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So the S8E03 Explained video is looking to be a similar length to the last couple videos. There's some analysis and book perspectives on the Dothraki, Melisandre, dragons, Lyanna, etc. But a lot of the video discusses the Night King's death, and what it all means for Arya, Jon, Daenerys, and the end of Game of Thrones. It's pretty subjective stuff, so we'll probably edit this down for the video, but I'd like to hear your thoughts –

There’s a lot of foreshadowing in the show leading up to Arya killing the Night King. Bran gave Arya her Valyrian knife in the godswood in Season 7, and you can tell he had a special purpose in mind. That’s the same knife that was used in an attempt to kill Bran in Season 1, so it’s neat that it saves Bran in the final season. Arya sneaks up on Jon in the godswood, just as she sneaks up on the Night King. And Arya uses the same hand-switching trick with the knife that she used against Brienne. In Season 1, Jon told Arya to “stick them with the pointy end”, and Syrio said to tell death “Not today” . Arya has trained for seasons to assassinate targets with skill and stealth. Her story is about death, and the Night King is the embodiment of death. Maybe now that she’s killed him, Arya can let go of her vengeance quest, and be more human and happy again. So from the perspective of Arya’s story, her killing the Night King makes a lot of sense. But what does it mean for Jon, Daenerys, Bran, the white walkers, and the deeper themes of magic and prophecy?

It’s been clear from the start that Jon and Dany are central to the song of ice and fire, the magic and prophecy that runs deep through the story. Daenerys was miraculously reborn from a fire with dragons beneath a bleeding star. Jon Snow was resurrected, and they both come from the ancient magic Targaryen bloodline. Jon has been fighting the walkers since Season 1, he’s been staring down the Night King since Hardhome. And Daenerys represents fire against ice. In the books, this goes deeper, with intricate prophecies hinting that Jon and Daenerys and some sacrifice will save the world from the white walkers. The show doesn’t mention prophecy much, but even if you ignore it, it's obvious that Jon and Dany’s destiny leads to the defeat of the white walkers. So it’s so weird that while Arya kills the Night King, Dany sobs over Ser Friendzone, and Jon.. yells at a dragon? The story had hinted so heavily that something big and magic and climactic would happen with Jon and Dany to defeat the walkers. But did they even really make a difference? Like, sure, Jon and Dany gathered the armies and helped fight the dead. But this was always a losing battle, they were only waiting for the Night King to turn up. If Jon and Dany and their armies weren’t there, the Night King still would’ve come to Bran, and Arya still could have killed him, right? So what was the point of all the magic and prophecy in Jon and Dany’s stories if they weren’t even necessary for the defeat of the Night King?

And what was the point of Bran? He spent seasons journeying to the three-eyed raven, learning to warg and have visions, losing Jojen Hodor Summer and his own humanity along the way. He said his powers were needed for the war with the walkers – but what did he do in this battle? He didn’t warg a dragon, or have some important vision, or tell anyone anything useful. He was just a MacGuffin on wheels. Is that it? The climax of Bran’s arc?

We also learned nothing new about the white walkers. No great revelation about their motivations or origins.  Nothing about these spirals, or baby sacrifices, or the Night King, or the deeper mysteries hinted in the books. And maybe that’s fine – the white walkers aren’t really characters, they’re a device. Like zombies in other stories, their purpose is to push the human characters to extremes, to show what they’re really made of, and make them do extraordinary things. But in this battle, the main characters did nothing new or unexpected. Jon and Daenerys were brave. Arya was badass. Tyrion drank wine. Bran was confusing. We did get conclusions for Theon and Jorah [and Beric and Mel] – but they were secondary characters, loose ends getting tied – they could’ve sacrificed themselves any number of ways. You’d think the final confrontation with the ultimate bad guys should bring out something new or climactic from the main characters. You’d also think that at least one main character would have died. Walder Frey killed more important characters than the Night King did. So what was the point of the walkers?

