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The Delta Flyers - The Cloud 106 Video (Patreon)

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2020-06-01 04:01:02
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2026-06
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The Delta Flyers is a weekly Star Trek: Voyager rewatch and recap podcast hosted by Garrett Wang and Robert Duncan McNeill. Each week Garrett and Robert will rewatch an episode of Voyager starting at the very beginning. This week’s episode is The Cloud. Garrett and Robbie recap and discuss the episode, and share their insight as series regulars. This week, Robert Beltran joins them for a short interview about the episode!

The Cloud:
The crew of the Voyager enters what they think is a nebula, but discovers it is a life form injured by their entry.

We want to thank everyone who makes this podcast possible, starting with our Executive producers Megan Elise, and Rebecca McNeill, and our Post Producer Jessey Miller.

Additionally we could not make this podcast available without our Co- Executive Producers Ann Marie Segal, Philipp Havrilla, Jason M Okun, Kelton Rochelle, Stephanie Baker, Stephen Smith, Sarah A Gubbins, John Tufarella, Brian Barrow, Chris Knapp, Daniel Adam, Eve Mercer, James Hildebrand, Matthew Gravens, Mary Jac Greer, Marie Burgoyne, Michelle Zamanian.

And our Producers  
Col Ord, Aithne Loeblich, AJ Provance, Ann Harding, Barbara Beck, Breana Harris, Catherine Goods, Charity Ponton, Chloe E, Chris Tribuzio, Claire Deans, Craig Sweaton, Crystal Komenda, Dave Grad, Deborah Schander, Father Andrew Kinstetter, Gay Kleven-Lundstrom, Gregory Kinstetter, Heidi McLellan, James G.Jones, James Amey, James Cooper, Captain Jeremiah Brown, Josh Johnson, Karel Hartlieb, Katherine Hedrick, Katie Johnson, Katherine Puterbaugh, Kelley Smelser, Laura Swanson, Liz Scott, Maggie, Mary O'Neal, Matthew Cutler, Mike Schaible, Máia W, Nancy Stout, Nathanial Moon, Nevyn Cross, Rich Gross, Richard Banaski, Ryan, Steph Dawe Holland, Terence Thang, Thomas Melfi,  Utopia Science Fiction Magazine, Warren Stine, York Lee

Thank you for your support!

“Our creations are protected by copyright, trademark and trade secret laws. Some examples of our creations are the text we use, artwork we create, audio, and video we produce and post. You may not use, reproduce, distribute our creations unless we give you permission. If you have any questions, you can email us at thedeltaflyers@gmail.com.”

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Comments

Chris Day

I disagree with some of the Tom Paris breakdown. Without some of the pig/jock moments, he'd have been more or less a straight laced member of the crew and we would not have the story arc of his redemption.

doug heimann

How about Harry Kim's Father is Korean and his Mother is Chinese? I also would like you to consider that the producers and writers were wanting to portray the fact that everyone's past cultures are still present in the future.

CMDR Klaas Metzel

Nelix little ship get mentioned later again in "The Chute". :D

Jim

It was great to see Robert Beltran join this episode. I love his character. I think he's right up there with the best first officers - so poised, dignified, loyal. A class act.

