because you assume that everybody will act like you or Eren XD You know that there is a Jewish mother who protects Palestinians, Orthodox and Jews, alike, from terrorist attacks, and she lost her daughter in one. What bothers me is when you say: in real life I'm not like that XD then how is it? morality is only applied in real life, but not in fiction, is that it? like a T-shirt that you put on and take off at will? Then you cannot use as an example "if you were in that situation..." because you are trying to put the subject in a fictitious scenario but applicable to a reality...a complete contradiction, like there is no truth.

nomorepartiezz
>>104446957

yep. if it was truly all about just protecting the island he had other options. nothing perfect but better than wiping out the human race.

Mohammad Ziad

I wonder what eren would’ve responded if floch asked him “what’s wrong with living in submission?”

nomorepartiezz
>>104448088

erwin would be sick to his stomach at that line but people always wanna act like floch is his reincarnation or something

James
>>104446602

If you already read the manga, you can go online and see what Isayama intended for Eren to represent, but I understand that he left the story widely open to interpretation.

Hamza Jirrari

Armin said once , people who can't sacrifice anything can't change anything

sesaka
>>104439343

Id like to see you come up with a solution to all of this that doesnt result in anybody dying.

Markus
>>104446602

I'm not talking about people leaning more to either side, everyone will have more sympathy for one over the other. I'm referring to comments that doesn't consider the pros/cons and make it seem like everything is either fully justified or that it's pure evil.

jul ☽

HAHAHAHAH omg I love how Carter's just like yeah those ppl would have been dead anyway with Marley invading and Zeke having spawned 200 titans

Rae
>>104447055

I think it’s because with Erwin, he didn’t intentionally kill the civilians in Stohess. His goal was to capture Annie and unfortunately the civilian casualties were unintended collateral damage. Eren is purposefully and directly targeting and killing innocent civilians. I don’t think what Erwin did is remotely comparable to Eren’s actions but to each their own.

Rae
>>104446957

I find it so odd that people are just dismissing this crucial detail and still think his actions are justifiable just because they think he’s doing it for Paradis. But I do understand anime watchers who miss it because a lot is going on visually while Eren’s confessing his feelings to Ramzi.

Markus
>>104448088

People will only defend Floch because he's fighting for Paradis and for being Eren's "right hand" in all of this.

Jayden Hart

The discussion at the end of the videos are so good. I would have to side with cannon and jack though.

James
>>104440760

@Andrea I can tell you have studied philosophy especially with your difference between objective and subjective truths, and I remember that puppies example from a philosophy class I took years ago. What is right, and what is wrong is determined by society. In modern society, taking actions to ensure the well-being of everyone and actions based on rational thinking is generally accepted as a “right” thing to do. Of course, this depends on who you think should be taken care of. We’re given no evidence that every single person in the AoT world has an unconditional hatred towards Eldians, and it’s the government of other countries that are referenced and not the people within a given country. If we gave Ukraine nuclear weapons, and then they decided to nuke every single Russian from the face of the Earth, would we consider that a righteous act in modern society? No, we wouldn’t despite what Russia has done to Ukraine. I’m inclined to believe there are good non-Eldians in the AoT world which we already saw in part 3.

James
>>104447055

I think Erwin was careless in his plan to capture Annie, but at least the plan involved taking Annie underground where they can try to minimize civilian casualties. When the plan didn’t go to plan as expected, the MP did put Erwin in handcuffs for a short while and even threatening to shoot him. Eren on the other hand, not only cause causalities on the island, he is planning to kill more innocent civilians around the world unless we’re assuming that every person in the AoT world has some kind of desire to get rid of Eldians. He even might go on to destroy the country of Hizuru, the country that tried helping Paradis island.

Darren Pangan

Objectively speaking, what Eren is doing is wrong. But putting myself into his shoes, I can't confidently say that I will not do the same thing. Thankfully I'm not oppressed and don't have the power of the rumbling so I don't have to really worry about that. First, I think Brig made a good point about Zeke and Eren fighting over Ymir. In Eren's mind, he probably thinks it's rumbling now or euthanize the Eldians and no third or fourth option, we don't know. Second, Eren almost his whole life was driven towards exterminating his enemies - the Titans. And then he found out the truth about the Titans, that they're not the real enemies. I think his rage over the Titans shifted towards the world who he thinks hates him and his race and sees them as his enemies.

