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Sacred Symbols+, Episode 453 | The Last of Us (HBO) Review Discussion and Spoilercast (Season 2, Episode 5) (Patreon)

Published:
2025-05-12 22:25:23
Edited:
2025-05-15 15:09:40
Imported:
2026-06
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As we make our way into the back-end of The Last of Us' seven episode second season on HBO, the action begins to ratchet up. As Ellie and Dina sneak through WLF-occupied Seattle, the Wolves fight their own war with the religious cult called The Seraphites. Meanwhile, Ellie's pursuit of Abby brings her ever-so-closer to her target, as she catches up with Nora, whose actor has a very special connection to Naughty Dog's next game. How do we feel things are shaping up? Where do we think everything will go? Let's get into the nitty-gritty, shall we?

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Comments

pbsandwich_

very excited to see what you guys think. I feel with every episode that passes I feel worse and worse about the show and the changes they make from the game. the pacing is a real problem at this point

Diddy’s Lube Guy

The fetal alcohol syndrome played much better when she was from Bear Island.

Deadpool2099

I feel Kaitlyn Dever would have been a better casting for Ellie. Her appearance to me is more in line with how I think she would look.

Smegaladon

This and the last episode have really lost me, Ellie and Dina are acting like they’re on a fun girls trip, not a revenge mission. It’s weird when Ellie changes gears and gets angry because for the most part she’s fun and jovial. They even roam the streets of Seattle without a care in the world

John

Did anyone think that, with all the talk about the hospital basement, that they were going to shift the RatKing scene into Ellie’s part of the story? I was surprised to see them even reveal spores at all, they said last season it was a conscious choice because they didn’t want the actors to have to wear gas masks for half the show, so I thought that scene was dope.

Matthew Cooper

Dustin nailed it right off the bat; I'm feeling it more and more with every episode this season, but TV show Ellie is just all wrong. I think it's probably an equal mix of writing, directing, and acting. Ashley Johnson's Ellie in the game is angry, determined, confident, capable.. She feels like a threat. Bella Ramsey's TV show Ellie isn't giving off that energy at all. She feels like a scared teenage girl in a situation that's way over hear head. Look at how Ellie reacted in the TV Station when the wolves showed up, she looked like she was shitting her pants. Game Ellie wouldn't let herself be overcome with fear like that. Even the scene in this episode with Nora in the basement, the energy just isn't right. In the game, Ellie's face is more raw, more emotional; in the TV show, Ellie looked much colder to me, almost sociopathic, just detached. I didn't really have a problem with Ellie's casting in the first season. But it's become a big problem this season. I've never seen Bella Ramsey in anything else, so I don't really have an idea of what her range is, but I wonder if she isn't really capable of delivering an Ellie comparable to what Ashley Johnson gave us in the game. So maybe the writers and directors are working with what they have to deliver as good an Ellie as they can in a different way. The only real solution I have for this would have been to delay season 2 another 2-3 years, let Bella Ramsey age a little more so she looks more mature; and also give her time to work on her Ellie performance. Let her work on her range, get better at her craft, if she needs it.

GameSimp

I’m pretty sure they’re setting up that woman to be the Seraphite Prophet (I think she was the same woman in the WLF who met Isaac in the beginning of the last episode — would also explain how Isaac knows the prophet). There has to be a reason they keep showing her, but I could be wrong.

Billyb

I guess I'm in the minority, but the changes from the game to the show really don't bother me They're not the same things in my eyes, and it's hard for me to care when I don't think many of the changes are negatively impacting the story The main story beats are still there, and it looks like we're ending up at the same place even if we're taking a different road this time to get there

Beef Burka

This is exactly how I feel. Ellie acts way too childish, Dina and Ellie are acting far too care free in Seattle. The part where Ellie said she was too stupid to figure out the map had me rolling my eyes. It's the writing that's ruined Ellie more than the casting.

Derek Hart

I've been thinking the same thing.

Beef Burka

When she questioned the woman about the spores, she mentioned Isaac was trying to prevent the truce with the Seraphites from breaking down, so the Seraphites are already active while she's still a WLF.