Amit J

Really enjoying this podcast so far and this is my first comment. My wife and I are wrapping up season 3 (her first watch and my second) and it's been especially nice seeing the character development throughout, especially for Tom Paris. I read all the previous comments and echo the sentiment that Robbie is being way too harsh on himself and the writers here, though I sympathize with how it must feel seeing a younger version of yourself say and do things that are unacceptable to you today. Tom had an amazing character arc from "a walking hormone" to the mature male character he ultimately became. Picard had a British accent and grew up on a vineyard in France, so I think the Chinese/Korean criticism could potentially be waved away. Garrett was probably correct that the writers didn't think of it that way, but that also they weren't doing anything out of malice and instead trying to be culturally respectful. Yeah it's easy to say it's cringe to hear an "ancient Chinese secret" regardless of the character's ethnicity, but Chekov always did the faulty Russian history in TOS for laughs at the USSR's expense, while the dialog for Kim was an attempt to be respectful. Where the writers ultimately failed here was in being a bit lazy in those attempts as well as hiring a fraud as their Native American consultant. It's nice to hear Robbie putting in the effort to ensure cultural accuracy on Resident Alien with far more diligence, but again that is a product of more modern times and sensibilities. Let's not be too over critical of mistakes from the past of this nature. I'm of Indian heritage (but born in the US) and my wife is from Japan and we've never felt "offended" by anything from the show's depictions of other cultures. More often than not, we simply laugh off the misfires as being a product of their time, while recognizing that they were steps in the right direction made with good intentions which you rightly pointed out. Regardless, I appreciate you both speaking your minds about all these topics and looking forward to more insights as I continue my journey through all of this fantastic content.

Melanie Weider
>>60351124

I never knew till recently that Kim was a Korean name but then I would have thought a good explanation would be that he has korean ancestry somewhere along the line and the name would come from that. Like my last name is french by marriage but I am English. My mams maiden name was Irish as we have Irish and even Scottish ancestry too and and so people can have all sorts of names due to that from anywhere in the world. People move around and intermarry.

Hefefloeckchen

In resident alien ALL the clischees all the xenophoboc ideas everything is reserved for the main character an it hurts to warch it

Harmony through Time Mighty Mouse

Robbie of all the misogynists on Star Trek you were the least, maybe I could see the actor behind it, you never looked excited about your playboyness

David Weston

Ok so. I have a story about watching this episode for the first time. My dad and me and my step mom all watched this series the first time through by renting from the library. Because of that, this was one of the last episodes we watched (even after the finale). And I remember a running joke my dad would always say “if I was on this ship I’d begin to wonder why the captain kept getting us into a different problem every week! I’d ask ‘what trouble has she gotten us into this time!?’”so when Nelix comes on at about 12 minutes into this episode and says “now look what she’s gotten us into” we all burst out laughing so hard 😂🥺 gotta love that family time

Chloe E

I definitely need more information about the boxer. Super cute! Finally, shaking is a 10/10! One of the things I love about Star Trek is its diverse casts, but I did find a lot of the stereotypes cringe-y in this episode. I don't completely hate Tom Paris as a womanizer in the early days...it makes for nice growth later! I think he definitely changed the most out of all the characters by the end of the series.

Katie Puterbaugh

Once again really enjoyed your recap! I completely agree, that there were several cringey moments in this episode, especially when viewed in the light of 2020. Maybe they just wanted to show Tom Paris at kind of his worst so that his character development throughout the series would be more prominent and redeeming 🤷‍♀️ In this episode though, as B'Elanna said, he's a 🐖 😂

Chloe E
>>37882235

B'Elanna, telling it like it is! This is probably the episode that catapulted her into favorite character territory for me!

Liz Scott

I definitely appreciate the candid conversation about the cringey moments in this episode. It was definitely refreshing to hear and makes me appreciate the thoughtfulness that you guys are bringing to this rewatch. I’m definitely glad that Tom Paris got out of that deep hole that was dug in the early part of the series. As always appreciate the work everyone on the podcast is doing, and it’s definitely been such a highlight during this period in my life.

Rich Gross

I appreciate the candid and honest comments particularly from Robbie, in this episode. I don’t have much of a problem with holodeck characters being stereotypical. I mean, look at Fairhaven and Captain Proton. The holodeck is for fun and escape, not necessarily realism. That said, the way the Sandrine characters come across is definitely odd. It’s a bit too intimate and awkward, almost as if Paris was taking Kim to a strip club. The part that offends me the most in Voyager as whole is the B.S. Native American stuff. Sure, this was filmed 26 years ago, but that wasn’t THAT long ago in terms of cultural enlightenment. I watch Voyager very often but I always skip the episodes involving those storylines. In general, I find this episode odd in that I find it hard to imagine the writers didn’t know that many of these things were cringe-worthy, and I think that’s a strange choice to enter that kind of territory so early in the development of the characters.