Lukeasbot

Eren is in the right. So were Reiner, Bertholdt, Annie, and Zeke. They were all just trying to save their worlds.

YourGirl

mckay's backwards hat is absolutely fire

YourGirl

sad everyone was coming @ Carter so hard this ep, our jaegerist king!!

Yoyo

Remember, Erwin came up with the plan to capture Annie inside Trost knowing full well she and Eren could transform and fight and kill many civilians, and exactly that did happen, so the parallels between Eren and Erwin are definitely there.

Rae

I’m with Jackson and Cannon. The whole “well they were gonna die anyway” feels so flippant and dismissive and callous tbh. The fact that Eren’s actions caused the deaths of the very people he says he’s going to protect is very ironic.

Lukeasbot
>>104456595

would you rather: kill 100 people OR kill 10 people? Its that simple. Everyone on Paradis Island was likely going to die, unless the whole world just has a change of heart, if Eren didn't do it.

Bob

I agree the Annie backstory is a bit cheap. It's too little too late for me. But I had love in my life growing up. To a starving person a whole french fry is a feast. Annie latched onto the tiniest bit of love, even if it was at the last possible moment.

kiiturii
>>104456595

hold on, that doesn't work. Because if we're talking kill counts, then Erens plan is FAR beyond any other option, I mean it's literally mass genocide on the entire population of the world. Erens plan here is definitely not the "kill 10 people" option

kiiturii
>>104447055

I think you forget how Erwin was literally improsoned for his deeds. Eren is basically playing god, no one can do anything about him, and the only person he listens to is himself. This is also Erens plan A, while Erwin did *everything* he could for the situation to not have casualties

Kim555
>>104450992

What eren and the yeagerists are doing is basically what we call fascism. I don't see a single reason to side with them unless you're cheering for evil

TheRealBilaal
>>104456595

theyre not talking about everyone, just the people inside the walls. because its either everyone in the walls die or just the people near the walls

TheRealBilaal
>>104457064

i feel like they shouldve shown more than the brutal training maybe him tucking her in bed or anything just to show despite how brutal the training is he does care about her as a daughter. idk just a thoughg

TheRealBilaal
>>104444445

part of me is lit like, noo dont argue😭 in the same way idw the scouts to fight eren, but it is nice to get the different points of view and some good discussions

TheRealBilaal
>>104437275

yeah i agree, but its nice that her character did develop somewhat despite her being frozen for 4 years

kiiturii
>>104456595

and why should the civilians outside the walls not be considered?

xhy

Erwin did sacrifice innocent citizens in S1E23-25 when Eren and Annie fought it out in the Trost District, but its on a different scale tho. Not that this could justify what Eren or the Yeagerists are doing rt now.

moonlightdove

the comments are extra vicious today

tskjn
>>104447055

To the people here who say the casualties in Stohess were accidental... what would you expect if you try to capture a dangerous well trained soldier who could turn into a gigantic killing machine in the middle of a crowded city in broad daylight?? It's not comparable to Eren's but let's not put Erwin on a pedestal please. Even HE knows he sits on top of a mass grave

anna
>>104457064

i think writing annie out of the story for the majority of the manga/show only to be reintroduced in the last few chapters was a huge mistake. i'm not saying her character is bad and after reading about her I feel like I understand her more, I just wish she was explored a bit more. Her coming back at this point feels like a plot device to me with a quick backstory and that's it

T. Law

I freaked out when I didn't see Cannon 😂.

T. Law

Wow, Cannon left me speechless! It's cheap for sure. But I somehow understand her father more than Grisha. Grisha was convinced at that time that there was nothing wrong with the way he treated Zeke but Annie's dad was 'pretending' to be evil, maybe?

Rukum
>>104456595

Because they hated eldians? it was either fight the entire world or just letting the world kill their entire race. In their world, they wanted to get rid of eldians, treated them terribly and in the end declared a war on the island. (Remember willy's speech). When eren fights back, how is it so wrong all of a sudden? If you have a better alternative, I would love to hear it tbh because I couldn't find any. I think they did everything they could to stop it .

T. Law

The way Carter ignored Cannon and asked 'do you guys understand what I'm saying?' 😂. It's the best thing to do once Cannon starts defending Erwin 😂.

