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The Expanse: Season 2 - Episode 11 & 12 (Patreon)

Published:
2022-12-13 13:00:06
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

Go to this site: Cinebingers.ca for the unedited versions of all our content.

👉 https://cinebingers.ca/6aEccEHMW6 👈 for the full reaction where you do not need your own copy.

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Files

Previews only

The Expanse: Season 2 - Episode 11 & 12 - Patreon Version

Comments

Pantelis Minaios

I fell in love with the show before reading the books and, in hindsight, although I don't consider the show poorly written I can see now how a lot of things are missing, especially in the first season. I've had friends unable to get past that first season and watch the whole thing and possibly my overhyping of the show did not help them. The characters in the books and their relationships are much smoother indeed. Given the time constraints (I presume) of a Tv show, characters have changed, not developed as much, moved around in the timeline etc. Still an amazing show that I hope you guys follow to its end. It gets better and better and you are already past the worst season.

Śéáń

George is smiling in the thumbnail and this gives me hope.

Tom Smith
>>97469959

I read the books first and I really struggled with season 1. There is a lot missing, but to get it all in who would have needed another 12-24 episodes.

Gaius Frakking Baltar

The Expanse does store quite a few half-eaten cans of food in the metaphorical fridge, but believe it or not all the cans will be consumed sooner or later (although some of the cans won't be completely eaten for another 2 or 3 seasons) 🥫🥫🥫

Tom Smith

I think the books are richer, but they can afford to be they have a lot more real estate than the TV show. There is a lot more internal character stuff as you suspect, Amos is tough to like in season 1, but in the book he's easier to like and understand. He's no less of a monster, but his motivations are much clearer and more appreciable. Avasarala is much less harsh and much more funny, but no less ruthless. I think the conflicts do exist in the books, but there is a lot more positive stuff to balance out the negative so it is less apparent. That is apart from Miller, he just gets on peoples nerves. I think the books are better at theming too, each has a clear central point or message.

redddfer44

100 % with Simone regarding expectations and the bad taste that the previous stuff has left! And the 52 thing at the end of episode 12. It was the first time that the show did something that actually touched me. (But those Holden puns --) I'm not saying this is peak tv scifi yet, but for me, these two episodes showed that they're able to introduce scenes that aren't so goddamn tryhard and that there's possible more to these character dynamics than we've seen. I'm not even halfway through the first book yet, but (no spoilers here!) Holden and his crew are almost entirely different characters. It's not just the inner monologue, but their interactions as well like George said. I guess some of it might be because it's based on an RPG campaign. You experience the rest of the crew from Holden's point of view so other characters' actions are sometimes described almost like in a session recap of an RPG session: "Holden [did stuff for three paragraphs and here's his melancholy thoughts and stuff about being a captain]. Naomi went to bed. Amos said fuck. Alex referred to his time in the Martian navy." Maybe they tried to fix this by inserting conflict into the show. The book isn't perfect, but I'm enjoying it a lot more than the first 20 episodes of the show. The book also describes different sensations like smells and the hum of the spaceship in a really evocative way that the series IMO fails at. The pacing of the first book, at least, is also much less frustrating. (No tattoos yet, but I'm seriously thinking about celebrating my long-worked-for graduation by getting a Blade Runner owl. Or the owl of Athena.)

BenJuan26

Regarding the bomb-drop of Naomi having a kid, I think it's just another example of how the show really drip-feeds information over a long period of time, sometimes even across many seasons. Just like people have said about Amos, and how his situation growing up is never outright stated, but instead implied through things that he says. We're not supposed to know what to do yet with the info that Naomi has a kid. It's just another tidbit of information that we know about her that we can use to understand her as the show goes on.

E.P.B.F.

There are some significant changes between the books and show beyond the dictates of adaptation between media. For example Camina Drummer, Fred Johnson's Belter chief of security and right hand henchwoman, who, in my opinion at least, is one of the most complex and awesome characters in the show (but only gets to shine from season 3 onward) does not exist in the books, but rather was created as an amalgamation of several characters from them. The metaphorical half eaten dishes problem George mentions however is mostly an issue caused by the show creators decision to split the books unevenly between seasons. It gave them about 50% more screen time per arc, but also meant they weren't forced to streamline the plot as much as they could, and probably should have done otherwise. As with most other things that bother Simone and George this gets smoothed out as the show progresses. Season 2 improves on Season 1, and Season 3 in turn really improves again on Season 2. Hopefully the two of you will stick with the show at least one more season. The growth in polish is noticeable and it is the season of payoffs where the various holdover plots setup during the two prior seasons all come due.