We’re told over and over that the walkers are an existential threat that make all the human conflicts petty and irrelevant. They show how pointless and self-destructive the endless wars for the Throne really are, and they brought people together – the north, the wildlings, and Daenerys unite against a true enemy. But now, that that’s over in Episode 3 – so will Dany and Jon march south to fight yet another war for the Throne against Cersei? Were the walkers just a distraction from the Throne, another stepping stone to one more petty war? The ancient ice demon apocalypse was just a warmup for the war against a drunk queen and her pal the horny pirate? Thrones author George Martin says his series will end like the Lord of the Rings books, with the Scouring of the Shire. In the final chapters of Rings, after the good guys beat Sauron, the hobbits go back to the Shire and deal with Saruman. It’s a bittersweet epilogue that shows that the world is saved, but it’s also changed, and its heroes have too. Maybe Game of Thrones will do something similar. The big bad white walkers are defeated, but taking Cersei off the Throne will be a time to reflect on how the last eight seasons of conflict have scarred Westeros and its people. But there are three long episodes left, and if they’re filled with more epic battles and petty politics, that would undercut the whole point of the white walkers as a metaphor for how terrible and self-defeating all the wars for the Iron Throne are.

Another – slim – possibility is that maybe, just maybe, there’ll be a twist. The Game of Thrones showrunners have promised a third ‘holy shit moment’ at the end of the series. Maybe it’ll turn out that the white walkers aren’t all gone. The actor who plays the Night King just tweeted about how the Night King’s touch can “change” characters. The Night King touched Arya – maybe she’ll change into something walkery. Or maybe something’s up with Bran – we still dunno what he was doing with his magic all battle. And there’s that tree in the far north where the walkers were created. Maybe the Night King will respawn for Round 2, and we’ll get a proper song of ice and fire in King’s Landing. But… that doesn’t seem likely.

We’ll have to wait and see what this all means. We’ll know the end of Game of Thrones in a few weeks.

Files

Comments

Patrick Long

i pretty much think we're done with all the white walker stuff and magic from here on out and all thats left is the scouring of the shire. I think my take away from the battle for winterfell is that D&D were never very interested in making a full fantasy show. I think they just wanted an interesting political intrigue show and that what we're getting back to.

Dylan

7 Seasons to build up to that. I have to imagine that the series that starts with a white walker killing watchmen will end by implicating them in some way. Can't wait for the video!

Patrick Long

I've seen a lot of people who say that the people who are unhappy with the episode are unhappy because all of our clever theories etc were wrong. I don't particularly care that my theories were wrong they were wrong most of the time anyway. I'm annoyed that the questions that those theories were aiming to address weren't answered or brought up at all. Who was the night king before he got turned? why did he rebel against the children of the forest? why did the children side with the first men? what is the stark's family role in this? why does a stark always need to be in winterfell? why did the ww go away for 8 thousand years? why did craster give them his children? if they were just trying to kill all men why did they leave craster alone and why didn't they kill sam or the ranger in the first scene? I used to hold out that the writers for the show were waiting for some clever time down the road to fully explain everything and that it will all make sense in the end. but i've finally realised that they actually have no answer.

Kenny Arnold

The Night King dying in that episode at the hands or Arya is like if Thanos was shot by the Winter Soldier in Infinity War and died

Kangaroo Bob

Halfway through your review I was considering unsubscribing. Despite being an epic and entertaining battle thus was the most underwhelming moment of the series. No twist, no shock, all the foreshadowing, prophecy, magic... And instead the 'long night' is ended after 1 hour with a single stab. This was a storytelling disaster and the fans deserve better. D&D should be ashamed.

Kangaroo Bob

The only thing that could redeem this is if Arya turns into the new night king

Kewl0210

I'm sure they'll give the other main characters some actual conclusions to their arcs. Just no idea what that going to be, given Brian's while arc has been about stopping the White Walkers. Maybe they're going to go for a "well what do they do after the battle is won?" kind of thing. "Now that Bram achieved his goal, how will his life continue from here as a tree person?" "How will Dany and Jon ruling together actually play out?" Like that's what D&d felt the show is "about" which is why the big battle is the 4th to last episode.