Stephanie Baker

I appreciate Robbie and Garrett confronting the stereotyping that occurred in this episode. I just watched TOS The Enterprise Incident last night (Kirk loses his memory on a planet populated by Native people). There has been loads of progress since then. I would also think that Robbie and Garrett were young actors without much power to change anything and not wanting to risk their jobs. I've seen this episode enough that I place those unsavory parts on a shelf and enjoy the good stuff. Sandrine's becomes a cool hangout, the bridge crew work together, innovating to fix the problem of the week, and relationships are being forged. and it was great seeing Robert Beltran. Thank you. My winners were the life form and Tom Paris. My losers were the life form and Janeway (because no coffee).

Matt

Class act having a moment of silence for Admiral Owen Paris, thanks guys! While I never met him in person, he seemed like one of those just genuinely good, nice people. As I continue reading through the Voyager books, every time there is a mention of Admiral Paris, I picture him.

Matt

"Robbie" I tried to think back very hard. We went through literally a cloud, some kind of thing...there was something about a cloud that affected the whole ship". LOL!! That's so awesome! I'm laughing drinking my coffee now.

Sophia Hayes

In terms of Harry being Korean, I suppose you could imagine that his mother was Chinese and Father Korean

Sean 'Kyosho' Brown

My brain: Ensign "Hairy Chin." Heh. Maybe the name was meant to be a joke originally, and they changed it to the Korean version to make it less silly?

Matt

I guess I'm different than most. While I do agree there are parts of this show that may be questionable in terms of how they portray certain races or nationalities, I just take Voyager for the wonderfully entertaining, thought provoking, and "way to escape to another world" show that it is. I don't analyze it that much, I take it at face value and just enjoy it without overthinking it.

sab ewell

just wanted to say that as a viewer and a fan we needed to see Tom Paris be that guy. I know it's cringy now watching with our 2020 woke goggles, but Tom's whole arc of the show wouldn't have the same impact if we didn't see those moments. Later we all come to realize that he's not THAT GUY deep down. Not really, that's just a facade he puts up. Roxann was right in that Stars in the House reunion chat, Tom owes it all to her 😂 . So yes keep watching he does redeem himself many times over.

Matt

Robbie mentioned about the hole that the writers due for Tom, as his character. I can definitely see his point, and how he wanted Tom to be different. I think it set the stage for the growth that Tom would experience throughout the series. By the time season 7 came along, the Tom had grown, matured, and completely changed.

Matt

OMG that chat with Chakotay was awesome! Would love to see more with Robert Beltran too in the bonus footage.

Cody Caudill

I really like how honest both of you are during this episode. I hope you guys keep this honesty for the entire podcast. I love Voyager, but there are definitely some things which come off as shocking, especially to viewers 25 years later. I'm loving the podcast overall and I'm really excited with how much behind the scenes information we are getting.

Sophia Hayes

Neelix's ship is seen at least 2 more times. Once in The Chute, and in Workforce

Jennifer7895

I thought Neelix (having watched this for the first time 23 years later) was getting a little too big for his britches. And I liked that his character mellowed out after Janeway told him off. 'Dismissed is Starfleet for Get out!' I think his drastic change was him becoming enlightened to the fact there is no reason for him to be there, thus he better shape up or ship out. If he continued to be combative, as Robbie points out, the audience would have constantly wondered why he is still on the ship. This episode may not have been great as a whole (because of the stereotypes and Tom's piggy-ness ), but it does have all the best one liners for the Voyager show. Thanks for another great show!