James
>>104456595

Eren didn’t have to un-harden the walls when he obtained the Founding Titan’s powers. He could have sent a message to every Eldian on Paradis island saying something like “Hey guys, please move away from the walls.” He’s not in his right state of mind, and at this point, he is hell-bent on killing everyone outside of the walls without consideration for who is Eldian or now.

T. Law

32:06 ❤️.

James
>>104455267

Except Eren has intent to kill billions of people, and I’m assuming most of those people do not have some kind of desire to kill all Eldians. Eren even might trampled on Hizuru which is the country that has been supportive of Paradis island.

A_Daddy Daichi

I don't think it matters if someone loses their cool or not. If you get things done, you get them done.

A_Daddy Daichi
>>104437275

true but it's understandable because she simply just didn't care based on how she grew up

A_Daddy Daichi

This show is so interesting. Remember “Everyone is a slave to something” Each character has different and/or similar upbringings. I thinks it’s good to at least try to understand why some characters do what they do. Why did they become this way? What happened when they were a kid? A young adult? Why would we think they’d do something else when what they experienced growing up can explain all their actions? I should’ve gone into psychology since it interests me so much lol. Anyways I’m just throwing up some questions that come to mind. Thanks for giving your honest reactions. I think it’s actually really cool to not agree on certain things all the time. I’m not right with my takes all the time and I change my mind a lot because I want to stay open-minded. That’s what makes discussions fun and intriguing.

Jag_227

There is a world where Willy Tybur makes his speech and riles up the world against Eren and Paradis and Eren chose not to kill Willy Tybur immediately after that proclamation. Instead, he could have remained on the island and waited for an attack, if it ever came. He could have used the FT and the Rumbling as a defensive weapon, pushing back attacks sent against Paradis. In the meantime, Paradis could attempt communication with other nations, trying to convince them that Paradis is not evil and wants peace. But, Eren did kill Willy Tybur in front of the world media. That choice heightened tensions and began the violence between Marley and Paradis. I disagree with people that claim Eren is acting in self-defense by killing the rest of the world. He wanted this. That attack on Willy Tybur is a massive turning point.

Allsports Athletics
>>104447055

Eren killed innocent Eldians on the island and it wasnt on purpose, it was to start his plan to protect Paradis. Just as Erwin killed inoccent civilians to capture an enemy. Its the same thing, nobody is talking about kills outside the walls here.

Mr. Simpson
>>104501248

I really don't think the attack in Liberio was a turning point. A majority of the world's nations were already meeting there in order to declare war on Paradis. The Rumbling is self defense, it's an end to the vicious cycle of violence that has gone on for 2,000 years. There was only two ways to end the cycle - The death of all Eldians, or the death of everyone else. Eren understood this, and his choice of the death of everyone else is the defense of his people.

Jag_227
>>104501248

Nations sent representatives to Liberio, but it was not pre-meditated that they were all going to declare war on Paradise. Some of these nations were just at war with Marley. They are not close allies. They have their own interests. Willy was calling for a joint attack, yes. But Eren is the one that declared war and made himself the enemy in front of the world media. Yes, the Rumbling is a means of self defense. Killing the rest of humanity is not defense. Eren even admits it was a childish fantasy of his to make the world like he dreamed of in Armins book. It's not ending a 2,000 year cycle of violence, it's just restarting it at the beginning.