Frankie H

The book authors Ty Franck and Daniel Abraham are heavily involved with the show as both episode writers and producers. So don't worry this isn't a netflix witcher situation. In fact Franck and Abraham often have been known to watch and comment on some Expanse reaction videos on youtube. Also one super important line you guys missed was when Bobby was talking to the spy Cotyar about how he found himself working for Chrisjen Avasarala and he replies that "actually I got her son killed". Very important line.

Mitchell Bowker

A lot of the high expectations are coming from people who have seen the WHOLE 6 seasons of the show, and probably also did not rate it so highly in it's first season.

E.P.B.F.

Simone is right that inserting the information about Naomi's kid in that way was clunky, but there are justifiable reasons for why it comes up (openly) now and not earlier, and there were hints sprinkled throughout the earlier episodes if you look back closely (eg. the terms of the deal Naomi made with Fred for her help with the hijacked planetbuster missiles from earth). Without getting too far into it Naomi has a seriously effed up past (second only to Amos), and keeps a lot of secrets that drive her choices but can't be revealed prematurely to the audience because spoilers. It's a very conflicted character struggling with strong competing imperatives and loyalties.

Dan Guisinger

As Ben says, they are drip feeding information for payoffs as far out as the final season. They hinted in S1E6 (i think) that Naomi was looking for someone, and in S1E4 she said she wasn't going to get to say goodbye and said it didn't matter, and they hinted earlier in Season 2 that she had a child as well.

E.P.B.F.

Holden being 'squinty' as George has noted is actually a bit of an in joke among Expanse fans. The real reason for that seeming habit of the character is that the actor who plays him, Steven Strait, is extremely nearsighted and can't wear his glasses while filming.

Jack Burton

Pretty sure you guys missed the part where he said he got her son killed when he was talking to Bobby on the ship. When he pulled his gun out and made sure it was rdy.

Dan Guisinger
>>97493922

Yup, they do talk over a lot of lines that tell them whats going on. This show, very little dialog is meaningless so it is hard if you aren't paying 100% attention.

Dan Guisinger

Something else to note regarding not always knowing whats going on - this show is written that way on purpose. The books are written in the first person. Book 1 was exclusively written from Holden's and Miller's perspectives (the show moved the story lines of Avasarala and earth up as it made sense to introduce them early) But from the perspective of the main characters, they had no clue what the bigger picture was...and each character learned things the others weren't aware of. This show continues to inform you of things as characters learn things, they won't show you the conspiracy as it develops unbeknownst to the main characters off screen or anything else that happens outside of their immediate awareness. I know my dad didn't like that about the show and stopped watching early on, which I always found strange because he likes reading novels which are almost always written in this style. Some people just like to be shown more explicitly what is going on in a TV series than they would expect in the way the story unfolds in a book.

Frostyflops

Sometimes people don't want to talk about trauma as difficult as losing a child. Also, not everything has to be told to the audience within 5 minutes of learning a subject matters existence. Maybe I'm weird but I enjoy some story elements instead of reading a dictionary.

Richard Hodgetts
>>97474375

And just about everyone outside of the crew regards Holden as an asshole, and says so, often.

Peter Dillard

Remember that when they were on the Cant that everyone there had a story.. Their backstories unfold over the seasons with much more to come.

Florian Hoyer

i dont even get season 1 taste i rly loved season 1 xD' considering all season, for me this is the best scifi season ever filmed ^^

Thomas Wendel

Another thing you might have missed was a conversation between Amos & Holden. You were talking about canned chicken. (The answer is: Never!) Anyway, it basically showed that Holden is losing it. The pendulum has swung from goody-two shoes to kill all protomolecule at all costs. It's why he didn't have an issue with Amos beating up chicken guy. And why he is so lazer focused on killing the hybrid. On the other hand, Naomi is fighting to save people. I also have been waiting for this episode because Bobbie's storyline just got great! She went from Earth Bad, Must War to Queen of Earth's bodyguard. And she still isn't Go Earth. What does that do to someone who is so gung-ho about Mars and then having to leave. Great story! George got his wish too with Bobbie "doing something". She's just getting started! Such a great character. As for Namoi's kid, that was kinda clunky. And she has still not told them she is Holden onto her own protomolecule sample (see what I did there. Sorry.)