Moonglade

I was lucky enough to meet Richard Herd at "Voyager: The Return" in Blackpool many years ago, he was a real gent. Very patient with everyone. Thank you for the moment of silence for him. Brilliant recap. I Loved it, especially the Robert Beltran funny chat - Chakotay's my favourite character. BTW, I was at a con once and someone asked Kate why she was against Janeway and Chakotay getting it on and Kate replied that Janeway was the captain and what would happen if Janeway fell pregnant - who would captain the ship etc? The questioner quipped, "So, there was coffee in that nebula, but no condoms?" Kate didn't miss a beat. "Nope." Whenever I watch this episode, I'm reminded of that and can't help adding, "... but no condoms!" when Janeway says, "There's coffee in that nebula." I'm also glad us J/Cers weren't alone in seeing J/C getting their flirt on this early on in the show :D

Jenny

I’m only 20 minutes in, but in case Garrett isn’t aware to mention this, I think Robbie would be interested. (Because it will be painful in another episode or two later on.) Voyager had a *fraudulent* Native American consultant at this time - he’d been outed, separately, by each an activist and a reporter in the 80s, so there was a major lack of vetting (or caring to vet) or checking with more than one source for their depictions, though the internet in the 90s is admittedly hardly what it is now. I don’t know or remember when the producers finally clued in and booted him, but it was sometime during Voyager’s run, and it was widely discussed online by at least season three. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamake_Highwater

Jenny
>>37884242

They had a Native American consultant for Chakotay’s character and history, just a fraudulent one. 🤦🏻‍♀️ (Which they could have known at the time, or picked up on just by consulting more than one source, but they were also not remotely the only ones the guy scammed.) But I think that probably explains their unfortunately going all-in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamake_Highwater

Deanna

Neelix's ship is also seen in his last episode Homestead, he flies it to the Talaxian colony when he leaves Voyager. His ship is also referenced in a 4th episode ("The Voyager Conspiracy") when 7 of 9 asks for his ship's logs.

GAY Kleven-Lundstrom

Great recap guys, Yes Tom Paris was a Misogynist character and it is very cringy re-watching it. But it wasn't Robbie's fault I lay the blame and insensitivity at the feet of the writers on lack of research on ethnicity of the crew they are writing for.

Breana Harris

I re-watched this episode a few days ago because I was curious what you guys might talk about, and I was really wondering how/if you would address the more racist and misogynist elements, so this was SO refreshing and well-articulated and just cool. I love that people who have the privilege to not care about these issues can hear that you do. Of course there are plenty of those elements in most of the shows from 25 years ago that are really good shows, and Voyager did lots of things that actually were ahead of its time too! Tom Paris is a really interesting and kind of subversive study in "playboy" characters because it does start to seem like he uses this stuff as a mask, but in this episode he is particularly yikes. I'm so excited about everything you guys do, thank you again!!

Louise Mallard
>>37895434

Kind of along my line of thought, maybe they were a Korean family who moved to China or he's gone to study in China. Or maybe generations of Koreans moved to China for some reason.

Erica Larabee
>>37896072

I'm with you! I enjoy the show for the entertainment and escape. I don't analyze any show I watch as I watch fictional TV (and movies) for the pure entertainment.

Erica Larabee

Loved what you guys said about Richard Herd. I was very sad to hear of his passing. Besides his appearances in Voyager, I really loved his work in seaQuest DSV. Before I did my rewatch of this episode in anticipation of watching the recap, I caught a bit of a post on the FB group about you guys talking about the cringey stuff. I didn't read the post at the time as I didn't want to be spoiled about what was discussed in the podcast. As I watched the episode tonight, I assumed what that person was referencing was Neelix's exuberant compliments of the captain's looks and her lipstick at the beginning of the episode. That was very cringey to me. The other stuff in the episode didn't bother me, but that exchange felt very awkward and uncomfortable to me. And just to end on a fun note...I nearly spit out a mouthful of Dr. Pepper when Robert Beltran said "And it was not a very good high. Believe me." OMG that was hilarious! I hope we get to see more of Robert (along with Bob) in future podcasts.

Mary Jac Greer

Just wanted to point out that Captain Janeway’s animal guide looked very similar to the lizzards she and Tom turned into in the later episode. Just thought it was kind of interesting.