Kei

Here’s a scenario You are living in your house with your family, minding your effing businesss. When your neighbours come into your house and starts killing them one by one. Why you ask? Because the previous owner of the house was a criminal and they killed a lot of people. Therefore, because u & your family live there, that means you are the same and need to be killed. Their justification? - they need to kill your family in order to save the neighbourhood. You tried to tell them over & over again but everyone have decided that is who you are. So your choice would be to be the ‘bigger’ person & be ‘noble’ about it - and let them continue killing your family because the previous owner ‘sinned’ greatly towards other people. Or you can stand up against these bullies that continue to harass your family. Or maybe you can continue to have ‘trying to explain’ to people who is deaf. Oh but wait, you only have a limited time - because you are sick so you only have 24 hours left to live. How will you protect your family. Is it wrong to kill other people who is going to kill you & your family? How do you weigh which lives are more precious. Is it because the neighbours are the majority therefore they are worth more? If you are the third party, you would say sacrifice that one small family in that house in order to save the neighbourhood. But I ask you, if it was your family, would you say yes, sure I am at fault for living at this house, and therefore my family need to atone for the sin of this previous owner, so for the greater benefit of everyone, I will accept the decision of this neighbourhood of killing my whole family. So tell me, is Eren wrong? The Paradis people lived inside the walls not knowing anything but also not bothering outside world. They were just living like animals inside a cage. How many scouts died outside the wall whilst trying to learn how to deal with titan. They were behind on so many things. Were they a threat to the outside world, hell they couldn’t even go far. And yet who decided to come and break the walls & the peace - was it because they felt scared & threatened? No, it was because of greed - they wanted resources & power. And somehow who was again the victims of this action - the Paradis people. But they justified it with what? They are the devils that humanity was saved from through ‘hero’ Helos. They deserve it because they are a devil race. Fast forward, Marley have lost their battle - which was initiated for their desire for power in the first place, not fear. And the world turned against Marley because they lost their power (which they more than deserve it). Then old Willy Tybur conveniently decide this is the time to ‘expose’ the truth about that ancient war. Because he needs to get people off Marley's back and chose Paradis people as the scapegoat. Hey, did I tell you that it wasn’t helos who saved everyone, it was the devils king aka fritz. ‘The world’ was temporarily confused, but how funny how that no one seemed to care that long. Why did no one asks if that was true, then why the hell did we punish those people all these years? why did we look at them as devil if actually they were the one who saved humanity? Oh no, it completely went to now there’s a rebellious guy inside the wall who have taken that power and he is dangerous so lets all unite and declare war on the Paradis island. Am I the only one who thinks how ludicrous that is? And the whole world brushed off the facts that for so many years they have punished the Paradis island on the basis of the original story but now, hey they are still the bad people because currently they have a guy who decided that enough is enough. Majority of the world is full of people like Gabi - if you can see how unbending her opinion on Paradis island then you should be able to understand. When the scouts went on a trip to Marley to try ‘discuss’ & forge alliance to Ymir’s protection group - who remembers what the outcome of the ‘protection group assembly’ was. Why do you think after that trip, Eren left to carry out the plan. They declared subjects of Ymir outside the walls should be freed, but devils of Paradis should be killed. Who is the continuous scapegoat in all of these scenarios? Let’s always change the narrative that is convenient for ‘the rest of world’ to use paradis people as scapegoat. So I’m sorry but I say Eren have no fault in this matter for what he decided to do. Its not for revenge nor for control, its because no one seemed to think Paradis people are worth anything, so Eren gave up his humanity to protect them, because the world have no humanity to offer the Paradis people. So if anyone wants to put the blame of innocent lives died from rumbling- put the blame on freaking Marley. And no, just because Eren has no fault in his decision, doesn’t mean Floch gets to do what he wants. So I don’t agree with the statement if you agree with Eren, then you agree with Floch. Sorry for the rant

James
>>104515350

Eren is taking revenge for the death of his mother which is one of the reasons why he is destroying the world. And Gabi did change her mind of the people on Paradis island. When she realizes that there are no devils on the island, we saw the symbolism with the bird cages; she's been free from the hatred from within her. AoT's creator Isayama has reportedly confirmed that this is a story about getting rid of hate rather than acting out on it.

Kim555

Is there an estimated date for The Last of Us episode 6?

James
>>104501248

@Mr. Simpson It was Eldians who conquer the world for 2,000 years before fighting each other in the Great Titan War, so the rumbling wasn't in response to that. The choice doesn't have to be binary in terms of who survives, and we should actually wait until we see how the story plays out.

metalgearbear
>>104457064

That second paragraph is such a great way to frame it, nicely done. And yeah it came really late in the game. Isayama teased us hardcore in S1 with Annie having some good backstory then said nope, no more until season 4 lol

metalgearbear
>>104439343

It isn't about resulting in nobody dying - nobody here is naively saying that. It's about what can be done to minimize loss of large number of lives. Eren killing the entire world is basically a middle finger to any/all people. It doesn't account for nations/large swaths of people who have no issue with Eldians. Heck, you can't even say he's doing this for Eldians since he's literally killing anyone who isn't on the island.

metalgearbear

A very nice mechanism Isayama used for S4 was basically kicking the audience out of Eren's head (up until the tail end that is). So we're left to the narration of the rest of the, very confused, characters trying to figure out why is Eren doing what he is. It's an interesting method to have the audience grapple with the morality and ambiguity of what's happening. That being said, it gets even more interesting towards the end when we get more information on the "why" behind what he did.