Cai

I really feel like they’re trying to appease the people who hate the game whilst also sticking to as many beats as they can. It’s just kind of watered everything down and it’s far weaker for it unfortunately.

Your Boi Nicky V

Show is a 10/10 whenever Ellie and Dina aren't alone and a 0 when they are. The 'you love me?' scene was awful.

Cai

Really looking forward to Neil’s episode next week - especially considering what it’s about. They need to get that one right!

Cai

Exactly! In the game the scene with Nora feels like a boiling point of her anger as she finally crosses a point of no return in her quest for revenge. And in this episode, even though I thought the scene was good, it was a tonal shift to see Ellie go to that place.

Big Swingin' Rick

There was one major thing that I'm surprised nobody touched on. Nora told Ellie Abby's milotovation for killing Joel which is a huge change. In the theatre when they finally confront each other, Ellie still doesn't know why Abby killed Joel. Will be interesting to see how that plays out in the show

Harry

I don’t know anymore, the source material has started to get so watered down it feels like we’re getting this weird teen-fic love story sometimes as opposed to what is ultimately a horror game. The conversations between characters always felt so “human” in the games but Ellie and Dina’s banter/quips come across to me like Marvel cringe. Save the “you love me?” For when we eventually get to the farmhouse. I don’t think it’s been earned yet. Also where is the impending sense of constant danger you get from TLOU2? I mean, even the weapon upgrade menu isn’t safe… Instead any kind of danger is restricted to set-piece scenes (the stalkers in the warehouse/ Seraphite forest) and it’s all happy-go-lucky in between. I do think next week is going to be the biggest highlight of the season though with what they teased. Excited to get Joel back in!

Sam

The issue people are having with this season vs last season stems from a misunderstanding of the different mediums the material is being presented in. Season 1 was an adaption of Last of Us 1 - the game is arguably the easiest adaption you could ever make if you had a good enough budget to attract the talent needed for the lead roles. The game is split perfectly into episodes already hence why season 1 was appreciated. The second season is adapted from the second game. Last Of Us Part 2 is a singular title that is almost peerless in the industry of games, there are a lot of things impressive about it but the one thing that makes it and it’s few peers truly outliers? It could only be a video game. The story doesn’t work in any other medium, you can’t keep Abbie’s motivations a secret for 15 hours in a tv show because the audience would lose interest, you just make changes from the source. You can’t force a viewer into that feeling of playing as Abbie in Day 1 Seattle - that alien feeling inhabiting this character you hate, they cannot replicate that and so they must make changes from the source. Think Abbie vs Ellie in the theatre, how much you didn’t want to press the buttons the game was asking? They cannot replicate that in a show and so they must make changes to the source. The ending in the water? Same principle, they must make changes. To appreciate season 2 you need to understand the quality of the game and its quality only being possible in a video game means the show cannot hope to accomplish something similar. There is a reason viewers who aren’t the familiar with the game are enjoying it the show and it’s because the show is really great, those who have played the game just can’t sever the two formats and how they can’t be consistent narratives along side one another. It’s not the shows fault that Part II is extraordinary.

Sam

You would be incredibly naive to believe season 2 would follow a similar beat for best stride as the first season, a complete misunderstanding of the second game and the medium it was presented in.

Chris Fazio

Come to think of it, in the game does Ellie actually ever find out why Abby did it?

Michael Vecchio

No. Ellie just thinks that Abby’s motivation was Joel denying humanity a cure and killing the Fireflies.

NeO JD

Not the same character but definitely weird casting decision.

NeO JD

The “adaptation” aspect of S2 is exactly why it’s weaker than S1. S1 was pretty much the game. S2 has felt like someone came in and tried to TV it way too hard. Like Dustin mentioned, Ellie’s writing alone is arguably why people aren’t loving this season. Hard to believe Neil would approve of some of the shit she says.