Sara Stewart

Robbie, I wish you weren’t so hard on yourself. First of all, it was a long time ago. Things were different then. Like you said, your barometers were off. You, the actors and you, the writers didn’t know any better. And second, most men in their early to mid 20’s are just pigs. They are one big hormone! Not to excuse their behavior, but I think that is just the person the writers were trying to portray. Tom Paris learns and grows and becomes a real MAN! And at each stage, you played him perfectly. Please don’t be ashamed of him. He is a really good example of what it means to learn from ones mistakes and try to change. Tom Paris was always one of my favorite characters. Not because of who he was, but because of who he became and the journey to get there.

Joel Aarons

Is there any chance that, for patreons, the video reaction can be part of the full audio? I am a podcast listener, so I prefer the audio. But I don't like missing those video reactions, even if they are audio only.

Mohamed Noor

Great podcast episode! Especially in the current climate, I really appreciated your thoughtfulness on the "different barometer" aspects. One sciency comment-- it's interesting to think what (and how much) that "cloud" organism would need to consume to maintain itself. Where do the matter and energy needed to maintain it come from? "Food" for thought (sorry- pun intended).

Elaine Ferguson

On Neelix's ship (sorry if this has been said already and I've missed it), we do see it again – it's used to rescue Kim and Paris from prison in The Chute :)

Eddie Ordaz

Tom Paris was good in this episode!

Luz R

Great episode and wonderful discussion. Tom Paris is 1 of my favorite characters and he def does redeem himself. I am very much of the opinion that this version of Tom is his facade. The one he puts out there to protect himself since he was hurt so much by those dearest to him. I look forward to the next episode.

N+D

I think you guys are being hard on Neelix. I like that he's an upbeat character.

Nikyah Brewer

I love watching this! makes my week. I watch episodes now and just can't wait to hear what they have to say about them.

Luz R
>>37978964

Tom and B'Elanna are so multi faceted and have so many underlying issues. I love both of them

Sarah Hall

I swear these episodes are the one thing getting me through med school exams

Sarah Hall

Also I love the mental image of Robbie fighting season 1 Paris. Don’t worry your performance makes him quite sympathetic in later eps

Moonglade
>>37895939

LOL! This is even funnier to me when I remember how Kate M would pronounce his name 'Hairy' sometimes :D

Ashley Risk

This is viewer feedback about a point of perspective Robbie notices items in the set like the sculpture on the briefing room being out of place for the settings, I never noticed it and ive watched all 7 seasons more than 15 times. kess referring to the emh as the emergency medical holographic system as someone watching the show I don't notice these things as kess was new to Voyager and didn't know Starfleet protocols she would refer to it in a way that she felt made sense. The Voyager I know this feels out of place, but to me it's just someone using words to describe what they see rather than correctly naming the ship I am enjoying all of these subtle differences in viewer/ actor perspectives. as for the podcasts and the actors perspective on set your podcasts are Joy and sheer gold, keep going guys.

Marina Kravchuk

You are perfectly correct in noting that "it felt like" the Native American stuff was not vetted. It wasn't. From what I recall from "the making of" Voyager book, a decision was made not to have Chakotay to be of a specific tribe, but rather be a sort of conglomerate being, so that not to offend anyone (!!!!!). And the person hired to advise on Native American culture, the infamous Jamake Highwater, was actually a fraud.

jonas

This was one of my favourite Tom Paris episodes growing up. I never comprehended how gross Paris was in this episode. Lol At the very least I appreciate how they set up his redemption arch - this is only Season 1 Episode 6, we need to eestable how far Paris needs to go to become the man he is by series end.

Kris Hansen

When do we get the "Yes Ma'am" ball cap?

Kris Hansen

It's interesting that Robbie and Garrett both believe that the writers and producers all intended to put Capt. Janeway into a relationship quickly. While the captains of the other series have had romantic encounters, this was usually after a few seasons (not counting Kirk's babe of the week). I'm disappointed that the writers and producers thought she needed romance to make her compelling. She was plenty compelling all on her own.