The RZA

I LOVE your content...but y is AOT patreon suddenly so far behind?

humbleandkindness

so many things to say about my thoughts on what's right or wrong so prepare yourselves

humbleandkindness

TLDR: AOT 3x2 11:44-13:34; figuring out who's right or wrong isn’t what the main cast has to do, at this point it’s a matter of choosing who they’re going to kill/let die The whole debate about which of these two options (Paradis genocide vs. global genocide) is the right thing to do, is really interesting to me because of course when you look at it comparatively, losing less lives is the better option. But: 1) we have the luxury of not having to actually make this decision or suffer the consequences ourselves; and, 2) Eren's not going to try and save as many lives as possible, even if he CAN see past the prejudice he had for his enemies and understand that he’d be killing millions to billions of innocent people. I think the best way to understand what might be going through Eren’s head would be going back to 3x2, after Armin killed one of Kenny’s squad members to save Jean’s life. Levi basically says that Jean is alive not only because armin shot the driver, but also because she hesitated, and at this point, trying to decide whether or not you’re doing the right thing is pointless. Who knows if you're doing is the right thing? Even for us as an audience, there isn’t a clear choice about what to do now. No one can create a realistic, probable solution that would end AOT's main conflict without major bloodshed, inside the world Isayama has created or out of it. All you can do is choose who you kill/save: your enemy or your friends. Anyone directly exposed to and/or affected by this decision (Paradis, Marley, and anyone with Eldian blood) who hesitates to act, on either side of the conflict, is either dead or about to be. Everyone left fighting is all in, and they’ll sacrifice whatever it takes to achieve their goals. There’s no time in the heat of the moment to feel bad about what you’re doing. Just like Eren says, “all there is left is to keep moving forward.” Given what we know about Eren, it’s pretty obvious what his choice is, and collateral damage is a byproduct he won’t try to prevent. The only people left we know (??? Kind of know) he really cares about are his friends from the 104th. I’m not sure eren really cares even about the Eldian race, so all of the lives that are lost in Paradis when he starts the rumbling aren’t a big deal to him as long as it’s not someone he’s trying to protect personally, aka our main cast. Those guys are also extremely tough to kill (have a lot of plot armor lol), so he’s probably not too worried about a little bit of destruction because he’s sure they’ll be fine. Right now the difference between Eren and everyone else is that he's ONLY trying to protect his friends and his dream, and that he understands the weight of what he has to do to succeed (we can see that in 4x5 when he's talking to Reiner, and in the beginning of the new special episode). He's gotten to know the people he's going to slaughter later, and he's learned for himself that they're not all bad- they only know what they've been taught (ie. even if we haven't met them, all Eldians/people outside the wall are bad, Ymir was a god/devil, etc). Knowing this, Eren acts anyways, even though outside those in his close circle (and even inside it, RIP Sasha), the people he grew up with and knows will most likely die in order for him to succeed. I don't think we can say that anyone outside his friends can understand the kind of weight/responsibility in that decision, if even them. They come to terms with that at the end of season 4, but they don't have the resources or strength to do it at such a large scale. Only Eren has the power to actually decide to do that globally. He has to make the choice alone. Taking everything into consideration about what eren has experienced and who he is, the whole situation comes down to one question. Who is eren going to kill: his friends, or his enemies? I was lucky enough to be born far away from anything resembling AOT's kind of conflict in this world, but if I'd been born into Eren's shoes, I'd choose the same thing. For that reason, although the Jaegerists drive me insane and I don't see me calling myself one any time soon, I also can't see myself siding with anyone BUT eren. Another thing I find interesting that I don’t have the energy to type out right now is how this idea interacts with and applies to 3x10 16:29-17:26, but if anyone's willing to chime in...

humbleandkindness

hehe srry everyone I'm just vv passionate about this

Phos Phryne
>>104515350

"So tell me, is Eren wrong?" YES Stop being a fascist and in the words of Hange "Genocide is evil"

Winifred
>>104456595

Eren is fighting back but honestly he just wanted to wipe out humanity outside the walls so that he could attain his twisted image of freedom, even if he found another way to save his people he would not have changed his mind about the rumbling.