Taylor Smith

I think it's important to note both here and in the recap video that the prophecy in the show/book about Azor Ahai or the Prince never really mentions killing the night King. Especially considering he isn't even confirmed in the books. It does talk about how he/she will lead the army of the living against the dead, how they will end the long night, etc. But Jon and Dany still do this in the show. They were instrumental in defeating the army of the dead. It doesn't necessarily mean they had to be the ones to kill the Night King. Either one or both of them can still be considered the Prince. And at this point, I would consider the dragons to be the true lightbringer for this era of westeros. Sacrifice was required to wake them from stone and they act as a fiery sword. The dragon has three heads could still refer to Jon, Dany, and the NK.

Lethewards Sunk

I don't think D&D remotely care about wrapping up that kind of detail. I suspect, in their minds, they've already explained this sufficiently: the NK was some bloke who was weaponised by the CotF then they lost control of him; the CotF sided with the first men because their weapon turned on them too, the NK was woken up by the wildlings when they were digging up graves looking for the Horn of Joramun/Winter; the Stark in Winterfell was one throwaway line that Cat mentioned just to ensure at least one of her kids stayed safe at home; Craster gave his kids away as a bargain for safety, etc. etc. They aren't invested in the detail of the books (clearly) and they aren't writing the show for a bunch of geeks who they probably think over-analyse every detail.

sam!

This is a good analysis of the episode, I think regardless of how people feel about the writing or specifics of the episode (stuff like the battle tactics everyone's been using as a punching bag), it's more important to think about the implications this episode has on the end of the series. Everyone is saying this is a terrible ending, but there is still 3 more long episodes, and since the writers have praised themselves on unpredictability and surprise so far this season, it's unreasonable to think that the next three episodes will be post-book thrones as expected. There will most certainly be some kind of twist in the final episodes, but whether that is something satisfying that fits with the ethos of the world GRRM created or not, we can only see.

Kelly Theobald

Aw Alt 😥 You summed it up beautifully. If it makes you feel any better: I’m somewhat glad it was Arya who killed the NK. Here’s why: Her storyline has been very frustrating the last few seasons. We’ve followed her all the way to Braavos, where there were no other characters, and sat through some really boring scenes and watched this huge transformation...for what? To see her stalk around Winterfell all creepy-like? I wanted a huge Arya payoff—a reason for her Braavos storyline—and this is it. Now it feels worth it sitting through all that. Plus it was completely unexpected, which I liked. I thought it was refreshing! That said, as someone pointed out in the Schwift Squwad, it would have been so much more meaningful if Arya had to sacrifice something in order to kill the NK—if he had blinded or maimed her in the process or even took her life. But there was no sacrifice at all in this episode. So the stakes were really low, which doesn’t fit in with the rest of the series at all. For it to feel like it has meaning, the stakes have to be high. I also think if this is really how they were gonna do it, they could have done a better job satisfying the book nerds. This was just kinda a big middle finger to everyone who got absorbed into and excited by the Azor Ahai prophecy. I hope there is a way they can address it next episode.

Kelly Theobald

Also, logistics—Dany sacrificed her Dothraki army, and it looks like the Unsullied all died. Does she not have an army now? I bet you that somehow, someway...she will anyway.

Patrick Long

but i thought they wanted the horn so they could get south to get away from the ww?

Lethewards Sunk

I'm with you that there will be a final twist, but I don't think it can be connected with the NK. The big three twists supposedly derived from GRRM himself, so it can't be anything particular to the NK given that he doesn't exist in the books. It could be something to do with the White Walkers more generally, but most of the predicted twists have still centred on plot points relating to the NK. It would be contrary to GRRM's oft-stated views about one-dimensional villains, but perhaps the White Walkers were just intended by D&D as the agent to bring unity between the North and Dany's invading force. So much of the story has been about the independence of the Northerners and Dany's determination to rule, that without the existential threat of the White Walkers there would have been no credible reason for them to ally. It's far less satisfying to we bookgeeks, but D&D have proved that they not invested in the richness of GRRM's world-building.