Megan Hurwitt

My mom and I always found Tom Paris, especially early Tom Paris, to be creepy and cringe. I can't express to you how great it is to see that Robbie, you're this unapologetic intersectional woke feminist. I am so here for it. You too as well, Garrett, but since Harry was always pretty wholesome, he was always baby. But yeah, Robbie--I am living for this.

Kevin Williams

I wonder if its Kudzu rather than Ivy creeping into Robbie's yard. Much harder to get rid of.

Megan Hurwitt
>>38123457

That was my thought too. If it's Georgia, kudzu is rampant there, and it can eat entire buildings if not trimmed or burned away. It's pernicious.

Aaron Schlabach

It was Star Trek in the early to mid 1990's. Robbie, you mentioned in an earlier that you needed the work, so I don't blame you for playing the character how they wrote it. And for the record, Paris does redeem himself. I've been through Voyager enough times to promise you that.

Craig Drebit

What makes this podcast extra fun for me is the chance to rewatch the eps in order alongside Garrett and Robbie for the first time in maybe 15 years. And it's probably been that long since I've seen The Cloud in its entirety! So I got the whole effect of cringiness when it came to the Chinese and Indigenous (this is how we now refer to First Nations in Canada) stuff. That being said, as many of you have already noted - this is early in the show and the characters are being developed and grown. Also, as one who is part Chinese I thought the Kim (and Sato) thing was odd but it's sort of common in TV shows anyway, and assumed Harry had some sort of Korean ancestry in his Chinese family :) Now we get to two eps - Eye of the Needle and Ex Post Facto that solidfied my love of Voyager as the best in the franchise!

Julie Miller

When I watched this contemporaneously I was delighted when B'Elanna called Tom a pig. That signified to me that the producers knew he was a dick and were presenting him as an ignorant young guy with a lot to learn. The Native stuff, however, went right by me at the time but seems horrifically cringeworthy now. I do not feel the same way about the Chinese reference, at least this time, because it is such a famous one. I refer to "may you live in interesting times" often. Of course having the Asian character say it does cast a different light.

Eric Bennett
>>37905332

Neelix's ship was seen a few times. His ship was small. Probably not much bigger than the Delta flyer so they could (apparently) park it in the hanger. His ship was seen again in The Chute when it was used to rescue Harry and Tom when they were falsely imprisoned.

Eric Bennett

Robbie and Garrett, you two are a little hard on yourselves for acting (and scripts) that you did 25 or so years ago. I think many of us probably cringe at things we might have done that long ago, though luckily for us what we did that long ago is not immortalized in film. Look at the skimpy outfits that were worn in some of the TOS episodes and even some of the early seasons of TNG. Hindsight is always 20/20, right?

Colin Cochran

Way too hard on yourself there...

Jessica Edmonds

I really don’t understand all the hate for Paris early in the series. Yea, he was a cocky playboy. He needed to be or there would be no development or character growth. He is the type of character that when you first meet you are a bit put off by so when you finally see him mature and become a husband and father it’s a satisfying journey. I’m kinda surprised Robbie isn’t understanding that.

Irene Artho

Just because in today's times the name Kim does not indicate Chinese.. who knows what might be in the 24th century. Plus the name might have been passed down from Korean family but later his ancestors moved to China. And as you say - the borders / countries might change by then anyway.

Laura

The doctor is eventually given the ability to turn himself off in a few episodes (Jetrel). However, in later seasons he is known as the biggest gossip on the ship, so I'm sure he just leaves himself on and listens to everyone lol

The Irish Buddhist

Robbie you were definitely not wrong about early Paris.. he truly was the ships male 'Pig'. But he did redeem himself and I did enjoy his character growth along with most all characters on 'Voyager'. (Playing major catch up since I went back to work in June after furlough. I can't think of a better day to do it, the day before 'Star Trek Day' on Labor Day and the day before we get hit with 3-7 inch of Snow when it's currently 87 degrees outside.. ) Thank you guys for the laughs with this one, especially when you brought the snippet of Beltran into the mix.. that'll carry me threw the work week lol.