Unika Ang
>>104501248

That's true. When a more powerful threat emerges, the enemy becomes an ally. Eren makes his own choice to keep moving toward hell after kissing Hisistoria's hand and realizing that the world outide wall is different from what he saw in Armin's book. He was so disappointed and childish that he wanted to use the rumbling to gain a brand-new earth, to gain his so-called freedom

Jag_227
>>104501248

Eren's motivations are very complex and contradictory. That's what makes this story and his decisions so challenging to understand

JJ
>>104456595

The eldians in other countries were traitors they were literally okay with everyone on paradis being slaughtered why would Eren spare them?? Lol

James
>>104456595

The Eldians in Marley were brainwashed into thinking the Eldians on Paradis Island were pure devils. There was also the Eldian resistance fighters, the Restorationists, who were fighting back against Marley. And there's no reason to wipe out the country of Hizuru (if Eren is planning to do so) which has been supportive of the Eldian people.

BassettHolland

Carter being a die hard jaegerist just like me is why he’s my favorite 😭

Mamox
>>104515350

makes you realize why facism is growing again, and far right ideologies are on the rise the last few years. The author himself has said its a story about letting go of hate, which eren has not. Even the author thinks eren is the bad guy in the end, yet so many people still agree with him lmao. Its nuts, really insightful as to why so many people fall down these ideologies in real life.

Arben
>>104515350

this is so silly lmao. Eren is killing every single person in the entire world—other Eldians, children, countries which were also oppressed by Marley—and all you can think of is "well it's like if all those people broke into my house and tried to kill me, so it's justified". Yes, it's complicated because Eldians are feared and hated the world over, but it's not so complicated that your offensively simple analogy manages to properly describe it. It's hard for me to imagine missing the point of the story so absolutely horribly!

jonathan spector

It looks like the last 2 aot videos were taken off YouTube and they haven’t posted since :/

Anonymous
>>104708726

no on patreon they start posting every week on fridays and the weekend. so basically they'll release the rest of the episodes tomorrow and on saturday and sunday.

jonathan spector
>>104708726

They post every weekday on YouTube and the videos they posed on Monday and Tuesday are gone and they haven’t posted anything else since

Данила Костин
>>104708726

Go to comunity tab on youtube, they posted that their channel got 3 strikes for copyright violations, they are trying to fix the issue but will still post on patreon

Tomislav Pijanec

Carter is Floch 100%, man is defending genocide, and the reason for the genocide being ok is that they would have potentially died anyways.

BoredVoid

You guys sounded a little quiet in comparison to the video in this one. I couldn't really hear you guys, which was annoying since you talked over a lot of this episode.

Doodlez
>>104789970

If you would have 2 options sacrifice your whole famaly and all your loved ones to save the rest of humanity or sacrifice all of humanity to save your famaly and loved once who in there right mind would sacrifice all of their famaly "just" to save people he never met. For me im behind Erens decision BUT Im against killing like everyone "just" send the continet back into stoneage. Maybe killing like 80% of all people or something like that.

Doodlez
>>104534384

So your saying Eren is doing that for his friends? But in the last special everyone on board of that aircraft are the people he is doing it for. And he still trys to kill them so if he would have shot them down and they all died, isnt the rumbling like pointless to him? Cause theres noone around he cares for. I think he is trying to save the Island(his home) and saving his friends is just a bonus if they will die trying to stop him thats very bad but he will still conitnue and do anything to save the island. On the other hand in season 4 ep 28 he said hes doing all of that for his friends and that say can live a happy long live. His contradicting himself there.

metalgearbear
>>104789970

@Doodlez, that's a poor comparison since objectively you would sacrifice your family for the rest of humanity. It's not as black and white as "us vs. them" because you have no idea how many of the "them" are actually against you here. There's potentially plenty of nations that weren't at Marley's declaration speech. And even the other nations that were there do not represent all of their people, so you could have so much of the world that has nothing against Eldians. You would be killing more innocent people and your justification for it would be at least you killed the ones you felt were the most threat? That's a poor reason on every front: philosophical, moral, and objectivity.

humbleandkindness
>>104534384

I actually really like that eren contradicts himself ! Isayama is a very smart author and wouldn’t make this sort of continuity mistake, especially not for such an important plot point, so there are two possible options we can take away from Eren’s contradictions: 1) He’s gone insane and is past the point of any sort of help, or 2) He’s lying and can’t keep everything straight Personally I really hope it’s the second one, but who knows really, maybe Isayama has it out for eren lol

Lag Sold

I’m now convinced Jack hasn’t watched this bc he hasn’t seen the part where eren tells floch his plans

Joshua Stephenson

Her Dad has to be Eldian because he saw the Eren’s vision.