Sam

But as my comment says, they had no choice but to adapt things. You may not like those adaptions, I don’t like some of them. But to come into this season expecting the same adaptation strategy as season 1 was a fault of your own not HBO’s.

DeadMail

Colin, this is my headcannon in dystopian fiction whenever it comes to using fuel: you can make biodiesel fuel from pig fat. Idk how effective and efficient it is like how many pigs to fill one tank of diesel gas. Maybe the WLF have a giant pig farm and the excess fat goes toward diesel production

king_ryan_james

I’m going to have to disagree with everyone’s hate of Bella Ramsey. She’s crushing the character how it’s written. The writing is at fault here. Totally agree with Micah on this. This Ellie covers up her hatred and anger with humor and that’s literally her. She is a habitual liar and will do whatever it takes to get revenge, even if she’s inappropriate or out of touch with the moment.

Xenomorph Moriarty

Decent episode but Nora all but looking in the camera to remind the audience with shitty unnecessary dialogue “you know what he did? Joel shot the doctor in the head! The only guy in the world that could make a cure from you, the immune girl! It was Abby’s father! That’s why she’s mad! Joel’s bad!” Like come on dude we already have all of this information. There’s a reason the game didn’t write this kind of dialogue and comes across so much more natural and poignant

Black Detective in Dexter

Every time Ellie and Dina are on screen it should cut to Logan Roy saying "You are not serious people".

Johnny Lamotte

I’m at a loss for words with how bad the last two episodes have been. I have enjoyed the show all the way up until then. The writing for Ellie is embarrassingly trash. “Natural gas babbyyyy”… Like I get she made jokes in the first game when she was…. A KID!! Idk why they decided to make her this immature child during scenes that were very impactful in the game. The whole theater section in the game is awesome, but here we get a few whacky dialogs and that’s about? Jesse saved the episode from being a 0/10 for me lol Bella isn’t at fault for the writing though but I’m shocked Neil didn’t communicate her attitude in the second game better. Idk why he would let them do this to such an amazing character 😭

The Lord’s Chips

What is the sheets company they are talking about in the beginning? Can't find them.

Paul Knickerbocker

I think my biggest problem with this season is that they've done a poor job with Ellie. The game portrayed her as older, more mature, and a terrifying person in combat. The show portrays her as incompetent and somewhat clueless. It doesn't help that they pair her up with Dina who is competent and smart. It also doesn't help that Bella looks like she is 15. The writing and directing aren't doing anything to help by having her act like she is 15. Just becomes distracting.

Daniel

I don’t understand Colin framing an episode where Ellie finally kills someone in Abby’s crew as an interstitial episode. While not my favorite of the bunch - it showcases how elements of the game can function (flowing from the Stalkers to WLF to Scars), gives a bit of backstory to Dina, and finally shows that turning point of no return for Ellie. But yeah sure compare it to the Bill episode which is entirely different.

Derek Alcott

Totally agree that the casting for Ellie just doesn't work. I don't see Ellie in the show being able to pull Dina. Maybe I'm wrong but feels like Ellie doesn't have good enough game to get Dina. Bella Ramsey looks too young to be a young adult.

Halphworm

That explains so much haha. I’ve been feeling like the writing has not been working for me. Maybe Neil should have been more involved to steer Craig in the right direction.

AllTooEasy_

Colin how do you play part 2 do a whole 7 hour podcast about this story, talk about the differences in story beats, love music and NOT talk about the future days nod

Bailey Callis

What a load of bs. The point is, pretty much everybody's disliking this season a great deal, so maybe their new strategy is a bad one. There has clearly been a huge dip in quality, just delusional to think otherwise

Sam

What a nothing thing to say

Bailey Callis

I don't think Colin understands how the vast majority of people online prefer the first game. I love both, but the common sentiment is clearly the first games better, that's also reflected in the sales

Hose A Taco

The first game wasn’t really his game also the second was and it’s trash

Austin Evans

I’m at the point where the show is just not enjoyable anymore. Or at least it’s not worth watching next weekend. I may catch up once whole season at once. Unlike the first season, this is not prime TV.