Scott Friend

Watching this really makes me wonder how much of what Robbie is saying is real, and how much is simply back-peddling to save face for something that could potentially be thrown back in his face about parts he played 25 years ago and the things his character said at that time. I really, really can't stand the current climate of being 100% politically correct and being afraid to speak your mind, or say what you mean, because you're afraid of what someone else MIGHT say or think 25 years from now. We live in today, not yesterday, and time changes everything including opinions and mindsets, so there is no way I would ever hold someone accountable for something they said 25 years ago, let alone while playing a character. That goes for the Chinese comments, the Indian comments, and the behaviors of Tom Paris. I would bet hard money that Robbie DID act that way at one point in his real life, just like we all have, but just because you said something or acted a certain way all those years ago doesn't mean that is who you are or stand for NOW, and the only thing that irritates me more than people who don't get that is people who back-peddle and try to justify it as something other than what it was. It was a different time, with different beliefs, and a different society, and in many ways, to an extent, a better one if you ask me as it wasn't built on people being 100% perfect from the start. As human beings, we are ALL imperfect by design, and having every single thing we say or do preserved for posterity for all-time by cameras, social media, and the likes just make us all live double lives, or worse, live lives that don't reflect who we are. I love Garret and Robbie, and the characters they play, but with all due respect, I really think Robbie just takes this stuff way too far, and to an extent, takes things way too seriously for my taste. I will still continue watching these and paying to be a premium member, of course, because I believe in supporting the things I love, and I love Star Trek for all it is, was, and especially for what it tries to be at heart, even if it can't be PC 100% of the time.

LT Turner Jr

What a great episode recap! Don't worry Robbie, Tom Paris totally develops into a wonderful guy. His character development I thought was amazing. And regarding Neelix's ship, you'll hear and see more of it again in later future episodes. :)

Harlon Rotnour
>>44068081

Perfectly said... It is so awkward to listen to Robbie back peddle for a character he is not even responsible for writing. Its absolutely absurd and simply virtue signalling to keep a minority of fans happy...

TheDeltaFlyers
>>44068081

I had thought about addressing the original comment back when it was written, but I let it go because we value different opinions and don't want to censor anyone. However, it seems that I do need to address this idea that Robbie is somehow not being "real". Hi, I'm Robbie's girlfriend and producer of this podcast. Robbie is 100% the person he is on the Podcast. He's not Tom Paris and he is allowed to dislike the writing for the character and how he portrayed the character. What he says are his true feelings and any accusation to the contrary is offensive. Robbie may not be your cup of tea and you may not always agree with him on his thoughts, feelings, and opinions. That's okay, what's not okay is making unfounded accusations that someone is peddling to what he thinks people want him to say. He just isn't that kind of person.

Bethany Avery

Enjoyed this recap- I second for Robbie- don’t worry it actually makes the arc he goes through that much more impressive because yeah yuck! But that aside the line which always bothered me was Janeway explaining sutures to Harry as an ancient technique. TNG had frequently used sutures by name and while I’m sure Dr. Crusher was using more than medical thread it always seemed out of place. Stitching some one up would be a standard practice in emergency survival that even our resident field medic would know about ;)

Elizabeth Gall

Catching up after a while! I love hearing about the chill life stuff like gardening adventures! (At least it's not bamboo - that stuff will come up through your dang foundation.)