Hennessy Jed

00:57 “Carter’s Floch” nah, he’s right, he’s Jean.. I’m Floch lmao

Macy Bokhari

Specifically in response to Erwin and all the people that died for the greater good of his plans volunteered for it - there are people who died that didn't volunteer. All the civilians of Trost had no idea or warning that a huge fight was about to go down between titan Annie and Eren. Potentially, the people of Orvud too - they were used as bait - but the Scouts and Historia made quick work of Rod Reiss's titan so most were spared.

Jay

(Such a nerdy detail rip sorry) But I think the airship's other term is 'zeppelin'!

Chase Blevins
>>104515350

Couldn’t have said it any better. I still think Eren should have targeted Marley and then the military bases…but at the same time…the only reason he is doing it…is because he can’t guarantee he is protecting his friends from retaliation unless he wipes out as much as he plans to. Either way you spin it…the situation is quite screwed. 😅

Chase Blevins
>>104515350

Couldn’t have said it any better. I still think Eren should have targeted Marley and then the military bases…but at the same time…the only reason he is doing it…is because he can’t guarantee he is protecting his friends from retaliation unless he wipes out as much as he plans to. Either way you spin it…the situation is quite screwed. 😅

Daniel Kofman

Carter -- If Erwin hadn't gambled those lives Eldia would have been eaten alive. He had no choice, and his "selfish" goal isn't even that selfish cause its perfectly aligned with what humanity's goal should be, knowledge. Without the critical information Eldia would never escape its doom, Erwin simply made the hard decisions someone had to make

Someone Someone
>>105056891

everyone here's chill, dont think anyone who isnt boosting their own ego would consider that nerdy, its a nice detail from you :))

april 🍏

While I agree with Cannon, I do think that the Erwin comparison is a good one. Erwin did sacrifice so many lives in order to attempt to fulfill his dream- just on a smaller scale. It was one of the reasons I felt that Erwin shouldn't have gotten the serum.

lydia

I knew Cannon and Jack are anti-jaeger from the start haha. My intuition can’t lie ✌🏻

rayman
>>104872602

Jack has apparently seen everything but continues to literally know nothing, remember nothing, and acts like everything is brand new to him. It's so weird. He remembers none of the key points.

smiv

I'll never understand Carter's take on eren. It seems like he thinks that doing it for his friends makes genocide okay? I don't get how you can excuse the most horrible actions just because he's doing it for the people he cares about. Eren could be doing this for eternal world peace and curing cancer and it still wouldn't excuse the fact that he is commiting mass genocide on billions of completely innocent people.

Kpop Tart
>>104789970

Well guess what, this is anime. We get that it is morally wrong. However, a moral compass usually disappears for most people when it comes to fiction. Have you never in your entire life wished for the death/suffering of a fictional character that you found annoying/was evil etc? Does that make you a murderer or a psychopath with homicidal tendencies? No.

Kpop Tart
>>104452466

Oh look, we have a genius here. Please grace us with your wisdom. 🙄

smiv
>>115044331

Lmfao what is the point in this reply? It seems like you couldn't think of a good argument against it but it made you angry so you had to reply for some reason.

Sanji
>>115044331

Honestly I would trade a one time genocide for eternal world peace and a perfect Europia LOL. Am I crazy that sounds really worth it?

JeanJean
>>104789970

A moral compass also generally disappears when you are hungry or people are threatening you and your family. Morality is complicated, no one knows what can be considered objectively good or bad. What you do know is that if you don't do something to protect yourself, people will hurt you, and in their case it's the world against their people. No time for philosophy, do you accept death in the name of some abstract "greater good" or do you strive for your close ones to be safe?