Lethewards Sunk

And let's not forget D&D are the fuckwits who thought you could tell the story of the Illiad from an atheist perspective.

Andrew

I was hoping that the ending in GoT, the TV show, would have at least some semblance to GoT, the book - even though it sounds like D&D did not really consult with Martin for the final series. The general feeling is that Martin will do this "better", but what if this is what Martin roughly intends and the story is salvaged by whatever happens next. The comment about the Night King's touch changing people might be a way out. The Night King was defeated before but still came back. Perhaps Arya or Bran will soon become the Night King reborn...or perhaps it's just a crappy ending.

Lukas Taylor

I like the idea of Arya turning into a white walker in a similar way that greyscale takes over

Patrick Henson

GRRM has said quite a few times that he loved the way that Lord of the Rings ended. He loved the scouring of the shire. I would have been shocked if this had gone any other way... In the books they will deal with the Others and then deal with Cersai and it will feel just as bitter and anti-climactic.

Donna

The thing is people keep comparing the writing of a tv show to writing of novels. They are not the same type of writing. They are different. And I think it’s not fair to compare them. The TV show has left out characters and plot lines that the novels will deal with. And that will include the mysteries of the others in more depth. We got a Cole Notes version with the Night King (presented in the show way differently than the Night King of the book) and for a TV show that was the depth that they could handle reasonably in putting on the screen. The show runners are saving a lot of these mysteries for Martin to flesh out. I don’t expect the TV show to give us everything, all the answers. And that’s a good thing because if there are some surprises left maybe Martin will finish the series. Without Dan and David spoiling the whole thing.

Donna

Starks have magic in their blood. That’s something else the show didn’t cover. It’s not only Bran that can warg into animals in the books. So both Targaryen and Starks come from magical bloodlines. That’s the ice and fire that is combined in Jon. Dany brought the dragons back into the world with Essos magic. Bran represents old Westeros magic of children of the forest. Jon has both, or at least he will have in the books. To kill the others it will take more of a combined effort of these three plus Arya. But the show never dealt with Stark magic other than Bran bring the 3 eyed raven. So we get Bran doing some warging in the show and not much else.

Kazuhiro Sato

"The five stages, denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance are a part of the framework that makes up our learning to live with the one we lost. They are tools to help us frame and identify what we may be feeling. But they are not stops on some linear timeline in grief."

Jeffrey Boerst

Like beginning impeachment hearings I say we need to wait and see more information before judging.

Patrick Long

Yeah and tbf i think ive kinda realised that it may not be fair to judge got against asoif as they are actually quite different stories. Theres much less fantasy/prophesy stuff in the show so its not so necessary to focus on it. Still leaves a little left to be explained.

Patrick Long

Yeah pretty sure thats what we're getting. I personally dont like the scouring of the shire plot line but whatever grrm loves it so i think youre right in saying that that is how the books will end. But i likee how others have put it "we've defeatee the devil why should i care abiut how you deal with a neurotic pregnant lady and a drunk pirate"

Bill Miller

Yaas, give in to the dark side. Let the snark flow through you. This was a great rant, and right on the money.

Laura

Remember Arya telling Tywin that Aegon the Conqueror didn't win alone. He had his sisters, Rhaenys and Visenya (I wish there was a stronger connection to Dark Sister). Jon wouldn't be who he is without his sisters (and a different type of incest). Does this mean he conquers? Or does this mean he does the opposite and re-divides the 7 kingdoms? The show won't answer Azor Ahai; it's never uttered those words. Bran is magical, but he represents humanity -- our memories, our interpreter into magical realms. His duty is done with this story (except for maybe editing Sam's novel).