Onikaze

as far as tats go. you're no Queequeg so have at it and even if you were, it's your body so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ .

Kris Brown
>>97578797

Naomi's kid was first hinted at when she told Fred Johnson that she might ask for his help to find someone some day.

Bruno Santos

I think the conflicts and drama were added to the show so that we know about the character's motivations and personalities. For example, in the books, we know that Holden is a good guy because we are literally reading his mind. In the show, they have to create conflict to see his actions, like in the 1st episode of the first season where they make him go against the Canterbury crew to save the Scopuly by registering the emergency signal. In the books the captain decides to save the Scopuly, there's no conflict there. I don't like it but I also don't have a better way to do it.

Travis

The hard work and planning ahead from you two does not go unnoticed. Appreciate the continual content. Hardest workers in the game 💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽

EMB

I enjoyed the reaction, and that you're enjoying the series more. I would've preferred a 3 part as opposed to a single season finale upload, but that's kinda nitpicking a bit. I understand Simone's desire for nicely wrapped up conflicts, but I can't relate personally. I enjoy the multifaceted group of actors in this story, all doing what they think they should from their position. I don't really mind the trickle feed of information the show gives, because I enjoy being the fish out of water a bit and not understanding characters' motives entirely. I think I might have a higher tolerance for that than others. This show resolves pretty much everything as far as I can recall. I don't have a glaring example of "What about this?!" to point to off the top of my head. I can't wait to watch the season finale, and I hope you continue with it in the future. P.S. George, you're fine. Tattoo yourself all you want. I, personally, don't like face or neck tattoos because I imagine the undoubtedly painful process of getting them, but, I'm glad that tattoos are more acceptible. Do you Geroge. I like your tattoos, especially Lok'Tar Ogar because Warcraft (WC3 in particular) was my shit back in the day. Also, it's more easily seen than the rest of your tats.

EMB
>>97638870

They do work hard AF in this game, and I do appreciate them.

EMB
>>97489504

It was a rather clunky info drop there, you and Simone are right.

JBK405

When it comes to The Expanse, I think the general fandom has a problem distinguishing OVERALL quality from the individual seasons. That is why they say how GREAT it is, and then those expectations can't be met for newcomers who expect Firefly-level quality from the very beginning. I consider it to be OVERALL a very good show, and I was very excited when I saw that it was being reacted to here, but I actually agree with almost every criticism that has been made for seasons one and two so far (The only exception is Naomi Nagata: She was one of my favorite characters from the beginning). The writing is slipshod, the interpersonal conflicts are aggravating and create False Drama, and if I had watched it when it first aired and needed to wait a week between episodes I likely would have gotten bored and left before season one ended. When I recommend the show to friends, I preface it with the caveat that it starts rough, but that if you persevere through it it all comes together. Personally, I wouldn't say the series becomes recommend-worthy until season three. I enjoy these early episodes now, in retrospect, because later developments made me really invested in these characters so I can go back and say "Oh yes, that time when X did Y, that lays the groundwork for Z in the next season..." Without that connection that comes later, some of it is just not very good. That's why the expectations clash so hard with reality when you start at the beginning (And that blow can taint the entire experience). I've seen it in many other reactions from people who got into the show because their friends were raving in seasons three, four, and five, only to be so confused when they got hamfisted melodrama at the beginning instead of the masterpiece they were expecting. Like I said, given how good it becomes I will say that it is worth the time to slog through the early episodes, and it really does build into something special. I was so impressed by season five that I began reading the books and plowed through the series in a week between episodes. But despite my affection for the series as a whole, even I won't say that the beginning isn't rough, and you were put down a bad path by not being cautioned against the beginning.

Jasper Collins

I'm late to all this but as someone who has only seen the show. The Drama between the crew was maybe a little annoying for some but necessary in my opinion. The crew has people from all throughout the solar-system and tensions are high. To show that plus make them actual characters and have them become a found family some conflict was necessary.

Jasper Collins
>>99003747

Also the show has the two people who wrote the book as advisers and so I don't think it's a writers problem you are feeling, maybe a medium problem or something else.