Roy Spaan

I'm not sure Garrett was right about EVERYBODY obviously understanding that Kim was Korean. I certainly never figured that out, actually until I started watching The Delta Flyers a few days ago, and with a familiarity of Korean that I didn't have back then, it suddenly jumped me: "Wait... Kim is clearly a Korean name". To be clear: I never thought he was Chinese either. Just "Asian", if you'll pardon the lack of subtlety. Really, I am often (not always) the guy to whom it doesn't really register at ALL. Kim is just Kim to me, Tuvok is Tuvok/Vulcan. I don't go "ow, there's the Asian guy again" or "wow, that Vulcan is black for some reason. And although I will excuse the general public, it's quite embarassing when one of the WRITERS of the show either mistakes Kim for being Chinese, or gave him the wrong name while intending for him to be Chinese all along. Giving a Korean guy Chinese proverbs to quote IS rather silly as well. Especially seeing the history between Korea and China, or more generally, Asian countries among themselves. I don't believe it should be a faux-pas entirely, as many Asians DO root themselves in their culture. Why condemn that entirely? It should be used sparingly though, to avoid making it THE defining trait of a character.

Roy Spaan

I love that Robert doesn't remember ANYTHING beforehand. His attempt to guess was hilarious. Probably not entirely meant to be though :P Flying through some anomaly was just about the story of 90% of all Trek XD "We fell asleep... or.. not." great stuff.

Aithne Loeblich

Just to be clear, Janeway's spirit animal is a Gecko. And it looks like a House Gecko to me.... not a salamander... =/

Theo Millett

The confusion of Kim being Korean/Chinese reminds me a bit of the fact that Captain Picard is a Frenchman with a British accent. Which i think Roddenberry explained as cultural borders blurring together in the 24th century. Still, i guess it would have been nice to show some of Harry's Korean heritage at some point.

Cass
>>46507783

I think the playboy aspect was an exaggeration of the expected flyboy persona. Also, I think Tom's arc is about overcoming expectations. Anyway, some of that is definitely part of his character, but based on what we see later I do think he plays it up as a mask (as mentioned Ricky wasn't in his - arguably more personal - Captain Proton program and the 5 girlfriends back home comment doesn't fit with him being in jail or his alt self in Non-Sequitur). I read the idea somewhere that B'Elanna's reaction (calling him a pig) in this episode stuck with him and started to crack that mask. I like that concept, but haven't rewatched enough to see if his behavior reflects this at all - it's probably still too early in the series. I also like the idea that his time on Voyager as a whole helped him reveal more of himself and become his own man vice the Admiral's 'failed' son and pilot stereotype.

Cass
>>60351124

Human cultural/ethnic backgrounds never seemed as well developed to me as the alien ones in Star Trek. I think that makes sense in some cases, as alien races needed to be created and given depth to feel 'real' with varied histories. However, I do remember thinking some human ethnic portrayals here fell flat/were disappointing even when the showed aired.

Dead_Alewives

I always just thought that when Harry was sharing one of his "ancient Chinese secrets" with someone, he was really just screwing with them.

Mario censullo

Speaking of nelix’s ship it was used in the episode where Harry and tom are in the space prison.

Charla&Allie

Robbie and Garrett, you guys are spot-on with these analyses of our favorite Trek show. Robbie, my 12-yr old daughter and I found it troubling that you were so hard on the “early Tom” character as if that character was you in real life. Tom Paris made an amazing character arc that was so well portrayed by you that I feel you have to give yourself much more credit. You were simply amazing in the role, which started out as troubled, insecure and arrogant but grew up into an amazing and caring individual who was so understanding and patient and loving. My daughter and I love these podcasts and watching along with you guys so much! Keep up the great work!!

Eric Leitman
>>46507783

Yes. Tom and B’Ellana’s relationship is beautifully written and I believe it changes both of them.

Rachelle H

For me the dislike of Neelix was his lecherous behavior with Kes. The grossest thing. He isn't starfleet and nit from the Alpha quadrant, so him bringing snacks was an experience he needed to learn from.

Rachelle H

To add. Paris absolutely redeemed himself. I love Tom Paris. Just an amazing character with good realistic growth and human behavior.

Andrea Landrum

They do talk about Neelix's ship again in season 6. I believe its the conspiracy episode and he uses the info from his ship to help seven find info about the care taker array explosion because some of voyagers info was damaged.