Laura

How are you merging "that tree in the far north where the walkers were created" and that D&D said in the After the Thrones that this is the Godwood where the NK ws created?

Paul Baker

I think by "where the NK was created" was referring to where Arya stabbed the NK, the same place the dragon glass was inserted, not the geographical location.

Paul Baker

I totally agree. I am glad that the TV show doesn't "wrap up the story from the books." I want the books to end in a completely different way so I have something to look forward to and be surprised by.

Paul Baker

Everyone was waiting for some major sacrifice by Dany or Jon in order to defeat the NK. But those sacrifices could just as easily have already happened. Dany had to sacrifice Drogo and her unborn son to wake her dragons. Dany sacrificed one of her dragons for the purpose of bringing humanity together against the dead. Dany sacrificed her guaranteed victory over the Iron Throne by bring her dragons and army north instead of simply sacking Kings Landing. She sacrificed two armies to defend the living in the battle for Winterfell. Jon's first love died attacking the Wall that he swore to defend. And then on top of it, he was murdered for trying to keep wildlings from further padding the undead army. Sacrifices have been made. Just because they didn't *directly* play into the NK's death in the moment shouldn't demean their importance.

Paul Baker

Undead Viserion was defending the entrance to the Godswood. Jon stood up and yelled (without even his sword drawn) as a distraction so that Arya could enter the Godswood and assassinate the NK. Try and change my mind.

Joy Cioci

I think it’s very curious with what the NK’s touch will do to Arya. Clearly his touch on the dead will shattered and the magic was gone.. but we’re all his generals casters children he changed or was that our own assumption? Because his touch there was on the living. And if the generals were casters children then they also shattered away... and his hand was on Ayra neck for just as long as his fingers were on the babies.. but Arya didn’t change and or didn’t shatter? Does his touch have a different affect on the Shark bloodline like a mark? Or was that only on bran cause it was in a psychic level connection touch? Also the actor Of the NK mentioned that the end of episode 4 has a mysterious ending/ it’s very Shakespearean ?? Also the NK actor posted a picture on his Instagram that he’s at the tower of joy?? How did we miss that i don’t get it?? Can you help explain. Thanks

Laura

Your last question is easy. The actor who played the NK in seasons 6-8 (Vladimir Furdik) was previously a stunt man at Meereen, Hardhome, the Tower of Joy, etc.

Ashley Lancellotti

I think Arya's whole storyline has been filled with self sacrifice, loneliness, and loss. I love Jon and Dany too, and I suppose it would have made for better drama to see any of them have to die to kill the Night King. I just however think Arya was best trained and clearly all the foreshadowing has been pointing to this possibility for years. I'm shocked at the amount of shade people are throwing at last week's episode. We aren't quite even halfway through this final season yet and I'm so excited to see where the story goes next.

Janel Brattland

Vladimir Furdik was the stuntman for Sir Arthur Dayne, Sword of the Morning. He’s the one who did the sword work onscreen in that episode and has also done a lot of other stunt work on the show. In a post-episode 3 interview somewhere, he said he was involved in the whole 55-night Long Night shoot and not just as the Night King. He was performing other stunt roles.

Anonymous

Well done. This was a tough episode to review. ' The ancient ice demon apocalypse was just a warmup for the war against a drunk queen and her pal the horny pirate? ' is a fantastic line. I personally really liked the episode. I saw it on a very big high contrast TV and loved the dark. I was on the edge of my seat for over an hour and I couldn't say when another TV show has had that effect on me. All the Arya hate I don't really get, the part that bugged me the most was when Danerys fell of of her dragon and didn't have one weapon on her. That made no sense. She's a warrior queen who went into a major battle with not one weapon on her. With all the money that was spent on this episode there should have been at least one medieval battle expert running around on set. That might have made all the difference.

Anonymous

Most of the characters who lived through the battle were packing Valyrian steel so there's one excuse for their survival.

Kangaroo Bob

I think Gendry would have some questions for Arya...